# Over Salting Anyone?



## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

Have you ever seen a lot that was over salted? Do you over salt? What would you do if an employee over salted?

I have enclosed a few pictures of a local school system that I believe over salted. This picture was taken 4 days after the snow event.

As a tax payer, snow removal - salting company employee I see the waste. The damage to asphalt, ground water and the waste is not a good thing.

Dave


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## lorentzlawnsnow (Aug 9, 2005)

i agree that is over salting and definitely unnecessary, but salt will not hurt asphalt.


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## sunriseturf (Nov 2, 2005)

Its the freeze/thaw that hurts the asphalt......when water perks into pavement then freezes. It expands then breaks up the asphalt....the start of a pothole.


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## jt5019 (Aug 28, 2003)

Looks like after the storm there was some black ice or leftover water spots that froze. Guess they really wanted to make sure nobody slips


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## MJM Landscaping (Mar 19, 2005)

I would rather over salt than under salt.


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## Big Nate's Plowing (Nov 26, 2000)

I had some lots look like that last week when we got a glaze of freezing rain sat sh!t is hard to get to melt off


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## jt5019 (Aug 28, 2003)

MJM Landscaping said:


> I would rather over salt than under salt.


Gotta agree with that.


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## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

*no one slips!*

It looks like they could slip and fall on the salt! I feel the target is to spread the "required" amount of salt to melt the snow and ice. Our drivers are trained to spread the amount of salt to melt the snow and ice on the parking lot at the present temperature. Our customers would be on the phone calling us complaining if we left a lot in that condition.

Dave


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## badranman (Dec 22, 2003)

He didn't oversalt on the last event, he just pretreated for the next one!


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## THE BOSS 1975 (Nov 16, 2005)

must be charging by the granule !!!


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## 06HD BOSS (Nov 28, 2005)

Two things. 
#1-Better to be safe than sorry
#2-I do agree that's definitely over salted
Skyking- bring a couple guys with brooms and shovels to that lot and fill up your V-boxes LOL


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

It is the end of the season you have to get rid of it some how!


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## mrplowdude (Apr 16, 2005)

grandview said:


> It is the end of the season you have to get rid of it some how!


This is true I still have about 7 tons left in my pile and find myself finding putting down a little more than extra to make sure its all gone.


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## Keith_480231 (Jul 13, 2004)

I was thinking maybe this guy had a "extra" bill this month  ????


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## CARDOCTOR (Nov 29, 2002)

$50.00 in salt is cheaper than a 50k law suit

john


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## DBL (Aug 27, 2005)

one of my biggest pet peives is seeing that white chalk all over a lot after storms


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## NJ Plowman (Dec 10, 2003)

We have a property management company that calls us for two or three days after every storm complaining that their saidewalks are covered in ice. The ice and snow on the roofs of the condo complex melts and then freezes overnight on the sidewalks, so it really has nothing to do with us becuase after every storm we have plowed and salted properly. We charge one price for the season. We still go back and salt for several days without and additional charge, just to keep them happy and so they re-new with us next year. Then we got a call that they are complaining about too much salt and they wanted us to send a crew over to sweep the parking lot to remove the extra salt... :crying: 

Damn if you do, damn if you don't. Now we just leave a 50lb bag in the hallway and tell the management company that the tennants or super will have to help spread some salt on the sidewalks in the mornings until the snow melts off the roof. We got sick of all the extra work and complaints and not being able to please anybody. When the tennants dig out their cars, they even pile the snow on the sidewalks that we just cleaned. The management company calls us and then tell me that our guys didn't do a good job on the sidewalks. What can you do? :angry:


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## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

*white chalk*

The white chalk and the salt grains on lot is also something I don't like either. Anyone can put down salt but to spread the correct amount is a real skill. The ground water run off is not good when it is loaded with salt either. I see lots of vegetation killed because of over salt too.

I guess the color of salted parking lot shows the skills of the salt truck driver.

