# New Dodge Pickup truck advice and opinions?



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

I am looking to buy a Dodge 2003 2500 four door 4X4 with a V-10 Magnum and manuel tranny. 
My question, how reliable are the V-10s?
What is thier HP and Torque? 
What is their MPG? 
What do they 'feel' like? (really powerful and fast, slow but powerful, etc...) 
What is the Dodge 5 speed manuel tranny like? Is it good? 
I have been a Ford man my whole life, and I decided to go with a Dodge because I wanted to try another brand, just to see what its like. I plan on turning it into an offroad monster. I know the diesel is better, but I dont want the diesel. So, comments, suggestions, and the like are very welcome, and thank you to anyone who replies!


----------



## kipcom (Feb 3, 2001)

Get the Hemi engine OR Diesel...all the specs are at dodge.com


----------



## Cumminsdude (Feb 12, 2003)

The Hemi produces more hp than the v-10. 345 against 315. With only 5.7 L compared to 8.0, it will be a heck of a lot more efficient. Don't know about torque but it can't be too much less.


----------



## Nozzleman (Feb 6, 2003)

If your going to get a gasser then I would suggest the Hemi. Unless you plan on towing a very heavy load the Hemi has plenty of power for plowing. Also, why a standard shift. For plowing a automatic is much nicer. Finally, I plow with a 2500 Cummins dodge and that is probably the best combo for plowing, towing, fuel economy and just about everything else. Basically I am saying if you have the money take a hard look at the Cummins because it does not disappoint.


----------



## wyldman (Jan 18, 2001)

If your not going diesel,then get the hemi.


----------



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

So if I dont get the Cummins, go with the Hemi V-8? I am not going to be using it for plowing (no snow down here on the coast of Texas) it'll be an offroader. This isnt for me, I am going for a hummer, this is for an old friend of mine, he wants something to compete with my hummer I have ordered. 
Thanks for the advice, I will look at the Hemi


----------



## A.L. Inc. (Jan 4, 2002)

Man, I wish I had that kind of money when I was 21......Mike


----------



## dillyolboy (Dec 24, 2002)

The HEMI flat out hauls. You would never guess you are in a 6600 lb. truck. Donuts on dry pavement, etc.  The mileage is about as dismal as all other big V8 gas engines.  I've heard somewhere around 13 in mostly city driving. I can't think of any advantages to having a V10.


----------



## Nozzleman (Feb 6, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Swampbeast _
> *So if I dont get the Cummins, go with the Hemi V-8? I am not going to be using it for plowing (no snow down here on the coast of Texas) it'll be an offroader. This isnt for me, I am going for a hummer, this is for an old friend of mine, he wants something to compete with my hummer I have ordered.
> Thanks for the advice, I will look at the Hemi
> 
> *


If your friend get's a hemi to compete with your hummer he may just kick your hummer right were it hurts.


----------



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

> _Originally posted by Nozzleman _
> *If your friend get's a hemi to compete with your hummer he may just kick your hummer right were it hurts. *


Ah yes, but I plan on taking that POS GM 6.5 liter diesel out of the Hummer, and putting an HO Cummins diesel in there! And since I wont be using it for anything except offroading, some turbos and computer chips are going on there! He he he! But thats going to take awhile, several months!
Money? The Hummer I am getting from Clarks Trucks, it costs $30,000. Thats about the same as a brand new Dodge pickup, and far less than a brand new Ford F-350, so its not to bad. Also, this is why I have enough money to go buy a play Hummer, the Stock Market. I got into it when I was 16 on my Dads advice, I have made several thousand off of it. 
Once again, thank you everyone for your advice, now I know not to let him get the V-10.


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

One more thing,if he is going to work the truck,and carry weight with it,get the 3500single wheel,it isnt much more money,and can carry an additional 1000 lbs legally.If you have a cummins this is important,since a 2500 Ram /cumins 4x4 is about 7000 empty.You need all the legal payoad you can get. The hemi will not weigh that much,but id get the 3500 anyway,guys who have them say they dont ride any firmer that the 2500 either.I thinks its more a marketing move than anythign else.


