# Plowing Laws?



## ALarsh

I am wondering where/what the plowing laws in Wisconsin are. Is there a site I can find all of the laws for plowing?

Is it illegal for a 16 year old to be plowing residential driveways? Commercial? What are the laws?

Thanks for any help.


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## clark lawn

check under your states web site for minor labor laws most states prohibit minors from occupations operating motor vehicles.


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## basher

You also might want to check your insurance. My Corporate insurance won't allow drivers under 21.


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## meyer22288

i was plowing the week after i turned 16 in a chevy 3500 dump truck. no1 ever gave me a hard time about it. i doubt they would to you


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## qualitylawncare

You should be able to get coverage. It's whether or not you can pay for it!

Don't remember what I paid for insurance when I was 16 but I did do it. I'm paying about $175,000 per year for insurance.

My personal work truck is just over $980.00 per month right now. That's with no accidents or tickets on my record. 

Auto drops 10% when you have had your license for 3yrs in NYS. It would have been 10% less to begin with if I had taken driver's ed. I already knew how to drive so that was pointless.

You cannot sign a contract. That may be your biggest obstacle. If you can have the business in your parents name and have them sign the contracts you should be all set. Just make sure you are covered fully under the COMMERCIAL PLOWING insurance rider. Ordinary commercial or plain auto insurance will not cover it.


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## Mick

qualitylawncare said:


> I'm paying about $175,000 per year for insurance.
> 
> My personal work truck is just over $980.00 per month right now. That's with no accidents or tickets on my record.
> 
> I already knew how to drive so that was pointless.


$175,000??? What all are you insuring? At some point, it's not worth being in business if you're only working to pay expenses. Same with the $980/mo.

Most people do know how to drive when they take driver's ed - although some do take it without ever having driven before. The purpose is supposed to be to sharpen skills and make a safer driver. Has been since I took it back in 1965. That's why insurance companies reward having taken it.


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## T-MAN

qualitylawncare said:


> I'm paying about $175,000 per year


Thats some serious coin for insurance. 
$980.00 a month for one truck is not a very good deal though. 
One truck commercial runs me 1250.00 a year, you might want to shop your policy.
Todd


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## Midwest BuildIt Inc

qualitylawncare said:


> You should be able to get coverage. It's whether or not you can pay for it!
> 
> Don't remember what I paid for insurance when I was 16 but I did do it. I'm paying about $175,000 per year for insurance."""""
> 
> thats about $14,500 a month. how many guys you got working for you?


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## dlcs

BNC SERVICES said:


> qualitylawncare said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should be able to get coverage. It's whether or not you can pay for it!
> 
> Don't remember what I paid for insurance when I was 16 but I did do it. I'm paying about $175,000 per year for insurance."""""
> 
> thats about $14,500 a month. how many guys you got working for you?
> 
> 
> 
> Lets see a picture of your entire fleet. I want to see how many trucks that $175,000 can insure.
Click to expand...


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## Sawboy

175k in insurance????


14,583 / month 

+

Payroll

+

Fuel

+

Maintenance 

+

Supplies


Better be a multi multi million dollar company.....NET


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## Scottscape

I started plowing when I was 16 and never ran into any kinds of problems. If you can get a license and carry insurance I dont see a problem with it.


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## LwnmwrMan22

T-MAN said:


> Thats some serious coin for insurance.
> $980.00 a month for one truck is not a very good deal though.
> One truck commercial runs me 1250.00 a year, you might want to shop your policy.
> Todd


Yah, that $980 / month. There's some doo-doo there. My 2005 and 2003 Dodge 2500's run me about $2500 for the two for the year, so along the lines of T-Man.

Although, I guess you never specified it's a pickup. If you're talking tandem dump truck, then I suppose you COULD be running along the $980 or so. Even then, it's high.


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## Mick

qualitylawncare, I checked out your profile and your website. You sign your post "Steve". If you are Steve Krieger, listed as the owner of Quality Lawncare and Landscape Management and you are 19 years old, own 14 trucks and have the business shown, my hat is definately off to you. But please understand my skepticism. The website shows the company has been in operation for seven years, which means you were 12 years old. With 14 trucks and insurance of $175,000 that means an average of $12,500 per truck per year.


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## procut1

dlcs said:


> BNC SERVICES said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lets see a picture of your entire fleet. I want to see how many trucks that $175,000 can insure.
> 
> 
> 
> You need a fleet first in order to take a picture of it..... Do a search on this guys posts and you'll understand
Click to expand...


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## dlcs

procut1 said:


> dlcs said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You need a fleet first in order to take a picture of it..... Do a search on this guys posts and you'll understand
> 
> 
> 
> I know.
> 
> I've been calling Quality out on to the carpet for some time both on plowsite and lawnsite. He can always brag about all his trucks and employees but never seems to have a picture of more than a couple of trucks together. He made the comment one time that his trucks are scattered all over the state of New York so there is no way he could get a picture of them all. Didn't he just get a plow truck a couple of seasons ago? LMAO
Click to expand...


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## LwnmwrMan22

This thread is going in different directions, so I would like to post this direction as well......


In order to have a "fleet", do you need the trucks to be all named with the same company name, or can you just put a bunch of trucks together, with no company names on them, and say "here is my fleet"??

