# Do i have enough equipment???... Help !!!!!



## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Ive been a sub contractor for years with my old boss... I own my own landscape business... Now i have the opportunity to be a sub contractor for another company... But i would be the one running the show and doing all the work at this facility... Im wondering if i have enough equipment? Its a section of a shopping mall... It has about 1,200 parking spots... Three businesses are on this site... And one road that needs to be cleared around the whole parking lot... Do you think two new trucks could do this... One with a 9'2" boss plow.. The other with a 8' boss plow ... One is a dually diesel dump truck... The other is a pick up... Both fords... Sander on back of dump... Is this crazy or can it be done... Obviously there will be times when i need to bring in a machine the next morning and push up piles, etc.... But is this doable with me and the right worker with me... As well as shovelers... If you cant tell me... Could you tell me if i sent you the diagram of the lot? Or could you tell me how you judge or tell how many truck can handle a square footage or parking area? I would really appreciate it alot !!!!! Thanks again !!!


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

Personally i think 2 trucks could handle that...but only if the parking lot doesnt have more than a handfull obstructions (light poles, islands, etc). Depending on how many obsticles there are, is what is gonna make this easy or a nightmare with those 2 trucks. If you can bring in a loader to push piles back the next morning, why not just leave it on site during the storm and have the trucks bulk it all out, and the machine relocate & push everything back? Like i said, depending on how straightforward the lot is, it can be done. I would also probably throw some wings on the 8' Boss.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Do you have a boss? Now would the wings work well if im rolling snow like pushing rows of snow over and over?


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

I have the overview of the parking lot, and then i found it on google earth, i just cant get it onto here... I could email you it to give you a better look im from mass... Where are you from


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

CT, just south of Hartford. Yeah i have a 8' Boss. The wings will still let you roll snow, theyll also help to expand the blade to carry more snow. While looking at the map of Google earth hit the "print screen" button on the top right of the keyboard. go into photoshop or paint or whatever program you have...right click and paste. crop out the other crap besides the lot...when typing a new post, click the add attachments and upload the pic. if done right, itll show up on here


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

ok ill do it now, if your still on let me know... otherwise let me know tmrw if you can, id appreciate it


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Heres an overview, its the large parkin lot you see... The single road that goes around it and the medium sized parking lot on the right of the last building as well as the small 40 car parking lot in the rear of the buildings where the 18 wheelers are... It has about 1,200 parking spots and it only has an island here or there, but they are not in the middle of any lots or anything... Any advice or equipment needs would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Sorry i didnt send it in that message, new to sending photos on this site


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

I can email you it, so you can zoom in and stuff or email you the original photo from the customer


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## Neige (Jan 29, 2008)

No way with 2 trucks. I believe in your area you get some big northeasters, loaded with wet heavy snow. You mention that you are being subbed out to do this job, what does the company who hired you say. Did he specify how much iron you need, what did they use past years. Does he think your 2 trucks will do.


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## Enzo (Feb 27, 2008)

I would get a loader with at least a 12ft box to push more efficiently and the two trucks


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

after seeing that pic..ideally i would use 2 trucks & 1 or 2 loaders. the trucks will definitely be tired after a night of plowing. if you dont own a loader or cant get one from the guy youre subbing for i would seriously consider renting one for the season. the trucks can go in circles around and around windrowing the snow outwards, but like neige said...with a heavy snow or deep accumulation its gonna be some work, those windrows are gonna get deep very soon. And i would definitely throw wings on that 8' if you end up doing this.


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

Stone, is that Solomon??????? You def wont be able to do that with 2 pick ups....


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## BlackIrish (Dec 22, 2007)

anything is doable,but if you get 12+ inches of wet snow you'll be pushing for days, loader better bet. if your serious about snow you know that first impressions are lasting. Put a loader there and go find add'l work for the trucks close by. imo


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## scitown (Dec 9, 2007)

Im from MA too. Small parking lots around here (grocery stores, pharmacies) seem to all use loaders. Im not sure where in MA you are but eastern we get snow that is real heavy. I have never done a parking lot but like I said most use loaders at least to pile the snow at the end of the heavy windrows. Where are you?


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Gicon, whats solomon? 

