# Money



## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

If you had the chance to make $90,000. nearly all profit in one year or make $105,000. over three years which one would you do and why. This is above and beyond my normal business operation.


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## Fourteen Contracting Inc. (Jul 5, 2019)

If you could take that $90,000.00 after one year and put it into a GIC or something very safe (say, a t bill) and after the next two years you will have more than $105,000 then I would take the $90,000.00 after one year. 
I'm not talking into account taxes though. It might make more sense from a tax point of view to take $35,000.00 or so per year for 3 years because it won't ding you as hard as the $90 k in one year. Best to run it by your accountant who will know your #s.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Fourteen Contracting Inc. said:


> If you could take that $90,000.00 after one year and put it into a GIC or something very safe (say, a t bill) and after the next two years you will have more than $105,000 then I would take the $90,000.00 after one year.
> I'm not talking into account taxes though. It might make more sense from a tax point of view to take $35,000.00 or so per year for 3 years because it won't ding you as hard as the $90 k in one year. Best to run it by your accountant who will know your #s.


I plan on running it by him when I get time.


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## prezek (Dec 16, 2010)

Many headaches to go along with it? If so, that one year number would be more enticing.


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## magnatrac (Dec 22, 2006)

Are you going to start selling all that topsoil in bags vs. by they yard?


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

prezek said:


> Many headaches to go along with it? If so, that one year number would be more enticing.


Almost normal business operations


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

LapeerLandscape said:


> Almost normal business operations


Run a pipe from the the Lapeer river and sell it back to GLWA?


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## the Suburbanite (Jan 27, 2018)

magnatrac said:


> Are you going to start selling all that topsoil in bags vs. by they yard?


Renting out a greenhouse?


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

magnatrac said:


> Are you going to start selling all that topsoil in bags vs. by they yard?


So I had a call from a guy looking for 3000 yards in the spring, 20 minutes later the guy I was getting this other stuff from called and said he needed to get rid of another 6000 yards. Now I know I can sell it eventually at my going rate or do I discount it and if so how much.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

the Suburbanite said:


> Renting out a greenhouse?


There is already too many weed grow operations in Michigan, already a bunch closing


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## the Suburbanite (Jan 27, 2018)

LapeerLandscape said:


> So I had a call from a guy looking for 3000 yards in the spring, 20 minutes later the guy I was getting this other stuff from called and said he needed to get rid of another 6000 yards. Now I know I can sell it eventually at my going rate or do I discount it and if so how much.


Will the 3k yard guy take it all at once? Seems like that would be the moneymaker. Especially if it could all get delivered and disappear quickly. How much do you move (topsoil) in a normal year? Would you have to add to the fleet/equipment to process it quickly?
There is a farmer/excavator near me and pretty sure he moved in excess of 8K yards last year. Those numbers made my head spin, especially as the top-soil is kind of a side-gig for him. Pretty sure it is equal parts getting rid of excavation material, scrape-off manure from the cattle, and ??? all run through a trommel/screen. Beautiful stuff, really rich, I used it for both my raised vegetable beds, and for final grading around the yard. Everything I planted in (or on) it grew like wildfire. IIRC it was priced somewhere around $30/yd for dump-trailer loads, with prices dropping a little on volume.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

the Suburbanite said:


> Will the 3k yard guy take it all at once? Seems like that would be the moneymaker. Especially if it could all get delivered and disappear quickly. How much do you move (topsoil) in a normal year? Would you have to add to the fleet/equipment to process it quickly?
> There is a farmer/excavator near me and pretty sure he moved in excess of 8K yards last year. Those numbers made my head spin, especially as the top-soil is kind of a side-gig for him. Pretty sure it is equal parts getting rid of excavation material, scrape-off manure from the cattle, and ??? all run through a trommel/screen. Beautiful stuff, really rich, I used it for both my raised vegetable beds, and for final grading around the yard. Everything I planted in (or on) it grew like wildfire. IIRC it was priced somewhere around $30/yd for dump-trailer loads, with prices dropping a little on volume.


The guy looking for the 3k is doing a sewage lagoon for a town north of me and I’m sure we are the closest thing around so a better price but further away may not be beneficial to him with trucking prices today. 8k yards of soil is double what I move in a year.


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## magnatrac (Dec 22, 2006)

LapeerLandscape said:


> So I had a call from a guy looking for 3000 yards in the spring, 20 minutes later the guy I was getting this other stuff from called and said he needed to get rid of another 6000 yards. Now I know I can sell it eventually at my going rate or do I discount it and if so how much.


I'd dump it now! Nobody wants to sit on too much inventory , especially if you can get more!!!


