# need help fixing this torch



## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

There is a leak somewhere. But I'm sure a good tightening will fix that issue. What I need help with is that one of the on off knobs was "pushed in". I pulled it out into place. But I have no idea how it works. Doors that mean its ok to use? Or is the whole torch set trash? 

Thanks


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

You're talking about an acetylene torch? If so, given the fact that you have to ask, you really should bring it to someone qualified to work on it. If that is the acetylene valve that is leaking, you could blow your hand off (or worse) with a leak.


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## Flipper (Nov 1, 2001)

Are you talking about a oxy-acetylene/propane torch set? What brand is it? I would just consider buying a new handle. They are not that much.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

The leak is from the 02. I can fix the leak. my main question is with the valve. if the valve is pushed in, is it broken? or since i pulled out back into place is it still good. Never worked on one so no idea how it works internally.


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

birddseedd;1731170 said:


> The leak is from the 02. I can fix the leak. my main question is with the valve. if the valve is pushed in, is it broken? or since i pulled out back into place is it still good. Never worked on one so no idea how it works internally.


The adjustment valve on the tanks or the one on the torch itself?


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Uniweld

Apparently the knob unscrews all the way out and is just a rod that pushes on something. The whole knob and white bushing were pushed in. That itself does not look like it would cause a problem, so i guess im at square one, wont know if it works till its full.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Rick547;1731178 said:


> The adjustment valve on the tanks or the one on the torch itself?


On the torch, although im missing a knob on one of the tanks. im sure its cheap to get.


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

From what I see from your pictures. You need a new set of gauges and new hoses.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

how can you tell if they are bad or not?


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

Looks like the threads are gone.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

so its possible itl leak out of hte threads? 

gauges are only 15 bucks (the big part with the screw in knob?). so thats not to bad if i have to replace it. 80 for regulators, a little more pricey.


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

birddseedd;1731189 said:


> how can you tell if they are bad or not?


First of all it looks like those gauges and regulators are old and look to be in bad shape. If the hoses outer covering are either checked, split or show excessive wear. Replace them.

If they were mine. I would buy a new set of regulators with gauges and new hoses. I do not know about the torch you have but check it over thoroughly.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

jasonv;1731166 said:


> You're talking about an acetylene torch? If so, given the fact that you have to ask, you really should bring it to someone qualified to work on it. If that is the acetylene valve that is leaking, you could blow your hand off (or worse) with a leak.


I think this just may be the best post you've made.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

best way to check for leaks?

how do i tighten the fittings, any tape or dope?

The hoses arnt cracked or anything, although they are old and could be leaking at the ends. guess ill find out.

thanks for the help btw


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Mark Oomkes;1731209 said:


> I think this just may be the best post you've made.


Thus why I have inquired on how to check for leaks.


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## clark lawn (Oct 7, 2005)

Spray soapy water all over them and then open the tanks up but not the torch end. Look for any bubbles. No pipe dope or tape or anything. Most important NO GREASE ANYWHERE on the tanks, regulators or torch end. Grease and oxygen make explosions.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

clark lawn;1731299 said:


> Spray soapy water all over them and then open the tanks up but not the torch end. Look for any bubbles. No pipe dope or tape or anything. Most important NO GREASE ANYWHERE on the tanks, regulators or torch end. Grease and oxygen make explosions.


Didn't know that. Thanks


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

birddseedd;1731180 said:


> Uniweld
> 
> Apparently the knob unscrews all the way out and is just a rod that pushes on something. The whole knob and white bushing were pushed in. That itself does not look like it would cause a problem, so i guess im at square one, wont know if it works till its full.


Ok, I thought you were talking about the valves on the torch.. that's just the adjustment screw for the regulator (not a valve) -- there is no gas pressure on those threads or around that spot, so as far as that part goes, you're good to go. You screw in the handle, and it puts pressure on a diaphragm and spring. Its only way down deep in the regulator that the actual pressurized gas is.

Just make sure that all your hoses and valves are in good shape, and be careful with it.


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

please don't use an Oxy/fuel torch until you've learned how to use one. These aren't something to play around with. These aren't just a little blow torch you'd use for soldering pipes. FWIW, I'm scared of acetylene. It's very unstable and very explosive. I'm set up for propylene at my shop at school just in case a kid makes a mistake. Propylene is more forgiving. You can also run regular propane and O2. Go do some serious homework on oxy fuel torches before you hurt yourself. You can get a Victor knock off regulator for about 100 bucks at a welding store if you got one of them around you. Go to a legit welding store where they sell the gasses. Don't mess around with anything from TSC or Lowes or wherever.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

I'v used them before. just never serviced one.