OK so it looks like i would minimum need to rent a loader with a pusher for the season.... will i get yelled at on here if i ask roughly how much they go for... i know it depends on the place and the machine, Etc. Just give me a ballpark... 

What about spreaders... Ive used gas one before... are the electric any better or more chance of recking your batteries?


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Ive got a 2004 Ford F350 Diesel, Dually Flatbed... And a 350 diesel pickup.. The dump/flatbed has a 9'2" Boss plow and the pickup has a 8' Boss Plow...


Another stupid question, im sure it depends on the contract and contractors.... If someone has an accident on your parking lot and your a sub contractor... Who gets sued, the Contractor who subs out the work, the sub contractor actually doing the work or the place? Does it all depend on the contract i suppose?


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## Pennings Garden (Dec 11, 2006)

A skid steer for 5 months, around $6000.- right? (We use our own, but I think that’s what they go for) you need to buy a pusher (I don't think you will find anyone to rent you one of those)

Spreader, everyone has an opinion, its gas for me... I have a hard time believing that electric can be as strong as gas powered, but like I said there is allot of guys who would fight me on that...


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## OfCourseYouCan (Oct 9, 2008)

*Who gets sued*

Everyone with a juicy insurance policy gets sued. But I suspect you are going to be quite deligent on a big commercial property and there won't be any solid grounds for negligence. Not that that won't stop people from trying. I've been told by insurance companies that if someone gets injured and they sue, they are probably gonna get some money just to go away. I have had 2 slip and fall claims against me in the last four years, and it seems they are no big deal. Word of advice seems to be keep good records, of the weather, and of your operations, plowing times, materials used, crew members, returns trips, etc. I am spoke with a lawyer today to have my contracts evaluated. I got asked a lot of questions in connection with the slip and falls regarding who was responsible for determining what course of actions to and when to take them. None of that is spelled out in my contracts. Usually I make the decisions and confer with property owners if I have any doubts.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

how much is a loader or a backhoe... no one rents a pusher with a loader or hoe huh?


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

the other question is... im in a situation where its a set price for the season... since im a sub, theres no negotiations, etc. If someone offered you $25,000 is that in the ball park or not? Another questions not easy to answer


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

one of the truck i used for my old boss was his pickup, it was a chevy 2500 or 3500... but anyways... it was a small regular sized chevy... standard cab... with a fisher probably 7
...i was looking to get one of those, cause the ford dumps are great, but the chevy i was able to boogy around the parking lot and the tranny was like a nissan... it just seemed like a quick and great plowing truck for a regular sized plow truck... any opinions or thoughts... any truck around that size you wouldnt get... chevy and gmc are basically the same right... anyone use a 2x4 pickup or dump? any problems other than putting weight in the back? 

When you rent for the season, what would be a safe amount of months to rent for? 3,4, OR 5 months? Would a loader with a regular bucket be ok versus a loader with a pusher?


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## scitown (Dec 9, 2007)

Im not the negative type but...I think your in over your head.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

in what sense?


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

ive run a full winter operation for years, i just never did it on my own... i basically ran my old boss's company... Ive had my own business now for 4 years and everyone has to start some where... i can do the whole plowing and coordinating and preping and hours... i have just never done the paper work side of plowing... i do my own books for my regular business.


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## jgoetter1 (Feb 23, 2007)

*In over your head*

I give you credit for your zealous ambitions, but your endless questions on almost every aspect of the business clearly demonstrates that this project is too much for you to handle.

Consider yourself fortunate to find out now rather than later. Sometimes the best way to go out of business is to grow too quickly.

By the way, 2 trucks for those lots is suicide.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

my bad... i thought that "new to this industry forum" would be to ask questions... even i can answer questions about trucks, dumps, plows, Etc.... I thought this was about asking questions for the "new to the indusrtry" and learning for those who would be new to it... i was just asking opinions and questions... i have my own, i just wanted to hear what other people thought as well


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

I have no idea on how much snow you get but if $25,000 includes salt I would quit now. A reg. cab long box truck is the best plow truck IMO. We used a 3500 2WD last year. We put 24 patio stones on the back and pushed every night. I would not consider that place without a hoe, loader, tractor or something like that. We have 1 Volvo backhoe out each night and he does 2 of the larger places in almost 1/2 the time of a truck. He subs for me and I give him the pusher. A pusher will cost you approx. $4000.

