# credit cards



## karl klein (Jan 28, 2001)

i was wondering if youm guys thought it was a good idea to accept credit cards or just a waste of money


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## John Allin (Sep 18, 2000)

I think it's a good idea.
We do it.


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## Chuck Smith (Dec 30, 1999)

I too think it is a good idea, but we had no takers in the year we offered the service. Make sure you advertise it well. We had the decals on our trucks, on our contracts and proposals, and business cards.... The company we used charged 3% of each transaction. The percentage drops as your sales increase though.

~Chuck


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## Ohiosnow (Sep 20, 2001)

*Karl*

Credit Cards are OK but in all my years of plowing I've never had anyone even ask so I don't offer. Just one less thing to do for me, a friend of mine has got stung by people with stolen cards (his fault for not checking) he ended up in court to get his money. 
But their are some people who live by charging everything so if you can get a job by having C.C.'s then it might be worth it.


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## Chuck Smith (Dec 30, 1999)

We had our terminal through Novus, and the program was run by Discover card (through their Merchant Services Division). We were able to accept Visa, Discover, and Mastercard. The terminal fee was $12 per month, and then 3% of each transaction.

I am not sure what the rates are now, or if Discover still offers the program.

Another interesting fact.... begining May 1, 2002 you will no longer be able to use Mastercard through third parties. The hardest one to be "hit" will be Pay Pal. They are currently trying to reach an agreement with Mastercard. I will go find the link again and post it here. Mastercard blames it on fraud, and people running up large tabs then saying they never authorized the charges, resulting in chargebacks to merchants.

[Edit]

Here's the link to the article:
http://www.usatoday.com/money/tech/2002-04-19-paypal.htm
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~Chuck


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## Bob V (Nov 29, 2002)

Karl,

I just asked myself the same thing, What about offering credit cards? I only plow and salt, no lawn business. So, I did a search and read the replies and asked myself again.

I think unless I get alot of calls for it, it is not worth the time and money they charge you to offer the service. I will lose time walking back to the truck dialing, waiting to connect then waiting for approval and having to bring the card back to the customer,when I could be plowing or out selling what I have to offer. I would rather do the plow or salt, then bill them from in front of my PC, with my nice hot cup of coffee after the storm.

I really would re-think, I did. Good Luck

Bob V:waving:


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## chtucker (Sep 6, 2002)

Rates for processin just keep getting higher and higher.... But it's cheaper than getting bounced checks.

I do quite a bit of credit card business, in the six figures, and my rates are 1.72, for visa, MC and Discover, 2.0 for Amex. I use a software based POS so I don't have a terminal. My recommendations for that are to lease one for "your" season. If you are doing landscaping it might make sense for a year round terminal. 

If you get any bounced checks, credit cards are the way to go. You ALWAYS no when you are going to get your money. We have experienced almost the elimination of bounced checks in my Pub.


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## cat320 (Aug 25, 2000)

I like the idea of the cards but why do we have to pay anything>When the sale is made they will make the money on the interest that people pay.At leat if they gave you the machine to use with the supplies or made it a small one time fee but they want to rent the machine,charge you a percentage of your hard earned money.We have been doing business for over 40 years with out that and do fine.Could we do better with most defenatly then you got to worrie weather they don't like your service or for what ever reason and have the credit card co. take back there payment. And it's just another job that you have to do each month.


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## Ohiosnow (Sep 20, 2001)

*chtucker*

I think this thread was for if Snowplowers offered C.C.'s as a way of payment.

Yes, you do need C.C.'s for a Pub Biz but I don't think anyone but a handfull of SNOWPLOWERS do.

In 28 yrs of plowing & running a Water Well Pump Biz I've only had maybe 10 people ask to use a C.C. & none for the snowplowing.:waving: And the 1's that did had no problem paying another way.


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## chtucker (Sep 6, 2002)

A couple of reasons to take credit cards as a plower

1) Cash flow, next day in your account for V/MC 2 days for AMEX and Discover.

