# plow pumps, monarch



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

Im currently building a plow for one of my pay loaders. The plow will be a 12ft scoop plow. Im looking for information on what pump i can use that will hold the pressure. Ive been told anything from an old meyer pump to monarch pumps. Im leaning more towards a monarch pump, i dont need a four way pump, as i will only need to angle the plow left and right. If anyone knows about these pumps will they hold the pressure from the plow and the weight of the snow> Or will it trip the relief?


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Why not just tap into the existing hydraulics?


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

Older loader, not exactly sure where or how tp tap into the existing system. Also this way i could swap the plow between loaders if something loader related was to break.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Can't help with your original question.

I suggest putting in a solenoid valve that would allow you to change the curl to angle with a flip of a switch. You would tap in where the hard lines probably connect to hoses on the arms for the curl function.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

That was my plan. However i thought if i had a seperate pump i could swap the plow from loader to loader. I may end up just putting a diverter valve in like you mentioned.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

You would still have to run power each time, and electric pumps will be slower. You will also add another hydraulic system to maintain.

Put the diverter valve in two (or more) loaders. You will both have a backup and give yourself the option to add a brush grapple or some other function you might need in the summer.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

I might just have to do that. Ill have to find heavier cylinders now is all. Big enough to handle what the loader is putting out.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

You don't need new cylinders, unless they are too small to begin with. Just use an appropriate crossover relief valve if the cylinders aren't rated for the pressure.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

I had planned on using snow plow cylinders since a monarch or simmilar pump is rated for those. However if i tried one of those on a loader system ill blow them out. Cylinders are easy to get however the crossover relief and what pressure it should relieve at is the next thing.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Depends on the geometry you are building and whether you are worried about hitting curbs and the like.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

Obviously has to be strong enough to hold, but weak enough to trip if i got a curb.


----------



## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

You could just plumb in a cusion valve.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Obviously....

So your blade is 12 feet, so that is 6 feet from the pivot. If you catch a curb with that, what force do you want it to push back with. 100 lb will probably be too light, and it will move while pushing. 6000 lb will wake you up in the cab for sure, but also might bend the plow, support frame. 20,000 lb might bend the loader arms. (These numbers are just made up, as I don't know the plow design, loader design, etc.)

Once you establish what you want it to push back at, you need to calculate the force on the ram. For example, let's say you settle on 4,000 lb., and the rams intersect the plow halfway out. The torque will be 4000*6= 24,000 lb-ft. For rams at 3 feet, each, if the rams are both at 45 degrees, then the combined force on the rams will be about 11,300 lb (24000/3* 1.414) This will be generated by the pressure in one cylinder * the piston area + the pressure in the other cylinder * (piston area - Rod area) = Pressure*(2*Area_of_piston-Area_of_rod). That's the pressure that your crossover relief valve needs to be set at. 

So the calculation depends on the plow geometry and the cylinders chosen. Even "snowplow cylinders" would probably work if your relief pressure were set low enough (I have no idea as to their design pressure).

A consideration in the design would be to have the cylinders large enough, or with a long enough stroke so that the plow doesn't move too fast. You can feather the loader valve to move the plow slowly, but you don't want it designed so that you bank it hard enough at the end of its travel to cause damage or premature wear.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

FWIW, I googled around a little, as I couldn't find a pressure spec on angling cylinders. The Meyer E68 pump is set at 2000 psi, and the crossover relief valve at 3800 psi. For the Boss RT3, the crossover relief pressure is 4000 psi. Thus, I don't think you would have any problem using these "snowplow" cylinders for angling if you wanted.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

So there roughly set at 4000 for a regular 8ft plow. The one im building is 12ft in a scoop shape. So i think i could say i would almost double the snow load of your conventional plow. I was thinking starting at 5000 and seeing how it works.


----------



## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Depends on your geometry. If you are wider set or at a different angle, then you may even be at a lower pressure.


----------



## TJS (Oct 22, 2003)

To the OP. Have you looked for one of these valves. This has reliefs built in and you can feed and return back to your existing hydraulic system.


----------



## leigh (Jan 2, 2009)

Randall Ave said:


> You could just plumb in a cusion valve.


Many use these when plumbing plows to loaders,skids etc.http://www.cylinderservices.net/store/#!/Crossover-Reliefs-Cushion-Valves/c/8273219If you're worried about crazy fast plow movement just make the inlet smaller with a flow restrictor.


----------



## bsrservices1 (Oct 15, 2013)

I think im going to go with the diverter style valve, just because its easier to install.


----------

