# My 1st account *pic*



## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

My 1st year plowing and this is my 1st account! 
Can anyone draw some arrows on this picture or give pointers to show best plowing...I want to keep time down so i can move to my next account.

By the way, I agreed to plow this for $100 per push. Does that seem about right?










Thanks!


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## plowin101 (Jan 22, 2006)

Can you give some more details? What is the trigger for plowing? What type of blade are you using? Salt? I'm assuming this is an apartment complex.


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## THEGOLDPRO (Jun 18, 2006)

congrats but a hundred bucks seems too little for that size account, thats a big lot.and it looks like your going to have the hassle of cars and such. if i was plowing that lot i would have asked for more most likely double your quote.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

yepp It is an apartment complex, the trigger is 3" of snow, no salting, and i will be plowing with a ford 250XL with a western 7 1/2 standard.

The reason i agreed to $100 per push is i live here.


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

rush said:


> The reason i agreed to $100 per push is i live here.


Then i hope your getting a break on rent. What if it snows 1 or 2 feet? Still $100?
I would want no less than $300 for that lot


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

$300?? WOW... then prices really are different where your at.

That last guy was plowing it for $150 a push and he was a large landscape and plow outfit.
It took him about an hour to plow it... 1.5 hours if we got hit good.

sorry to say, at your price you wouldnt get any accounts in my area.


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

rush said:


> It took him about an hour to plow it...
> sorry to say, at your price you wouldnt get any accounts in my area.


Understandable...totally different markets. I guess i figured it right time wise...for my area between $200-$300/hr is standard.


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## Bruce'sEx (Sep 16, 2006)

I agree seems low price to me, but whats your average number of "pushes" a season?


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## murray83 (Dec 3, 2005)

$100 for 1-1.5 hours work? even $150 is still quite low for a lot that large.I'm guessing you get say around 20-25 storms a year? is this large lot really worth 2 grand a year to you?

What about parking issues,how many people live there? I think I see what 50 or so spaces? thats 50 cars and trucks you'll have to move around to get the lot fully cleared.

Also just to ask,who is looking after the insurance if someone was to say fall? for that price I'd make shure it was my landlord.I think he might be taking advantage of you,I really hope this isn't the case.


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## REAPER (Nov 23, 2004)

$100.oo Is still low for Wisconsin. You said the last guy was doing it for $150 so why go lower then that? Living there you will be expected to clean up any little spot there is when a car moves. Gas has increased since last year and this winter look for it to go back up to around $3 a gallon. Hit a car or damage some signage or anything and you will be paying them to plow. 

Looks like a lot of work for $100 bucks turning and backing up around cars. Seems like a low-ball price just to get the job which in turn will have you banging your head on the dash wondering why you agreed to such a low rate.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

murray83 said:


> I'm guessing you get say around 20-25 storms a year? is this large lot really worth 2 grand a year to you?
> 
> Also just to ask,who is looking after the insurance if someone was to say fall? for that price I'd make shure it was my landlord.


Insurance is definatly covered by the owner (landlord)

"20-25 storms"...I WISH!! last year the landlord paid for 6 pushes..

I know i lowballed it at $100 ..previous guy was at $150, like i mentioned. 
But i wish i could get even $200 per hour like some of you....most plow guys around my area that still charge by the hour, are bidding at $65.

I know it will hardly make a difference in my bank account, but its close to home, and if i'm not doing it someone else is for a measly $50 bucks more. Im looking at it as a way to make a buck and gain experience at the same time.

PS. I might look big in the pic..but its only a 24 unit apartment complex...8 apartments per building. thoes are the garages on the left and right of each building. most park in the garage in the winter.


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## AlaskaShooTer (Aug 2, 2006)

This lot looks like it will be a pain in the butt to plow. In looking at the way cars are parked, going different directions in the upper middle and lower sections plus the ends have structures built on 4 out of the 6 sections of the lot. Where exactly is the snow storage area? Looks like a lot of back dragging and plowing nightmare that's worth a couple Ben Franklin's a push. I don't think the property developer designed this lot layout with the snow plow contractor in mind.  

Good point on the insurance question. The only + points is the commute is short and you'll be in good with your landlord which is generally not a bad thing as long as they are happy with your work and don't expect you to be their "resident" snow guy. 

Good luck with the account. 

Rush, any chance they don't permit parking out on the lot during snow events if there are garages or carports for tenants? 