Dave


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## heather lawn spray (Mar 11, 2003)

NJ Plowman said:


> We have a property management company that calls us for two or three days after every storm complaining that their saidewalks are covered in ice. The ice and snow on the roofs of the condo complex melts and then freezes overnight on the sidewalks, so it really has nothing to do with us becuase after every storm we have plowed and salted properly. We charge one price for the season. We still go back and salt for several days without and additional charge, just to keep them happy and so they re-new with us next year. Then we got a call that they are complaining about too much salt and they wanted us to send a crew over to sweep the parking lot to remove the extra salt... :crying:
> 
> Damn if you do, damn if you don't. Now we just leave a 50lb bag in the hallway and tell the management company that the tennants or super will have to help spread some salt on the sidewalks in the mornings until the snow melts off the roof. We got sick of all the extra work and complaints and not being able to please anybody. When the tennants dig out their cars, they even pile the snow on the sidewalks that we just cleaned. The management company calls us and then tell me that our guys didn't do a good job on the sidewalks. What can you do? :angry:


Been there, done that.
Keep tight tabs on the amount of time & material that you are burning on this project. Politely explain next season why the price is going up 20% or so. Be prepared to find other work to replace them when they don't renew. This is a loaded game that you are not allowed to win. THEY KNOW what it costs to do the place. They will just keep looking for quotes that are the cheapest, run the contractor dry and move on to the next one. That's how they make their living and justify their existence. I hate to be a downer but it took us 15 years to figure this out.


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

That might be over salted for this time of year. If it were January it would be fine. We salt our commercial stuff as soon as it starts snowing so if you have that much down you will not need to salt right away and you will save labour and equipment costs for the next salting. You also won't have to jump when you see the first snowflake.


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

I went down to Exhibition Place over the weekend and the GO Transit people really seem to want to ruin their new concrete platforms. There would have been a year if you had clean it up that you could still use, and this was on newer concrete... this bugs me because the city is always saying that they are over budget on salt...

Jon


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## hickslawns (Dec 18, 2004)

It does seem like overkill. Schools and hospitals usually hit it hard around here. I salted one of our commercial accounts this year and was accused of not salting it. There were only a couple spots with white residue. There was no ice. The lot was spotless. Because of no white residue I didn't salt? That is the perfect application of salt to me if I were the customer. The account is billed by the pound. They should have been thrilled. No extra, and no icy spots. Can't win with everyone. Oh yeah, by the way, the same customer complained on other storms that we oversalted and then wanted to only salt 1/3 of the aisles, entrances, and nothing where the employees parked or walked. Nothing in the truck docks (until they got some trucks stuck), and nothing in the receiving areas. Some people just won't be happy!


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## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

*Called the School....*

I called the Norton City School administration office in Norton Ohio to complain about the over salting of there lots. They said they would get back to me about this wasteful action. Well looks like I will grow old and die before they respond.

Dave


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## lawnboy30 (Nov 4, 2004)

*2 cents*

Just my 2 cents, but when owning a snow & ice control company, one has to always think about lawsuits. It is better to prevent ice (ie by oversalting) then to have even a patch of ice for someone to slip and fall on. I bet if it was the other way around you would have a problem with there being ice. No offense, but you will probably not get an answer from them.


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## landcare pa (Dec 2, 2004)

i agree with lawnboy30 you have to think of the rotten scumbags out there that can find a patch of ice the size of a booger and say they fell on it. we got served papers last week for someone that fell on feb 18,2003.
looking back in are records that day we had 24 inchs of snow and everything was closed and a state of emergency so i say over salt if it protects you and your customer.


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## golden arches (Oct 30, 2003)

Looks more like a school district that has a budget for salt and wants to spend it all to ensure they have the "correct amount" in next year's salt budget.

I'm guessing the janitor is screaming, but no one is listening. The residual damage to the floor and interior of the building is a direct result of this dump.


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## Turfmower (Dec 20, 2003)

That look light in comparison to some of the lots around here. I hit all my lots heavy people want to see the snow and ice gone in 15 mins after a storm.


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## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

*over salting moot point now*

Not able to talk to anyone at Norton School System in Norton Ohio. Now it is a moot point. It rained and all the salt has been washed into the grass and into the small stream that goes by the school.

