# Pricing Kmart lot



## SureShotcarolina (Sep 7, 2018)

I’m new to pricing commercial jobs, but was contacted by a property manager for an old Kmart lot. LoopNet says the lot is roughly 12 acres. It’s a standard size Kmart lot with lots of spaces. I don’t know where to begin with pricing for 12 acres, especially since I can only buy bagged salt because I do not have a location to dump a load. I am in the CAROLINAS so it only averages 3 inches of snow a year but the ice just depends on the amount of rain. Any thoughts on pricing?


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

There's still KMarts open?


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## Ajlawn1 (Aug 20, 2009)

SureShotcarolina said:


> I'm new to pricing commercial jobs, but was contacted by a property manager for an old Kmart lot. LoopNet says the lot is roughly 12 acres. It's a standard size Kmart lot with lots of spaces. I don't know where to begin with pricing for 12 acres, especially since I can only buy bagged salt because I do not have a location to dump a load. I am in the CAROLINAS so it only averages 3 inches of snow a year but the ice just depends on the amount of rain. Any thoughts on pricing?


Start with 500lbs +/- and acre on average... Ice is going to take alot more! Do some math from there... Maybe they'll have bags of rock salt on blue light special for ya...


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

yea there's a few around still

Since you're new to commercial jobs; perhaps you shouldn't bid on a company that's nearing bankruptcy


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

Should probably only need to keep 12 to 15 parking spaces clean anyway. The rest of the lot will be empty.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

LapeerLandscape said:


> Should probably only need to keep 12 to 15 parking spaces clean anyway. The rest of the lot will be empty.


That's just for the employees...


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## Mike_PS (Feb 28, 2005)

again, please offer the new guy advice and/or suggestions on pricing...he's not asking whether or not the store will be open, etc.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Michael J. Donovan said:


> again, please offer the new guy advice and/or suggestions on pricing...he's not asking whether or not the store will be open, etc.


K...OP, do you really have to plow and salt all 12 acres if there are only 12-15 employees and customers there throughout the day?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

BossPlow2010 said:


> yea there's a few around still
> 
> Since you're new to commercial jobs; perhaps you shouldn't bid on a company that's nearing bankruptcy


This, K Mart/Sears stores are near death. But if you're determined. Go back say 10 years. Average out the storms. Calculate how much salt you will use, then go from there. What do you have for equipment?


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

In all seriousness, he said an "old Kmart lot" and mentioned the "property manager" not "store manager." The Kmart may not be an actual operating Kmart right now and there could be any number of reasons while it still needs to be maintained.


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## SureShotcarolina (Sep 7, 2018)

Randall Ave said:


> This, K Mart/Sears stores are near death. But if you're determined. Go back say 10 years. Average out the storms. Calculate how much salt you will use, then go from there. What do you have for equipment?


F350 super diesel with 8 foot plow. I have an f250 that I am considering putting a plow on if the price works out for this property.


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

SureShotcarolina said:


> F350 super diesel with 8 foot plow. I have an f250 that I am considering putting a plow on if the price works out for this property.


I like that "super diesel"

What equipment do you have for Deicing/ anti icing?


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## SureShotcarolina (Sep 7, 2018)

BossPlow2010 said:


> I like that "super diesel"
> 
> What equipment do you have for Deicing/ anti icing?


Last season I used push behind spreaders. I'm looking at getting 2- 800 pound tailgate spreaders.


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## SureShotcarolina (Sep 7, 2018)

Store is currently open but I’m not sure for how long as property manager wants to pay a flat rate for open store vs closed store. The flat rate for a closed store wouldn’t even cover the costs of a cheap plow.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

SureShotcarolina said:


> Store is currently open but I'm not sure for how long as property manager wants to pay a flat rate for open store vs closed store. The flat rate for a closed store wouldn't even cover the costs of a cheap plow.


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## SureShotcarolina (Sep 7, 2018)

Pa


cwren2472 said:


> In all seriousness, he said an "old Kmart lot" and mentioned the "property manager" not "store manager." The Kmart may not be an actual operating Kmart right now and there could be any number of reasons while it still needs to be maintained.


Store is open but I don't think for long. Property manager mentioned pricing for occupied building and unoccupied.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

SureShotcarolina said:


> Store is currently open but I'm not sure for how long as property manager wants to pay a flat rate for open store vs closed store. The flat rate for a closed store wouldn't even cover the costs of a cheap plow.


