# Smoke free business.



## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

I have a question for you guys. We are a smoke free company and do not allow employees to smoke on our property or in any of our equipment. I know some of my past employees cant go more than a hour without having a smoke so they would stop and get out and have a smoke break. These breaks add up over a 24 hour period. Second, i cant stand the equipment smelling like smoke and I had one guy who swears up and down to me that he does not smoke in the skid steer, but I cant for the life of me get the smoke smell out of there. He says its just the smell on his clothing that makes it smell in there. I don't like the idea of seeing our equipment sitting in a clients parking lot and one of my guys having a smoke. I don't care if you choose to smoke, its your life, but when your working for me is it wrong to ask for no smoking at all? Just want your guys take on this....I'm sure a lot of you smoke so I will get some negative response on this as well.


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

4x4Farmer;1294630 said:


> I have a question for you guys. We are a smoke free company and do not allow employees to smoke on our property or in any of our equipment. I know some of my past employees cant go more than a hour without having a smoke so they would stop and get out and have a smoke break. These breaks add up over a 24 hour period. Second, i cant stand the equipment smelling like smoke and I had one guy who swears up and down to me that he does not smoke in the skid steer, but I cant for the life of me get the smoke smell out of there. He says its just the smell on his clothing that makes it smell in there. I don't like the idea of seeing our equipment sitting in a clients parking lot and one of my guys having a smoke. I don't care if you choose to smoke, its your life, but when your working for me is it wrong to ask for no smoking at all? Just want your guys take on this....I'm sure a lot of you smoke so I will get some negative response on this as well.


*Your *Company.....*Your* Rules......The largest road paving company in the State of Michigan Has a No Smoking Rule....The ad they run states ......Smokers Need not apply....


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

If the guy is kicking ass plowing snow who cares,he's saving you money by not stopping for a smoke. And yes it stays on the clothes even if they don't smoke in the equipment.


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## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

Matson Snow;1294632 said:


> *Your *Company.....*Your* Rules......The largest road paving company in the State of Michigan Has a No Smoking Rule....The ad they run states ......Smokers Need not apply....


good point! That's how I feel.


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## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

grandview;1294634 said:


> If the guy is kicking ass plowing snow who cares,he's saving you money by not stopping for a smoke. And yes it stays on the clothes even if they don't smoke in the equipment.


I see your point....still don't like the smell in the equipment.


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

4x4Farmer;1294630 said:


> He says its just the smell on his clothing that makes it smell in there.


Introduce him to the concept of a washing machine and coming to work in fresh clothing. It's just like beer, He may not be drinking but if a man's clothing smells of yesterday's after work beer it sure leaves that impression. I don't want my employees or service men standing around my driveway/parking lot smoking cigarettes anyway.

Giving him a SS with out a full cab and heater would be another way to go about it. I was told the smoke gets in the moisture in the heat/AC ductwork and other moisture pockets creating some type of fungi, mold or something. I understand Auto detailers and used car lots use Febrezze to get rid of it. Sorry I don't know anymore details. I just heard a guy ranting about it one day.


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## swtiih (Nov 30, 2008)

from what I see in workers smokers, people who constantly talk on their cell phones, text numerous times throughout the day are consuming your time which adds up to less productivity. My belief is your company your right to the rules.


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## Plow man Foster (Dec 10, 2010)

At worK i dont let any of my guys smoke IN or around our equipment! And if i catch them they know its a suspension! First offence 3 WORK Days.... <<This is because in the winter we dont work everyday! 
I do let them smoke while shoveling though. But i REALLLYYY Dont like it! 

As someone else stated above my 3 guys who smoke are Kick ass plowers! These 3 plow with 2 feet its Crazy but they are really good so its not like i can get rid of them.


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## kcplowman (Nov 27, 2009)

I am a smoker, but I have been thinking about the same thing. I can atleast restrain my self from smoking when im on a site. I do in the truck but it is kinda my truck. I do get mad though when helpers smoke at the jobsite. But my big thing that pisses me off is when they text. Thats my thing that when I see that makes me blow up.