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## peteo1 (Jul 4, 2011)

Moose's Mowing;1732636 said:


> please don't use an Oxy/fuel torch until you've learned how to use one. These aren't something to play around with. These aren't just a little blow torch you'd use for soldering pipes. FWIW, I'm scared of acetylene. It's very unstable and very explosive. I'm set up for propylene at my shop at school just in case a kid makes a mistake. Propylene is more forgiving. You can also run regular propane and O2. Go do some serious homework on oxy fuel torches before you hurt yourself. You can get a Victor knock off regulator for about 100 bucks at a welding store if you got one of them around you. Go to a legit welding store where they sell the gasses. Don't mess around with anything from TSC or Lowes or wherever.


This is good to know as I'm thinking about buying at set. Might rethink it


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

If you have a need for a torch at your own shop, go with propane or propylene. Those gasses are much more stabil. Acetylene is dissolved in acetone and the bottles have some kind of porous material in them. This makes it safe to use it and transport it. But it's a very explosive and unstable gas and if handled improperly can do some serious damage. the magic # for acetylene is no more than 15psi at the gauge, but you're usually working with less for most torch work. Another thing is to not overdraw the tank. It's sort of like the duty cycle of a welder. The larger the bottle is, the longer you can run the torch. If you overdraw it, the gas doesn't have enough time to stay fully dissolved in the acetone and it becomes unstable. I'm not real sure on the exact science behind that, I just know not to use my little torch for too long at a time. 

On the other hand, propane is super easy to use, it'll do anything acetylene will do for most people. Some guys say it doesn't burn as hot, and they're probably correct. But most people wouldn't notice a difference when cutting or welding. I use Propylene just because that's what my supplier has readily available. You can use the same regulator, same torch, same hose, same everything. All you need to do is swap out the tips you plan on using. Propane is also nice because when you run out, you can find it easy on a weekend, and can use it right away. Acetylene needs to settle for awhile after you transport it, just like a keg of beer. If you think you have use for a torch, by all means get one. Just be sure you educate yourself about them. You're working with super high pressures of super flammable gas. There's some things to you gotta keep in mind is all. Simple stuff like opening the Oxy bottle all the way, but only open the fuel bottle a 1/4 to 1/2 turn. The logic here is if there's a fire or you cut a hose or something, you can quickly shut off your fuel gas. The oxygen bottle has to be all the open due to something with the way the valve is designed I think. One guy already said NO GREASE on anything, that's a big no-no. Also, make sure your bottles are secured properly to a cart or chained to a wall or something. I always shut my torch off when I'm done, then bleed the gas out of the lines, then unscrew the regulators. That's supposed to make them last longer. Torches are one of the most versatile tools you can have in your shop. You can heat the snot outta stubborn bolts with the rosebud tip or heat and bend metal, you can cut really thick material if you're good at it, you can weld, braze, solder.....One of the best tools I've ever bought, I'm just scared of the acetylene is all. Might just be my nerves of working with kids in a shop all day long, but I'm like an over protective mother sometimes cause I've seen the stupid stuff kids will do. Better safe than sorry, just make sure you educate yourself is all and you'll be fine.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

The most important thing about it is storage. you don't want it falling down, getting knocked over, punctured, busted, or leaking in any way shape or form. inspect hoses once in a while so you know they arnt leaking.

its a great tool and i personally would not go with propane because iv seen what acetylene can do. but like any dangerous tool, you have to take precautions. In fact, I might even leave mine at my buddies place as my garage is falling down. But if you are careful and inspect it once in a while it can be safe.

This conversation makes me want to send mine in to be inspected by a pro. being that they are old and have not been used in some time.


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

birddseedd;1732786 said:


> The most important thing about it is storage. you don't want it falling down, getting knocked over, punctured, busted, or leaking in any way shape or form. inspect hoses once in a while so you know they arnt leaking.
> 
> its a great tool and i personally would not go with propane because iv seen what acetylene can do. but like any dangerous tool, you have to take precautions. In fact, I might even leave mine at my buddies place as my garage is falling down. But if you are careful and inspect it once in a while it can be safe.
> 
> This conversation makes me want to send mine in to be inspected by a pro. being that they are old and have not been used in some time.


