# Heres a good one guys, PRICING



## ews101

Either Im nuts with my prices or people are just straight up crazy. How much do you guys think a Bank of America, 120000 sq ft parking lot. 2000 sq ft sidewalks, calcium on the sidewalks and salt every push would go for. Seasonal price. we usually have to go out 34 times a year is the average here. 1 inch trigger. there is a real narrow driveway about 800 feet long with a curb on ur left side and you have to clear out the loading docks. other than that it is pretty striaght forward. Just wanna see what you guys think it will take to do it and how much.


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## Camden

I give up, how much?


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## grandview

Toaster with every plow?


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## jb3nh

Bank of America just contacted me as well. Reading thier contractor plow specs. they have a zero snow policy. Not sure if that's what you got in thier email as well, but keep it in mind. Too much for me to handle.


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## big acres

I'll take a guess... about 10-11k. About 7 in plow/shovel 4 in salt/ice melt. How much?


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## ews101

I went in at 30k they have bids as low as 15k. must be a guy with a pickup truck, no insurance, and a grass seed spreader to spread salt.


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## big acres

ews101;613810 said:


> I went in at 30k they have bids as low as 15k. must be a guy with a pickup truck, no insurance, and a grass seed spreader to spread salt.


pricing is regional... but at 34 visits you are at $882 per occurence for a quarter acre lot with about an hour and a half of walks?

I just bid a restaurant, Applebees. about the same size with at least as much sidewalk. One inch trigger (about 20 visits annually), mow 24x, spring/fall clean-ups, 3 fert/wc, 2 pruning (lots of shrubs) AND MONTHLY (7) lot sweeepings... guess how much it is being done for?


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## cretebaby

120000 sq/ft = 2.75 acres


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## 042500hd

big acres;613830 said:


> pricing is regional... but at 34 visits you are at $882 per occurence for a quarter acre lot with about an hour and a half of walks?
> 
> I just bid a restaurant, Applebees. about the same size with at least as much sidewalk. One inch trigger (about 20 visits annually), mow 24x, spring/fall clean-ups, 3 fert/wc, 2 pruning (lots of shrubs) AND MONTHLY (7) lot sweeepings... guess how much it is being done for?


$25k. Gotta let me know if I'm close.


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## ews101

yea its close to 3 acres, 2 trucks 2-3 hours each and one man clearing sidewalks and applying calcium. 900 bucks a time with salt, applied to whole lot and calcium applied to sidewalks is a good and fair price in my eyes. If someone want to do it for 15k and make a few bucks thats cool, I would rather sleep and not woory about wrecking my equipment.


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## ews101

haha its kinda funny with a name like big acres he doesnt know how many sq ft are in a acre


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## Camden

ews101;614069 said:


> haha its kinda funny with a name like big acres he doesnt know how many sq ft are in a acre


He most likely read it as 12k not 120k. Mistakes happen, get over yourself.


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## big acres

Camden;614101 said:


> He most likely read it as 12k not 120k. Mistakes happen, get over yourself.


Thanks Camden... yeah, read it as 12... 43,560 per acre. Now his price looks good, and makes my 10-11k for 12,000 just about right imo. I agree $15k is ridiculously low.


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## big acres

042500hd;613842 said:


> $25k. Gotta let me know if I'm close.


As I mentioned, I misread the bank as 12k sq ft, not 120k... saw bank and assumed branch, not a largge office building.

So the Applebee's comparison was compared to 12k... and it is currently being done for about $4k year for lawn and snow, about half of my proposal. When the manager told me that they had just started with them this spring, I said "I am a bit worried for you on a one inch trigger this winter... call me if you have any problems, we do the bank next store and have equipment there on a dusting".


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## ews101

Actually Camden you get over yourself. I was breaking balls. You say mistakes happen, well hopfully that mistake doesnt happen twice while you are reading a bid requirement and you bid it wrong because you made a mistake.

As for 4000 a yr for snow and lawn, your nuts, that is 75.00 a week, so you know you are going to be there ever week at least, mowing, plowing or salting. Its gonna cost you more in labor, fuel, insurance. Equipment, than you are going o make, but than again this goes back to the every guy with a pickup truck and lawnmower thinks they are a landscaper.
Even $8000.00 is too cheap.

I know the guys who do the applebees in my area and they get 35k, landscaping, snow removal and sweeping


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## Camden

ews101;616304 said:


> I was breaking balls.
> 
> Yes, I know that. It's not your place and that's why I called you out for being a *********.
> 
> You say mistakes happen, well hopfully that mistake doesnt happen twice while you are reading a bid requirement and you bid it wrong because you made a mistake.
> 
> I don't know anyone who would blindly bid on a property without checking it out in person. Even if someone mistakenly reads it as .25 acres in the bid packet they'll quickly realize it's 2.5 acres upon arrival at the site.


Happy Monday


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## LIBERTYLANDSCAP

ews101;613460 said:


> and you have to clear out the loading docks. .