If someone slips and sues you will all be named on the claim. The mall will put the blame on the contractor and he will put it on you.


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## jgoetter1 (Feb 23, 2007)

Nothing wrong with asking questions, but when you ask as many as you have, you've told us that you not ready for this large of an undertaking. 

I'm sorry this upsets you but once again, you should be grateful to find out now.


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## ducatirider944 (Feb 25, 2008)

First, get prowings, Second find someone to sub to you that owns a back hoe or skidloader. Then you are only paying for the time it is actually running. What would you do if you rent a back hoe for $1200 or $1500 a month and you only get 4 or 5 snows a month? Where do you come up with the cash for the rental? Plus, you have to pay the person running the back hoe. Do you have workmans comp? Just some food for thought


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## scitown (Dec 9, 2007)

Stone781;601646 said:


> my bad... i thought that "new to this industry forum" would be to ask questions... even i can answer questions about trucks, dumps, plows, Etc.... I thought this was about asking questions for the "new to the indusrtry" and learning for those who would be new to it... i was just asking opinions and questions... i have my own, i just wanted to hear what other people thought as well


Like I said Im not trying to knock you down. Just seems like a huge lot to take on, Oh and if you have been doing this for years why would you be asking questions like can I do this with two trucks? ? Good luck.


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## Neige (Jan 29, 2008)

Stone you are getting real honest answers to your questions. You may not like what you are hearing, but you should be grateful. 
If you prefer I could tell you yeh go for it. 2 trucks no problem, heck if you could pick up something across the street go for it, your only at 75% productivity. 
If you really want good opinions, give us the sq.ft total, the average seasonal snow, the average snow events. The average snow per event. Do you get any storms over 12 inches, how many and how much snow. You gave us your equipment list of 2 trucks. Is that all, do you have any backups, what is the experience of your drivers. Those are a few of many, more info you give the better our opinions.
On what you have shared so far. I still say 2 trucks are not even close enough.
One last note, I am still very concerned that someone would sub out that contract to you, without checking to see if you have the right equipment to do it.

Don't  the messenger.


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## BM'S PLOWING (May 11, 2008)

How big is the lot? i must agree that two trucks are not going to cut it. I would check into a loader if you are able to. Where in mass. are you?

BM'S PLOWING
2005 F-250 W/ 8 1/2 FISHER HD
MODIFIED REAR SUSPENSION
2 YARD HENDERSON SANDER
HONDA HS-80 TRACK SNOWBLOWERS

SOON ANOTHER TRUCK AND SANDER


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## shredder781 (Sep 27, 2008)

06HD BOSS;601044 said:


> after seeing that pic..ideally i would use 2 trucks & 1 or 2 loaders. the trucks will definitely be tired after a night of plowing. if you dont own a loader or cant get one from the guy youre subbing for i would seriously consider renting one for the season. the trucks can go in circles around and around windrowing the snow outwards, but like neige said...with a heavy snow or deep accumulation its gonna be some work, those windrows are gonna get deep very soon. And i would definitely throw wings on that 8' if you end up doing this.


i agree with 06HD BOSS
a couple of questions that I have.
1) what would you do in the event of a 6" or more snowfall.
2) Is salt included.
3) Is it a zero tolerance lot.

I do alot of big zero tolerance lots that require clean pavement during business hours and I can tell you it's very demanding. I like your aggressive attitude but with mechanical breakdowns and unreliable people it goes from fun to hell on earth very quickly.
Keep me posted I am interested to know the outcome.

Shredder,


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

basically im stuck in a situation where someone offered me a set price for the season... im just trying to here peoples opinions and thoughts... i know set prices SUCK.... but im just waying my options... the parking lots ive done in the past where by the hour per machine and truck... so we never had to figure out what was needed and stuff... the end customer did not mind spending good money to have it done right... this is a different situation where its a set price and nothing good or bad is guarenteed.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

so if someone offers you a set price and went back to them and said hey ill do it with 2 trucks and a rented loaded... it might not be as quick as you want but it will get done... if the customer didnt mind, i would do the whole thing with my own truck, but realistically that isnt going to happen...


