# Pulled over for plow being to wide



## dsplow

I got pulled over for my plow being to wide. I have a 7-1/2 meyer with pro wings. I had plow angled back to driver side. state cop said I was only allowed 8' 6" width, plow measured 9' 2" straight end to end. got $100 ticket Does this sound Wrong .


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## mcwlandscaping

If you were indeed angled then you were in the right as long as you are under that legal measurement


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## Woodenshoe

dsplow;1419723 said:


> I got pulled over for my plow being to wide. I have a 7-1/2 meyer with pro wings. I had plow angled back to driver side. state cop said I was only allowed 8' 6" width, plow measured 9' 2" straight end to end. got $100 ticket Does this sound Wrong .


Yup, sounds wrong if you for sure had it angled all the way. But I would not get in a pissing match with a trooper on the side of the road. Do some research (maybe look up the specific law for which he issued the ticket) then decide if its worth fighting.


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## terrapro

dsplow;1419723 said:


> I got pulled over for my plow being to wide. I have a 7-1/2 meyer with pro wings. I had plow angled back to driver side. state cop said I was only allowed 8' 6" width, plow measured 9' 2" straight end to end. got $100 ticket Does this sound Wrong .


Nope they measure possible width around here...Suck it up and just be happy he didn't write anymore tickets.


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## RepoMan1968

sounds to me theres not alot of crime there . our state pd is way too busy chasing bad guys here . what a joke


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## WIPensFan

I just posted the other day about how wide some guys are driving around with wings on. Everybody just ignored it for the most part.


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## RepoMan1968

WIPensFan;1419774 said:


> I just posted the other day about how wide some guys are driving around with wings on. Everybody just ignored it for the most part.


when the flakes are flying , it dont matter . But when it's sunny and 49* , your on your own .


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## Turf Commando

Michigan is in a world of hurt. County mounty, city boys and especially (state police) have a certain amount of tickets that need written.. Chalk it up to wrong place, wrong time..

Here's a story my father drives a semi for 7up he was going Northbound and a off duty trooper tried to call other troopers to pull him over. Stating he was driving reckless because he passed the cop in semi doing 67mph while the trooper was on phone.
This officer I mean (ass) went as far as calling his 7up boss (had trailer #) and said ;Quote ''If I could off pulled him over I'd give him 6 points on license''. welcome to Hell Michigan..!


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## Matson Snow

dsplow;1419723 said:


> I got pulled over for my plow being to wide. I have a 7-1/2 meyer with pro wings. I had plow angled back to driver side. state cop said I was only allowed 8' 6" width, plow measured 9' 2" straight end to end. got $100 ticket Does this sound Wrong .


Welcome to Michigan......I thought you were only allowed 8 Foot....

Anyway....They will sell you a Permit per county for i Think $110....That will cover you for the over width....But at $110 per county it starts to add up....


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## RepoMan1968

Turf Commando;1419833 said:


> Michigan is in a world of hurt. County mounty, city boys and especially (state police) have a certain amount of tickets that need written.. Chalk it up to wrong place, wrong time..
> 
> Here's a story my father drives a semi for 7up he was going Northbound and a off duty trooper tried to call other troopers to pull him over. Stating he was driving reckless because he passed the cop in semi doing 67mph while the trooper was on phone.
> This officer I mean (ass) went as far as calling his 7up boss (had trailer #) and said ;Quote ''If I could off pulled him over I'd give him 6 points on license''. welcome to Hell Michigan..!


Terrible . Thats that liberal non-capitalist thinking mentality. Hemay just need to spread his wealth more .


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## Turf Commando

RepoMan1968;1419843 said:


> Terrible . Thats that liberal non-capitalist thinking mentality. Hemay just need to spread his wealth more .


When I hear about police forces being cut I feel awful...


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## RepoMan1968

Turf Commando;1419856 said:


> When I hear about police forces being cut I feel awful...


thats why we have a right to bear arms . I feel safe in my home .


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## JB1

just make a campaign donation to the local prosecutor.


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## MRHORSEPOWER1

What are they gonna do if you had 9' hiniker scoop plow mounted on....


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## Eronningen

If he said 8'6" max width, than go and angle your blade like it was, put a 2'x4' on the angled in sideso you can get a true width measurement. If you're still over pay the ticket, if not, take some pics and go to the court date and plead your case if its worth it for the $100 or principle


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## WRIGHTWAY

terrapro;1419763 said:


> Nope they measure possible width around here...Suck it up and just be happy he didn't write anymore tickets.


If it's not over 8-6 Take measurements and photos and have your day in court. I am not against law enforcement in any way but possible is not a factual term. You ether are or are not breaking the law it's possible for me to rob a bank but until I have don so I have not broken any laws


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## jhall22guitar

RepoMan1968;1419781 said:


> when the flakes are flying , it dont matter . But when it's sunny and 49* , your on your own .


