# 2 skid steers or 1 two speed skid?



## bullit340 (Oct 25, 2005)

I am looking for some advice. I currently use a s185 bobcat with a 8' pusher and a 1 yard snow bucket to move snow around after the storm. I was thinking that a s250 with the 2 speed option and a 2 yard snow bucket would be way more productive moving snow around after the storm. The problem is the cost and I am not sure its worth it.

I can purchase a larger skid that is not 2 speed, and another 8' pusher to run with my s185 for much less money than upgrading my s185 to a bigger 2 speed unit. I almost own my s185. If I just bought a larger skid I would have two bobcats on site, and could put a 2 yard bucket on the larger skid. It just would not have the 2 speed. Is the 2 speed really going to make that much difference? I would not be pushing the snow pusher in the high range but I figure it would be in the high range going around the parking lot and moving piles. Any advice would be greatly appreciated


----------



## timm9 (Dec 19, 2001)

I don't run skids but I do have two (2) Toolcats, both are 2 speed. While everyones situation is different, I have never heard anyone complain that they wish they never bought the 2 Speed version. Even if you are leaving the skids "on site", nothing is forever and things do, and will change in the future. I actually sold a CAT because it was just too slow. The only large piece of equipment I still have is turbo charged and will really move.


----------



## MIDTOWNPC (Feb 17, 2007)

I would rather have 2 skids for redundancy vs 1


----------



## LoneCowboy (Jan 2, 2007)

Economics 101

It's cheaper to run 1 big skid steer than 2 smaller ones.

1 unit of labor vs. 2

It costs less to buy one big unit than 2 smaller ones.

Maintenance costs for one big unit are less than 2 smaller ones.

Registration, taxes, permits, moving the things around, insurance, etc are more for 2 units than 1.

Do the math, it's cheaper to run one big unit than 2 smaller ones.

But, as someone noted, if you're down, you're down. And it may not fit your situation. (you need the smaller size to get in some lot, etc)

It also lets you do things that other people can't (because they have small machines and you have a big one)


----------



## BlackIrish (Dec 22, 2007)

IMO if you go drive a 2 speed you'll never look back, having a 2nd skid as back up is priceless. OUT OF 7 skids for this yr only the 3 oldest are single speed (slow), you can definitely plow in high speed.


----------



## big pusher (Sep 9, 2008)

I personally will never own another skidloader that is not a 2-speed.


----------



## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

obviously a 2 speed would be referred but it will not get twice as much done

i would buy the second machine and use them both


----------



## NICHOLS LANDSCA (Sep 15, 2007)

cretebaby;597997 said:


> obviously a 2 speed would be referred but it will not get twice as much done
> 
> i would buy the second machine and use them both


X2, You can never have too much equipment. 2 is better than 1, I don't know of anyone that charges more for a 2 speed.


----------



## MIDTOWNPC (Feb 17, 2007)

*lonecowboy*

I agree with lonecowboy, on that fact that its cheaper, cause of manpower and other issues, but also factor in one thing

if your hourly 2 machines is making you more.

maybe one with a blade one with a bucket even?

no one i know charges more for a 2 speed then single speed
infact it is kinda strange but I usually find guys who have a 185 charge the same as I do with s300. I charge hourly for my big sites that want a skid steer, and I get mad at myself every time I want to upgrade my equipment cause i know its not going to make me much more. eg if I add a 8611 blade to my skidsteer am I going to get $10 more, probably have a hard time convincing however I believe it would shave hours off my time vs a bucket and then I think, am I putting myself out of work, eg: save 2 hours, get an extra $20 and over all lost $80. or I would have to calculate my bills

I love 1 price bidding (all the plowing all the salt, no worries for the customer, just 5 easy payments)

it depends alot on what the majority of your work is.

2 speed would really have helped me out in traveling from one location to another, but not so much onsite of my plowing because I am either on a small tight lot, or a large lot where I plow with a truck.


----------



## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

i had a friend a few years ago, he had like 7 machines, and his guys kept on breaking the key way on the pumps, and motors, , he thought it was because they were operating in the high range, doing alot of forward reverse stuff... when they should have been in the low range...so he locked out the hihg range....no more problems.... just FYi

i dont know anyone that pays more for a 2 speed machine, i think in most cases you could charge more with 2 machines Vs one...


----------



## bullit340 (Oct 25, 2005)

Thanks for all the replys, I am still debating this as I hate spending money on the wrong thing. I now know for sure now that we will be using 2 skids this winter at this particular site. It is not hourly so the quicker I get things done the better. 

My current choices for the second skid are:
s250 with the 2 speed for like 25k 500 hrs
873 with single speed for 15k 1000 hrs

I am kinda leaning towards the s250 cause I don't want to be wishing I had the 2 speed down the road and don t want to have to do this again anytime soon. But on the other hand, I am sure I would be happy with the 873 and with the extra cash I would save I could get another pusher if I wanted. 

So now my debate is 2 skids 
one single speed and one 2 speed or just get two single speeds. Is the 10k+ worth it?


