# Do I need a D.O.T. number?



## blackDiesel

If I plow with my personal truck for another company (sub contract) and don't have a business in my name, do I need a DOT number on my truck?


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## plowatnight

Might should check w/ the Department of Transportation


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## bighornjd

Only if your GVWR is over 10,000 lbs. What kind of truck and how's it set-up?


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## Brucester1

you don't have to have them unless your GVW is over 10000# or you haul a trailer. but since you are doing commercial work it can't hurt cause some law enforcement officers can be over zealous in their duties and try to ticket you. this is what i was told when i called the Department of Transportation.


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## wizardsr

bighornjd;1066612 said:


> Only if your GVWR is over 10,000 lbs. What kind of truck and how's it set-up?


To clarify, over 10k and used commercially (to make money or as a business vehicle).


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## skidooer

or up to the DOT officer you run into,way to many grey area's. lol


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## Rc2505

It's an extremley easy thing to get, so if I were you, I would go ahead and get it. It's alot easier to explain why you have one, than it is to come up with a reason you don't have it.


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## blackDiesel

Good info, I appreciate your time everyone... I have a 2500 Chevy with a straight blade Boss 8'2 on it. Its not lettered commercially, so in other words its a pickup with a plow. I believe the company that I would be working for requires me to put a magnet on the sides depicting their name. other than that, I would have a hard time believing the truck is over 10,000 lbs??? Still get a D.O.T number?


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## bighornjd

You should be fine unless your running a big salter loaded to the gills, in which case you will be overweight for the truck's GVWR anyway, so you would end up with a ticket just the same. You should be good to go without it unless of course you pull a trailer regularly for commercial use. For just plowing though, no worries.


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## NoFearDeere

No, if you dont cross state lines.


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## wizardsr

blackDiesel;1066784 said:


> Good info, I appreciate your time everyone... I have a 2500 Chevy with a straight blade Boss 8'2 on it. Its not lettered commercially, so in other words its a pickup with a plow. I believe the company that I would be working for requires me to put a magnet on the sides depicting their name. other than that, I would have a hard time believing the truck is over 10,000 lbs??? Still get a D.O.T number?


Nope, a 3/4 ton's GVWR is under 10k, you can verify this on your door sticker. No DOT number needed.

In terms of crossing state lines, the criteria is the same on whether or not you need a DOT number. The difference is if not crossing state lines, you simply need to have it available upon request (in the truck somewhere, in your memory, etc.). If crossing state lines, it needs to be displayed on the outside of the vehicle. Again, the criteria doesn't change, but the display requirements do. We put the numbers on the trucks to make everyone's lives a little simpler, even though it's not technically required. I can't expect employees to know our DOT number off hand, and it's just as easy to stick them on when having the truck lettered.


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## Mick

Your GVW is likely 9600 so, no DOT # is required. You may have a magnetic sign, but is your vehicle registered & insured for commercial work? That would be the bigger issue.


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## WIPensFan

NoFearDeere;1067458 said:


> No, if you dont cross state lines.


State lines don't matter in WI and most other states. As everyone has said, 10000# and over for commercial use, even if you're staying within the state.


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## JDiepstra

1. Question: Who needs to obtain a Michigan Intrastate USDOT number?
Answer: All carriers or operators of commercial motor vehicles that operate solely in the state of Michigan. A Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in commerce as defined in Act 181, PA 1963, CFR 49, part 390.5 when the vehicle:
o Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 10,001 lbs. or more, whichever is greater; or
o Is designed or used to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation; or
o Is designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers, including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation; or
o Is used in transporting material found by the Secretary of Transportation to be hazardous under 49 U.S.C. 51 transported in a quantity requiring placarding under regulations prescribed by the Secretary under 49 CFR, subtitle B, chapter 1, subchapter C.

Guys I am pretty sure you are all giving him some bad info. As you can see it is vehicles with GVWR, GCWR, GVW, or GCW of over 10,000 lbs. I can assure you, any 3/4 ton is going to have a GCWR of over 10,000 lbs, which means basically ANYONE IN MICHIGAN WITH A 3/4 ton or bigger WORK TRUCK needs a MI DOT number. Now, to the OP, I would hope you would man up and go legit with this plowing. Go legit, pay taxes, get your DOT and insurance. If you wanna be a hack, I guess that's your choice.


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## JDiepstra

............


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## Mick

GVWR for his truck is 9200#

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_GVWR_of_Chevrolet_2500


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## JDiepstra

Mick;1067772 said:


> GVWR for his truck is 9200#
> 
> http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_GVWR_of_Chevrolet_2500


Who cares? Whats the GCWR? I assure you it's over 10K


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## NoFearDeere

IL State Troopers all say no DOT number needed unless crossing state lines unless your talking some big weight otherwise they dont care. They just see the semi's hauling gravel and blacktop and smile...payup


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## WIPensFan

NoFearDeere;1067802 said:


> IL State Troopers all say no DOT number needed unless crossing state lines unless your talking some big weight otherwise they dont care. They just see the semi's hauling gravel and blacktop and smile...payup


I looked up Illinois, and they are not one of the states where you need a number if you're operating intrastate ( within state lines ).


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## Mackman

I never had a DOT number and no one ever cared. just my 2cents.


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## Newdude

Sorry if I am hijacking...but......If say I decided to throw a blade on my 04 hd (GWVR 9200) and start plowing driveways to make $$$, would a DOT number be needed?


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## ajslands

Newdude;1067829 said:


> Sorry if I am hijacking...but......If say I decided to throw a blade on my 04 hd (GWVR 9200) and start plowing driveways to make $$$, would a DOT number be needed?


If you are over 10,001 pounds then yes!


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## MileHigh

It's not about what your truck weighs, or how much weight is in it...it's about how much your axles are rated to carry. GVWR.

So if your commercial (depending on state, I know MASS is exempt) you should pretty much have the dot numbers posted on your rig. Most 3/4 ton are around 9k GVWR...If you ever have to tow a trailer, the axles on the trailer would put you over the 10,001# limit. 

