# Help Me Understand Salt/Sand Measurements



## XJ1517 (Oct 7, 2014)

One of my new clients requested that I do salting. It's a 0.5 mile laneway with about a dozen houses off of it (dirt road). They'll need it sanded about 4/5 times per year. I figure it's a good excuse for me to finally get a sander and maybe offer the service to my other clients. 

I picked up a larger tailgate spreader to do the job. I tested it out with regular sand and it worked great. 

I got a quote from a local sand/gravel company. 

"Our price for Pickled Sand is $50.00 per yard plus taxes and delivery, with a minimum charge of $50.00. Delivery is via a triaxle truck, which can hold approx. 25 yards of pickled sand. Therefore, it would be dumped directly from the box of the triaxle truck. Delivery prices vary depending upon the location of delivery, with the majority of the area at a delivery price of $90.00"

How much does one yard typically yield? Is there any sort of formula or rule of thumb for this?

Thanks!


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

You could start here.
http://www.fredburrows.com/calculator/calc.html

I plugged in depth of .01 ( that was the minimum allowed), half mile about 2640 feet, then how wide the rode is
Steve


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Not sure what "pickled sand" is as I use straight rock salt on all my accounts. I would assume that it is what we call salt/sand mix here, either 50/50 or 60/40 blend of the two? Anyways, a 1yd bucket (level fill) of straight salt is roughly 1 ton of salt, so I would assume a mix of salt and sand is roughly the same weight, although again, I don't do sand, so you might want to ask your vendor who is selling it to you for clarification. But if my above figures are correct, then 1yd is 1 ton. MOST guys lay salt down at anywhere between 750-1000 lbs per acre, depending on numerous variables. Treated salt can be used at lessor amounts. Use the search box, many threads previously on how much to use. Hope this helps.

Edit: You might want to start out buying bagged salt by the pallet. Although price wise, it will be a little more expensive than buying in bulk, it will be MUCH easier to handle in the bed of your truck and much easier to load into the spreader. Then, if you grow your sales of this service and find that you have more customers wanting it, then you can graduate to a v-box and bulk. Just know that that comes with a whole slew of its additional requirements, where to store, keeping it dry while stored and how to load from pile to truck.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

derekslawncare;2068474 said:


> Not sure what "pickled sand" is as I use straight rock salt on all my accounts. I would assume that it is what we call salt/sand mix here, either 50/50 or 60/40 blend of the two? Anyways, a 1yd bucket (level fill) of straight salt is roughly 1 ton of salt, so I would assume a mix of salt and sand is roughly the same weight, although again, I don't do sand, so you might want to ask your vendor who is selling it to you for clarification. But if my above figures are correct, then 1yd is 1 ton. MOST guys lay salt down at anywhere between 750-1000 lbs per acre, depending on numerous variables. Treated salt can be used at lessor amounts. Use the search box, many threads previously on how much to use. Hope this helps.
> 
> Edit: You might want to start out buying bagged salt by the pallet. Although price wise, it will be a little more expensive than buying in bulk, it will be MUCH easier to handle in the bed of your truck and much easier to load into the spreader. Then, if you grow your sales of this service and find that you have more customers wanting it, then you can graduate to a v-box and bulk. Just know that that comes with a whole slew of its additional requirements, where to store, keeping it dry while stored and how to load from pile to truck.


Does salt work on a non paved surface?


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Philbilly2;2068511 said:


> Does salt work on a non paved surface?


I don't know why it wouldn't other than you may have to apply a little heavier or more often depending on how crowned or soft the road is due to run off. Maybe one of the guys on here that plows dirt can chime in.


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## Freshwater (Feb 28, 2014)

A yard of salt weighs 2500lbs not 1 ton. Wet salt can weigh closer to 3k.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

derekslawncare;2068528 said:


> I don't know why it wouldn't other than you may have to apply a little heavier or more often depending on how crowned or soft the road is due to run off. Maybe one of the guys on here that plows dirt can chime in.


Sand is much better then salt on gravel. It just roughs up the surface to make it not slippery and still allows you to plow it without gouging in all the time. Plowing a salted gravel lot the next time when its been salted is a complete mess. For our shop yard I go buy sand when needed and I have 300 ton of salt generally on hand.


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

We dont use ice melt of any kind on gravel,
just sand/cinders/ clinkers.

As mentioned it makes soft spots and mud.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Freshwater;2068536 said:


> A yard of salt weighs 2500lbs not 1 ton. Wet salt can weigh closer to 3k.