I've never seen a bank w/ a loading dock

I wish mine had one, so I didn't have to make multiple trips with a wheelbarrell to make depositsxysport


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## big acres

ews101;616304 said:


> Actually Camden you get over yourself. I was breaking balls. You say mistakes happen, well hopfully that mistake doesnt happen twice while you are reading a bid requirement and you bid it wrong because you made a mistake.
> 
> As for 4000 a yr for snow and lawn, your nuts, that is 75.00 a week, so you know you are going to be there ever week at least, mowing, plowing or salting. Its gonna cost you more in labor, fuel, insurance. Equipment, than you are going o make, but than again this goes back to the every guy with a pickup truck and lawnmower thinks they are a landscaper.
> Even $8000.00 is too cheap.
> 
> I know the guys who do the applebees in my area and they get 35k, landscaping, snow removal and sweeping


ews101... I'm glad your prices help the price curve in this industry, and yes, the Applebee's is an agressive bid by my standards even at $8k. As you have seen, we are all under pressure on our prices... you just lost one on price, right?

If you feel the need to break balls, go ahead. Like alot of guys, I check out this site late at night to unwind... after a long day I read it as 12k, which you should agree is fairly strong pricing -for 12k. This is very different from sitting down to do a bid.

As you can see on this site, guys will speak up if someone is bashing another, and most guys are pros who are here to share ideas and learn. I didn't take offense at your one-liner... but you can always search a memebrs post to determine their experience level before calling taking a jab. If I wanted to return in-kind, I would call you "junior"... due to your whopping four posts here on PS. But, for all I know you run a multi-million dollar company... and who knows... maybe I do too. Good luck this year, and welcome to PS.


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## deadogwalkin

Gentlemen- now that is class (Big Acres), oh and look he is from Minnesota!!


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## ews101

To the poster who stated they never saw a bank with a loading dock. Well This bank Is a processing center and they get Large amounts of paperwork from other branches.

And also to MR Cocky. who says its not my place to break balls... Get over yourself...

As for pricing. the reason why you can open up the newspaper and see ads for seasonal contracts, 300.00, 350.00 residential is because some people in this business are just plain stupid. I rather bid high and get 75 percent of my bids than get them all. Also most of those low ballers wont even show up after a while.

As for the Bank Job it was offered to me at 25k because they wanted a business that was reliable and had the proper insurance which for this particular location is 5,000,000.. thats 5 Millon. I told them 30K was my bid and I wont budge. I know they are in a jam bc those lowballers were people they called out of the newspaper that do not have insurance.

Well we are about to get a nor eastern tommorow and wedsday so it will be intresting to see what happens.....


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## big acres

I am truly amazed... ews101 has a 75% closing ratio at top dollar, so an annual growth rate of 75%! You should get out of plowing and become a sales guru -even they will tell you that those numbers are untouchable in an industry that is largely tied to the three-bid process. Is that 75% growth rate by adding three accounts to your existing four?... that is surely doable I guess.


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## tom_mccauley

big acres;617273 said:


> I am truly amazed... ews101 has a 75% closing ratio at top dollar, so an annual growth rate of 75%! You should get out of plowing and become a sales guru -even they will tell you that those numbers are untouchable in an industry that is largely tied to the three-bid process. Is that 75% growth rate by adding three accounts to your existing four?... that is surely doable I guess.


*touché*


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## ews101

see this is why I never post because some people are so stupid. I look at it like this, people dont mind paying, if they know they are going to get good reliable service they will pay a extra 100.00 a season or a few thousand in the commercial market. Since there is such a competion and most of the low ballers cant afford newer equipmant, Equipment breaks down they cant afford to go out if its a bad winter. cant pay for fuel. than guess what the customer gets screwed and they remember that and the smart ones dont always go with the lowest bid in a 3 bid process.

As for 75 percent of my bids signed. It is true say I bid 10 jobs i usually get 7-8. It has nothing to do with new growth since some contracts go for 3 years and some go 1. So every year I may Be bidding on the same accounts. 

Im so glad I have 3 new accounts to my existing 4. Luckily for me The 4 I already Have pay very well I make 500.00 off of them for working all winter long, I wish I had more Like you Big acres I bet your the man with your chevy s-10 with a 6 foot plow. Diddnt your mommy ever tell you, dont wake the sleeping bear.


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## Camden

ews101;617160 said:


> thats 5* Millon*


Is a "Millon" more or less than a G'Jillion? I just need to make sure my insurance policy falls within industry standards.


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## big acres

Ews101... you know I've agreed with most everything you've actually said on a factual basis. It's just the way you say it... so damn abrasive. We are all a little bitter about lack of price integrity in our market this year, but you are wearing it on your sleeve man.

I'm not sure what the bear comment is supposed to mean... I get it, but wtf does it mean here? Sure there are guys with S-10s... there is a market for them, but we are all quick to point out when they are in over their head. I'm no bigshot... maybe you are, but I can say that I am soley responsible for keeping a company owned fleet of over 30 pieces moving all year long -none of the model years start with a "1" either... How 'bout you? I guess when you bid over 200 properties, you can't hit 75% closing ratio.


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## Superior L & L

If you are closing 75% of "cold" calls then you need to raise your prices. If they are your current mowing customers that doesn't count!


