# Who is making these decisions?



## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

Got a call from a 5+ year customer the other day "i had to get another quote this year, we have a problem, they are a lot lower than you" this is a major player in town, he sent me the bid. Now lets do a comparison here. Keep in mind we've done this for over 5 years, the production numbers, and salt usage have all been tracked, I know where we are.........

Ours 
Plow 1-3 $215 
Salt $178 
Walks 1-3 $125 

Theirs 
Plow 1-3 $150 
Salt $315 
Walks 1-3 $35 



"they are a lot lower than you"


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

Longae29;814617 said:


> "they are a lot lower than you"


Yes they are.....let's hope their service is too.

What a burn.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?p=814644&posted=1#post814644

Same type of person that is hiring this guy.


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

Doesn't look much lower to me. Both are approx $500


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## RLM (Jan 12, 2006)

Did they loose their calculator or fail math, yours $ 518 vs. comp. $500, thats 4% difference, nothing, call them back explain & cut $ 18 from whereever as a good will gesture.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

I was wondering if you guys would notice, did that get by TCLA? one lower number and one drastically lower number outweigh the bigger (more commonly occuring) number.

Guess its a good way to get your bid a second look, and maybe slip through the cracks. 

As soon as he sent me their bid, I crunched the numbers, called him back and explained that we would be lower over the course of the season with more saltings than plowings


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## plowtime1 (Nov 1, 2007)

Did you receive that lovely contract signed yet? Some people just dont think...sometimes you must lead them to the water. LOL


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

Plus he will salt when conditions call for plowing.


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## big acres (Nov 8, 2007)

Longae29;814673 said:


> I was wondering if you guys would notice, did that get by TCLA? one lower number and one drastically lower number outweigh the bigger (more commonly occuring) number.
> 
> Guess its a good way to get your bid a second look, and maybe slip through the cracks.
> 
> As soon as he sent me their bid, I crunched the numbers, called him back and explained that we would be lower over the course of the season with more saltings than plowings


Yup... think that one got by TCLA. Let's forgive him since it doesn't happen often, lol.

Managers mainly look at the "full-plow" number and the hourly rates to make decisions. You might think they are incompetent, but mainly they are as overworked as anyone. At least they gave you the scoop and a chance to explain it.

I have lost so many bids to guys playing the game this way that I've started to play it myself... and yes, having that low plow number does get you a meeting.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

big acres;814702 said:


> Managers mainly look at the "full-plow" number and the hourly rates to make decisions.
> Their hourly rates were extremely low compared to their per push price since i know how long the lot takes to do, can't imagine they would over inflate their time there? :realmad:
> 
> I have lost so many bids to guys playing the game this way that I've started to play it myself... and yes, having that low plow number does get you a meeting.
> I'm going to give it a shot on the next bid i work up and see what happens[/COLOR




My conversation with the property manager was late last week, havent seen my signed contract yet.


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## terrapro (Oct 21, 2006)

Assuming you have an average of 15 plowable/shoveling events and say 20 saltings...

Per season-
You $8660
Them $9075

LOL


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## Bruce'sEx (Sep 16, 2006)

There are a couple company's around us that are the same, plow for nothing, but salt high. And Manager's see that and love it.

Problem is the numbers are normally double the number of salting runs then plowing. So in the end it just cost more. 

These are also the guys that try to salt off 3 inches of snow, instead of plowing. I wonder if it cause they get so much work that to actually have to plow they just can't handle the work load. 

Hopefully, if you explained him the numbers and went over how it's similar, and or you may even be cheaper if there is alot of just salt runs. that the Property Manager comes around.

Good luck


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

Didn't I say that earlier??


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## big acres (Nov 8, 2007)

WIPensFan;814868 said:


> Didn't I say that earlier??


By gosh, I believe you did say something similar... most of our high-end salt customers know that rather than try to burn-off a couple of inches, we usually plow 3/4 of it at no charge.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

Update: Lost this bid. They are "clearly going to save money with the other company" even though i sent them a nice spreadsheet showing how that wasnt the case. :realmad:


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## KL&M Snow Div. (Jan 2, 2009)

People are so dumb. They just found a number they liked and locked on it. Sometimes I wish people wouldn't be so set on one certain thing like alot of people are.


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## BRENTMAN (Oct 13, 2008)

you should have just matched his numbers, but did $310 for salt, and said youve been loyal to them and they'd have chosen you....and their bill would have been higher than the previous years! haha

..assuming you'd salt like crazy just to be an A hole


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## buckwheat_la (Oct 11, 2009)

sorry to hear it man, that sucks, the good news for you, when you see these guys salting the hell out of 3-4inches of snow, you can go into the store, smile at the manager, and say "hey, your lot looks like sh!t" and walk back out.


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## big acres (Nov 8, 2007)

I started a thread under commercial about having met with a big retail manager of several malls and where our bid came in and why we were not chosen, anyways...

They have a spreadsheet and they plug in all the numbers, plow, salt, sidewalks, ice melt. The spreadsheet figures a certain number of 1-3", 3-6", saltings, etc... and spits out the ranking by estimated expense for the season under each contractor and the percentage over/under the next guy.

This might be a handy tool to have for ourselves to give out only when we know the prices are actually very close but the client can't see past the shell game.

...woudn't give it to everyone though, cause it might make US look higher priced.


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## chitown sparky (Sep 24, 2009)

I would have told them I would match it and now salt it more often than plow and you make more money and they are happy to even though it would have been cheaper your way


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## blowerman (Dec 24, 2007)

I recall talking to you the other week on the phone about this acount... Sorry to hear they went with the other guy. I'm assuming it's the "big name company" you shared with me. I've picked up a couple of new accounts bidding against one of the other big guys in Milwaukee area. What helped was they did such a crappy job the past year these places didn't even want those guys back.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

Yeah, went to the "big name company" I'm not that upset to lose them, they were always a real P.I.T.A when it came to salting under 1''., which we do for EVERY account.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

Update: Guess from reading this thread I was a bit of a sore loser here at the end on the last post.

I signed this account to a 2 yr. deal this afternoon. apparently the grass is not always greener on the other side.

I also got one of my larger landscape maintenance accounts back that went elsewhere last year. 

Having a good day to say the least.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

That's how the game is played.... don't burn bridges... give them reason to consider you again when the time comes.. remember that managers change, property owners change,and hopefully you're still around to rebid it (and get it back).
sometimes you just get outbid. Not neccessarily your fault.


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## Luther (Oct 31, 2007)

Longae29;814673 said:


> did that get by TCLA?


Yes it did.....

I was obviously not paying attention. :laughing:

Good for you Longae....wonderful update!!


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## Brant'sLawnCare (Jun 29, 2007)

Longae29;1028642 said:


> Update: Guess from reading this thread I was a bit of a sore loser here at the end on the last post.
> 
> I signed this account to a 2 yr. deal this afternoon. apparently the grass is not always greener on the other side.
> 
> ...


Congradulations! That's good to hear. Maybe this season will be better than last. It feels like spring out already, and Tru-Green is already out spraying! :laughing:


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