# multiple residentials



## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

I have someone that owns 500 homes in a hundred mile radius in Ohio.
they want the driveways plowed and walks from the drive to the steps shoveled. they also want the walks salted from the drive to the steps. this is all on a 3" trigger before and after photos have to be submitted. driveways will be all different sizes, they will all be the same price.
#1 what would you charge per?
#2 how many trucks would it take you to complete in 24 hrs. (starting from the center of the radius)


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

R U serious? 100 miles? No way to tell.

On edit,and just for kicks, I'll say 20 trucks with a driver and a shoveler, at $50 per pop. 500 homes times $50 would be $25,000 per event, or $1,250 per crew per event.


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## BlackIrish (Dec 22, 2007)

That radius is to large for you to service properly.
A call back could be a 50 mile trip one way.
Holy ****e.
I get upset if I have to drive across the city.
You could do it if you had reliable subs in MANY diff areas.
That large an area snow accumulation will vary from place to place.
GL


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

are they foreclosed homes that need to be servicied. What you are trying to do is ridiculous. A waste of time. What are you thinking in trying to take on a job like this? You are a crazy. welcome to plowsite.


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## exmark1 (Nov 30, 2005)

Unless they are foreclosed vacant homes where you could do them after a storm I would pass or try find subs in the areas and only do what is close to you.


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

Pictures before and after. Just trying to manage that alone would be a nightmare. 

It sounds like empty properties. IF you can plan out the route's the drivers take you might be doing 4-8 house an hour. So 500 homes might be 125 hours to 62.5 hours of plowing then.

Realistically you might need 12-18 trucks. :laughing: The drive themselves might go for $3 to $8 a walk and $20 to $30 a drive. Consider the nightmare of supplying and training everyone on how to use the camera and to turn the picts in as well. That alone is going to cost you a bundle in time and money.


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Burkartsplow;847369 said:


> are they foreclosed homes that need to be servicied. What you are trying to do is ridiculous. A waste of time. What are you thinking in trying to take on a job like this? You are a crazy. welcome to plowsite.


^^^^^^^^^^ Burkartsplow always makes good posts.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

they are not foreclosed homes but i do have 24-48 hours and can start after the storm


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## Lux Lawn (Jan 5, 2004)

This does sound kind of crazy thats for sure.
You would need so many sub in different areas to even make it work. Whats with the pictures the guy not trust you?


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

he might trust me but should he trust the subs too? subs will be dispatched from a centralized location. all will be trained and have cameras and laptops and pre routed workorders with GPS nav. I am going to try it with 6 trucks and have a few emergency backup contractors around the perimeter


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## Rc2505 (Feb 5, 2007)

Wow 6 trucks sound pretty ambitious. Hope you are prepared to spend a few more sleepless nights then you normally do. If you have anything around the Findlay area, I can probably help you out in a pinch. I am not looking for full time sites though. If you need to contact me let me know.


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## Lux Lawn (Jan 5, 2004)

Marionlandscape;847477 said:


> he might trust me but should he trust the subs too? subs will be dispatched from a centralized location. all will be trained and have cameras and laptops and pre routed workorders with GPS nav. I am going to try it with 6 trucks and have a few emergency backup contractors around the perimeter


If he trust you to do the job, then he is goin to have to trust the subs. He is also going to have to understand picture taking is going to slow down the entire process.
What part of Ohio is this in.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

central and north central


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

6 trucks :laughing: in a 100 mile circle ... it must be your 

83 driveways per driver....... in a 100 mile circle ... I must be missing something.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

if they average 10 min per driveway (some wont have driveways some will have larger ones) thats 14 hours. give them 10 hours drive time thats 24 hours. do you guys think this will work?


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## CMU07 (Sep 29, 2009)

I think that sounds ambitious. I don't know if someone will keep that pace. 10min with walks cleared and salted. After about 40-50 of them.... I don't know.


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## CMU07 (Sep 29, 2009)

Which with drive time will put them into what?... 12-15 hours of straight work.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

I am used to 30-40 hours of straight work I know I can't expect that from my subs but i do all commercial work. I am depending on you guys to say it is possible because I don't do driveways only have ever done 2 or 3 of my vip customers homes. I am estimating 85-90% of these homes are in the cities. another thing to consider it that these are not expensive homes they are $50,000 homes. the more I talk about it the more I talk myself into it. if you were me would you do it? would you use more trucks?