George


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

rush said:


> But i wish i could get even $200 per hour like some of you....most plow guys around my area that still charge by the hour, are bidding at $65.
> 
> Im looking at it as a way to make a buck and gain experience at the same time.


When i shot out the hourly numbers i just meant like adding up the number of driveways done per hour or taking commercial accounts and dividing the time i takes to do them by what the price is per push.

And your right about gaining experience and making some money doing it. Gotta start somewhere & happy plowing


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## murray83 (Dec 3, 2005)

lol,I wish I got $200 an hour  last year my half ton got $100/hr and even then people thought i was nuts,I get $20-25 for a driveway  oh well but if even I can get that you could get $125-150....that sized lot should go for $200+ I think the land lord is just being tight

Don't ever sell yourself short,for every one lost job there is 4 nice paying ones out there for you to find


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

AlaskaShooTer said:


> Rush, any chance they don't permit parking out on the lot during snow events if there are garages or carports for tenants?
> 
> George


Everyone out here is trained pretty good, during the snow storms they park in the garage and if they have multiple cars they wait for the main strip in the center to get plowed then park along the side there. Its close to winter and right now i only have 3 accounts..all comercial, this apartment complex a BP gas station and another apartment complex about the same size. They are all right next to eachother. (3 properties in a row on the same side or the street too...thankfully) Its just me and my truck...so im not even sure if i should look for more or not, since its my 1st time ever even driving a plow truck.


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## EnviroTeam (Sep 29, 2006)

Ok what the heck am I doing wrong???....lol...I don't see any picture anywhere...


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

Don't you see the picture in the first post?


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## THEGOLDPRO (Jun 18, 2006)

murray83 said:


> lol,I wish I got $200 an hour  last year my half ton got $100/hr and even then people thought i was nuts,I get $20-25 for a driveway  oh well but if even I can get that you could get $125-150....that sized lot should go for $200+ I think the land lord is just being tight
> 
> Don't ever sell yourself short,for every one lost job there is 4 nice paying ones out there for you to find


damn that sucks, i get no less then 45 per driveway, and it only goes up from there, i was being pretty conservitave with saying 200 per push, im sure once i saw it in person i would def ask for more, but im in ct, and they seem to pay better up here.


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## AlaskaShooTer (Aug 2, 2006)

*Price Upgrade*

Well Rush, it's good to hear that the other tenants are willing to work with the snow fighters but I'd talk to the property manager and at least get him/her/them to pay you what they paid last year. Fuel is no cheaper, maintenance etc. Life is just more expensive and I would at least ask them to pay what they paid for the service last year. I personally feel that would be more then reasonable and you'd split the difference of opinion here on the form. Many feel $200.00 is reasonable, you're willing to do it for $100.00 so $150.00 sounds like a more then fare amount for your area. Ask $175.00 and settle for $150.00 or $160.00.

Prices for services have not dropped 33% since last year. Just stop by your local mechanics shop, gas station, plow dealer. Ask if they have had a price decrease of 33%since last year? I realize you want the business but let's be realistic.

I'll be the first to admit I don't know squat about plowing. I'm new to this forum, I'm new to owning a plow but have learned a lot from reading the plow forums and the one thing I've learned is snow removal is not cheap. First you buy the equipment then you maintain it so when the snow flies it's ready to do the job. If you're in to it as a hobby or doing a friend a favor that's one thing BUT, I do know if you want to make money, make a profit and cover your expenses you have to charge what the market will bare. Push it!

It's nice that fuel prices have dropped over the past few months but don't count on them staying here for long. Even though you live in close proximity your equipment will not last forever and you need to make money now and sock it away to pay for the new stuff in the future.

My motto. You can't make too much money! Everyone else want's your $$$.

George


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

REAPER said:


> You said the last guy was doing it for $150 so why go lower then that? Seems like a low-ball price just to get the job


exactly..close to home and i need the experience.



REAPER said:


> Gas has increased since last year and this winter look for it to go back up to around $3 a gallon.


Where im at gas is down .38 cents per gallon from this time last year...

Wisconsin 
Regular Premium

October 22th: 
$2.24 $2.44

Last year: 
October 22th
$2.62 $2.79 

Thanks for all the positive comments..lol

Ok..Now i know you all feel i *** myself on my bid.. but that a side, anyone willing to help with my original question?


