# Diesel or Gas Power wagon? help me.



## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

I need to get a new truck and i was looking to get either a 06 dodge 2500 diesel with 30k miles or a 09 Powerwagon with 18k miles on it, they both cost the same 35k but cant decide which one to get. I tow a 16ft landscape trailer and a 12ft dump trailer during the summer and plow during the winter, so which one is best?


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## dforbes (Jan 14, 2005)

I will never own anything but a diesel again. 35K sounds high to me for an 06 with 30K miles. I didn't give that for my 07 mega cab brand new. I know there are a lot of options, but even loaded it sounds high.


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## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

thnx 4 the reply, im still up in the air about it but it might come down to whatever i can get the best deal on and were in the beging of the price battle between the dealer now. lol


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## wideout (Nov 18, 2009)

go with the diesel! but look around because that is way to much money check theprices on ebay


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

yep tony paid 35k for his 06 with 40k on the clock and his truck was in perfect shape.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

I don't think you can put a plow on a Powerwagon because of the winch. I could be wrong but that's what I was told when I was shopping for new trucks last year.

Also, the PW gets next to nothing for mileage. They're definitely a work horse but if I were you I'd go with the diesel.


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## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

we will see about the winch since my neighbor up the street jst bought an 2010 wagon , were putting it on tomaro so ill let u guys know, at this point im leaning toward the diesel.


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## wideout (Nov 18, 2009)

go to the dodge pic and vidoe thread rhford has a plow one on his and it looks sweet. page 3 i beleive


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## sweetk30 (Sep 3, 2006)

power wagon for the win plowin. factory selectable lockers . and thay can be slightly modifyed for plow and winch use.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

I am about to buy a 2007 6.7 Cummins.... THAT BEING SAID! wait for my explanation!

I just drove a 2010 Power Wagon while going over my future fleet at the dodge dealership... That thing was tuned OHHH SOOO SWEEEETT  It got the same fuel mileage as my FX4 2010 F250 XL (about 10mpg or so). It was the sweetest gasser ride and I would have guessed it was a quiet diesel by the power. With the maintenance costs and EPA stuff in the future, you may be better off with this vehicle over a diesel.

If you are going to be hauling SS and Backhoes and roll offs like my new truck will, then you will want a diesel for the torque numbers and better fuel economy.

The 5.9 2500 and the powerwagon are very close in quality... it is a tough choice, but if you are not hauling trailers over 14K GVWR consistently then you will want to go with the powerwagon. That truck is awesome and you can let those trail boys make fun of your gasser, cause it will probably beat up on some of those diesels. It is the cream of the crop plow truck. I do not recall the one I drove having the winch sticking out or under the front. i thought it was built into the bumper but that might change from year to year... idk.... 

Most municipalities are moving away from small diesel vehicles and will be replacing them with the V10 and tuned V8's in the near future (due to emissions crap now).

If you really want to spend dough the right way, wait until august and get an International TerraStar with the newer NaviStar Diesel. i hear they are getting away without regen. or DEF systems.... they have something in the makes for it.... won't be out in 4x4 til august though!!! great truck for this though!!!!

In the end it is your decision but I was impressed with the powerwagon (and I always hated the hemi in a truck and ditched it for vortec.... it changed my mind!)


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## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

for the majority of the time i am jst towing 2 xmarks and one walk behind, but there is the occasional times were i will be towing a skidder (maybe once a month) and in the near future i plan on buying a dump truck as well. i test drove the power wagon today and it had a lot more power than my 03 silverado hd, so i was also very impressed by the hemi and thats y im keeping it as an option.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

KPZ Enterprises;1208692 said:


> for the majority of the time i am jst towing 2 xmarks and one walk behind, but there is the occasional times were i will be towing a skidder (maybe once a month) and in the near future i plan on buying a dump truck as well. i test drove the power wagon today and it had a lot more power than my 03 silverado hd, so i was also very impressed by the hemi and thats y im keeping it as an option.


