# Input on another new to me style job



## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Got a call for an estimate on a 104 home, i guess you'd called it an HOA, for driveways and sidewalks. They are new duplexes, 75-85% of the duplexes have two single car garage doors(the rest are only have one), and the driveways are next to each other seperated only by a 8"x6' strip of grass or stone. The road will be taken care of by the city and the alley will be taken care of by the builders. They driveways are way too small for a truck, so I'm thinking knocking most of it out with 4-wheelers and touching up with snow blowers or shovels. So the real question is what kind of time am I looking at for the driveways. I'd have at least 2 4-wheelers with plows possibly a 3rd or a john deere gator with plow and 2-3 snow blowers. Thanks for the help


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

Does new = developer has control and no money like it does here? If they called you out of the blue I'd wonder why. If you can use 4 wheelers and a gator why is it too small to backdrag out?


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## TPC Services (Dec 15, 2005)

How short is short?, an longae29 asked is it a HOA, or the Developer wanting this done?? we would use a Skid loader on something that size . we have a couple 54 unit ones that we use ATVs on but the driveways are like 20' long an the units across the streets drives don't line up an the streets are only 20' wide. so we can't use a truck to back drag Due to all your trucks being 3/4 long boxes or C.C. which makes them way to long to try to back drag with a normal plow.


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

use a skid steer with a blower. u can control where u put the snow there is no where else to put the snow. good luck.


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

the two driveways put together are about 25x50 and the alley is too skinny to probably even drive down with my dually. I was also thinking about using the back blade on my tractor to drage away from the doors and then push it off to the side with a 1/2ton plow truck or compact loader tractor etc... Does $7 per drive sound right maybe 10. Somewhere between $728 and $1,040 just for drives?

The customer is the builder/developer/president of the HOA, and i know people that have worked with him before and say that he pays good and in a timely manner. He and his crew usually do the snow but are working on many projects out of town and dont have the time this year


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## DirtyJerzey (Dec 21, 2007)

skid steer and push pull box... blowers are nice but they always leave snow that has to be shoveled in front of the garage door.


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

What do you all think time or price wise?


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Anybody?

I'm thinking a 8' pull box behind a tractor, 2 snowblowers/shovelers, 1-2 atv's with 4' plows for the 9000+ feet of sidewalks and a plow truck? 5 crew members total. Anybody want to guess on total time


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## TPC Services (Dec 15, 2005)

Be better is we could see a image of the property to give you a better idea on what it may take!!, Also depends on what your overhead is, what you want to pay guys, What's the area market you live in is paying?? If you have been a sub take your old pay an tack on 15%-20% more or so??, Most of us don't know what your market is getting for plowing, sdwks , sanding/salting, liquid. How much do you want to charge to do the leg work to get this job, (I.E. tracking subs, getting time sheets in, billing, call backs on where your money is, dealing with phone calls of them *****ing or wanting you back to do something). So market up so you can grow hire people, Put on more equipment of your own, Crap like that. Just don't lowball it!!! long winded story short . (WHAT IS YOUR TIME WORTH)


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

DirtyJerzey;1106746 said:


> skid steer and push pull box... blowers are nice but they always leave snow that has to be shoveled in front of the garage door.


I'll second that!


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

TPC Services;1108150 said:


> Be better is we could see a image of the property to give you a better idea on what it may take!!, Also depends on what your overhead is, what you want to pay guys, What's the area market you live in is paying?? If you have been a sub take your old pay an tack on 15%-20% more or so??, Most of us don't know what your market is getting for plowing, sdwks , sanding/salting, liquid. How much do you want to charge to do the leg work to get this job, (I.E. tracking subs, getting time sheets in, billing, call backs on where your money is, dealing with phone calls of them *****ing or wanting you back to do something). So market up so you can grow hire people, Put on more equipment of your own, Crap like that. Just don't lowball it!!! long winded story short . (WHAT IS YOUR TIME WORTH)


Heres the picture, the scale is to 100'










I really dont want help with the actual price, just help estimating the time and i can estimate the price from there.

Thanks again for all the help so far. This is an interesting place


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## Kollen Parsons (Oct 21, 2010)

Who does the walks here? All that common walk screams $$$$.

Sidewalks - I estimate roughly 40,000sf of walks....all of them (can't see the entire picture).

How many per hour with the wheeler?
7hrs with a wheeler w/ plow for the common walks
5-10hrs for the walks to the doors depending on how you do them.
Total:
$480 - $680 + deice (12 bags) + add time to apply.
= $637.32 - $877.32 to do the walks!