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## AlaskaShooTer (Aug 2, 2006)

*Fuel*

Where I am gas is still $2.999 a gallon, down $0.25 cents a gallon from its all summer price per gallon. HOWEVER, I'm happy to report diesel fuel is down to below regular unleaded prices to a sizzling $2.81 with the $0.10 cent Safeway, get screwed for the groceries, get fuel a little cheaper discount.

George


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## LLM Ann Arbor (Sep 18, 2006)

$100.00?

Whoa.


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

hey i live in madison wi, commercial is about 70-80 per hour and my ? for you is... when those cars move and you have to clean up and when the city plow comes by do they expect you to keep it open? i would charge $200 up to 6 inches. not including salting!


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

mr.mow said:


> hey i live in madison wi, commercial is about 70-80 per hour and my ? for you is... when those cars move and you have to clean up and when the city plow comes by do they expect you to keep it open? i would charge $200 up to 6 inches. not including salting!


our arrangement is for a $100.00 for the first push and $50 for and clean ups later in the day.


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

in southern wi we get maybe 10-12 snowfalls a season and maybe 4-5 are 6" or better and everybody and thier dog and cats own a plow or mower! its pretty funny the first time you see a dog on a stand up mower!


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

what inch level does that go to? and what is your official measurement location point? Airport?


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

you seem close to ball park. what about salting?


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## LLM Ann Arbor (Sep 18, 2006)

See that may be true that every tom, dick, harry and fireman has a plow, but the real reason your market wont bare higher prices is long term lowballing, thats trashed the market.

I suspect it will only get worse in all areas with the economy suxing like it does regardless of what the investment class republicans want you to believe in an election year.


Conversley on another thread a guy in Illinois bids a 15 space government property for 475 a push and a guy in Jersey says he does the same property for the gov for twice that

I refuse to work for free, and I refuse to take advantage.

This industry is going to hell if you ask me.

Im almost to the pointof subcontracting for someone specifically and not doing my own work and trying to compete aginst this crapola.


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

how are you lowballing if thats pretty much what everyone else charges. I think its price fixing! it happens more in this industry than most. which is illegal, but its not if there is competition and there is alot of competition in this market. Gas wars lowered prices because of competition(ok maybe a little lowballing) and price fixing happened after that,people got sued...cause there really wasnt much competition oil companys owned and controlled the market and they were fixing the price, now convient stores make nothing off the gas they sell its just to get people into the store to buy things. where as competition is supposed to stabalize a desired price for the market and it has here. it easy in snow removal cause not every tom dick and harry want to get up at 3 in the morn cause they have a truck and are unemployed and have extra money to buy a plow...it has stabilized!


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## LLM Ann Arbor (Sep 18, 2006)

Its not low balling if you are charging what your market will accept, but somewhere along the line someones been low balling that account, and presumably that market long before our friend started his business.

If enough of that goes on....it drives the market price down for everyone across the board.

And eventually across the country.


Its like if 2 guys sell milk for 1 dollar a gallon, and 2 guys sell milk for 3 dollars a gallon, sooner or later the guys selling it for 3, will have to sell it for 1, or go out of business.

Now they didnt lowball, but they end up in essence having too in order to compete.

Ya see?


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

gotcha. maybe other markets are inflated though. i follow but there is always two sides to the coin. if your still makin a profit and satisfied then live with it or move. i was going to go on but but we hijacked his thread.


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## murray83 (Dec 3, 2005)

Thats the big issue in this buisness...bidding.

There are too many morons with a truck out there trying to bid jobs but have no bloody clue what they are doing.

There was a reason the prior contractor bid this lot at $150,the key is to see how you can keep your operating costs lower than him,maybe he had all new trucks? or paid his employees more than you? just don't walk into a bid blind and yell out $100,now this land lord will expect nothing more than $100 now on for this lot,and everyone in this area will loose.

Myself I've stopped bidding on commercial,I can sit for hours working numbers and taking time to put in bids but morons will still do a Wal-Mart for $75 so I won't take the time to bid I have better things to do than waste my time when i'll be undercut anyway.

Oh well,what can you do?


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

LLM Ann Arbor said:


> Its like if 2 guys sell milk for 1 dollar a gallon, and 2 guys sell milk for 3 dollars a gallon, sooner or later the guys selling it for 3, will have to sell it for 1, or go out of business.
> 
> Now they didnt lowball, but they end up in essence having too in order to compete.


