# Front end sagging



## GMC99

I've done a search for this topic and haven't really gotten a good answer. So hear it is, I've got a 2002 2500 ram (old body style) without the plow prep package (it's got the towing setup on it). I just recently got done putting a 7.5 western pro on it and the truck sags alot more than I thought it would. I looked at timberens and they look to be a good product, but I have heard that when the plow isn't on the truck they make it ride rougher than normal? So I started looking around for some other ideas, so now it's either timberens, air shocks, or these orange bags that fit between the coil spring and the shock, or just leaving it alone.... So i need some input! Which will work better? and be less of a hassle? Any help would be great! THANKS!


LET IT SNOW!!


----------



## snowplowjay

You could grab a set of the good old Balloons that go inside the springs and inflate them in the winter and deflate them in the summer if you wanted to. We used to use them on our pickup trucks that we had.


Jay


----------



## Joey D

I would go for a spring upgrade. Easy to swap in and can't be to expensive. The timbren's do work so it's your call.


----------



## easthavenplower

ok remember that you should put weight in the a$$ end which will level out the truck timbrens will help also


----------



## Mike 97 SS

Either do the spring upgrade or get the Timbrens. Putting in a set of Timbrens is cheaper than changing the front springs I bet. I have the Timbrens in my truck and with the truck parked, plow off, they are not touching, they are about a 1/2"-3/4" away from touching, therefor they do not affect the ride with the plow off. I was worried about the samething as you, getting a lousy bumpy ride from the Timbrens, but this hasnt been the case since they arent making contact with the plow off. I havent had the plow on yet since the Timbren install, so I cant comment on how the ride will be. I dont care if the ride is a little rougher with the plow on, as long as the Timbrens do what they are supposed to do, which Im sure they will from looking at how they are in there. Mike


----------



## johngus

check the tags on your springs.you'll probably want to go up a couple of numbers on the springs.I did this on the Dodge I used to have and it helped alot.I think the hot setup with the Diesel is 046 on drivers and 039 on pass. side.I would check with John DeMartino on this as he seems the most knowledgable on these trucks.


----------



## Roger Dodger

Here's a link to the specific model Timbren for your truck. I have the same truck/pkgs. as you and mine hardly droops. In fact I'm considering installing the 2" front levelers from Daystar or similar. That way the truck sits level year round. Requires an alignment afterwards and the pitman arm doesn't really need modding or replaced as some are led to believe. As mentioned, consider placing counterweight in the bed.


----------



## Nuttymopar

I just checked out these Timbrens also for the first time. I currently have air shocks for the front on my 92 and they do not hold air longer then a day or two. So I am worried about the ride when the plow (blizzard 810) goes on soon. I am considering Rancho 9100 series, Bilstein, or air shocks again. I have a 2.5 inch lift in the front to level out the overall truck so I am not sure if the Timbrens will help or not since they might sit too much of the springs. Not sure where the stock ones ride right now, will check tonight. Had Rancho 9000 years back and liked them for the ride quality but not sure if they would hold the extra 1000 lbs plow, even if turned up to 9? Would they extra weight damage them? Bilstein make adjustable or equivilant? 

Thanks.


----------



## John DiMartino

GMC,like was mentioned ,check your tags and see what you have now.Being a gas truck you should have o38 or lower numbered coils.You can go up one step if your looking for about a 1" raise in the front end.If your looking for closer to 2" raise get 2 new springs.If you have 038/037,and want a 2" rasie,get 0046/039,this will stiffen it quite a bit. I havent tried timbrens on the front of the Dodges,but I did try Monroe Muscles SLE's. I can tell you without a doubt DO NOT BUY the Monroes.I sent mine back ASAP for a full credit.I delt with Shock warehouse they did great by me. I called Monroe about 4 times,worked my way up to the engineers that design and test them.I battered him with questions until he admitted they did not work well on the Dodge's.Once i got that out him,I asked him the obvious question then why do you have a listing and sell a produt that doesnt work. The problem with the Monroes is the truck only sits 1/2" to 1" off the Monroe stop without the blade.Any bump bottoms the truck on the monroe rubber "which is rock hard,and the truck then is basically riding on the frame. Here is the page from a TDR member that lists all the factory springs availabe and there rates. http://dodgeram.org/tech/specs/springs.htm


----------



## wyldman

The Timbrens are a hundred times better than the Monroe muscle LSE.They don not affect ride quality at all with the plow on,they actually make it better.With the plow off,it is slightly stiffer,but not much.They do prevent bottoming better too.