Any 1 ton dually would be over 10k GVW, and would need dot#s posted on rig.

There free anyways.

From the state site.

To help ensure the safety of large trucks on roadways, most commercial motor vehicles-including those used in agricultural operations for transporting livestock and produce-must have a U.S. Department of Transportation (US DOT) identification number, according to Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. Federal regulations define a commercial motor vehicle as any self-propelled or towed vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating, a gross combination weight rating, or a gross combination weight of 10,001 or more pounds. The regulations apply to all commercial motor vehicles traveling (intrastate) as well as between states (interstate).

Definition of Commercial Motor Vehicle as per Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations Part 390.5 for the purpose of compliance with DOT Marking Requirement 390.21:

# Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property when the vehicle:
# Has a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross combination weight of 10,001 pounds or more;
# Is Designed to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation;
# Is designed to transport 16 or more people including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation;
# Is transporting hazardous materials in quantities requiring the vehicle to be placarded. (There is no weight threshold for placarded vehicles and applies to both intrastate or interstate operations.)
****** Effective January 1 2003 All Intrastate operators of commercial motor vehicles with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross combination weight of 10,001 pounds or more domiciled in the following states must now secure and display a USDOT number: Alabama, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, New York, Ohio, Oregon, South Dakota, Tennessee, Utah, West Virginia & Wisconsin.
****** MARYLAND: A DOT Number is required for INTRASTATE NON HAZ MAT carriers. A number must be applied for offline and will take 4 to 6 weeks for the state to process. 


It looks like there are a few states where you have to DISPLAY the numbers..and others where the posting of the numbers are not required...my state of CO...the posting of them is required.


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## Mackman

Some people are putting way to much thought on this.


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## MileHigh

DOT numbers are important cause if you get stopped by DOT and are not in compliance....

They can shut your rig down right there on the spot.

I've gone threw a few weigh stations down here...and there are always a few guys totally screwed over for the day for not having the right stuff.

BTW...you need a fire extinguisher and safety triangles as well.


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## Mackman

MileHigh;1067847 said:


> DOT numbers are important cause if you get stopped by DOT and are not in compliance....


In all my years in trucking. I never seen the DOT mess with a plow truck. Also never seen them mess with anything in the middle of a snow or ice storm.


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## MileHigh

Mackman;1067850 said:


> In all my years in trucking. I never seen the DOT mess with a plow truck. Also never seen them mess with anything in the middle of a snow or ice storm.


Well I guess it's all about where you are...

DOT runs rampant around here...

I'd rather be straight up then just figure I'd never run into one, but that's just me.


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## Mackman

MileHigh;1067852 said:


> Well I guess it's all about where you are...
> 
> DOT runs rampant around here...
> 
> I'd rather be straight up then just figure I'd never run into one, but that's just me.


Thats ture. I guess in CO they are crazy. I know in PA they just want big trucks.


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## WIPensFan

Never had DOT #'s on any trucks before. 2 weeks ago one of my 1 ton dumps got pulled over for not having the numbers on it. Had to fix license plate light bulb as well as rear marker lamp. Also needed to get a safety inspection($100.00) fire extinguisher and safety triangles. Did not get a ticket, just needed to become compliant within 15 days. PITA! I will put them on all trucks - even pickups - as they haul trailers sometimes.

P.S. didn't the weight requirement used to be higher than 10000#??


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## Mick

JDiepstra;1067782 said:


> Who cares? Whats the GCWR? I assure you it's over 10K


DOT cares (US and State). He's talking about his state DOT and as some have pointed out, each state sets its own rules (some states require USDOT #s). That's part off the reason I went from a one ton to a 3/4 ton, I still have a commercial plate and insurance but do not (actually can not) get a commercial inspection nor a state DOT # BECAUSE the GVWR is under 10,001. I pull a trailer *to haul my own stuff, *but it is licensed for personal use (yes, that's legal, I checked it all out before I registered the trailer). If I go out of state, it would be for personal use and not with the trailer. I have no business related functions that would take me out of state so USDOT would never apply, again because I'm under 10,001 GVWR.


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## x.system

blackDiesel;1066784 said:


> Good info, I appreciate your time everyone... I have a 2500 Chevy with a straight blade Boss 8'2 on it. Its not lettered commercially, so in other words its a pickup with a plow. I believe the company that I would be working for requires me to put a magnet on the sides depicting their name. other than that, I would have a hard time believing the truck is over 10,000 lbs??? Still get a D.O.T number?


If your going to be displaying another companies name, why not use their DOT number as well?

A friend of mine does truck lettering and he's been getting 2 or 3 new customers a week due to DOT numbers. DOT will shut you down on the spot if your not in compliance around here.

Another friend of mine, last year, plows 2 or 3 driveways for his family members. He didn't have any kind of warning lights or lettering on his truck but was pulled over and got a $500 ticket for no lettering on his truck. He sold the plow and payed his ticket and quit plowing.


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## Brucester1

a friend of mine that works for his family's cement company was pulled over on I94 by the DOT last week. he was ticketed for not having the name of his town on his truck. the state is broke they will make reasons...


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## Green Grass

try this website and fill out the step by step help in the middle box http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/


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## Green Grass

Brucester1;1067931 said:


> a friend of mine that works for his family's cement company was pulled over on I94 by the DOT last week. he was ticketed for not having the name of his town on his truck. the state is broke they will make reasons...


the name of the city you operate out of and state are required by every state I was told a few years ago. The good news in MN the ticket was cheap.


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## blackDiesel

What a topic I started! Thanks for all the info...


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## wizardsr

JDiepstra;1067782 said:


> Who cares? Whats the GCWR? I assure you it's over 10K


Maybe you could tell us what GCWR stands for...

Maybe you could also tell us how GCWR has any effect on whether or not a simple 3/4 ton plow truck needs a DOT number.