The PW axle ratio is 4:56 whereas your Chevy is probably a 3:73 or maybe 4:10 and that's why you felt such a difference in power.


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## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

the chevys got 4:10 in the back, but even so it the the pw was sweet. lol


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

KPZ Enterprises;1208692 said:


> for the majority of the time i am jst towing 2 xmarks and one walk behind, but there is the occasional times were i will be towing a skidder (maybe once a month) and in the near future i plan on buying a dump truck as well. i test drove the power wagon today and it had a lot more power than my 03 silverado hd, so i was also very impressed by the hemi and thats y im keeping it as an option.


If you are planning on buying a fleet then I suggest trying to make the components the same on everything.

Mowers use as many of the same parts - blades, spindles, belts. Same goes for trucks. Get the same power train in each vehicle. It allows you to service them at the same place or get used to doing it yourself (easy to train newbs too). Use the same wheel/tire size so that you can buy in bulk. Use the same fuel so that some Dumb @$$ doesn't put gas in your diesel.... use the same plow manufacturer and stock parts.

It is called streamlining your maintenance. if you want to grow into a landscape business like those big guys out there (pro turf and such) you need to know more about managing the crews and equipment than doing the landscaping to be totally honest. Most business plans fail because there is not enough R&D put into the management techniques used.

Part of my plan was to switch to all diesel vehicles because of the types of stuff I plan on hauling and getting into. I chose the Cummins diesel because it was very reliable and their update was readily available on the used market. I went to the dealer and got prices on five brand new 2010-2011 Cummins quad cabs. Before I invested 120K into trucks I decided that I would get a used 6.7L with the same options. I researched and spoke to the diesel tech at my local dealer and decided on this 07 drw 3500 with the same engine/tranny. So I invested under 30K into the vehicle and will feel it out for the next two years. and try to decide if the investment is worth it. Then I can drop dough into the vehicle. I don't have them yet and I already know where to do my diesel fuel stops, what parts to stock, what codes commonly flash, and how quick and where I can get service done. Now I just am going to try it small scale.

I did the same with mowers and am in the process of doing the same with plows. Streamlining your business is very important. I always suggest just starting. Go out non-streamlined and learn what you would change. Save up some money and then drop it on the right stuff. Smart buying, and testing the waters will help you make many important management decisions. Start small scale and work up. If it doesn't work for you and a buddy on a truck, then how will you motivate people to work for a fraction of the cost and get a good return. Remember the principle of diminishing return.

That is about all of the advice I can give you... the rest is up to you...


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

Dude you are gonna get **** MPG's just get a diesel and stop ***** putting around. Only good thing about the wagon is the lockers... my truck is built like the wagon 4.56 detroit locker in the rear and truetrac in the front.


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## DAFFMOBILEWASH (Dec 9, 2006)

Esso and Sunoco will love your new Power wagon !!!!

It comes to making the right choice when buying a piece of equipment. Dollar to dollar anyone who does alot of towing and or driving the diesel truck is the only way to go. The PW would make a great toy / Sunday driver.


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## MrPLow2011 (Jan 14, 2011)

Yeah those Power Wagons got 4:56 rear end. You MPG will be like 6-8 if yo are towing anything. I would buy a diesel


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## trevier (Dec 24, 2007)

I would love to drive a power wagon, there isn't one dealer up in NH that has one in stock, they all say the same thing, it's all about the MPG, who cares, let me worry about that, would love to at least test drive one though,


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## plowguy43 (Jan 2, 2008)

Camden;1208699 said:


> The PW axle ratio is 4:56 whereas your Chevy is probably a 3:73 or maybe 4:10 and that's why you felt such a difference in power.


It also couldve been that the HEMI has 390HP to the chevy's 320HP.


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## KPZ Enterprises (Sep 16, 2010)

lol ya that could have it it too.


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## CGM Inc. (Dec 15, 2008)

go diesel!


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

Cedar Grounds;1209976 said:


> go diesel!