If you have anything in the 037\038\039 range for front springs,then upgrade them.I usually go 047\048 combo,and it's pretty stiff.I am usually loaded heavy all the time,so it's no big deal.The 046\047's are a little softer,but will hold the plow up better than what you have now.


----------



## Mike 97 SS

This may be a stupid question, so sorry if it is, but why 2 different spring numbers? Why not have 2 of the same in the front? Are the numbers different because there is a right and left, like a strut or caliper, or are the numbers different because they are a different firmness? Judging from the replies above, Im thinking its because of the firmness of the spring, but I dont understand why not have the same on both sides in the front. Is that because its compensating for the driver sitting in the driver seat? Mike


----------



## wyldman

Dodge offsets the spring rates,with a stiffer one on the drivers side to compensate for the fuel tank and the driver on that side.

They all have very similar installed heights,so you can't really see a difference.

I have had no problem using identical springs,or ones with less ofset.


----------



## GMC99

Well I decided to go with the timberens, the air shocks just seemed like they were going to be to much of a hassle. I've got one more question for you guys, a buddy of mine bought a ram 2 years ago and a mechanic at the dealer told him he should bring the truck in before the plowing season starts and have the bands in the trans adjusted?? Has anyone heard about this?


----------



## micah79

Yes and I would definatelty recommend that. Along with a trans. flush. I skrewed my 727 3 speed by not having them adjusted. The trans. shop said a band slipped and messed up almost everything else in my trans. If I would have had them adjusted then I might have saved $1300 on a rebuild. My local trans shop will adjust them and do a complete flush and filter for $130. .:crying:


----------



## wyldman

Good choice on the Timbrens.Air shocks don't belong on the front end of that heavy truck.

I adjust my bands every year,it pretty easy.The $130.00 for the trans service and band adjustment isn't bad either if they are doing it right.


----------



## micah79

The shop I go to is awesome. They give me a commercial warranty on any work done. They are locally owned, and always win the auto service award for my town every year. If thats a good price, then I will stick with them, cause I know their work is awesome. I've only had work done from them, cause of my experience and their reputation around town, so I had no idea whether I was getting a good deal. But I'm glad to know that I am.


----------



## Nuttymopar

One of the reasons why I went with Air Shocks is because from the factory in 92, if you got the Plow Package, they replaced the normal shocks with Air shocks. Since my normal shocks are gone, I need some type of shock and figured why not air for now and hopefully get Rancho 9000 for the summer. I don't tow or haul, just normal 35,000 /year driving. Air shocks help for the plowing but I will admit, they don't deliver the best ride for the summer.


----------



## GMC99

Thats the thing I was concerned about was the ride with the air shocks. Going from a 1/2 ton gmc to a 3/4 dodge was a big difference in ride quality so i didn't want to make it any rougher than it already is.


----------



## griffithtlc

*3500 coils on a 2500?*

Hey guys, with the new blizzard hooked up, the truck has a pretty good rake to it when it is raised. I can get a pair of coils from Napa for a 3500 for $124. I was wondering what the spring rates are on these. Napa doesn't have the rates, but we are going to need something stiffer. I was also wondering how much ballast you guys recommend to run in the back.


----------



## wyldman

The 3500 coils may be no stronger than the 2500,as they share the same springs,depending on configuration.

If you can dig up the spring rates,I can match them up to the Dodge springs and see if they will help.

I'd also price the right springs from Dodge.You'll want a 046\047 or a 047\048 combination.

Timbrens will help if you don't already have them.


----------



## griffithtlc

I got some specs on the springs from Napa. Here they are: Free height-17.78". Load Hight-16". Load 648. Rate load height(?) 400. # of coils 7.48. Wire Diameter-.828" and the inside is Conoco. I priced the 47/48 combo from dodge and they are $300 for a pair. He said they were the same that were used in a 3500. Maybe you can translate some of that jibberish at the top?:salute:


----------



## wyldman

Judging by the specs you posted they would be the equivalent of a 039 from Dodge,but with a progressively stiffer rate due to the tighter coil winding.I wouldn't take any chances with them,unless they guarantee they will hold the weight of the plow,and will not sag after a few years.

