# posi doesn't work



## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

Does anyone (B&B  ) have the schematic for the gm gov lock rear end that's in my 97 chevy k2500? The last couple weeks i noticed that the other wheel doesn't lock up at all anymore and it's like i'm just driving with an open diff (not what i want at all). If anyone could provide some insight on what to do ide really appreciate it.....seems like i'm just living truck problem to truck problem lately  all part of the game i guess

-mike-


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

I know the feeling. In the last 4 weeks I have dropped $1304.95 total into my truck in different repairs:realmad: All have happened while plowing to Thats what really pisses me off. I will see if I can find the schematic for you.


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

The first is a diagram of a 10 1/2 rear the second is all others


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## KGRlandscapeing (May 2, 2007)

its what we all do the bigger guys can just slush fund the parts us smaller guys it hits harder


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

Thank you so much for that!  any idea on what may be causing the problem (like which part numbers)?

thanks guys,
-mike-


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

I suggest pulling off the cover and seeing if there is any metal in the fluid . Is it making any noise?


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

No noise that i know of, i'll pull the cover off and take a look....any ideas are welcome to check for


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

From what I read on it if it needs adjustment you replace the right side cam gear to do that. Needs a shop regardless as the specifications ie backlash etc have to be perfect. Check to see if the fluid is full first. If you want me to come take a quick look I can. Just call me. 660-1629. Ken


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

streetfrog;509989 said:


> From what I read on it if it needs adjustment you replace the right side cam gear to do that. Needs a shop regardless as the specifications ie backlash etc have to be perfect. Check to see if the fluid is full first. If you want me to come take a quick look I can. Just call me. 660-1629. Ken


I'll give you a call right after school....so you're saying that a shop would have to fix this due to close tolerances/specs?


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## L.I.Mike (Dec 28, 2002)

I had to have mine rebuilt to the tune of $1200. It was whining for a long time and needed a new posi unit since the spider gears were shot.
The whole unit is built with tight tolerences so I dont think it a back yard fix.
Good luck.


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

If it needs to have certain parts replaced. I can take a look and give you a better idea. Just let me know


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## mike33087 (Feb 9, 2005)

man it never ends for you.... hope you can figure it out.... or just trade her in for a new baby


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

If it's going to cost more than $500 to fix then i might as well just get a detroit locker or something to put in there instead that's going to be bullet proof, i don't care about gas mileage too much, if its not going to break and be strong and last, then it's worth it.


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## Mark13 (Dec 3, 2006)

mcwlandscaping;510144 said:


> If it's going to cost more than $500 to fix then i might as well just get a detroit locker or something to put in there instead that's going to be bullet proof, i don't care about gas mileage too much, if its not going to break and be strong and last, then it's worth it.


Check out the detroit trutrac for a posi unit. I have also heard good things about precision gears if those need to be replaced.

Also check out fullsizechevy.com, lots of information there.


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## ABES (Jun 10, 2007)

Mark13;510277 said:


> Check out the detroit trutrac for a posi unit. I have also heard good things about precision gears if those need to be replaced.
> 
> Also check out fullsizechevy.com, lots of information there.


i am preety sure they dont make a detroit trutrac for the 9.5" 14 bolt


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

Would this be the one ide need? 
http://www.4wheelerssupply.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/71172

if not, which one out of this list:
http://www.4wheelerssupply.com/catalog/index.php/cPath/470_496_22_417

Would you guys recomend anything else? Where would you recomend me buy whatever ide get? I wouldn't plan to do this til spring or summer so ive got time.

Thanks for all your help again on everything guys,
-mike-


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

Do you know for a fact it needs it yet?


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

no, just preparing for the worst as that's what seems to always happen :-/ i still would like to give you a call to see if you can look at this sometime to see if maybe it's not someting too too horrible that went wrong in there!
-mike-


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## streetfrog (Dec 9, 2007)

No problem. Just call me when you want me to look at it.


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## snowcan (Sep 28, 2006)

MCW the clutches in your diff will be burnt, thats why your posi doesn't work, that diff repair is not for beginners because of backlash/preload adjustments, you should at least change the oil now to reduce the amount of contamination left by the clutches to reduce the chance of fu damage to your ring and pinion and spiders. When you replace the clutches, expect that job to become a differential overhaul, (bearings, seals,etc.)


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

Mike it looks like the diffs in the links you posted are for a 10.5 14 bolt, not the 9.5 like your truck has.

I'd bet your Gov-bomb broke the governor or flyweight mechanism...that's usually what fails on them first, if they don't just explode the entire guts in the first place. You may remember in the beginning when you were getting ready to swap this rear in you asked about the durability of the factory lockers and I told you they weren't the strongest, sounds like you've found out. If you pull the cover off and anything with the diff looks wrong, don't put a dime in it. Pitch it and get a good aftermarket unit.