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Marionlandscape;847615 said:


> I am used to 30-40 hours of straight work I know I can't expect that from my subs but i do all commercial work. I am depending on you guys to say it is possible because I don't do driveways only have ever done 2 or 3 of my vip customers homes. I am estimating 85-90% of these homes are in the cities. another thing to consider it that these are not expensive homes they are $50,000 homes. the more I talk about it the more I talk myself into it. if you were me would you do it? would you use more trucks?


I wouldn't even consider it.... you are in for a world of hurt.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

ok fair enough. maybe you guys should know I will have a dispatcher and office staff running the events. technology will also be a big factor work orders will be completed on the spot with photos submitted and transmitted to the office. then would you attempt it?


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

Marionlandscape;847629 said:


> ok fair enough. maybe you guys should know I will have a dispatcher and office staff running the events. technology will also be a big factor work orders will be completed on the spot with photos submitted and transmitted to the office. then would you attempt it?


NO, DONT DO IT.. But if you do attempt this please keep us up to date.


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## Rc2505 (Feb 5, 2007)

I honestly don't see any possible way to pull this off with 6 trucks. I mean drive time alone is going to be 4 to 5 hours per truck at the minium. Then figure 5 minutes for pics before and after, at each location. 5 to 10 minutes per location of shoveling per location. 5 to 10 minutes of plowing per location. 5 to 10 minutes of salting per location. Now if you add up all the time, 20 to 35 minutes per location not counting drive time X 83 locations per truck = 27+ hours and you have to add drive time in. So unless your looking at adding at least 4 more trucks, and can gaurntee no breakdowns all winter I wouldn't even dream of this. Furthermore is your dispatcher, and office staff going to be able to work those kinds of hours as well? I just see the cost on this being tremendous. If the profit isn't going to be tremendous on top of the costs, I would have to think you are biting off way more then you can chew. That would be the reason I told you to get ahold of me if something would happen and you might need bailed out at some point for any locations close to me. I would be willing to help you out, but I think you would be in over your head.


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Marionlandscape;847629 said:


> ok fair enough. maybe you guys should know I will have a dispatcher and office staff running the events. technology will also be a big factor work orders will be completed on the spot with photos submitted and transmitted to the office. then would you attempt it?


What would you need a dispatcher and an office staff for? A plow route is a plow route. Any dispatching off the route will only make things worse.


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## cubicinches (Oct 19, 2008)

Marionlandscape;847567 said:


> do you guys think this will work?


No.



Marionlandscape;847615 said:


> if you were me would you do it?


No.



Marionlandscape;847629 said:


> then would you attempt it?


No.


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

I think were being fished. Thy guy has a zillion real reasons why his approach will not work. However, he keeps going forward with out changing the plan.

The numbers speak for themselves. Wait until the first sub bales out or has an accident. I can't wait to hear the insurance investigator when they ask how long the route runs are and that the driver is 30 hours into it. Yup ......


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## carl b (Dec 28, 2006)

Marionlandscape;847477 said:


> he might trust me but should he trust the subs too? subs will be dispatched from a centralized location. all will be trained and have cameras and laptops and pre routed workorders with GPS nav. I am going to try it with 6 trucks and have a few emergency backup contractors around the perimeter





Marionlandscape;847615 said:


> I am used to 30-40 hours of straight work I know I can't expect that from my subs but i do all commercial work. I am depending on you guys to say it is possible because I don't do driveways only have ever done 2 or 3 of my vip customers homes. I am estimating 85-90% of these homes are in the cities. another thing to consider it that these are not expensive homes they are $50,000 homes. the more I talk about it the more I talk myself into it. if you were me would you do it? would you use more trucks?





Marionlandscape;847629 said:


> ok fair enough. maybe you guys should know I will have a dispatcher and office staff running the events. technology will also be a big factor work orders will be completed on the spot with photos submitted and transmitted to the office. then would you attempt it?





Burkartsplow;847710 said:


> NO, DONT DO IT.. But if you do attempt this please keep us up to date.


I read this than i see you are looking for subs here .???
http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=88403

Will you get me a lap top and gps . after all you know me from plowsite=trust . I need a new cam. too.

You may think on this one a bit longer.


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## terrapro (Oct 21, 2006)

I would do it. 

Are you going to drive around and estimate every drive or just wing it and figure an average of $50 per? With the salt and pictures you need to tack on another $5 minimum for each drive for difficulty. 

The picture thing should be easy, just snap a pic from the cab of the mail box that shows the drive. Big whoop, for an extra $5 and 3seconds of my time.

I wouldn't try with 6 trucks but maybe 10. Each would have 50 drives, on a normal storm I see it being hard to go over 8hr routes.


