# Notice for all Ford trucks with the E40D transmission



## streetfrog

To everyone that has a 90's or newer Ford with the E4od transmission.
DO NOT Run your truck with the HAZARD lights on.
By doing so will cook your transmission. 
The torque converter lock up solenoid is controlled by your brake lights. Every time they flash they switch the solenoid on/off. 
By doing that it ends up destroying your transmission ! 
Just an FYI for you Ford owners.


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## SnoFarmer

just a Q..

fords have an electronically controlled toque converters?
How is this accheved?
I know how a torque converter works, so how does this work?


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## streetfrog

It is the TCC lockup solenoid that is the issue. I can't go into the specifics as I am not that knowledgeable on the electrical breakdown of it. I worked for a transmission shop for 3+ yrs and after R&R ing hundreds of em for that specific issue I am bringing it to the attention of as many ford owners as possible. I have been told by the owner/builder at that shop and also from a Ford service management about the exact cause of failure.


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## B&B

SnoFarmer;492911 said:


> just a Q..
> 
> fords have an electronically controlled toque converters?
> How is this accheved?
> I know how a torque converter works, so how does this work?


 Most all lock up converters are electronically controlled SF...only the very early units relied totally on hydraulic activation...Ford's AOD's are an example.

The clutch in the TC is still hydraulically applied, but the hydraulic activation is controlled by an electric on/off solenoid (_exactly_ like a valve/solenoid on a plow pump). The ECM uses many different input readings from different sensors, including the brake light switch like street frog mentioned to decide when the TC should be engaged or released..or in the late model stuff, held somewhere in between.


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## B&B

FYI: Most of the newer stuff (GM especially) actually cycle the TC clutch on and off dozens of times per second...this allows for a smooth, controlled and easy apply and release on the clutch so the driver never feels the TC lock or unlock. GM refers to it as "EC3" converter strategy.


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## merrimacmill

Well, good thing I don't own a ford.


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## streetfrog

Thank you B&B You explained where I couldn't seem to get the point out. thank you.


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## DeereFarmer

I never would have thought of that. Good to know.


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## KINNCO

*one would think that it would be controlled by a brake sensor not a flashing tail light
interesting though*


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## streetfrog

Ahhh But thats the thing. It is controlled by the brake light Circuit. Of which the hazard lights run through. Hence the problem with doing so.


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## jjtmarineb2

Good to know! So is there a recall on this or what? Interesting to say the least.:salute:


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## sparky8370

Try and find a wiring diagram of where this thing ties into the brake circuit and add a diode just after it. That way the flashers won't backfeed and and kick it out. I's sure the point of this is to turn off the tc lockup so you can actually stop.


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## StoneDevil

whats the source of this info??


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## gotsnow?

So I probably shouldn't be power braking my Ford???


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## BREAULT69

Brake switch is actually several switches inside. Seperate circuits for the actual lighting and signal to PCM. That's why your cruise control doesn't shut off when you activate turn signal or hazard. The PCM looks at several inputs (speed,gear,load,rpm,temp,throttle pos. etc.) and decides to lock or what % to lock the converter. If trans. is failing because of hazard light operation it's probably because if your hazards are on something outside of normal operation is occuring - snowplowing, pulling heavy load etc.


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## rjfetz1

So how do you tell if you have that transmission? E4od??


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## KINNCO

StoneDevil;496345 said:


> whats the source of this info??


*good question*


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## BREAULT69

Here is the connector view from Alldata for a 2003 F-350. 4r100 trans. Updated version of E4OD. The signal to PCM that controls the trans. is a completely seperate circuit from the lighting system. There are seperate contacts inside the brake switch. I've even taken them apart and looked. If you don't believe me drive down the highway at 60 mph and activate your hazard lights. If this circuit controlled TCC you would feel a "trailer hitching effect" or what may feel like the trans. shifting up and down as the lights flashed. You would see the tach bounce as well. The engineers who designed this system definitely made some mistakes but this was not one of them. If you want to help your E4OD get a reputable trans. shop to recommend and install a valve body kit (shift kit) such as a sonnex. These trans. are very expensive $2500.-3000. to replace with oem and double that for an extreme duty unit. It would be worth your time to talk to a trans. specialist (reputable) about a kit, and keep them serviced. 4X4 LOW is your friend.


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## niederhauser la

I have a light on my truck when the T/C is locked the light is green. I drove down the high way and turned on my flashers and the light did not blink. Plus the T/C usually wont lock up when plowing anyways unless your are going pretty fast.


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## Ggg6

rjfetz1;496950 said:


> So how do you tell if you have that transmission? E4od??


You do not have it in your 06.


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## KINNCO

Did anyone ever find out the real deal on this story?


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## LTL

This is how rumors get started. Their is no evidence that the hazard cause transmission failures on E4OD's.