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## Solaris (Jun 22, 2011)

i agree on the no smoking in your machines and your trucks but at the same time, you said it yourself, its their choice to smoke or not, you'll just need to ensure to limit smoke breaks so it doesnt get carried away. I'd love it if none of my guys smoke, but they all do, its gross as hell, but for the most part they are good employees and i'd take a solid employee who smokes like a chimney 100 times over a unreliable or wishy washy one that might not light up on a regular basis.... just my opinion


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

basher;1294648 said:


> Introduce him to the concept of a washing machine and coming to work in fresh clothing..


This is very important. Several guys at work smoke, but they don't smell like smokers. I have customers that come in first thing in the morning reeking like the butt bucket. Hats, jackets, gloves, boots, everything absorbs that stench. And i think some of them are wearing the same jeans and shirts for several days.....

Whatever you decide to adopt for rules, you have to enforce them fairly and consistently. I was at a restaurant the other day and noticed a sign for workers that smoke. They are now required to clock out for a smoke break. If they don't clock out, they will be docked 30 minutes for each break they take.


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## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

Thanks for the advice guys. That gives me some options to think about.


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## rob_cook2001 (Nov 15, 2008)

I do not smoke, and dont let anyone smoke in my personal truck. I agree that anyone who owns a company should be able to make what ever rules they want, that being said i would never tell a employee that he can not smoke weather shoveling, in equipment or if he works on my farm. Now if he makes a mess in the equipment with his smokes that is a whole new story. Sure it can make a big mess but so can people who eat or drink soda in your equipment. Hopping in a machine covered in trash or spill pop will piss me off much more than one that smells like smoke. I have seen smokers that make a HUGE mess. But there are others, my brother will smoke 2packs while plowing for 20hours, the day after the storm he cleans out the truck and you cant even tell he smokes in it.
Sorry for the long post, I just dont like smokers being treated like they are junkies. 
Robert


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

I have mixed feelings too. I look at it like this, While we're in lawn mowing/landscape mode there is no smoking while operating any mower's and no smoking while in the trucks. We only have one guy who smokes and he is very courteous about it. We had a guy a few years ago that smoked like a chimney and before long the truck he ran smelled something fierce and I said something about it and he offered to come in on his own time and clean it out and he did. It still smelled but not near as bad. We also had one idiot one year who I caught smoking in our enclosed trailer while filling up a string trimmer.....that went over well! I don't mind if they get out a few times a night and have a smoke, it probably keeps them awake and gives them a chance to stretch out a bit too so they don't wreck our trucks,lol. I'd rather sacrifice 5 minutes a night then have grumpy, tired guys behind the wheel.


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## MatthewG (Jun 16, 2009)

Aside from plowing I run a commercial flooring business. There are no rules about smoking, however, if they are caught throwing the cig on the ground either by myself, or reported by others, its a $50 fine (deduction in pay)

IMO there is nothing more disheartening then piles and piles of cig butts blown into parking lot corners, flower beds, etc. because smokers use the world as their ashtray.

I wish the $300 littering fine in PA was enforced on cigarette disposal


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## YardMedic (Nov 29, 2006)

MatthewG;1295179 said:


> IMO there is nothing more disheartening then piles and piles of cig butts blown into parking lot corners, flower beds, etc. because smokers use the world as their ashtray.
> 
> I wish the $300 littering fine in PA was enforced on cigarette disposal


I endorse this 100% Thumbs Up


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

I see employers who have such rules as participating in a form of acceptable discrimination. Many who have worked for me smoked. Some were mindful and careful others no so much and butts and burns everywhere. I would rather have an employee who smoked than I would an employee who was constantly talking on their phones, checking their email, texting, surfing the web, listening to music so loud they couldn't here me, taking pictures/videos or posting to forums from their phones, while on my dime. A good worker may have bad habits but can still be a dependable, honest, hard worker making me money. Just my 2 cents.


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## wizardsr (Aug 8, 2006)

MatthewG;1295179 said:


> Aside from plowing I run a commercial flooring business. There are no rules about smoking, however, if they are caught throwing the cig on the ground either by myself, or reported by others, its a $50 fine (deduction in pay)


Be careful. Deducting pay is illegal in most cases in many states.


