# How to bill as quickly as possible



## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

I was wondering what some of you do to get bills to clients ASAP/STAT in a storm.
When we are out plowing day and night for 80 hours straight it's tough to get all the information in from all the plowers, salters, and shovelers to get over 300 invoices completed quickly.

Any information you can share about how you get bills out quickly after services would be appreciated.


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## EGLC (Nov 8, 2007)

I'm sure if you got a secretary and a spreed sheet you could fill it all out pretty quickly?? What if you gave each truck a booklet to jot down how many hours on lot "A", "B" and so on?? Plus they could write down weather conditions, etc


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

EGLC;1061744 said:


> I'm sure if you got a secretary and a spreed sheet you could fill it all out pretty quickly?? What if you gave each truck a booklet to jot down how many hours on lot "A", "B" and so on?? Plus they could write down weather conditions, etc


1. The secretary could not make it in as she was snowed in. We should have arranged to have her picked up.

2. They guys in the trucks have sheets where they record everything. The issue is they are out in the field over a 60 mile diameter, so it is hard to get all the sheets into the office. Some are subs and they plow for 50 hours and then head home for bed for another 15 hours.

So we run into a problem Collecting all the information in one location (the office) and getting the staff in to do the work.

Also, 300 invoices at 5 minutes each (organizing the sheets, recording the data, looking up pricing (everyone is different), logging and printing invoices, stuffing envelopes) is 25 hours of billing time! 5 minutes might be a little long, but maybe not.

Your suggestions are well taken.. keep 'em coming.


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## erkoehler (Sep 25, 2008)

That depends on how you are billing? Are you billing hourly, per push, etc?


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Thank god my visa doesn't send out a bill every time I make a purchase, or my hydro for every KWH. Set your billing up every 15 days net on receipt, or better yet seasonal. Billing should be regular but not over laxatative. JMO


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## swtiih (Nov 30, 2008)

Wish I had your problem. How did you come to have over 300 customers/invoices ? It didn't happen overnight. What changed ? As you grew how did you manage this ?
Each truck has to keep accurate records of where they where and for how long plowing xx hours salting xx lbs. Make up log sheets that work for what service is being completed. Have your drivers get it to the office fax,drop off,US mail,e-mail, phone,within 48 hours of service. Maybe hire a detailed orientated person to run your office ?


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

How about this. Since your guys have all the paper work done all ready in the truck .Have some self addressed envelopes for them. Then all they need to do is throw it in the first mailbox they past and you'll have it in a day or two.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

Mr.Markus;1061783 said:


> Thank god my visa doesn't send out a bill every time I make a purchase, or my hydro for every KWH. Set your billing up every 15 days net on receipt, or better yet seasonal. Billing should be regular but not over laxatative. JMO


15 days is a long time for snow and ice billing. Customers don't like getting snow bills when its 70 degrees out and not a sign of any snow/ice. Also, it's out of contract terms for some of my clients, and way too long for me to wait for that kind of cash flow.

We do bill lawn maintenance clients monthly, however any extras are billed when completed.

Thanks for the feedback.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

*oops- not 300 clients*



swtiih;1061979 said:


> Wish I had your problem. How did you come to have over 300 customers/invoices ? It didn't happen overnight. What changed ? As you grew how did you manage this ?
> Each truck has to keep accurate records of where they where and for how long plowing xx hours salting xx lbs. Make up log sheets that work for what service is being completed. Have your drivers get it to the office fax,drop off,US mail,e-mail, phone,within 48 hours of service. Maybe hire a detailed orientated person to run your office ?


I am sorry - I may have mis-spoke (or misled). We don't do 300 sites...we did perform over 300 services each time for the 12, 14, and 17 inch storms we had. In other words, if a truck went to Plow/Shovel/De-ice, that was a service. If a truck went to de-ice, that was a service. There were over 300 "Lines" filled out on the trucks' sheets - each one being a separate service visit.

Each one of these goes onto an excel sheet. We then have to match the correct price (hourly, per inch, per push, per bag, per application, etcetera) to each line, and then generate an invoice or fill out the proper form provided by the contractor.

If you would like to know more about us please PM me.

Thanks


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

grandview;1062012 said:


> How about this. Since your guys have all the paper work done all ready in the truck .Have some self addressed envelopes for them. Then all they need to do is throw it in the first mailbox they past and you'll have it in a day or two.


I like this idea, except it would be 2 or 3 days before we get the invoices, and I need the billing mailed out before that.

