# bidding on some gas stations



## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

i am putting together my bid for plowing and salting 11 gas stations around my area they are all on one contract. I have done the math and came up with a price it seems a little low to me what do you guys think.

I would be using 650lbs of salt if the salting is to be done after the snow plowing is complete it would be an extra $260 that would be $0.40 per pound of salt spread. If the salt is being put down before a storm or only an ice and the lots are not being plowed then I charge an extra $5 for every station to offset the fuel price that is already added in if I was to plow. that brings the total to $315. 

Do the numbers add up for they way you charge also or do they seem low. Any help both good and bad is better than nothing. Thanks for the help....

Wes


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## vt properties (Jan 28, 2010)

pvtwaggs14;1050795 said:


> i am putting together my bid for plowing and salting 11 gas stations around my area they are all on one contract. I have done the math and came up with a price it seems a little low to me what do you guys think.
> 
> I would be using 650lbs of salt if the salting is to be done after the snow plowing is complete it would be an extra $260 that would be $0.40 per pound of salt spread. If the salt is being put down before a storm or only an ice and the lots are not being plowed then I charge an extra $5 for every station to offset the fuel price that is already added in if I was to plow. that brings the total to $315.
> 
> ...


260 for 11 stops seems way low. I believe that is what you mean. An average gas station size say 20 parking spaces would be 50.00 to apply bulk salt or a mix of both and say. I usually charge the same or close to the same for the plow price. I have never pretreated but have applied only salt in the event of ice conditions. I use bulk , so figure how mucch a ton or yard costs and figure it that way.


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## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

vt properties;1050899 said:


> 260 for 11 stops seems way low. I believe that is what you mean. An average gas station size say 20 parking spaces would be 50.00 to apply bulk salt or a mix of both and say. I usually charge the same or close to the same for the plow price. I have never pretreated but have applied only salt in the event of ice conditions. I use bulk , so figure how much a ton or yard costs and figure it that way.


bulk salt today was 65 per ton picked up and for pre treating it works out really good for gas stations because it helps for when you plow because it keeps the snow from compacting and freezing to the blacktop. It is a trick that I learned from my dad, and I must say it works pretty well. when you break it down the bulk salt is .03 per lb and im charging .40 per pound plus $5 per station for fuel... It might still be a little low that why im asking for people to comment on it.

Thanks
Wes


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

pvtwaggs14;1050903 said:


> bulk salt today was 65 per ton picked up and for pre treating it works out really good for gas stations because it helps for when you plow because it keeps the snow from compacting and freezing to the blacktop. It is a trick that I learned from my dad, and I must say it works pretty well. when you break it down the bulk salt is .03 per lb and im charging .40 per pound plus $5 per station for fuel... It might still be a little low that why im asking for people to comment on it.
> 
> Thanks
> Wes


So basically you're estimating only using 23lbs per station? 
$9.45 per 23lbs but you're charging them $40-$60 according to your spreadsheet? 
You're making a killing if that's the case.


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

underESTIMATED;1051373 said:


> So basically you're estimating only using 23lbs per station?


How did you come up with this number?


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

pvtwaggs14;1050795 said:


> i am putting together my bid for plowing and salting 11 gas stations around my area they are all on one contract. I have done the math and came up with a price it seems a little low to me what do you guys think.
> 
> I would be using 650lbs of salt if the salting is to be done after the snow plowing is complete it would be an extra $260 that would be $0.40 per pound of salt spread. If the salt is being put down before a storm or only an ice and the lots are not being plowed then I charge an extra $5 for every station to offset the fuel price that is already added in if I was to plow. that brings the total to $315.
> 
> ...





vt properties;1050899 said:


> 260 for 11 stops seems way low. I believe that is what you mean. An average gas station size say 20 parking spaces would be 50.00 to apply bulk salt or a mix of both and say. I usually charge the same or close to the same for the plow price. I have never pretreated but have applied only salt in the event of ice conditions. I use bulk , so figure how mucch a ton or yard costs and figure it that way.





pvtwaggs14;1050903 said:


> bulk salt today was 65 per ton picked up and for pre treating it works out really good for gas stations because it helps for when you plow because it keeps the snow from compacting and freezing to the blacktop. It is a trick that I learned from my dad, and I must say it works pretty well. when you break it down the bulk salt is .03 per lb and im charging .40 per pound plus $5 per station for fuel... It might still be a little low that why im asking for people to comment on it.
> 
> Thanks
> Wes





TCLA;1051378 said:


> How did you come up with this number?


Chinese Math. 

650lbs of salt to be used between 11 stores = 59lbs/store

$.40/lb spread = $260 as posted.

$260/11 stores = $23.64/store.


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## dodge2500 (Aug 20, 2009)

I do two gas stations in my area and they each take at least 400# and they aren't huge but aren't small either. I have never seen a gas station that takes 59# JMO


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

underESTIMATED;1051373 said:


> So basically you're estimating only using 23lbs per station?
> 
> You're making a killing if that's the case.





underESTIMATED;1051385 said:


> Chinese Math. $23.64/store.


