# Nebighor troubles, need help.



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Live on a private sand road, has lots of problems with drainage so it has to be plowed in a specific way. The guy that plows for the town is an idiot and cant plow for spit. I got my own plow so it can be done right. The town guy still plows the neighbors and leaves a bank at the mouth of there drive that spills over and pinches the way to us off and he pushes snow on top of what I already plowed. I always have to go back and clean up after he plows and some spill gets in the mouth of the neighbors drive. I missed out on 4 snow falls so the first time I plowed they got buried, went to finish up my place before I cleaned them out and I got a unpleasant phone call from them so I had a few words with him and told him I'd take care of it this time, but I wont plow for free after this. Well they haven't gotten plowed in the last 2 snowings, was about 8" and we were having trouble getting through so I go to knock it down a bit, hit the wrong button and send snow in there drive. Lowered the plow to the height of the snow that was in the drive and scoped it out best I could without going on there property, said they don't pay me to plow and they don't want me to plow, also I would be trespassing at that point. Well there is no reasoning with them and they just cant understand it, not even that I already plowed it out. Well they seem to think I'm doing it on purpose and came over yelling they cant get into there drive, gave me a shove and he was totally ready to fight, the wife was holding him back. told them I would plow what went in there out and I would make a contract but they said no, but they expect me to plow it all the time. Plow them out anyways, but they still get stuck cause there's 8" and they haven't been plowed in 2 storms. They aren't the most balanced people, one min. hes trying to start a fist fight, then next they tell me to come over for some beer and pot, buddy buddy crap. 
Well we are land locked and that road is out legal drive (we have an easement), there legal drive should be on the other road but they use ours because it's already there. Well I don't see any way of working with these people and there's always going to be some spillover in by them, so I'm at a lost on what to do with this. 
Wondering how you would handle this if it were you ? 

Thanks for any help or thoughts to this.


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Heres a photo of what it looked like the first time I scoped it out and the bit that was left from trying to get the bulk of it out.


----------



## Joe D (Oct 2, 2005)

Why not just back in their driveway and push the mesh out to the road then clean it up?


----------



## salopez (Apr 11, 2004)

I have the same problem.

just keep it clean and go about your day. try to plow to the left the whole time to minimize what is left on their drive then clean up.

think about it...they call the cops for treaspassing, they show up and see that you helped get them out in bad weather... the cops will not do anything so long as you are keeping everything clean. so don't pile snow in the way which could impede an emergancy vehicle!

good luck! might as well get some free beer out of the deal!


----------



## mycirus (Dec 6, 2008)

I dont see the problem. I would just plow normally and let them deal with it. I know on my street when the plows come by it ends up on my driveway, and my neighbors and so on. Its what happens. Its up to them to worry about it themselves. My town plows dont clear driveway after each pass or at all for that matter.


----------



## REAPER (Nov 23, 2004)

I would charge him with assault the second he gave me a "shove". 

Then I would start plowing the windrow to the right to show em what it could be like.


----------



## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

Why do you let them use your easement?


----------



## ColliganLands (Sep 4, 2008)

if its legally your street then its too bad for him if the approach to "his" driveway gets filled in
that being said you could plow everything to the left and avoid getting huge windrows in his driveway.
or you could take the whole street and pile it in his driveway (just kidding)


----------



## Mick (May 19, 2001)

Something is wrong here (actually several somethings). Each landowner and separate property should have an easement to a common driveway/private road (also utility companies should have easements). The town is piling snow, blocking entrance to a private road? You're piling snow, blocking another person's driveway? People aren't getting plowed for several snowfalls? Do you live here? Why don't you plow each snowfall on your own portion? Driveways can easily be back-dragged to take care of windrows that would be left. Why do they expect you to plow their driveway for free? Is it actually your property that you rent to them?

Just too much confusion in your post.


----------



## richard.bessey (Dec 27, 2008)

*Get a camera*

Security camera's, suddenly make people behave. Keep your cool, be a nice guy, and keep the camera's running 24/7 on your property, the road, and even in your truck if you can.


