# pumps for spray system



## AbbottCon. (Jan 12, 2010)

I am going to make my own magic salt and i am trying to build my own spray system i already have a poly tank and i was wondering what/where to get the right pump. I'm in mass but i don't mind shipping if anyone can lead me in the right direction.


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

If you want gas buy a honda powered trasch pump rated for chemical use, ussually a plastic pump body, impeller and I think viton seals. If you want electric look at Turbo Turfs website, they sell electric pumps for this purpose. Either way, end of season thorughly flush with fresh water as even though your mix might not be corrosive to the pump as it dries up it will leave heavy deposits and can "lock up" the pump, had this happen couple years back and had to take the pump apart, remove literally chunks of deposits and it took a long time to get it all out. Also central equipment in I think Wayland Ny is a great source for Banjo fittings, hose, remote valves, and maybe pumps.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

AbbottCon.;956525 said:


> I am going to make my own magic salt and i am trying to build my own spray system i already have a poly tank and i was wondering what/where to get the right pump. I'm in mass but i don't mind shipping if anyone can lead me in the right direction.


Are you going to treat the pile, or wet it at the spinner?


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## AbbottCon. (Jan 12, 2010)

I am looking to treat my pile of salt. effectively making my own magic salt just not paying as much. so i basically looking to built a skid mounted spray unit.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

AbbottCon.;956802 said:


> I am looking to treat my pile of salt. effectively making my own magic salt just not paying as much. so i basically looking to built a skid mounted spray unit.


How many gallons of liquid will you need to spray per ton? How many tons of salt?


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## AGMI (Nov 26, 2009)

I do the same thing, and I am local to you. Here is what I do. I have 2 - 300 gal. tanks that I have plumbed together. I have a 2" hose that reduces to 1 1/2" to 3/4" at the end. I have them 10' off the ground. (my supplier hooks up to the hose to fill) I have enough pressure with the gravity to treat my pile. I usually get in trailer loads. If you want to come down to see how I have it PM me. I can get you the tanks for about $125 ea and my supplier sells all the plumbing.


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## AbbottCon. (Jan 12, 2010)

i have a 300 gallon poly tank already. you need to spray 3 gallons per ton and we do about a 100 ton a season. the problem with the gravity feed system is we mix in batches of about 20 ton in a couple locations none of which are my shop. which is why i need a skid unit with a pump for mobility


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## RacerBren (Nov 6, 2005)

Kubota 8540;956812 said:


> How many gallons of liquid will you need to spray per ton? How many tons of salt?


8 gallons per ton..


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

RacerBren;958447 said:


> 8 gallons per ton..


The reason I asked all the questions was to find out what pump you actually needed. A small electric would be more than enough to handle 8 gal/ton and 20 tons. I treated my salt pile with liquid calcium chloride last year with the electric pump ( 5 gal/min ) I have and it did fine. I paid $150 for the pump and fittings. Hooked up to the tote and pumped from the bottom valve. The pump was a 5 gal/min 12 volt unit. It worked fine, but didn't break any speed records. Why build a skid unit unless you plan on using it for a sprayer later on? Most of the gas powered pumps are like 160+ gallon per minute. That would be to big in my opinion.


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## RacerBren (Nov 6, 2005)

A 5hp trash pump would be ideal. It more $ but more versatile.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

RacerBren;958585 said:


> A 5hp trash pump would be ideal. It more $ but more versatile.


More versatile without any doubt. At roughly $300 + fittings and hose, maybe $400? Just depends if he has use for it other than just treating salt in the winter?


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## AbbottCon. (Jan 12, 2010)

could i step up the trash pump to do hydro seeding in the summer and if so where can i get a pump like that?


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

AbbottCon.;958735 said:


> could i step up the trash pump to do hydro seeding in the summer and if so where can i get a pump like that?


I don't know anything about hydro seeding but if you can figure out what pump will work for that it would be no problem to set it up for simply spraying a salt pile.
http://www.icecontrolsprayers.com/ also hydro seeding


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

5hp trash pumps can be had for around 500 with hoses. STRONGLY reccomend a honda engine.


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

Save the trash pump for pumping out sludge. Chemicals will eat aluminum up in no time flat. Most trash pumps are aluminum. My happy $150 aluminum barrel hand pump was chewed up in 1 month with magic -0. Useless junk now. Ate the seals and the aluminum. Mag. chloride products, (including as corrosive as water magic-0 ) eat the **** out of aluminum.
I now have a lil briggs powered pacer chemical pump, made for pumping ag. materials. Zero issues.