All I know is that when I used to buy from a competitor, when they loaded me with their skid with the "big bucket" (1yd), they charged me the one ton rate per bucket loaded. Now when I say level bucket, I mean they would drive into the pile curl and raise bucket about 18-24 inches off the ground so that sides were level and then shake bucket so that anything above top edge would spill out, then load what was left. They considered that 1yd/1ton of salt. Obviously, if you are loading "heaped" buckets, that is more.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Glad a few of you that do gravel chimed in.


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## leigh (Jan 2, 2009)

A yard of sand weighs 2750 lbs.A dry yard of bulk salt weighs 2000lbs. I salt one gravel lot with so-so results. A common mix is a 6-1 mix of sand to salt.Havent used in years but would custom mix it depending upon temps.I would spread it about 1/3 more than I now spread salt. Works well,leaves a mess in spring on paved lots. You're looking to cover a little over an acre so maybe figure a ton on the high side.


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

Salt on gravel....
The salt burns a hole threw the snow.
Does littel to melt the snow or ice.
Unlike pavement where the brine breaks the bond the snow and ice has with the pavement it soaks in to the gravel.
This loosens up the gravel causing a mess,even in the dead of winter.

Plow Early don't let the snow set or get driven on and raise/remove the shoes , after the ground has frozen .


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## Freshwater (Feb 28, 2014)

Freshwater;2068536 said:


> A yard of salt weighs 2500lbs not 1 ton. Wet salt can weigh closer to 3k.


Sorry read the wrong line in my book. Read for dirt. 
Salt is 2025- 2160 per cubic yard. Based on 75-80 per cubic foot. Depending on moisture.


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## Lone Wolf Ent (Oct 18, 2006)

We figure a yard of salt averages 2000 lbs. We do a school bus lot that is mostly gravel. For that lot I mix 1 yard of salt with 4 buckets (10,000lbs) of sand. Gives a 10 to 1 ratio that will not freeze easily and makes the ice porous and the sand is instant traction.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

SnoFarmer;2068605 said:


> Salt on gravel....
> The salt burns a hole threw the snow.
> Does littel to melt the snow or ice.
> Unlike pavement where the brine breaks the bond the snow and ice has with the pavement it soaks in to the gravel.
> ...


Bingo - Thumbs Up


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## lfaulstick (Sep 7, 2009)

we do alot of gravel roads/driveways we never use salt, as stated before makes a Huge mess especially when spring thaw comes seems to take base right out of road.

we use straight sand, cinders, peagravel, or peagravel/sand mix...it is a pain pile always freezes if job is to far away it freezes in spreader.

It is nice though when it gets well below freezing you can spread it out and keep busting it up and it kind of freeze dries the moisture out and it wont freeze as bad in spreader going down the road.

years ago used to do alot of access road, and they wanted limestone chips and we used to use window washer fluid in sprayer and load spreader in small amounts and spray every layer to help from freezing up..worked well, but a gallon didnt go very far.


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## XJ1517 (Oct 7, 2014)

Wow. Alot of great info! I do alot of residential driveways that are paved, but my clients who have laneways/roadways which are gravel, it seems I'll be better off to sand them. 

"Pickled Sand" as they call it here is a sand/salt mix. I may just ask them for a load of sand. Is there a certain type I ask for? Fine? Coarse?

Thanks again!


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## Snow tracker (Jan 31, 2014)

Coarse sand works best for traction. We mix a small amount of rock salt or calcium chloride into the sand to keep it from freezing. Sand will hold water and freeze hard without it. The little bit of salt does not mess up the gravel like using all salt on gravel.


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## XJ1517 (Oct 7, 2014)

So I googled Pickled sand and this is what it said: 

"Pickled sand is a homogenous mixture of abrasive sand and sodium chloride (NaCl) at a salt concentration of about 8%."

Think this will be good for my gravel road clients? Doesn't look like its a high concentration of salt.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

XJ1517;2072647 said:


> So I googled Pickled sand and this is what it said:
> 
> "Pickled sand is a homogenous mixture of abrasive sand and sodium chloride (NaCl) at a salt concentration of about 8%."
> 
> Think this will be good for my gravel road clients? Doesn't look like its a high concentration of salt.


Previous Responses:



Philbilly2;2068511 said:


> Does salt work on a non paved surface?





JD Dave;2068538 said:


> Sand is much better then salt on gravel. It just roughs up the surface to make it not slippery and still allows you to plow it without gouging in all the time. Plowing a salted gravel lot the next time when its been salted is a complete mess. For our shop yard I go buy sand when needed and I have 300 ton of salt generally on hand.