If he's pulling a trailer, GCWR (I'll save you the time, Gross Combination Weight Rating) comes into play, but DOT isn't concerned about the trailer he's not pulling when he's out pushing snow...


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## JDiepstra

wizardsr;1068445 said:


> Maybe you could tell us what GCWR stands for...
> 
> Maybe you could also tell us how GCWR has any effect on whether or not a simple 3/4 ton plow truck needs a DOT number.
> 
> If he's pulling a trailer, GCWR (I'll save you the time, Gross Combination Weight Rating) comes into play, but DOT isn't concerned about the trailer he's not pulling when he's out pushing snow...


You're pretty smug, especially considering you're wrong.


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## Mackman

I dont think you need one for plowing.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/registration-licensing/gettingstarted/guide0.10.htm

It talks about moving cargo and passengers. Says nothing about plowing at all. USDOT number is more for trucking companys then joe blow with a snowplow.

*Companies that operate commercial vehicles transporting passengers or hauling cargo in interstate commerce must be registered with the FMCSA and must have a USDOT Number. Also, commercial intrastate hazardous materials carriers who haul quantities requiring a safety permit must register for a USDOT Number. The USDOT Number serves as a unique identifier when collecting and monitoring a company's safety information acquired during audits, compliance reviews, crash investigations, and inspections.

New-Entrant Program
All first-time carrier applicants for a USDOT Number will be automatically enrolled in the FMCSA New Entrant Safety Assurance Program. This program requires new entrants to pass a safety audit and maintain acceptable roadside safety performance over an initial 18-month period before they are given permanent registration status. In most cases, companies operating exclusively as brokers or non-vehicle-operating shippers or freight forwarders do not need to obtain a USDOT Number*

BTW i wouldnt even think about getting a DOT number. I just got my own one about 3months ago cuz i went into trucking. My audit is coming up. What a nightmare. Alot of BS paperwork.


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## Mick

wrong? 

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capacity/vehicle/gcwr.htm


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## JDiepstra

Do u understand the difference between gcw and gcwr? If u do, go back to page 1, read the part I put in red, and u will see why he does need a DOT number in his home state of Michigan.


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## MileHigh

I don't see why it's so hard to see??..

The door jamb on your truck will tell you your GVWR.

If your a commercial truck (any truck that makes money) and your GWVR is over 10,000 pounds...you will need a usdot # posted on your vehicle.

If your GVWR is under 10,000 pounds...you DO NOT NEED a number UNLESS your towing a TRAILER...cause that will put your combined axle weight ratings well over 10,000.

So most 3/4 ton do not need the usdot numbers posted as they are under the 10,000 GWVR...even if they have a crap ton of crap in the back....as it is not what you weight...but what your axles are rated to weight. Towing and Hauling are Two different things here.... But as soon as you tow anything, your over...I tow all the time, I know many of you don't so, you should be just fine.

Most one tons need the numbers as they are over....

CHECK YOUR DOOR JAMB...my lord.


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## jomama45

MileHigh;1068484 said:


> CHECK YOUR DOOR JAMB...my lord.


I did, but there's no GCWR on it.............


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## MileHigh

jomama45;1068492 said:


> I did, but there's no GCWR on it.............


who cares?


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068498 said:


> who cares?


Hey Mr Genious, go back to the first page and check the part that I highlighted, if you are even able to read.


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068484 said:


> I don't see why it's so hard to see??..
> 
> The door jamb on your truck will tell you your GVWR.
> 
> If your a commercial truck (any truck that makes money) and your GWVR is over 10,000 pounds...you will need a usdot # posted on your vehicle.
> 
> If your GVWR is under 10,000 pounds...you DO NOT NEED a number UNLESS your towing a TRAILER...cause that will put your combined axle weight ratings well over 10,000.
> 
> So most 3/4 ton do not need the usdot numbers posted as they are under the 10,000 GWVR...even if they have a crap ton of crap in the back....as it is not what you weight...but what your axles are rated to weight. Towing and Hauling are Two different things here.... But as soon as you tow anything, your over...I tow all the time, I know many of you don't so, you should be just fine.
> 
> Most one tons need the numbers as they are over....
> 
> CHECK YOUR DOOR JAMB...my lord.


Again, go back and read the red part. You obviously have no idea what you are talking about so you should stop, or, do some research, and then post again with factual information. You don't know the difference between GCWR and GCW......., or, the definition of either it appears.


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## MileHigh

MileHigh;1067842 said:


> It's not about what your truck weighs, or how much weight is in it...it's about how much your axles are rated to carry. GVWR.
> 
> So if your commercial (depending on state, I know MASS is exempt) you should pretty much have the dot numbers posted on your rig. Most 3/4 ton are around 9k GVWR...If you ever have to tow a trailer, the axles on the trailer would put you over the 10,001# limit.
> 
> Any 1 ton dually would be over 10k GVW, and would need dot#s posted on rig.
> 
> There free anyways.
> 
> From the state site.
> 
> To help ensure the safety of large trucks on roadways, most commercial motor vehicles-including those used in agricultural operations for transporting livestock and produce-must have a U.S. Department of Transportation (US DOT) identification number, according to Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations. Federal regulations define a commercial motor vehicle as any self-propelled or towed vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating, a gross combination weight rating, or a gross combination weight of 10,001 or more pounds. The regulations apply to all commercial motor vehicles traveling (intrastate) as well as between states (interstate).
> 
> Definition of Commercial Motor Vehicle as per Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations Part 390.5 for the purpose of compliance with DOT Marking Requirement 390.21:
> 
> # Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property when the vehicle:
> # Has a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross combination weight of 10,001 pounds or more;
> # Is Designed to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation;
> # Is designed to transport 16 or more people including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation;
> # Is transporting hazardous materials in quantities requiring the vehicle to be placarded. (There is no weight threshold for placarded vehicles and applies to both intrastate or interstate operations.)
> ****** Effective January 1 2003 All Intrastate operators of commercial motor vehicles with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross combination weight of 10,001 pounds or more domiciled in the following states must now secure and display a USDOT number: Alabama, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Michigan, Minnesota, New York, Ohio, Oregon, South Dakota, Tennessee, Utah, West Virginia & Wisconsin.
> ****** MARYLAND: A DOT Number is required for INTRASTATE NON HAZ MAT carriers. A number must be applied for offline and will take 4 to 6 weeks for the state to process.
> 
> It looks like there are a few states where you have to DISPLAY the numbers..and others where the posting of the numbers are not required...my state of CO...the posting of them is required.