I'd still go with the right springs from Dodge,as you know they will do the trick,and work as designed.Timbrens will still help take some load off the front end to with a plow that big.I run both the heavy springs and Timbrens together.


----------



## griffithtlc

I have done some price checking from spring companies, and they don't have a significant difference, and I have come up with this: 1) Get a 47/48 combo from dodge, 2) get a progressive with a 1" lift, so I can leave them in and get a smoother ride, 3) get a stiff spring from spring shop, and take out in summer. What do you think?


----------



## wyldman

Buy the ones from Dodge.If you want a bit of front lift,get a set of the bolt in upper coil tower spacers from Daystar.

I wouldn't trust any aftermarket or specialty springs,as they are very inconsistant and don't hold up well without sagging.

You will find the heavier Dodge springs don't ride much worse than what you have now.It will handle better,and not bottom as much over big bumps.If you really find them to stiff,swap the stock springs back in for the summer when your not plowing.They can be changed in less than an hour.


----------



## Mean4x4

*springs*

I have a Ram 1500 I just did a 5.5 inch lift, from BDS suspension. The springs are much stiffer then factory but still ride great. I spoke with my distributor (suspension expert) he said get the ram 3500 springs WITH A DIESEL He said they should run no more then 200-250.00


----------



## micah79

Are you planning on plowing with a 5.5" lift?


----------



## Mean4x4

*Yea*

Yea, I have 3 ram 1500's 
one is lifted 7.5 inches and the other two are lifted 5.5 inches, They plow like champs. This will be my first year with the 1500 Extended cab. Spicer makes a heavy duty U-Joint that will hold up to the driveshaft pitch. I have 4.56's with Eaton L/S's in the rear on 35 inch tires. And they push fine


----------



## micah79

It doesn't stress the a frame? I have been wanting a lift for a while, but I have been told not to do it. Where are you at in MI?


----------



## Mean4x4

*I'm based out of Farmington Hills*

I work out of farmington hills, I love your website, I do lawns, some landscaping and brick work, nothing too heavy. and a load of snow removal. I have an 03 F350 Quad Cab Longbed with a v-box powerstroke and 8 1/2 ft western. Lifted 8 inches. What kind of truck are you talking about?
And no, The frame isn't too stressed, I hopped a curb at the nextel building off 12 mile and 696 plowing with the ram thats 7.5 inches up. going 40 mph I tripped the plow and it kept going. In summer I run 39 1/2's and in winter I run 35 inch MTR's
feel free to call Mike 248-939-1061


----------



## micah79

Heck i"m in Brighton. We should meet up for lunch or something. I have done quite a bit of work in Farmington Hills. I 'm in the Novi area all of the time. pm me if you want.
Micah


----------



## Mean4x4

*cool*

Cool cool, if you or anyone is looking for any snow work. I'm "Sub, Subing" out some driver for 60/hr and sidewalk crew for 15/hr and 40/ton to salt


----------



## micah79

I'm not looking for anything. I have my hands full for this year already. A guy on here (remmers) was looking for work though. Send him a message.


----------



## griffithtlc

I know there has been some recent discussions about heavier springs on here, and I have a set of 47/48 coming in from dodge on friday. If anyone is interested, I'll take pics of the install for them. Just PM or email me.


----------



## Bighammer

GriffithTLC, I'm interested in your spring swap and your reaction to it. I have the same 94 Cummins with an 8' Western Pro. (just bought it from a neighbor and haven't used it yet) I had the plow on once and lfted it up and was surprised athow much it squats in front. I also have a Ranch Hand replacement bumper w/grill guard that adds some weight too.


----------



## griffithtlc

I'll make sure and shoot some pics for ya. I'll throw 'em in this weekend after I take care of my little tranny episode.


----------



## griffithtlc

*New Springs*

I got the springs in tonight. I must say that I am 110% pleased with them. The install wasn't bad, would have been a lot easier if I had just unbolted the sway bar  It took me 2 hours, but that includes about 20 minutes wrenching on my homemade spring compressors. The truck sits 1" higher unloaded, and with the 1000 lb. Blizzard on, it only drops 3/4 to 1". The change in ride isn't really noticable, but with the plow on, the back end shudders without weight, but ballast will take care of that. Here are the 2 new springs with an old one, the 48 is on the left, old (39, but not sure) in the middle, and 47 on the right. Quite a difference!


----------



## griffithtlc

Here is the jig that I made to compress the springs- a U-bolt with a piece of 1" square tubing, with 3/8" bolts. It worked pretty well.