2) People are trying to earn miles, another selling point for your biz. Don't discount this, their are people myself included that have managed to accumlate over 200,000 miles this way.

3) No worry about a check bouncing. 

4) Towing services do it because poeple don't always have the money when the "need" it. People/Businesses don't always have the money when it snows.

5) In a big city, on a one time job it would be very easy for someone to stick you with a NSF/closed account or stop payment after you leave.

I am of the firm belief that the best part about this business is the money. I like to make it easy for people to give me thier money!

payup 

Most people understand that checks are going to be gone in the next decade, or sooner. They have checking debit cards that are sponsered by MC/VISA that can take the money from their account to yours in the blink of an eye.

It wouldn't make sense to go out and buy a $400+ terminal for some, but for others it would work great to lease one for $10 a month.


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## Bob V (Nov 29, 2002)

Just got a call from a guy who wants me to sign on and start advertising that I take cards.

Yes, all the things that *chtucker* said is true, but the this salesman said my costs are $79.00 amount for the wireless unit, $12.00 a month for air time, 1.49% on all money generated, a free website for 6 months and get this, a 48 month contract.

I told him I am in an area that not only is money hard to find but plastic is even harder to find. This would mean I would do at least 5 to 7 average drives for free before any money would be made. He continued to say if I ran an ad with "Cards Accepted" I would have tons of calls.

My Questions are " Who calls me for plowing in the off months"? and "Why pay a middle man"?

If I can't get paid, Like I read before "I can always put it back"

Sorry,  Not for me!


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## Got Grass? (Feb 18, 2001)

I've never even had someone ask if I take cards.
People pay most of their bills with checks so why not mine?

Direct debit is nice for paying utilities but not for this business.
The larger co's out there accept cards, but I dont see it worth while for the smaller guys.

I'm not willing to give up whatever % so 1 or 2 people can pay w/ a card. just not worth it.


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## Ohiosnow (Sep 20, 2001)

*That's was my point too*

I love the sales guys- advertise & you'll get tons of calls  bull$hit 
Some Biz live by C.C.'s & that's great but snowplowers I don't think so.

And yes is it fair to pas on the charges on to all your accounts because 2 or 3 want C.C.'s I don't think so. Almost all are willing to pay another way.

When the day comes that C.C.'s & Debit Cards are the "only" way to pay then they won't be able to charge us so many extra fees.IMO:waving:

PS: as for Debit cards I like them for somethings but like I've said almost nobody asks to pay that way so why pay the BS fees.


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## chtucker (Sep 6, 2002)

It is easier for me because I already am setup 

There are MUCH cheaper options out there for terminals. I wouldn't use a wireless one. What I would do is hardcopy slips with the old swipe type paper machines and do voice authorizations on you cell/landline phone.

Mail in your bank slips and your only costs are the transaction fees and the card companies share.

Is it for everyone, certainly not, I just was presenting my view point.

Howard


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## Doctordo (Dec 13, 2001)

I THINK IT IS A GREAT IDEA I HAVE BEEN DOING IT FOE ABOUT 6 MONTHS . WE PROCESS IT RIGHT ON THE COMPUTER IT COST LESS THIS WAY INSTEAD OF TALKING WITH SOMEONE ON THE PHONE. IT ALSO OPENS UP MORE WAYS FOR YOU TO GET THE GREEN BACKS


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## cat320 (Aug 25, 2000)

Bob V have him sign a contract that that would Gauranty that you would get many customers.I think that you have to do more to make up for the instant cash and conveinece.


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## Acorn (Dec 3, 2002)

people pay quicker if they have the option to pay by CC. This helps cash flow. I've had a dozen or so repeat customers that called me up with their CC # over the phone. I have a manual CC thingey.


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## Rooster (Dec 13, 1999)

Seems like a good idea, one point to think about. If your customer decides after you leave, that you have done a "bad" job, the customer can challange the amount charged.

Rick


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## chtucker (Sep 6, 2002)

Documentation is the key. You will need to provide service information like time spent at facility weather conditions, person performing the service and equipment used. Information is key. The customer would have to PROVE that you did a poor job..

