# Fisher Discussion 11/3 - 11/7



## Mike_PS (Feb 28, 2005)

Hello Everyone!

Once again this year, one of our sponsors, Fisher Engineering, will be hosting a discussion here in the snow removal forum. The discussion will begin on Monday 11/3 and run until Friday 11/7. Be sure to read the discussion and feel free to participate. The discussions by Fisher in the past have created some great information and ideas and you can expect the same again this year.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

*Fisher Factory Discussion*

Hello All,

Once again we will be hosting a week long discussion forum to answer any question you might have. This is also a good opportunist to let us know what you would like to see Fisher offer on future products. With winter just around the corner, many of you are getting ready for what will hopefully be a very snowy and profitable plowing season. When pulling out your plowing equipment for the beginning of the season it tends to drum up questions or suggestions and I will try and answer the question in the order that they are received.

Thanks,
Brian Simmons
Fisher Engineering


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## nickv13412 (Nov 9, 2006)

Brian - 

Thanks for taking the time to do this discussion. I am wondering if Fisher is planning on making a set of wings for the X-Blade, similar to the ones that you make for the XTreme V? I know there are a lot of guys running X-Blades including myself, and itd be nice to be able to buy a set of OEM wings for the plow. Thanks again - Nick


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## Flipper (Nov 1, 2001)

Can the ExtremeV be ordered without hydraulics (Hydraulic Delete)? 

Also are there any plans to return to making a light commercial duty plow (trip edge would be nice) for smaller trucks to compete with the Meyer Drive Pro which carries a commercial use designation and warranty?

Of course, and I say it every year, I would really like to see universal belt drive packages offered by Fisher Electric clutch pump, electric solenoid underhood valves, resevoir and hoses. Brackets would be fabbed by installer.

Finally and I mentioned this a couple years ago how about making replacable clear acrylic windows in the front panel of spreaders? This way you could look out your back window and have an idea of how much material you have left.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

nickv13412;623373 said:


> Brian -
> 
> Thanks for taking the time to do this discussion. I am wondering if Fisher is planning on making a set of wings for the X-Blade, similar to the ones that you make for the XTreme V? I know there are a lot of guys running X-Blades including myself, and itd be nice to be able to buy a set of OEM wings for the plow. Thanks again - Nick


Nickv13412,

Currently there is nothing in the works for this model blade. I know there have been a few requests in the past and we really should look to see if there is any possibility. The XtremeV was designed to accommodate wings from the start whereas the X-blade was not. Your comment will be forwarded to the Product Manager for consideration. Thanks for the opening comment.

Brian Simmons


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## nickv13412 (Nov 9, 2006)

Brian Simmons;623455 said:


> Nickv13412,
> 
> Currently there is nothing in the works for this model blade. I know there have been a few requests in the past and we really should look to see if there is any possibility. The XtremeV was designed to accommodate wings from the start whereas the X-blade was not. Your comment will be forwarded to the Product Manager for consideration. Thanks for the opening comment.
> 
> Brian Simmons


Ok thanks Brian, I know the blades are a bit different, but if all it takes is a little bit of modification to your XTreme V wings, I'm sure thered be plenty of guys who would buy them from Fisher rather than using pro wings and having to drill the moldboard and brace behind the hole...I know i dont wanna touch my stainless with a drill  Thanks again Brian and please let us know if there is any news - Nick


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Flipper;623431 said:


> Can the ExtremeV be ordered without hydraulics (Hydraulic Delete)?
> 
> Also are there any plans to return to making a light commercial duty plow (trip edge would be nice) for smaller trucks to compete with the Meyer Drive Pro which carries a commercial use designation and warranty?
> 
> ...


Flipper,

Currently the plow cannot be ordered without Hydraulics, we have had no demand. With Straight blades it's an easy install but not with V-plows. Most users stay away from v-plows and central Hyd. as the system is much more complicated. In the three years we have been selling the XtremeV, this is only the second request for such a setup. If you wanted the unit without Hyd. you could work with the dealer to order everything but the Hyd. unit and go from there.

As for the underhood Hydraulic setups, like we stated last year the trucks change way to often and most trucks don't have enough room (2008 Ford diesel - hard enough trying to find a place to mount the relay). If you really wanted to install this type of system we still sell all of the major components (pump, valve, cables) and you could fab all of the required brackets. If you would like I can send you a complete list of all the part numbers that would be packed in a "universal kit". I completely agree it would be great to be able to still use underhood setups.