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Things are pretty screwy around here, and easements are over looked and even built on with full knowledge. I would plow it for them but as they told me they don't want me to plow it, I wont. I had a nice talk with someone else on my block last summer at one of his properties and then a week later a cop shows up to give me a trespassing ticket. Without a contract or anything I wont go on any ones property and risk getting cited for trespassing and property damage should anything happen or I dig into the ground, cops also agreed on that I could get cited for plowing them. I was thinking about the assault thing, but with how strange there acting I don't want to push anything. With how the drainage is the snow has to go on the right, when I get by them I angle the blade the other way so they don't get much in by them, but they still complain about it. I have been thinking about plowing the whole easement and showing them what a real windrow looks like and just tell them I'm not there plow guy not my problem. 
Here's a picture of the lay out of the drive, the blue is our easement which is about a quarter mile long, the red is there legal access, but they never put a drive in there, they just use ours because it was already there.

Thanks for all the replies.


----------



## ColliganLands (Sep 4, 2008)

ok so if you own the road 1 why is the municipality plowing it and 2 if you have to plow it to the right for drainage then its really not your problem if it goes in their "driveway" what do they think happens on every other street. i know when we go by we make no effort to avoid filling driveways thats just what happens it goes in the opening not your problem unless you were also his plow guy.
tell him nicely that its not your problem and its naturally occuring my guess is the cops will side with you if it goes that far.
good luck


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Mick;691853 said:


> Each landowner and separate property should have an easement to a common driveway/private road (also utility companies should have easements). The town is piling snow, blocking entrance to a private road? You're piling snow, blocking another person's driveway? People aren't getting plowed for several snowfalls? Do you live here? Why don't you plow each snowfall on your own portion? Driveways can easily be back-dragged to take care of windrows that would be left. Why do they expect you to plow their driveway for free? Is it actually your property that you rent to them?
> 
> Just too much confusion in your post.


We own the 2 lots at the very end of the road and live on the one, they own the lot before us. There legal access is off of the public road on the other side of their house. 95% of the snow I plow stays on our land and I am not leaving any big piles blocking the other drives. They pay the town to plow then, who has a 4" or 6" trigger so it can be a few snow falls before they even come out to plow and when they do they pile the snow at the corner of there drive and it spills over and starts to narrow off the drive to us.


----------



## cj5 (Apr 26, 2005)

Its not clear - do they have permission for you easement? Your easement is a driveway, not
a county road..


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

ColliganLands;692321 said:


> ok so if you own the road 1 why is the municipality plowing it and 2 if you have to plow it to the right for drainage then its really not your problem if it goes in their "driveway" what do they think happens on every other street. i know when we go by we make no effort to avoid filling driveways thats just what happens it goes in the opening not your problem unless you were also his plow guy.
> tell him nicely that its not your problem and its naturally occuring my guess is the cops will side with you if it goes that far.
> good luck


We do not own the road, just have an easement, but it gives us the legal right to cross everyones property to get to our place. The township here plows driveways for $40 a year so thats why there plowing it. I tired to explain that the snow that spills in there drive is because the guy that plows for them makes a big bank at the front of there drive that spills over and blocks us off, but they wont hear it.


----------



## ColliganLands (Sep 4, 2008)

well then just keep doing what your doing and if the neighbors plow guy is blocking your easement then you can probably involve the police if thats the route you have to take


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

cj5;692341 said:


> Its not clear - do they have permission for you easement? Your easement is a driveway, not
> a county road..


Yes it is a driveway and is not a town road. It is a private road and the township will not maintain it unless you pay for it. We are land locked and are the only ones to have an easement, and they dont have permission to use it as an easement. there drive should be on the township road thats on the other side of their house, but they put their drive off of our easement. I informed them of that but they couldn't care less.


----------



## Mick (May 19, 2001)

Ok. I'd say you should check your state laws and/or consult a lawyer. Way too complicated for a forum like this.


----------



## Kenyou (Oct 13, 2007)

Just for the heck of it, I would have the police come out and see what the county plow does and then show them what you do to clear your right of way. Then when this guy goes nuts and calls them for a complaint, they will know all of the story. He may go nuts with you but I don't think he will do that with the cops, or then they will know he is a fruit cake. Good Luck!


----------



## jkiser96 (Sep 19, 2006)

If that is your easement I would start putting railroad timbers along the edge of YOUR drive for landscaping purposes. If they get mouthy then I would have them wrote up for trespassing on your property. I have a similiar situation with our neighbors that just moved in a few years ago, we extended the culvert & filled the ditch in & then they started driving out that way after they cut the fence. My son was playing one day by the barn & this a$% hole comes flying out & almost hit my son so I dug the culvert out without him knowing and that night he tore the front suspension out of his truck & tried sueing me but the judge said no go he did not have a permit to use it as a drive & 100% his fault. Stand your ground but also watch your back.