One should inspect his tools daily before use.


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## alldayrj (Feb 28, 2010)

Are your tanks current? Its not missing a handle, they come like that. You have a square wrench to open and close it. This whole thread oozes of no experience with torches. Really not something to be playing around with. What do you need these for?


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Yea. i was confused about that. iv only used larger ones that have a knob. Picked up 2 new tanks today. going to snug everythign up and check for leaks. hopefully everything works.

torching off bolts. heating bolts. the first thing im goign to do is remove some old pieces from my mount that cant really be removed easily in any other way.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

The ace. redlines at 15 psi, so i think ill go 10 psi. But there is no redline for the oxy. what pressure does that go up to?

As far as oxy ace being more dangerous than other gasses. how is this so? the oxygen is the explosive part, which is in the combination of other torch types? the ace. burns easy, but is not all that explosive.


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

http://www.wikihow.com/Set-Up-an-Oxy-Acetylene-Torch


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

"For cutting, there is a different head. You will notice a trigger, and three tubes going up to the nozzle.
First, turn the oxygen that IS released by the trigger, all the way on."


open your oxygen all the way to light the torch???


also, think link says ace at 5 to 7 lbs. someone here stated 15. 5-7 seems more logical, although i should probably confirm.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Also, if oxy only goes to 25psi, why does my regulator go to 200?


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

I guess it depends on how think im cutting. This torch set must be made to cut some dang thick metal.

if you use 50 for a foot thick, how dang thick is 200 psi going to cut through?


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

birddseedd;1734275 said:


> The ace. redlines at 15 psi, so i think ill go 10 psi. But there is no redline for the oxy. what pressure does that go up to?
> 
> As far as oxy ace being more dangerous than other gasses. how is this so? the oxygen is the explosive part, which is in the combination of other torch types? the ace. burns easy, but is not all that explosive.


Because http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxy-fuel_welding_and_cutting#Acetylene

Oxygen is much safer and can be worked with safely at whatever pressure your plumbing is able to withstand.


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

Pure acetylene is crazy unstable, making it explosive. This is due to the way the carbon atoms are bonded together....I'm not a scientist so don't ask me anything further about that. Oxygen by itself is not and straight O2 doesn't burn at all. The O2 just makes your fuel gas burn hotter, it's like stoking a fire. The O2 also allows you to produce an oxidizing flame, which is what you need for cutting. As far as propane goes, it'll cut anything acetylene will. I worked for a demolition contractor one summer and I ran a torch for most of that time cutting some thick a$$ stuff. They ran all propane and it worked fine. For most application, you wouldn't notice a difference. 

As far as pressure settings, it depends on what you're doing. There's 3 ways to set up a flame. You can have a neutral flame (equal O2 and fuel gas) a carbonizing flame (heavy on fuel gas) and an oxidizing flame (heavy on O2). Each has a use. It's not as simple as just saying "I'm cutting today, so I use X psi on fuel gas and X psi on O2" you also need to consider your tip sizes of your torch and the thickness of the material being cut. The regulators, once set properly, will get your flame in the ballpark, then the torch knobs can fine tune it. If you want to heat a bolt or something with a rosebud, you're pressure settings will be different. Same thing if you want to weld or braze something. I have a bunch of charts on the wall in my shop I use cause I never remember them. But for most cutting, I prefer 7psi fuel and around 25psi or so on O2. Some guys like more/less by a few pounds but my #'s will get you started at least.


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

You can take it higher for cutting, but you only need so much to make a neutral flame. If it us too high it will blowthe flame out. 

Also if you have a cutting head on you will open the main oxygen all the way. The second one is for flame adjustment.


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

birddseedd;1734290 said:


> "For cutting, there is a different head. You will notice a trigger, and three tubes going up to the nozzle.
> First, turn the oxygen that IS released by the trigger, all the way on."
> 
> open your oxygen all the way to light the torch???
> ...


15 is the safe limit. I.e., DO NOT EVER turn the pressure higher than that, even if you jimmy the regulator so that it can.


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

birddseedd;1734290 said:


> "For cutting, there is a different head. You will notice a trigger, and three tubes going up to the nozzle.
> First, turn the oxygen that IS released by the trigger, all the way on."
> 
> open your oxygen all the way to light the torch???
> ...


