# Toros NEW COMMERCIAL single stage...? Power Clear® 721 R-C (38751)



## Exact Services

Anybody have one of these.....yet....? Just saw it in Oct Lawn & Landscape.

4 stroke

weighs more than my old CCR 2450

extra life paddles...?

No Quick shoot cables to freeze up


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## Exact Services

Key difference would be the bigger engine over the 621 with less displacement.

I have heard numerous users claim they up the engine RPM on the "older" 2-stroke Toros for more grunt. I wonder how that would compare.


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## WIPensFan

If they would have put the quick shoot on those new 212cc machines I would have one right now...never had one freeze up. Fluid Film the inside and out of the entire mechanism. Mistake on Toro's part IMO. You can't go back to the old way of moving the shoot.


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## Exact Services

I'm going to try fluid film on mine. The Quick shoot models are insanely fast. I like a few aspects of the Honda 520A but that goofy longish chute bar...? 

I hope Toro is watching this thread. 

Bring back the 24" Snow Commander...!...!

If I had to exclusively use a 2-stage blower I'd quit doing snow. End of story.


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## bdlawncare

just bought 2 mint snow commanders... Looked at these compared to them and decided against spending 700 on one. Picked up 2 mint commanders for 350 each.


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## TKLAWN

Dang $600. How long will one of these last?


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## WIPensFan

They will last for many yrs...Before selling a bunch of mine 2 yrs ago, I had some of them 10 yrs. And that's heavy commercial use. You just have to keep renewing paddles and scrapers.


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## road2damascus

Got a ccr 2000, ccr 3000 and just picked up a "used ten times" ccr 3650. 6hrs before I found the 3650, I was at the dealer, ready to pay 683 out the door for one of these 721 rc blowers. They were out of them but had five on order. 

Very interested to see what you guys that have the 721 say about them. Looks strong.


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## TKLAWN

I forget which models we have, but they chew belts up pretty fast.


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## Exact Services

bdlawncare;1733148 said:


> just bought 2 mint snow commanders... Looked at these compared to them and decided against spending 700 on one. Picked up 2 mint commanders for 350 each.


I really wonder how the new 721 with the commercial 4 stroke compares with the old Toro Snow Commander...?

Which engine do those Toro Snow Commanders have on them...? Are they 7 hp?


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## 97f250Heavyduty

I have 1 snow commander, the guys like it a lot. Uses the 7hp r tek toro 2 cycle engine. Engine is almost the same engine as a 3650. I have plenty of 3650 and ccr2000s. Can't beat toro single stages.


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## WIPensFan

TKLAWN;1733206 said:


> I forget which models we have, but they chew belts up pretty fast.


They should not chew belts fast if they are being used properly. I always had to replace a few belts after a big storm where the walks were drifted and had street snow plowed onto them. That's when you get a lot of belt slippage( heat ) because you have to push it hard to make the first pass through. If the belts are squealing your doing damage. Or if the belt gets put on wrong( did it once ) it chews it up instantly.


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## yardguy28

looks just the model I'm using now and only $150/$200 more than what I paid for mine. 

power chutes aren't necessary in my opinion unless your doing large areas. I just use mine for sidewalks. but I did have an older toro that had the crank bar like a 2 stage. never had a bit of trouble with it freezing up. 

I only go through one set of paddles and one scraper bar per snow blower (I have 2) each season anyway. 

but this would be the model I'm sure will replace what I have when I need a new one or whichever model is newest.


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## CARDOCTOR

always bought used toro single stage blowers never had a problem. 7 yrs ago decided to spend the big money on a new 3650 what a piece of crap 3 pull rope . muffler fell of and then the plastic carb took a crap (warped) had to spend $125 on a metal carb since toro wouldnt give me any assistance. and how about some better fasteners that done rust. funny part was. pulled my 15 yr old craftman single out of my shed fuel it ,gave it a shot of ether started right up .


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## yardguy28

everyone has there own experiences. i won't use anything but toro single stage snow blowers. never had a problem with them. they always fire right up.


