# SuperTarget got what they paid...LOL



## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

Chicago southside: Tinley Park IL

this is in a large area that we do, the complex is about a half mile by a have mile and Target is one of the largest stores there

We do NOT do Target, just the smaller lot within the common drive plus everything on the other side of the drive.

i will upload the video later, these pic's are taken on Thursday morning when all the stores have reopened, its about 9 am and hasn't snowed in 20 hours

look at their saying, EXPECT MORE. PAYLESS...PRICELESS


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

here are some more


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## GMC Driver (Sep 9, 2005)

WOW!

I know there's always room for improvement, and those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones - but if we did that at our sites, they wouldn't be our sites.

Incredible - piles in the cart corrals and handicap spaces. Not a stitch of salt.

Wonder what the contract price was? I hope they didn't get a 10 cent job for a buck.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

i have video from friday, it was still just as bad. having trouble uploading pic's


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## kipcom (Feb 3, 2001)

Looks like a great place for me to go shopping and slip & fall...humm Im thinking "retirement" funds payup JK

Expect-more & Pay-em LESS

Your gonna work for peanuts....and LIKE IT

Work harder....not smarter ?


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## JTVLandscaping (Jan 1, 2010)

Guys in pick up trucks shouldn't do a loader's job...and this is coming from a guy with a pick up truck. Know your limitations. I'm just assuming they're not using the proper equipment...what are they using?


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

JTVLandscaping;1231395 said:


> Guys in pick up trucks shouldn't do a loader's job...and this is coming from a guy with a pick up truck. Know your limitations. I'm just assuming they're not using the proper equipment...what are they using?


they have a skid and a loader....up loading video's of thrusday am and friday night now


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## bristolturf (Dec 20, 2008)

looks like by the tire marks im seeing and the real lack of height to the piles, probably a skid loader with a pusher. That place looks like crap.


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## Lawn Enforcer (Mar 20, 2006)

Wow, what a friggin' joke. Just asking for a lawsuit there...


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## rcr4w (Jan 21, 2011)

While I understand it's a super crappy job what is the point of more pictures or video? I assume they got what they paid for or they would have had another contractor in there to do it right. We have some accounts who only want the lot pushed 1 time no matter how much it snowed at least that way in court they can say it was plowed and salted if it wasn't for the fear of being sued they wouldn't plow it at all. As bad as I hate to admit it I am sure we had some look that bad or worse "except we clear out the handi's and never pile snow around the kart corral" but thats what they want done and all they are willing to pay for so what else are we supposed to do?


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

and nobody was on site...

in the last pic, thats our side of the lot...their is no break or parking islands, just a line of site, they even push a coral on to our side


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

rcr4w;1231423 said:


> While I understand it's a super crappy job what is the point of more pictures or video? I assume they got what they paid for or they would have had another contractor in there to do it right. We have some accounts who only want the lot pushed 1 time no matter how much it snowed at least that way in court they can say it was plowed and salted if it wasn't for the fear of being sued they wouldn't plow it at all. As bad as I hate to admit it I am sure we had some look that bad or worse "except we clear out the handi's and never pile snow around the kart corral" but thats what they want done and all they are willing to pay for so what else are we supposed to do?


they didnt even plow it once in some area's....things are done right in chicago


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## NW Snow Removal (Oct 12, 2007)

1olddogtwo;1231430 said:


> they didnt even plow it once in some area's....things are done right in chicago


yes they are. this is a city where people don't want to see snow on the ground. they want bare pavement.


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## rcr4w (Jan 21, 2011)

Well apperently not!! Well around here these places simply don't build enough into their budget and don't have the money to pay it. Not talking about the super giant stores more of the mom and pop strip malls. Then we have snow like this year and they are really crying the blues.


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## diesellandscape (Jul 17, 2009)

Haha. You know someone had the seasonal contract... Seen a big snow... Started.. Realized "hmm the 18k I'm getting for this 30k job just isnt worth it". Stopped. And now this... Someones doing the target I had for a few thousand less and at this point in the year i'm sure they have over half the contract cost of salt. 

One day they will see the light. Its not worth sitting on 10,000 wirth of salt for 60 days. (NOT to mention fuel & insurances).