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## Milwaukee

I don't believe this. My uncle have ford truck and he did pull trailer since it have flat tires so he turn on hazard light and drove 2 miles to gas station and auto transmission still work.


We need is see PROOF where you found that. Where link?


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## KINNCO

I used mine all last winter.


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## Dstosh

KINNCO;543350 said:


> I used mine all last winter.


If you are referring to the truck in your sig, it doesnt have the e40d, it has the 4r100 i beleive.


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## Ggg6

Only the 92-97 body style F250-350, and vans had the E4OD trans, the 99+SD trucks got the 4R100 or 5R110 depending on what year/engine.
My 96 did not unlock the torque converter with the hazards and neither does my 2000 both trucks have a 7.3L PSD engine.


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## Ggg6

Only the 92-97 body style trucks had the E4OD trans, the 99+SD trucks got the 4R100 or 5R110 depending on what year/engine.
My 96 did not unlock the torque converter with the hazards and neither does my 2000 both trucks have a 7.3L PSD engine.
* I can't delete my previous post I don't know why this site will not allow this, but oh well. I edited to reflect that there were more than 3/4 and 1 ton trucks that used the E4OD such as the F150 Lightning.*


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## AbsoluteH&L

streetfrog;492923 said:


> It is the TCC lockup solenoid that is the issue. I can't go into the specifics as I am not that knowledgeable on the electrical breakdown of it. I worked for a transmission shop for 3+ yrs and after R&R ing hundreds of em for that specific issue I am bringing it to the attention of as many ford owners as possible. I have been told by the owner/builder at that shop and also from a Ford service management about the exact cause of failure.


This is for all those that are to lazy to read the post, READ THE FREAKIN POST!!!


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## Ggg6

So whats your point H&L???


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## AbsoluteH&L

"I don't believe this...
We need is see PROOF where you found that. Where link?"

"This is how rumors get started..."

"Did anyone ever find out the real deal on this story?"

You just proved my point!


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## KINNCO

*AbsoluteH&L.....next time you should look at your Wheaties before you eat them*


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## niederhauser la

H&L Im confused...the bottom like is whoever posted this does not know what he/she is talking about! Using your flashers DOES NOT unlock the torque converter!!!!


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## AbsoluteH&L

I no longer have an e4od to know whether this is true or not, nor do I care. My pet peeve is when people ask questions that have clearly been answered previously in the thread.


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## KINNCO

AbsoluteH&L;543980 said:


> I no longer have an e4od to know whether this is true or not, nor do I care..


If you don't care,Then don't post..it's that easy bro!
Skip right by it if it bothers you that much...


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## Sharpshooter77

And the bottom line is???


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## KINNCO

Sharpshooter77;544410 said:


> And the bottom line is???


Only the 92-97 body style trucks had the E4OD trans, the 99+SD trucks got the 4R100 or 5R110 depending on what year/engine.

The 96 did not unlock the torque converter with the hazards and neither does my 2000 both trucks have a 7.3L PSD engine.

* I edited to reflect that there were more than 3/4 and 1 ton trucks that used the E4OD such as the F150 Lightning.*


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## MrCarlson

I will give this a shot on my 97 F250 tonight, but I am pretty sceptical. It is pretty easy to tell when the torque converter locks and unlocks (it feels like it is shifting in and out of a gear). If the thought is that it locks and unlocks every time the lights flash, my grandma would even notice that. If the thought is that it just never locks, I guess that could happen, but I think most motorheads would notice that pretty quick. The only time you can really do any damage because the TC is not locked is if you are cruising at speed with enough load to make it heat up.

-Matt in MN
"Knowledge is HorsePower"
97 F250 PowerStroke, Boss 9'2" V, Airlift bags, TommyLift Tailgate


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## Honest Mike

I dont believe this one bit. The brake light switch, yes thats true, but the hazards being on??? I highly doubt it, but hey, with Ford, anything is possible, lol.


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## Honest Mike

"IF" this was true, then wouldnt the converter be locking and unlocking while driving down the highway, making a lane change, with your right or left blinker on??? If you say the hazard lights blinking make it lock and unlock, because the bulb is flashing, then the blinker being on should do it too no??? Its the same bulb blinking!!! I dont believe this, no way no how. Im not calling anyone a liar or anything like that, just think this is false information, or information wasnt relayed to us correctly...


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## ageel

*From Ford Truck Enthusiasts*

Take this for what it is worth. I don't know the guy but he does have the background.

Originally Posted by SpringerPop 
There's a ex Ford tranny design guy (handle: Mark Kovalsky) that occasionally hangs his hat here. He'll know.

Posted by Mark Kovalsky
Yeah, I do know about this.

It's true. The four way flashers will cycle the torque converter clutch. It wasn't intentionally designed that way, it was an oversight.

The PCM unlocks the torque converter when the brakes are applied. The PCM looks at the brake light circuit to determine when the brakes are applied. The PCM can't tell the difference between the brake lights and the four ways, in the circuit they look identical.