Thats probably part of the issue, I believe here if your plow is one 72hrs after a storm its illegal -__-


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## cretebaby

jhall22guitar;1420153 said:


> Thats probably part of the issue, I believe here if your plow is one 72hrs after a storm its illegal -__-


I'd like to see that in writing.


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## cretebaby

terrapro;1419763 said:


> Nope they measure possible width around here...


Well lets not be stupid here.

If you open the doors on the truck you'd be to wide as well.


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## jhall22guitar

If I can find it I will post it.


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## cretebaby

jhall22guitar;1420180 said:


> If I can find it I will post it.


I won't hold my breath.


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## jhall22guitar

http://www.plowsite.com/archive/index.php/t-42452.html

Here is a link to a discussion about it that includes the link. (4th comment has law)

LINK TO LAW DOSNT WORK :'(


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## cretebaby

jhall22guitar;1420187 said:


> http://www.plowsite.com/archive/index.php/t-42452.html
> 
> Here is a link to a discussion about it that includes the link. (4th comment has law)
> 
> LINK TO LAW DOSNT WORK :'(


So that applies for only a few days per year?


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## 31050

A few years ago I was pulled over by DOT, 810 with wings out and foward and given a warning. I was told that the ticket was $250 for over width.


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## jb1390

That law about 72 hours only applies between May 15th, and october 15th. The rest of the year, you can keep it on 100 percent of the time.

Here is a link that should work better

http://www.mass.gov/rmv/rmvnews/2005/SnowplowAnnouncement.pdf

And pretty much all plow manufacturers give plow width when straight, and plow width (in the lane of travel) when the plow is fully angled. Since wings were used, you'd need to calculate the width when angled using trig or methods posted earlier. If you do want to go to court, it might be a good idea to take in plow manufacturers data showing a 9' plow is less than that when angled, in case the judge flunked out of high school math.


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## jhall22guitar

Yup, its pretty stupid, but even now (we havent had any pushable snow here) there are a few guys riding around with plows on. I am surprised that there isnt a law here about that.


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## nick4634

jhall22guitar;1420187 said:


> http://www.plowsite.com/archive/index.php/t-42452.html
> 
> Here is a link to a discussion about it that includes the link. (4th comment has law)
> 
> LINK TO LAW DOSNT WORK :'(


Couldn't it be interpreted that the 3 day rule only applies during may 15 through oct 15. so if theres a snow storm on may 25 you can put your plow on but it has to be off by may 28. I don't think it applies during winter


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## WRIGHTWAY

cretebaby;1420179 said:


> Well lets not be stupid here.
> 
> If you open the doors on the truck you'd be to wide as well.


Found myself looking for the like button on that one


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## jhall22guitar

WRIGHTWAY;1420227 said:


> Found myself looking for the like button on that one


Maybe PS should add a Like/Dislike LOL


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## 04f250fisher

8'6" is the legal width to run down the road. It applys to tractor trailers as well and if your over that then you have to have an over size load permit. The fact that the cop would pick up on a snow plow is strange but he right.


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## Mark13

8.6' is legal here too. The farm manager where I work runs a 8.6' unimount with pro wings and was fueling up when an officer told him that if it wasn't snowing he would consider giving him a ticket for over width if he had him stopped somewhere. Since it was snowing the officer just took the time to inform him so he knows for the future, wasn't trying to be mean or anything from the story he told me since I run a 9' and a 9.2' and wanted to pass on the info.


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## 4d9

The law does state that you cant be over 8'6" total width without the proper permit. If you are over the 8'6" width, you have to have oversize Load signs front and back and have your rotator on top. You will also have to have a permit for the highway as well as the county roads that you are traveling on. The DOT always measured the widest part of the vehicle/load. this could playout two different ways in court. The cop could say that your plow wasn't angled far enough to put you under the 8'6" limit when he wrote you the ticket, or they could let you go.


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## 4d9

The law does state that you cant be over 8'6" total width without the proper permit. If you are over the 8'6" width, you have to have oversize Load signs front and back and have your rotator on top. You will also have to have a permit for the highway as well as the county roads that you are traveling on. The DOT always measured the widest part of the vehicle/load. this could playout two different ways in court. The cop could say that your plow wasn't angled far enough to put you under the 8'6" limit when he wrote you the ticket, or they could let you go. Technically you are supposed to have a twlelve inch red flag hooked to both sides of the widest part ie both corners of your plow if you are over 8'6"


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## dsplow

The cop said it was straight when he passed me and that I moved it when I pulled over, which I did not. the plow was not fully angled but was angled. He measured tip to tip like it was straight. Wouldn't boss v-plows be over if u had to straighten it. Snow was falling and plows were all over and he was licking his lips. The cop was very rude.


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## jhall22guitar

If you go to court, or even before, go get the dash cam video, that will prove that it was angled prior to you pulling over


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## got-h2o

If there's any truth to the permit thing in your area, just offer to buy the permit for the extra $5 instead of paying the ticket, and you'll be good to go for the rest of the season.