.............................


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Moose's Mowing;1734299 said:


> Pure acetylene is crazy unstable, making it explosive. This is due to the way the carbon atoms are bonded together....I'm not a scientist so don't ask me anything further about that. Oxygen by itself is not and straight O2 doesn't burn at all. The O2 just makes your fuel gas burn hotter, it's like stoking a fire. The O2 also allows you to produce an oxidizing flame, which is what you need for cutting. As far as propane goes, it'll cut anything acetylene will. I worked for a demolition contractor one summer and I ran a torch for most of that time cutting some thick a$$ stuff. They ran all propane and it worked fine. For most application, you wouldn't notice a difference.
> 
> As far as pressure settings, it depends on what you're doing. There's 3 ways to set up a flame. You can have a neutral flame (equal O2 and fuel gas) a carbonizing flame (heavy on fuel gas) and an oxidizing flame (heavy on O2). Each has a use. It's not as simple as just saying "I'm cutting today, so I use X psi on fuel gas and X psi on O2" you also need to consider your tip sizes of your torch and the thickness of the material being cut. The regulators, once set properly, will get your flame in the ballpark, then the torch knobs can fine tune it. If you want to heat a bolt or something with a rosebud, you're pressure settings will be different. Same thing if you want to weld or braze something. I have a bunch of charts on the wall in my shop I use cause I never remember them. But for most cutting, I prefer 7psi fuel and around 25psi or so on O2. Some guys like more/less by a few pounds but my #'s will get you started at least.


From the chart i found it seems 7 and 20 will do everything im going to need to do (rosebud for heating not included).

Although, you are incorrect about 02 being explosive, 02 is extremely explosive. even says so on the bottle. In fact my uncle says that he would use O2 only for cutting jsut for the fun of it.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Moose's Mowing;1734305 said:


> 15 psi is MAX psi for Acetylene. When it comes out any higher, it becomes unstable and explosive. you're correct that 5-7 psi is reasonable for most stuff.


so open it to let out any pressure in the system out, fully void of o2 from the cyl. correct?


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

birddseedd;1734307 said:


> From the chart i found it seems 7 and 20 will do everything im going to need to do (rosebud for heating not included).
> 
> Although, you are incorrect about 02 being explosive, 02 is extremely explosive. even says so on the bottle. In fact my uncle says that he would use O2 only for cutting jsut for the fun of it.


But only as an expanding gas, NOT as an actual chemical reaction. Yes, if you puncture the oxygen tank, all of the oxygen in it will blow out real fast, but it won't be a chemical reaction with a big ball of fire that causes the world to burn.

I.e., sledge hammer vs a stick of dynamite.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Guess i don't fully get the science behind it. all i can say for sure, don't smoke around o2 else itl go boom, in some way or another.

now to find the ace leak. cause i can smell it.


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

oxygen is only "explosive" because it's under extreme pressure in the bottle. The actual Oxygen gas itself won't burn. Your uncle is correct, you can cut with Oxygen only. Once you get the metal melted, the cutting process is working through oxidation. You'd only need the oxygen at that point to continue cutting. I've never tried it, but I've seen it done. There's not much of a practical point to it other than saying "hey look what I can do". Long story short, please go read as much as you can about this before you burn your shop down or kill yourself.

Check out Victor's website for some information. Those welding companies usually are good with educational stuff. Miller has a ton of stuff on their website. 
http://www.millerwelds.com/resources/ 
not sure if they cover torches on there or not, but it's worth looking at for general welding info. Miller used to send out full text books for free if you asked them. They included little welding calculators and other cheat sheets as well. I still have my entire set in my shop. Very valuable resource.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Found leak, under the regulator.

bad regulator?


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

looks like its leaking in the same spot on both.


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## jasonv (Nov 2, 2012)

birddseedd;1734314 said:


> Guess i don't fully get the science behind it. all i can say for sure, don't smoke around o2 else itl go boom, in some way or another.
> 
> now to find the ace leak. cause i can smell it.


No, smoking around oxygen won't make it go boom. At most, it will slightly increase the speed at which your cig burns. That's all.

Air is 21% oxygen.