There was a fix put in, but I can't remember exectly when. I thought it was around '97, but that's too long ago for my limited memory. The fix was to calibrate the PCM to ignore the brake light circuit if the go pedal is more than 10%.

__________________
Mark

Former Ford automatic transmission engineer, 1988-2007.
on edit: Link to their forum thread http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/7...iller.html?highlight=flasher+converter+lockup


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## ron f350

I have a 94 f 250 e4od the trans just stopped working out of nowhere no grind slip nothing could this be the problem??


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## kimber750

ron f350 said:


> I have a 94 f 250 e4od the trans just stopped working out of nowhere no grind slip nothing could this be the problem??


May be better off starting a new thread instead of posting in an 8 year old thread.


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## Jonny O

Well its a good thing my brakes don't come undone instead of the TC! Hi, all, 94 E250 Owner here (V8 / 5.8L / E4OD). It has been dubbed "Great White Marshmallow" a.k.a. "Dirt Box". I cant seem to let her go! 

Anyhow...I read this thread the other day and did a couple tests with it in mind. I am a believer of Mark Kovalsky if he in fact was a "FORD Tranny Design Guy". I did not have a clue as to why my transmission either shifts smoothly into 2nd, clunks into 2nd or slips gear after 1st and in OD on the highway causing the RPMs to crank (mainly going downhill - brake tapping). 
I live here at the beach and there are a lot of stop signs when cruising through the neighborhood. Sometimes every block! I have not tried driving with the hazards as I don't want to make the "Great White Marshmallow" a.k.a. "Dirt Box" upset but maybe one of these days. 
So I noticed that if I do a minimal and typical "California Roll" using less than 10% brake or even up to what feels like 15% I will have that clunky shift from the sleeping torque converter. I have tried stopping with my foot down on the brake hard (as I probably need new brakes) and then letting the brake pedal come all the way up before I accelerate and there is minimal hard shifting and slipping of gears. Ahh the joys of owning a pre-2000 FORD again (such quirky fixes). I love the personality that the design error creates, however it could be a definite safety issue if one needs to punch the gas as in an evasive maneuver to avoid a collision, etc. I need to do a bit more research on the fix for this although I saw some really awesome posts with alternative PC fixes. Ive already soldered the main resistors on the PC for a different quirky FORD fix, I cant imagine this fix being too much different. That is all.

"Less focus on possessions + more focus on experiences = a rich life" 

Thanks All, Ill try to write too long of a post on here again soon,

"The Great White Marshmallow" aka "Dirtbox"


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## Jonny O

Also wanted to just mention that I will be inspecting the spring/cable for my brake as well line to ensure it springs back to the resting position as soon as I let my foot off. I will also be looking to buy a new "4 way flasher module" (Blue plastic, tucked behind the fuse box according another thread). I will start at the dealer and see if they will foot the bill. 

On a side not, my high tail light (center) is cracked from who knows what and leaks water into the back! Time to rig something up or hit the junkyard haha.


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## michaelclyde

kimber750 said:


> May be better off starting a new thread instead of posting in an 8 year old thread.


Even if topic is possibly relevant? Found this thread (and forum) while searching "_E4OD solenoid"_. Spouse has a '96 5.8 Econoline-150 conversion van and is wearing thru brakes from what appears to be "_torque converter clutch not engaging_"? Has that pulling/not coasting feeling all the time with the transmission reving high in all the forward gears, late or not shifting at all?
I realize this is not a 'repair' forum, understand less about auto transmissions but is it possible problem is electric, control circuit related rather than tranny itself?

Will try "flasher/brake light experiment" by tapping brake while accelerating to see if it shifts up!


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## Randall Ave

Welcome to the site. Seems to be the way it's done here. Is the light on the shift lever flashing? And check all your fuses, I don't remember what one, but if a particular fuse blew, the transmission would shift hard. Otherwise it's a trip to the transmission shop.


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## michaelclyde

Randall Ave said:


> Welcome to the site. Seems to be the way it's done here. Is the light on the shift lever flashing?


 As Elvis might say "_why thankyou very much_"!!

Well jury is in on '96 5.8L Econoline-150 replaced TPS (throttle position sensor) for $58 after 20% off @ AdvanceAuto and high idle/trans not shifting problems are _GONE_, is running just fine now. Suppose I got lucky despite busting all knuckles, mounted on the bottom of the throttle body like it is could it 'ave been worse??

Only had to remove one bottom coolant line to eventually get at it replaced a cracked short vacuum line but Ford used two _locked tight_ phillips screws (20 year old heads!!) so after managing to get one out had to bust and melt what was left of the old TPS replaced both with new hex heads.

Looks like _No Sanding_ at Hartsfield airport with Peterbilt spreader kit this year The South is predicting a mild winter _Oh Well_!! Been doing alot of '_hot rock_' paving lately _gov't prints own money will spend_!!


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