# Kubota l5740/l6060 or John deere 4720 going up hill speed



## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

HI guys! I curently run a kubota m100x with an inverted blower. We have pretty steep hill where I operate. I'm looking at getting a second tractor for next year and I'm wondering if a 60hp Hydro would be able to go up a grade 10 hill in high range, would it maintain speed with a blower on the back of it? Or would have to be in medium range to tackle them. 

The m100x does it no problem with out down shifting and only drop about 1 km/hr.


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## Triple L (Nov 1, 2005)

High range forsure, might drop a couple hundred rpm and 5km/h but nothing to think about changing a range for


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

I agree, we have some steep, long hills here and losing a few km on a machine that only does 27km downhill with the wind behind you sucks
The good news is even if you have to change to low it has a dual speed quick shift lever on the console so you don't have to stop and shift between high and low. Edit: on the 5740/6060


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## Hysert (Dec 16, 2009)

Not quite apples to apples? Our M59 (58hp) TLB has HST, low/med/high with dual speed in each... personally don't like the HST vs the GST I had on the L39.... I'm not sold that you won't notice the steep hills? 100hp forsure no issue, 60hp IMO questionable???


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

I don't like the HST either my 4630 has the gst and I prefer it.
Having said that I only downshifted to low once to make it up a hill and it was a watertower steep SOB that I should have started in low to begin with.


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## Unraveller (Jan 28, 2014)

Hysert said:


> Not quite apples to apples? Our M59 (58hp) TLB has HST, low/med/high with dual speed in each... personally don't like the HST vs the GST I had on the L39.... I'm not sold that you won't notice the steep hills? 100hp forsure no issue, 60hp IMO questionable???


What's GST?


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Glide shift trans

A shuttle for forward and reverse.


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## Unraveller (Jan 28, 2014)

Mr.Markus said:


> Glide shift trans
> 
> A shuttle for forward and reverse.


Why do you prefer it? Apologies for the simple questions, but looking at buying a 60hp for ah inverted next year, and I have a lot to learn regarding terminology...


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

I grew up clutching on older tractors so it doesn't bother me. A lot of the new hydros are complicated meaning theres more to go wrong with them, they add anti stall, auto throttle ect. Great for ease of use that a company with lots of people can train quickly. I don't know if you've ever been on a slippery hill with a hydro unit and panicked and let your foot off the engage but it's quite the pants changer.


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

Thanks guys for all the replies. How does the shifting happen in the Gst trans. Do you need to clutch in to go from fwd to rev.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

boutch said:


> Thanks guys for all the replies. How does the shifting happen in the Gst trans. Do you need to clutch in to go from fwd to rev.


No.

*Glide Shift Transmission (GST Models):* This transmission has a gear drive that has 12 forward and 8 reverse gears. The main benefit of the Kubota Glide Shift transmission is that you never have to use the clutch. You can shift up through all 12 forward gears without ever needing to touch your clutch. Like the hydraulic shuttle shift, you can also shift from forward to reverse or vice versa without the clutch.

Best Uses: This transmission can only be found the Kubota Grand L Series tractors which range from 35 horsepower all the way up to 60 horsepower. These units have all the benefits of the hydraulic shuttle shift and standard gear shift such as not having to hold a pedal down while you're driving. Being able to shift gears without a clutch also means that you can bring your tractor up to speed more quickly. The lack of clutch also makes this a relatively easy transmission to learn.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Mr.Markus said:


> I grew up clutching on older tractors so it doesn't bother me. A lot of the new hydros are complicated meaning theres more to go wrong with them, they add anti stall, auto throttle ect. Great for ease of use that a company with lots of people can train quickly. I don't know if you've ever been on a slippery hill with a hydro unit and panicked and let your foot off the engage but it's quite the pants changer.


I always thought it was entertaining to do that.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Kubota's Glide Shift rocks. I'd much prefer to run it over a hydro in almost all applications for tractors in that size range. 

Baby PowerShift is what it is, with a reverser.


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## Hysert (Dec 16, 2009)

Absolutely! HST works with all the other hydros, so as you enter a pile and use the loader while pushing in your power drops dramatically! The anit stall kicks in and now you can't move!! To much electronic BS, IMO!!


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## Hysert (Dec 16, 2009)

Mr.Markus said:


> I grew up clutching on older tractors so it doesn't bother me. A lot of the new hydros are complicated meaning theres more to go wrong with them, they add anti stall, auto throttle ect. Great for ease of use that a company with lots of people can train quickly. I don't know if you've ever been on a slippery hill with a hydro unit and panicked and let your foot off the engage but it's quite the pants changer.


Our M59 has a clutch too with the HST!! And I still find myself pedelling?? The GST was awesome and I miss it!!


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

John_DeereGreen said:


> Kubota's Glide Shift rocks. I'd much prefer to run it over a hydro in almost all applications for tractors in that size range.
> 
> Baby PowerShift is what it is, with a reverser.