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## horizon jay

I had some toro 2450's and sold em (kept 1) Now I have 3 621 R's. It would have to be a big difference for me to spend the extra cash because my 621's run like champs! We have dual stage blowers if it gets too deep but 5-6" or less we havent had any problems for 2 years with the 621. We usually replace paddles and scrapers twice in a season. We have a villa of 58 homes and they get chewed up out there. I wonder if I can get the "extra life paddles" for mine? 
Also ,I just changed our paddles, scrapers, belts and actually took the paddle assembly/shaft off the machine to change them.... It is super easy and I cannot believe we use to cram our fingers in that machine to change the paddles, taped nuts on wrenches etc... World of difference! So if you need to change paddles just take the shaft out, Its that simple Thumbs Up


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## locallawncare.c

I like the bigger engine, but no quick chute was the deal breaker for me, I just fluid film the crap outta mine and it's always fine, I've heard some people having issues with the paddles vibrating a lot, not sure why they are just thicker, also this model has a thicker belt which it should because it has a larger engine, I have a toro 621qzr and its been great all season. My 2 stroke would have a hard time starting after repeated uses and being restarted shortly after shutting down, no issues at all with my 621qzr, I do about 30 driveways with this blower every storm and have replaced the paddles and scraper once so far this season. I also found out that the paddles, scraper bar and belts are the same as the older models with the 2-stroke engine, which is nice because I had some from last winter. I have noticed that the 621 has a little less grunt than the 2-stroke, this is likely the reason why they introduced a larger engine on this commercial model, just wish it had a quick chute, this is an essential item for, wouldn't go back to the old way of bending over and turning the chute back and forth especially when going up and down driveways, also the lack of the handle sticking out the side allows me to get closer to cars and garage doors and other obstacles that would normally be getting scratched up by the chute rotation handle, sorry to rant, love the new commercial otherwise.


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## buckhigh

Exact Services;1666145 said:


> Key difference would be the bigger engine over the 621 with less displacement.
> 
> I have heard numerous users claim they up the engine RPM on the "older" 2-stroke Toros for more grunt. I wonder how that would compare.


How is this done?


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## buckhigh

I run 2-221qr and I'm about fed up with them. About to switch to 2 stage blowers. The chute clogs when the snow is really wet and heavy, doesn't blow the snow more than 4 feet, and when the snow is less than 2" it just shoots the snow out the front rather than the chute. I'd love for toro to demo me one throwing snow 25' as advertised. What a bunch of bs!

Any ideas of what could be wrong or need to be tweaked??


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## wrtenterprises

I have (5) snow commanders and (2) new 721's. Both are great machines, my only complaint all these years in regard to the snow commander is the weight. It's tough to get the big boy on the truck alone. Ramps work fine, but we all know time is money and loading and unloading every stop with ramps sucks. The 721's move snow nearly as fast, a few inches smaller cutting path, 4 stroke engine. IF there is going to be a weak point on the 721, in my opinion, it will be the engine. The rest of the machine is a proven winner. 

To sum it all up, the only reason the snow commander did not sell was price. For commercial sidewalk and small drives, it can't be beat. The 721 may end up being as good, but not better.....


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## wrtenterprises

Have you ever replaced the paddles? We replace ours every season, sometimes twice. They wear allot faster than user think....


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## buckhigh

wrtenterprises;1733748 said:


> Have you ever replaced the paddles? We replace ours every season, sometimes twice. They wear allot faster than user think....


I just put my second 221 in service this year. I can't believe the paddles are worn down already? I'll look at the holes on the paddles to double check. Even if the paddles are worn down a bit, I still can't believe that would affect throwing distance much...


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## horizon jay

buckhigh;1733774 said:


> I just put my second 221 in service this year. I can't believe the paddles are worn down already? I'll look at the holes on the paddles to double check. Even if the paddles are worn down a bit, I still can't believe that would affect throwing distance much...


Dealer told me if u can fit finger between the back/inside of machine & freely spin the paddles without pinching finger they need changed. I don't know actual distance but mine and the older 2450 will toss some snow! If it's coming out the front the chute is probably clogged. Wet heavy snow sucks and 2 stage is where it's at IMO.


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## locallawncare.c

For buckhigh, you can try fluid film on the entire housing/paddles/chute, this might help with the wet snow, but generally speaking single stages aren't that great on wet slushy snow, this is a common issue. One thing that helps is to keep the chute as forward pointing as possible (only slightly to to side not 90 degrees). I found that these blowers need atleast 3cm to even work, it seems like the more snow there is the further it throws it, if that makes sense, well to a point anyways. I don't see the need to throw snow 25 feet anyways, that distance is usually on the neighbour's driveway, so 10 feet is fine. I find it can throw anywhere from 4 feet to 20 feet, it really depends on the conditions and the amount & type of snow. The paddles have a wear indicator hole on them, you can usually go until the hole is basically gone (it does wear on an angle so you will see the hole getting flared out), hope some of this helps, single stages have their limitations, thats why they make 2 stagers.