I agree that a "see thru" window would be a good idea , but would be more cost effective as a enduser upgrade. I will forward your request to the marketing dept.

thanks for the comments.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

nickv13412;623459 said:


> Ok thanks Brian, I know the blades are a bit different, but if all it takes is a little bit of modification to your XTreme V wings, I'm sure thered be plenty of guys who would buy them from Fisher rather than using pro wings and having to drill the moldboard and brace behind the hole...I know i dont wanna touch my stainless with a drill  Thanks again Brian and please let us know if there is any news - Nick


Nick,
There would need to be modifications to both the wing and the plow. There is a 5° attack angle difference and the way it mounts to the top of the spring anchor would need modified. I will make sure I forward your comments to the Product Manager.

thanks,


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## GPS (Jun 27, 2008)

I'll second the request for factory wings for the X blade. That would be a big seller, in my opinion.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Brian Simmons;623482 said:


> Flipper,
> 
> Currently the plow cannot be ordered without Hydraulics, we have had no demand. With Straight blades it's an easy install but not with V-plows. Most users stay away from v-plows and central Hyd. as the system is much more complicated. In the three years we have been selling the XtremeV, this is only the second request for such a setup. If you wanted the unit without Hyd. you could work with the dealer to order everything but the Hyd. unit and go from there.
> 
> ...


One advantage of our multiplexing systems on our PolyCaster lineup is that fact that it can sense amp draw. There is an LED light that will flash a series of codes and one such code is "Hopper Empty or material bridged". Although it will not let you know when the hopper is getting low it will let you know when your empty or nearly empty.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Brian - Last year Gary did the Q&A with everyone here. Where's he at this year?

Secondly, is Fisher going to have any products at the SEMA show in Vegas this week? I'm going to be there by the end of the day and I'd love to chat with some of your representatives. 

Lastly, who's Dean?

Thanks!


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Camden;623555 said:


> Brian - Last year Gary did the Q&A with everyone here. Where's he at this year?
> 
> Secondly, is Fisher going to have any products at the SEMA show in Vegas this week? I'm going to be there by the end of the day and I'd love to chat with some of your representatives.
> 
> ...


Gary is no longer with the company. We used to split the responsibility with one covering each site. Now I will be covering both sites.

No we are not going to have any products at the SEMA show. We do Sponsor the other SIMA though.

Well since I never made any references about a Dean, you must be referring to Dean Fisher - the founder of Fisher plows. He designed the first ever trip edge plow 65 years ago.


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## mercer_me (Sep 13, 2008)

Thank you for having this forum I think Fisher makes the best plows out there. I have 2 questions.

1. Why did you change to electrical hydrolic? The old hydrolic plows had alot more power.

2. My dad wants to take a quik switch plow off a 1985 Ford Ranger and put it on his 2000 Ford Ranger , what modifications will he have to make to to plow? He just wants to leave the frame on all year. So will he have to put new push plates on it or anything?


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## Woodland (Sep 17, 2005)

I just had a brand new 7'6" HD straight blade installed on my truck. This is after a short stint with a Diamond (although I started with a Speedcaster a few years back). I do like the Fisher and I'm glad to be back. My only gripe would be the location of the mounting holes for the cutting edge. The Diamond that I had, the mounting holes were centered on the cutting edge so you could essentially get two edges from one piece of steel. Why doesn't Fisher subscribe to this method?


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## 3bladz (Dec 8, 2005)

Are you planning anything for skid steers? Like the xls?


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## Captain (Sep 27, 2008)

I recently had a Homesteader plow installed. When trying to remove the spring loaded pins the passenger side slides out good everytime. The drivers side however is bound tight and I have to actually jack up the plow almost 1/2" to get the pin to move freely. Is this normal??? I bought the plow for the ease of being able to put it on and off.


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## bribrius (May 5, 2007)

Brian

where are you the rest of the year? Im sure you have heard this before, but having other dealers on this site year round and you showing up a week a year is a little discouraging.
I actually had to recommend a snoway this past week out of distraught that we have no fisher representation here 99% of the time:realmad:. If i have to stay here and reco fishers by myself you could at least send me a paycheck. It wouldnt be a bad thing for one of you to stop in occasionally just to go through the fisher thread and offer advice.