This does make me think of some of the newer phones that could take a clear enough picture of the log sheet and then email them into the office.

Thanks.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

*How we bill*



erkoehler;1061751 said:


> That depends on how you are billing? Are you billing hourly, per push, etc?


Some are billed hourly, some per push, some per inch, some per bag, some per application.


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## Mick76 (Aug 2, 2009)

Are you Resi or Commercial? Never heard of commercial being billed every storm.... We're set up for either 15 day or 30 day invoicing......

Build up a little nestegg money wise and go with Grandviews Idea... Easy approach and will only take a few days.....

Hell some of my accounts are paying me when its 60 degrees outside without a problem....

Good luck! Its a good problem to have!


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

Mick76;1062041 said:


> Are you Resi or Commercial? Never heard of commercial being billed every storm.... We're set up for either 15 day or 30 day invoicing......
> 
> Build up a little nestegg money wise and go with Grandviews Idea... Easy approach and will only take a few days.....
> 
> ...


Events in the area are billed as they occur because we do not get very many events here in the South. In fact, last year was a record setting year and we only had 4 snows. Seasonal pricing is a rarity down here as the variation from year to year (0 events to 6 events) is to great, versus in the north where your variance percentage is much less.

I appreciate your recommendations on changing how we bill, but the question is do you have suggestions on getting the bills out quickly, not how can I change my bill dates.

Thanks much.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Only thing that is left then is to put the bill in the door before your driver leaves.


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## redman6565 (Jul 14, 2008)

like grandview said, there's many options when it comes to covering a 60 mile span like you said. it's not like these guys are going to personally drop off a time sheet regularly. 

my thought is excel or microsoft word document that they can email you after every event. simply fill it out, email it to you, then you print it and calculate the bill.


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## asps4u (Sep 16, 2009)

Put a laptop in every truck with a wireless Wi-Fi card. Set up your database to be hosted on your website with all the formulas and billing parameters built-in for each client. Than instead of the guys filling out log sheets and getting them to you, they just fill out the info online right from the truck. Once they submit the info, you can have it billed immediately, either by email or you can print an invoice and mail it to them. This would allow you to have your invoices to your customers before the trucks even get done with their routes.


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## redman6565 (Jul 14, 2008)

asps4u;1062083 said:


> Put a laptop in every truck with a wireless Wi-Fi card. Set up your database to be hosted on your website with all the formulas and billing parameters built-in for each client. Than instead of the guys filling out log sheets and getting them to you, they just fill out the info online right from the truck. Once they submit the info, you can have it billed immediately, either by email or you can print an invoice and mail it to them. This would allow you to have your invoices to your customers before the trucks even get done with their routes.


benefit probably isn't worth something that elaborate. i would imagine that being very expensive, but i'm no IT guy.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

asps4u;1062083 said:


> Put a laptop in every truck with a wireless Wi-Fi card. Set up your database to be hosted on your website with all the formulas and billing parameters built-in for each client. Than instead of the guys filling out log sheets and getting them to you, they just fill out the info online right from the truck. Once they submit the info, you can have it billed immediately, either by email or you can print an invoice and mail it to them. This would allow you to have your invoices to your customers before the trucks even get done with their routes.


I really like the thought of this. Probably could be done through phones, if not something as elaborate as database, at least the reporting. I saw something like this just this morning on the Everest Snow Management web site (watch the video). It looked like an App for the phone.


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## asps4u (Sep 16, 2009)

Weeded!;1062054 said:


> I appreciate your recommendations on changing how we bill, but the question is do you have suggestions on getting the bills out quickly, not how can I change my bill dates.
> 
> Thanks much.





redman6565;1062088 said:


> benefit probably isn't worth something that elaborate. i would imagine that being very expensive, but i'm no IT guy.


He asked about getting the bills out quickly, not cheaply. The initial expense would be a bit much, but it could cut a lot of time and overhead to compensate, which would probably end up saving him money by the end of a season if he pays someone (secretary, office manager, etc) to do the "25 hours of billing" per storm. Although he could get a really good deal on buying 16 laptops at one time. (for the 16 trucks in his signature) Adding this to his existing website (assuming he has a website) would be very inexpensive for what he'd get back out of it. He already has all the info (excel spreadsheets) they would just have to add it to the site.



Weeded!;1062098 said:


> I really like the thought of this. Probably could be done through phones, if not something as elaborate as database, at least the reporting. I saw something like this just this morning on the Everest Snow Management web site (watch the video). It looked like an App for the phone.