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## xtreem3d

Kage makes replacement urethane paddles FWIW...
http://www.kageinnovation.com/en/snow-removal-products/rotor/


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## White Gardens

xtreem3d;1736158 said:


> Kage makes replacement urethane paddles FWIW...
> http://www.kageinnovation.com/en/snow-removal-products/rotor/


We've been using a couple of 180r's for the light weight of throwing them in and out of the truck.

But, since I've seen the Kage paddles, we will only be buying 21" models from here on out. They only make a 21" replacement paddle for the toros. So wish they did for the 18's.

.......


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## starspangled6.0

Just switched from Toro 2-cycle single stages to a couple of new 621's. Holy cow, they're awesome. Same weight as the older ones, more power, and now that the paddles are broken in, they scrape really nicely. They start a lot easier and are quieter, too.


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## horizon jay

I wish I would have seen the Kage paddles two weeks ago when I replaced mine. Holy cow! I know what I'm buying next time!!


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## locallawncare.c

Man those paddles look sweet, gotta get me some, changing them is a pain the butt.


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## horizon jay

locallawncare.c;1736932 said:


> Man those paddles look sweet, gotta get me some, changing them is a pain the butt.


Remove the shaft the paddles are on from the machine! It's a breeZe!! Then replace paddles. 3 bolts on each side hold shaft. Trust me I did it the other way for years. Taped nuts on wrenches , pinched fingers . It's idiot proof. I know this too be true because I was successful lol!


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## locallawncare.c

Thanks for the tip, I realized part way through that taking off the shaft is probably easier, had a hard time getting the bolts through the new paddle too, seemed like the holes were undersized or something, but yes many pinched fingers and curse words were thrown back and forth, lol. In the end I was victorious, thanks again for the tip.


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## White Gardens

With our 18's, we've never had any issue with the paddles getting them on and off. But we always buy the paddles that are Toro paddles.

I don't know if the design is different with the 21's or I'm just awesome as a mechanic..... ........





...............


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## locallawncare.c

I'm sure you are just awesome, lo, it's not too difficult just a little awkward with tight clearance, took me about 20mins to do both paddles and the scraper and also inspect the belt, the only thing I dislike is having to change the oil, didn't have to with 2-strokes, but the benefits out-way the negatives. Looking forward to more real world reviews from 721 owners and also those new Kage paddles.


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## WIPensFan

locallawncare.c;1737819 said:


> I'm sure you are just awesome, lo, it's not too difficult just a little awkward with tight clearance, took me about 20mins to do both paddles and the scraper and also inspect the belt, the only thing I dislike is having to change the oil, didn't have to with 2-strokes, but the benefits out-way the negatives. Looking forward to more real world reviews from 721 owners and also those new Kage paddles.


What are the benefits of the 4 stroke over the 2 stroke other than it's quieter?


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## locallawncare.c

It's quieter, doesn't have a lingering exhaust smell on your cloths after heavy use, also seems to start way easier after quick on and off cycles. I guess that's about it, lol. It's a little heavier (not much), I was kind of thinking more along the lines of the quick chute control because my older 2-cycle doesn't have it, although I know it was available on the 2-stokes before the 4 stroke came out. Some don't like mixing gas but that's not really an issue, overall I just like it, plus 2-stoke is no longer available so for people staring out or adding more to their fleet it's the only thing available, I know many people swear by the old 2-cycle blowers that had the suzuki engine.


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## WIPensFan

locallawncare.c;1737837 said:


> It's quieter, doesn't have a lingering exhaust smell on your cloths after heavy use, also seems to start way easier after quick on and off cycles. I guess that's about it, lol. It's a little heavier (not much), I was kind of thinking more along the lines of the quick chute control because my older 2-cycle doesn't have it, although I know it was available on the 2-stokes before the 4 stroke came out. Some don't like mixing gas but that's not really an issue, overall I just like it, plus 2-stoke is no longer available so for people staring out or adding more to their fleet it's the only thing available, I know many people swear by the old 2-cycle blowers that had the suzuki engine.