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## dsplow

I wonder if he will pull me over again if I leave the wings on, and angle it all the way. It measured 8ft angled all the way. I just don't want to have to pay another $100


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## chad1234

They seem to only notice being over width if you have some type of wings


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## jomama45

Matson Snow;1419834 said:


> Welcome to Michigan......I thought you were only allowed 8 Foot....


I've tried to make that point as well in the past (that MI is one of the few states that still only allows 8' width on most roads), but no one ever seems ot care........Thumbs Up


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## willsterman

*May be able to get out of it or get it reduced*

Follow the directions on the ticket and do the following:
1. Plead NOT GUILTY by mail.

2. You should get a notice in the mail for a pretrial date.

3. Then, a couple days BEFORE the PRETRIAL call the Prosecutor (District Attorney) office that handles your matter (contact clerk of court if not sure).

Tell the person that answers that you have a pretrail scheduled for (date & time) and you would like to speak with the DA to try and reach a plea agreement by phone. Be ready to give them the case number off your pretrial notice, and your citation number off your citation, along with your name to help them locate your file.

Give the DA a very short explanation of what happened, that most snowplows are your size or slightly larger. Hopefully the DA will give you an acceptable deal. It rarely is worth the effort to take a traffic matter to trial unless you are 90% certain you will win.

Disclaimer: The above is just my opinion, not legal advice, see an attorney licensed in your state if you want a legal opinion.

Good luck.


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## jjklongisland

willsterman;1420509 said:


> Follow the directions on the ticket and do the following:
> 1. Plead NOT GUILTY by mail.
> 
> 2. You should get a notice in the mail for a pretrial date.
> 
> 3. Then, a couple days BEFORE the PRETRIAL call the Prosecutor (District Attorney) office that handles your matter (contact clerk of court if not sure).
> 
> Tell the person that answers that you have a pretrail scheduled for (date & time) and you would like to speak with the DA to try and reach a plea agreement by phone. Be ready to give them the case number off your pretrial notice, and your citation number off your citation, along with your name to help them locate your file.
> 
> Give the DA a very short explanation of what happened, that most snowplows are your size or slightly larger. Hopefully the DA will give you an acceptable deal. It rarely is worth the effort to take a traffic matter to trial unless you are 90% certain you will win.
> 
> Disclaimer: The above is just my opinion, not legal advice, see an attorney licensed in your state if you want a legal opinion.
> 
> Good luck.


lol... that might work in Wisconsin but where I live if you actually can get a human on the phone regarding a traffic ticket thats is a miracle in itself... To ask for a pretrial with the DA I think they would fall over laughing and need to call EMS and dispatch them to person requesting the pretrial to see if he is mentally insane...

I think if you fight it you have a good chance...


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## terrapro

cretebaby;1420179 said:


> *Well lets not be stupid here.*
> 
> If you open the doors on the truck you'd be to wide as well.


Why did you reply then?

For your information you will get a ticket for opening your doors while driving also.

I don't care if you don't believe me, come to Michigan with your wings and drive around you will see what happens.

Original poster take your wings off while driving or you will be fined again.


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## cretebaby

terrapro;1420653 said:


> For your information you will get a ticket for opening your doors while driving also.


For being overwidth?


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## blee1ash

terrapro;1419763 said:


> Nope they measure possible width around here...Suck it up and just be happy he didn't write anymore tickets.


The comment about the doors has to do with the fact that if you open your doors you have the possibility to be over width, but they don't ticket evreybody with doors on their vehicle just because they could be over width if they opened their doors.

If you did truly have the plow angled, and it is under the width limit when it is angled(measure it and take pictures for proof), I would fight the ticket.


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## kashman

has any1 seen a dually with tow mirrors they get wide


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## cwby_ram

kashman;1420756 said:


> has any1 seen a dually with tow mirrors they get wide


I should have measured mine before I switched the mirrors. Had the Dodge fold out mirrors on my dually. They were a good bit wider than my fenders.


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## Plowtoy

Bring it to court, chances are (at least in my area) the officer wont show up, especially if the weather conditions are bad. Just my .02 ussmileyflag


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## jmac5058

jhall22guitar;1420153 said:


> Thats probably part of the issue, I believe here if your plow is one 72hrs after a storm its illegal -__-


Not in Mass.


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## the new boss 92

4d9;1420269 said:


> The law does state that you cant be over 8'6" total width without the proper permit. If you are over the 8'6" width, you have to have oversize Load signs front and back and have your rotator on top. You will also have to have a permit for the highway as well as the county roads that you are traveling on. The DOT always measured the widest part of the vehicle/load. this could playout two different ways in court. The cop could say that your plow wasn't angled far enough to put you under the 8'6" limit when he wrote you the ticket, or they could let you go. Technically you are supposed to have a twlelve inch red flag hooked to both sides of the widest part ie both corners of your plow if you are over 8'6"


technacally most plows by me have red flags on both cornersussmileyflag


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## cretebaby

kashman;1420756 said:


> has any1 seen a dually with tow mirrors they get wide


Mirrors are not included in the width measurements.


