# Possible Downgrade



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

I have an 01 chevy 2500HD that I have used it for my lawn biz and doing snow removal on residential driveways and sidewalks. It doesn't have a plow on it i been doin everything with snowblowers and shovels. Lately I have been thinking about downgrading to an S10/Sonoma crew cab 4x4 because for what im doing, I think its too much truck. I work for a another Landscaping and lawn maintenance company full time and do my business part time and I plan on keepin it that way for a while to keep gaining more experience from them. I am also going to school for horticulture and that is about an hour drive from home and work and gas was killing me last year. I talked about doing this before and some of my friends and family was saying that I would regret doing because Ive had the truck for so long and I know everything about and "What if you grow faster than you expect and need the truck to haul more equipment and plow big lots and stuff?" I hear them but at the same time Im just tired of driving this big gas hog around. I love my truck and originally planned on keeping it forever since it was my first ever vehicle period, but know s10s and sonomas are looking real nice especially with gas going back up again.

My question is that : Is there anyone thats been in a similar predicament? And if so what did you do and did you regret it or are you satisfied with what you did?


----------



## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

I would gather some information. How much is this downgrade going to cost you? How long will it take to make back that money by saving gas? If you do it, make sure you can mount a plow on the smaller truck. Good Luck with any decision you make.


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

Thanks for the input.
I have been doing research on everything. Around here trucks like mine with around the same miles(185,000) have been going around $6-7k. S10/Sonoma crew cabs with between 70kmiles and 120-130kmiles have been going for close to the same or less in some instances. I have a relative with a dealers license and he has access to insurance auctions and other auctions exclusive to dealers and hes working to help me out and I might be able to find one cheaper than 6-7k. I had been looking at SnoWays to put on a s10/sonoma. I have seen colorados/Canyons, rangers and s10s/sonomas on plowsite and they look pretty sweet and saw a few of what seem to be successful stories using those trucks.


----------



## STIHL GUY (Sep 22, 2009)

i started out with a ranger because it was my dads but recently switched over to a 2500HD. After using my 2500HD for plowing and hauling mulch nad brush and doing fall cleanups, it is amazing how much more i can do with the bigger truck and i would never go back to a smaller truck


----------



## STIHL GUY (Sep 22, 2009)

i know thats probably not what you wanted to hear but i just dont want you to end up selling the truck and regretting it it could turn out that you sell the big truck and love it and wonder why you didnt do it years ago. i just wanted to give some personal experience. i am also still in school and commuting does suck with the gas hog but the ranger never got much better mileage to make a difference anyways. What they say online your new truck will get for mileage is going to be higher than you actually get in real life scenarios


----------



## TDS Landscaping (Sep 19, 2010)

Want best of both worlds?

Keep your 2500hd and buy yourself an older Geo metro, Volkswagen rabbit, 92 or older Honda civic, etc.. For under $2500. These will get MUCH better mileage than any compact truck (I had a 99 5spd ranger for a while, best MPG i EVER saw was 19, all highway) put a trailer behind it or put 500 pounds in the bed and it plummeted quickly. With an older, high gas mileage car like the ones listed above, you will see mileage around, or above 30mpg and this should more than cover the additional insurance for a 2nd vehicle with the commuting you do.
Plus, i can't speak for what you paid for your 2500hd, but the depreciation you are going to eat by selling it would probably cancel out any short term (2 or 3 year) benefits of a smaller truck. 
One lesson i have learned in life, that anytime i try to downgrade something to "save money" i usually end up right back with what i had, or something bigger/better a few years later. Better gas mileage feels great in the short run, but when you need to/want to upgrade later, if you actually did the math, i doubt you would come out on top. Good luck with your decision!