When an O2 tank explodes, all you get is O2 gas. It won't react with itself to make weird things happen.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

jasonv;1734363 said:


> No, smoking around oxygen won't make it go boom. At most, it will slightly increase the speed at which your cig burns. That's all.
> 
> Air is 21% oxygen.
> 
> When an O2 tank explodes, all you get is O2 gas. It won't react with itself to make weird things happen.


Why do o2 tanks say "flamable"?

what about my regulators? fixable? completely shot?


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

Time for some new ones


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

maxwellp;1734372 said:


> Time for some new ones


sigh 

at least i didnt spend much. 160 for the set.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

harbor freight, full set for 150, or new good regulators for 160 and these hoses and torch?


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

woo hoo. tightened the housing a bit and the leak went away. tip even works perfectly


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

Y'all are over complicating torches

15psi is more than enough. You have no need for 20.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Well. Thanks for the help everyone. Having a torch set will make my whole life easier.

Glad to finally have a thread not overrun by trolls and mindless bickering.

Thanks yall


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Now if I could only find a rosebud tip that wasn't effing expensive


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

birddseedd;1734475 said:


> Now if I could only find a rosebud tip that wasn't effing expensive


You don't need one. All it does is save a little fuel. I use torch for everything


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Isn't it used to heat up larger areas. Say if I want to make the whole thing glowing red to shape or temper it?


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

birddseedd;1734507 said:


> Isn't it used to heat up larger areas. Say if I want to make the whole thing glowing red to shape or temper it?


You can use cutting torch for that.

I have a rosebud and haven't used it in 15 years


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Quick question here. To start, there are no leaks I can find i with soapy water.

I cut a piece of metal. 2.5" x 2.5" angle iron i had to remove the weld on. 
Then i heated the metal up a twice to bend it. 
Then i used it to heat up where one of my wings was bent to straighten it out.

At this point, the new tanks were almost empty. Did I do something wrong, or did they not give me full tanks. I find it hard to believe that a brand new tank will do little more than cut a single piece of metal.

The regulators read 2k psi for o2, and around 300 if i remember for ace.


45 bucks to cut one piece of angle iron?

Thanks

Other than that, it worked great.


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## alldayrj (Feb 28, 2010)

What size tanks


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

12 x 4 and 12 x 5


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## derekbroerse (Mar 6, 2004)

How long did you leave the tank valves open while the regulators were leaking? Always shut the tanks off when not in use...

Tank sizes come as letters, like a Q tank or an S tank... the two bottles are matched to suit.


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## clark lawn (Oct 7, 2005)

12*4 & 12*5??? Are these those little ones like you buy at Lowes? Never used those tiny ones but would not be surprised if that's all you get out of them.


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

derekbroerse;1744609 said:


> How long did you leave the tank valves open while the regulators were leaking? Always shut the tanks off when not in use...
> 
> Tank sizes come as letters, like a Q tank or an S tank... the two bottles are matched to suit.


Just long enough to find the leak.

how much psi should there be? in the 02 there is 2k psi. new.


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## derekbroerse (Mar 6, 2004)

clark lawn;1744735 said:


> 12*4 & 12*5??? Are these those little ones like you buy at Lowes? Never used those tiny ones but would not be surprised if that's all you get out of them.


The numbers didn't click with me, you're right, those must be those little tiny ones for plumbing/soldering... especially for cutting, they sure wouldn't last long at all!


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## Moose's Mowing (Oct 6, 2012)

Weighing the bottle is the only way to know for sure if you got a full tank. Not very practical IMO. Pressures will change with changes in temps. I think they fill them at around 70 degrees. I'm not sure the size of my tank but it's around 100 cubic feet. That's about 4 feet tall x 12" (guessing). When I get a a new refill, my psi gauge reads just shy of 300. My oxy bottle is 80 cuft. That's roughly the same size but a tad skinnier. I own my tanks and the 80 cuft is the largest I can get without having to lease the bottles. My new ones are 2500 psi. 

I think you have those real small portable bottles. Those work fine if you're soldering and need to be mobile. I'd see about trading them in at the gas supply place and getting larger ones. Hope this helps


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## shep28 (Jan 1, 2010)

Not anything to play with






https://www.google.com/search?q=ace...yu7JAbu7gLAP&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAg&biw=1366&bih=657


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## birddseedd (Jul 12, 2010)

Torch came in handy today. Tail pipe got wrapped around axle. Couldn't get it off. So torched it off


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