----------



## griffithtlc

Here is with the spring out. To get it out, all you had to do was take off the nut holding the upper part of the shock off, then take the 3 nuts off of the upper shock tower, that bolts to the upper coil mount.


----------



## griffithtlc

Here is the finished product. If anyone is interested in my old springs, they will be for sale in the used equipment forum. Great for a 1/2 ton with a blade on it.


----------



## wyldman

Nice work.I recommend that spring combo to a lot of people,and they think it's way to stiff,until they try it.It never hurts to have too much spring. 

The OEM DC springs are very high quality too,and very consistent.They should last a long time without sagging.More than I can say about most aftermarket stuff.


----------



## John DiMartino

Matt,I did mine a bit differently. I removed the lower shock bolts,and the antisway bar end links,this took all of 5 minutes a side,then raised the truck with a bumper jack from the plow frame,Tires come off,compressed the shocks upward by hand,pryed downward on the axle,slid the springs out(bottom out first,they slipped right out,with about a minutes worth of prying.Then reassemble.The entire job took under 45 minutes .I am running the 046/039,and I like it a lot,I had the 039/038.I have a new o47 I havent used yet,maybe if i get a Blizzard plow ill use it. I didnt need to compress the springs,they went right in with a little cussing .


----------



## MWS LAWN

This is a pretty good post for me, because I to have a 94 3/4 Cummings 4x4. I am wanting to put a 8.5 mvp plow on it. I was concerned about the weight. I'm not sure what springs I have, but I know the plow and mount weights close to 1000lbs. I do plan on putting timbrens on it. My other concern is that I have a 4500lb. rated front axle, and the western dealer did not recommend a plow on it. But a 4800lb. front axle he did recommend a mvp on it??? Can't see why 300lbs. would make that big of a difference? I'm going to put the plow on it any way.


----------



## griffithtlc

You shouldn't have to worry. The Dodge frontends are dramatically underated. The Dana 60 is a super strong axle that won't give you trouble. I would definitely suggest the 47/48 combo, they don't really ride any rougher, and they hardly compress when the plow is lifted. We won't need to run timbrens, just because the springs keep the truck up.


----------



## wyldman

> _Originally posted by MWS LAWN _
> *This is a pretty good post for me, because I to have a 94 3/4 Cummings 4x4. I am wanting to put a 8.5 mvp plow on it. I was concerned about the weight. I'm not sure what springs I have, but I know the plow and mount weights close to 1000lbs. I do plan on putting timbrens on it. My other concern is that I have a 4500lb. rated front axle, and the western dealer did not recommend a plow on it. But a 4800lb. front axle he did recommend a mvp on it??? Can't see why 300lbs. would make that big of a difference? I'm going to put the plow on it any way. *


You should have the 4850 front axle.The last year for the 4500 lb axle was in 93.94-95's had a LD 3800 lb axle,and the HD 4850,which came under the Cummins.

The axle is WAAY underated.It will carry an MVP no problem with a set of Timbrens and a spring upgrade to 047\048 springs from DC.


----------



## MWS LAWN

Wyldman, What is DC? A buddy of mine has a set of new timbrens that he did not put on. He said he would take 100.00 for them. Am I correct that the springs will cost me 300.00? Thanks for the info. wyldman. O, btw is 1420.00 tax included plus install good for the pro flo ( 950lb. cap.) with in bed mount and controls? Thanks.


----------



## griffithtlc

MWS-DC is Daimler Chrysler. Just call your local Dodge dealer and ask them to quote some 47/48 springs. They might ask for your vin # and stuff. Tell them that you are replacing with non stock. MAKE SURE thay look at the part number, and that it ends in 47 and 48. They probably won't know what 47/48 combo is, so tell them to look at the part numbers-I had to walk the parts guy through ordering mine, so I made sure I got the right ones! My springs came to 275 with tax. Well worth it, though. Good Luck :salute:


----------



## wyldman

> _Originally posted by MWS LAWN _
> *Wyldman, What is DC? A buddy of mine has a set of new timbrens that he did not put on. He said he would take 100.00 for them. Am I correct that the springs will cost me 300.00? Thanks for the info. wyldman. O, btw is 1420.00 tax included plus install good for the pro flo ( 950lb. cap.) with in bed mount and controls? Thanks. *


Like stated above,DC is short for Daimler Chrysler.$100.00 for the Timbrens is a good deal,I'd take it.The heavier springs seem to be in the $250.00 range for a pair.Can't comment on the price on the Pro-Flo,as I'm not to sure what they go for in your area.