Plowing:
It will depend on where you can put the snow!
Without complications:
5 minutes a drive with a skid and push/pull box (x) 104 = 8.67hrs (you may beat this)
Roughly 12,000sf of "alley" plowed = 1hr or less
Misc time to tidy up and shovel out the 1-3' in front of the garages if needed 104 (x) 1-2 manual minutes each on an average snow + time to tidy up the property = 3.47hrs max at shovel rate - 1 at machine rate

9.67 machine hrs @ your rate
3.47 shovel hrs @ your rate
13+ total hrs 
2 skids and a walk guy.....you'll be done in under 5 Hrs.
Here it would be $1000+ per average occurence

The "city" always plows them (driveways) back in...do you get to charge extra to fix it?
Blowing and drifting correction?
Will you be responsible for Mailboxes and fire hydrants?

Based on our average snowfalls and plow pricing here it could be a $16,000 seasonal without the ?????'s above.
$9.62 Unit per time

$1480 on the low end to do it all ;>)


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Thanks Kollen, I'm thinking capping my prices for 6" at a time, after 6" double the price etc... unless they want me to wait until the strom stops.


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## PTSolutions (Dec 8, 2007)

i won a bid for a 62 unit hoa with 2 car x 1 carlength drives. will be using an 84" blower on a skid. contract calls for front walkways and garage doors to be shoveled clean anyways.

drove through it last year, comp was using plow trucks and there was no where to put snow. piles were taking up half the driveways. my bid was the second highest and I still won. gotta think outside the box.


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their input on this, I landed the contract, now I just have to fine myself a good skid loader


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## jvm81 (Jan 4, 2005)

I dont understand how a blower can leave snow at the front of a driveway/garage door ( i realize it does as I do snow this way) but then confused how a skid or plow backdragging does not leave snow at the driveway/garage door? Congrats on getting the job. Care to share any numbers?


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

It was enough to make money on, it was around Kollens' numbers. I dont want to share exact because I know some of my comp gets on here

Has anyone had experience with the small skid steers?


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## turb0diesel (Dec 13, 2009)

Good luck with the gator!

its so slow!


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

Guess where all the street snow and alley snow is going to end up? That's right, on your walks and in your drives. You will be removing 2-3 times as much snow than what fell originally on those areas. Do you have the timing down as far as when the builder will plow the alleys and when the streets are plowed? If you get in there first, you're going to be doing it all over again. I also think those numbers that were posted were way low. I know why you got the job. I don't think you know what you got yourself into.


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

I have a clause in the contract that states if we have to clear the alleys or do any other cleanup that is not caused by us and they want it to be cleaned up they will be billed hourly


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Just thought I'd update this, I'm not gonna say what the exact price is, but i can be in and out of this place with under 6" of accumulation with 4-5 people in 3.5hr, walks, sideways and driveways clear and tidy. Using 5 snowblowers, 1 four wheeler and shovels. Making over $100/ man hour with small equipment. And the builder is very easy to work with. Just wanted to thank everybody for their help in my procurement of this job.


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

J.R. Services;1204314 said:


> Just thought I'd update this, I'm not gonna say what the exact price is, but i can be in and out of this place with under 6" of accumulation with 4-5 people in 3.5hr, walks, sideways and driveways clear and tidy. Using 5 snowblowers, 1 four wheeler and shovels. Making over $100/ man hour with small equipment. And the builder is very easy to work with. Just wanted to thank everybody for their help in my procurement of this job.


How many times have you done this place this season? How much snow during those times? What kind of snowblowers?


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

5 times so far, 1-5", and all new 28" simplicitys.


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

Very good. Thanks and good luck.


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## J.R. Services (Aug 15, 2009)

Figured I'd continue on this thread instead of posting a new one. 

The community in this thread has grown significantly and I trying to retool to decrease my manpower needed. They do not want the snow pulled into the alleys and then stacked at the end so I have come up with a kubota b3200 with a 64" rear mount snowblower with hyd chute rotation with a 72" hyd angle snowplow on the front. In theory Id back up the driveway on the one side, blowing then go forward across the alley and backdrag that driveway to the edge of the alley, do that repeatedly then comeback and blow the backdragged snow on the one side. Thoughts?


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## F250/XLS (Nov 23, 2014)

J.R. Services;1106222 said:


> Got a call for an estimate on a 104 home, i guess you'd called it an HOA, for driveways and sidewalks. They are new duplexes, 75-85% of the duplexes have two single car garage doors(the rest are only have one), and the driveways are next to each other seperated only by a 8"x6' strip of grass or stone. The road will be taken care of by the city and the alley will be taken care of by the builders. They driveways are way too small for a truck, so I'm thinking knocking most of it out with 4-wheel ers and touching up with snow blowers or shovels. So the real question is what kind of time am I looking at for the driveways. I'd have at least 2 4-wheelers with plows possibly a 3rd or a john deere gator with plow and 2-3 snow blowers. Thanks for


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