Thats true to a certain point. In this industry the low-ballers might be stealing work from us or maybe even putting us out of business....for now. But give it time, these guys are going to price themselves right out of business, with the cost of living go up, guys who get say $20 for a $45 driveway are not gonna be able to cover their expenses and eventually screw themselves. Either that or the customers will realize they get what they pay for and fire the losers. Figuring if in time these guys all price themselves outta business and whos left? Us, the real deal...the market wont be able to hold on $20 driveways with the cost of fuel and other things...therefore the market will be back to where it should've been the whole time and we get our business back, for the price WE want!


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## mayhem (Aug 25, 2006)

I think you first need to discuss with the owner/super/whatever where he wants you to put the snowbanks. Looking at the photo I'm assuming the lower outer buildings are the garages, I'd be inclined to push your piles as far as is reasonable off the front and rear edges of each parking lot while keeping it as close as possible to the garages themselves so you don't create a visibility problem for a tenant. Also pay attentio to that small outbuilding in the middle on the right. You're not doing the sidewalks but the onsite maintenance amn probably is and he'll be really pissed off if he has to dig out 6' of snowbank every time they get 4" on the ground.

Everything looks liek you'll want to backdrag away from the garages and then push the snow off the edge. You mgiht want to look into investing in a backdrag attachment for this.

Make sure you work out with the owner about lawn damages come springtime and try to accomodate runoff too for when it melts, you don't want to kill half the lawn because you put all the snow in a spot where it floods the yard for a month in the spring becuase you didn't ask about springtime drainage.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

Thanks Mayhem!

Just when i was thinking about slashing my wrists for being new to plowing and "low balling" my bid, you come along and restore my faith. 
I learned alot from your reply. I've heard so many times "a monkey can plow snow"... Well that might be true, but then theres guys like you that cover every angle, like run off for when the snow melts.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge with a new guy...maybe someday i can pay it forward.


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## mayhem (Aug 25, 2006)

No big deal. I'm pretty much a noob too, only been plowing a year and only do my own driveway. But nobody else was stepping up to offer anything useful so I thought I'd offer my two cents.

Guys, as I read it, the bid has been accepted, so rush is locked into a contract. I would no more expect him to back out on a contract than you guys would a commercial customer who signed a contract to have you guys plow them out. He's locked in, admits its his first time out and accepts that he needs to get the contracts in order to gain experience. If this place bends him over backwards and it costs him money instead of at least breaking even, so be it...he's got a contract. 

Rush, best of luck to you. I advise keeping really anal track of everything this year including official snowfalls, number of plowable events, number of multiple visits to your cutomers, fuel consumed, fuel costs, dates, time it took to get your money from the time you sent the bill (most businesses are either NET10 or NET30, make sure to discuss payment policy with prospects up front)...the more data you gather and collate this year means you have more useful data upon which to base actual decisions for next years bids.


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## dentman (Oct 20, 2006)

rush said:


> Insurance is definatly covered by the owner (landlord)
> 
> "20-25 storms"...I WISH!! last year the landlord paid for 6 pushes..
> 
> ...


Im relatively new to plowsite, but not marketing. You needed to tell the landlord that your worth 200 bucks a push because the job gets done immediately, and your onsite to cover any additional light pushes from moved cars, light shovel work, etc etc.. you'll be doing the odds and ends anyways because to your neighbors, your the plow guy and they will call you with problems as its your job to get them cleaned up... may as well be paid for it. Its all about value...charge the most the market will bear and add value to the deal. Provide more than expected and you;ll have gobs of accounts. good luck


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

dentman said:


> You needed to tell the landlord that your worth 200 bucks a push because the job gets done immediately, and your onsite to cover any additional light pushes from moved cars, light shovel work, etc etc..


 I disagree... I can offer the Job for less, Since i use no gas to get to the job or have no travel time to get there.

As for clean ups later in the day, There is an additional $50 fee stated in the contract.

Thanks!


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## 2moresleeps (Aug 23, 2006)

rush....you stated that you have a gas station and another complex. You didnt mention insurance. Believe me, no matter what the landlord "says", make sure it is in writing because any agreement you two have verbally will hold no weight in court.

IMHO, the gas station will be difficult for you to manage if its your first year plowing. Cars are always coming and going and rarely do you get a break.