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

the other thing in my mind is... there are people out there that will spend $25,000 a storm to have there parking lot cleaned... versus another guy looking to spend $25,000 a year... theres no safe bet with a fixed contract.... obviously an ideal contract would be hourly or per push... but beggeres cant be choosers... im a young guy... looking at the numbers... im looking at the POSSIBLY end result... and taking it as chunk of change... more than i would be making if i was plowing for 65 an hour.... everyone has to start someone, i know... i know i shoud get something or several lots that are smaller... but if the numbers are there... then why not way my options... i understand we could have the worst winter or the best winter...depending on if you have a fixed contract or not... or how many storms we get... its a big f'n guessing game...


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

Stone...i hear where youre coming from in that last post. Look at it this way too....if you get $25k for the season, and you have an active winter, half or better of that money could go towards expenses. Lets say you pocket $10k of that. If you have to plow Nov-March, thats 5 months..equals $2k a month, equals $500 a week all season...you could plow once a week for all we know, and have 20 events...Is all those long hours really worth a $500 paycheck for the week? Now if you could pocket even $20k it might be worth the time. Lets say the guy youre subbing for is probably getting $30-$40k for the account, and thats honestly what id have to get in order to deal with that lot. Thats just the way im thinking about it.


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## smoore45 (Oct 27, 2007)

Stone, I would definitely have a loader ready and at least a third truck to run either for a backup or when the snow is really flying. Subbing the loader out is probably your best option. And was the 25K your initial offer from the guy who is subbing you or was that your bid? If it was an offer then you should always counter offer.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

that was his offer.. its a company... one of the employees made a statement like the price is what it is, but it was said quietly and kind of without confidence, you know what i mean ... but i call ********... i think there going off of last years numbers... which was a small to medium winter and want someone to do it as cheap as possible obviously ... who knows... Thats the thing about a set price is that i could make good money or i could work long hours and make regular money... do you think i could counter offer without upsetting them... im looking at the money as a chunk of change once my expenses are paid off... cause i dont know how many hours im going to work... confusing...


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

that was his offer.. its a company... one of the employees made a statement like the price is what it is, but it was said quietly and kind of without confidence, you know what i mean ... but i call ********... i think there going off of last years numbers... which was a small to medium winter and want someone to do it as cheap as possible obviously ... who knows... Thats the thing about a set price is that i could make good money or i could work long hours and make regular money... do you think i could counter offer without upsetting them... im looking at the money as a chunk of change once my expenses are paid off... cause i dont know how many hours im going to work... confusing... 

I DO APPRECIATE ALL YOUR COMMENTS THOUGH.. EVEN WHEN THEY ARE NOT WHAT I WANT TO HEAR


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## shredder781 (Sep 27, 2008)

Stone, I was in your position many times before so i know whats going on in your head!!!
if you you realize the position your in and accept it i say go for it.This can lead to bigger and better things or flop. annual contracts with no snow cap are always a risk, but they can also pay huge.
Shredder,


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

About 10 years ago I was asked to do this place for $27,500 including salt. I took it and we received about 50% of our annual amount of snow. The next year the same guy told me he had someone that would do that place for $24,500 and did I want to match the price. I told him I was going to raise my price by $10,000 because it can't be done on a normal year for $27,500. The guy that gave me the work just keeps shopping until he gets the lowest price so he makes more. My leason learned is price your own stuff and not what someone tells you. I hope you have a light year because it looks like you are plowing that place.


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

Stone, us MASS guys want to know what the location is so we can help you. Not because we are going to try to take the work from you. Its evident that you dont even belong there this winter. What is the location?


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## 18lmslcsr (Jan 20, 2007)

he hah he!
The group who take care of the local Wally World and Menards parking lot (it's huge - just like the one above) use tons of salt and tons of huge earth moving equipment (Case) and it takes them days to do a lot that size. S.E. WI. (110" last year)

C.

p.s. run forest....run


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## smoore45 (Oct 27, 2007)

Stone, I guess it depends on your relationship with they guy. Someone above said that you should price your own stuff and I totally agree. Take a little time to figure out what YOU would charge for this parking lot. That way if you do counter offer you have some explainations for why the price went up (i.e. I'll need a loader, cleanups after the place closes, etc. etc.)