JDiepstra;1068514 said:


> Again, go back and read the red part. You obviously have no idea what you are talking about so you should stop, or, do some research, and then post again with factual information. You don't know the difference between GCWR and GCW......., or, the definition of either it appears.


Look JDip****ra...I previously posted the exact same thing that you are trying to say I don't understand...as I have quoted it above.

I agree with you one hundred percent on this one..people need the usdot numbers...the thing is the gcwr is not readily available information and hence is not enforced like the gvwr is. I have gone through about 10 checkpoints in the last 4 years and have talked about it with the agents each time and it's crystal clear.

If the gcwr is enforced...it means anybody in a commercial vehicle that happenes to be an acura mdx is needed as it has a gcwr of over 10k...and pretty much any other SUV there guy.

Your probably one of those fools who talk a bunch of crap about this subject but doesn't run usdot numbers...lol.


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068525 said:


> Look JDip****ra...I previously posted the exact same thing that you are trying to say I don't understand...as I have quoted it above.
> 
> I agree with you one hundred percent on this one..people need the usdot numbers...the thing is the gcwr is not readily available information and hence is not enforced like the gvwr is. I have gone through about 10 checkpoints in the last 4 years and have talked about it with the agents each time and it's crystal clear.
> 
> If the gcwr is enforced...it means anybody in a commercial vehicle that happenes to be an acura mdx is needed as it has a gcwr of over 10k...and pretty much any other SUV there guy.
> 
> Your probably one of those fools who talk a bunch of crap about this subject but doesn't run usdot numbers...lol.


Wow clever with insults and a genious, how amazing. I have MiDOT numbers. That's all I need. I am also the only person to correctly answer the OP's question. What is funny to me is that you still don't know what GCWR stands for. You can call all the names you want, but you're still wrong. Here is a hint for you... a GCWR has nothing to do with whether or not your are towing a trailer. You can have a GCWR of over 10,000 lbs and not be towing anything. Amazing huh?


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## MileHigh

JDiepstra;1068533 said:


> Wow clever with insults and a genious, how amazing. I have MiDOT numbers. That's all I need. I am also the only person to correctly answer the OP's question. What is funny to me is that you still don't know what GCWR stands for. You can call all the names you want, but you're still wrong. Here is a hint for you... a GCWR has nothing to do with whether or not your are towing a trailer. You can have a GCWR of over 10,000 lbs and not be towing anything. Amazing huh?


Holy moly...your not that bright...

Are you serious...

My f250 has a gcwr of 16k UNLOADED, and a gvwr of 9k no matter what the hell im doing.

You think that this info is only held by smart people or something?


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## MileHigh

I'm saying that in my state the GVWR is what is enforced...not the gcwr...

go plow your lame driveways in your dying economy in MI.


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068538 said:


> Holy moly...your not that bright...
> 
> Are you serious...
> 
> My f250 has a gcwr of 16k UNLOADED, and a gvwr of 9k no matter what the hell im doing.
> 
> You think that this info is only held by smart people or something?


OK so 16K is more than 10K right? So in MI, he needs a number.


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## MileHigh

jdiepstra;1068543 said:


> ok so 16k is more than 10k right? So in mi, he needs a number.


yup.........

basically anybody in a half ton or bigger truck needs one if you want to get technical.


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068540 said:


> I'm saying that in my state the GVWR is what is enforced...not the gcwr...
> 
> go plow your lame driveways in your dying economy in MI.


Why would you tell us what is enforced in your state, when the OP was clearly asking about MI? Seems  to me.

My economy is just fine payup


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## JDiepstra

MileHigh;1068545 said:


> yup.........


OK we agree to agree. Have a good night ussmileyflag


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## blackDiesel

Now that was fun to read!!!


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## JDiepstra

blackDiesel;1068590 said:


> Now that was fun to read!!!


Hahaha All in good fun! No hard feelings!


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068533 said:


> Wow clever with insults and a genious, how amazing. I have MiDOT numbers. That's all I need. I am also the only person to correctly answer the OP's question. What is funny to me is that you still don't know what GCWR stands for. You can call all the names you want, but you're still wrong. Here is a hint for you... a GCWR has nothing to do with whether or not your are towing a trailer. You can have a GCWR of over 10,000 lbs and not be towing anything. Amazing huh?


JD, you are the one that clearly has absolutely no frickin idea what GCWR is or how it is figured.

A pickup NOT towing a trailer that has a GVWR of 10k or less does NOT need USDOT numbers.


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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068690 said:


> JD, you are the one that clearly has absolutely no frickin idea what GCWR is or how it is figured.
> 
> A pickup NOT towing a trailer that has a GVWR of 10k or less does NOT need USDOT numbers.


I knew, as soon as I saw that you posted, that it would be a stupid post. In Michigan, you do. That's what this thread is about. Get a clue fella.


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068694 said:


> I knew, as soon as I saw that you posted, that it would be a stupid post. In Michigan, you do. That's what this thread is about. Get a clue fella.


Stupid post eh? Really I think you need to get a clue simce you obviously don't know how to figure GCWR.

Here is a hint for you GCWR = GVWR(truck) + GVWR(trailer). So if you are not pulling a trailer you don't have a GCWR.


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## toby4492




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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068698 said:


> Stupid post eh? Really I think you need to get a clue simce you obviously don't know how to figure GCWR.
> 
> Here is a hint for you GCWR = GVWR(truck) + GVWR(trailer). So if you are not pulling a trailer you don't have a GCWR.