Keep up the good work over there and if there are any interesting developments in the works i wouldnt mind some info in a pm.

thanks


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## mcwlandscaping (Sep 8, 2005)

Captain;624159 said:


> I recently had a Homesteader plow installed. When trying to remove the spring loaded pins the passenger side slides out good everytime. The drivers side however is bound tight and I have to actually jack up the plow almost 1/2" to get the pin to move freely. Is this normal??? I bought the plow for the ease of being able to put it on and off.


Are you pushing up while your trying to pull out the second pin? With the first pin out, all the weight is riding on that second pin, so you do have to push a bit and then pull the pin to get it out....on a new plow especially, the paint and powder coat make everything fit nice and tight, so with some use, that should help things become easier as well.


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## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

bribrius;624181 said:


> Brian
> 
> where are you the rest of the year? Im sure you have heard this before, but having other dealers on this site year round and you showing up a week a year is a little discouraging.
> I actually had to recommend a snoway this past week out of distraught that we have no fisher representation here 99% of the time:realmad:. If i have to stay here and reco fishers by myself you could at least send me a paycheck. It wouldnt be a bad thing for one of you to stop in occasionally just to go through the fisher thread and offer advice.
> ...


i dont have a fisher....

but ill say the support of a few snow way guys on this site, makes me highly reconsider the plows i use


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## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

i have two top questions... keep in mind im a western guy , but close enought


1. with the high cost of deicer this year, is there going to be any consideration , or testing/devlopement regaurding how well the plow scrapes and cleans. Snow way has a down pressure system, im sure they have it patented pretty well, but any simpliar things? or playing with the angle of attact on the cutting edge.. minimizing salt costs is going to be a key for years to come - 

2. the new talk around here , has been liquids.... any thoughts on a liquid system , or possibly , a pre wet system , ?


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

mercer_me;623835 said:


> Thank you for having this forum I think Fisher makes the best plows out there. I have 2 questions.
> 
> 1. Why did you change to electrical hydrolic? The old hydrolic plows had alot more power.
> 
> 2. My dad wants to take a quik switch plow off a 1985 Ford Ranger and put it on his 2000 Ford Ranger , what modifications will he have to make to to plow? He just wants to leave the frame on all year. So will he have to put new push plates on it or anything?


mercer_me,

There were a few different reasons. One being that the trucks were changing just about every other year, shrinking available free space under the hood (Ford Diesel - hard enough to find a place to mount a relay), numerous engine options( some had as many as 4 different engine options) all made it an engineering nightmare. By going to electric all we had to worry about was the frame changes every 5-10 years.

Well unfortunately we do not offer either conventional or MM plates for the 2000 Ford Ranger. The only application we have for this model year is the Homesteader plow. If he wants to mount that plow to that truck he will have to fabricate a set of plates for it.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Woodland;623932 said:


> I just had a brand new 7'6" HD straight blade installed on my truck. This is after a short stint with a Diamond (although I started with a Speedcaster a few years back). I do like the Fisher and I'm glad to be back. My only gripe would be the location of the mounting holes for the cutting edge. The Diamond that I had, the mounting holes were centered on the cutting edge so you could essentially get two edges from one piece of steel. Why doesn't Fisher subscribe to this method?


Well there has been a lot of debate on this issue over the years. A 6" center punched cutting edges allow for about 4" of wear - a couple of inches on each side. A 6" top punched cutting edge allows for about 4" of wear but without having to flip the edge. We all know how much fun it is to remove all of the frozen bolts to flip the edge. There is a mind set out there that they should be center punched. This is why our Straight X-blades and municipal plows are center punched as this is what municipalities prefer.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

3bladz;624057 said:


> Are you planning anything for skid steers? Like the xls?


At this point in time we do not have anything in the works. This might change in the future if there is any demand.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Captain;624159 said:


> I recently had a Homesteader plow installed. When trying to remove the spring loaded pins the passenger side slides out good everytime. The drivers side however is bound tight and I have to actually jack up the plow almost 1/2" to get the pin to move freely. Is this normal??? I bought the plow for the ease of being able to put it on and off.