I agree.... but there is a problem

Diesels HATE low idle for extended periods. Especially turbo diesels because there is a sleeve in the turbo.... it slides and if it is covered with carbon it will like to blow out oil. Diesels love to haul and work... and if you are doing a lot of hardcore plowing it is good *just turn her off and plug her in when you are sitting for a long period*

the other problem is that if you work the diesel correctly while plowing, that your transmission will hate you :laughing:

The tranny hates to shift, it heats it up if it shifts too much and takes a load. Turning your haul/tow on can keep you in gear for longer periods;thus shifting less - and my local dodge dealer tech told me to never plow without it on. He swears by it.

So with a diesel, you are looking at either turbo or tranny issues from plowing. Then again not a single vehicle is perfect for anything. Pick your poison with diesel and get ready to shell out to keep it in good shape...... or shell out gas money and engine swaps over a gasser's life..... pretty much evens out in the long run. Every vehicle breaks.


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## wideout (Nov 18, 2009)

With the cummins idling isn't that big of a deal because its more industrial than the others. The 5.9 is the same one that's in the smaller dump trucks and its time tested and proven!


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

wideout;1210197 said:


> With the cummins idling isn't that big of a deal because its more industrial than the others. The 5.9 is the same one that's in the smaller dump trucks and its time tested and proven!


Not as big of a deal on the cummins as with the powerjoke's lol (even though I own a super-poopie; so I can say it!) BUT it still is not desirable.

Now with the 6.7 it is a different story. The REGEN system needs to run each and every week. If you don't kick it, it causes issues. Our local FD is moving away from diesel because of the new restrictions. They do not find regen good enough and DEF based systems even worse. Any pre 2007 diesel is just going to go up in value.

I would take the larger engines in anything class 7 and up. The 5.9 wasn't made for it. Cummins has an 8.3, 9, 11.9, and 15 engine along with two new four cylinders, present in equipment like the GEHL SS and more.

If he isn't buying a new fleet soon, I'd buy 2003-2007 vehicles with the 5.9L. I'm buying a fleet of new Dodge Cummins cab and chassis.... So I am picking up a used 6.7L here in a week or so.

The new wright standers even have after-treatment systems in the exhaust lol.... I think it is absurd but you have to live with it or vote against this crap. We just have to live with being controlled more and more.... and the diesel nightmare is moving into gassers... so it is only time IMHO. So I just bit the bullet and went diesel since gas has its own issues (rarely confronted).


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## hardwoodcd (Dec 29, 2010)

Get the diesel! you won't regret it.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

Can't you turn this into a poll? this would make a good poll. I would like to see the results Thumbs Up


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

He don't know how to make polls to new to forums.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

dodge15004x45.9;1210360 said:


> He don't know how to make polls to new to forums.


oh, oh well...

I am interested in a poll on this lol... I just asked myself all of these questions...

Poll anyone? (I mean the type to vote on, not dance like the rest of you just thought :laughing:; none of us are pretty enough for that either)


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

I can just make a new thread for him just to piss him off. I'm gonna hear **** tomorrow lol.


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

****** PLEASE USE THIS THREAD******
http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=117223


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

dodge15004x45.9;1210367 said:


> I can just make a new thread for him just to piss him off. I'm gonna hear **** tomorrow lol.


Don't worry about it lol I'll piss 'im off lol....

just to be clear he posted a very valid question and I will give him full credit.

The thread will be titled "Cummins Diesel Or Hemi Power Wagon"

How's that sound?


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## dodge15004x45.9 (Jan 2, 2009)

dodge15004x45.9;1208636 said:


> yep tony paid 35k for his 06 with 40k on the clock and his truck was in perfect shape.


****** PLEASE USE THIS THREAD ******

http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=117223


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

DaytonBioLawns;1210376 said:


> Don't worry about it lol I'll piss 'im off lol....
> 
> just to be clear he posted a very valid question and I will give him full credit.
> 
> ...


Oh geez lol man you are on top of it... beat me to it....

NVM!!! Use the one up thur^^^^:laughing:

guess I should wake up and stop doing proposals for the springtime so intensly lol... my PS skills are lagging


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