You see though, there is this letter at the end "R", which means rating..... Just because you are not towing a trailer that puts you over 10K, does not mean your truck is not rated to do it. It is the RATING that crates the need for the numbers. Yes, your dumbness continues. Keep digging.


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## snocrete

toby4492;1068699 said:


>


That is so awsome.


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## toby4492




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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068700 said:


> You see though, there is this letter at the end "R", which means rating..... Just because you are not towing a trailer that puts you over 10K, does not mean your truck is not rated to do it. It is the RATING that crates the need for the numbers. Yes, your dumbness continues. Keep digging.


Since you are so smart your highness. Is there a "GCWR" on your door label?


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## cretebaby

snocrete;1068703 said:


> That is so awsome.





toby4492;1068704 said:


>


Could one of you two bring the popcorn I am all out?


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## toby4492

That's about the best I can do Scotty. Free refills available at my avatar LMAO


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## toby4492




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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068705 said:


> Since you are so smart your highness. Is there a "GCWR" on your door label?


I fail to see how a GCWR on my door as anything to do with how smart I am. I can't see the truck right now anyway. 
You're just digging deeper.


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068714 said:


> I fail to see how a GCWR on my door as anything to do with how smart I am. .


That's alright, you _fail_ to understand how GCWR is figured.

You knoiw as well as I do that there is no "GCWR" on your door label.

Would you agree that MI requirements for DOT number are identical to the feds?


----------



## JDiepstra

Here you go..... the GCWR for my truck is 20,000. Just so you know, that's more than 10,000.

http://dodgeram.info/2004/load-tow/2500.html


----------



## toby4492




----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068715 said:


> That's alright, you _fail_ to understand how GCWR is figured.
> 
> You knoiw as well as I do that there is no "GCWR" on your door label.


GCWR is the maximum weight of truck + trailer. What's so hard to understand about that? I get it. Do you?


----------



## cretebaby

toby4492;1068713 said:


>


Pizza?

You da man Toby. :laughing:


----------



## toby4492




----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068715 said:


> That's alright, you _fail_ to understand how GCWR is figured.
> 
> You knoiw as well as I do that there is no "GCWR" on your door label.
> 
> Would you agree that MI requirements for DOT number are identical to the feds?


No, I would not. Michigan has tightened it's requirements in an attempt to generate more revenue. I hope we can at least we can agree that that is the purpose of the DOT numbers!


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068718 said:


> GCWR is the maximum weight of truck + trailer. What's so hard to understand about that? I get it. Do you?


Wrong "GCWR".

That particular one is not a legal rating, since it is not on the dorr label, and is not what require a DOT number.


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068723 said:


> Wrong "GCWR".
> 
> That particular one is not a legal rating, since it is not on the dorr label, and is not what require a DOT number.


OK, this is really getting old. Go to page one and read my post, specifically the part I colored RED. In MICHIGAN, a DOT number is required if the GVWR or the GCWR is over 10,000.

Sorry fella, you're wrong. Gonna keep digging?

And LMAO, a rating is only legal if it's on the door sticker? LMAO!!!!!!!!!


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068722 said:


> No, I would not.


Hmmm. They look the same to me.



MileHigh;1067842 said:


> Definition of Commercial Motor Vehicle as per Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations Part 390.5 for the purpose of compliance with DOT Marking Requirement 390.21:
> 
> # Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in interstate commerce to transport passengers or property when the vehicle:
> # Has a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight (GVW) or gross combination weight of 10,001 pounds or more;
> .





JDiepstra;1067736 said:


> . A Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in commerce as defined in Act 181, PA 1963, CFR 49, part 390.5 when the vehicle:
> o Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 10,001 lbs. or more, whichever is greater; or
> .


Looks like one of them copy and pasted the other one they are so similar.


----------



## Mackman

We need some snow and FAST!!!!


----------



## snocrete

damn man....i turn my head for one second and bam....sorry for the delay,..:salute:.


----------



## 02f250superduty

1. Question: Who needs to obtain a Michigan Intrastate USDOT number?
Answer: All carriers or operators of commercial motor vehicles that operate solely in the state of Michigan. A Commercial Motor Vehicle means any self-propelled or towed motor vehicle used on a highway in commerce as defined in Act 181, PA 1963, CFR 49, part 390.5 when the vehicle:
o Has a gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating, or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, of 10,001 lbs. or more, whichever is greater; or
o Is designed or used to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation; or
o Is designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers, including the driver, and is not used to transport passengers for compensation; or
o Is used in transporting material found by the Secretary of Transportation to be hazardous under 49 U.S.C. 51 transported in a quantity requiring placarding under regulations prescribed by the Secretary under 49 CFR, subtitle B, chapter 1, subchapter C.

Notice it says used on a highway in commerce. Are you plowing public roads? Probably not. You are using the road to get from job to job just like the average person. I say no you do not need a DOT number.


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068726 said:


> OK, this is really getting old. Go to page one and read my post, specifically the part I colored RED. In MICHIGAN, a DOT number is required if the GVWR or the GCWR is over 10,000.
> 
> Sorry fella, you're wrong. Gonna keep digging?
> 
> And LMAO, a rating is only legal if it's on the door sticker? LMAO!!!!!!!!!


This is pointless until you figure out how they get GCWR.

And sorry "fella" you are wrong here.

The new Fords and Chevy have that particular "GCWR" over 26k, do they need a CDL?


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068728 said:


> Hmmm. They look the same to me.
> 
> Looks like one of them copy and pasted the other one they are so similar.


You're telling me that's the entire code or did you just edit the parts you wanted? Either way, I'm still right and you're still wrong. Thanks for opening yourself up on this topic. Must suck to come in an act like a jerk and then be made to look like one!


----------



## ajslands

I don't think a cop is going to get out the scales while it's snowing and theirs a few inches on the ground, they would want to help out at places they could do better like a traffic accident or a medical call or drinking syrup or going to shanangans.