Thanks,
Jordan


----------



## Sabsan84 (Jan 22, 2009)

TDS Landscaping;1259751 said:


> Want best of both worlds?
> 
> Keep your 2500hd and buy yourself an older Geo metro, Volkswagen rabbit, 92 or older Honda civic, etc.. For under $2500. These will get MUCH better mileage than any compact truck (I had a 99 5spd ranger for a while, best MPG i EVER saw was 19, all highway) put a trailer behind it or put 500 pounds in the bed and it plummeted quickly. With an older, high gas mileage car like the ones listed above, you will see mileage around, or above 30mpg and this should more than cover the additional insurance for a 2nd vehicle with the commuting you do.
> Plus, i can't speak for what you paid for your 2500hd, but the depreciation you are going to eat by selling it would probably cancel out any short term (2 or 3 year) benefits of a smaller truck.
> ...


best advice yet, just get a economical car, a s-10 is not gonna be really any better than the full size truck, not worth the fuel savings, just get a cheap car, 4cylinder!! no more than that, and you are good to go! good luck


----------



## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

TDS Landscaping hit a homerun with his advice. I have a 2011 F250. This is the biggest vehicle and engine I have ever owned and I have been driving for 40 years. I kept my 4cyl. Pontiac Vibe for the exact reason he states.


----------



## 32vld (Feb 4, 2011)

When I was deciding to get a suburban or an s 10 blazer. I did the math and what others have said you won't save much gas by down sizing, and you will take a beating on selling your truck.

Then a s 10 will not take daily heavy use as well leading to more repairs.

As pointed out by a 30+ mpg car to go to school and your job. Use your truck only for your business.


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

Its a big difference between how much it cost and what its worth now (about half). I thought about buying a small cheap car but i have done that a few times and it didnt work out. Stuff was cool first and then out the blue, trans went , then 2nd car trans went again. And second if i got a 2nd car for me then I would have 3 cars to worry about for insurance, (wifes car). And we are both under 25 and our insurance is high as hell now.


----------



## TDS Landscaping (Sep 19, 2010)

You may want to look into changing insurance then.. If it is just you and your wife, a 3rd vehicle should cost next to nothing for only liability coverage. (in insurance companies eyes, a group of 2 people can't hardly get max use out of 3rd vehicle) My wife is 23 and I'm 22, we have 4 vehicles, the 3rd and 4th are older vehicles and thus have liability only, and are less than $25 a month to insure.

Take your time in selecting an older car, don't get one that some high school kid has modded and beat on, find one that is stock and looks reasonably clean. Get it checked out by your mechanic and you should be fine.. Obviously my advice is not for everyone and a stock car that looks clean could keel over in a week. But i have been on this vehicle "roller coaster" going between old trucks and new trucks, diesel to gas and back again, smaller truck to older car for commuting. Unless you are positive you will never do more than shovel and snowblow drives part time, DO NOT buy a compact truck. Trying to find a singular vehicle to fit both ideal business and ideal personal needs is a lost cause in most cases. Its not the 10mpg vs 17mpg that kills you, its the constant buying and selling of vehicles tp fit your current (short term) needs that kills you financially in the long run. 
Again, this is only my opinion based on past experience, best of luck with your decision.


----------



## Triple L (Nov 1, 2005)

By the time u buy the second vehicle and put fuel and insurance in it how much are u really further ahead??? Honestly? Just drive your truck and don't worry about it! I'm sure you got a much better use for 3-7K right now then having it tied up in a second vehicle that's only gonna cost u dollars to save a few pennies... And then, what if something brakes on the car? Now u gotta fix it or put tires or brakes into it...


----------



## TDS Landscaping (Sep 19, 2010)

Triple L;1259872 said:


> By the time u buy the second vehicle and put fuel and insurance in it how much are u really further ahead??? Honestly? Just drive your truck and don't worry about it! I'm sure you got a much better use for 3-7K right now then having it tied up in a second vehicle that's only gonna cost u dollars to save a few pennies... And then, what if something brakes on the car? Now u gotta fix it or put tires or brakes into it...