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## the new boss 92

cretebaby;1420901 said:


> Mirrors are not included in the width measurements.


well i might sound dumb, but a plow isnt technacally part of the truck. therefore if teliscoping mirrors aren't part of it, then niether should a plow. correct?


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## cretebaby

the new boss 92;1420931 said:


> well i might sound dumb, but a plow isnt technacally part of the truck.


It sounds just as it is.


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## plowguy43

willsterman;1420509 said:


> Follow the directions on the ticket and do the following:
> 1. Plead NOT GUILTY by mail.
> 
> 2. You should get a notice in the mail for a pretrial date.


Follow those two rules only. Definitely fight the ticket.



jjklongisland;1420611 said:


> lol... that might work in Wisconsin but where I live if you actually can get a human on the phone regarding a traffic ticket thats is a miracle in itself... To ask for a pretrial with the DA I think they would fall over laughing and need to call EMS and dispatch them to person requesting the pretrial to see if he is mentally insane...
> 
> I think if you fight it you have a good chance...


I do as well.



Plowtoy;1420818 said:


> Bring it to court, chances are (at least in my area) the officer wont show up, especially if the weather conditions are bad. Just my .02 ussmileyflag


EXACTLY why you should fight it. Depending on the state (in Mass they never show up, in Maine, they are always there) the cop generally won't show up.

On your ticket there should be a section saying what to do if you need to re-schedule your court date. Follow the steps, and say you are going to be on vacation that day and cannot cancel the trip. Then when the new date arrives, send it in again saying you have an appointment for work that you cannot reschedule - they don't care about the reason, they just get the letter and move your trial. After long enough the cop with either forget about it, or have something else on that date. I postponed a ticket for over a year (basically because Maine literally takes 2 months to reschedule the dates). When I showed up the officer wasn't there.

***Not giving legal advice, just offering an opinion on what worked for me*** I think any ticket is worth fighting you need to remember you are innocent until they prove you guilty. ussmileyflag


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## jjklongisland

Over width mean over width.... Mirrors, plows, cargo... it doesnt matter if it is a permanent vehicle feature or not. Either way, I see plows all the time over width by me. Never scene a plow truck pulled over. Most police officers welcome the site of plow guys cause they know we work our buts off, and we clear the roads / lots to make it safer for everyone travelling. 

The cop that wrote you was doing his job. If what you say is true, that you had it angled and its under width while travelling than he just didnt do his job all that well.... Hopefully the judge will be on your side. I think you have 50 / 50 chance of winning. Bring photos of your measurements etc. Be polite, and keep us posted. Curious how it goes...


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## Antlerart06

the new boss 92;1420931 said:


> well i might sound dumb, but a plow isnt technacally part of the truck. therefore if teliscoping mirrors aren't part of it, then niether should a plow. correct?


Good point think check my mirrors see if they are over 8.6


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## WIPensFan

For WI mirrors don't count for width.
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/business/carriers/forms/sp4415.pdf


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## cretebaby

jjklongisland;1420967 said:


> Over width mean over width.... Mirrors, plows, cargo


What part of mirrors not counting in the width don't you understand?


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## JunkFood331

I think you should look at it from a business aspect, amount of time for research, time on phone, time for travel, time in court. Is it worth it? It's a hundred bucks not a couple hundred or thousand. But a hundred bucks is a hundred bucks. Look at it from the big picture and then make your decision.


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## cretebaby

And if he don't fight it then the dirty rat gets to write one more ticket on a law that don't exist.


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## terrapro

blee1ash;1420738 said:


> *The comment about the doors has to do with the fact that if you open your doors you have the possibility to be over width, but they don't ticket evreybody with doors on their vehicle just because they could be over width if they opened their doors.*
> 
> If you did truly have the plow angled, and it is under the width limit when it is angled(measure it and take pictures for proof), I would fight the ticket.


No kidding...

You guys are still arguing this? You live in other states, how do you know what we have to deal with. We have associates that have faught tickets just like you said only to have the CVE walk out of the courtroom straight to the truck they drove in and write enough tickets to get vehicles impounded. I know guys that have had $1000's of dollars in tickets from one day just to get pulled over the next with a different truck and get them all over again. If you want to deal with shiat like that go for it!

To the original poster please for your own good just take the wings off when you are on the road, don't listen to these guys.


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## plowguy43

cretebaby;1421027 said:


> And if he don't fight it then the dirty rat gets to write one more ticket on a law that don't exist.


Exactly



terrapro;1421059 said:


> No kidding...
> 
> You guys are still arguing this? You live in other states, how do you know what we have to deal with. We have associates that have faught tickets just like you said only to have the CVE walk out of the courtroom straight to the truck they drove in and write enough tickets to get vehicles impounded. I know guys that have had $1000's of dollars in tickets from one day just to get pulled over the next with a different truck and get them all over again. If you want to deal with shiat like that go for it!
> 
> To the original poster please for your own good just take the wings off when you are on the road, don't listen to these guys.