The one they closed down here all they plow is 2 drive lanes up to the storefront, and 4 loops around the building for fire lane access


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## LapeerLandscape (Dec 29, 2012)

We had an old Kmart here in Lapeer that eventually closed and didnt look good but then they redid the front and inside now there is a Marshalls and Michaels there. So there could be potential even if the store closes.


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

SureShotcarolina said:


> Pa
> 
> Store is open but I don't think for long. Property manager mentioned pricing for occupied building and unoccupied.


I would advise you to pass up this offer as I stated before. You'll save yourself a lot of headache money by not taking this property on


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

12 acres with bags... oy vey that would be a ball buster.

OP, look into dumping a pile on the lot and tarp and tire it if you dont have a yard. I did that for years so the trucks could stay on site and not have to run back and forth to get salt as I did not have dedicated salt trucks. You will loose some to the weather, but you can typically throw the big chunks on the ground a crush them up with the machine once the pile gets moisture in it.

2nd thing... 12 acres with 1 truck with a blade on it... the snow will have melted before you can make piles to charge for. Figure an hour per acre to get you started. If it starts snowing at 10pm, snows till 2am, will the property manager be OK with the snow being on the lot till 2pm in the afternoon? Were I plow snow the answer is no. If it stops while it is still dark out, when the day go'ers want a wet lot when they arrive.


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

And I am rusty with this stuff as I have been out a while now, but I think the quick figure was 50lb bag could do 10,000 square foot of pavement for some reason? Sound right?

Someone please correct me if this is a bad figure.

So figure 12 acres at about 522,000ish square feet. That would be 52 bags a night to load in a hopper. And that is if you only salt 1 time in a night. Then think if you go back to back to back nights of salting. Not to mention the cost


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Philbilly2 said:


> And I am rusty with this stuff as I have been out a while now, but I think the quick figure was 50lb bag could do 10,000 square foot of pavement for some reason? Sound right?
> 
> Someone please correct me if this is a bad figure.
> 
> So figure 12 acres at about 522,000ish square feet. That would be 52 bags a night to load in a hopper. And that is if you only salt 1 time in a night. Then think if you go back to back to back nights of salting. Not to mention the cost


That's only about 200# an acre Phil. Better double that to accomplish anything at all, and it's still too low to bid with.


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## BossPlow2010 (Sep 29, 2010)

Philbilly2 said:


> And I am rusty with this stuff as I have been out a while now, but I think the quick figure was 50lb bag could do 10,000 square foot of pavement for some reason? Sound right?
> 
> Someone please correct me if this is a bad figure.
> 
> So figure 12 acres at about 522,000ish square feet. That would be 52 bags a night to load in a hopper. And that is if you only salt 1 time in a night. Then think if you go back to back to back nights of salting. Not to mention the cost


When I figured it, I came up with 192 bags


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## iceyman (Mar 1, 2007)

SureShotcarolina said:


> Store is currently open but I'm not sure for how long as property manager wants to pay a flat rate for open store vs closed store. The flat rate for a closed store wouldn't even cover the costs of a cheap plow.


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## Freshwater (Feb 28, 2014)

The Sears here doesn't plow the whole lot. 
OP plan to plow 4acres of the lot at most. For the price of 2 tailgate spreaders, get a 1 small used v box. 

I agree with the consensus to pass on this lot.


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## m_ice (Aug 12, 2012)

Mark Oomkes said:


> There's still KMarts open?


I said the same thing when I was in Warren, MI. I saw it and literally almost hit a pedestrian and rear ended a box truck I was so suprised.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

In our town we had a Zellers that became a Target, then a Dollorama, Marks Work Warehouse, it keeps changing tenants. Property owners seem to stay the same. In the 90s it was a $60k account, it's half that now. Too many Dutchmen...


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## cjames808 (Dec 18, 2015)

PASS. You’d make more doing driveways and be home sooner. 

Target some small dental/medical offices or small strip malls.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

That's a lot of bags......

Ask them if they want the Blue Light Special


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## Mike_PS (Feb 28, 2005)

alright, back on point, enough with some of the unnecessary posts please


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## DeVries (Nov 27, 2007)

HEY I take offence to the dutchman comment 

J.K please continue


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

DeVries said:


> HEY I take offence to the dutchman comment
> 
> J.K please continue


Then consider yourself a Hollander.


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