Keep all your records for at least 6 months as this things come back 2-3 months later.

Howard


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## HLS Wholesale (Dec 10, 2002)

Cash flow, cash flow, cash flow. That's what it's about. I bill at the end of the month and have about 30 customers who leave their cc # on file with me. I just run the numbers through and send a paid receipt to the customer. Usually the money is in my bank by the time they get their receipt. 

It's a convenience to them and a great way to get money quick for me. It also set's you apart from a lot of fly-by-nighters.

I use CLIP VISUAL which also makes it even easier. I'm up to around $20 -25,000 average per month on credit cards. That's a nice chunk of change to get at the end of the month without having to worry about when it's going to come in.

Dan


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## Brother1 (Oct 29, 2002)

*QuickBooks CC Option*

Do any of you guys use the option in Quickbooks that allows you to take credit cards??? We set this up a few months ago but havent used it yet. I was going to do a test run on my own card this week to see if it goes thru ok and if so then I'll start telling customers about it.


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## wyldman (Jan 18, 2001)

I've been stiffed way to many times in the past.Credit cards or direct debit are the only way to fly.

All of our residential and small commercial per push accounts are set up on CC or debit.You can pre-auth the card for a retainer or deposit,or just use it per push.It saves running around picking up payment,bounced checks,or people who don't want to pay afterwards (oh,i don't know why you plowed,it all melted anyways,so why should I pay).It helps sell jobs as most of our stuff is pre-paid only,and a lot of people don't have the cash,but they do have a credit card.It's like on the spot financing.

It is also is nice for those "extra" jobs.we constantly get people asking us to plow,and "I'll pay you tommorow,or I just gotta run to the bank,or will you take a check".Now we swipe the card,and do the job,cash is in the bank next day.It also prints out a receipt for them so we don't have to write one out.

We use a portable,wireless unit,carried right in the truck.Just swipe the card,enter the amount and it prints the receipt.Anybody could use one.Wireless charges are all included in the 49.00 monthly fee.No slips to carry around,no imprints needed,and it does Visa,Mastercard,Amex,Discover,Diners,etc,and all debit cards.If you belong to any association (board of trade,BBB),your discount rates are quite low (1.5 %).There is a flat rate of only .18 cents on debit,no percentage.

I don't think I would ever be without one.It could be used for anything.Cut someones lawn,get paid on-site.Clean up and haul away some trash,get paid....the list goes on and on.Great for odd-jobs.

We advertise it heavily,and most people prefer it now,especially with all the points,air miles,discounts,and benefits people get by using their cards.We have a very large commercial customer would paid his entire season fee,and all his salt billings,on his GM Visa,so he can get the dollars to put down on his next lease.I would estimated it has increased revenues 10-15%.


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## wyldman (Jan 18, 2001)

I've been stiffed way to many times in the past.Credit cards or direct debit are the only way to fly.

All of our residential and small commercial per push accounts are set up on CC or debit.You can pre-auth the card for a retainer or deposit,or just use it per push.It saves running around picking up payment,bounced checks,or people who don't want to pay afterwards (oh,i don't know why you plowed,it all melted anyways,so why should I pay).It helps sell jobs as most of our stuff is pre-paid only,and a lot of people don't have the cash,but they do have a credit card.It's like on the spot financing.

It is also is nice for those "extra" jobs.we constantly get people asking us to plow,and "I'll pay you tommorow,or I just gotta run to the bank,or will you take a check".Now we swipe the card,and do the job,cash is in the bank next day.It also prints out a receipt for them so we don't have to write one out.

We use a portable,wireless unit,carried right in the truck.Just swipe the card,enter the amount and it prints the receipt.Anybody could use one.Wireless charges are all included in the 49.00 monthly fee.No slips to carry around,no imprints needed,and it does Visa,Mastercard,Amex,Discover,Diners,etc,and all debit cards.If you belong to any association (board of trade,BBB),your discount rates are quite low (1.5 %).There is a flat rate of only .18 cents on debit,no percentage.