----------



## bula_1984 (Dec 22, 2008)

Johnny where in wisconsin you live, sounds like our neighbor also, but we live on a private drive.


----------



## zabMasonry (Oct 13, 2007)

F em; If you got the rights to the driveway and they don,t act like their driveway ain't even their. If they own the land that part of your driveway is on, tell em that you got the right to keep the driveway clear, and you will do that, if they got a problem you should tell them you are more then happy to clear the windrow out of their driveway.


----------



## KarlG (Jun 6, 2007)

Although you are entirely in the right to plow your easement as you see fit and leave a windrow, as you stated in the title of your post you have neighbor problems. That is never a good thing, because you have to live next to these people. You would be much better served to talk to them nicely and work a mutual arrangement out. You could angle away from their drive on the way past, or take a few extra minutes to back drag and pile the end you go past. Looks to me like it could be done in a variety of ways including a back in and push out, just angle away in that section, or coming from both directions just push to either side like the town guys. Bottom line, although you are the one that is right, it will require minimal work on your part to keep peace with your neighbors 


Good Luck!


----------



## jomofo (Apr 26, 2008)

On our mountain, that sh*t doesn't fly. People who don't plow and complain about it get a driveway full of snow.


----------



## Sno Biz (Nov 19, 2008)

I have the same problem on some of the condos that I plow. The garages are in the alley and in order to plow the left side of the alley you always get some snow in front of the garages on the right. I just tuck in the snowbank I create. havent had any complaint in 5 years. If I were you, I would do what you do, then back into his drive and push out the pile you created. it will take you a few extra pushes, but you have to live next to the guy...its worth not having to worry about it.


----------



## 4u2nv (Jan 29, 2008)

I say plow it like a public roadway... angle to the right plow going in... plow going out. Windrow on both sides, who cares about his driveway. I myself live on a private way that I plow and do it the same way. The driveways get snow on the ends... I myself, like and get along with my neighbors, there are 5 of them total here... so I clear the ends of the driveways for them. But it sounds like your guy doesn't want you "trespassing" so I say leave the snow there... if he was nicer about it I'd clear the end for him but since he has threatened you I'd leave it all there. I'd never angle the plow the other way either... if it was a public way he would have to clear it, the town wouldn't.


----------



## Jdeerekid (Nov 9, 2008)

I agree with most of the other posters. I would plow it just like any town,city, or state plow would. If he doesnt have permission to use the easment any way he cant complain about it. Do you get alon with your other neighbors?? Does he get along with them?? If they dont want him on the easment get them all involved and get the police involved if he threatens or pushes you again. You have bent over backwards for him originally cleaning his driveway for nothing, going out of your way to make extra passes so he would not complain but still got him pissed off. So I would say the hell with him and go on like he is not even there. I had a couple neighbors like this also and I am perfectly fine not talking with them or being nice and taking care of them for free.


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Thanks for all the replies. 
I'm on the west side of the state, one of them small tourist towns where most of the places are seasonal. I worked for a couple of the places on my road and haven't had any problems with them. The one guy on the road isn't very fond of me and sent the cops my way a few times. I had a ton of problems with the guy that does the plowing for the town, which is the guy that's plowing them. That why we got our own plow, which had a fire in it this summer, just put a new plow on my other truck. I can't say there was any issues with the folks next to us before, they called up to complain just once last year that I left snow by there driveway, which I went and took care of right away. I think it's safe to say though that they side with the guy that keeps calling the cops on me and the guy that's plowing them now. Have some snow coming up tomorrow, with luck there wont be any problems, just have to wait and see I guess.


----------



## Lil STX Ford (Nov 27, 2008)

lift plow 10 feet before his entrance then drop 10 feet after... if he complains tell him to call village plow man cus it's trigger time....