Well there might be a few different answers to this. When you are attaching/detaching the plow do you have the control on and in float. This style plow has a double acting cylinder and needs to be on and in float. The other issue might be a small misalignment issue or powdercoat buildup. If it is hard to remove this pin go back to the dealer and ask them to look at it and make it right. This plow should be easy to attached and removed. If pushing back on the headgear to remove this pin does not help then there is an alignment issue somewhere.


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## weeman97 (Dec 4, 2005)

i just bought a brand new xtreme v 8.5 from CPW is there anything i should be on the plow to look out for? i had a fisher before and loved it and hoping this plow will give me many years of service. keep up the good work.


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## FordFisherman (Dec 5, 2007)

Brian, 
Just a quick maintenance question. How often should I "drop the can" to clean the screens on my MM2? I'm starting the 5th season with this plow. Thanks


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

bribrius;624181 said:


> Brian
> 
> where are you the rest of the year? Im sure you have heard this before, but having other dealers on this site year round and you showing up a week a year is a little discouraging.
> I actually had to recommend a snoway this past week out of distraught that we have no fisher representation here 99% of the time:realmad:. If i have to stay here and reco fishers by myself you could at least send me a paycheck. It wouldnt be a bad thing for one of you to stop in occasionally just to go through the fisher thread and offer advice.
> ...


Well for the most part I am the only factory rep that has been on here thru the years. I know of only one other rep and he just came on board a few months ago to promote their products ( not saying that it's a bad thing ). Over the years I have provided lots of info mostly thru PM either started by me or sent to me. For the most part there are some very knowledgeable guys on here that answer most of the post correctly, no need to step in and repeat the info. If there is any false or incorrect info i usually will put in my 2 cents. On top of that I do travel and have other projects that prevent me from being on the site all the time. I will do my best to be on here to help when I can. If there are other reps on here that I do not know about let me know.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

elite1msmith;624204 said:


> i have two top questions... keep in mind im a western guy , but close enought
> 
> 1. with the high cost of deicer this year, is there going to be any consideration , or testing/devlopement regaurding how well the plow scrapes and cleans. Snow way has a down pressure system, im sure they have it patented pretty well, but any simpliar things? or playing with the angle of attact on the cutting edge.. minimizing salt costs is going to be a key for years to come -
> 
> 2. the new talk around here , has been liquids.... any thoughts on a liquid system , or possibly , a pre wet system , ?


Well as you stated DP is patented, but over the years we have been increasing the attack angle of our plows. Take the X-blade for instance - the 75° attack angle is very aggressive when it comes to scraping. Some have even stated that it is too aggressive. Our XtremeV and XLS are at a 70° attack angle for improved scraping. Then there are our smaller blades such as the Homesteader plow. This plow is only 250lbs total weight but scrapes as well if not better than our full size blades. This is achieved by installing what we call a scrape lock relief valve in the lift cylinder. It is set to 1200psi and prevents the blade from lifting from the force of the snow, while still allowing the blade to float. All of our other blades do have adjustment holes at the back of the a-frame that can allow for a little adjustment of the attack angle. Normally you would install it so that the a-frame is level but if you use the bottom hole when you would normally use the middle or top hole it will allow you to roll the blade forward for a steeper attack angle.

There has been some discussion on pre wetting systems but nothing substantial at this time.


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## mercer_me (Sep 13, 2008)

Brian Simmons;624488 said:


> Well unfortunately we do not offer either conventional or MM plates for the 2000 Ford Ranger. The only application we have for this model year is the Homesteader plow. If he wants to mount that plow to that truck he will have to fabricate a set of plates for it.


Thank you for all your help you make an exelant product. I think we will fab it up to make it work.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

weeman97;624541 said:


> i just bought a brand new xtreme v 8.5 from CPW is there anything i should be on the plow to look out for? i had a fisher before and loved it and hoping this plow will give me many years of service. keep up the good work.


Well just your normal maintenance items like greasing the electrical plugs, changing the fluid prior to the plowing season, touching up any scratches before it leads to rusting issues etc.... Keep an eye on your cutting edges to make sure they are wearing evenly, v-plows require adjustments at install to make sure the edges sit flat in all blade configurations.