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## the Suburbanite (Jan 27, 2018)

LapeerLandscape said:


> The guy looking for the 3k is doing a sewage lagoon for a town north of me and I’m sure we are the closest thing around so a better price but further away may not be beneficial to him with trucking prices today. 8k yards of soil is double what I move in a year.


So if you can reliably get rid of 4k yards seasonally without the lagoon guy, sounds like this could be a heaven sent deal, provided lagoon guy comes through. Can you pull it off without having to invest $$ in trucking/equipment? Would sitting on that 3K yards if he backs out cripple you? Seems like my local farmer/dirt slinger is using this "side-gig" to bankroll new/upgraded equipment purchases (don't get me wrong, he is a businessman first, most of the equipment used in the top-soil part is the older "yard only" stuff.) The trommel/scren plant looks old and tired, but never seems to stop turning. Thinking about the numbers made on dirt makes my head spin, lol. If you can pull it off, do eeeet.


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

Wtf... Didn't you just ask me for miner money...


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

magnatrac said:


> I'd dump it now! Nobody wants to sit on too much inventory , especially if you can get more!!!


That’s the issue, these quantities don’t come around in Lapeer especially at the price I’m paying and the guy getting rid of it is paying the trucking because he needs the land to put up more apartment buildings.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Ajlawn1 said:


> Wtf... Didn't you just ask me for miner money...


Yes, I need $200,000 for a trommel screen plant


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

the Suburbanite said:


> So if you can reliably get rid of 4k yards seasonally without the lagoon guy, sounds like this could be a heaven sent deal, provided lagoon guy comes through. Can you pull it off without having to invest $$ in trucking/equipment? Would sitting on that 3K yards if he backs out cripple you? Seems like my local farmer/dirt slinger is using this "side-gig" to bankroll new/upgraded equipment purchases (don't get me wrong, he is a businessman first, most of the equipment used in the top-soil part is the older "yard only" stuff.) The trommel/scren plant looks old and tired, but never seems to stop turning. Thinking about the numbers made on dirt makes my head spin, lol. If you can pull it off, do eeeet.


No trucking, the lagoon guy has his own. As far as equipment I’m buying a trommel screen plant, might get it this week. Also I’m not afraid to sit on inventory that I know will sell in the future and not go bad. On the other hand a large influx of cash would pay down the trommel so I need to weigh those two options.


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

LapeerLandscape said:


> No trucking, the lagoon guy has his own. As far as equipment I’m buying a trommel screen plant, might get it this week. Also I’m not afraid to sit on inventory that I know will sell in the future and not go bad. On the other hand a large influx of cash would pay down the trommel so I need to weigh those two options.


Need someone to set it up?…


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

LapeerLandscape said:


> Yes, I need $200,000 for a trommel screen plant


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Ajlawn1 said:


>


That looks like a washing machine tub.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

BossPlow2010 said:


> Need someone to set it up?…
> View attachment 254431


I’m afraid I would have to give him gas money to make it here.


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## Kvston (Nov 30, 2019)

IMO if you have a debt to pay down, get the 90k. If you don’t, go over 3 years. Even with inflation, steady cash flow is golden.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

Im korn fused here... Is the 105K?

105k x 3 = 315K
or
35k x 3 = 105k


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## BUFF (Dec 24, 2009)

LapeerLandscape said:


> That looks like a washing machine tub.


It's a game changer..... Think Quick Cube....

The warden made a screen oot of steel mesh with a 2X4 would frame for screening compost and it's close to being as productive as that gizmo and a fraction of the cost.


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## the Suburbanite (Jan 27, 2018)

Can your current unscreened topsoil supplier keep you stocked looking ahead (beyond the next 6K yards he is offering)? If you are purchasing the trommel/screen-plant, you are stepping up production capability moving forward, regardless of the lagoon guy. If you are moving 4Kyards/year now, I'd have to think you can up the sales annually to cover the plant nut and keep you in Heinekens. Are you going to need to add another employee just to move dirt?


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Ajlawn1 said:


>


That's actually pretty slick...maybe I shouldn't get rid of my skidsteer. And really all I need and could justify.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Philbilly2 said:


> Im korn fused here... Is the 105K?
> 
> 105k x 3 = 315K
> or
> ...


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

Sell um BOTH!

3000 yards @ $30 PLUS.... 3000 yards a $35!

But seriously. Take the 3000 guarantee yards at a $5 discount if it is a profit right deal.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Philbilly2 said:


> Sell um BOTH!
> 
> 3000 yards @ $30 PLUS.... 3000 yards a $35!
> 
> But seriously. Take the 3000 guarantee yards at a $5 discount if it is a profit right deal.