But if you think they will then go to FMCSA and go to the FAQ and click who needs a DOT number.


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068736 said:


> You're telling me that's the entire code or did you just edit the parts you wanted?


EH?

I copied the part, that was previously posted, that is relevant here.

Do you know how to read?


----------



## snocrete

ajslands;1068737 said:


> I don't think a cop is going to get out the scales while it's snowing and theirs a few inches on the ground, they would want to help out at places they could do better like a traffic accident or a medical call or drinking syrup or going to shanangans.
> 
> But if you think they will then go to FMCSA and go to the FAQ and click who needs a DOT number.


Do you have DOT #'s?


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068733 said:


> This is pointless until you figure out how they get GCWR.
> 
> And sorry "fella" you are wrong here.
> 
> The new Fords and Chevy have that particular "GCWR" over 26k, do they need a CDL?


Why are you trying to change the subject? Beaten too badly huh? I almost feel sorry for you..... but I don't.


----------



## JDiepstra

ajslands;1068737 said:


> I don't think a cop is going to get out the scales while it's snowing and theirs a few inches on the ground, they would want to help out at places they could do better like a traffic accident or a medical call or drinking syrup or going to shanangans.
> 
> But if you think they will then go to FMCSA and go to the FAQ and click who needs a DOT number.


Noone was asking if a cop was going to get out the scales. The OP was asking if he needs DOT numbers. The answer is yes.


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068742 said:


> Why are you trying to change the subject? Beaten too badly huh? I almost feel sorry for you..... but I don't.


So you disagree that GCWR=GVWR+GVWR?

Take a couple seconds to read what I post instead of just saying I am wrong.


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068738 said:


> EH?
> 
> I copied the part, that was previously posted, that is relevant here.
> 
> Do you know how to read?


Yes. Do you know how to properly use commas? (No)


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068747 said:


> Yes. Do you know how to properly use commas? (No)


Do you know how to spell?


----------



## jomama45

MileHigh;1068498 said:


> who cares?


 #1: The OP *DOES NOT*need a DOT number per my understanding of the law.

#2: If I was wrong (and I'm not like JDip****ta, I'd admit it), I'd still suggest that the OP not get a DOT number of his own. If he's displaying another company's lettering on his truck when plowing, he should also display their DOT# IMO.

#3: The odds of the OP getting fined for operating over his GCWR, yet under his GVRW, is far less likely than JDip getting fined for operating over Michigan's maximum vehicle width law with his plow on.

Now, pass me some popcorn Toby...............................


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068746 said:


> So you disagree that GCWR=GVWR+GVWR?
> 
> Take a couple seconds to read what I post instead of just saying I am wrong.


Yes I would disagree with that. Sort of like how your FAWR + RAWR does not = GVWR. A fully loaded truck + a fully loaded trailer could be over GCWR of the truck. (Assuming I understand the question properly).


----------



## ajslands




----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068748 said:


> Do you know how to spell?


Please tell me, what word did I misspell?


----------



## tuney443

JDiepstra;1068722 said:


> No, I would not. Michigan has tightened it's requirements in an attempt to generate more revenue. I hope we can at least we can agree that that is the purpose of the DOT numbers!


I'll leave the pizza,popcorn,and whatever other BS cutsie little icons you boys want to play with,but the above statement is completely wrong.DOT #'s are for ID purposes only,similar to license plates,they are NOT a revenue gimmick.Now,once you have them,because they are required[when appropriate],that's when you fall under the scrutiny of the Dep't of Trouble.Now we're talking revenue---right now in NY,you are almost guaranteed some kind of fine if you get pulled over.


----------



## snocrete

I can see it.....he's starting to give


----------



## ajslands

tuney443;1068754 said:


> I'll leave the pizza,popcorn,and whatever other BS cutsie little icons you boys want to play with,but the above statement is completely wrong.DOT #'s are for ID purposes only,similar to license plates,they are NOT a revenue gimmick.Now,once you have them,because they are required[when appropriate],that's when you fall under the scrutiny of the Dep't of Trouble.Now we're talking revenue---right now in NY,you are almost guaranteed some kind of fine if you get pulled over.


Why'd you have to take a side, I wanted to see how long this would go on


----------



## JDiepstra

jomama45;1068749 said:


> #1: The OP *DOES NOT*need a DOT number per my understanding of the law.
> 
> Your understanding of MI law is wrong.
> 
> #2: If I was wrong (and I'm not like JDip****ta, I'd admit it), I'd still suggest that the OP not get a DOT number of his own. If he's displaying another company's lettering on his truck when plowing, he should also display their DOT# IMO.
> 
> That's cute how you manipulate a name Mr "IBangedYoMama"
> 
> #3: The odds of the OP getting fined for operating over his GCWR, yet under his GVRW, is far less likely than JDip getting fined for operating over Michigan's maximum vehicle width law with his plow on.
> 
> LMAO yeah that's a big problem with a V Plow.
> 
> 
> Now, pass me some popcorn Toby...............................


Perhaps your medication is what you really need.......


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068753 said:


> Please tell me, what word did I misspell?





JDiepstra;1068700 said:


> You see though, there is this letter at the end "R", which means rating..... Just because you are not towing a trailer that puts you over 10K, does not mean your truck is not rated to do it. It is the RATING that *crates* the need for the numbers. Yes, your dumbness continues. Keep digging.


.....................


----------



## JDiepstra

tuney443;1068754 said:


> I'll leave the pizza,popcorn,and whatever other BS cutsie little icons you boys want to play with,but the above statement is completely wrong.DOT #'s are for ID purposes only,similar to license plates,they are NOT a revenue gimmick.Now,once you have them,because they are required[when appropriate],that's when you fall under the scrutiny of the Dep't of Trouble.Now we're talking revenue---right now in NY,you are almost guaranteed some kind of fine if you get pulled over.