Yes it could be done with any smart phone for sure (i-phone, droid, blackberry, etc). The database would be the same as your excel sheet, (your excel sheet is a database by the way) only it would be hosted online instead of on your computer, that way the info gets entered one time directly to your database instead of into a spreadsheet than transferred to yours. It's cutting the amount of work in half to reach the same end result, only in a lot less time.

All just food for thought...Good Luck


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## Mick76 (Aug 2, 2009)

asps4u;1062106 said:


> He asked about getting the bills out quickly, not cheaply.


Your right, but would that be the right choice with only a few billable storms a year? That cost would have a huge ROI but if thats what he wants to do go for it......


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

We have our guys turn in route sheets before they go home, subs that direct report and then go home MUST fax immediately before going to bed, really filling out the sheet SHOULD be done as they perform service so dropping a piece of paper in a fax and hitting send isn't that hard. Sure there's the coffee and ketchup stains and people who don't have a fax at home but most times it works.......


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## asps4u (Sep 16, 2009)

Mick76;1062113 said:


> Your right, but would that be the right choice with only a few billable storms a year? That cost would have a huge ROI but if thats what he wants to do go for it......


I agree 100%, and that's a decision he'll have to make for his business...


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## redman6565 (Jul 14, 2008)

forestfireguy;1062117 said:


> We have our guys turn in route sheets before they go home, subs that direct report and then go home MUST fax immediately before going to bed, really filling out the sheet SHOULD be done as they perform service so dropping a piece of paper in a fax and hitting send isn't that hard. Sure there's the coffee and ketchup stains and people who don't have a fax at home but most times it works.......


for most of us, that is the plan, but he stated he covers a 60 mile range, so i doubt his subs are driving all the way to his office location if he's working that far away.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

I missed it. Is he plowing commercial or residential?


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

grandview;1062178 said:


> I missed it. Is he plowing commercial or residential?


We plow almost exclusively commercial. Any residentials are mostly "favors."


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Weeded!;1062400 said:


> We plow almost exclusively commercial. Any residentials are mostly "favors."


how did they pay last yea? most commercials will milk it for 30 days no matter when you give them the invoice. Some companies only pay invoices twice a month so if you miss it your still not getting paid for 3 weeks.


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## redman6565 (Jul 14, 2008)

that's a good point too. what do your customers want? sounds like you want to bill regularly as the snow falls, some customers may not appreciate that. I have some that want to be billed bi-weekly, some once a month, others once a week. have you ever asked them what they want/expect?


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

*customers want them fast*



redman6565;1062540 said:


> that's a good point too. what do your customers want? sounds like you want to bill regularly as the snow falls, some customers may not appreciate that. I have some that want to be billed bi-weekly, some once a month, others once a week. have you ever asked them what they want/expect?


Our customers want the bills fast, and they want to get us paid.
Thanks for asking.

I saw in Snow Biz magazine yesterday "Crew Tracker Software." This has an "IVR" system for reporting. I have not looked at the web site yet. Does anyone know about this?


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

Thank you all for your help. I have settled on a solution.


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## redman6565 (Jul 14, 2008)

Weeded!;1063068 said:


> Thank you all for your help. I have settled on a solution.


good to hear.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Weeded!;1063068 said:


> Thank you all for your help. I have settled on a solution.


They have a word for people like you.P***k tease!

Well?


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

grandview;1063084 said:


> They have a word for people like you.P***k tease!
> 
> Well?


:laughing::laughing:


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## matter (Aug 22, 2009)

drivers have to get in time sheets immediately after a storm, either drop off at office, or fax, plus we call in times to the office after every location, after 24hrs and not turned in= no pay


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

Not sure you'll be able to get away with that no pay deal.....Highly doubt it's legal. In that situation we delay their pay, in our sub agreement it's spelled out that if their paperwork is delayed and it delays our billing, then it delays us getting paid which in turn delays them getting paid........simple and fair. Besides you'll potentially scare guys off with such rules........


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## bterry (Oct 30, 2003)

asps4u;1062083 said:


> Put a laptop in every truck with a wireless Wi-Fi card. Set up your database to be hosted on your website with all the formulas and billing parameters built-in for each client. Than instead of the guys filling out log sheets and getting them to you, they just fill out the info online right from the truck. Once they submit the info, you can have it billed immediately, either by email or you can print an invoice and mail it to them. This would allow you to have your invoices to your customers before the trucks even get done with their routes.


