# what to do when a customer refuses to pay?



## TinyGiant

i picked up a customer mid winter and met up with him walked the property and agreed to plow at 4" unless he called to ask us not to. 


that last storm we had in NH was 4-5 inches and happened to be warm the next day. I plowed all the accounts that didnt call and ask me to not come.. as i usually do. A few even called to double check that i was coming. 

so this guy ignores the bill for a month.. when its far overdue i emailed asking for him to pay the invoice asap since its overdue a month. He replied saying he didnt think it needed the plowing and is not going to pay. 


mind you this is a month after the work was done..he didnt mention this the day i plowed.. or when i sent the invoice that month.. 


is there anything i can do? or worth doing?




here is the discussion from email 


me-"please send payment asap. this is over a month over due now....(send with invoice)"

customer-"I haven't paid this bill because I wasn't expecting to be plowed that day. The snow was melted hours after you left! Please let me know how we can resolve this. Thank you!

me-"please let me know when you plan to make the payment. of all 25 of my accounts that my wife and i plowed that day you are the only one who hasn't paid up. We had 4+ inches that day and schools were canceled. Typically every plowing company plows on agreed depth automatically unless the client calls and asks not to plow. Ignoring bills doesn't make them go away, its inconsiderate to be thinking you didn't want to pay this the whole time and just ignoring the bill after we spent the time and gas servicing your property so you wouldn't have the hassle of dealing with it. 


here is the link to make the payment again."

customer"You have provided a respectable plow service thus far. It's a shame to have come to this disagreement. If you had called all 25 customers prior to plowing, many of them would have declined service due to the impending warm weather. Some, I'm sure, appreciated it. As for our household; we did not find it necessary and did not expect plowing into the Spring season. This bill will not be paid.

Regards,"

me-"We had some clients call us and ask us not to and some that called to make sure we were still coming. I believe it was stated when we met if you didn't want us to come you are to call. Plowing is a verbal agreement to automatically plow at an agreed depth. You asked me to come when it needed it not at will. If payment isn't received we will be forced to forward this to the collections agency we deal with. The work was done. Payment must be received. Sorry to be a stickler on this but it's ridiculous to just decide randomly not to pay someone for the work they were asked to do. Especially a small local husband and wife business just trying to make ends meet.
I will not be pushed around. You are outside of our route and we even added you late in the season. We went above and beyond trying to offer great service and spent far longer making sure your driveway was well plowed than we had to.

Please pay your bill. I hate putting a mark on peoples credit but. The agency will charge me 20% so if you want to send payment for 48 instead of 60 we can do that. But we spent our time and gas (which isn't cheap) on your property making your life easier..."

(note i havent contacted or use a collections agency.. but this guys arrogance might lead me to it lol)

customer-"Honestly, there was no snow on the ground beforehand, the weather was 50+ degrees before and after the storm. At some point a person assumes that the plow trucks are no longer working. When you first contacted me I had no idea what day was in question. I didn't even realize you plowed that day. But I considered paying this just to throw you some money and resolve the issue. But now I consider that unreasonable on my part.

I've worked for a small business so I know how it works, some people ignore the invoice. But at the end of the day we still tried to please the non-paying customers, because it never fails, at some point they would have to return and their money would be received one way or another. "


me-"so you are saying that if it snowed april 1st and it happened to be cold the whole week you wouldn't have expected me to come plow .. leaving your driveway with 4-5 inches of snow. you would have been upset that i didn't come. The city trucks were out plowing which means snow piles up at the ends of driveways. I'm not a mind reader.. which is why we come to an agreed plowing depth with customers. its quite the standard practice. 

I sent an invoice the day of the storm. there should be no question of what day we plowed. 