----------



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

How much more would that be? (the 3500 over the 2500)
Also, we both already have heavy duty trucks for towing, I have an F-350 Powerstroke, and he's got a Chevy 3500 dually. These new trucks we are both getting are strictly for cruising the streets looking for babes and for offroad playing, and some hunting. I doubt they will ever be used to tow anything other than a small trailer with two jetskis on it.So we are not looking for heavy haulers. 
But you think he should get the 3500 anyway? I'll tell him that.


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

I would get the 3500,only becasue its the same truck,with a little better tires(those tires are an option o nthe 2500),and the ability to carry more weight. Guys on the dtr have checked them out,and the brakes,springs,rims,axles,everythign else seems to be the same.The dually has bigger everythign,but the SRW 3500,and 2500 seem to be the same truck.My 2500 is overwight quite abit,so Id get the 3500 if it were me. 3500 just sounds beefier than 2500 also  .More is better ,LOL


----------



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

Ahh! More is better! Always! Yes! I agree! 
Seriously though, I see what you mean. Thanks.


----------



## Joey D (Jan 6, 2002)

I must be the only one to say get the V10 and the 5 spd. If this truck is for 4 wheeling this is the combo. Stick with the 2500 as you are not after towing or hauling ability and get the steepest gears available. 
Will this truck be lifted?
I say the V10 for torque as it must have 450ftlbs or so. The Hemi does make great power for it's size but at a much higher 4400rpm peak tq. The 488 will be a great crawler with the NVG4500.


----------



## Swampbeast (Jan 29, 2003)

This was kinda what I was thinking in teh first place. 
Yes, it is going to be lifted. Anywhere from 8 inches to 12 inches. Something in that range. 
So for low range crawling, the V-10. Hmmmm


----------



## Crazygator (Jan 18, 2003)

I have built some 4x4 for the same reason and would offer this idea. If you thought your friend will tinker a lot with this truck (and sounds like he and you will) I would get the Hemi. I dont know of too many after market parts that would be bolt on the the V-10. But heck you could find boat loads for the Hemi V-8.

If you are into rock crawling I would think about the manual verses the auto. Of course I am talking very serious steep rock crawling. 

If your just after a cool lifted truck that will find a local mud hole every now and then, then either would be ok but I would lean toward the auto for that situation.

And since your going to lift anyway I would stay with the 3/4 over the 1 ton. I dont think he needs to waste any money on something he would never use anyway. Yeah its better for our business, but this is a play toy. Have fun!


----------



## Roger Dodger (Nov 8, 2002)

The V10 smokes the hemi - period. Unless you want a revving motor that produces a lower amount of torque early on get the hemi. If you want a grunt motor that produces high torque in the 1200-1800rpm range get the V10. Even the standard Cummins doesn't produce heavy torque until 2000 rpms & up. The HO version is a different matter. The hemi produces 20lb-ft. more torque than the 5.9 gasser did but at a whopping 4200-4400 rpm!!! No thanks. Gas mileage on the V10 isn't all that bad when compared to other gassers. My former 5.9 gasser faired by only 1.5 mpg better than my V10.... same truck pkg. apples to apples. And there are many aftermarket accessories avail for the V10 if one is diligent about searching for them. Mopar Perf. has some and things like the MSD plug wires, K&N, etc. are avail. as well.


----------



## Nozzleman (Feb 6, 2003)

Roger Dodger, I just wanted to correct a minor mistake in your above statement. That is, both Cummins whether Standard Output or High Output are at peak tourque at 1400 RPM and they hold it just about to the redline.


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

Ditto on Nozzlemans post, I have 2 friends with V10's they are strong for gas motors,but in no way does the low end torque match the Cummins. Another thing,graphs dont show is as the road speed increases the V10 peeters out a tad,and it starts to lose its torquey feel,where as the cummins is just getting started,its overcome its weight disadvantage and its turbo is spooled,the increased speed is putting a load on the engine,this is where the Cummins shines,it need a load to perform,roll on both from 60 mph,the HO cummins will pull with the V10 without even downshifting,from 1600.BTw most HO 2d gens dyno at 200-235hp and 485-575 ft lbs(rear wheel)bone stock. The same auto trans is used behind the V10,and diesel,the Cummins engine routinely tears 4th,3rd,and the lockup clutch right out of them due to its low rpm torque where the V10 has much less problems with slipping the tranny.


