# Slip and Fall Insurance question



## JayFan75 (Feb 7, 2016)

Wondering how you guys word your contracts regarding commercial properties. Do you put in Hold Harmless Agreements??? What to do if the owners won't sign them? Trying to limit my exposure to Slip and Fall liability.....but not sure there's a way....


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

The rub, there is nothing you can put in the contract with your client that will stop a 3rd party from taking you to court.
If there was we wouldn't need insurance.

How do you limit your exposure, don't cause any unsafe conditions.


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## JMHConstruction (Aug 22, 2011)

Ask your lawyer, not the plow guys. He/she will know much more. Like Sno said, not much you can do to avoid it. We all (or most :hammerhead have insurance for a reason.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

I have a generic hold harmless/not responsible for damage or injuries clause in my contract but like sno said there's nothing you can put into a contract that will protect you from the third party. Actually it won't even protect you from the client if they have a good lawyer in some cases. I have it in there so that hopefully they may think twice about it but they probably won't. Just have to pony up for the slip and fall insurance to cya. Not worth it to not have it. It's always a good idea to take pictures of your lots pre season and have them in the truck with you. Identify drains etc. so that if they get covered up you can uncover them to allow the lot to drain.


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## JayFan75 (Feb 7, 2016)

Appreciate the replies. Regretfully, most of my contracts are for large elderly housing complexes (on hilly terrain!)....and people who are in terrible physical shape. This year was my first slip and fall case in 22 years! I am going to contact my lawyer etc.... just wanted to see what other "legitimate" companies are doing.


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## Ben/Insurance (Oct 22, 2012)

Jay, we always recommend our clients have a hold harmless signed in their favor and wherever possible, have them listed as "additional insured"
by the housing complex (in your case). Sometimes they get it and sometimes they don't. Maybe you can post some signage at the entrance/exit indicating "caution/slippery surfaces"? I had a client do this and his GL insurance carrier said it helped a lot with his claims. Good, high quality insurance is always the backstop and lately we are seeing our clients choosing larger deductibles on general liability to get the premiums down (insurance companies love when you have some "skin in the game"). Contact your attorney to discuss the hold harmless agreement. Good luck.
Ben/Insurance


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## Philbilly2 (Aug 25, 2007)

JayFan75 said:


> ? Trying to limit my exposure to Slip and Fall liability.....but not sure there's a way....


Stop plowing snow is about the only way I know...


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## MSsnowplowing (Nov 1, 2012)

I have this in my formal contracts and I always take before and after pictures and keep a permanent log of times I was there and what was done.

*7. Indemnification.*

To the fullest extent permitted by law, the Client shall indemnify, defend and hold harmless the Snow Contractor, employees and subcontractors from and against any and all liabilities, costs, damages, and expenses for injuries or damage to persons or property resulting from any cause related to contractors work in, on or about the clients premises unless caused by the gross negligence of the snow contractor, contractor employees and subcontractors.

The Client shall also indemnify, defend and hold harmless the Snow Contractor, employees and subcontractors from and against any and all liabilities, costs, damages, and expenses (including without limitation attorneys' fees and other costs of defense) for injuries to persons or property which occur while Snow Contractor is not physically on premises while they are not in performance of their duties on days there are no Snow Storms.

Notwithstanding, I still got sued by a third party in Jan 2015 but with my pictures and logs, it fell back on the person and their personal responsibility so they ended up dropping the case against me before it even went to court.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

MSsnowplowing said:


> I have this in my formal contracts and I always take before and after pictures and keep a permanent log of times I was there and what was done.
> 
> *7. Indemnification.*
> 
> ...


Thumbs Up I like that one. It's better than mine. Maybe I can "borrow" it?


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## MSsnowplowing (Nov 1, 2012)

I was going to do you one better and post my formal contract but it won't let me post it.
Which is weird because it's just a word perfect document. If you want it shoot me a email.

got it, they changed the format, it has to a PDF now.
I'm tired was driving around from 4am to 4pm yesterday looking at trucks and then from 8 to 12, so all the neurons are not hitting right now.

Here you go.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

MSsnowplowing said:


> I was going to do you one better and post my formal contract but it won't let me post it.
> Which is weird because it's just a word perfect document. If you want it shoot me a email.
> 
> got it, they changed the format, it has to a PDF now.
> ...


Thumbs Up


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## shop king (Dec 16, 2010)

Thanks just what I was looking for !!


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

you had one slip and fall in 22 years, i'll trade you places in NJ for one season and you can add to that number quick! i'd be happy with one a year, and we salt like its going out of style. Everything is your fault, snow, slush, people cleaning off cars, overhang snow, refreeze, ice/snow under parked cars, curbs freezing up, not being there often enough, even 1-2hrs prior, not using proper chemicals, not good enough its just salt, they'll say you should have done more.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

Ramairfreak98ss said:


> you had one slip and fall in 22 years, i'll trade you places in NJ for one season and you can add to that number quick! i'd be happy with one a year, and we salt like its going out of style. Everything is your fault, snow, slush, people cleaning off cars, overhang snow, refreeze, ice/snow under parked cars, curbs freezing up, not being there often enough, even 1-2hrs prior, not using proper chemicals, not good enough its just salt, they'll say you should have done more.


Holy crap I'm glad I'm not there. That's pretty rough and almost to the point that I might not do it if that were the case here. Obviously we all carry slip and fall here but I know guys that have been doing it for 20 plus years and never been sued on a slip and fall.


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## FredG (Oct 15, 2012)

You have to have slip & fall, Just make sure you have salt present and your lot is safe, If your lot is safe very hard to have a lawsuit that will hold. It's no secret everybody should use caution under snow and ice conditions.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

FredG said:


> You have to have slip & fall, Just make sure you have salt present and your lot is safe, If your lot is safe very hard to have a lawsuit that will hold. It's no secret everybody should use caution under snow and ice conditions.


Bingo


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