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## Woodland (Sep 17, 2005)

Brian Simmons;624508 said:


> Well there has been a lot of debate on this issue over the years. A 6" center punched cutting edges allow for about 4" of wear - a couple of inches on each side. A 6" top punched cutting edge allows for about 4" of wear but without having to flip the edge. We all know how much fun it is to remove all of the frozen bolts to flip the edge. There is a mind set out there that they should be center punched. This is why our Straight X-blades and municipal plows are center punched as this is what municipalities prefer.


Am I missing something? Are you saying that I'm supposed to let my trip edge wear down to within 2" of the bolts? If I did that and then put a new cutting edge on, it would hang 4" below the bottom of the plow??


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

FordFisherman;624595 said:


> Brian,
> Just a quick maintenance question. How often should I "drop the can" to clean the screens on my MM2? I'm starting the 5th season with this plow. Thanks


Well if you have not done it yet you should. It's not a bad idea to do it yearly but it's not required. Once the unit has a few years on it then it should be part of your regular maintenance, especially if your using ATF. Since we have gone away from the packing style cylinders the screen clogging has all but disappeared. The newer o-ring style gland nut cylinders do not break apart like the packing style did.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Woodland;624682 said:


> Am I missing something? Are you saying that I'm supposed to let my trip edge wear down to within 2" of the bolts? If I did that and then put a new cutting edge on, it would hang 4" below the bottom of the plow??


You are correct. On our base angle equipped plows the base angle was designed to be used as a cutting edge. If you look on the back side of the base angle you will see to wear pads welded to the backside to prolong the wear. Once you get within an 1-1/2-2" (make sure the bottom spring anchors are not wearing) of the bolt holes then you bolt on the cutting edge. Your best scraping performance will be seen by the base angle or cutting edge but not both - less surface area touching the ground will improve the scraping. If you double up there will be twice as much ground contact and will not scrape as well. The difference is not huge but noticeable.


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## Woodland (Sep 17, 2005)

Brian Simmons;624717 said:


> You are correct. On our base angle equipped plows the base angle was designed to be used as a cutting edge. If you look on the back side of the base angle you will see to wear pads welded to the backside to prolong the wear. Once you get within an 1-1/2-2" (make sure the bottom spring anchors are not wearing) of the bolt holes then you bolt on the cutting edge. Your best scraping performance will be seen by the base angle or cutting edge but not both - less surface area touching the ground will improve the scraping. If you double up there will be twice as much ground contact and will not scrape as well. The difference is not huge but noticeable.


By golly, I guess I did learn something today! Isn't there a substantial risk of snapping that steel cutting edge with that much hanging down unsupported?

P.S. Knowing this bit of info, I take back my comment about center punching the mount holes!


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## SNOWANDICEMAN (Sep 11, 2007)

Brian, 
Just wanted to say welcome aboard, I wanted to know without drilling holes in the bed of my truck whats is the best way to secure the fisher poly caster. Thanks SNOWANDICEMAN


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## Captain (Sep 27, 2008)

Brian Simmons;624535 said:


> Well there might be a few different answers to this. *When you are attaching/detaching the plow do you have the control on and in float. This style plow has a double acting cylinder and needs to be on and in float*. The other issue might be a small misalignment issue or powdercoat buildup. If it is hard to remove this pin go back to the dealer and ask them to look at it and make it right. This plow should be easy to attached and removed. If pushing back on the headgear to remove this pin does not help then there is an alignment issue somewhere.


Hmmm.....it's alot easier to pull those pins with the plow control on and in float mode   

Thanks Brian


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## iceyman (Mar 1, 2007)

Brian Simmons;624647 said:


> Well for the most part I am the only factory rep that has been on here thru the years. I know of only one other rep and he just came on board a few months ago to promote their products ( not saying that it's a bad thing ). Over the years I have provided lots of info mostly thru PM either started by me or sent to me. For the most part there are some very knowledgeable guys on here that answer most of the post correctly, no need to step in and repeat the info. If there is any false or incorrect info i usually will put in my 2 cents.


i know of one rep from a company already mentioned in this thread that is on here 7 days a week and is always looking to help out a fellow member.... this rep has been a member for about 2 years and is not only a sponsor trying to promote his products but has become a regular member just like alot of us on here.... he also takes the good with the bad but always answers to a post referring to his company...whether or not if its the answer the poster would of liked to hear or the answer he would of liked to give.... but the point is this rep has not been new the last few months and doesnt just ***** out his own product... and maybe some other companies should look at what this rep ( with other help from shop owners) has done on this site and take the same path because he is selling alot of plows that wouldnt have been sold have they not been here.... i know im buying one within the next year just because of the support... Thanks for your time hope the week turns out well


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

Brian Simmons;624661 said:


> Normally you would install it so that the a-frame is level but if you use the bottom hole when you would normally use the middle or top hole it will allow you to roll the blade forward for a steeper attack angle.
> .