From the beginning you are telling me you are not paying me for the work i did. if you were considering "throwing me some money" you would have done that. Why put me through the hassle of having to chase down money due to us if you were "intending on paying". thats quite contradictory. Its unreasonable to not pay for work that was done... I've given you over a month to pay the invoice without a word from me. A having to wait a month to be paid for something that was invoiced the day after the storm is unreasonable. I didn't bug you guys and figured maybe you needed some time. I did send an invoice ..then later you guys tell me you were just ignoring me hoping it would go away. If a client doesn't pay i have no reason to go back and service them in the future especially when a client says.. eh i decide when i want to pay you for the work i agreed on. chances are they will do it again. Time is valuable and i don't like my time and money wasted. I wouldnt work for an employer that pays me when he feels like it. you wouldnt either. 

every tried this stunt with any other bills? would like to see what your phone company, mortgage or credit cards would say about you deciding you don't think you need to pay them. 


i am not being unreasonable. we discussed the plowing when you decided to hire us. if you had a problem you should have addressed it immediately rather than being inconsiderate and irresponsible and figuring ignoring the bill would make it disappear. I still cant understand how you think you are in the right for doing that. "


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## TinyGiant

last reply "Send this bill to collections and do not contact me EVER AGAIN." 


i dont really want to do this. why would someone want a bad mark on their credit for something stupid like this?


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## show-n-go

Wow. what an *******. drive into his lawn at 20-30 mph and drop plow. that will do mor than 60 bucks lawn damage


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## grandview

Call your local court and see if you can small claim him. If you can add a money for time spent trying to collect on him to.


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## IMAGE

Small claims court. The fees get added to his bill. He will likely not even show up to court, thus you will win automatcially. Then he will get a set # of days to pay, if he does not pay then there are other options, and the court administrator can help you with them. (likely filing a request for asset information, getting a judgement, and levying the funds from their bank account)


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## TinyGiant

its only $60 bux which isnt a huge deal. but this guy obviously is causing a problem..


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## swtiih

for 60 bucks write the guy off not worth the headache. Next year have contracts for all your customers that clearly spell out the begining and end of the season.


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## CAT 245ME

This is why I no longer bill per push on residentials. Charge a flat rate for the season, it's not worth the aggravation to have to chase money every spring. Been there done that, never again.


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## TinyGiant

of the 25 accounts we have everyone paid all season with no issues.. this guy did too.. just crapped out in the end i guess


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## Mackman

For 60 bucks i would just write it off as a loss.

On a side note i have the other problem with people calling me up wanting to know when the bill is going to come so they can pay me lol.

I forgot to bill one of my driveways. i only have 4. the lady called me asking where her bill was at. lol


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## csi.northcoast

We have put on the bottom of our invoices , " Any dispute of invoice must be made with in tem days in writing" but for sixty bucks i would write if off....or tell him you are going to send in navy seals


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## justme-

I have a few customers that just mail the check the day following the storm- no invoice needed. Several customers call asking for a bill - there are good customers out there.
What to do depends on how much you want the money, how much you want to make him pay and what you're time is worth. Make sure you have contracts for next year spelling out payment and terms. I head out when the municipal trucks do - between 2.5 and 3 on the road which is usually more in drives. 
If you want to persue, go to small claims. If your time is more valuable, forget it and move on. I'd remember him for the future, in case he calls in a few years.


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## TinyGiant

yeah i will probably not bother to pursue it. just hate when people pull that stuff and get away with it. lol 

i guess i know the real reason they needed someone mid season and why the old pow guy stopped plowing.. they probably pulled the same thing on him. 

i will definitely add the dispute line on the bottom of the invoices. thats a good idea


all of my other customers have been awesome paid the next day or within a couple days of invoice. theres always one in the crowd i guess.


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## PerfectEarth

Just reading this makes me angry....people have some nerve. What an A**!!!!!!!!!!


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## Mackman

TinyGiant;1282760 said:


> yeah i will probably not bother to pursue it. just hate when people pull that stuff and get away with it. lol


I hear ya. But it will cost you more to keep messing with this guy then what its worth.


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## RedArrow

That's the Great thing about KARMA, he'll get his!!! And if you maintain your professionalism the way you have, you will get it back in spades!! When it is all said and done, people still like to deal with honest and ethical businessmen. If this helps, look at it this way: 25 accounts x 10 snow events = 250 invoices. 1 write-off for 250 invoices is less then 1/2% bad debt. In my other business, I would kill to get it that low!!!


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## mcwlandscaping

These are the stories that make me wish we had a "do not service" list for PITA people...i certainly would have a few to add to the list!