----------



## Roger Dodger (Nov 8, 2002)

Well, the torque chart in the Dodge Dealer's brochure (2000-2002) shows the standard 5.9 Cummins as having its curve rise later than the V10. I based my comment upon that. I would hope D.C. is not misprinting things. And the graph does indicate a lull or dip in V10 torque while the Cummins slightly rises and peters out at higher rpms.


----------



## Nozzleman (Feb 6, 2003)

The graphs can be misleading because they may not be graduated the same way for both engines.


----------



## Roger Dodger (Nov 8, 2002)

I got curious and pulled out that brochure and the graduations are identical. It definitely shows the V10 churning alot more torque at very low rpms with the Cummins close behind. V10 peters out sooner as the Cummins continues then plateaus. Not arguing my point, just restating what this graph shows, however right or wrong it is. 
Thing is, it was this chart, the limited supply of diesel in the forested areas I spend my time at, and the extra high cost of the diesel option that leaned me towards the gasser. At least the V10 performs far better than any other gasser.


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

Roger, your right the V10 is one strong motor.When Cummins built the ISB 24V version of the B series in 97,the dodge version is detuned quite a bit from what this engine is capable of.They reduced the torque at idle to only 350 ft lbs,so the light duty clutch would hold up in the 5 speed trucks.In bigger trucks the same engine has over 450 ft lbs at idle speed of 800RPM. Those bigger trucks have the 14" clutch to hold that though. Being a torque junkie like myself I thought you would get like to hear that. . This is also one of the reasons why the Cummins roll out s omuch better than a PSD with a standard and a trailer.You can just let the clutch out on a Cummins and the ECM will add fuel up to 350 ft lbs to keep it at idle RPM.It will literally pull the t railer away,even up hills at idle.Try that with a PSD it will stall right out.The PSD is much harder to drive gently with a 5/6 speed,they are touchy off the line.


----------



## Brickman (Jun 17, 2002)

> _Originally posted by John DiMartino _
> *.................................. This is also one of the reasons why the Cummins roll out s omuch better than a PSD with a standard and a trailer.You can just let the clutch out on a Cummins and the ECM will add fuel up to 350 ft lbs to keep it at idle RPM.It will literally pull the t railer away,even up hills at idle.Try that with a PSD it will stall right out.The PSD is much harder to drive gently with a 5/6 speed,they are touchy off the line. *


Running my PSD with a car hauling trailer (when I was hauling cars) with another car hauler using a Dodge I can see what John is saying, how ever I will stick with my PSD. I have yet to find a Dodge in this area that even wants to run with me. Every one I see I race and he either makes no effort to keep up or loses the fight.

Swamper I am ashamed of you wanting a Dodge.


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

Brickman,your comparing your chipped/propaned PSD to a stock Cummins. Let me under the hood of a Cummins for the same $$ you put in the PSD,and the Dodge Cummins will say bye bye to a Ford, Im not being a wise guy,the PSD just cant compete dollar for dollar with a Cummins when modified. PSD's also get into EGT trouble way before the Cummins does,even if you have the power you have to back off or melt the engine down. Propane helps you with this,but you still can get in EGT trouble pretty easy. The upside to a PSD is a chip is usually enough power for anyone sane(exc Dockboy) . . Dodge guys like to combine a fueling box(does similar thing Chip does),with injectors,mostly because you get more power,and they are affordable.


----------



## Brickman (Jun 17, 2002)

John what is the cost to get an extra 75 to 120 HP and the torque that comes with it on the Cummins? I can up grade that much with just a chip for less than $500. And because I have a friend that is dealer for chips I get the friend price which is even lower. Less than $300


----------



## plowking35 (Dec 21, 1999)

A fuel box for all 3 diesels are running around 800.00.
Dino


----------



## John DiMartino (Jan 22, 2000)

The edge comp box can be had on sale for 550-600 bucks. they were 500 last winter. No one pays 800 for them.You can get an easy 125hp from that box,and the truck drives great.The PSD with 110hp+ Chips that i have seen /driven do not have good driveability at all,they knock,and cackle like crazy,and they are best used as flip chips with a milder program around 75-80hp to run every day and use the 110+ for racing only. Tell me this where do you go from there on a PSD? Now you need injectors and custom chip= $$$ .The Dodge,pick you hp,you can streetably add another 50-125hp to the truck and still tow with reasonable egts and smoke control with a set of injectors that are reasonably priced,and you can keep your stock ones too.You need a turbo upgrade on either truck at this point.


----------