Wouldn't that lead to the wear edge wearing unevenly?


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## Marbleman (Oct 29, 2006)

*XLS Plow Stops*

Hi Brian, I have a new (installed this fall) XLS mounted on a 2008 f350. The existing plow stops only raise the plow 6" till it bottoms out. I went to a dealer today to get a smaller stops, the ones I have now are about 4 inches( they are pointed at the touch point). (I tried to get some that are similar to the ones I have on my ez v but they do not sell those anymore (those were round at the touch point). What do I do, with 6 inches the plow will bottom out and will not get over a curb?


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## NickyBombs (Dec 9, 2005)

*X-blade wings*

I too would definately buy fisher wings for my x-blade. Don't want to drill my stainless moldboard. Please make one.


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## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

basher;625082 said:


> Wouldn't that lead to the wear edge wearing unevenly?


on a vee blade it would , but i think it would have little effect on a straight blade, unless you constantly plow angled to one side.... like for road way use

my question is ... they say a "steeper" angle? like 75% I would think that a shaloower angle , closer to the ground, like a knife blade would scrap more?


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Woodland;624732 said:


> By golly, I guess I did learn something today! Isn't there a substantial risk of snapping that steel cutting edge with that much hanging down unsupported?
> 
> P.S. Knowing this bit of info, I take back my comment about center punching the mount holes!


No. Look at all of the full trip blades. They are all that style for the most part.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

basher;625082 said:


> Wouldn't that lead to the wear edge wearing unevenly?


It may to a point when angled fully in either direction. The original question was about increase scraping ability. We obviously recommend the a-frame be installed per our instructions. But if you have a plow that is not scraping to your liking this is an easy way to help out the performance.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Marbleman;625121 said:


> Hi Brian, I have a new (installed this fall) XLS mounted on a 2008 f350. The existing plow stops only raise the plow 6" till it bottoms out. I went to a dealer today to get a smaller stops, the ones I have now are about 4 inches( they are pointed at the touch point). (I tried to get some that are similar to the ones I have on my ez v but they do not sell those anymore (those were round at the touch point). What do I do, with 6 inches the plow will bottom out and will not get over a curb?


Well we do still sell the EZ-V style - P/N 27533. These may work in some senarios. The main issue you need to watch out for is when the blade is in full V and in the raised position that the inner top spring anchor on the passenger side does not contact the Hyd. unit. Also do you have the recommened amount of ballast behind the rear axle? What is the configuration of this truck? Engine?


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

elite1msmith;625339 said:


> on a vee blade it would , but i think it would have little effect on a straight blade, unless you constantly plow angled to one side.... like for road way use
> 
> my question is ... they say a "steeper" angle? like 75% I would think that a shaloower angle , closer to the ground, like a knife blade would scrap more?


The steeper the angle the more pressure is applied to the edge. The X-blade is a prime example of this. It has a 75° attack angle and scrapes better than our other plows. More of the weight is applied directly over the cutting edge.


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

Brian Simmons;625591 said:


> It may to a point when angled fully in either direction. The original question was about increase scraping ability. We obviously recommend the a-frame be installed per our instructions. But if you have a plow that is not scraping to your liking this is an easy way to help out the performance.


Makes sense Thanks for the response:salute:


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## bribrius (May 5, 2007)

just a comment.
i dont quite understand the cutting edge replacement time.
On my chevy the a frame is near level. with ballast in the back it is level. the degree on the cutting edge is about 50 or so. The cutting edge itself is just under six inches now from wear. The thickness of the edge and the base angle hitting the ground is near one inch. The spring anchors are not wearing but where the anchors meet the base angle is right on the ground (the wear pads). This is usually about when i change the cutting edge, even though its still got almost six inches on it just because im about to go into where the spring anchors meet the base angle. I changed it out twice last season and dont feel im getting anywhere near the usage out of a cutting edge i should be.
I have the plow frame set on the center hole. 
And like i said its damn near level with the ballast in the truck.

its a 7.5 mm1 on a 2000 silverado half ton


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

Brian Simmons;624661 said:


> All of our other blades do have adjustment holes at the back of the a-frame that can allow for a little adjustment of the attack angle. Normally you would install it so that the a-frame is level but if you use the bottom hole when you would normally use the middle or top hole it will allow you to roll the blade forward for a steeper attack angle.