A word to the wise though if your going to replace the Gov-bomb with an aftermarket diff, don't use a mechanical locker in it if it's your primary vehicle..they're way to rough and aggressive for a daily driver and I doubt you'd be happy with the on road characteristics of a true mechanical locker.


A much better diff for a daily driver/plow truck would be a Detroit Tru-Trac... it's a gear type (no clutches) limited slip. They're excellent on the street with good manners (smooth), take no special lubricant and are very durable/reliable. They make them for the 9.5 14 bolt too.


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

B&B;512327 said:


> Mike it looks like the diffs in the links you posted are for a 10.5 14 bolt, not the 9.5 like your truck has.
> 
> I'd bet your Gov-bomb broke the governor or flyweight mechanism...that's usually what fails on them first, if they don't just explode the entire guts in the first place. You may remember in the beginning when you were getting ready to swap this rear in you asked about the durability of the factory lockers and I told you they weren't the strongest, sounds like you've found out. If you pull the cover off and anything with the diff looks wrong, don't put a dime in it. Pitch it and get a good aftermarket unit.
> 
> ...


Where would you suggest me looking at getting one of these? I"m almost scared to take the cover off as i'm just ready for everything inside will fall out lol. Also, as far as getting the replacement in the truck, would i buy it then take it to a shop to have them install it?


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

Yes you'd want have a shop do the diff swap for you. Rears aren't something you want to learn on unless you have someone with experience to work with you through the install.

As to where to buy one, theirs plenty of online outfits that sell Detroit. Here's a couple I've bought from before...

Summit

Reider Racing


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

B&B;512342 said:


> Yes you'd want have a shop do the diff swap for you. Rears aren't something you want to learn on unless you have someone with experience to work with you through the install.
> 
> As to where to buy one, theirs plenty of online outfits that sell Detroit. Here's a couple I've bought from before...
> 
> ...


I'll probably be calling streetfrog to have him take a look and then go from there. I have a feeling i'll end up having to replace it all with the way thigns have been going on the truck :-/ what other things would you suggest/or know of that should be done at the time this is done. And, if i have the parts, what would you expect or guess a shop would charge for doing the install?


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

When I pull them apart to do a diff swap I check the ring and pinion, axles and axle bearings for wear while I'm in there. 

Always put new axle seals in any time it's apart (takes an additional 10 mins and $25 in parts). 

If your swapping diffs, you'll need to purchase two new carrier bearings and races since the new diff won't have them pre installed, so that will fix any worn carrier bearing problems your current diff might have.

As to cost of labor, it's tough to say. Just depends on what the market is in your area and who you go too. Generally speaking though, figure about 3-4 hours of labor if they don't find anything else wrong when you tear it down.


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

B&B;512358 said:


> When I pull them apart to do a diff swap I check the ring and pinion, axles and axle bearings for wear while I'm in there.
> 
> Always put new axle seals in any time it's apart (takes an additional 10 mins and $25 in parts).
> 
> ...


I should just pay you to come and do it  that'd be nice

Anyway, thank you for all of your help, i'll have the inners looked at to see what we're dealing with. I'll probably end up PMing you for specific questions as things progress if that's ok. This probably won't happen until spring or so, so ive got some time to figure out what this'll all cost

thank you
-mike-


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

mcwlandscaping;513463 said:


> I should just pay you to come and do it  that'd be nice
> 
> Anyway, thank you for all of your help, i'll have the inners looked at to see what we're dealing with. I'll probably end up PMing you for specific questions as things progress if that's ok. This probably won't happen until spring or so, so ive got some time to figure out what this'll all cost
> 
> ...


 Just yell when your ready Mike.

And NH ain't that far away


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

B&B;513937 said:


> Just yell when your ready Mike.
> 
> And NH ain't that far away


This could be pretty cool....you could do that dual alternator/third battery setup on the truck as well while you're here  I have no problem paying for very good service!

I'll see what my local shop says about all of this and then see what you think about what they say! I'm going to change the fluid by the end of the week to see whats going on in there...ide do it right after school but with the storm coming and my luck, the whole diff would just fall right out :-/

When i do the fluid change (will do front too while i'm at it) would it be bad to spray some brake cleaner or something in there to get as much of the old fluid and crap out? Could that hurt anything any further in the diff?

-mike-


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

Brake cleaner is how I clean them...just be sure to give enough time for the cleaner to dry up good.

How about a couple clear, close up pics with the cover off? More eyes are better than two. Might be able to see something....


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## BREAULT69 (Jan 15, 2008)

I've blown up several factory limited slip units in different vehicles, I finally tried a Detroit Locker. Super tough but violent engagement. It's either locked or unlocked, nothing in between. It was funny to step on the gas while going around a corner and watch what anybody riding in the vehicle would do. That thing would lock and jerk the entire vehicle, usually cause the inside tire to chirp. people would say "holly s**t ! what was that ?!" I loved that thing. Definitely not for everyday driver.