----------



## MWS LAWN

Well, I ordered the 47/48 combo., price came to 250.00. What side does the 47 need to go on? Also put the deposit on my 8.5 mvp so they would not sell it until my springs come in. It sure is a big looking plow. I am taking you alls advice in believing my truck can handle it! I hope I'm not wasting 4500.00 on a plow my truck will not handle. About how much ballast should I run in the back of the truck?


----------



## griffithtlc

Don't worry, as long as you don't drive like a madman, the truck will handle it great. Put the 47 on the passenger side, and the 48 on the driver. We are going to run 600 lbs. of ballast, if it doesn't do a whole lot, we will do more. You will notice right away the incredible difference that the springs make when the plow is raised. The nice thing is that they don't ride a whole lot stiffer when the plow isn't on. Good luck, and if you have any trouble getting the springs out, post or PM me, and I can help if Chris or John aren't around.


----------



## snow_man_48045

*1994 Dodge*

I Have a 94 Dodge 2500, and looked today for my front spring tag and founf that the only one left on was the driver side. It was a #021. The truck has a Meyer CP 8 on it. Plus timbrens, and weight in the back. When the plow is off, and the truck bed is emty the timbrens are just touching, making a harder ride.
I'd like to upgrade spings, but what is a good # to go to from this 021??? Oh and the weight of the plow is around 978 lbs.


----------



## snow_man_48045

*1994 Dodge*

I Have a 94 Dodge 2500, and looked today for my front spring tag and founf that the only one left on was the driver side. It was a #021. The truck has a Meyer CP 8 on it. Plus timbrens, and weight in the back. When the plow is off, and the truck bed is emty the timbrens are just touching, making a harder ride.
I'd like to upgrade spings, but what is a good # to go to from this 021??? Oh and the weight of the plow is around 978 lbs.


----------



## griffithtlc

Do you have the Cummins? If you don't, I would think that you could do the 38/39 combo. It sounds like you don't like a stiff ride, and the timbrens will help. I am going to do some specs on mine, you can find out what they are just by measuring, but the ones that I took off of mine I think are 38/39. They came off a 94 3/4 ton with a Cummins, and plow prep. If you are interested, email or pm me, and we can talk something up, if you want to try them and think you want something stiffer, you could just send them back. However, if you do have the Cummins, I would say go with the 47/48 or 46/47 combo. Good Luck:salute:


----------



## snow_man_48045

*1994 Ram 2500*

Sorry I left that out, the truck is a gasser. It has a 318 under the hood.


----------



## griffithtlc

I think that the 38/39 combo would be all right. The 318 weighs quite a bit less than my Cummins. With your plow weight, it wouldn't hurt to jump up to a 39/46 combo, it depends on how important the ride is. There shouldn't be much of a difference between the 38/39 and the 39/46, as Wyldman stated, it never hurts to have too much spring. I guess, if it was me, the truck is going to ride like a truck anyways, I'd get the 39/46.


----------



## drafto

Alright, I am bringing this one back alive. I bought a set of springs off ebay this week and they arrived today. They are off a 94 diesel 4X4, the guy said he didn't have the truck anymore but it was the "heavier" front end model. One of the tags is gone off the springs and the other one is an 038. Great I am ready to install, but wait, I have a 1999 2500 5.9 Gasser 4X4 and the inside of my door says I have the 4850 front end. According to JD's (no disrespect meant with the abbreviation) chart, I probably have the 038 and 039 springs on my truck now (both stickers missing). Where does this leave me? I only paid $70 for the springs and shipping so I am not worried about the money, I just do not want to waste my time swapping the same springs in. Is it possible that Dodge would put the same springs in a diesel and a gas? My front end sags pretty good with my C-8 on there and I need to upgrade, calling a dealer and getting the 47/48 combo is an option but I would like to figure out what I have first. Please help.


----------



## CARDOCTOR

i have 38&39 on my dodge 98 2500 
with a c-8 on the front the sag isnt that bad
call the dealer and order the heavier springs for the front
john


----------



## drafto

Thanks John. I figured that was my next course of action, I was hoping that my springs were the 24's or 23's and the 38/39's would be an upgrade. What is the from GVWR on your front axle in that 98'? Is all of your work in Philly? Let me know if in the future you are looking for help, keep me in mind: [email protected]

Thanks,
Dan


----------



## TLS

Just wondering what all the hubub is about front end sag?