This is basically how I do it, except no wifi stuff. The guys all have the route lists in the truck, and it looks just like the form they fill out on the internet. Their bill for me automatically gets generated for them too. I do not accept their time until the sheets are keyed in on the internet. They are supposed to do it the following day and most times they do. All I have to do it download the data into my billing software (custom database), check it, and hit the print button. I send bills monthly.


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## matter (Aug 22, 2009)

i sub to a fairly large company, the no pay thing for not turning in paperwork within 24hrs has never be exercised, but still its motivation to get it in, another company i sub for, has in the agreement, must be turned in with in 48hrs, or else a 10% discount, after 72 hrs, thanks for donating your time, it seems most companies around the area are getting that way with their billing


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## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

well im glade to hear you picked something, i would like to know after its in use how welll you like it

couple problems that we all have,

1. getting the guys to acuatly do the papper work

2. getting it all turned in to use

3. entering all the data

4. actually getting them stamped and in the mail

5. getting paid


#1 get a gps solution, i have looked at a few and for the small amount of money they can tell you some big things, talked to a guy today, 4 inputs, 2 out puts on his until. so hes example, you could tell if the ignition was turned on, you could tell if the vehical aws in park or nuetral, you could tell if the plow was down (float) and you could tell if the spreader was on..in addition the out puts could be, starter/igntion kill, doors lock, doors unlock, aux transfer tank fuel pump on/off - this all goes into a report and you can start seeing dollars saved as well as accuate times and what is being done

2. - cheap easy way - just have the guys phone it in, and leave a voice mail - get a product like magic jack, the voice mail transfers to your email, and you always have it, it dates and time stamps it for you. Yes you have to listen to the message, but its not too bad

other option - get a "cloud based program" - im using service auto pilot, you can take your. A. set up routes for each truck, using the smart phone (which everyone has these days) they can log into a "mobil" beta, and veiw the route, punch on and off the jobs as needed....data is in real time, you could bill as they were doing the work- i just did it for lawncare and it works great . OR .... B set them all up in the system, and ask them to key in the work so that you just look it over. there is limited acccess so its not like they can mess up the whole thing, just do the data entry

3. - better computer program, or find a better way to use yours. I use to use QB. i use to open an invoice for a customer, then go thru route sheets finding each time for each truck when and what was done...hours..... then i figured out, if you do use QB, you can use the "time tracker" as a data entry, instead of flipping to find that 1 customer, you can just enter the data off of each sheet, exactly as its listed on the sheet , then QB will condense it all and put the work to the appropreate customers. the program i am using is better thant this even , but if your using QB, this will cut yoru time in half and requires less brain power

next - mailing them - use a print house, QB has there own now and for $15 per month, plus .70 per invoice they will print them, fold, envelope, stamp, return enveople and mail them out. my cost in house with no labor was close to .60 per ...so thats a big time saver, push a botton and they are done,
Email as many as possible tho - big savings

getting paid - possibly credit cards? i have a few customer we keep on file and bill the card each time a job is complete- that does help, otherwise, there are systems to get them to pay by check online, adn if they choose the paper method, a check scanner saves time from actually driving to the bank. and it can be done at any hour of the night unlike your local branch


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

elite1msmith;1067117 said:


> well im glade to hear you picked something, i would like to know after its in use how welll you like it
> 
> 3. - better computer program, or find a better way to use yours. I use to use QB. i use to open an invoice for a customer, then go thru route sheets finding each time for each truck when and what was done...hours..... then i figured out, if you do use QB, you can use the "time tracker" as a data entry, instead of flipping to find that 1 customer, you can just enter the data off of each sheet, exactly as its listed on the sheet , then QB will condense it all and put the work to the appropreate customers. the program i am using is better thant this even , but if your using QB, this will cut yoru time in half and requires less brain power
> 
> next - mailing them - use


Great post...
I am going to look at the QB time tracker. 
Once we have the invoices printed mailing is not really a problem for us.

Thanks much


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## elite1msmith (Sep 10, 2007)

they hickup with the time tracker - DO NOT put in the actual time. it will bill out your cusomer incorrectly. were it asks you for the hours put 1. thats it. QTY 1

if you do not, it will take yoru plowing rate and multiply it by the QTY of hours. but like i said you can enter the sites in the order that you did the work (which should be the order that your route sheets are in) and then QB will group the work to the appropreate customer for you to create an invoice.

mailing isnt that hard, but if it snows storm after storm, id rather pay 10 bucks and have them in the mail, and keep the needed sleep


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