I had one of the new 4 strokes and I liked it. The only thing I thought was better was the low noise. I hate having to change oil on one more thing or 10 more things if you use a lot of them. I currently have 3 of the 2 stroke models that were bought in 2010. I used to lift these on and off the truck 50 times per event, the 4 strokes are much heavier when lifting that many times. I know the EPA made the 2 strokes go away but aren't we just creating more waste oil?


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## starspangled6.0

WIPensFan;1737882 said:


> I know the EPA made the 2 strokes go away but aren't we just creating more waste oil?


I don't the EPA really cares about that... "fix" one problem, pat yourself on the back, get more funding, and ignore that fact that all you're doing is creating more problems in the first place while solving nothing.


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## Exact Services

I have an older Tecumseh 421 Quick Shoot and it was able to throw snow a tad further than my 221 Quick Shoot or my Ccr 2450 with the same engine as my Quick shoot 221. Carb is toast on the 621 but I will get to it someday...

Looking to buy a used 24" 7hp Snow Commander. Not much snow here this winter. Kinda nice...most accounts on flat rate.

Been having leaking carb issues with my CCR 2450 and my Quick Shoot 221. 221 has been a total PITA to restart when warm...?


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## Exact Services

Getting a hitch rack is the way to avoid a full tail gate lift on the heavier 80#+ blowers. I tweaked my back few years back and lost most of my snow accounts from that drill. Lifting 6"-12" beats a full tail gate lift 30-50 times per event.


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## locallawncare.c

Hey exact are you Exact Rotolilling? I also had issues restarting my 221 after it was warm, never figured it out, tried cleaning the kill switch, was gonna put in a feul valve to shut it off between houses, I found letting it idle after heavy use helped a little bit, but even idling is still high rpm so I'm not sure if it did anything or was just wishful thinking. I have handle a snow commander and it's a freaking beast, some people say they are awesome, but for me it just seems too big, I like being able to throw around my single stage (sliding it around, fishtailing, getting all squirrelly). No way you could lift a Snow Commander safely and repeatedly. My 621 is still manageable (just have to do a dead lift style, bend the knees back straight,etc. I feel like this thread is lacking in 721 owners and has become me and a few others simply ranting about our existing snowblowers, lol.


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## Unraveller

locallawncare.c;1738482 said:


> I feel like this thread is lacking in 721 owners and has become me and a few others simply ranting about our existing snowblowers, lol.


My sidewalk crew uses a 621 & a 721. The 721 is "mine". It's a beast, it pulls faster, it's more powerful, throws 10 feet further, and it crushes the plow curtains.

It also vibrates much more while idling, is a pain in the ass to use the chute, and the pull bar falls off if you set it down roughly.

It's a better machine than the 621 and I love it, but it needs the quick chute.


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## locallawncare.c

Thanks Unraveller, that's what I wanted to hear a real world side by side quick comparison of the 2 machines, thanks. Kinda what I had hoped and expected, more powerful but needs quick chute, sweet.


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## WIPensFan

Unraveller;1738511 said:


> My sidewalk crew uses a 621 & a 721. The 721 is "mine". It's a beast, it pulls faster, it's more powerful, throws 10 feet further, and it crushes the plow curtains.
> 
> It also vibrates much more while idling, is a pain in the ass to use the chute, and the pull bar falls off if you set it down roughly.
> 
> It's a better machine than the 621 and I love it, but it needs the quick chute.


I said it needed the quick chute, at least as an option. Thank you for confirming that, and for the comments on the blower itself. Sounds like I should get one. As far as the pull bar...try taking it out and pulling(bending) it farther to the outside to make it harder to come off.


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## Unraveller

WIPensFan;1738706 said:


> I said it needed the quick chute, at least as an option. Thank you for confirming that, and for the comments on the blower itself. Sounds like I should get one. As far as the pull bar...try taking it out and pulling(bending) it farther to the outside to make it harder to come off.


Great Tip! I'll give that a shot.

I've also heard rumours that the 721 will have the quick chute as an option, starting next year. (Not that you can buy a 721 this year anymore around here... they were sold out in October....)


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## horizon jay

WIPensFan;1738706 said:


> I said it needed the quick chute, at least as an option. Thank you for confirming that, and for the comments on the blower itself. Sounds like I should get one. As far as the pull bar...try taking it out and pulling(bending) it farther to the outside to make it harder to come off.