That makes no sense.... ID of what? For what purpose? It's all about the money. If you believe otherwise, you've been drinking too much koolaid!


----------



## wizardsr

It's pointless Scooty... Until he goes back to school and learns what "combination" means, he ain't gonna get it... Every SUV on the planet would be sporting DOT numbers if they went by tow ratings like dip seems to think they do...

Oh, and ain't MI special, they get their OWN numbers... :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:

OP, you don't need DOT numbers unless you're towing.


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068763 said:


> .....................


Ah you got me there. Spell check doesn't catch a properly spelled word...

But again, you're just trying to change the subject.

I'm still right and you're still wrong.


----------



## MileHigh

I with JDiepstra on this one.

It's Crystal clear.

And the gcvw is a rating that the truck has whether it's loaded, hooked up, or not. When a trailer is involved it raises the gvwr rating due to the added axles, but does nothing to the gcvw of the truck.

The guys saying they don't need one aren't reading there laws clearly, and or do not truly understand what the hell the laws are trying to say.


----------



## JDiepstra

wizardsr;1068766 said:


> It's pointless Scooty... Until he goes back to school and learns what "combination" means, he ain't gonna get it... Every SUV on the planet would be sporting DOT numbers if they went by tow ratings like dip seems to think they do...
> 
> Oh, and ain't MI special, they get their OWN numbers...
> OP, you don't need DOT numbers unless you're towing.


Sorry, but you're wrong too. Dumbness abounds on this site! 

Who said they go by "tow ratings"? I know I didn't.


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068751 said:


> Yes I would disagree with that. Sort of like how your FAWR + RAWR does not = GVWR. A fully loaded truck + a fully loaded trailer could be over GCWR of the truck. (Assuming I understand the question properly).


I recently posed a question about GCWR to the FMCSA.

This is what I asked. (This was pertaining CDLs but it is the same either way and keep in mind I was using Ford for an example)



> Hello Mark
> 
> Per our converstation on the phone I am looking for a clarification of the term of "GCWR" as used to decide whether or not a class A CDL would be required.
> 
> This is the definition that I have found on the FMCSA site.
> 
> Gross combination weight rating (GCWR) means the value specified by the manufacturer as the loaded weight of a combination (articulated) vehicle. In the absence of a value specified by the manufacturer, GCWR will be determined by adding the GVWR of the power unit and the total weight of the towed unit and any load thereon.
> 
> This is the definition of "GCWR" as found on the Ford site.
> 
> GCWR (Gross Combination Weight Rating)
> 
> Weight specified by the manufacturer as the maximum loaded weight of a towing vehicle and its trailer. The sum of the loaded vehicle weight of the truck and trailer should not exceed the GCWR.GCWR = vehicle curb weight + payload + trailer weight + driver and passengers.
> 
> Ford Vehicle Glossary | The Official Site of Ford Vehicles | FordVehicles.com
> 
> Here is a spec sheet showing all of the configurations of Ford superduty. It shows a "GCWR" and towing rating.
> 
> 2011 Ford Super Duty | View Towing Specifications | FordVehicles.com
> 
> So this is where we need some clarification.
> 
> It is my understanding that GCWR= GVWR(truck) + GVWR(trailer).
> 
> My colleagues are saying that if we had a Ford configured so that it has a GCWR of 26,001 or more as listed in the specs that it would need a class A to tow any trailer 10,001 or over. Or on the inverse a truck configured so that Ford listed it's "GCWR" at 26,000 or less it would not need a CDL no matter what the trailer was rated for.
> 
> It is also my understanding that the "GCWR" as given by Ford is not a legal rating since it is not listed on the door label like GVWR and GAWR are.
> 
> I hope you understand my question and please feel free to ask any questioons you need to clarify anything.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Cretebaby


