# 22 Acre ( how to bid)



## DJRLandscape

Ok I have been plowing commercially for about 9yrs and I currently have 8 trucks in my fleet. I have recently been asked to bid a 22 acre lot with 24/7 traffic. I know I will need to add a loader or backhoe to the fleet and probably another spreader. What i am looking for is a little help on how to bid this, pricing? 
If i base it off other lots i have 1-2 acres i come in around 7000 for a 2-3.99 storm plus salt figure around 12 tons of salt to do the lot. 
average snowfall is 28" 19 events
Any help here


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## Bossman 92

I think you are a little off on how much salt you will need ( I figured about 8 tons, if you salt everything ) and I am not sure on pricing in your area, but think 7k per push is a bit high. Just my thoughts tho. Alot of large places around here only want the main drivelanes and intersections salted (again just my thoughts)

Good luck


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## JD Dave

So they asked you to bid it per push with different pricing /inch. I'm just trying to think how it's possible to bid a 22 acre lot that way. Everything is seasonal here so I really have a hard time wrapping my head around this.


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## DJRLandscape

Thanks guys. 
I was told give them my best price they dont care how its bid. Seasonal, inch, hr. Doesnt matter


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## csi.northcoast

they don't care how you bid it????? how are they goingto compare numbers

i could give them $25 per hour for plowing, but it may take me 60 hours to plow it

vs a loader that can take 8 hours?????


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## DJRLandscape

obviously they want it done as fast as possible. Like i said they dont care how its bid, thats why i am asking for some help


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## SullivanSeptic

I assume this is something like a large trucking terminal? If so, you will need at least 2 machines. Salt wise, 12 ton is too much. More like 8 ton. Being 24 hour, you will have a lot of time in it. Basically the snow can never pile up. Expect to have guys there as soon as snow starts


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## SNOWLORD

Im a little confused by some of this but my best advice would be for you to get in front of the person or persons that will be making the decision, and ask them how it was bid or billed in the past and make your bid look as similar to that as possible as this is what they are most comfortable with, I would also include another type of bid, the one that you would like them to choose, and sit down with them and explain the differences and really sell yourself to them in person, Usually in situaions like this the people making the decision on the plowing has 100 other things to do and most likely will get overwhelmed when a bunch of bids come in all bidding it different ways and usually retreat to the old comfortable way of things, so again get at least one bid in that looks familiar to them. Also if you are getting 7k for plowing 2 acres you are doing well. Good luck


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## DJRLandscape

7k for 2acres? Do you mean 22? That's why I'm asking the largest lot we do now is about 1.5-2 acres at a little over $500 so 250 x 22. = 5500 or 333x22=7326. So I figured 7k for 22 acres. So from what I see you guys think that's to high, I respect that. What would be a more reasonable rate. Also we get 180-200 per ton of salt so 200x8 ton= 1600. Which on a 24 hr property could add up quick. Does this look right? To high to low ?
Thank you.


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## mpgall26

Sounds odd that a property of that size doesn't have specs, but something that size that requires a good amount of dedicated staff and equipment would ideally be a seasonal. Seasonals with 20% in hand 11/1 allows you to shell out some cash for loaders/skids or whatever without fronting all the money. Those accounts can destroy companies with repeats of last season watching equipment sit, unless you own it outright already. Good luck it will be either a big loss or gain, I hope you do well


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## Bossman 92

So you charge close to $300 an acre to plow, but only charge $180 a ton for salt?


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## DJRLandscape

It's more like 250 an acre. And yes 180-200 for salt. I have min on lots that don't use much. I talked to another guy from VA the other day and he told me he would bid it around 9k for a 4". Are prices that different?


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## RLM

Pricing in every market is different, so it makes it had to compare pricing. I will tell you this just as a pickup looses efficiency as the lots get larger, pushes get longer, etc. Wheel loaders do the same, for instance we have a lot just under 3 acres we plow with our loader in about an hour. We did two Lowes stores, each probably 7 acres, they both took about 5 hours each. Like I said your rates are going to be different than mine, but I can tell you as the lots get bigger the pricing gets smaller, you will probably surprised at how little it goes for if they'll share the numbers. Everyone wants to say "I plow Lowes" or " I plow XYZ freight terminal". But in reality the guy plowing Mrs Jones & Mr Smiths driveways probably has more left at the end of the year.


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## Maclawnco

youll never get $250 an acre plowing unless you have family signing the other spot on your contract.


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## DJRLandscape

Already getting it. But what I'm getting is for this 22 acre lot I need to be more like 80-90 an acre. Or bid it hourly.