Thats a great idea! I have the 621's and have the same problem. I actually lost one of the bars last year (who know's where) so we were down a blower that night. Mine kept falling off this year and I almost lost one in a parking lot. I looked up in rearview and noticed it was gone right before I left. I had 3 in the back plus a 2 stage blower so Im sure they were bouncing around while plowing. Found it in the lot along with the spring. I zip tied all of them through the extra hole on handle and to the frame work it connects to. Its loose enough it doesnt affect operation. So now if they fall off at least they will be swinging and not MIA. I will try the bend method also.


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## Cooter24

We weld a washer to bail handles on all of the Toros. They cannot fall off after doing this.


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## Exact Services

Yeah that's me all right.  I found a Snow Commander I just might buy. Cash is crazy tight but I'll do it...maybe. But yes hitch rack it or leave it at home.

Speaking of other blowers I'm selling my Honda 520 Single. Hate the stone age chute bar. Doesn't track as well as even the older Toro 2450 and is only 19" wide and the wetish snow cage packs in largish ball between the paddles and the point of restriction in the chute. Yeah it quiet and easy to start but I'm done with it. My Toro 180 is 18" wide and lacks the grunt but is lighter. 

Been a silly light winter here BTW.

My 2 stroke Toros are not running all that well lately. Carb rebuilds maybe in order. Both my 2450 and 221QS are leaking fuel from the carbs....?



locallawncare.c;1738482 said:


> Hey exact are you Exact Rotolilling? I also had issues restarting my 221 after it was warm, never figured it out, tried cleaning the kill switch, was gonna put in a feul valve to shut it off between houses, I found letting it idle after heavy use helped a little bit, but even idling is still high rpm so I'm not sure if it did anything or was just wishful thinking. I have handle a snow commander and it's a freaking beast, some people say they are awesome, but for me it just seems too big, I like being able to throw around my single stage (sliding it around, fishtailing, getting all squirrelly). No way you could lift a Snow Commander safely and repeatedly. My 621 is still manageable (just have to do a dead lift style, bend the knees back straight,etc. I feel like this thread is lacking in 721 owners and has become me and a few others simply ranting about our existing snowblowers, lol.


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## TNLC

Exact Services;1739620 said:


> Yeah that's me all right.  I found a Snow Commander I just might buy. Cash is crazy tight but I'll do it...maybe. But yes hitch rack it or leave it at home.
> 
> Speaking of other blowers I'm selling my Honda 520 Single. Hate the stone age chute bar. Doesn't track as well as even the older Toro 2450 and is only 19" wide and the wetish snow cage packs in largish ball between the paddles and the point of restriction in the chute. Yeah it quiet and easy to start but I'm done with it. My Toro 180 is 18" wide and lacks the grunt but is lighter.
> 
> Been a silly light winter here BTW.
> 
> My 2 stroke Toros are not running all that well lately. Carb rebuilds maybe in order. Both my 2450 and 221QS are leaking fuel from the carbs....?


A little spit back is normal but it should not be noticeable unless you are checking for it. No way should it cause a leak. Your needle and seat may need replaced.


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## yardguy28

seriously you hitch rack a toro snow blower??? I lift those things in and out of the truck bed 30+ a times a storm storm like they are feathers. 

hitch racking is for 2 stage snow blowers.


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## road2damascus

yardguy28;1739753 said:


> seriously you hitch rack a toro snow blower??? I lift those things in and out of the truck bed 30+ a times a storm storm like they are feathers.
> 
> hitch racking is for 2 stage snow blowers.


The snow commander is 115lbs.

I just unloaded over 17,000 lbs of bagged de ice products and restacked it. In the spring summer and fall I work out intensly with a force recon team leader. My 3650 is just over 70 lbs and at the end of my 14 hours of snow removal, it does get heavy to throw over the side of a pickup truck. My older ccr 3000 can be thrown over all day and night.

The 721 r-c I believe is just over 80lbs

What toro models do you use?


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## yardguy28

road2damascus;1739770 said:


> The snow commander is 115lbs.
> 
> I just unloaded over 17,000 lbs of bagged de ice products and restacked it. In the spring summer and fall I work out intensly with a force recon team leader. My 3650 is just over 70 lbs and at the end of my 14 hours of snow removal, it does get heavy to throw over the side of a pickup truck. My older ccr 3000 can be thrown over all day and night.
> 
> The 721 r-c I believe is just over 80lbs
> 
> What toro models do you use?


currently I'm using the 621's I believe. but before that I was using the commander.

throw OVER the side of a pickup?? I drop the tailgate and load/unload them that way. I wouldn't even load/unload the 621's over the side.