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## STREETGLIDE (Aug 20, 2009)

I wouldnt get a trash pump theres no control to them, Buy a Wilden air operated pump thats what we use on our asphalt sealer truck the pump will stop pumping when you close the ball valve,


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

If you decide to go the trash pump route most of the cheaper trash pumps have an aluminum pump and I would suggest you stay away from those. Banjo and Pacer make a poly trash pump that would work fine. If you want to make it into a hydro seeder for year round use you would not be able to make a very big one. I would say 150 gallons would be about all you would have the agitation to keep suspended. 

Cast Iron also doesn't seem to be a problem with anti-icing chemicals.


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## JJSLandscape (Sep 6, 2009)

go to the Banjo Pump website, and request them to send you some local distributor information. They sell a honda 5hp with the pump attached & sealed for around 750$. This is the exact pump that taconic sells as the "Magic Sprayer". I've decided to go this route and will be buying it next week. Let me know if you need any help.


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

How about this pump. 
5.5HP Brigs pacer pump.


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

The Banjo poly pumps can be purchased with the 5.5 HP Honda Electric start which is another plus. The electric start itself is no big deal but it does give you an electrical system so if you need to power an electric ball valve you can use the 12 volt system from the pump and not have to tie into your vehicles electric system.

That pacer on ebay is a good buy but personally for cold weather personally I like a Honda better.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

Just for clarification, the link and pump on Ebay is not a Pacer pump. It is the old Homelite pump line. It was purchased by Riverside Mfg and renamed accordingly. Riverside Pumps. It is a excellent pump motor combination, I have purchased several. They are similar to all brands of poly pumps. The Briggs engine is feed by a float feed carb and are excellent cold weather engines. How they compare to a Honda for longevity I don't know.


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

turboguy;963312 said:


> The Banjo poly pumps can be purchased with the 5.5 HP Honda Electric start which is another plus. The electric start itself is no big deal but it does give you an electrical system so if you need to power an electric ball valve you can use the 12 volt system from the pump and not have to tie into your vehicles electric system.
> 
> That pacer on ebay is a good buy but personally for cold weather personally I like a Honda better.


The Honda's corrode after a lil wile and start to give you problems. My new brigs did give me grief last time I started it in the cold. It started then didn't want start anymore so I said F it.

How much is a Honda with E start? $700

How are the electric Sotera pumps holding out on your spray systems and Electric in General?


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

Grassman09;963695 said:


> The Honda's corrode after a lil wile and start to give you problems. My new brigs did give me grief last time I started it in the cold. It started then didn't want start anymore so I said F it.
> 
> How much is a Honda with E start? $700
> 
> How are the electric Sotera pumps holding out on your spray systems and Electric in General?


If the head or area around the spark plug is wet it may be acting as a kill switch. Some kind of shield over the engine would prevent moisture or snow on the engine.


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

Kubota 8540;963732 said:


> . Some kind of shield over the engine would prevent moisture or snow on the engine.


That was in the plans just didn't get that far. Not that winter is over here :laughing: I will get back to the drawing board.


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

Grassman09;963695 said:


> The Honda's corrode after a lil wile and start to give you problems. My new brigs did give me grief last time I started it in the cold. It started then didn't want start anymore so I said F it.
> 
> How much is a Honda with E start? $700
> 
> How are the electric Sotera pumps holding out on your spray systems and Electric in General?


I wish it was that price but quite honestly as a manufacturer I pay more than that. We usually get $ 1295.00 for the electric start Honda with either the Banjo pump or the one that is now standard for us the Ace pump with E-coating. The Banjo was our standard pump for about 3 years or so. The pump worked well. The problem we had with it was the pressure. It only has about 30 psi. That works ok for a boom and will do a hose and gun but doesn't have much distance on the gun. We sold units to Pittsburgh and NYC and had to take them back and swap out the pumps because the city guys wanted to do steps standing at the bottom and spraying up and the Banjo just wouldn't do it. The Ace has much more pressure.

If someone wants either of those pumps and engines I would want to check and make sure the prices haven't gone up but I might consider a Plowsite special for $ 995.00. That would be plus shipping and tax for anyone in PA.

You asked about the Soltera. It has been a great pump. Very, very few problems and it has a 3 year guarantee on the diaphragm. The only problem with it is that it is 11 GPM which is pretty good for an electric but that flow will only let you run a one lane boom. that GPM is not enough for a 3 lane. Still, it is a great pump and very affordable. It comes with the control box and cable already in the package so that helps too.


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

That will work in a perfect world with no wind. Add some wind and that will be all over the place. Looks like it would take to long to apply with that electric pump.