This would be the 2nd best option, in my opinion.. If you can triple fuel mileage, from 10 to 30 (some of the cars is listed get closer to 40mpg), driving an average of 200 miles per week, at $3 per gallon (low now, but good 3yr average). That would be a monthly savings of $110 a month, even factoring in about $25 a month for insurance. The potential extra maintenance costs of the car would be more than canceled out on maintenance costs saved by the extra commuting miles on the 2500hd. In my experience the upkeep and maintenance cost per mile (not including fuel) to run a compact car is much lower than a 2500hd. (i have owned more than one of these, both gas and diesel, and currently own an 02 duramax) Just in tire wear alone, will save you a bunch. ($700 to $1000 for a set of new tires for the 2500hd, compared to $300 to $500 for a compact) Brakes, starters, fuel pumps, water pumps, etc.. all will be 2-3 times the cost on the 2500. 
If you are looking for a 1 year solution, stick with what you have, just suck it up and pay for the gas. If you are looking 2+ years out, the compact will pay. 
Again, just my opinion


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

My old lady is saying the same thing you guys are saying about the situation. The difference in what I think will be saved wont work out down the line. I was ready to pull the trigger before I made this thread, now have slowed down to think further. I had started looking at different trucks and planning on which one i would buy and all that. Tahnks again for the insight.


----------



## hydro_37 (Sep 10, 2006)

you better do whatever the wife tells you to do

"if momma aint happy...then NO one is gonna be happy...........lmao


----------



## Triple L (Nov 1, 2005)

TDS Landscaping;1259901 said:


> This would be the 2nd best option, in my opinion.. If you can triple fuel mileage, from 10 to 30 (some of the cars is listed get closer to 40mpg), driving an average of 200 miles per week, at $3 per gallon (low now, but good 3yr average). That would be a monthly savings of $110 a month, even factoring in about $25 a month for insurance. The potential extra maintenance costs of the car would be more than canceled out on maintenance costs saved by the extra commuting miles on the 2500hd. In my experience the upkeep and maintenance cost per mile (not including fuel) to run a compact car is much lower than a 2500hd. (i have owned more than one of these, both gas and diesel, and currently own an 02 duramax) Just in tire wear alone, will save you a bunch. ($700 to $1000 for a set of new tires for the 2500hd, compared to $300 to $500 for a compact) Brakes, starters, fuel pumps, water pumps, etc.. all will be 2-3 times the cost on the 2500.
> If you are looking for a 1 year solution, stick with what you have, just suck it up and pay for the gas. If you are looking 2+ years out, the compact will pay.
> Again, just my opinion


I'd love to find insurance for $25 a month for a third vehicle... I have a flawless record and still.... Call your insurance agent before you do anything


----------



## TDS Landscaping (Sep 19, 2010)

Triple L;1260571 said:


> I'd love to find insurance for $25 a month for a third vehicle... I have a flawless record and still.... Call your insurance agent before you do anything


If you were in MN, or even the US for that matter i would be glad to give you my agent's name and number to set you up...I have Auto Owners Insurance, and I get discounts for "paid in full" "non-primary vehicle" (more vehicles than insured drivers) "homeowners" and "accident free" discounts. Things may be different in Canada, but i don't think $25-$30 a month for liability only on a non primary personal vehicle is unheard of around here, in fact i know it isn't.


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

LOL hydro37! my dad always says a happy wife means a happy life.


----------



## Dakota Dave (Mar 3, 2010)

Get A samee Cheep Car for primary transportation and Keep the truck. I bought a 88Cavalier for 400 4 years ago. its needed tires and oil changes. put a new batterie in it when I bought. 35 MPG on a no frills ugly slightly rusty car means the 10 MPG truck gets to stay home unless I need it. My insurance for liability on extra car is only $60 every 6 months.


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

Well I have decided to keep my truck. I am just going to stick it out with her. I am going to go ahead and fix a few things that it needs:

ac compressor
tailgate
get new tires

Im working on getting some nice lawn work that will transition over to snow removal and get a plow.