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

BREAULT69;514923 said:


> It was funny to step on the gas while going around a corner and watch what anybody riding in the vehicle would do. That thing would lock and jerk the entire vehicle, usually cause the inside tire to chirp. people would say "holly s**t ! what was that ?!" I loved that thing. Definitely not for everyday driver.


My passengers used to ask me if someone smacked the frame with a sledge hammer .


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## Ryan4x (Dec 3, 2007)

Don't get a Detroit Trutrac, it'll do the same thing your gov lok did. As formentioned your carbon clutches in your gov lok are toast, there is a special additive to use with those, you can rebuild your gov-lok, I rebuilt mine for around $200, but it was a pain, right now you have an open diff, I would recomend getting a full blown Detroit locker or like what i did ,replace my spiders with a powertrax locker, where you reuse your stock differential. Good luck bud...


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

Ryan4x;514973 said:


> Don't get a Detroit Trutrac, it'll do the same thing your gov lok did. As formentioned your carbon clutches in your gov lok are toast, there is a special additive to use with those, you can rebuild your gov-lok, I rebuilt mine for around $200, but it was a pain, right now you have an open diff, I would recomend getting a full blown Detroit locker or like what i did ,replace my spiders with a powertrax locker, where you reuse your stock differential. Good luck bud...


Do you have any information on this?

Thanks guys so much for all the information, it is so very much appreciated! Kinda makes me excited to get the parts and whatnot, or at least do the research to go along with it to choose what i want to put in there. Honestly, i wouldn't mind a detroit locker, its a HD work truck meant to do work. Soon enough it'll just be a work truck when i get a new(er) 2500HD sometime within this spring/summer season and that'll be my normal driver while my 97 will be my second/backup truck. We'll see what happens in the near future to sway my decision! 

-mike-


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## WisEd (Jan 5, 2008)

I used a Richmond Gear PowerTrax the last time, and it was very easy to put in. I didn't have any problems.


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

WisEd;515430 said:


> I used a Richmond Gear PowerTrax the last time, and it was very easy to put in. I didn't have any problems.


looking at that, i'm really interested in taking a close look at it and maybe getting some pricing on it as well! Thank you guys for all of these ideas, i really had no idea all of these different companies existed!

-mike-


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## PLOWIN DOUGH (Mar 7, 2007)

I believe Im having a problem with the posi in my 00 dodge ram 1500. If im in 2wd on snow and one tire is spinning (slow, like idle or just above idle) I hear a definite grinding which i suspect to be clutches not fully engaged or burnt out.
If you change your differencial/ pumpkin fluid you need to ad an additive that is designed for the friction/ lubrication of the posi.
I think ill just let this go as i dont truly need posi traction. I like the idea of buying a real locker but they aint cheap and you have to manually lock/ unlock them.
Any info let me know.


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## Ryan4x (Dec 3, 2007)

I had a Corp 10 bolt, and blew up the gov lok, rebuilt it, then blew up the entire differential. (this is in an 88', 5 in lifted chevy suburban) Then I gave up on the 10 bolt and swapped in a 6 lug Semi float 14, GM did make them but only for about 2 years. The spiders were toast in that axle so I ordered a Powertrax automatic locker, it was about $375, where a Detroit locker is around $500. The install was very easy, it came with decent instructions, and the unit works great. ( I wheel this rig very hard and haven't blown up that axle or locker!)


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## Detroitdan (Aug 15, 2005)

Have you checked the fluid? I don't know how damaged mine might be, but it has a slight leak and every few months the level gets just a tiny bit low and the locker stops working. Throw a little fluid and additive in it, and it starts working again. I actually changed it with Amsoil that was "supposed" to have all the right additives in it, but the locker would not work. Put a tube of additive in, drove 300 feet and it was working again. It just stopped working again, so I need to crawl under and check the fluid. I have to add a little about once a year. Can't seem to fix the axle seal leak, but it's minor.


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

What is this additive that i need? Is it already in the fluid or do i have to get the fluid and then something else to put in it? I'll do that on saturday!

Thanks guys,
-mike-

ps, i'm really interested in that powertrax lock right diff


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## Detroitdan (Aug 15, 2005)

mcwlandscaping;516598 said:


> What is this additive that i need? Is it already in the fluid or do i have to get the fluid and then something else to put in it? I'll do that on saturday!
> 
> Thanks guys,
> -mike-
> ...


I got a tube of limited slip additive at A-zone, it's about a 12 ounce tube. Just squeeze it in with the oil. If you are going to change it don't waste a new tube, do it when you refill it. I'd check the fluid, if it's low put the additive in first then top off. If it's real dirty may as well pop the cover off and take a look. If nothing important looking falls out, wipe it down and button it back up and refill with fresh 80/90 plus the additive.
Good luck


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