# Snow and Ice Management-worth it?



## beanz27 (Dec 22, 2012)

I have been thinking about buying John Allin`s book `Snow and Ice Management` off Amazon. Anyone read it or think it`s worth the $35 for it? Not that it`s a large investment but given all the things with him, figured I`d ask....


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## basher (Nov 13, 2004)

The Issues with JA had nothing to do with his knowledge of the industry.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

I think I threw mine away. 

Good book, just have to be careful. He is knowledgeable about the industry, the financial aspect, not so much. Telling folks that cash flow is more important than profit. Cash flow is a close second behind profit. Very close. Unless you're the gov't, you can't operate without either. 

I read one of his articles that it was a waste to have plows on salt trucks. Maybe in some locations, but in areas of high traffic that doesn't move when snow is falling, it would be stupid to not have plows on salt trucks performing double duty. 

Just beware if you do get it, it is not scientific fact, it is his opinion. 

You may also want to ask "Where is he now?"


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## beanz27 (Dec 22, 2012)

Mark Oomkes;1762062 said:


> I think I threw mine away.
> 
> Good book, just have to be careful. He is knowledgeable about the industry, the financial aspect, not so much. Telling folks that cash flow is more important than profit. Cash flow is a close second behind profit. Very close. Unless you're the gov't, you can't operate without either.
> 
> ...


Pretty much what I was thinking, and apparently he is on radio now lol. I think I`ll get it, thanks Mark.


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## beanz27 (Dec 22, 2012)

So reading it so far it seems to brag him up, and honestly I learned MUCH more on this site. Worth buying? Maybe for $20, but not the $33.20 I paid.


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## peteo1 (Jul 4, 2011)

Glad you posted that Beanz. I was thinking about getting that book as well. Maybe I'll keep my $33 and put it towards a good case of beer


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## nepatsfan (Sep 16, 2004)

Ill take my 33 bucks and put it towards lottery tickets so I can quit this sh$tty business


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

Well he's successful whether you agree with him or not. I've heard some of the stuff is good info and some is useless.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Brian Young;1776129 said:


> Well he's successful whether you agree with him or not. I've heard some of the stuff is good info and some is useless.


Where is SMG now?


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## beanz27 (Dec 22, 2012)

Brian Young;1776129 said:


> Well he's successful whether you agree with him or not. I've heard some of the stuff is good info and some is useless.


This is spot on, however, everything discussed is also discussed here, often in greater detail. Worth it for downtime reading, may learn a thing or two, only real benefit I see is Table of Contents instead of a search button.


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

Mark Oomkes;1762062 said:


> I think I threw mine away.
> 
> Good book, just have to be careful. He is knowledgeable about the industry, the financial aspect, not so much. Telling folks that cash flow is more important than profit. Cash flow is a close second behind profit. Very close. Unless you're the gov't, you can't operate without either.
> 
> ...


I would have to agree.


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## DSBI (Nov 22, 2013)

There is some useful information in there. I own both editions, and don't regret buying them. 

Although, I've learned in the snow industry that you essentially pick sides in the whole JA debate. With him or against him. It was a group of very good, helpful, and honest people that told me this so I have to make my assumptions based on that. I was not around in this industry as an owner when the whole SMG thing went down.

I was actually told at one point, directly, that there is a literal division within the industry due to JA.


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