I see....Chinese math.

Hmmmm.........

And how is this a killing?


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## ajslands (Sep 3, 2009)

Very random; but dosent OSHA require a poly cuttig edge for doing gas stations?


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

dodge2500;1051387 said:


> I have never seen a gas station that takes 59# JMO


I would agree with you there dodge. However gas stations do get away with smaller quantities due to the constant activity and distribution of product.


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

ajslands;1051390 said:


> Very random; but dosent OSHA require a poly cuttig edge for doing gas stations?


I don't think so.


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

underESTIMATED;1051385 said:


> Chinese Math.
> 
> 650lbs of salt to be used between 11 stores = 59lbs/store
> 
> ...





TCLA;1051389 said:


> I see....Chinese math.
> 
> Hmmmm.........
> 
> And how is this a killing?


He's charging double, but only applying ~60lbs per store.

Maybe not a "killing" per se, but $.85/lb spread = win.


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

I must say you're true to your name.

This service needs to be viewed and sold according to what it's value is.

Salting any parking lot (no matter how small) for $23-24 per visit is devaluing the service.


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

TCLA;1051396 said:


> I must say you're true to your name.
> 
> This service needs to be viewed and sold according to what it's value is.
> 
> Salting any parking lot (no matter how small) for $23-24 per visit is devaluing the service.


Review his bid so you'll understand what I'm referring to. http://www.plowsite.com/showpost.php?p=1051055&postcount=10

The average price charged is $50/station.

He just said he's setting aside 650lbs of rock for 11 stations.

I never said he isn't charging enough, I simply stated that he's doing well to spread that little salt for that price.


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

I already know and realize the information on his other threads.

I was rolling with your feedback on this thread. xysport


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## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

OK so update so you can tear this apart as well lol.....

I went with a 30 min charge for any station. one of the stations that is $30 is just over 8,000ft2 but over half of it is covered. some of the larger accounts for one of which is $80.00 that one is just over 20,000... in the end ill be making more of a profit off the smaller stores and a smaller profit on the larger ones, I have figured about700 per time I spread, but can also spread up to1400 on the same price it all just cuts into the profit a little bit but its one set price.... total price is 550 per salting

so now its time for math 550/1400 = 39 cents per pound

with using my bulk spreader the pounds are not that easy to control that is why I bid it on the full price... they might get a little more than what they are paying for they might get a little bit less in the end their will be salt on the ground to get the mission done.

payup


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## Mick76 (Aug 2, 2009)

wes, Your not charging enough. As others already mentioned, its the VALUE of the service that your missing. Ie liability of a slip and fall. all stations are a pita to do. what about your time getting the salt and loading the salt? really look at EVERYTHING about your biz and what it REALLY cost you to run the biz. then make your price associated with your costs . around my neck of the woods i get double you rate for salting gas stations. TOO MUCH LIABILITY NOT TO PRICE THEM THIS WAY! HIH Mike


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## mullis56 (Jul 12, 2005)

There was a yo yo here a few years back maybe (5) that took on ALL of the Speedway gas stations, like 100 of them....had same ideas he was going to make a "killing" yet he was charging enough to cover expenses....long story short last I knew he was in jail and was lucky he was as he didn't pay anyone that he subbed out. 

Bottom line, you aren't charging enough, go deVALUE another industry not ours!


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

mullis56;1051467 said:


> There was a yo yo here a few years back maybe (5) that took on ALL of the Speedway gas stations, like 100 of them....had same ideas he was going to make a "killing" yet he was charging enough to cover expenses....long story short last I knew he was in jail and was lucky he was as he didn't pay anyone that he subbed out.
> 
> Bottom line, you aren't charging enough, go deVALUE another industry not ours!


Your expense(s) and his are two different animals.

Criticize someone else and devalue their business.

He asked for feedback on his rate, not Polly Pessimist.


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## vt properties (Jan 28, 2010)

Mick76;1051427 said:


> wes, Your not charging enough. As others already mentioned, its the VALUE of the service that your missing. Ie liability of a slip and fall. all stations are a pita to do. what about your time getting the salt and loading the salt? really look at EVERYTHING about your biz and what it REALLY cost you to run the biz. then make your price associated with your costs . around my neck of the woods i get double you rate for salting gas stations. TOO MUCH LIABILITY NOT TO PRICE THEM THIS WAY! HIH Mike


excellent post ..


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

pvtwaggs14;1051415 said:


> .....one of the stations that is $30


like other posters have mentioned...

you are helping to bring the market pricing down if your plowing any kind of a commercial lot with paying customers that come in and out for a measly 30 bucks....Can you imagine how you would feel losing that account due to some guy coming in at 28 bucks for the plowing? Well the company that underbid years previous is like WTF..I underbid at 45 to get the work and some yahoo underbid that?..:laughing:

Don't you think an insured, covered, commercial plow truck, with a experienced operator is worth more than $30 to show up in the middle of the night to service a gas station..which in itself is already not the best lot to service for us plowers, with the covers, random cars shooting in for gas, pumps, etc?..