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## THEGOLDPRO (Jun 18, 2006)

4x4Farmer;1294630 said:


> I have a question for you guys. *My Boss* runs a smoke free company and *My Boss * does not allow employees to smoke on *My Bosses* property or in any of *My Bosses* equipment. I know some of my *Bosses* past employees cant go more than a hour without having a smoke so they would stop and get out and have a smoke break. These breaks add up over a 24 hour period. Second, *My Boss* cant stand the equipment smelling like smoke and I had one guy who swears up and down to me that he does not smoke in the skid steer, but I cant for the life of me get the smoke smell out of there. He says its just the smell on his clothing that makes it smell in there. I don't like the idea of seeing *My Bosses* equipment sitting in a clients parking lot and one of my *Bosses* guys having a smoke. I don't care if you choose to smoke, its your life, but when your working for *My Boss* is it wrong to ask for no smoking at all? Just want your guys take on this....I'm sure a lot of you smoke so I will get some negative response on this as well.


Fixed it for you bro.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

It's funny I know very few people that smoke anymore and none of my guys smoke. It seemed 10 years ago everyone smoked including my dad and I. I can't believe how much cleaner everything stays now. That being said the bigger you get the problems you have finding good guys so I'd rather have a guy that smoked and was a good operator then the other way around.


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

JD Dave;1295230 said:


> It's funny I know very few people that smoke anymore and none of my guys smoke. It seemed 10 years ago everyone smoked including my dad and I. I can't believe how much cleaner everything stays now. That being said the bigger you get the problems you have finding good guys so I'd rather have a guy that smoked and was a good operator then the other way around.


But it says something about a person's ability to set and achieve goals when they have or can quit. I too am a reformed addict and not to sound like I'm preaching but health, money and otherwise I'm glad I did. I also know how hard it is and place a value on a persons ability to do that. I know some (as they call themselves) recovering alcoholics who are the best employee you could ask for.

Perhaps a monetary incentive, $500.00 to any employee who can stop smoker and maintain it for one year? I beat your good operator that smoked could kick it for a nice bonus.

In Delaware many sites are smoke free so you cannot smoke on the job site.


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

basher;1295269 said:


> But it says something about a person's ability to set and achieve goals when they have or can quit. I too am a reformed addict and not to sound like I'm preaching but health, money and otherwise I'm glad I did. I also know how hard it is and place a value on a persons ability to do that. I know some (as they call themselves) recovering alcoholics who are the best employee you could ask for.
> 
> Perhaps a monetary incentive, $500.00 to any employee who can stop smoker and maintain it for one year? I beat your good operator that smoked could kick it for a nice bonus.
> 
> In Delaware many sites are smoke free so you cannot smoke on the job site.


I was a 3 Pack a Day Smoker for 25 years.......I Quit 2 Years ago.....My employer has a program in place that rewards Quitting Smoking......$600 a Year...I get $50 a Month in my Check.......The increase in Productivity makes up for the $600 a Year.....


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

Matson Snow;1295284 said:


> I was a 3 Pack a Day Smoker for 25 years.......I Quit 2 Years ago.....My employer has a program in place that rewards Quitting Smoking......$600 a Year...I get $50 a Month in my Check.......The increase in Productivity makes up for the $600 a Year.....


 I bet you are saving even more not buying cigarettes.


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

4x4Farmer;1294637 said:


> I see your point....still don't like the smell in the equipment.


its not your equipment so what does it matter


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

basher;1295293 said:


> I bet you are saving even more not buying cigarettes.


At $6 a Pack it comes to......$126 a Week.....$504 a Month....$ 6048 a Year.....payup


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

What's going on here.......


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

basher;1295269 said:


> But it says something about a person's ability to set and achieve goals when they have or can quit. I too am a reformed addict and not to sound like I'm preaching but health, money and otherwise I'm glad I did. I also know how hard it is and place a value on a persons ability to do that. I know some (as they call themselves) recovering alcoholics who are the best employee you could ask for.
> 
> Perhaps a monetary incentive, $500.00 to any employee who can stop smoker and maintain it for one year? I beat your good operator that smoked could kick it for a nice bonus.
> 
> In Delaware many sites are smoke free so you cannot smoke on the job site.