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## blowerman (Dec 24, 2007)

Every post about skidloaders being able to clear big lots, but that it just takes more time: that only holds true for lighter snows. When it comes to big drifts and deep snow, you need the right equipment for the job. (wheel loaders)


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## shooterm (Feb 23, 2010)

Thats awful and a product of people plowing that have never plowed. We had almost the same problem at a local Sams club where we got called to stack every three days after a event. Store Manager said it was coming out of the contractors pay because it was clearly stated stacking with a loader is required. We even got threaten by the guy in his plow truck because he said he was going to stack it himself( with his pick-up?). Anyways he was kicked off the job and know for a fact our hourly loader cost more then he could of made.

Have to add the more I look at it , its just a lack of common sense and general organization skills. All they'd have to do is drive to the next strip mall take look how everything is piled and copy it.


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## rcr4w (Jan 21, 2011)

Oh there's no doubt sometimes people get in over their head's with seasonal contracts thats why we don't do them. My point was that if it wasn't what they paid for you would think a store like Target would simply make a call and have it done right and let their lawyers handle the deadbeat contractor.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

blowerman;1231452 said:


> Every post about skidloaders being able to clear big lots, but that it just takes more time: that only holds true for lighter snows. When it comes to big drifts and deep snow, you need the right equipment for the job. (wheel loaders)


bingo.....


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

thrusday morning....friday night still uploading


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## Pinky Demon (Jan 6, 2010)

You get what you pay for.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

friday, 2 1/2 days after it stop snowing....






and yes i suck at making videos.....


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## hamm8232 (Nov 5, 2009)

guys like that need their keys for equip taken away


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## Pinky Demon (Jan 6, 2010)

I like your truck and the air horns are a nice touch. :laughing:


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## Dr Who (Dec 16, 2010)

Other then the really tall piles of snow(compared to our snow fall amounts) it looks like just about every large parking lot/mall type lots here. Granted they do salt some of them, but the way they plow looks the same, just put that snow were ever and hit partand leave the rest. 

I love the snow in front of the basket parking thing, be heck to get carts in there!

I think the first shot (expect more pay less) is priceless! that is a great!


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## Omran (Oct 10, 2009)

good vidio, man that target is really really bad. and your lots are really clean, very good job on yours.


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## JTVLandscaping (Jan 1, 2010)

from your video, it looks like they at least salted it finally, that's a good start. Some guys are slow learners, maybe we're all just being impatient, LOL


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## wannabeplowing (Feb 9, 2008)

HAHAHAHA I can't believe they left a lot looking like that, the company I work for did the target in Fargo here for the last couple years and they were hands down the most demanding account we had we would have been fired immediately if we ever left it looking like that. I can't believe someone was ok with leaving a lot looking that bad!!


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

Dude that was awesome!!!! I wish I had someone that bad here to say..."go with us!...not the other guy" Good marketing for ya!....

I watched all of both of those videos lol...not working until 10 today and then I get to do the opposite of what those guys do once snow gets here haha.

Did anyone catch the cart corrals? Were they bent from pushing or was that just me?! All I know is that a cart is like 2-300 bucks a pop to replace up here and we have built corals and they COST $1200 easy per one side like that installed.....

The bad pushing and snow is probably the contractors fault in this case, although sometimes it is caused by massive traffic flow (some people drive crazy around plowers) issues. The rest was probably the Property Management company not telling them to do stuff or not paying up for it.

To be totally honest I could do a much better job but no one will pay me to do it.... that is why I have a massive hold harmless in my contracts for those people. If they won't allow us to use our own discretion on de-icing product, then we will not cover ANY part of their property and we state that boldly on contract and then a separate waiver on those ones. These guys here prolly either a)aren't equipped or b)aren't paid to do this job. I see both all of the time in this industry.

I was putting down sooooo little material on lot that I needed to use my WB spreaders to lay that little this year... needless to say those contracts have the waiver.

The economy and inexperience are, after-all, why we don't get paid professional wages like certified installers and plumbers ect. do.

Good job on the lots btw. and what air horn setup did you put on that truck? I want it now lol.... my father would be proud (he is a fireman)


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## SNOWLORD (Aug 10, 2007)

We have the same thing going on here. Whats funny is when we used to do the supertargets here, if we missed one pebble of snow I would get a call, and nowdays there is snow everywhere and they seem to not care. They must have 2 sets of rules.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

SNOWLORD;1231959 said:


> We have the same thing going on here. Whats funny is when we used to do the supertargets here, if we missed one pebble of snow I would get a call, and nowdays there is snow everywhere and they seem to not care. They must have 2 sets of rules.


 they do have two sets of rules...