Are there any negatives about it?

You hang 700-1000 lbs of plow on a front end, its going to sag. Unless it poses a problem with the truck or plows operation, I leave it be.


----------



## drafto

I always questioned the front end suspension on my Ram, it has always seemed a little soft up front, sometimes it will bottom out going over a speed bump. So when I saw this tread I could relate to it, and I never knew I could upgrade my springs, no hubub, I was just listening and learning. I just wanted to upgrade them and see how differently it handled, that is all, didn't mean to bother anyone.

Dan


----------



## griffithtlc

Front axle weight rating isn't the spring rating. If you have the 360 gasser, It doesn't have the 38/39 combo. That is what comes for the diesel engines. I think if you put the 38/39 combo you got in, you will be very satisfied. That is what I had in my truck (94 3/4 T w/ Cummins), and with the 1000 lb. Blizzard, it dropped about 2.5 -3 inches. You don't want your front end bouncing off of your bump stops all the time. Especially when stacking. You have the weight of the plow AND the weight of the snow on the blade, which puts a lot of strain on your front end. not to mention the softer springs will wear out a lot quicker. If you go new, make sure and go OEM, aftermarket springs are not up to the same specs of the Dodge ones.


----------



## drafto

Hey GriffithLC drop me a line: [email protected], I am buying that 2003 ram that wew talked about in another forum, the leather, sport, silver, your brother got one into his lot just like it? The guy came down to $30,000 including the breand new boss 8.2 v-plow. I want to ask you about your 2003 and plowing.

Dan


----------



## MSC

Here's what I did. I installed a set of Skyjacker D25 2" leveling springs on my 97 Dodge extra cab, long bed, Cummins diesel.
Easy to install, about the same money as timbrens, and the truck feels so much better to drive with or without the plow on.
Here is a pic of the truck with the 8' plow raised off the ground, no weight in the back of the truck.


----------



## griffithtlc

Nice MSC! I plan on installing a 2" leveling kit in mine, which will have about the same effect as your 2.5 " springs on. When i think back on it, I think I probably would have rather gone with the D25's, but oh well. I plan on adding a 2" add a leaf in the rear, for 2" all around. Does your truck sit nose-up with out the plow on? Looks good.


----------



## MSC

It did, just about 1" higher in the front without the plow on.
I also installed Airlift Super Duty air bags in the rear, this leveled the truck right out.
I usually run about 10-15psi in the bags. 
This really improved the ride. Before the bags, the rear suspension was always slapping the helper springs due to the 
wonderful condition of our construction riddled roads(major sewer project going on across 2 towns), Also the bags are great for towing the skidsteer and the mini excavator.


----------



## griffithtlc

Did you install longer shocks? That is what is holding me back, I can't really afford the shocks right now. If you didn't, have you topped out yet?


----------



## MSC

Still have factory length shocks on all 4 corners of the truck.
They have never topped out.
I don't do any off roading other than the job sites I have to get in and out of, never had a problem.
I would look into the air bags if I were you.
If you do any heavy towing, they are a godsend.
The bags I bought are Airlift Super Duty bags.
They have a 5000# capacity per pair.
I usually run about 10-15psi in them.
They will take 100psi.
I imagine the pressure goes up some when loaded.
Next time I hook to the trailer and put the PC-40 on the trailer I will check the pressure in the bags to see how much they increase when loaded.
Maybe even take some pics with the machine on the trailer too!
Rich


----------



## MSC

OK, here's a pic of the truck with the PC40 on the trailer


----------



## snow_man_48045

LOOKS GREAT! :salute: Nice setup with the Epuip. too. I like that color of your Dodge. Thinking that will be my next choice for colors. It realy look sharp!


----------



## glenspot

*tire wear?*

I will be putting 1-ton diesel springs on my dodge 1500 before the winter. I was warned that leaving them on during hte summer would cause tire wear. Any logic to this?