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## Flawless440

I've seen guys on here say $100 an acre push 2-4 then another $100 to salt an acre


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## BC Handyman

I'd say $5000 per visit up to 5" if it wide open, but thats me.


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## PhilFromErie

its hard for anyone to say anything on it without a picture, but if its a wide open lot a loader and a hoe can do it I'd think with a truck to help. May be even one loader with a truck if your loader is really on the ball. what it would go for in my market has nothing to do with where your at but....I'd say $2,500 per push and about a G to salt


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## dfd9

You'd never get anything close to that around me. Except shown the door.


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## PhilFromErie

Mine or the original poster?


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## dfd9

PhilFromErie;1487845 said:


> Mine or the original poster?


OP. Thumbs Up


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## G.Landscape

PhilFromErie;1487755 said:


> its hard for anyone to say anything on it without a picture, but if its a wide open lot a loader and a hoe can do it I'd think with a truck to help. May be even one loader with a truck if your loader is really on the ball. what it would go for in my market has nothing to do with where your at but....I'd say $2,500 per push and about a G to salt


I agree with this...


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## JerryA31

If you can average the industry standard of 1 acre = 1 hour couldn't you just multiply 22 x your rate per hour? In my market that would be about $1,750 to $2,000 per push.


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## MatthewG

I see numbers all over the place

I just bid an 18 acre warehouse site, all open, flat, concrete

bid it like this 
0-1.9
2-3.9
4-5.9
etc
12+ is then by the hour - I charge $500 an hour, that is for 2 wheel loaders and maybe one truck for the tight spots

Salt is separate and I figured it max at 10 tons, another guy said it would take 20 (go fish)


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## ryde307

For the guys stating x per push. How do you push 22 acres of a 24hr facility consistently enough to give per push pricing?
Not saying your wrong trying to understand. Per push is not common here.
I would think something like this would be per event, per hr or seasonal.


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## PhilFromErie

Yea, for sure seasonal would be better but some times people just want per push you know. On smaller lots its easy per push but ones this big in a storm you might run the drive lanes 4 times, clean the entrances 6 times and do the lot twice. We had this situation before and i pretty much just billed what ever I felt was fair whenever we plowed and they never complained. I wouldn't count on saying "welp we just got done plowing the whole lot, guess we can start on our second plow now" It just never works that way with lots this size.


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## dfd9

ryde307;1498163 said:


> For the guys stating x per push. How do you push 22 acres of a 24hr facility consistently enough to give per push pricing?
> Not saying your wrong trying to understand. Per push is not common here.
> I would think something like this would be per event, per hr or seasonal.


How do you determine a seasonal price without determining what one push would take time wise?

Seems like per event would be far more difficult than a per push.

I will readily admit to knowing nothing about determining a per event price, but it would seem like one could really screw themselves on a 22 acre site with per event pricing.


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## Masssnowfighter

With 20 acres plus, there is no such thing as per push. Its not like a driveway where you can plow it and come back 4 hours later and plow it again. You will be pushing non stop from the first flake to the last flake, if you are lucky you might be ahead of it enough to go take a quick coffee break


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## ryde307

Masssnowfighter;1500453 said:


> With 20 acres plus, there is no such thing as per push. Its not like a driveway where you can plow it and come back 4 hours later and plow it again. You will be pushing non stop from the first flake to the last flake, if you are lucky you might be ahead of it enough to go take a quick coffee break


This is basically what I was getting at.
When figuring a seasonal we come up with a base push price 1-3" and calculate from there.
My wonder was how do you push 22 acres and turn around do it again and again in 1 storm to bill out multiple pushes? Unless you have alot of equipment dedicated to the site so push it in 2 hrs.


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## Mark Oomkes

How did you come out come out on this bid OP?


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## framer1901

I know you're busier than that Mark, maybe it was a three year contract.....


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## AUDRAIN PLOWER

a lot that size has got to be by the hour in my opinion GOOD LUCK


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## cet

AUDRAIN PLOWER;2005943 said:


> a lot that size has got to be by the hour in my opinion GOOD LUCK


Why do you say that?


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## BMWSTUD25

See....he's a pro at small lots. Now he's ready for 35 acres!!! And here you have been giving him a hard time lol


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## Mark Oomkes

framer1901;2005937 said:


> I know you're busier than that Mark, maybe it was a three year contract.....


I was just wondering how much help and advice the OP had proffered. I noticed most if not all his posts have been questions. But he gets pissed when someone doesn't help him.


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## framer1901

Mark Oomkes;2006090 said:


> I was just wondering how much help and advice the OP had proffered. I noticed most if not all his posts have been questions. But he gets pissed when someone doesn't help him.


I just meant that last post was three years old is all.


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