I think the bonus idea is a great idea. I find it funny to listen to people talk about how broke they are and they smoke a pack a day.


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## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

THEGOLDPRO;1295217 said:


> Fixed it for you bro.





EGLC;1295302 said:


> its not your equipment so what does it matter


I know that the equipment is not mine...but I am the guy who has to maintain and clean the equipment, there for I treat the equipment as if it was my own. I operate the snow removal side of this company so there for I take pride in the business that I work for and treat it as my own, just the way the boss wants me to...goldpro, we have beaten this to death so I don't know why you waist your time on it.

All good ideas I'm hearing. We have had many smokers work for us and it had never really been a problem till this last year as far as the equipment smelling. I have to run this equipment from time to time and don't want it smelling in there is all. I don't mind if the guys take a break now and then to stretch and stay awake, its just I don't want them having to take a 5 min break every half hour.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

4x4Farmer;1295382 said:


> I know that the equipment is not mine...but I am the guy who has to maintain and clean the equipment, there for I treat the equipment as if it was my own. I operate the snow removal side of this company so there for I take pride in the business that I work for and treat it as my own, just the way the boss wants me to...goldpro, we have beaten this to death so I don't know why you waist your time on it.
> 
> All good ideas I'm hearing. We have had many smokers work for us and it had never really been a problem till this last year as far as the equipment smelling. I have to run this equipment from time to time and don't want it smelling in there is all. I don't mind if the guys take a break now and then to stretch and stay awake, its just I don't want them having to take a 5 min break every half hour.


So I went back and read the first post that says WE ARE A SMOKE FREE COMPANY? But you are not the owner or the boss? You were hired to maintain and clean the equipment? Has your boss asked for your input? Or to report smoking in the equipment to him? If not, do your job and just clean and maintain the equipment.


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## IMAGE (Oct 21, 2007)

Kubota 8540;1295386 said:


> So I went back and read the first post that says WE ARE A SMOKE FREE COMPANY? But you are not the owner or the boss? You were hired to maintain and clean the equipment? Has your boss asked for your input? Or to report smoking in the equipment to him? If not, do your job and just clean and maintain the equipment.


4x4 is The Boss because his Boss trusts him to be the Manager for the snow side of the business. Not sure why you guys are giving him a hard time. He runs the entire winter operations side of the business. He's the guy that does the hiring, firing, routing, and basically runs the whole show when it comes to snow and he's the reason that company is successful at Snow.

Edit: If Jim from ESI says "We are having a sale..." or "We built a new shop..." or "I need ideas to get the shop monkey to work harder..." Would you guys give him a hard time and think he was missrepresenting his position at ESI? No of corse you wouldn't. So why would you guys give a hard time to a guy that manages snow operations for a company larger then both of GoldPro's and Kubota's combined?


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

IMAGE;1295388 said:


> 4x4 is The Boss because his Boss trusts him to be the Manager for the snow side of the business. Not sure why you guys are giving him a hard time. He runs the entire winter operations side of the business. He's the guy that does the hiring, firing, routing, and basically runs the whole show when it comes to snow and he's the reason that company is successful at Snow.
> 
> Edit: If Jim from ESI says "We are having a sale..." or "We built a new shop..." or "I need ideas to get the shop monkey to work harder..." Would you guys give him a hard time and think he was missrepresenting his position at ESI? No of corse you wouldn't. So why would you guys give a hard time to a guy that manages snow operations for a company larger then both of GoldPro's and Kubota's combined?


Not trying to give him a hard time. 1st post sounded like he's the owner. Half way thru he states he was hired to maintain and clean the equipment, he never stated he was hired to MANAGE the snow removal side of a business. Generally always 2 sides to a story, trying to figure out which side this is.


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## IMAGE (Oct 21, 2007)

In post #28 he says he operates the snow side of the business. 

And I know he does, we are from the same town. Also, notice how he is profiled in Pro-tech's video, not the owner of the company? Hmmm maybe because he is the boss and his boss let's him run the show.