I've always found that changing the attack angle (from it's design intended position, whatever it may be) by altering the A-frame height on trip edge plows moderately affects the trip action. And for the most part it's usually negatively. Your thoughts Brian?


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

bribrius;625881 said:


> just a comment.
> i dont quite understand the cutting edge replacement time.
> On my chevy the a frame is near level. with ballast in the back it is level. the degree on the cutting edge is about 50 or so. The cutting edge itself is just under six inches now from wear. The thickness of the edge and the base angle hitting the ground is near one inch. The spring anchors are not wearing but where the anchors meet the base angle is right on the ground (the wear pads). This is usually about when i change the cutting edge, even though its still got almost six inches on it just because im about to go into where the spring anchors meet the base angle. I changed it out twice last season and dont feel im getting anywhere near the usage out of a cutting edge i should be.
> I have the plow frame set on the center hole.
> ...


Well without seeing a pic it's kind of hard to determine what is going on. Wearing away some of the anchor is OK. If you look the gusset extends to the very edge of the base angle. The gussets are fully welded nearly the entire length both on the top and sides. You can wear these down and still have plenty of strength with the remaining portion of welds. These base angles were designed to be worn down to the point that when cutting edges are installed there is plenty of usable cutting edge material. Supply a pic if you can


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

B&B;626332 said:


> I've always found that changing the attack angle (from it's design intended position, whatever it may be) by altering the A-frame height on trip edge plows moderately affects the trip action. And for the most part it's usually negatively. Your thoughts Brian?


Well for optimum performance the a-frame needs to be level. But if this cannot be achieved, it is better to have the rear of the a-frame higher than the front. It takes less force to trip the blade. If the rear of the a-frame is lower than the front it will require more force to trip the base angle. So ideally you want the a-frame to be level, or have the rear of the a-frame higher than the front. With the 54° attack angle if the rear of the a-frame is lower than the front you have decrease the angle of attack and in theory the blade actually needs to lift slightly in order for the blade to trip. This is why more force is needed to trip the base angle in this configuration.


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## M&M (Sep 8, 2008)

I have a newly installed 8.5 extreme v on my 2002 2500HD extended cab 6.0L. Do I need to change the hole location at the back of the frame when my edge begins to wear? In other words, my frame is level with ballast and a new edge. Will the frame get out of level when the edge wears down? Thanks in advance for the reply.


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## bribrius (May 5, 2007)

Brian Simmons;626424 said:


> Well without seeing a pic it's kind of hard to determine what is going on. Wearing away some of the anchor is OK. If you look the gusset extends to the very edge of the base angle. The gussets are fully welded nearly the entire length both on the top and sides. You can wear these down and still have plenty of strength with the remaining portion of welds. These base angles were designed to be worn down to the point that when cutting edges are installed there is plenty of usable cutting edge material. Supply a pic if you can


few pics. . if you others let me know. Like i said i try to change out the edge when i get to where the spring anchors meet the base angle. Perhaps this is my mistake i know others run them lower but i thought it would be better for the plow and keep more weight on the cutting edge.
thanks.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

M&M;626608 said:


> I have a newly installed 8.5 extreme v on my 2002 2500HD extended cab 6.0L. Do I need to change the hole location at the back of the frame when my edge begins to wear? In other words, my frame is level with ballast and a new edge. Will the frame get out of level when the edge wears down? Thanks in advance for the reply.


It will but not much. Some customers will reset the alignment when their edges wear down 50%, but for the most part the uneven wear will be minimal and the edges will still wear together. If you only plowed in one blade configuration 90% of the time and then used a different blade configuration it would be more of an issue.