LOL then there is something seriously wrong with those trucks and or the judicial system. I find it funny when people roll over and play dead just because they got a ticket. If you go to court and see how much of a routine it is for them, its almost laughable. When someone is educated about the situation and knows how to argue it, they backpeddle and generally back down. Dumb things like asking the cop what the weather was like, what color was your truck, what color was the plow, etc etc, because they more you can prove the cop can't remember, then the better case you have in proving he wasn't correct in ASSUMING your plow was too wide and/or not angled as you drove by.

Innocent until proven guilty - its your job to prove your innocence, otherwise pay the bill as stated and hope it doesn't mess up your insurance rates (but that may be different in your state as well)


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## Woodenshoe

terrapro;1419763 said:


> Nope they measure *possible width* around here...Suck it up and just be happy he didn't write anymore tickets.


They measure a plows width as found when stopped (which should be angled or v-ed)... If they make you give "possible width" you would have to extend a Blizzard/Wide-out/etc plow, and open up a Daniels Wing plow or folding pusher on a loader :laughing: What would be the point of making such plows


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## terrapro

You guys can keep using your inflated excuses like opening doors and extending your wideouts to cover for running around with wings on angled plows. Do what you want I guess I don't really care.


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## dfd9

terrapro;1419763 said:


> Nope they measure possible width around here...Suck it up and just be happy he didn't write anymore tickets.


FIght for what's right. If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything.

This is flat out wrong and needs to be fought every single time a ticket is issued.



WRIGHTWAY;1420054 said:


> If it's not over 8-6 Take measurements and photos and have your day in court. I am not against law enforcement in any way but possible is not a factual term. You ether are or are not breaking the law it's possible for me to rob a bank but until I have don so I have not broken any laws


Bingo.



cretebaby;1420179 said:


> Well lets not be stupid here.
> 
> If you open the doors on the truck you'd be to wide as well.


:laughing:



jomama45;1420490 said:


> I've tried to make that point as well in the past (that MI is one of the few states that still only allows 8' width on most roads), but no one ever seems ot care........Thumbs Up


Why? State roads are all 102".



terrapro;1420653 said:


> Why did you reply then?
> 
> For your information you will get a ticket for opening your doors while driving also.
> 
> I don't care if you don't believe me, come to Michigan with your wings and drive around you will see what happens.
> 
> Original poster take your wings off while driving or you will be fined again.


The point is, every vehicle has the possibility of breaking the speed limit or being overweight or failure to yield or failure to stop at a stop sign and every driver has the possibility of driving drunk. But if it didn't happen, a crime was not committed. Intent is not a crime, in this case.



jjklongisland;1420967 said:


> Over width mean over width.... Mirrors, plows, cargo... it doesnt matter if it is a permanent vehicle feature or not. Either way, I see plows all the time over width by me. Never scene a plow truck pulled over. Most police officers welcome the site of plow guys cause they know we work our buts off, and we clear the roads / lots to make it safer for everyone travelling.
> 
> The cop that wrote you was doing his job. If what you say is true, that you had it angled and its under width while travelling than he just didnt do his job all that well.... Hopefully the judge will be on your side. I think you have 50 / 50 chance of winning. Bring photos of your measurements etc. Be polite, and keep us posted. Curious how it goes...


You need to do some reading and educate yourself.



cretebaby;1421016 said:


> What part of mirrors not counting in the width don't you understand?


The part about the mirrors not counting.



terrapro;1421059 said:


> No kidding...
> 
> You guys are still arguing this? You live in other states, how do you know what we have to deal with. We have associates that have faught tickets just like you said only to have the CVE walk out of the courtroom straight to the truck they drove in and write enough tickets to get vehicles impounded. I know guys that have had $1000's of dollars in tickets from one day just to get pulled over the next with a different truck and get them all over again. If you want to deal with shiat like that go for it!
> 
> To the original poster please for your own good just take the wings off when you are on the road, don't listen to these guys.





terrapro;1421181 said:


> You guys can keep using your inflated excuses like opening doors and extending your wideouts to cover for running around with wings on angled plows. Do what you want I guess I don't really care.


Wrong is wrong, and these tickets are wrong. If we don't fight for what's right, who will?

What happens when you get a ticket because your vehicle can speed? Or run a stop sign? It _is_ the same thing, whether you think so or not.


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## cwby_ram

^^^^Thumbs Up


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## cubanb343

Yeah, but what about the mirrors on vehicles with air brakes??? 

Are there such things as WING endorsements on CDLs?!


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## Gear_Head

Why are people calling the cop a rat, when we have yet to see the MI law? Someone posted WI and I could post IL, but it doesn't matter in this case. He very well may be in violation. If not, ask for your day in court.


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## Yaz

I'm thinking your time to plead your case it was on the road at the time it happened. I personally hate big winged plows passing by me on narrow roads even though i plow myself. Sounds to me it was at night and with your black wings and headlights so far inbound like every plow, you scared the crap out of him just like you would other drivers.