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## chs1993 (Nov 12, 2006)

No smoking in any of my equipment!


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

Kubota 8540;1295386 said:


> So I went back and read the first post that says WE ARE A SMOKE FREE COMPANY? But you are not the owner or the boss? You were hired to maintain and clean the equipment? Has your boss asked for your input? Or to report smoking in the equipment to him? If not, do your job and just clean and maintain the equipment.


What the hell does that have to do with anything we are discussing. You are not doing business with the guy, he is not trying to force anything upon you or sell anything.

If he is an employee he must be a damn good one. I want my employees to feel like they are part of the company, that their opinions matter and I try to empower them to be more then just a body that shows up for a paycheck. I want me employees to say "we", "our" and us. I refer to what we do as "we, us and our," I can not do it alone and want employees that have a personal interest in improving our company and making it profitable while satisfying our customers.


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## 4x4Farmer (Sep 22, 2006)

Thanks for backing me on this guys....but as far as I'm concerned this thread can be done! lock it out if you want Sean! Thanks for all the idea's guys!


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## merrimacmill (Apr 18, 2007)

THEGOLDPRO;1295217 said:


> Fixed it for you bro.


I've personally met Nick, and spent some time around him while I was at the SIMA symposium. I can say if he lived around here, I'd hire him in an eye blink for my snow ops. I wish I had more people that would take on his attitude. And yes he does run a sizable operation, need any more proof than this? 




As to the smoking thing, I hate when employees smoke. I don't stop them, unless I feel it becomes out of control and they stop and get out all the time. Huge time waster. I would love to have a smoke free company, but I also don't need one more thing to enforce every day and having to fire good employees over smoking would suck. But at some point I'll be laying out some official plan to deal with this.

And the legal discrimination thing is BS. Like others have said, your company, your rules, etc.. It would be wrong if as the owner of the equipment, I could not choose if people smoke in the equipment or not. I'm sure its a matter of time before they start crying about that though and get some laws tossed at it.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Is hog smoking allowed in your trucks?


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## CGM Inc. (Dec 15, 2008)

Legally up in Canada you are not allowed smoking in a business facility or equipment.

I would love to be a smoke free company but it's hard to enforce even so it is illegal.
If a cop stops you up here smoking in a work vehicle you can get fined! Same at a facility.
I have 2 or 3 Guys that smoke that I really don't want to lose.


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## Neige (Jan 29, 2008)

OMG now I am in trouble, we are one of the companies featured in Project Snofighter, and you can clearly see smoking going on in our shop. Then you have me talking on a cell phone while operating a vehicle. It would be great to have a smoke free policy, and if you are willing to lose some operators go for it. I think all of us have to weigh the pros and cons with operators who smoke. Honestly I cant stand getting into a piece of equipment where someone smoked. But I can less afford to lose that operator, so I tolerate it. I get where Nick is coming from, and if you can do without those operators more power to you. I have a guy that has worked for us over 30 years and still smokes, he cleans up after every outing and you can hardly tell. I have guys who eat munchies and drink coffee that leave a bigger mess in the equipment. We used to put the employees name on the equipment thinking they will take pride and keep it spotless. Well a pig is a pig, check out their cars inside, it will tell you loads about the operator. In the end, for me it comes down to how well they operate the equipment, if they are a dedicated A1 operator then the smoking or being messy is a small price to pay. Something we are going to enforce this season is everyone gets a spotless piece of equipment and have to return it in its original condition. If not there will be a $250 fee to have it cleaned, which will be removed from their final pay. I too have met Nick, and Dan is a very lucky guy to have such a dedicated person running his snow business.


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## bosshogg (Feb 16, 2007)

Hey Nick how about you do what I did when I Managed Smithco for 10 years tell your guys to smoke on there own time not on mine> It seemed to work for me I guess. You just have to get after them. Dan doesn't want allow smoking in any of his equipment so thats it. Talk to you later buddy!


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## Charles (Dec 21, 1999)

4x4Farmer;1295432 said:


> Thanks for backing me on this guys....but as far as I'm concerned this thread can be done! lock it out if you want Sean! Thanks for all the idea's guys!


I will lock it for Sean


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