----------



## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

arnt the 73's getting up there in years


----------



## pieperlc (Jan 4, 2005)

The 10k is probably worth it. Remember you're getting a newer machine and also a newer generation machine. You will probably wish you would've gotten the 2 speed down the road. I know I do everyday. In a good winter the 2 speed might make up most or all of that 10k price difference.


----------



## cornerstone (Dec 3, 2007)

*2speed-2speed-2speed!*

I would take fuel burn into consideration also. With the 2 speed you'll probably not wind the motor so hard and burn less fuel, but if you're a wide open type person you're going 12 MPH in high and covering ALOT of ground. A 2speed and 8 or 10 ft pusher and you will move some snow. I climbed in our JD 280 2-speed and accidently broke the 2speed button off. Haven't had a chance to grab a new one and it's like having an anchor tied to your butt in low moving pallets around the store. I'll have it fixed before bad weather rolls in no doubt.


----------



## powerjoke (Nov 13, 2004)

personally, 

if i was gonna spen $15k i would buy a older T200 or a 864 track machine, 

that way you have not just another run of the mill machine, 

and besides that i hate the vertical lift rubber tired machine's, they as good in the dirt as a radius machine!.



PJ


----------



## hickslawns (Dec 18, 2004)

Bullit340- Option C is buy the 2 speed. Then get a different set of tires and rims for the winter for the 185. I put some snow tires on my 773 last winter. Taller tire which barely fit, but it amazed me how much better it pushed. I thought it was the carbide chips in the tires at first then realized how much faster I was going. Didn't even think about that when I bought them, but what a huge bonus that was. I am looking at a 2 speed to add to the lineup right now as well. After demoing a couple, I know I will never buy a 1 speed again.


----------



## lordstanley (Dec 6, 2008)

Phil HIcks,

Can you clarify/expound on your tires and how you got "more speed".

Type, where you got them, etc. Does it just "feel" faster or is it really faster?


----------



## Otts (Nov 8, 2008)

powerjoke;601109 said:


> personally,
> 
> if i was gonna spen $15k i would buy a older T200 or a 864 track machine,
> 
> ...


You must have never ran a rubbered track machine in the snow. I hear the suck pretty bad.

Go for the newer 2 speed. I just upgraded to a '05 2 speed S250 from a '95 853. Very nice.


----------



## Superior L & L (Oct 6, 2006)

Otts;699705 said:


> You must have never ran a rubbered track machine in the snow. I hear the suck pretty bad.
> 
> Go for the newer 2 speed. I just upgraded to a '05 2 speed S250 from a '95 853. Very nice.


It depends on what tracks you run. Our T190 is a plowing machine


----------



## CityGuy (Dec 19, 2008)

We use 2 Cat 277C with tracks and have no problems at all with traction.


----------



## DGODGR (Nov 30, 2008)

Bullit340, I have an A300 (2spd) and I use 2spd 95% of the time. Low speed is very slow and the lot better have a lot of snow and be very tight to not need the high speed. With the 2nd speed come more potential for problems. I have not had nor herd of any mechanical problems from using high speed but if you are doing parking lots you must be aware that if you accidentally hit a curb it will knock your teeth out. You must adjust your timing because it will slide (when you want to stop) if you are not using chains. This is not a huge problem but factor it in. I think "lonecowboy" makes a good argument. If you have a quallified operator to run the second skid it will give you the oportunity to get done faster and thus get more work. If you are doing things right the bennefits of this are obvious and out weigh the additional costs.
I have used track machines before and they work OK in the snow but if you are plowing to the pavement (you will notice there is a sheet of ice after you push most of the time) traction suffers. Ice + tracks = not very good traction). You may experience difficulty if it is not flat and when you are changing directions (F/R), or steering. 
Does the 500HR machine come with a warranty. If so that can be worth something. It seems as though the $25k is very close to what a new one may cost. If you go new you do have warranty and or a loner program if your dealer has one. On the flip side you did not mention how many hours or the condition of the 863. If it is in excellent condition with low hours it would take a lot of repairs to tally up $15k.


----------



## LUCKY 7 (Dec 9, 2008)

I ran my T190 on the pavement one year and won't do it again. The traction was terrible and it was very hard on the tracks. Now it pushes back piles, loads, and blows. I know for a fact that 2speeds are great for snow removal but, I don't hear anything about the customer wanting more for less. Why not have twice as much equipment for way less money??? Things are bound to change sometime and then you would have flexibility to tackle other situations.


----------



## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

ummm, i have learned alitle on the subject

the 2 speed - i would never again buy a single speed...it rocks 

but - it dependson yoru lots. we use it incombination with the trucks. we use the trucks to move the snow down the lot... and the SS, cleans tight areas


in that type of situation , the 2nd high speed, really doesnt come into play, becasue your not taking snow down the parking lot, instead your doing slow tedous work... in that case the 2nd machinewould be better... 

so it depends on what you plow, and how you intend to use it

on a side note, at least with 2 machines if one goes down , your not totally screwed


----------



## KAG (Jul 19, 2007)

*Having the very same thoughts*

Glad you posted the question. Looking at the option of getting an older 2 speed.


----------