----------



## wirenut (Jan 16, 2004)

its your easement not his....plow away


----------



## In2toys (Jan 25, 2006)

Like others have said, if it's your easement plow away. I REALLLLLY don't like it when people cross my property or areas I have use of without my permission. I'd also consult a scumbag lawyer to cover you'r azz & see where you stand. Or like lil ford guy said lift & drop by his driveway. I've done that before on sidewalks with an atv with a neighbor I didn't get along with. I'd do the whole cull de sac except for the sidewalk in front of his house.


----------



## Winter Land Man (Aug 9, 2005)

Johnny Bravo;691681 said:


> Live on a private sand road, has lots of problems with drainage so it has to be plowed in a specific way. The guy that plows for the town is an idiot and cant plow for spit. I got my own plow so it can be done right. The town guy still plows the neighbors and leaves a bank at the mouth of there drive that spills over and pinches the way to us off and he pushes snow on top of what I already plowed. I always have to go back and clean up after he plows and some spill gets in the mouth of the neighbors drive. I missed out on 4 snow falls so the first time I plowed they got buried, went to finish up my place before I cleaned them out and I got a unpleasant phone call from them so I had a few words with him and told him I'd take care of it this time, but I wont plow for free after this. Well they haven't gotten plowed in the last 2 snowings, was about 8" and we were having trouble getting through so I go to knock it down a bit, hit the wrong button and send snow in there drive. Lowered the plow to the height of the snow that was in the drive and scoped it out best I could without going on there property, said they don't pay me to plow and they don't want me to plow, also I would be trespassing at that point. Well there is no reasoning with them and they just cant understand it, not even that I already plowed it out. Well they seem to think I'm doing it on purpose and came over yelling they cant get into there drive, gave me a shove and he was totally ready to fight, the wife was holding him back. told them I would plow what went in there out and I would make a contract but they said no, but they expect me to plow it all the time. Plow them out anyways, but they still get stuck cause there's 8" and they haven't been plowed in 2 storms. They aren't the most balanced people, one min. hes trying to start a fist fight, then next they tell me to come over for some beer and pot, buddy buddy crap.
> Well we are land locked and that road is out legal drive (we have an easement), there legal drive should be on the other road but they use ours because it's already there. Well I don't see any way of working with these people and there's always going to be some spillover in by them, so I'm at a lost on what to do with this.
> Wondering how you would handle this if it were you ?
> 
> Thanks for any help or thoughts to this.


Who cares about what they say? Just smile at them with the finger up, next time you drive by there. Don't let those people getcha down!


----------



## swa136 (Oct 5, 2006)

The best defense in the world, is a good offense! You're clearly dealing with a sociopath(only they matter, and you are beneath them) First mistake was not filing a police report for the assault, along with getting a restraining order. Second was trying to deal with them. You need to go on the offensive, or they will continue to use you. Sociopaths see others as tools to be used, hence their willfully trespassing on your right-of-way, which they see nothing wrong with because you are below them, and are there to be used. All that matters to them is themselves! Think I'm overestimating them? Keep on being the nice guy, and you'll see! I'd say good luck to you, but you need more than that, you need the Police, and a Lawyer.


----------



## Turbodiesel (Aug 5, 2008)

Typical , neighbors .


----------



## g.moore (Oct 10, 2006)

Jomofo has it in our neck of the woods. Neighbors complained because I plow MY way out and not theirs so I just swung the blade around and dumped it all on their side of the road. Most of them have learned to just be quiet and happy that everything is plowed within 150' of their house and they don't have to try and make it through 1/4 mile of snow in their Screwbaru. I have 1 neighbor that's doing some hardwood floor work in our house since I plow his road and another who keeps my freezer full of Elk and Deer for plowing his driveway.


----------



## harddock (Mar 1, 2008)

For what it is worth. I would offer to back in and push out your windrow keeping his entrance clear ( the last 10' of his driveway) for free. I can't imagine it taking more than a minute. If really concerned about his mood swings I would present this to him in writing when you are all getting along. He can then shovel, melt, snowblow, have plowed or just roll around and make snow angels in the rest of his driveway. If this is unacceptable then just plow the road and be done with it. You would have made the jesture and have a document to show the authorities if he complains and becomes unreasonable.