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## TEX

well pretty much all i can say is wow


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## cornbinder

EWS. what are you doing?? you must not want to be welcomed here on the site the way your talking to people. chill out!! it's gonna be a long winter with lots of snow. (hopefully) welcome to plow site. don't piss everybody off. later, pete


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## plowtime1

Did you ever... know... you are my... her..o? lol


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## Niteman9

3 acre bank lot. I have never seen a bank with that big of a lot.


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## plowtime1

Fellow plowers,

Don't sweat the small stuff..everyone has different overhead costs and its not about lowballers. regardless of anyones bids its about CAM.


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## elite1msmith

i think i would be in the 19-22 k range


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## Neige

ews101;617160 said:


> To the poster who stated they never saw a bank with a loading dock. Well This bank Is a processing center and they get Large amounts of paperwork from other branches.
> 
> And also to MR Cocky. who says its not my place to break balls... Get over yourself...
> 
> As for pricing. the reason why you can open up the newspaper and see ads for seasonal contracts, 300.00, 350.00 residential is because some people in this business are just plain stupid. I rather bid high and get 75 percent of my bids than get them all. Also most of those low ballers wont even show up after a while.
> 
> Wow, I thought I was doing really well till now. My residential is 270.00 - 300.00, I must be an idiot. I own all my equipment, and most of it only gets used for the winter months. Looks like I will be losing even more money since I have increased my residential to 2800 clients.:crying: I better stop taking on more.
> 
> As for the Bank Job it was offered to me at 25k because they wanted a business that was reliable and had the proper insurance which for this particular location is 5,000,000.. thats 5 Millon. I told them 30K was my bid and I wont budge. I know they are in a jam bc those lowballers were people they called out of the newspaper that do not have insurance.
> 
> Oh no, thanks for pointing out that 5,000,000 is 5 millon, I thought it was 5 million. Looks like you think your a big shot when you have that kind of insurance. Big deal, if your willing to pay for it you got it, we ve had it for 3 years now. Means absolutely nothing about our competence, just costs more. All it took was a 3 minuet phone call to up it from 3 million, to 5 million. I am sure the bank will ask for proof of insurance, all my big accounts do. I would price your bank for 12 grand + $250 a visit for salting. Most likely lose it to someone in the 8 grand range, salting included.
> 
> Well we are about to get a nor eastern tommorow and wedsday so it will be intresting to see what happens.....


 You have alot to learn Jr. and your people skills suck. I figure while your pricing accounts you must be bad mouthing your competition. Not how I run my business. Anytime your up near Montreal, drop by for a visit, you can buy me lunch and I will show you how stupid I am.


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## big acres

Neige;620754 said:


> You have alot to learn Jr. and your people skills suck. I figure while your pricing accounts you must be bad mouthing your competition. Not how I run my business. Anytime your up near Montreal, drop by for a visit, you can buy me lunch and I will show you how stupid I am.


Neige... is that your fleet, or a tractor dealership next door? lol


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## Luther

ews101;617509 said:


> competion equipmant Diddnt your mommy ever tell you, dont wake the sleeping bear.


We can only hope and pray you hibernate like one and we don't hear from you until Spring.


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## ews101

Its cool, not trying to sound like a *******. Just have a lot of beer money snowplowers killing the market. I dont do mowing. I am mostly into sealcoating, striping and crackfill. Commercial and residential.

All I am saying is I would rather sleep than give away plow accounts. I Have around 50 residentials and 20 commercial lots. I raised prices up this year and got rid of some accounts.


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## big acres

ews101;620990 said:


> Its cool, not trying to sound like a *******. Just have a lot of beer money snowplowers killing the market. I dont do mowing. I am mostly into sealcoating, striping and crackfill. Commercial and residential.
> 
> All I am saying is I would rather sleep than give away plow accounts. I Have around 50 residentials and 20 commercial lots. I raised prices up this year and got rid of some accounts.


That's good enough for me guys...ews101 has a clean slate in my book. Again, welcome to PS.


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## Superior L & L

ews101;620990 said:


> Its cool, not trying to sound like a *******. Just have a lot of beer money snowplowers killing the market. I dont do mowing. I am mostly into sealcoating, striping and crackfill. Commercial and residential.
> 
> All I am saying is I would rather sleep than give away plow accounts. I Have around 50 residentials and 20 commercial lots. I raised prices up this year and got rid of some accounts.


Did you say BEER!!!


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## Neige

Me to, welcome to PS. The invite to Montreal still stands, and I will buy you lunch.


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## plowtime1

Perfect! now lets go make some dollars


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## redman6565

ews101 do you know capnsac? has he offered you to plow at a Target with him? sounds like you two would get along great...


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## ews101

haha your soo funny


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## redman6565

sorry i couldnt resist


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## ews101

come on now that guy is just straight up nuts if he thinks 2 people could plow 6 targets with 2 plowtrucks, salt, shovel etc...... He would be lucky if he could handle 1 store 1-3 inchs with what he has.


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## redman6565

well with that comment you just moved up in my book! haha no but seriously, just busting balls is all.


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