1) do your job to the T rules.... meaning....
-You get babysat
-You get harassed by the property manager
-You get paid wayyyyyyyyy late

or

2) Don't do your job.....
-You get paid promptly
-The property manager kisses your behind
-They lawyer up and stand clear
-You get your pants sued off over a claim

No one read you those rules your first day here on PS?! what a bunch of slackers lol! 

it's kinda a now-er-later kinda thing.


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## SilkKnitter (Apr 2, 2008)

Looks like an easy account to get for next season. Send them the tapes with your bid and enjoy.


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## dayexco (Oct 30, 2003)

i'll bet i can write the script of what's happening there...


the national service provider..."i think we are all aware of who handles the bulk of the target stores".....had a decent contractor for that site...they beat him up on price, and contracts that screwed him like a house cat...that the good contractor said fug it...took his beating, and is lying off in the corner licking his wounds somewhere. in a panic...the national service provider grabbed the first $10 hooker off the street corner in hopes of them getting them off. this is the end result. it'd also be my guess...the store manager is peed off, the national service provider isn't paying for services for the lack thereof, and the "so called" contractor who left that mess, is overwhelmed, and soon to be broke. 

but that's just my guess

oh by the way....they all lived happily ever after. we think, wait for the sequel


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## dayexco (Oct 30, 2003)

SilkKnitter;1231982 said:


> Looks like an easy account to get for next season. Send them the tapes with your bid and enjoy.


you've never worked with the national service provider in question, have you? for the most part, the local store manager has NO influence on who gets hired for the outside services. and the national service provider probably get a chuckle out of the tape, and the bid...and file 13 both of them. but that's just my guess after dealing with them.


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

dayexco;1232223 said:


> i'll bet i can write the script of what's happening there...
> 
> the national service provider..."i think we are all aware of who handles the bulk of the target stores".....had a decent contractor for that site...they beat him up on price, and contracts that screwed him like a house cat...that the good contractor said fug it...took his beating, and is lying off in the corner licking his wounds somewhere. in a panic...the national service provider grabbed the first $10 hooker off the street corner in hopes of them getting them off. this is the end resort. it'd also be my guess...the store manager is peed off, the national service provider isn't paying for services for the lack thereof, and the "so called" contractor who left that mess, is overwhelmed, and soon to be broke.
> 
> ...


So elegantly spoken, you have a real way with words. Maybe you should write greeting cards.


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## dayexco (Oct 30, 2003)

WIPensFan;1232239 said:


> So elegantly spoken, you have a real way with words. Maybe you should write greeting cards.


why thank you...i've just been on the receiving end of how they treat their contractors. i felt like going to a rape crisis center after my dealings with them.


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## WIPensFan (Jan 31, 2009)

dayexco;1232248 said:


> why thank you...i've just been on the receiving end of how they treat their contractors. i felt like going to a rape crisis center after my dealings with them.


:laughing: Sorry to hear you got screwed, never wish that on anyone. I've never dealt with any nationals, nor will I ever.


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## Eronningen (Dec 20, 2008)

One can only wonder if this national provider deal will ever "run its course". Part of me really thinks it will not. One can only count on locally owned business to work for as they are the only ones demanding quality.
Your chain stores, franchise stores and the suits running them off site are only looking at the numbers and bottom line. And with these contracts they are getting contractors to sign basically holding the stores and the national provider harmless would slip and fall lawsuits even bother them???


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## 496 BB (Feb 11, 2010)

1OldDog......Coming to a lot near you for inspection :laughing:


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## tjlands (Sep 29, 2005)

Sad but oh so familiar story. 
Nothing will come of it, most likely, other than the poor sap that took it on will be replaced with some other small in-experienced company .This all after some pretty voice on the other end working for the National company talked this under-manned under equipped company to take on the site with the promise of gold at the end of the winter. Now he will be out of the job and will not get paid for the many many hours he tried to do the best he could with the wrong equipment. 
I have been on the receiving end of those phone calls oh so many times the last couple of years only to mislead them into thinking I would bail them out. 
Who's fault is it really? The guy who should have know better or the company that talked him into it?
Does anyone really think the Target people care? I have two of them by me and both are a disgrace. Especially around the Holidays last year. 2ft of snow 12/20 and Christmas eve they were still a disaster.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

too bad this didn't happen the week before christmas...might have been a big deal then


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## snowman5313 (Jun 19, 2009)

old dog you sob...I should have done that to the stores I lost. Do to a F up on my part I lost 3 big stores. Anyways, there was snow everywhere for a week and no sign of the plowers. They were to busy doing other work to worry about getting the job done.