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## vinny69 (Sep 7, 2009)

terrapro;848521 said:


> I would do it.
> 
> Are you going to drive around and estimate every drive or just wing it and figure an average of $50 per? With the salt and pictures you need to tack on another $5 minimum for each drive for difficulty.
> 
> ...


I agree,you need at least 10-12 trucks,Two guys or gals per truck and IF they move quickly you can do maybe 45-55 houses per storm in 10-12 hours if all gos well.
And i would hope that there is some form of payment before i did any work.Should never put all your eggs in one basket...


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## kpmsnow (Sep 18, 2009)

You can do it! Just from the fatigue end of things I would run 10 trucks with 2 man crews.. First few storms will be a pain and everyone else has warranted concerns because it is a logistical nightmare but it can be done. I have a similar deal with 180 restaurants for applying liquid anti-icing. Logistically it was rough getting started, one bit of advise I would also include a group of supervisors to head out close to the end of each event to double check the route was completed correctly. Cover thy a**


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Yeah a group of supervisors is just what he needs.............


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## Advantage (Nov 7, 2007)

This can be completed AFTER the storm? What are you going to do then when you get 10"+


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## terrapro (Oct 21, 2006)

Advantage;848695 said:


> This can be completed AFTER the storm? What are you going to do then when you get 10"+


Plow it!

This is not a 4 acre job with a loader. Driveways are easy as pie man.


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## Advantage (Nov 7, 2007)

terrapro;848733 said:


> Plow it!
> 
> This is not a 4 acre job with a loader. Driveways are easy as pie man.


LOL, yes plow it of course. Why didn't I think of that. I was specifically speaking about the added time of shoveling/snowblowing that much snow. That would push his hours up.


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

I'm not worried about them shoveling the 10"+ of snow on the sidewalks. I'll run the plow right down the sidewalk if i have to


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

you guys are idiots to think this a good idea.....


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

I'm telling you he is yanking everyone's chain. Running a plow down the sidewalk. 10" of snow is no big deal. He's messing with everyone. Close down this thread.


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

scottL;848911 said:


> I'm telling you he is yanking everyone's chain. Running a plow down the sidewalk. 10" of snow is no big deal. He's messing with everyone. Close down this thread.


put up four more posts and we will be tied. awesome :bluebounc. yeah throw this thread out and the one where he is asking for subs.


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## kpmsnow (Sep 18, 2009)

This is how big company's become big they take the big risks. Like I said I have 1 customer with 180 locations to anti-ice and he is not my only anti-icing customer either. If I had asked for your advice about it before excepting it you would have tried to talk me out of it. It took a lot of preparation but we get them all done and make darn good money doing it. As long as you are aware of your limitations as a business owner and the limitations of your business its self, and you feel comfortable with taking the work on, I say go for it.


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

Burkartsplow;848916 said:


> put up four more posts and we will be tied. awesome :bluebounc. yeah throw this thread out and the one where he is asking for subs.


Does a post count if it is quoted?


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## Marionlandscape (Jul 27, 2005)

ok so first off it can be done and is done in other locations in the midwest I was in contact with one of his contractors in another area this afternoon. just because some of you can't do this don't mean that it is a bad idea for someone else. we have a rule in my company that I am very strict about. If you come to me with a problem you had better have some possible solutions. Thank you all for the posts I have my solution now.


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## ERICS LAWN CARE (Oct 19, 2009)

how do you know you are going to get paid? who is the management company?


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## suzuki0702 (Apr 6, 2008)

hahaha i know what ur thinking.....25k x 10 events! lol


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## Schuley (Jul 22, 2009)

We do about 50 drives every storm in about 4-5 hours with 1 skid and 1 shoveling crew. I should also mention that they are in a 1 mile radius of our shop, not 100 miles. If the houses are grouped together it would be a lot easier. At our rate it would take us 50 hours with the 1 crew, if everything was close like it is now. Add a second crew and in theory we could do it in 25 hours, add a third....you do the math. Now that isn't figuring in much for drive time. If they are in groups of 50 or even 100 or so in an area it might be do-able. I take it its probably a bunch in different towns. So if you have 6 crews, around 84 drives per crew, You might want to re-think it. If people are trying to get out of those drives your going to get screamed at, if nobody lives in the homes and you can take you time getting to them its another story. 8 crews still have 63 to do each, so.....it comes down to how much time you have, and how efficient you are. Just designate each crew their own group of drives. But i'd still go 10 crews....... just my .02


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