----------



## artic429 (Feb 20, 2008)

I know its not the right thing to do but if it was me living next to this bonehead..... he would have every snowflake in the county i could get my hands on, in his driveway!! hahaha


----------



## MattR (Jan 4, 2009)

Hey Johnny, Have you tried to take this matter in front of the town board when they have their meetings? From what I understand it is an easement issue which should have nothing to do with the cops. Cops got better things to do with their time than argue over some snow. Living in a rural WI area, I know how the town plow guys can be. If your town is like mine, those plow guys bid on the plowing for the town roads. The town themselves actually hire the plow guys, so get in their and talk with the ones who hire them for the town. That way there may not have to be an arguement with your neighbor regarding where that plow guy leaves the snow. Let the town board know of the problems and the extra time and stress this has caused. Afterall you pay taxes to the town or county. You have the right to clear your driveway without having problems so emergency vehicles can make it to your place if needed. Make sure you take some pictures with you to the town board as well. I believe this is the correct route to take to resolve your problem. Hope this helps you.


Matt


----------



## GL&M (Sep 26, 2005)

Johnny Bravo;692354 said:


> Yes it is a driveway and is not a town road. It is a private road and the township will not maintain it unless you pay for it. We are land locked and are the only ones to have an easement, and they dont have permission to use it as an easement. there drive should be on the township road thats on the other side of their house, but they put their drive off of our easement. I informed them of that but they couldn't care less.


And there lies your answer. He does not have permission to use the easement. Expalin it kindly to him one more time. After that have him arrested for trespassing on your property, and then proceed to block his access from your side of the property. I believe the law is on you side. People seem to think that an easement is for the general public and not for one specific person or company. Utility companies have easments on alot of properties, but not everyone can use the utility companies easement.


----------



## RepoMan207 (Oct 7, 2008)

Thats like private roads I plow....Unless the resident pays me to plow there drive, they come home to a spill off in there apron. Do you think the Town / City / DOT guys care about all the ones they berried in. It's the nature of the business. It is what it is. 

BTW, guy comes at me with a shovel, no matter the size, he is getting some action, if not a warning shot if on my property.


----------



## Dave Meyers (Feb 27, 2008)

Johnny Bravo, I am curious for some follow up. Have you had a snow since your first post, and what did you do? I just live on a plain old suburban street, but my next door neighbor is similar to yours. He didn't like the noise my tools made when I built up my rig. So, in the deepest snows, I plow the big pile on my apron left from the city plow, while he is struggling to clear his with shovel and snow blower. Two pushes with my toasty-warm truck (that he didn't like me to work on) and my driveway is clear. Then I go back inside my house to sip hot cocoa while watching him in the cold. I know this doesn't help your situation, other than to empathize about a neighbor who is a d#@$.


----------



## My bowtie (Jan 15, 2008)

Dave Meyers;708900 said:


> Johnny Bravo, I am curious for some follow up. Have you had a snow since your first post, and what did you do? I just live on a plain old suburban street, but my next door neighbor is similar to yours. He didn't like the noise my tools made when I built up my rig. So, in the deepest snows, I plow the big pile on my apron left from the city plow, while he is struggling to clear his with shovel and snow blower. Two pushes with my toasty-warm truck (that he didn't like me to work on) and my driveway is clear. Then I go back inside my house to sip hot cocoa while watching him in the cold. I know this doesn't help your situation, other than to empathize about a neighbor who is a d#@$.


I would of stoped and rolled the window down and said it's nice and warm in here..


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Well went to an attorney about it, wrote up a letter to send them. He didn't say anything that they couldn't drive on our easement, but did say that they could sue me for the windrow going in by them because they pay to get plowed, but it would only be for removal cost. I guess its time I start charging myself to clean out the mouth of our drive for $100 and sue the county for clean up . I'll keep you all posted if anything else should come of this.
Thanks again to all for the replies.


----------



## MrBigStuff (Oct 4, 2005)

That's goofier than a three dollar bill!!

The guy pays someone to plow an access to an easment he's not even legally allowed to use and can sue you, the legally rightful user, for blocking it?

Man, that's messed up. It doesn't seem to pass the sniff test. I'd get a second opinion from a lawyer with some [email protected]


----------



## Johnny Bravo (Jan 4, 2008)

Yeah I thought the same thing was just like the hell. They pay a flat $40 for the whole year to get plowed, sure it would cost more than that to sue so it would be kind of stupid to do that.


----------



## sabres07 (Oct 9, 2008)

Seems like you should just tell him not to drive on your easement...then take the steps necessary towards those ends......geesh.


----------