They are both very profitable and if I don’t sell some of it for $30. It will sell in the future for $35. It won’t expire. It just seems like a $15,000. discount is pretty big but $90,000. in the bank is big to.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

LapeerLandscape said:


> It just seems like a $15,000. discount is pretty big but $90,000. in the bank is big to.


One in the hand is worth two in the bush...


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Get the guy getting rid of it to haul half to you and half to lagoon guy.. sell lagoon guy at a delivered " higer discount price" and dont touch it. You make more that way without touching it.


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## Fourteen Contracting Inc. (Jul 5, 2019)

Wait a minute, who's this lagoon guy?


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Theres really 7 of them....


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

Mr.Markus said:


> Get the guy getting rid of it to haul half to you and half to lagoon guy.. sell lagoon guy at a delivered " higer discount price" and dont touch it. You make more that way without touching it.


But hows he going to run it through his new $200k trommel then...


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## BUFF (Dec 24, 2009)

Mr.Markus said:


> Theres really 7 of them....
> 
> View attachment 254466


Mary Ann for the win....


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Ajlawn1 said:


> But hows he going to run it through his new $200k trommel then...


He can always sell it in 12 years as "new never used..."


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## magnatrac (Dec 22, 2006)

Mr.Markus said:


> He can always sell it in 12 years as "new never used..."


If he adds the word " organic" to his material list he can double his price lol.

He should already be selling " organic" mulch, sand , gravel, etc etc.
If questioned, it's just better because!!!


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## Kinport (Jan 9, 2020)

I’d sell it to the lagoon guy and take the 90.

This is a minor aspect, but whats the size of your average topsoil sale? A pickup truck load? It will take a lot transactions to get that 3000 yards moved. Each one of those transactions will cost you a little, between loader fees, POS and processing fees, etc, so that the extra $5/yard your making is really $4-4.50/yard. Add to that headaches of dealing with many customers vs just one, I would think the 90k would be pretty enticing.

personally, given where we are right now in the economy, I would be hedging against a correction. It may not as severe as others, but when it does come, demand for topsoil will likely drop. Where your making a large investment in a screen, I would take the large plug of cash early to help manage cashflow if things slow down

i believe it was the wise @Philbilly2 who once said “one bird in my hand is better than 2 in my bush” or something like that…


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

magnatrac said:


> If he adds the word " organic" to his material list he can double his price lol.
> 
> He should already be selling " organic" mulch, sand , gravel, etc etc.
> If questioned, it's just better because!!!


When people ask me if my top soil is organic I say as opposed to what? Synthetic top soil? Then I get a dumb look from them and I say isn’t all soil organic, it comes from the earth.


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Kinport said:


> I’d sell it to the lagoon guy and take the 90.
> 
> This is a minor aspect, but whats the size of your average topsoil sale? A pickup truck load? It will take a lot transactions to get that 3000 yards moved. Each one of those transactions will cost you a little, between loader fees, POS and processing fees, etc, so that the extra $5/yard your making is really $4-4.50/yard. Add to that headaches of dealing with many customers vs just one, I would think the 90k would be pretty enticing.
> 
> ...


That’s a good point about selling small transactions even though we do charge a card fee.


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

LapeerLandscape said:


> When people ask me if my top soil is organic I say as opposed to what? Synthetic top soil? Then I get a dumb look from them and I say isn’t all soil organic, it comes from the earth.


Doesn't everything that's synthetic technically come from the earff too...?


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Ajlawn1 said:


> Doesn't everything that's synthetic technically come from the earff too...?


Exactly, that makes it organic. You must have worked in a really good landscape yard in the past to know that.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

When they start demanding certain PH levels you need to double the price...


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Mr.Markus said:


> When they start demanding certain PH levels you need to double the price...


You could be on to something but I’m not sure I have that tolerance for those kind of people


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

LapeerLandscape said:


> You could be on to something but I’m not sure I have that tolerance for those kind of people


Nobody does...


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## BUFF (Dec 24, 2009)

LapeerLandscape said:


> You could be on to something but I’m not sure I have that tolerance for those kind of people


If you do make sure you're wearing your Hay Doodes...... you know so you'd fit in with them..


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

BUFF said:


> If you do make sure you're wearing your Hay Doodes...... you know so you'd fit in with them..


And have some of marks beer in the fridge


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

Here comes your first loads of top soil...


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Ajlawn1 said:


> Here comes your first loads of top soil...
> 
> View attachment 254576


Thats 100% traction


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