----------



## SnoFarmer

*Installed new springs*

I installed a set if 47-46 springs on my 98 3/4 Dodge with a boss v, gained 2 1/2 inches of lift and it holds up the plow frame high enough to get over the curbs to push back the piles with out scraping the curb or plow frame.
I also have a set of 38-39's on my 01 3/4 Dodge with a 8ft straight blade they work fine for the light straight blade, but if your going to change your springs go with some thing close to the 47-46 set up, I installed mine by my self in about 1 1/2 hour, it was easer than I thought it would be. I would recommend this set up to any one serious about plowing...


----------



## dieseltroop

Hey Griffithtlc,

Let me know how those coils work with the Blizzard 810. I would like to put one on my '01 2500 Diesel Ram.


----------



## SnoFarmer

Why do you people use timbering's?? there just covering up a bigger problem ( kind of like a band aid)? What I mean is if your truck is sagging or can't handle the weight of your plow you need stiffer springs!!! A timbering is just a big bump stop...... If your frame is resting on your axle bump stops you don't have any suspension travel left, so why would timbering's help there just big bump stops. I guess my point is' if your axle is against the stop and you hit a bump and your axle can't move some thing is going to give, then you woun't have to worry about your timbering's any more.. so put in heaver springs to handle the load ,it's very easy to do ,if you can change a tire you can put in new springs..


----------



## glenspot

*now the back end looks low*

So, I installed 1-ton springs on the front of my dodge 1500.. It got some nice lift and it carries the plow GREAT.

But now the back-end looks low. Its not lower than it was before...just that now the front end is up a little...the back end looks funny.

Whats the easy and/or best fix? another leaf in the spring? I dunno.

Glen


----------



## SnoFarmer

1fast4+4,, Here is the thread I was talking about..


----------



## micah79

Timbrens are load handlers. They don't increase payload. They help because they decrease the rebound (boat) effect of hitting bumps with a plow out in front. I'm not saying that they make a truck super tough, but they do help a lot. A half ton truck is not made for plowing commercial accounts. They work fine for res., but I would never use one for large commercial accounts.


----------



## gino

GMC99 said:


> I've done a search for this topic and haven't really gotten a good answer. So hear it is, I've got a 2002 2500 ram (old body style) without the plow prep package (it's got the towing setup on it). I just recently got done putting a 7.5 western pro on it and the truck sags alot more than I thought it would. I looked at timberens and they look to be a good product, but I have heard that when the plow isn't on the truck they make it ride rougher than normal? So I started looking around for some other ideas, so now it's either timberens, air shocks, or these orange bags that fit between the coil spring and the shock, or just leaving it alone.... So i need some input! Which will work better? and be less of a hassle? Any help would be great! THANKS!
> 
> LET IT SNOW!!


 I put the Timbrens on my 2005 2500hd. There is an improvement and, in my opinion, they give the truck a slightly stiffer ride. I see this as a positive because the newer truck suspensions bounce around too much anyway. I like them and for the money you cant lose. Definitely do the Timbrens instead of the other headaches.
gino


----------



## danno

glenspot said:


> So, I installed 1-ton springs on the front of my dodge 1500.. It got some nice lift and it carries the plow GREAT.
> 
> But now the back-end looks low. Its not lower than it was before...just that now the front end is up a little...the back end looks funny.
> 
> Whats the easy and/or best fix? another leaf in the spring? I dunno.
> 
> Glen


GLENSPOT, you can install add a leaf(AAL). Or get larger blocks.


----------



## Lawn Care Pro's

i have timbrens on all 4 tires! do they help ? hell yeah! however you could add a leaf in the rear and in the front upgrade to different tighter coils up front. personaly i wish i had put different coils on rather than timberns. they do help but not as much as i wanted. Also if your going to put them on do not have a shope do it! it is simple as long as you can get the truck hoisted you will be good to go! it is a waiste of mney to pay a shop to do the work


----------



## SnoFarmer

First, if you bought a 1500 you got a car with a truck body.......
having said, that hears why.
1500 are not plow trucks or work trucks there look cool boulevard cruisers...any 1/2 ton for that matter. you need a 3/4 ton or larger to plow with IMO.
Do what ever you like with them. but the bottom line is there soft ride and lack of payload capability rules them out as plow trucks...
so, now you want to plow with your boulevard cruiser and keep the car like ride? 
If you are going to plow with it any why, do your self a favor and get the new springs from the dealer #39 # 38 are the springs that come on the 3/4 ton with the plow-prep like on my 02 2500. On my 98 2500 I put the #46 #47 combo on it
the ride is firm not harsh it rides like a truck not like your moms van or your 1/2 ton boulevard cruiser.
To install the new springs is easy too.
1, unbolt the bottom of the front shocks & loosen the lug nuts.
2. raise Tuck off of the ground so the tires are in the air( about 6in) set it on jack stands ,supported by the frame, so the Axel can hang down.
3. remove front wheels.
4. disconnect the sway bar where it connects to the Axel.
5. the springs can be removed now, with (OUT) an spring compressor. mine came right out.
the new ones go right in there place. bolt every thing back and your done.
it took me about an 1, 1 1/2 hr to do it.