I would hope so...

There needs to be a minimum price set...and it should be no where near the number thirty..

I can't even believe I'm talking commercial plowing and the number $30 is being used for anything other than maybe a hand shoveler or a bag of melt


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

underESTIMATED;1051469 said:


> Your expense(s) and his are two different animals.
> 
> Criticize someone else and devalue their business.
> 
> He asked for feedback on his rate, not Polly Pessimist.




And feedback on the rate was exactly what mullis56 gave him.


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## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

mullis56;1051467 said:


> There was a yo yo here a few years back maybe (5) that took on ALL of the Speedway gas stations, like 100 of them....had same ideas he was going to make a "killing" yet he was charging enough to cover expenses....long story short last I knew he was in jail and was lucky he was as he didn't pay anyone that he subbed out.
> 
> Bottom line, you aren't charging enough, go deVALUE another industry not ours!


Once again thanks to everyone for the help here with the prices. I think i am getting close to being where I want to be both on how much salt I will be using and the amount I will be charging... I'm glad that people on here think I am trying to deVALUE their industry last time I was reading through my post on here I was asking to advise to make sure I was not doing that... but some people have their thong pulled way to far up there A$$ to notice that. Ok so I am not some huge operation that grosses 1mil a year... I am small time I make a living off of it and I love to do it...When I have nothing to do at work I pull up youtube videos of snowplowing no mater what month it is. I take my work very seriously and dont want to hurt our industry the amount of money we spend and or loose clients as well. So for the people who are sharing good constructive criticism thank you for helping me out.

oh yeah bladescape no where in that bid does it show me plowing for THIRTY bucks it says that I will salt for that but for the same property its ballpart 65 bucks to plow... you give good advise most of the time I think you just skipped part of the post.

Wes


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## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

upslope;1051604 said:


> like other posters have mentioned...
> 
> you are helping to bring the market pricing down if your plowing any kind of a commercial lot with paying customers that come in and out for a measly 30 bucks....Can you imagine how you would feel losing that account due to some guy coming in at 28 bucks for the plowing? Well the company that underbid years previous is like WTF..I underbid at 45 to get the work and some yahoo underbid that?..:laughing:
> 
> ...


HaHa in your one post to me you are saying how you underbid people what to lowball our industry Looks like you did the same think you think I'm doing and you also posted

"I can't even believe I'm talking commercial plowing and the number $30 is being used for anything other than maybe a hand shoveler or a bag of melt" well the "bag of melt" is right not plowing


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## scottyknows50 (Feb 19, 2010)

it's funny that such a "blue-collar" business has such uppity people making sure you feel like **** after you're done with this forum.


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

Bidding 1 gas station and bidding 11 is a different game. They put the 11 together to get better pricing. If these gas stations are that small on a night where you plow and salt I bet you are making $200 plus/hr even with these prices. For you guys getting .40/lb for salt that would be a dream around here. I put down approx 30,000lbs/night and I don't get near $12,000 to do it. We also salt 40-50 times per year.


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

pvtwaggs14;1051725 said:


> HaHa in your one post to me you are saying how you underbid people what to lowball our industry Looks like you did the same think you think I'm doing and you also posted
> 
> "I can't even believe I'm talking commercial plowing and the number $30 is being used for anything other than maybe a hand shoveler or a bag of melt" well the "bag of melt" is right not plowing


I don't get the first part of your post here...but I do get the second part so : 

My bad.

And I agree with cet...having the 11, as opposed to just one station is going to affect the pricing substantially..

good luck.


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## underESTIMATED (Jul 2, 2010)

cet;1051729 said:


> For you guys getting .40/lb for salt that would be a dream around here. I put down approx 30,000lbs/night and I don't get near $12,000 to do it. We also salt 40-50 times per year.


My point exactly.


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## mullis56 (Jul 12, 2005)

And you plan on salting these gas stations 40-50 times in your local market place? Plus your using bagged material not bulk different game!


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## pvtwaggs14 (Mar 1, 2010)

OK i'm going to try this again and I think this will sound a lot better with everyone else on here and me being to low... yes it seems my numbers where way low. Even though I was making money off of what I wanted to price I've been doing a lot of math to try to get my numbers right. Here is the formula I came up with let me know what you think

SQFT x .02 = lbs of salt you should use on the light side you can use .04 and should be ok.....

i came up with the numbers like this 5000sqft takes 100lbs of salt (100/5000=.02)

the total sq feet for all the gas stations is 206,590
206,590x.02=4131 so we will round up 4150x.35cents per pound = $1,452.50 is what I should be charging if it was one large lot so I am going to go through tonight and redo all the salt prices to get me close to that magic number. I have a meeting with the manager tomorrow to go over the bid. I guess one last change is going to be good i hope....


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## deicepro (Mar 24, 2009)

HMM... well I say $50 to $60 MINIMUM on any commercial lot


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