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## cretebaby

Gear_Head;1421416 said:


> Why are people calling the cop a rat,


Sorry.

Pig would have been the correct term.


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## Gear_Head

cretebaby;1421430 said:


> Sorry.
> 
> Pig would have been the correct term.


you can call names all you want, but you are providing the op no help.


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## jhall22guitar

In MA they never show up, and in most states they dont. Its not worth their time to go get one ticket for $250 thats being fought, when they can work instead and give out 5 more for $250


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## cretebaby

Gear_Head;1421435 said:


> you can call names all you want, but you are providing the op no help.


:laughing: You are? 

If you honestly think MI has a law for plows "potential" width...........


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## Gear_Head

jhall22guitar;1421440 said:


> In MA they never show up, and in most states they dont. Its not worth their time to go get one ticket for $250 thats being fought, when they can work instead and give out 5 more for $250


I can only vouch for IL. Here they show up. The fines mean nothing as to what an officer gets paid. They can write 10 tickets and see none of that. Court is usually OT for most around here, so going IS beneficial to them.


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## jomama45

dfd9;1421301 said:


> Why? State roads are all 102".


Which is fine if you only stay on state roads......

But let me guess, you're one of those guys that get's drawn to the rivers & streams....................


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## Gear_Head

cretebaby;1421442 said:


> :laughing: You are?
> 
> If you honestly think MI has a law for plows "potential" width...........


yeah, I think they might. Why? Unfortunately someone ruined it for everybody. Same reason why some states have laws on the books saying when plows can even be on the trucks.

:waving:


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## 4d9

all state routes are not 8'6" width. Moat of them are not enforced though. the same goes for saying that all state routes don't have frost laws. I used to have a map of michigan that showed the width on each state route and which are frost lawed.


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## 4d9

ok lets have some more information: where were you stopped? road, county, township, city? What type of officer stopped you? city, county, msp, msp carrier enforcement, county weighmaster?


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## coldcoffee

If I really believed I was right, I'd gather all evidence & enjoy taking it up in court. Let the cop show his video/ pictures that he took. I'd just make sure I knew for sure what the law states & if it's a fuzzy area, I'd find lots of examples to support my case.


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## cretebaby

Gear_Head;1421451 said:


> yeah, I think they might. Why? Unfortunately someone ruined it for everybody. Same reason why some states have laws on the books saying when plows can even be on the trucks.
> 
> :waving:


There has been plenty of representation from MI members. Some of them are very knowledgeable of the laws that pertain to them. So I would bet that if it was on the books we would have seen it by now.


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## cretebaby

jomama45;1421449 said:


> Which is fine if you only stay on state roads......
> 
> But let me guess, you're one of those guys that get's drawn to the rivers & streams....................


ponds.......


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## Gear_Head

cretebaby;1421516 said:


> There has been plenty of representation from MI members. Some of them are very knowledgeable of the laws that pertain to them. So I would bet that if it was on the books we would have seen it by now.


the statute he violated is more than likely on the ticket. I have seen MI members in this thread weigh in saying it was a good ticket. Maybe post the statute posted up and find the law, see what it says.


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## 87chevy

I just read through Michigans field update for 2011. Nowhere in there does it state anything about plow width.


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## WRIGHTWAY

A quick google search (maximum width of a vehicle in Michigan)

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp....,cf.osb&fp=81972625ffbdd2fd&biw=1024&bih=547

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/Loads_dim_87014_7.pdf

http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/2003-2004/billanalysis/House/htm/2003-HLA-0736-5.htm


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## jjklongisland

dfd9;1421301 said:


> The point is, every vehicle has the possibility of breaking the speed limit or being overweight or failure to yield or failure to stop at a stop sign and every driver has the possibility of driving drunk. But if it didn't happen, a crime was not committed. Intent is not a crime, in this case.
> 
> You need to do some reading and educate yourself.


The federal safety highway administration does state that mirrors and turn signals can extend beyond the vehicle maximum width limits but individual states can have stricter regulations. I can tell you that after dealing with NYSDOT and also acquiring permits for oversized loads they have much more restrictive rules. Its up to each individual State.

I also found this interesting

STATE OF NEW YORK
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
Central Permit Office
50 Wolf Road, 1st Floor
Albany, New York 12232
Type 8 - Oversize Snow Plow Equipment for Private Contractors
Authorizes the movement of over width snow plow equipment for private contractors during "snow months" (October 15 through 
April 15). This permit is valid on State highways within a 25 air mile radius of the municipality in which the contractor's business is 
located. Self propelled construction vehicles such as front end loaders, graders, gradalls, or backhoes are not eligible for this permit.
Limits:
25'0" Wide
40'0" Long
13'6" High
Legal Weight as defined by Section 385 of the Vehicle and Traffic Law.
Valid For: October 15 to April 15.
Amendments: An active permit can be amended for the following reasons:
Power unit license plate
Gross weight
Any dimensions
Axle weights and/or spacings
An active permit cannot be amended for the following:
To alter the load description, including revising the year, make, model or serial number.
Change permit type.
Motor carrier name and address.
Power Unit VIN #
Radius Point
Special Requirements:
18" x 18" flags.
Flashing amber lights on roof.
Reflectors on extreme ends of plows.
Continuous travel authorized.
Fees: 
Mail in/CPO Walk In: $90.00
Regional Offices: $110.00
Permit Service: (October 15 - April 15) $90.00. Fees do not include applicable permit service charges.
Amendment Fee: $15.00