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## potskie

yardguy28;1739834 said:


> currently I'm using the 621's I believe. but before that I was using the commander.
> 
> throw OVER the side of a pickup?? I drop the tailgate and load/unload them that way. I wouldn't even load/unload the 621's over the side.


I load, unload my 621 over the side. easy enough. Fits nicely between my salter and cab.


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## yardguy28

no salter on my truck. 

loading it over the side I can see why it'd get tiring and why someone mite hitch rack it. but like I said, I drop the tailgate, slide it to the edge, pull it off and I'm good to go. 

even if I ever do get back into commercial lots and have a salter it's gonna be a tailgate salter that swings away so I can get my tailgate down.


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## road2damascus

yardguy28;1739834 said:


> currently I'm using the 621's I believe. but before that I was using the commander.
> 
> throw OVER the side of a pickup?? I drop the tailgate and load/unload them that way. I wouldn't even load/unload the 621's over the side.


I have a salter. Mine has to go over the side.


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## CAPELAND

yardguy28;1739834 said:


> currently I'm using the 621's I believe. but before that I was using the commander.
> 
> throw OVER the side of a pickup?? I drop the tailgate and load/unload them that way. I wouldn't even load/unload the 621's over the side.


We recently purchased 2 621 units and used them for the 1st time yesterday and was extremely impressed with the little units. I would recommend the Toro single stage units to anyone that's currently hand shoveling. We had six inches of powder yesterday that we wiped out our accounts quicker because of these machines.
One guy could put the machine in over the side but we chose to have two guys do it, to make it easier. 
My only complaint was that one of my guys lost the nut and bolt that holds the handle together in the first hour of operation, I don't know if that was operator error or a problem from the factory design, 
I will make sure they are tight the next time we use the units looks like Monday. 
all in all a great little unit


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## MikeA5150

I have the Toro 721 r c. It works good and has plenty of power, my only complaint is its advertised as being light enough to lift in and out of your truck. Maybe you young bucks can but I cant. Last couple storms I went back to using the powerlite because I was by myself.


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## xtreem3d

The 621 has the electric start option and 721 does not ?


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## yardguy28

why do you need electric start???


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## potskie

xtreem3d;1741561 said:


> The 621 has the electric start option and 721 does not ?


Depends on the model. If it has R in the model # its recoil start. If it has E its elec. Same as Q is quick shoot and Z zip deflector. So a 621R is recoil and 621E is electric. Most of the 4 strokes (newer) have electric start.


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## locallawncare.c

Electric start is a homeowner type of gimmick used to sell to old people who remember the days of pulling a starter until it felt like your arm was going to fall off. This machines starts right up every time, Maybe if it had an on-board battery and charging system it would be worth while, but other than that it seems like a waste of money.


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## yardguy28

locallawncare.c;1743442 said:


> Electric start is a homeowner type of gimmick used to sell to old people who remember the days of pulling a starter until it felt like your arm was going to fall off. This machines starts right up every time, Maybe if it had an on-board battery and charging system it would be worth while, but other than that it seems like a waste of money.


I'm with you on this one. my toros start on the first pull each and every time. not to mention where am I gonna use electric start once I leave my garage???


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## WIPensFan

locallawncare.c;1743442 said:


> Electric start is a homeowner type of gimmick used to sell to old people who remember the days of pulling a starter until it felt like your arm was going to fall off. This machines starts right up every time, Maybe if it had an on-board battery and charging system it would be worth while, but other than that it seems like a waste of money.





yardguy28;1743649 said:


> I'm with you on this one. my toros start on the first pull each and every time. not to mention where am I gonna use electric start once I leave my garage???