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## 04tundra (Jan 30, 2011)

i wouldnt drive around so much in that parking lot, people might think that your the one who plows it!  LOL

good work on your side!payup


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## goinggreen (Dec 1, 2010)

I bet usm runs that property. I work for target in michigan and i tell you our lot is always clean dont ever have to call the plow guys just got a dusting of snow last night and was salted this morning. I think it all depends on who is running tohe show at the stor i know that would not have been acceptable at my store. I think you should really send in the tapes to our headquarters so they can see


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

496 BB;1232716 said:


> 1OldDog......Coming to a lot near you for inspection :laughing:


well for one, i take great pride in the work i do as well as the company i work for. We employ over 500 people on any give storm.

I will not name the company doing the work or lack of, i will just say that they are not a newbie's by any means. Their are other lots around here that also will look as bad or a worst after a snow event. It does matter if its 2in or 24 inch's's. This is my guess on this one.

national company says: Here are all these stores, can you do them for this price? Sure we can....Now the contractor thinks what are the chances of Chicago having a 4th year in a row with 50+ inches or having a 20in storm....and yes I also never would have thought so too. Now these guys have bit off more then they can chew....They don't have the man power or wisdom to handle this..or worst they dont care

There was plenty of warning and all the stores if not most had closed by Tuesday 6pm. The snow stopped by 2pm on Wed and these pic's were taken about 8am on Thursday( i thought it was 9am). There is never a reason to push snow in to the cart bin's, or pile up on the front islands and leave it there or in the middle of the drive lanes. They had all of Wednesday and that night do to the clean up,plus Friday.

there just is not a reasonable excuse.

Here are some other pic's from a large mall. Once again heres a parking lot that that we do and someone else does for a national company

our half is on the left








looking from ours








ours








other guys








nice


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## Stik208 (Oct 19, 2004)

The Sears one doesn't look too terrible little salt and a little cleanup would be alright. The Target lot on the other hand is horrifying.


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## Westhardt Corp. (Dec 13, 2009)

Just wow. I worked with an outfit that had several Targets a few years back, and that is simply unacceptable. Oh, and the kicker? We had no loaders--not one. Story was the MC wouldn't pay for it, so we had skids with 10' pushers and trucks. Wasn't my money, so I just kept guys on it until it was _done._ The few times we had an issue, I spoke with the Facilities Manager for Target--in person. Still have his card, actually.

Hmmm....


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

Any chicago contractor will tell that bare payment and curb's showing are the standard's here.

On that sears store, it had stop snowing 6 hours earlier and the store was opening early for X-mas shopping.

That crap gives us all a black eye.


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## blowerman (Dec 24, 2007)

While the pictures are a good example of bad service at the Target, what is the point you are trying to make?
Why don't you find out who is in charge and go after the account... Nationals change contractors all of the time. Get them to hire you and problem solved. Perfect service from here on out!


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## Westhardt Corp. (Dec 13, 2009)

1olddogtwo;1233936 said:


> Any chicago contractor will tell that bare payment and curb's showing are the standard's here.
> 
> On that sears store, it had stop snowing 6 hours earlier and the store was opening early for X-mas shopping.
> 
> That crap gives us all a black eye.


I believe the term is "black & wet", sir.


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## CGM Inc. (Dec 15, 2008)

Wow! what a crap job


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

blowerman;1233944 said:


> While the pictures are a good example of bad service at the Target, what is the point you are trying to make?
> Why don't you find out who is in charge and go after the account... Nationals change contractors all of the time. Get them to hire you and problem solved. Perfect service from here on out!


Great Point......Go get the account if your so concerned about it.....I think if you dig a little deeper you will find the reasons why these lots look the way they do....The Target Store is just terrible work....But i think it all boils down to Price and what the National is willing to accept in terms of Service verses Price....


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## Dissociative (Feb 28, 2007)

nobody can afford to pay for decent snowplowing anymore..so they say....too many VPs with nice cars to pay off...

the storage places by me all went untouched until *saturday morning*...

.kinda sucked having salt and stuff in there behind 5' of snow....

needless to say...i am scheduled to meet with the regional manager to discuss contracts for next year on 10 properties after a 60min phone call where i told her what "could" be done with the right contractor. And how she is getting bent over by the one who left the entire storm to pile up for 4 days and now is charging T&M on bobcats at 150/hr to clean up his own mess...she was a little pissed to hear about my 10 properties that stayed fully functional and open all through the storm...


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