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## Buck331

Been reading this very interesting thread, and my thoughts are to plead not guilty. I worked in law enforcement 30+ years and retired after serving nearly 15 years as chief of police in Minnesota. Without knowing the facts I would guess that you dealt with a young over-zealous officer. Previous posts here refer to cops getting overtime for court. Thats true, however the truth is that most young cops HATE going to court and are just as nervous if not more nervous than the average citizen. Remain calm and DO NOT get cocky, irrational, or emotional. If the DA thinks this case stinks he or she will not even bring it to a trial. And remember this cop does NOT want to go to trial, and does NOT want to lose if it goes that far. Things have changed, it's all about "generating revenue" instead of "protect and serve" in many law enforcement agencies. I utilize a Ford F250 V10 with a 9 foot Boss V plow. I've never heard of anybody getting a ticket regarding width of a snowplow in my life! If I received a citation for a similar offense I would begin by requesting a meeting with the chief, assistant chief, or captain. Be very polite and calmly explain that you are not trying to be a smart ass, but simply do not understand the alleged violation. Advise him how important your snowplowing business is to you, and request help with compliance issues you are unaware of. I have had many snowplow drivers assist me with stuck squads during winter snowstorms over the years..., always bought them a coffee or beer at a later date to express my appreciation!

Here is a link of the Michigan Traffic Code Width: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(z3...objectname=mcl-257-717&query=on&highlight=717

Take a look at your ticket and post the traffic code the officer wrote on the citation. Also you should be able to consult with an attorney for first initial visit.


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## WRIGHTWAY

MICHIGAN VEHICLE CODE (EXCERPT)
Act 300 of 1949
257.717 Maximum permissible width of vehicle or load
(4) Except as provided in subsections (2) and (5) and this subsection, if a vehicle that is equipped with pneumatic tires is operated on a highway, the maximum width from the outside of 1 wheel and tire to the outside of the opposite wheel and tire shall not exceed 102 inches, and the outside width of the body of the vehicle or the load on the vehicle shall not exceed 96 inches. However, a truck and trailer or a tractor and semitrailer combination hauling pulpwood or unprocessed logs may be operated with a maximum width of not to exceed 108 inches in accordance with a special permit issued under section 725.
*After reading this sound like pickup trucks are limited to 96 other than tire width of 102 *
(5) The total outside body width of a bus, a trailer coach, a trailer, a semitrailer, a truck camper, or a motor home shall not exceed 102 inches. However, an appurtenance of a trailer coach, a truck camper, or a motor home that extends not more than 6 inches beyond the total outside body width is not a violation of this section.
*Look like mirror are excluded as long as they are shorter than 6 inches*


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## the new boss 92

im seeing this whole topic as bs, go to court fight it. take a picture or 2 with a tape and present it to them. i think its bs with the width thing but thats just me, and sounds like the pig ran out of lube and coffee to entertain himself so he pulled you over instead and wrote you a bs ticket that will get dropped!


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## dsplow

4d9;1421476 said:


> ok lets have some more information: where were you stopped? road, county, township, city? What type of officer stopped you? city, county, msp, msp carrier enforcement, county weighmaster?


Stopped on M-34 in lenawee county in Adrian Mi at 1:20pm after lunch during a snow storm. State weight master, plow was angled not all the way I was probably at 8' 8" width if he would have measured it with a straight edge. I can get the plow down to 8ft if i angle it all the way. I wonder if it is angled all the way at 8ft if he can write me another ticket next time. And cops have to show up in MI its mandatory.


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## dfd9

cubanb343;1421395 said:


> Yeah, but what about the mirrors on vehicles with air brakes???
> 
> Are there such things as WING endorsements on CDLs?!


No, you mean air breaks. Thumbs Up



jomama45;1421449 said:


> Which is fine if you only stay on state roads......
> 
> But let me guess, you're one of those guys that get's drawn to the rivers & streams....................


Don't knock it til you try it.

You'll also notice that local jurisdictions can adopt the 102" limit. Not all counties\cities have, not sure where to find the list. Most have.



Gear_Head;1421536 said:


> the statute he violated is more than likely on the ticket. I have seen MI members in this thread weigh in saying it was a good ticket. Maybe post the statute posted up and find the law, see what it says.


True enough, actually, I believe it has to be to be a valid citation.