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## B&B (Nov 4, 2006)

Brian Simmons;626602 said:


> Well for optimum performance the a-frame needs to be level. But if this cannot be achieved, it is better to have the rear of the a-frame higher than the front. It takes less force to trip the blade. If the rear of the a-frame is lower than the front it will require more force to trip the base angle. So ideally you want the a-frame to be level, or have the rear of the a-frame higher than the front. With the 54° attack angle if the rear of the a-frame is lower than the front you have decrease the angle of attack and in theory the blade actually needs to lift slightly in order for the blade to trip. This is why more force is needed to trip the base angle in this configuration.


Thanks Brian. I know why and how it affects the trip. What I was looking for was feedback from customers from your prospective. Haven't had much success on altering the attack angle for more or less scraping ability.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

B&B;627003 said:


> Thanks Brian. I know why and how it affects the trip. What I was looking for was feedback from customers from your prospective. Haven't had much success on altering the attack angle for more or less scraping ability.


The difference will be minimal as you are only changing it a few degrees but it does make some difference. I have not heard much customer feedback on this issue.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

bribrius,

Those bottom spring anchors look to close to the ground. Every GM1500 that I have seen or installed use the bottom hole of the a-frame. These trucks sit lower than all of the other Mfg., and always use the bottom hole. By the looks of the spring anchor you'll need to readjust it to the bottom hole. But you can wear this gusset down with the edge wear. All you want to be watching for is that the wear does not wear away where the bolt hold the spring on.


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## MSS Mow (Mar 19, 2006)

I'm surprised there has been no discussion on the electric poly spreaders. I'd like to know what kind of issues you are seeing with these, if any, especially from those running sand instead of straight salt. One big thing mentioned on the site is that they struggle to handle the weight of the sand (vs. straight salt). Is there any plans of having an inverted V for the spreaders? I am going to be buying a spreader in the next week and would like to know what your thoughts are. Also, do you only offer the 1.25yd?

Thanks


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

MSS Mow;627779 said:


> I'm surprised there has been no discussion on the electric poly spreaders. I'd like to know what kind of issues you are seeing with these, if any, especially from those running sand instead of straight salt. One big thing mentioned on the site is that they struggle to handle the weight of the sand (vs. straight salt). Is there any plans of having an inverted V for the spreaders? I am going to be buying a spreader in the next week and would like to know what your thoughts are. Also, do you only offer the 1.25yd?
> 
> Thanks


Obviously if you do a search you will see that we did have some start up issues a few years ago. We have since then reworked all of them in the field to far as I know, the customers satisfaction. The only issue with the sand is that after you run a load or two thru it the belt needs to adjusted. The extra weight of the sand causes the belt to stretch a bit. Once it has been readjusted everything works fine. We already have an inverted V available for the unit - P/N 94970. Currently this is the only model available.


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## Brian Simmons (Mar 13, 2002)

Well this week has come to a close and I would like to thank all of you that participated. I hope it was for the most part informative. I do know that for the most part that I learned just as much from you as you did from my posts. It's always nice to know what you as customers like and dislike about our product. I know most of you would like to see me on the boards a little more often to answer any questions you have, and I will try but I cannot guarantee the frequency. These forums are filled with very knowledgeable people that can give assistance with most questions inbetween. Snow is coming (in case you did not hear Deadwood, SD got 47.5" of snow yesterday) and I hope you all have a great plowing season. Best of luck and We'll do this again next year.

thanks
Brian Simmons


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## MSS Mow (Mar 19, 2006)

Brian Simmons;627812 said:


> Obviously if you do a search you will see that we did have some start up issues a few years ago. We have since then reworked all of them in the field to far as I know, the customers satisfaction. The only issue with the sand is that after you run a load or two thru it the belt needs to adjusted. The extra weight of the sand causes the belt to stretch a bit. Once it has been readjusted everything works fine. We already have an inverted V available for the unit - P/N 94970. Currently this is the only model available.


Thank you Brian for answering my and everyone else's questions. Hopefully you are able to visit occasionally. Everyone really does like having sponsors around.


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## bribrius (May 5, 2007)

MSS Mow;627846 said:


> Thank you Brian for answering my and everyone else's questions. Hopefully you are able to visit occasionally. Everyone really does like having sponsors around.


AGREE.

i moved it to the bottom hole. Course now the a frame isnt level (eh?????) but the spring anchors are a half inch or so higher........
Im going to remove the cutting edge now and let the base angle wear down some now that i dont have to worry about the spring anchors as much. 

thanks brian, (you to b&b)


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