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## blk90s13

mcwlandscaping;1282826 said:


> These are the stories that make me wish we had a "do not service" list for PITA people...i certainly would have a few to add to the list!


We have that on the wall in front the telephone in our family owned bed and breakfast

trouble makers non payers etc go on there  and lots of them call to make up but no thanks

What does he do for living ? I would try to stiff him in his place of work in return


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## wizardsr

His wish would be my command. Send it to a collection agency. You provided the service, you should get paid for your time. A collection agency won't make diddly on it, neither will you, but he may very well pay it at the threat of having his credit screwed up over $60, to get rid of the annoying phone calls at dinner time, etc. If he still doesn't pay, write it off as bad debt. Not worth the drive down to the court house for $60 though IMO.


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## DodgeBlizzard

I would. Just out of spite. You don't have to make a special trip to the Court House. Just next time you're near it, swing in and do what needs to be done. It's people like this that make me cringe. They know not to do this when they need you to do their dirty work. Then wait until the end of the season when they no longer need you, then stiff you. Then next year do the same thing to another sucker not willing to chase down the money owed to them. It's not about the money, it's about what's right and the principle of it all. So go to the court house. I DARE YOU. I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU. There, now you have to do it, cuz I double dog dared you. I would call the guy and say if you don't receive payment by May 15th, you're going to file a claim against them and then it will cost x amount MORE due to filing fees. You did the work and you know it's not right. So DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Sorry, I work too hard for my money. And don't forget the fact THEY could have shoveled out in the cold all by themselves.


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## goel

Plow him IN next winter.


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## GL&M

DodgeBlizzard;1282918 said:


> I would. Just out of spite. You don't have to make a special trip to the Court House. Just next time you're near it, swing in and do what needs to be done. It's people like this that make me cringe. They know not to do this when they need you to do their dirty work. Then wait until the end of the season when they no longer need you, then stiff you. Then next year do the same thing to another sucker not willing to chase down the money owed to them. It's not about the money, it's about what's right and the principle of it all. So go to the court house. I DARE YOU. I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU. There, now you have to do it, cuz I double dog dared you. I would call the guy and say if you don't receive payment by May 15th, you're going to file a claim against them and then it will cost x amount MORE due to filing fees. You did the work and you know it's not right. So DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. Sorry, I work too hard for my money. And don't forget the fact THEY could have shoveled out in the cold all by themselves.


We must think alike in PA. I do it for the principal. It costs a few bucks to do it, but it gets added onto their bill. If they don't pay on the court order, I file a lien and renew it every 5 years. Messes with thier head if nothing else. Screw them non payers.


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## stan the man

next year wait for wet and heavy snow. fill his driveway up with snow after if been plowing. if he has a garage. push it right go to the garage doors


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## jb1390

It might be too late now.....but in pursuing this, you most likely cost yourself a (semi) decent customer for next year. If he paid every other time, you are out some money now. Some people can afford to drop customers, most of us have to keep the ones we have. The COST of you plowing the driveway is much less than $60. So to write it off, the cost of fuel and wear and tear on one driveway out of many that day is negligible. And now the money that could have been made next year (300-400 at least?), won't be made. 

This does not imply that I agree with your customer...I would pay, because I believe it is ethical to do so.


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## albhb3

do you happen to know anyone with a quad axle haha


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## Mackman

jb1390;1282988 said:


> It might be too late now.....but in pursuing this, you most likely cost yourself a (semi) decent customer for next year. If he paid every other time, you are out some money now. Some people can afford to drop customers, most of us have to keep the ones we have. The COST of you plowing the driveway is much less than $60. So to write it off, the cost of fuel and wear and tear on one driveway out of many that day is negligible. And now the money that could have been made next year (300-400 at least?), won't be made.
> 
> This does not imply that I agree with your customer...I would pay, because I believe it is ethical to do so.


I have to disagree with you on this. My services are never free.

I pay my gas bill on time for the past 3 years. So if i mis a month do you think they gas company will be ok with this?? Cuz i was a good customer for the past 3 years. I dont think so.

To the OP write this joker off and never deal with them again. If he did it once he will more then likely do it again.