However, these cops in the SE corner seem to be stretching their interpretation of this law, as pointed out by crete and woodenshoe. If we are talking potential width here, then anyone running an Ebling, Blizzard, Daniels, Wideout, XLS, folding ProTech, etc is violating this law. And every single operator in Michigan is violating numerous laws every time they get in their vehicle. There might be a light bulb out, get in an accident for following too close, run a red light, the list goes on and on. Yet these don't fall under RICO statutes, so can not be a violation until it is actually committed.

Question for you guys, why is it that most muni's and road commissions, even MDOT run 12' wide underbodies, no flags or oversize load signs on them.


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## cwby_ram

Sounds to me that it all hinges on whether or not you had the plow angled and whether or not you can prove it. This talk of "potential" width is ridiculous. If that were really true it would seem that all those types of plows wouldn't even be able to be sold up there. If you can prove you were angled (cop's dash cam?), you should be set. They won't be able to see 2", I don't think on a dash cam vid. Just that you were angled and the officeer said you weren't. Best of luck, eagerly awaiting results.


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## cretebaby

cwby_ram;1421925 said:


> Sounds to me that it all hinges on whether or not you had the plow angled and whether or not you can prove it.


Wouldn't it be the cops job to prove that it wasn't angled?


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## Matson Snow

jomama45;1420490 said:


> I've tried to make that point as well in the past (that MI is one of the few states that still only allows 8' width on most roads), but no one ever seems ot care........Thumbs Up


Joe.....I care.....I Really do Care......:laughing:.....:waving:


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## Matson Snow

dsplow;1421833 said:


> Stopped on M-34 in lenawee county in Adrian Mi at 1:20pm after lunch during a snow storm. State weight master, plow was angled not all the way I was probably at 8' 8" width if he would have measured it with a straight edge. I can get the plow down to 8ft if i angle it all the way. I wonder if it is angled all the way at 8ft if he can write me another ticket next time. And cops have to show up in MI its mandatory.


I was Told By a State of Michigan State Trooper Weighman.....It Doe's NOT matter if the Plow is Angled or Not.....They will measure the Plow at any Angle and if its Over the size alloted....You are getting a Ticket


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## dfd9

Matson Snow;1421982 said:


> I was Told By a State of Michigan State Trooper Weighman.....It Doe's NOT matter if the Plow is Angled or Not.....They will measure the Plow at any Angle and if its Over the size alloted....You are getting a Ticket


I understand what you're saying, but the cop is wrong. I would bet good money if it was brought to court the judge would throw it out. And if he\she had a brain, would give the cop a lesson in actual law violation vs intent.


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## terrapro

Matson Snow;1421982 said:


> I was Told By a State of Michigan State Trooper Weighman.....It Doe's NOT matter if the Plow is Angled or Not.....They will measure the Plow at any Angle and if its Over the size alloted....You are getting a Ticket


:salute:



dfd9;1422058 said:


> I understand what you're saying, but the cop is wrong. I would bet good money if it was brought to court the judge would throw it out. And if he\she had a brain, would give the cop a lesson in actual law violation vs intent.


They interpret the law as tip to tip so it doesn't matter if the plow is angled. Please don't throw a car door or wideouts into the mix we are talking about a straight blade with wings, you can not change the actual width of this setup unless you add or subtract the wings.


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## dsplow

The cop said i should get a blizzard plow because they fold in, but that they are expensive. He would not give me any real info on how to make it legal. I even got out and took the wings off and put them in the bed of the truck. I talk to an attorney he said that the cop is very knowledgeable and is not a nice guy.


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## cretebaby

terrapro;1422122 said:


> :salute:
> 
> They interpret the law as tip to tip so it doesn't matter if the plow is angled. Please don't throw a car door or wideouts into the mix we are talking about a straight blade with wings, you can not change the actual width of this setup unless you add or subtract the wings.


I think it is pathetic that you condone this behavior.

So if I take my 9' straight plow off and put in the bed am I still to wide?


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## clydebusa

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/Loads_dim_87014_7.pdf
By reading this, it looks like a ticket was in order. It states 8' unless designated hiways.


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## terrapro

cretebaby;1422145 said:


> I think it is pathetic that you condone this behavior.
> 
> So if I take my 9' straight plow off and put in the bed am I still to wide?


Are you serious? LOL Okay well I think it is pathetic the only way you can get a point across is to throw insults and blatant embellishments.


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## WIPensFan

Ok so a Boss 9'2" V-plow is 99" in the V position. That's considered overwidth in MI no matter how its angled? In WI it's fine in the V position. Seems strange because they make them in MI right?


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## WRIGHTWAY

dsplow;1420454 said:


> I wonder if he will pull me over again if I leave the wings on, and angle it all the way. It measured 8ft angled all the way. I just don't want to have to pay another $100


With the plow angled measure to see how far it is off the front of the truck. 
3 feet is the max on the front 
If you can be under 3 feet forward and 8 feet wide at the same time then you are with in the law.


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## Mike_PS

ok guys, let's move on

thanks :waving:


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