I don't think I would ever be without one.It could be used for anything.Cut someones lawn,get paid on-site.Clean up and haul away some trash,get paid....the list goes on and on.Great for odd-jobs.

We advertise it heavily,and most people prefer it now,especially with all the points,air miles,discounts,and benefits people get by using their cards.We have a very large commercial customer would paid his entire season fee,and all his salt billings,on his GM Visa,so he can get the dollars to put down on his next lease.I would estimated it has increased revenues 10-15%.


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## Brother1 (Oct 29, 2002)

Hey wyldeman - that sounds like a great idea. How do those wireless units work?? I never heard of them before. I see your in Canada and was just wondering if the same thing works here in the States. I'd like to get some info on how you have it set up so anything u can send my way would be great. I know that I use my AMEX card everywhere since i get air miles on it and I'm sure my customers would do the same thing.


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## wyldman (Jan 18, 2001)

Brother1 - Not sure who makes the unit,but there are a few different types.Saw them first at a local McDonalds.Look kinda like a big cell phone,with a card slot in the bottom.As far as I know they work off the same networks as the cellphones.Only costs me $10.00 more a month than my old wired terminal at the shop,plus I don't need a dedicated phone line like the old unit.All airtime is included.It runs off rechargable batteries,which are included.Only upfront cost was a $75.00 setup fee.Fees and charges may be different in your area.It is so simple to use,and the customer can even swipe their own card,and complete the transaction,for security reasons.

I'm sure if they have them in Canada they must have them in the US.You guys are usually ahead of us up here

Best thing to do is to contact your bank,and they can put you through to a merchant services provider who can hook you up with what you need.

I was just leafing through some of the receipts,and in plowing and salting alone we put through over 10 grand through our machine last storm.This money was in the bank the next day,instead of having to cash checks,deposit cash,and chase down people still owing.I couldn't do without it now.


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## Brother1 (Oct 29, 2002)

Well definately sounds like something we're going to have to look into. That is one of our biggest problems - waiting on the money from people. Thanks for the info - is going to be one of my projects in the next few months to see about getting something like that going.

 Thanks


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## KLMlawn (Apr 18, 2001)

I am not sure if I saw anyone mention that although Credit Cards are a nice way to accept payment ... there is always the possibility of a chargeback ... afterall, the CC company is in the business to charge interest on the charges ... who pays this ... the customer. If they do not side with the customer to a good extent when things are in duspute, they will likely loose a customer and the interest charges they receive.
An NSF check is more of a hassle, but at least it is a firm "promise to pay" and they defaulted. By paying a small fee and taking a little time out, you can sue them in small claims court and usually win. If they don't pay, you can turn it over to the Sheriff's and they will collect or attach the persons property. It may take a while, but I believe you will get your court fees and "normal" interest on the owed amount ... eventually.


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## wyldman (Jan 18, 2001)

Good point KLM

I have never had a chargeback for snow removal operations.I have had a few at our auto shop from idiots who didn't have the money.The credit card company will verify what was done,and if the dispute will require a chargeback.I have never had one stick.If you keep good records,which everyone should right ? You will never have a problem.

Also,most of the stuff the credit cards are handy for is smaller stuff,like call-ins or flag downs,which if you do lose one or two a year,isn't even worth fighting.


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## Superior L & L (Oct 6, 2006)

Ohiosnow;59338 said:


> I love the sales guys- advertise & you'll get tons of calls  bull$hit
> Some Biz live by C.C.'s & that's great but snowplowers I don't think so.
> 
> And yes is it fair to pas on the charges on to all your accounts because 2 or 3 want C.C.'s I don't think so. Almost all are willing to pay another way.
> ...


I was looking at some realy old threads. Funny how this guy talked about if the day comes when debit cards are the only way to pay. Its kind of like that now. I use mt debit card for everything who needs cash


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## baddboygeorge (Oct 20, 2002)

*accept em*

almost all commercial vendors are using plastic its a must for any business these days.


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