I agree with the pulling being easy, however at resale on Craigslist, the electric start ones are very sought after. I've sold a couple almost as fast as I list them, because they had electric start. Lots of "office types" looking for something easy or that the wife can use. Only reason I've had a few is because I needed a couple when that is all they had left. I got one in my garage right now with electric start. Just something to think about


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## locallawncare.c

I just ordered a set of the KAGE poly paddles for my 621, I'll let everyone know how they hold up. Anyone having wear issues with their paddles on their single stage toros? Mine seem to wear the edges out really quickly for some reason, they flare out and the rubber layers seem to come apart and the stitching also, my first set that came on the blower new seemed to last a little longer and wear a lot better without any fraying/separation, but the last set I replaced wore out really fast and this latest set has only been used for one event which has a real heavy 15cm of heavy heavy snow along with severe plow ridges, I do about 31 residential driveways, a couple I did twice and all of them had severe plow ridges and some have some ice on the sidewalks and the bottom of the driveways so I guess that would prematurely wear the paddles but I dunno it just seems excessive, although I was pushing the machine to its limits, this was really 2-stage machine snow but it seemed to chug through it nicely and throw it really far which was nice. They still have a lot of life left until the indicator hole is gone, and they were clearing perfectly fine. Here is a picture of how they look like after 1 event.


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## Exact Services

yardguy28;1739753 said:


> seriously you hitch rack a toro snow blower??? I lift those things in and out of the truck bed 30+ a times a storm storm like they are feathers.
> 
> hitch racking is for 2 stage snow blowers.


Well what happens is when one is working 2 businesses and you're sleep deprived [wife refuses to work] your body doesn't have a chance to heal up or rest. I F'ed up my back 2.5 years back with a herniated disc and then a secondary injury even worse further up from that. Almost quit the biz cold turkey. Lost lawn accounts and it was an uphill battle to stay in business. Gave up all my snow accounts just heal up over the winter from that and lost a huge amount of forfeited income.

So now I work vastly smarter and can most likely dodge back surgery. I can outlift many much younger than I am but still when I turn 90 I want to be able to enjoy retirement and be able to out run most 65 year olds. .

I still lift my single in and out of my pickup for my limited amount of accounts but for next winter I need to get back to my former account load then some to make snow relocation worth bothering with.

So yes a hitch rack is best.


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## Exact Services

Still looking for user feedback on the old 7hp 24" wider and heavier Snow Commander vs the 721 and/or 621 Quick shoot. The Quick shoot Toros are crazy fast blowers maybe I should just wait for the 721 Quick Shoot next year and skip the heavier 2-stroke snow Commander...?

What is the approx HP on the current 721...? I'm assuming 7hp range...?
http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?p=1745317#post1745317


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## road2damascus

Exact Services;1746526 said:


> Still looking for user feedback on the old 7hp 24" wider and heavier Snow Commander vs the 721 and/or 621 Quick shoot. The Quick shoot Toros are crazy fast blowers maybe I should just wait for the 721 Quick Shoot next year and skip the heavier 2-stroke snow Commander...?
> 
> What is the approx HP on the current 721...? I'm assuming 7hp range...?
> http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?p=1745317#post1745317


Wait for next year 721 quick chute. Not sure what the hp is on the 721 but its got to be a torque monster being a 4 stroke.

Hp and rpms will give you 30 foot rooster tail throwing distance. Torque will allow you to move 7" of concrete wet snow.

I have never used a snow commander. I have seen and tried lifting one. I also tried maneuvering on dry pavement. I did not want one due to its size, weight and its lack of maneuvering compared to other toro single stage. I found the 3650 has the same engine but is rated at 6.5hp instead of 7hp. It is smaller and weighs 30-40 lbs less. I need to lift it over the side of my pickup. Power to weight ratio just ain't cutting it.

I really want the 721. I will wait till next season as well. I really want to hear what people have to say after our busy season.


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## Exact Services

Well if the older snow commander doesn't handle all that well and/or you have to lift up on the handle to get it to move... that just might be a deal breaker for me. My 221 Quick Shoot I can basically run behind it and it tracks exceptionally well. Makes my Honda 520 single seem like a waste of space frankly.


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## road2damascus

Exact Services;1746542 said:


> Well if the older snow commander doesn't handle all that well and/or you have to lift up on the handle to get it to move... that just might be a deal breaker for me. My 221 Quick Shoot I can basically run behind it and it tracks exceptionally well. Makes my Honda 520 single seem like a waste of space frankly.


Tell me about the 520. Nearly new one for sale locally.


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## Exact Services

road2damascus;1746546 said:


> Tell me about the 520. Nearly new one for sale locally.


Pros:
Crazy easy to start.
Quiet when compared to the other single stage blowers.

Cons: 
Cumbersome and annoying chute handle. Restricts getting close to obstacles garage doors & vehicles. 
Only clears 19"...?
When the paddles wear a bit it tend to trap a snow ball between the paddles and exit chute.
Exit chute needs to be opened up.
Tracks and handles poorly when compared side by side with the 21" Toro Power Curve models.