If the latter is the case, then I'll get all of my buddies together, all of whom have plows, take a great big picture of 20 plow trucks, even though we all have our own accounts / deals that we plow, and average out how much I pay for my truck for costs / insurance, multiply it by 20, and WHA-LA!!! I've got a full blown FLEET!


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## procut1

dlcs said:


> procut1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I know.
> 
> I've been calling Quality out on to the carpet for some time both on plowsite and lawnsite. He can always brag about all his trucks and employees but never seems to have a picture of more than a couple of trucks together. He made the comment one time that his trucks are scattered all over the state of New York so there is no way he could get a picture of them all. Didn't he just get a plow truck a couple of seasons ago? LMAO
> 
> 
> 
> Lotsa guys have been calling him out and to his credit he just ignores them..
> 
> Im not calling him a liar but I know a year or two ago he was working out of his parents driveway with a couple of Ford rangers and a couple of months later claims to have dozens of vehicles, crews, multiple companies and properties all across new york state.
> 
> If you look at his website he has pics of one grey ford and thats it I think.
Click to expand...


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## dlcs

procut1 said:


> dlcs said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lotsa guys have been calling him out and to his credit he just ignores them..
> 
> Im not calling him a liar but I know a year or two ago he was working out of his parents driveway with a couple of Ford rangers and a couple of months later claims to have dozens of vehicles, crews, multiple companies and properties all across new york state.
> 
> If you look at his website he has pics of one grey ford and thats it I think.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey don't forget his logging business too. Someone has said that it is his dad's business but he says its all his. i remeber last year he was talking about plowing a lot for free so he could learn to plow.
Click to expand...


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## procut1

And another point to make,

I do have what someone would consider a "fleet".

We have 15 vehicles on our policy, a commercial auto policy and I will say that our premium is nowhere near $175,000. I think maybe he put an extra zero in by mistake.

Now if you're 18-21 and have a ton of new vehicles and you register and insure them under your personal name then you would be paying a significant amount more but it would take a lot more vehicles to equal that number than a bank would finance for an 18-21 yr old.

Due to my own age, when I went from a personal policy on the trucks to a commercial policy I saved THOUSANDS of dollars, because once they are registered to a corporation, my age didnt matter as I was only listed as one of a whole list of drivers.


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## me1223

thats a very impressive fleet there, any tips for those starting out?


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## BCLARK

You had better check WI laws very carefully!! There was just a death of a 17year old who worked part time at a towing service ( in Brookfield Wisconsin) and I do not think he was supposed to be driving the truck or operating the hoist (which is what falied). 

Bob


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## ALarsh

BCLARK, my parents heard about that on the news and that is what triggered them to see if it is legal for me to drive a plow truck or not.


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## BCLARK

I'm going to guess that you cannot do this legally. Best to check with the state to make sure.

Bob


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## ALarsh

I did find the following information:

"the occupations of motor-vehicle driver and outside helper on any public road, highway, in or about any mine (including open pit mine or quarry), place where logging or sawmill operations are in progress, or in any excavation of the type identified in Sec. 570.68(a) are particularly hazardous for the employment of minors between 16 and 18 years of age."

http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/Title_29/Part_570/29CFR570.52.htm


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## BCLARK

I don't know about this. I would be VERY carefull!
! 
I would also check with an attorney who specializes in labor laws to make sure that you can do this.


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## ProWorkz.com

*???*



me1223 said:


> thats a very impressive fleet there, any tips for those starting out?


Don't lie.......!!!!!


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## RJ snow

qualitylawncare said:


> You should be able to get coverage. It's whether or not you can pay for it!
> 
> Don't remember what I paid for insurance when I was 16 but I did do it. I'm paying about $175,000 per year for insurance.
> 
> My personal work truck is just over $980.00 per month right now. That's with no accidents or tickets on my record.
> 
> Auto drops 10% when you have had your license for 3yrs in NYS. It would have been 10% less to begin with if I had taken driver's ed. I already knew how to drive so that was pointless.
> 
> You cannot sign a contract. That may be your biggest obstacle. If you can have the business in your parents name and have them sign the contracts you should be all set. Just make sure you are covered fully under the COMMERCIAL PLOWING insurance rider. Ordinary commercial or plain auto insurance will not cover it.


Dude what are you a 3 time phelony DWI case or what? You sure that isn't what your policy will pay out in the event of an accident. Sounds fishy to me. I heard of $1,000,000 business coverage for about 5% of that cost. I think I'd be shoppin around if I were you or get married and put it in your wifes name...**** that totally ridiculas. If i had the choice of gettin hitched to the first broad that looked my way or pay those rates i think i'd be headin to vegas.

Better yet can I be your insurance agent???? The dudes probably pocketing about $160K a year on ya!


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## ALarsh

RJ snow said:


> Dude what are you a 3 time phelony DWI case or what? You sure that isn't what your policy will pay out in the event of an accident. Sounds fishy to me. I heard of $1,000,000 business coverage for about 5% of that cost. I think I'd be shoppin around if I were you or get married and put it in your wifes name...**** that totally ridiculas. If i had the choice of gettin hitched to the first broad that looked my way or pay those rates i think i'd be headin to vegas.
> 
> Better yet can I be your insurance agent???? The dudes probably pocketing about $160K a year on ya!


Remember, he had 14 trucks and 19 trailers a couple months ago, but somehow couldn't get any pictures. I wouldn't waste your time.


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