This over salting is wasteful and causes damage to property that is payed for by the tax payers of Norton School District.

Dave


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## TLS (Jan 31, 2000)

Last week we were hit with two storms.

None were plowable.

Both were slippery.

Both required salt.

Salt residue left from first really helped the second.

Though these pics show a bit more, most of my lots are similar.

At least my granuals are small though. The bulk salt guys are freaking rediculous though. You can trip over those "rocks" in their lots!

We just haven't had any rain to wash it away yet.


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## SkykingHD (Jan 31, 2002)

*More*

Here is another lot that is over salted. We have not had much snow here this year so some contractors get creative! This customer should be screaming.

Dave


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

This past month I've seen a lot of excessive salting. I myself didn't hit my commercial, even though my wallet said I should, but a lot of guys (or one guy with a lot of accounts) did.

On the otherhand, how would you feel if your son getting off the bus was hit by a car because it couldn't stop on some black ice?

What CET said is true, if this was January I doubt people would complain. Maybe the weather forecast called for below freezing temps for a few days so the contractor salted once instead of every night and infact then SAVED the school money? Hey you never know.


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## badcompany (Mar 22, 2006)

here we cant use salt.because of our mountain range alot of the run off feeds the mojave river to all the desert comunitys,instead cinders are used.Volcanic rocks provide traction on these mountain roads


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## streetsurfin' (Jan 22, 2004)

I remember several salt "speed bumps" that remained into mid may last year as a result of oversalting by local municipalities on the roads. Very little spring rain and pure negligence on the part of the road departments left it a bain to deal with. Some were a safety hazard and all were a pain to deal with for those who like to wait till the salt is gone to take out their collector cars and motorcycles. I say bring it to their attention as much as possible. A heavy application is one thing but accidents and inexperience that go unattended to is just plain ignorant.


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## Grader4me (Jan 4, 2006)

streetsurfin' said:


> I remember several salt "speed bumps" that remained into mid may last year as a result of oversalting by local municipalities on the roads. Very little spring rain and pure negligence on the part of the road departments left it a bain to deal with. Some were a safety hazard and all were a pain to deal with for those who like to wait till the salt is gone to take out their collector cars and motorcycles. I say bring it to their attention as much as possible. A heavy application is one thing but accidents and inexperience that go unattended to is just plain ignorant.


Sometimes it is very hard to get the right amount of salt on so that you don't have residue after everything melts and drys. Probally anyone that uses salt has had this happen many times.
I am really surprised by your mention of "speed bumps" left into mid May by the local municipalities.
I work for the DOT here in New Brunswick and at times we get to much on for conditions. It shows more on intersections where the traffic will not blow it off. If to much is applied at an intersection we clean it up, simple as that. To leave speed bumps on a road is unacceptable and I just don't understand why they would not clean it up.


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## streetsurfin' (Jan 22, 2004)

I don't understand the reason for the piles being left around either. I guess I could attribute it to the busy lifestyle, hectic traffic, and hoping rain and traffic would reduce the mess. Some were likely accidents or mechanical failures that allowed the spinners to continue at stops or mistakes by the drivers. I am certainly guilty of excess salt too. How hard is it to fan it out with the plow though so it doesn't freeze hard into a hazard? That was my solution when it happened on commercial properties. Some were clearly spills over the back of the gate as they tried to shift the load. It seems denying responsibility for things is a way of life around here. There is always someone else that can be blamed for a problem. I am near the corner of three different municipalities, then we also have state and county roads that intersect amongst them; each maintained by different departments. I think that makes it easy to pass the buck.


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## Grader4me (Jan 4, 2006)

Streetsurfin,

Yes at times things happen like salt spilling off the spreader or perhaps the tailgate pops open giving a heavy concentration in one place. You are right about it being easy to fan this out or back drag with the plow.Of course in heavy traffic this might pose a challenge.
It seems to me in your area someone (department) has to step up to the plate and accept responsibility for their actions. Sounds a little harsh I know but who in the heck wants to put up with salt speed bumps in May? Just my two cents worth...hope I didn't offend anyone.


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