SnoFarmer;2068546 said:


> We dont use ice melt of any kind on gravel,
> just sand/cinders/ clinkers.
> 
> As mentioned it makes soft spots and mud.





derekslawncare;2068554 said:


> Glad a few of you that do gravel chimed in.





leigh;2068595 said:


> A yard of sand weighs 2750 lbs.A dry yard of bulk salt weighs 2000lbs. I salt one gravel lot with so-so results. A common mix is a 6-1 mix of sand to salt.Havent used in years but would custom mix it depending upon temps.I would spread it about 1/3 more than I now spread salt. Works well,leaves a mess in spring on paved lots. You're looking to cover a little over an acre so maybe figure a ton on the high side.





SnoFarmer;2068605 said:


> Salt on gravel....
> The salt burns a hole threw the snow.
> Does littel to melt the snow or ice.
> Unlike pavement where the brine breaks the bond the snow and ice has with the pavement it soaks in to the gravel.
> ...





Lone Wolf Ent;2068919 said:


> We figure a yard of salt averages 2000 lbs. We do a school bus lot that is mostly gravel. For that lot I mix 1 yard of salt with 4 buckets (10,000lbs) of sand. Gives a 10 to 1 ratio that will not freeze easily and makes the ice porous and the sand is instant traction.





Philbilly2;2069947 said:


> Bingo - Thumbs Up





lfaulstick;2069991 said:


> we do alot of gravel roads/driveways we never use salt, as stated before makes a Huge mess especially when spring thaw comes seems to take base right out of road.
> 
> we use straight sand, cinders, peagravel, or peagravel/sand mix...it is a pain pile always freezes if job is to far away it freezes in spreader.
> 
> ...





Snow tracker;2072613 said:


> Coarse sand works best for traction. We mix a small amount of rock salt or calcium chloride into the sand to keep it from freezing. Sand will hold water and freeze hard without it. The little bit of salt does not mess up the gravel like using all salt on gravel.


Pretty sure everyone has clarified what to use.


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## tbi (Sep 30, 2007)

Freshwater;2068536 said:


> A yard of salt weighs 2500lbs not 1 ton. Wet salt can weigh closer to 3k.


You must be buying water logged salt because I've never had it weigh up that much and I buy clearlane.


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## tbi (Sep 30, 2007)

XJ1517;2072595 said:


> Wow. Alot of great info! I do alot of residential driveways that are paved, but my clients who have laneways/roadways which are gravel, it seems I'll be better off to sand them.
> 
> "Pickled Sand" as they call it here is a sand/salt mix. I may just ask them for a load of sand. Is there a certain type I ask for? Fine? Coarse?
> 
> Thanks again!


I prefer stone dust or 1's as the sand around here is very dirty.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

tbi;2081092 said:


> You must be buying water logged salt because I've never had it weigh up that much and I buy clearlane.


My thoughts exactly. In my area, a 1yd bucket properly (level) loaded is considered 1 ton.


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## XJ1517 (Oct 7, 2014)

I can see that, but the question I was alluding to was if 8% salt is too high.

Some people said they don't use salt. Does that mean 100% salt? 50%? 10%?

I want something that will provide traction, but not sand that can freeze rock solid. The supplier I contacted said that people use the sand/salt mix is so that it doesn't freeze. Where I live, every year it'll come close to -40*F/-40*C for a solid week or two and will constantly be below freezing for 3 months+. I don't want to deal with the hassle of the sand chunking up where I store it and in my spreader.

I'm from a smaller town and the 3 suppliers I called don't sell bagged sand or salt. It's straight out of their pit. They'll either deliver in a tri-axle or I can pick it up.



Philbilly2;2073983 said:


> Previous Responses:
> 
> Pretty sure everyone has clarified what to use.


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## BillyRgn (Jan 28, 2004)

If your gonna buy sand in bulk your probably going to want to add at least 100 pounds of salt per yard of sand to prevent the pile from freezing, even covered some moisture will get in the sand and turn it into a rock if you don't have some salt in there


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## Salty Sands and Supplies (17 d ago)

Good Afternoon. 

We own a pickled sand supply company in Northern British Columbia. We put up about 1400 cy of material last fall. We experienced a week of -35C to -40C temperature and our formulation of blended salt and 5/16" material was not frozen at all. Our loading equipment froze up. But when its that cold for that long, nothing is moving and is having new snow. Our formulation is less than 6% salt. Our blend is generally used on parking lots mostly. Our customers, the guys with sanders in the back of their trucks and F550's love it. because it does not freeze up in their hoppers. When we were down. some of our clients went to the competition, that does not have salt in the mix, was not happy as it turned into a solid mass in the hopper at -35C.

We are about 60% of our original stock pile. thinking of putting up another 400 CY. in the next few weeks. but have to thaw out some frozen material. 

Keep up the good work and making winter safe.


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