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## swtiih

If this guy was a seasonal customer he would have been the first to call had you not shown up. And if you would have told him the snow would melt in a few hours he would have refered you back to the fact he was a seasonal. Not the type of customer to have.


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## Mr.Markus

......It's $60! Let him get away with it.... it was a close call. Keep him as a customer. If and when he does it again you can call him on it and make him pay or not service his drive quoting precedence. It's cheaper to keep an existing customer than finding a new one. JMO


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## JUNKYARD

I am sure your time is worth more than the $60.00 that he beat you for next season remember his address he be calling again like you said he called mid season so he has stiffed other plowers. The majority of people are great to work for than you get one dirt bag


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## TPC Services

pull out your 45 and threaten to shoot his family first and than him, Go old school Moffia style on his but


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## tuney443

Don't do anything stupid that you'll regret.Filing a mechanic's lien usually get's people's attention.Cheap to do yourself and right to the point.I'll be doing one real soon for a deadbeat.


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## TPC Services

I still say send a death threat!!!!!!!!


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## Mackman

TPC Services;1287840 said:


> pull out your 45 and threaten to shoot his family first and than him, Go old school Moffia style on his but


Thats what im talking about Thumbs Up


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## Wayne Volz

*Contract may have helped*

Utilizing a service agreement may have helped you. Maybe not with the paying aspect, but you would have a recourse for not only your fee for the job, but the money to collect the fees charged.

I am a fan of having everything in writing and if they don't pay you may have a way to help you collect. A contract doesn't always mean you will get paid, but it certainly helps.

I also agree with the prior post about utilizing a collection agency. Many times they will pay when they realize you are serious about getting your money.

Good luck.


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## BossPlow2010

goel;1282927 said:


> Plow him IN next winter.


I've got somebody in mind for that next year 

el cheepo!


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## kevlars

I have a customer that will be getting plowed IN, next season, too!! I know my truck can make a REAL big pile in his driveway!!!

kevlars


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## theplowmeister

most of my advice is too late. for now all you do stop fretting and walk away, its not worth $60 .

24 years ago when I started plowing I decided I would not fight with a customer, 3 things happen when you do
1) you end up with high blood pressure
2) you loose ALL future revenues with that customer
3) he tells his neighbors that you are unreasonable and plow when not needed just to charge.

next time say why you plowed (4" storm and the weatherman are never wrong, so the 50 degree day is guaranteed to melt the snow) ask him what would have happened if you did not plow and the weather did not worm up?

if he still thinks he should not pay, Then suck it up and say "OK I will not charge you for that storm."
next time you get a storm where its going to melt you will know not to plow him.

He thinks your reasonable and trying to do a good job, and may pass your name on to other people. your BP wont rise and you can move on with your life.

I have a satisfaction guarantee "if your not satisfied with my plowing, its free" I have in 24 years had to give out ~$300 of free plowing. I have an average of 80 customers for 24 years.

it works for me.


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## mchur01

IMAGE;1282616 said:


> Small claims court. The fees get added to his bill. He will likely not even show up to court, thus you will win automatcially. Then he will get a set # of days to pay, if he does not pay then there are other options, and the court administrator can help you with them. (likely filing a request for asset information, getting a judgement, and levying the funds from their bank account)


Totaly agree, this is usualy our route, then they are added to the black list that is shared by some of the companies in our area, or my favorite, wait for a big storm and push all the snow from the road in front of there garage door and drive, they tend to settle pretty quick, lol.


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## Plowtoy

Mark this down as a "STUPID TAX" on your end and NEVER, NEVER, NEVER plow snow again with out a SIGNED CONTRACT.


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## Solaris

I'm sorry I can't believe somebody took the time to write such a detailed post over $60, not sure what the economy is like down in your parts, but $60? I understand and agree the customer is in the wrong, but if you start stressing over such petty small things your going to give yourself a heart attack....I seem to eat at least a debt or two like this every month, just a cost of doing business, for the amount of energy I have to expend chasing down bad debts in this price catigory, I can expend the same energy at generate 3 or 4 more jobs of like price, much better use of my time as far as I'm concerned.....payup


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