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## Neige (Jan 29, 2008)

Stone it is important to know your numbers. Lets say its 225,000sq. ft, so 5 acres.
Lets say your trucks do 1 acre an hour each, so 2.5 hrs. for 2 inches of snow. Add 15% more time for every inch of snow.
Lets say the average is 20 events per year, and 5 inches average. I think it fair to say you will hit your account 40 times, that would include bigger storms, and returning the following night to clean where there were cars.
Based on all that you get around 80 hours per truck.
Say you will have to stack after every 25 inches, so 4 times. So min 4 hrs for a loader, lets be safe and say 20 hours loader time to stack.
Sidewalks to keep things simple say 2 guys with snow blowers, at the same amount of time as your trucks. 80 hrs per guy.
Salting if its included again 600lbs to 800 lbs per acre so 1.5 - 2 tons each time. Again to keep it simple say 40 times there will be times you get only freezing rain, so 60 to 80 tons
Have no Idea what salt costs in your area, or what you will be using. Don't forget to add the time to spread it.
I hope this helps, the plowing times I got of the SIMA site, I don't use pick ups. Salting depends on the individual Elite goes by 600 lbs, I do 800 lbs.
If the price is based on last years numbers, its to cheap. The price of fuel alone allows for a 5% increase, and the salt as much as a 50% increase. No go and crunch these numbers and see what you come up with.
PS I often add 15% as padding, until I really get to know the site and customer.


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

The average in this area is closer to 15. 10 events is what to expect. 20 would be an above average winter.


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Exactly Gicon... Neige... I really appreciate your comment... I just got home from work... So im going to shower and eat... but when i come back ill sit down and figure everything out... You the man... thank you... ill let you guys know


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## jgoetter1 (Feb 23, 2007)

You're nuts if you accept the 25000 for that project. Whoever said that the guy shops around the contract is exactly right. Don't be the next sucker. 

If you're so desperate to make money plowing for yourself, start with driveways and build up to bigger lots. In 3-4 seasons you may understand why we're discouraging you.


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## ducatirider944 (Feb 25, 2008)

It sounds like your a sub not the contract holder. I would do it hourly per piece of equipment. The contract holder will get the big payout, I personally think you would be a fool to take on a contract like that at a set price. Yeah, you might laugh to the bank if you have a below average year, but you will lose everything, being your just getting into it if it's a bad year. I understand risk=reward but I think you might be over pushing the risk end. Just my $.02 but what do I know? I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

ive got about 20 driveways now... but i want to get back into just commercial lots and be dedicated to commercial accounts and no bull****ting with old people or whatever... about the guys didnt do the back patio or something... you know what i mean... driveways are miserable... especially when youve duallies


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

Stone781;603248 said:


> ive got about 20 driveways now... but i want to get back into just commercial lots and be dedicated to commercial accounts and no bull****ting with old people or whatever... about the guys didnt do the back patio or something... you know what i mean... driveways are miserable... especially when youve duallies


If you cannot handle the stresses and pressures of residential accounts, you will NEVER succeed in commercial plowing. If you cant handle problems that arise on a $30 driveway, how do you think you will manage problems on a $30,000 account? I have more driveways than you can shake a stick at, and more problems and headaches than anyone else in this town. The way I handle situations has been the way I got to where I am. You are not ready for a commitment this large....


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

i never once said i couldnt handle anything having to do with driveways... there easy... there a pain in the ass for the money... the only reason i have driveways, is because last year i did not do commercial... i never planned on doing driveways or would ever want to... i never once said i cant handle anything... the only reason i picked up driveways last year was because i got out of benig a sub for my old boss and didnt commit to commercial account until i had two trucks... you have 2 trucks and you do driveways... how can you say i will "NEVER" succeed in commercial plowing if you dont even do it? Ive done it, i know whats involved... the bigger the risk the bigger the reward in most cases... Its a whole lot easier for me to consentrate on 1 large account that to run around to about 20 accounts and worry about making your $30 a driveway... you shouldnt judge a book by its cover... Im willing to bet i would impress you in every aspect of my work ability... wether its landscaping, masonry, hardscapes or plowing and ive got the portfolio to prove it Im 24 and im not cocky or conceded but im doing pretty well for myself ... Ive been certified for years and i have never ONCE lost a customer in either landscaping, masonry or plowing... I can handle the headaches and the ********... but theres a time when the driveways get old and become more of a pain in the ass for your $30 a driveway... Where the commercial account, im there at all times... im able to stay on site and fix any problems that may occur and take on more responsibility... I understand there people out there that do driveways and thats fine... But when you have a newer 350 Dually Diesels... the truck is capable and more productive on commercial accounts... Everyone has there preferences... its whatever tickles your pickle... I just stated my opinion... I just didnt appreciate how you took my quote out of context and made it into something bigger than what was said... ive appreciated your previous comments but that one was ********.. Where are you from and how long have you been in business and what do you do... attach some pics of your work, id like to see them... i always appreciate good work...