I know i pi$$ed off the 1/2 ton plowers but thats life:waving: 
I have to stop my self from getting sucked in to these silly debates


----------



## zupp242

*Pi$$ing contest.*

I guess you win.


----------



## danno

1/2 tons are "fine" with a plow, just make sure you have a snow plow prep pkg. The dealer wouldn`t sell them on 1/2 tons if they had issues. Match the plow to the truck and there won`t be any problems. Period.


----------



## zupp242

*A 1/2 ton will do just fine.*

I took the Fisher gear off of a 3500 and put on a 1/2 ton. Looks like to me they have the same frame. I believe it's all in what you are using the truck for. A 2500 or more would be overkill for what plowing and hauliung I do in my line of work. I did however add a couple of 2" spacers and longer shocks to my front springs to level the truck out.


----------



## Lawnboy67

Snofarmer....... I think you are wrong about the 1500 qoute. There are a lot of people who buy 1500 short beds to do drives and small lots. its too hard to put long box 2500 and 3500 trucks in small spaces. 

Any 1500 can be beefed up to do the same thing a 2500 can do. 

Brian


----------



## SnoFarmer

Lawnboy67 said:


> Snofarmer....... I think you are wrong about the 1500 qoute. There are a lot of people who buy 1500 short beds to do drives and small lots. its too hard to put long box 2500 and 3500 trucks in small spaces.
> Any 1500 can be beefed up to do the same thing a 2500 can do.
> Brian


 I see more short box 2500 Dodges than I do long boxes, and I have one of each(long & short). There are short box 3500 sw too. I think the reason why people use a 1500, is that there cheaper and people think because it's a 4+4 and a truck it's good to plow with.

The money to really make a 1500 onto a 2500 would be better spent on a 2500 to begin with. There 7500# 2500 and there 8500# 2500 trucks to choose from, the 8500# is a better choice.


----------



## SnoFarmer

It's nice to see we can keep a thread alive this long!! 
It was started on 9-15-03, it must be the oldest thread still alive??


----------



## SnoFarmer

Bump, There seams to be a need for this knowledge..


----------



## NoNeck

Does anyone know if I can upgrade my springs? It's an 03 ram quad 2500 with a cummins. It sits lower in the front with no plow as it is. I am adding a Meyre c-8 setup. (Actually I posted earlier, but this thread seemed to be right up the alley of my question.) I just ordered a 2inch leveling kit for the front.


----------



## SnoFarmer

You all ready have the stiffest springs. Yours may be tired and in need of replacement. Some new ones, or you can get the spacers mentioned.
hope this helps:waving:


----------



## NoNeck

OK, thanks.


----------



## SnoFarmer

NoNeck said:


> OK, thanks.


 A leveling Kit - consists of spacers-:waving: 
Your Welcome...


----------



## NoNeck

Yeah, I actually just put a leveling kit in my 95 2500 v10 last month. Pretty easy to do. I sold the truck though to get this one but now I'm hooked on the leveling kit.


----------



## SnoFarmer

Bump, some one asked :waving:


----------



## ta3834bbl

This thread is still alive, again! 

I just picked up my new 46-47 springs from the dealer today and will be replacing my 38-39 combo this evening. I will take pics of before and after. I think my truck sits way too low on the front end, as my bump stops are only 2" off the axle and it bottoms out all the time on small bumps without the plow. I am concerned that the a-frame on the plow won't be level anymore, but that can be fixed. I may be selling the 38-39 springs soon, depending on the ride stiffness in the new springs. 
Oh, the springs were 118 for the 46 and 128 for the 47 with a 3 day delivery to the dealership.


----------



## SnoFarmer

If you do not have the camper package a set of timbrens for the rear is a good idea.


----------



## ta3834bbl

I just put an ad up here linking to ebay for my old 038 & 039 coils. http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=34434


----------