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

Grassman09;979373 said:


> That will work in a perfect world with no wind. Add some wind and that will be all over the place. Looks like it would take to long to apply with that electric pump.


That is one of the reasons you don't want a high pressure pump. With a high pressure pump the spray tends to mist more and will blow but unless you are in gale winds there shouldn't be a problem.

As far as electric pumps I would agree with what you are saying if someone is using something like a sureflo pump at around 5 gpm but if someone is using a pump such as the Soltera at 11 GPM for anti-icing most guys are in the 30-40 gallon per acre range and that would be a breeze. For de-icing most guys are in the 60-80 GPA range with some going up to maybe 100 GPA which which would let you easily go at any speed most would want to drive in a parking lot. I have seen one or two guys who de-iced as high as 150 GPA and yes at that rate about 5-6 MPH is about all you could do. You are pretty much limited to a one lane boom with an electric set up however. An electric isn't a bad choice for someone who wants to try liquids without a big investment or someone who does a limited amount of work. It has a place and works well for those guys. If someone has a lot of work and wants to get it done as fast and efficiently as possible a gas powered unit is probably a better choice.


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

turboguy;979889 said:


> That is one of the reasons you don't want a high pressure pump. With a high pressure pump the spray tends to mist more and will blow but unless you are in gale winds there shouldn't be a problem.
> 
> As far as electric pumps I would agree with what you are saying if someone is using something like a sureflo pump at around 5 gpm but if someone is using a pump such as the Soltera at 11 GPM for anti-icing most guys are in the 30-40 gallon per acre range and that would be a breeze. For de-icing most guys are in the 60-80 GPA range with some going up to maybe 100 GPA which which would let you easily go at any speed most would want to drive in a parking lot. I have seen one or two guys who de-iced as high as 150 GPA and yes at that rate about 5-6 MPH is about all you could do. You are pretty much limited to a one lane boom with an electric set up however. An electric isn't a bad choice for someone who wants to try liquids without a big investment or someone who does a limited amount of work. It has a place and works well for those guys. If someone has a lot of work and wants to get it done as fast and efficiently as possible a gas powered unit is probably a better choice.


I looked at going electric and looked at the Sotera that you use and it was m ore expensive then a gas engine unit.

I use the Tee Jet SJ3 20 VP usually run around 20PSI which is doing around 42 GPA x 6 = 252 GPA Still need to play with they system a bit.
I stand corrected I shouldn't multiply right Kubota? 

Dultmier sells the electric Sotera for what $450 $500 you can go on ebay and get a Gas brigs for $350 $400 already.

I like electric for quietens but not the price.


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

Well, I will totally agree that the electric pump and a gas powered poly trash pump are not priced all that far apart but the electric is still far cheaper. I know that doesn't make sense but I will explain why.

With an electric pump like the soltera all you need to add is a hose going to your boom.

With the gas powered pump you need to add an electric ball valve, a control box for the electric valve and a bunch of plumbing, You need tank fittings, bypass hoses, you should have a strainer and more,

The soltera is a demand pump and you don't need a bypass and it has the control and wires already included,


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

What psi does the Soltera Electric pump put out?


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## Grassman09 (Mar 18, 2009)

Yes true you got me there. The buy pass ball valve was only $160 some 1" Hose and Some 2" hose thats maybe another $200. Gas is a lil more convenient you can pump form one tank to another or add a hose real for walks and what not. Lets just say they both have there place.  

What about using a big DC motor like a salt auger motor to run a roller pump? Can you get equal the flow of a gas engine then?


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## turboguy (Sep 16, 2008)

Kubota 8540;980231 said:


> What psi does the Soltera Electric pump put out?


I would have to check to tell you for sure and I am at a trade show in OHIO at the moment. It is not real high PSI, I would guess max operating pressure is around 30.

Grassman, you can also add a hose reel to electric units. I was going basically by the fact that our elecric units using the same tank and nearly the same frame are almost half the price of the gas. I guess those little parts can add up fast enough if you have enough of them. Yes, the electrics won't let you pump from tank to tank and gas will. I agree ther is a place for both and if someone is committed to liquids and has a lot of work gas is a far better way to go but there are people and places where electric is a good choice.

As far as attaching a DC motor like a salt auger motor to a centrifugal pump if you had the torque and the HP to turn it the same RPM you would have the same results. I haven't looked that close at those electric motors but my guess is they won't have enough power. Of course the centrifugal pumps used with the gas engines have a lot more output than neccessary and there may be a slightly smaller centrifugal pump that would work. I believe that salt augers run at a much lower RPM than a pump does and I am just guessing on that and that could be the difference. Good thought however.


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