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

I am from Mass, and run 7 trucks, and 19 guys doing nothing else but driveways. I think it is safe to assume I have more than 20 accounts. I overlooked your statement about having duallies. That is certainly not the most desirable truck for residential work. If you choose to take on that large account, good luck. If you ever get in a bind, you can call me, and if I can help you, I will.


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## BM'S PLOWING (May 11, 2008)

Have you thought about buying a new holland skid steer? I believe that they are offering 0% on them for 4 or 6 years. You might benefit more from that and not to mention that would help out a lot for that parking lot instead of renting one. Where in mass are you?

BM'S PLOWING
2005 F-250 W/ 8 1/2 FISHER HD
MODIFIED REAR SUSPENSION
2 YARD HENDERSON SANDER
HONDA HS-80 TRACK SNOWBLOWERS

SANDER MIGHT BE FOR SALE


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

North shore, beverly


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## sno commander (Oct 16, 2007)

stone will the contractor just hire you as a independent sub with 2 trucks payed by the hour? this way you do what your equipment allows for a lot like that.make sure he understands that more equip. is needed for alot this size. this would save you alot of headaches it would be his problem to bring a loader in or whatever it takes to get the job done in a timely fashion. then maybe next season you can work out a deal with him about you doing the lot by yourself since you would have a heads up on what is needed to do this account. hope this hepls:salute:
nick


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## aeronutt (Sep 24, 2008)

I'll appologize up front for sounding a bit presumptive...

You own a landscape company, but not a loader? Isn't it time to start playing with the big boys and get one? It's a long-term commitment, but it will pay for itself. Renting means you eventually pay for one, but don't own it. You can find a lot of decent Bobcats on the used market for 12K or so. Bigger models are more capable, but watch out for getting too big for the landscape jobs you do if you work in tight areas.


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## Neige (Jan 29, 2008)

Hey Stone, have you run your numbers yet. You dont have to give them to us, just let us know if your :crying: or payup. Remember everyones numbers are different.


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## scitown (Dec 9, 2007)

Stone781;603702 said:


> North shore, beverly


Im happy you answered. I do drives on the south shore and I live in Weymouth right now. In a pinch after a storm I may be able to help. As far as stealing your account like someone else said. Noone else will try it with two trucks and one loader so I think your safe. Goodluck


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## Stone781 (Oct 9, 2008)

Yes, i own my own landscape company... I started it 4 years ago... Ive been in the business for 7... Im only 24... Ive got a $37,000.00 truck... A $28,000.00 truck... A landscape trailer... An enclosed trailer... 2 ride on machines... 2 walk behinds... Wet saws... Compactors... Tow behind mixer... Compressor... Leaf vacs... When i started out, i had a partner... Once we split business 2 years ago... It was starting over for me... I think im doing pretty well i let me work speak for itself... In time ill step up with the big boys... What do you have for equipment aero? Any pictures of your stuff? I dont owe any money on any machine or truck... Today i went looking for another truck actually... I was thinking about a machine... I know it would help me out alot in the summer... But i wouldnt have work for it everyday... So if i do i might buy a used cat... 

Neige- its a tough situation... I just got in from work.. Im going to eat and clean up... Then ill reply again... I sent an email to the contractor... Like i said before the #'s could go either way... And theres nothing to go off of except the facts of the last 10 seasons... And even that is to just get the smallest winter... The biggest... The average and the average amount of storms, etc.

Sno command - i would like to be hired as an hourly rate... That is one of the offers i mentioned... Thats how i use to get paid.. Back when i only had 1 dump truck... 

Thanks for all you guys's help.... I look forward to more of it


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