Sorry Honda...you need to update this blower already. And oh yeah I really like the Honda 2-stage 928/1132/1332 but unless you're super short like 5' 2" or less....please change these and put higher handles on them already.

I will still buy a wheel drive HS928 for next season with the middle earth dwarf bars but why not have an option for us normal height folks...?


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## yardguy28

well I have the 621 and I can tell you it works great for the snow I get and move with it. the paddles and scraper bar last me a whole season. even with this season being vastly busier it looks like I'm gonna get another full season out of the paddles and scraper bars I out on my 2 621's at the beginning of the winter season. 

I do 22 residential properties so I'm lifting the unit 44 times an event. never phases me. I'm using them on sidewalks and once in a while to relocate small piles of snow made from my plow. 

this is the third winter for these snow blowers.


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## Exact Services

There was someone on here a few years back who flat out said he really felt the older 24" Snow Commander was better and faster than his Quick Shoot 621 Toros.


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## snowcrazy

Sounds like the 721 would still be a chore for me to put in and out of the truck by myself over the bed which is what I would have to do since I have a large tailgate salter on the back so putting the tailgate down is out. The good thing is normally I have another person with me so 2 ppl should be a snap. Im also only 5'5" tall so that plays a factor. And im a panzy pip squeak!!!!! Im just not very strong....... 

With that all being said next season this truck will have an aluminum flatbed on it so I should be able to manage getting it over the the sides of that...........


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## Exact Services

snowcrazy;1756785 said:


> Sounds like the 721 would still be a chore for me to put in and out of the truck by myself over the bed which is what I would have to do since I have a large tailgate salter on the back so putting the tailgate down is out. The good thing is normally I have another person with me so 2 ppl should be a snap. Im also only 5'5" tall so that plays a factor. And im a panzy pip squeak!!!!! Im just not very strong.......
> 
> With that all being said next season this truck will have an aluminum flatbed on it so I should be able to manage getting it over the the sides of that...........


Lifting over the side of truck bed is okay fine for the smaller Toro. It was called the Powerlite. Blowers over 75# gets iffy. Honestly it is a back surgery factor down the road with the destruction of the disc in the back. Lifting and twisting and other poor bio mechanics etc. Trust me I know about this and have paid the price.


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## cj7plowing

alright my guys want some of these single stage Toros which model 621 should I get, I see there is like 4 or 5 of them


don't want the 721s as I have 4 larger 2 stage blowers. they want something that can be tossed in and out of the truck.


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## Antlerart06

cj7plowing;1764153 said:


> alright my guys want some of these single stage Toros which model 621 should I get, I see there is like 4 or 5 of them
> 
> don't want the 721s as I have 4 larger 2 stage blowers. they want something that can be tossed in and out of the truck.


 My son is 6'5'' he loads his 21 on his flat bed but a truck bed can be easier. I wont load it

In my truck I have 418 and its easy to load on my flat bed 
the 418 is a beast. The deepest I use it in 8'' at 2'' be ready to walk your a$$ off

My son's 21 isn't a Toro Its a craftman The Toro handles was to short for him wasnt comfortable why went with caftman longer handle and it was last 21'' blower in town when I bought it before are last blizzard


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## locallawncare.c

Though I would revive this thread, toro has came out with the new line of 721 blowers, they have the quick chute now, I'm sure this model will replace the 621, anyone get their hands on one yet? I found my 621qzr to have plenty of power but more is always better, I liked the idea of the 721r-c when it first came out but the lack of the quick chute was a deal breaker for me personally.

http://www.toro.com/en-us/homeowner...pages/model.aspx?pid=power-clear-721qzr-38743


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## Antlerart06

locallawncare.c;1836547 said:


> Though I would revive this thread, toro has came out with the new line of 721 blowers, they have the quick chute now, I'm sure this model will replace the 621, anyone get their hands on one yet? I found my 621qzr to have plenty of power but more is always better, I liked the idea of the 721r-c when it first came out but the lack of the quick chute was a deal breaker for me personally.
> 
> http://www.toro.com/en-us/homeowner...pages/model.aspx?pid=power-clear-721qzr-38743


See they came out with a 518 model I have the 418 and that thing is a horse for its size Only bad thing about Toro is the kage is plastic in cold weather if you pick a rock it will break the plastic I know I did it 
One thing I like about the craftsman its metal


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