Good luck, get the insurance.


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

*what you asked for...*

*Thats the problem*, sometimes people forget what the question is and just jump on the soap box. 3 things for you: 1) get plow insurance-and don't believe what your agent tells you, get it in writting and tell them exactly what you'll be doing- the gas station is going to cost you some bucks. 2) get ProWings for your plow, a 7 1/2 will take you a while, the wings will safe you 30-40 minutes on this lot. 3) this is a learning experience and you jumped right into the frying pan, keep a 3 ring binder in the truck with a copy of the contract, pictures of existing damage, and a log sheet that you list time started/finished, temp, amount of(at the lot, not the airport 30 miles away) / type of precip, and a note column for things like "blue lincoln in the way plowed in I meen around"

I assumed no curbs, they will just slow things down and you might have to rethink where to put snow. when pushing snow to a pile, make sure you account for all the snow yet to come, so don't push it 2' off the driveway- go 15' into the lawn if you have to. You'll thank your-self come February.

Since you'll have back-dragging to do and no salt to help you out, you will need a backdrag edge installed otherwise you'll have lots of hardpack build-up.

These links will show you the prowings and backdrag edge I have installed.
http://www.plowsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=15856&d=1140976743
http://www.plowsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=17056&d=1159126273

Oh yeah, get some reflective taped fiberglass snow markers and mark the corners of the lanes.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

Grn Mtn said:


> *Thats the problem*, sometimes people forget what the question is and just jump on the soap box. 3 things for you: 1) get plow insurance-and don't believe what your agent tells you, get it in writting and tell them exactly what you'll be doing- the gas station is going to cost you some bucks. 2) get ProWings for your plow, a 7 1/2 will take you a while, the wings will safe you 30-40 minutes on this lot. 3) this is a learning experience and you jumped right into the frying pan, keep a 3 ring binder in the truck with a copy of the contract, pictures of existing damage, and a log sheet that you list time started/finished, temp, amount of(at the lot, not the airport 30 miles away) / type of precip, and a note column for things like "blue lincoln in the way plowed in I meen around"
> 
> I assumed no curbs, they will just slow things down and you might have to rethink where to put snow. when pushing snow to a pile, make sure you account for all the snow yet to come, so don't push it 2' off the driveway- go 15' into the lawn if you have to. You'll thank your-self come February.
> 
> ...


*AWESOME!! *THANKS FOR YOUR TIME


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## nekos (Oct 16, 2003)

first of all you bid way to low ! 
even $200 for that lot is not enough.

Grn Mtn gave you some good advice, i would push the lot slightly different then him but it honestly wouldn't make much if any difference. 

BTW i know your trying to justify low balling this account but I'm going to tell you something that most of the guys that make the big money don't want you to know.

because your charging so little you have to rush to get the job done.
you have to plow more lot's to make the same amount of money. in turn you will end up doing a ****** job. the guy's that make $200+ an hour love low ballers. we offer something they can't... reliable and quality service.

next year after your truck has broken down 2 times and you over slept because $100 is not worth getting out of bed for, i or some one like me will come in and offer a reliable and quality service. if that's not what the property owner is looking for then you will keep the job. that is until your forced to compete with some one that low balls you and you low ball each other out of business. 

im not trying to take a shot at you or anything, i mean low ballers are the reason why i make good money.payup i should thank you


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

nekos said:


> first of all you bid way to low !
> even $200 for that lot is not enough.
> 
> Grn Mtn gave you some good advice, i would push the lot slightly different then him but it honestly wouldn't make much if any difference.
> ...


1st of all Nekos, My price will *NEVER* reflect the quality of my job...time to me on this job *IS NOT* important. I will do the same quality plowing job for them at $100 as i would if i were charging $200. By you assuming my quality of work decreases with pay only tells me, your one i would never hire for anything.

2nd of all Nekos, Even if it takes me 2 hours to plow this lot I will be making $50/HR Thats well worth it in my book.... So you go and bid your top dollar Jobs and make your customers feel all warm and fuzzy because you can "afford" to take your time. But The cold hard fact is, I will offer the same quality work you do for half of what you do, and still make money....so no need to thank me...thank you!


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## mr.mow (Sep 14, 2006)

Your not really making 50 an hour, once you deduct tax,insurance,gas,maintence, wear and tear and money you might be losing if you were charging more. just keep that in mind.