----------



## Milwaukee (Dec 28, 2007)

I keep big truck for these stuff and use small car like Geo Tracker 4wd for daily driving. It get 30 mpg on hwy.

Look for Suzuki car they FAR CHEAP to fix. it only like $12 brake pads and $15-20 rotor.


----------



## PrimoSR (May 15, 2010)

Milwaukee;1269945 said:


> I keep big truck for these stuff and use small car like Geo Tracker 4wd for daily driving. It get 30 mpg on hwy.
> 
> Look for Suzuki car they FAR CHEAP to fix. it only like $12 brake pads and $15-20 rotor.


If I had a 3 car garage I would do the same thing. Geo Tracker - up to 30mpg, cheap repairs, cheap insurance (I believe in MI you are only required to carry liability insur. in which case on a 2nd 20 yr/old vehicle should be more than $30/mo.) calculate your own personal mpg, miles driven daily, insur. costs, average repair costs, etc...and figure out how long it will take you to break even and start saving money. I would guess it is somewhere between 12-18 months.


----------



## plowguy43 (Jan 2, 2008)

I still have my 96 Saturn SL 5 speed. Talk about cheap to fix and VERY easy to fix as well. I wish all cars were designed like this thing. 166k miles on it and starts everytime without a hiccup and runs smooth. Heck its been parked at the top of my driveway since August and I had to move it this weekend because of water pooling up around it - turned the key and it kicked right over even though the battery had barely any juice left.


----------



## NEWFINISH (Mar 23, 2009)

What about a 4cyl ranger or s10? I had been thinking about if I did get a second car for me that it could be one of these. I would be able to use it to get around running errands and pull a a 5x8-5x10 trailer with a 36" walk behind if I needed to. Or even get a ramp and drive the walk behind into the bed. I was thinking about this cause somedays my route is lighter than other days, or more spread out on some days with a lot of drive time. Also this could be my backup if I needed to do any major repairs to my 2500HD. If its down in the shop for a few days then I wouldn't have to put my customers off or have somebody cut for me. Parts can't be that expensive on these, can they? How good are these gas? Anybody know?


----------



## exmark1 (Nov 30, 2005)

That's the best option! I bought a 2004 F-150 6 Cylinder trying to get better milage, it didn't work. For what I have in the truck to what I am saving driving my diesel it doesn't add up, therefore I am selling the 1/2 ton this week and just driving the other trucks.


----------



## plowguy43 (Jan 2, 2008)

NEWFINISH;1270340 said:


> What about a 4cyl ranger or s10? I had been thinking about if I did get a second car for me that it could be one of these. I would be able to use it to get around running errands and pull a a 5x8-5x10 trailer with a 36" walk behind if I needed to. Or even get a ramp and drive the walk behind into the bed. I was thinking about this cause somedays my route is lighter than other days, or more spread out on some days with a lot of drive time. Also this could be my backup if I needed to do any major repairs to my 2500HD. If its down in the shop for a few days then I wouldn't have to put my customers off or have somebody cut for me. Parts can't be that expensive on these, can they? How good are these gas? Anybody know?


You'd be better off buying a 92-96 F150 I6 with a 5 speed manual. These were great on gas, had plenty of torque for towing, and ran forever. Parts for those model years are cheap, pretty easy to fix, and go forever. Personally I don't think you'd really love a 4 cyl Ranger or S10 - add any weight to them and the gas mileage will plummet.


----------



## 00bluegtp (Jul 13, 2009)

I have a 1994 s10 with a 4.3 6 cyl vortec with a fisher mm1 and a 2002 2500hd with a fisher mm2. The s10 does supprisingly well with plowing but it usses a crazy amount of gas when its put to work. Maybe more than the 2500hd? maybe because it has to work harder. I dont know. but i gotta say one thing. The s10 will menuver like an animal. Thats the only reason i keep it.


----------

