# Payroll ratio to Sales



## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

What is your guys payroll (including the labor burden) to GROSS Sales %?

Just curious to see what the industry looks like! If you'd like to pm me thats cool

- Jared


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

I wasn't sure so I just looked and it's just a hair over 29%. Man, that sure seems high. Holy smokes!

I'm interested to see what others say.


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

I have found material and fuel costs do not come close to what labor rates are with the proper worker's comp and tax statutes.


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## Defcon 5 (Mar 20, 2014)

Camden;1983629 said:


> I wasn't sure so I just looked and it's just a hair over 29%. Man, that sure seems high. Holy smokes!
> 
> I'm interested to see what others say.


Must be that GPO saving you ALL that money on Salt,Fuel,Equipment and Labor costs to attribute to that high rate of return...............:laughing:........


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Right at 31.5% last year.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Defcon 5;1984040 said:


> Must be that GPO saving you ALL that money on Salt,Fuel,Equipment and Labor costs to attribute to that high rate of return...............:laughing:........


"We mock what we don't understand."


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## Herm Witte (Jan 27, 2009)

EGLC;1983627 said:


> What is your guys payroll (including the labor burden) to GROSS Sales %?
> 
> Just curious to see what the industry looks like! If you'd like to pm me thats cool
> 
> - Jared


Got me wondering and looking. Three year average is 41.5% which includes my salary. This is for Snow and Landscape Maintenance. We've been working hard to bring the percentage down and last year it was at 38%. We still have a ways to go. As a seasonal employer my unemployment rate is at 12.65%. Percentages do not include health insurance or retirement benefits. I'll spend a bit of time over the weekend to separate Snow from Landscape.


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

I guess I must be doing well than at a hair under 20%… 

My drivers get $25hr and shovelers $16hr. I was thinking of increasing to $30hr for my 3 best guys. 

That % is for snow only, including shop time (washing trucks, etc)


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## Herm Witte (Jan 27, 2009)

OK, you got me going on this. 29.60% three year average labor to sales on the snow end of our business.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

My number was year round, not just winter related.

Never really looked at winter vs summer.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Herm Witte;1984287 said:


> OK, you got me going on this. 29.60% three year average labor to sales on the snow end of our business.


Almost exactly where I'm at.

Edit: My total was for 12 months as well.


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## Herm Witte (Jan 27, 2009)

Maybe we need to add one piece to the equation;

Labor + Labor Burden + subcontracting expenses (since sub contract income is part of the income) = a clearer picture or not?

Headed home and have a great weekend!


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## Defcon 5 (Mar 20, 2014)

Camden;1984208 said:


> "We mock what we don't understand."


I mock you.......I understand GPOs Very Well.......


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

I should clarify, I have no real subcontractors...just a local friend who helps out if I am in a pinch. If I did that would surely change the numbers.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Defcon 5;1984313 said:


> I understand GPOs Very Well.


No you don't.

You said that Cargill wouldn't waste their time with them. It took me 1 minute to prove you wrong. (Did you ever call them by the way?) What else ya got? 

And what's your ratio of payroll to gross sales since that's what this thread is about?


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## snocrete (Feb 28, 2009)

Herm Witte;1984300 said:


> Maybe we need to add one piece to the equation;
> 
> Labor + Labor Burden + subcontracting expenses (since sub contract income is part of the income) = a clearer picture or not?
> 
> Headed home and have a great weekend!


32% for the whole yr, last yr.

Winter only for last yr is looking like 20-25%....but that was just quick figuring...not totally accurate.


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

Wow! Different world's, we are closer to 50% labour expense.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Pristine PM ltd;1984493 said:


> Wow! Different world's, we are closer to 50% labour expense.


That's staggering. Is ANYTHING less expensive in Canada? It sure doesn't seem like it...


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

Nope, even the plows we manufacture, you get cheaper.

Part of our problem is that our insurance costs are insane


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Pristine PM ltd;1984493 said:


> Wow! Different world's, we are closer to 50% labour expense.


Holy hell. I don't see how you can make any money paying out 50% of gross in labor related costs.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

Pristine PM ltd;1984493 said:


> Wow! Different world's, we are closer to 50% labour expense.


I wonder how different your summer and winter is.


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

JD Dave;1984530 said:


> I wonder how different your summer and winter is.


That I don't know off the top oof my head, but I would assume summer is higher.


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

Pristine PM ltd;1984493 said:


> Wow! Different world's, we are closer to 50% labour expense.


That is insane! Are your employees on hourly wages? Whats your labor burden % up there?


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

Some of these % fit the rule of x3 on your salt cost.


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

I have some research to do, I am mostly a salesman, and my partner handles the business, but including all cost associated with our employee's, subs, workplace safety, Canada pension, etc... is about 50percent of the income. I don't know if I missed something, or we are in a crazy different world. My partner and I do not work with the guys, so that savings that some guys have, we do not.


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## DKG (Feb 3, 2008)

I second that Jon. I'm at least 50% All of my guys are standby plus hourly, or full time.


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## Pristine PM ltd (Oct 15, 2005)

Phew, was feeling like I was wrong for posting!


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## DKG (Feb 3, 2008)

The maintenance business would have to be higher, because the main thing being sold is time.


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