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## nekos (Oct 16, 2003)

rush said:


> 1st of all Nekos, My price will *NEVER* reflect the quality of my job...time to me on this job *IS NOT* important. I will do the same quality plowing job for them at $100 as i would if i were charging $200. By you assuming my quality of work decreases with pay only tells me, your one i would never hire for anything.
> 
> 2nd of all Nekos, Even if it takes me 2 hours to plow this lot I will be making $50/HR Thats well worth it in my book.... So you go and bid your top dollar Jobs and make your customers feel all warm and fuzzy because you can "afford" to take your time. But The cold hard fact is, I will offer the same quality work you do for half of what you do, and still make money....so no need to thank me...thank you!


your right , you might do a good job ... that is until you get your 6th , 7th and 8th account's. 
then your stuck, you either have to rush to get these done or hire a sub that you can't afford at your prices.

im not doubting you can or will do a good job... 
im just saying that you are setting yourself up to put yourself out of business like the rest of the low baller's.

im going to give you a scenario that is all to common in our business.
your out working and your trans drops. you have now lost money plowing that lot for the season. at your prices can you afford a back up rig ? a back up plow ? and most importantly , who will you get to plow this lot for that price ... when your truck can't be looked at much less fixed for at least 3 days ?

plowing snow is the easy part , it's running the business thats hard.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

mr.mow said:


> Your not really making 50 an hour, once you deduct tax,insurance,gas,maintence, wear and tear and money you might be losing if you were charging more. just keep that in mind.


earlier in the thread i stated: clean-ups later in the day will be additional $50.. so yes, it will probably be $50/per hour.

and gas..repairs..tax......all write off's


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## murray83 (Dec 3, 2005)

I'll have to agree.

the big issue with cutting each other throat is who really wins? shure you got the account for $100 when its $150 last year but next it'll go for $90,then $60 and so on.


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## rush (Oct 5, 2006)

nekos said:


> im going to give you a scenario that is all to common in our business.
> your out working and your trans drops. you have now lost money plowing that lot for the season. at your prices can you afford a back up rig ? a back up plow ? and most importantly , who will you get to plow this lot for that price ... when your truck can't be looked at much less fixed for at least 3 days ?
> 
> plowing snow is the easy part , it's running the business thats hard.


...And you think charging $50 more for this lot is going to change anything you just mentioned, considering i am only taking on 3 accounts??

I understand what your sayin, it just does not fit my situation.


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## nekos (Oct 16, 2003)

rush said:


> ...And you think charging $50 more for this lot is going to change anything you just mentioned, considering i am only taking on 3 accounts??
> 
> I understand what your sayin, it just does not fit my situation.


nope $50 more would do nothing. you would still be working for minimum wage.
$150 - $200 more would bring you into the $75 - $100 an hour mark after taxes and operating costs though.


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

nekos said:


> ... i would push the lot slightly different then him but it honestly wouldn't make much if any difference...


I laugh because once I get on site I usually end up doing something different than planned also

Oh, your killing the thread, you made your point, its different from his, neither of you are going to change, move on.

Come on everyone, read the question and answer it, nowhere did he ask if his pricing was on track, he just wanted an opinion on how best to plow it.

EDIT: okay so I just reread the top and he did ask how his pricing was as a second question -my bad. But everyone also knows debating costs is like discussing politics with your girlfriends dad, don't do it! Hell it looks about a 45min job, thats $125 p/hr.


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## nekos (Oct 16, 2003)

Grn Mtn said:


> EDIT: okay so I just reread the top and he did ask how his pricing was as a second question -my bad. But everyone also knows debating costs is like discussing politics with your girlfriends dad, don't do it! Hell it looks about a 45min job, thats $125 p/hr.


your right , i probably should have just said his price was to low and move on. 
it just drives me nuts when people bid low to get a job and leave so much money on the table.

im hoping he will see why the bid was low and with his 4th and 5th accounts, he can start to charge correctly and have some money to buy his friends a few rounds at the end of the season.

anyway ...
i never plow a lot how i had planed from the start ... it always takes me a few try's to figure out that the way i had planed first was the fastest


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

nekos said:


> ...and leave so much money on the table...


now that is exactly my point:salute: it has been said many 'o time before, but who else is on-call 27/7 for 5 months, beats the crap out of their equipment, and has to pay arms and legs just to be legit? answer-plow guys, so why not charge accordingly


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