John_DeereGreen said:


> Kubota's Glide Shift rocks. I'd much prefer to run it over a hydro in almost all applications for tractors in that size range.
> 
> Baby PowerShift is what it is, with a reverser.


Thanks John and Markus. With the glide shift can you skip gear once it is moving or it is just like my power shift, got to shift gear one a the time. How smooth is the up and down shift.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

You can jump gears. Not sure if it's recommended or not though. It's a mechanical lever, not push buttons.

Comparing to a GX model M series I'd say the shift is harsher, but still isn't bad. If the tractor is under a load (say ground engaging attachment) there is a delay to let it declutch or whatever, then the shift. Depending on circumstances it can be a decent jolt in that case.

Edit. Unless they've changed things, GST can't be had in a cab tractor. So if you want a factory cab your only option is hydro.


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

John_DeereGreen said:


> You can jump gears. Not sure if it's recommended or not though. It's a mechanical lever, not push buttons.
> 
> Comparing to a GX model M series I'd say the shift is harsher, but still isn't bad. If the tractor is under a load (say ground engaging attachment) there is a delay to let it declutch or whatever, then the shift. Depending on circumstances it can be a decent jolt in that case.
> 
> Edit. Unless they've changed things, GST can't be had in a cab tractor. So if you want a factory cab your only option is hydro.


You are right. I just looked for some gst tractor. In the new series 60 they are only available in rops. I think it the same with previous 40 series and only up to l5040.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Mark Oomkes said:


> I always thought it was entertaining to do that.


Shart yourself...?


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## Hysert (Dec 16, 2009)

Laurin cabs lists a L5740 under the L3130 category??? If you were still interested in that model? Tho the site is vary vague! Mite wanna check them out! Top notch stuff Thumbs Up


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

Hysert said:


> Laurin cabs lists a L5740 under the L3130 category??? If you were still interested in that model? Tho the site is vary vague! Mite wanna check them out! Top notch stuff Thumbs Up


Wow they really do makes some nice cab. As nice as the glide shift seem to work and how few are available plus the trouble of getting a cab, hst seem to be the only realistic option in a 60hp.


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## Hysert (Dec 16, 2009)

Yes they are basically the closest you'll get to a factory cab option, the Sims and curtis cabs are metiocre at best IMO... I installed the laurin on ours and fit and finish was perfect!! Big money tho


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## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Another way to address this question......

As a rough guestimate, rolling resistance can be approximated as 5% of the weight. The force down the hill is equal to the weight times the grade (using the small angle approximation).

F = m*g*(grade+5)/100

So for a 10% grade, a 10,000 kg tractor (including attachments, ballast, etc.) would have a force of
F = 10000*9.81*15/100 = 14715 Newtons.

to get velocity, divide speed in km/h by 3.6.
V = S/3.6
So 25 km/h becomes 6.94 m/sec. 
P = F*V, so P = 14715*6.94 = 102187 Watts
Divide watts by 746 to get hp
102187/746 = 137 hp.

Transmission efficiencies are probably about 85% for anything with a torque converter. so 137/0.85 = 161 hp

Thus, to put a 10,000 kg tractor up a 10% grade at 25 km/h takes 161 hp.

For those of you that prefer the English system, we'll start with the mass of the tractor in slugs... (just kidding, we can use weight in pounds).

F = lb*(grade+5)/100
V = mph*88/60
Power (lb-ft/sec) = F*V
HP = Power/550

So a 20,000 lb tractor going 15 mph up a 10% grade would take
F = 20000*15/100 = 3000 lb.
V = 22 ft/sec
Power = 66000 lb-ft/sec
HP = 120
Engine HP = 120/0.85 = 141

This isn't exact, as the rolling resistance will vary, efficiencies of transmissions vary, there is no wind resistance, etc. 

It will get you close.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Aerospace Eng said:


> Another way to address this question......
> 
> As a rough guestimate, rolling resistance can be approximated as 5% of the weight. The force down the hill is equal to the weight times the grade (using the small angle approximation)


 I am gonna try this formula the next time I'm sliding into the ditch wiping my.....


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## Aerospace Eng (Mar 3, 2015)

Not recommended, as it would be worse than texting, but will address the OP's question.

Look up the tractor weight, blower weight, plow/loader weight if applicable. Guess a velocity and check. If you have enough HP, great. If not, you will slow down.


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

Aerospace Eng said:


> Not recommended, as it would be worse than texting, but will address the OP's question.
> 
> Look up the tractor weight, blower weight, plow/loader weight if applicable. Guess a velocity and check. If you have enough HP, great. If not, you will slow down.


Thanks for the formulas. L5740 with a 80 inches inverted blower and some front end balast it come to about 6000 lbs. Calculation come to 42hp to tackle the hill. Hydro tractor might have a bit more lost but look like it should be ok.


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