This was his reply



> Cretebaby,
> 
> Yes, the GCWR = GVWR (truck) + GVWR(trailer). This would be taken off the spec plate of both vehicles. We donç¨š care what Fordç-´ website states. All inspector and investigators are trained to review the spec plate of the vehicle(s) they are inspecting.
> 
> The GCWR on that website is basically stating what the manufacture has specified the weight that vehicle can haul, including the weight the power unit and trailer.
> 
> What is the issue? Does someone not want to obtain a CDL?
> 
> Mark G. Oesterle
> 
> Division Administrator
> 
> Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration
> 
> 1 Point Place, Suite 101
> 
> Madison, WI 53719
> 
> Office 608-662-2010
> 
> Fax 608-829-7540
> 
> These interpretations might help with your questions;
> 
> Question 3: If a vehicleç-´ GVWR plate and/or VIN number are missing but its actual gross weight is 26,001 pounds or more, may an enforcement officer use the latter instead of GVWR to determine the applicability of the Part 383?
> 
> Guidance: Yes. The only apparent reason to remove the manufacturerç-´ GVWR plate or VIN number is to make it impossible for roadside enforcement officers to determine the applicability of part 383, which has a GVWR threshold of 26,001 pounds. In order to frustrate willful evasion of safety regulations, an officer may therefore presume that a vehicle which does not have a manufacturerç-´ GVWR plate and/or does not have a VIN number has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more if: (1) It has a size and configuration normally associated with vehicles that have a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more; and (2) It has an actual gross weight of 26,001 pounds or more.
> 
> A motor carrier or driver may rebut the presumption by providing the enforcement officer the GVWR plate, the VIN number or other information of comparable reliability which demonstrates, or allows the officer to determine, that the GVWR of the vehicle is below the jurisdictional weight threshold.
> 
> Question 4: If a vehicle with a manufacturerç-´ GVWR of less than 26,001 pounds has been structurally modified to carry a heavier load, may an enforcement officer use the higher actual gross weight of the vehicle, instead of the GVWR, to determine the applicability of part 383?
> 
> Guidance: Yes. The motor carrierç-´ intent to increase the weight rating is shown by the structural modifications. When the vehicle is used to perform functions normally performed by a vehicle with a higher GVWR, ï½§390.33 allows an enforcement officer to treat the actual gross weight as the GVWR of the modified vehicle.
> 
> Question 6: A driver operates a tractor of exactly 26,000 pounds GVWR, towing a trailer of exactly 10,000 pounds GVWR, for a GCWR of 36,000 pounds. HM and passengers are not involved. Is it a CMV and does the driver need a CDL?
> 
> Guidance: No to both questions. Although the vehicle has a GCWR of 36,000 pounds, it is not a CMV under any part of the definition of that term in ï½§383.5, and a CDL is not federally required.
> 
> Question 12: A driver operates a combination vehicle with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of more than 26,000 pounds. The tractor is towing a semitrailer and a full trailer, each with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) of less than 10,001 pounds. Is this combination a Group A vehicle that requires a driver with a Class A commercial driverç-´ license (CDL)?
> 
> Guidance: Yes. The GVWR for multiple towed units are added to determine whether the 10,000 pound GVWR threshold has been met. If the total GVWR for the two trailers is at least 10,001 pounds, and the tractorç-´ GVWR is sufficient to produce a GCWR of at least 26,001 pounds, the combination is a Group A vehicle requiring a driver with a Class A CDL with a double/triple trailers endorsement. For example, a combination vehicle with a GCWR of 36,000 pounds includes a semitrailer and a trailer, each of which has a GVWR of 6,000 pounds. This is a Group A vehicle having a GCWR of 36,000 pounds inclusive of two towed units having a combined GVWR of 12,000 pounds.
> 
> Are drivers of double and triple saddle mount combinations required to have the double/triple trailers endorsement on their CDLs?
> 
> Guidance: Yes, if the following conditions apply:
> 
> è£•here is more than one point of articulation in the combination;
> 
> è£•he GCWR is 26,001 or more pounds; and
> 
> è£•he combined GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.
> 
> Question 2: Is a driver of a combination vehicle with a GCWR of less than 26,001 pounds required to obtain a CDL even if the trailer GVWR is more than 10,000 pounds?
> 
> Guidance: No, because the GCWR is less than 26,001 pounds. The driver would need a CDL if the vehicle is transporting HM requiring the vehicle to be placarded or if it is designed to transport 16 or more persons.
> 
> Question 5: Do tow truck operators need CDLs? If so, in what vehicle group(s)?
> 
> Guidance: For CDL purposes, the tow truck and its towed vehicle are treated the same as any other powered unit towing a non-powered unit:
> 
> *f the GCWR of the tow truck and its towed vehicle is 26,001 pounds or more, and the towed vehicle alone exceeds 10,000 pounds GVWR, then the driver needs a Group A CDL.
> 
> *f the GVWR of the tow truck alone is 26,001 pounds or more, and the driver either (a) drives the tow truck without a vehicle in tow, or (b) drives the tow truck with a towed vehicle of 10,000 pounds or less GVWR, then the driver needs a Group B CDL.
> 
> è¼¸ driver of a tow truck or towing configuration that does not fit either configuration description above, requires a Group C CDL only if he or she tows a vehicle required to be placarded for hazardous materials on a è˜subsequent move,é‹³ i.e. after the initial movement of the disabled vehicle to the nearest storage or repair facility.
> 
> Mark G. Oesterle
> 
> Division Administrator
> 
> Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration
> 
> 1 Point Place, Suite 101
> 
> Madison, WI 53719
> 
> Office 608-662-2010
> 
> Fax 608-829-7540


----------



## WIPensFan

wizardsr;1068766 said:


> It's pointless Scooty... Until he goes back to school and learns what "combination" means, he ain't gonna get it... Every SUV on the planet would be sporting DOT numbers if they went by tow ratings like dip seems to think they do...
> 
> Oh, and ain't MI special, they get their OWN numbers... :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:
> 
> OP, you don't need DOT numbers unless you're towing.


Is JDiepstra saying if you put a plow on a 3/4 ton pickup, you're over 10,000# and need the numbers? If he is I think he's wrong. Wizardsr is right. Only if the OP is towing.


----------



## snocrete

JDiepstra;1068772 said:


> . Dumbness abounds on this site!
> 
> .


Is that why you been here so much lately? ...hugs and kisses


----------



## cretebaby

wizardsr;1068766 said:


> It's pointless Scooty... .


This is worse than teaching computers at the nursing home.


----------



## MileHigh

Look...

GVWR over 26k needs cdl
GVWR over 10k needs usdot#'s
GCWR over 26k does not need cdl
GCWR over 26k needs usdot#s
GCWR over 10k needs usdot#s


----------



## cretebaby

MileHigh;1068779 said:


> Look...
> 
> GVWR over 26k needs cdl
> GVWR over 10k needs usdot#'s
> GCWR over 26k does not need cdl
> GCWR over 26k needs usdot#s
> GCWR over 10k needs usdot#s


Oh boy.


----------



## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068774 said:


> I recently posed a question about GCWR to the FMCSA.
> 
> This is what I asked. (This was pertaining CDLs but it is the same either way and keep in mind I was using Ford for an example)
> 
> This was his reply


We are not talking overweight or license requirements. We are talking DOT numbers.


----------



## MileHigh

WIPensFan;1068775 said:


> Is JDiepstra saying if you put a plow on a 3/4 ton pickup, you're over 10,000# and need the numbers? If he is I think he's wrong. Wizardsr is right. Only if the OP is towing.


no...he saying that the gcwr on a 3/4 ton is higher than 10k...hence putting it in the category of needing dot numbers.


----------



## wizardsr

WIPensFan;1068775 said:


> Is JDiepstra saying if you put a plow on a 3/4 ton pickup, you're over 10,000# and need the numbers? If he is I think he's wrong. Wizardsr is right. Only if the OP is towing.


As Crete stated above, and exactly what I was saying when I poked this fool waaaaaay back on page 2. GCWR is truck and trailer ratings COMBINED, and has nothing to do with what the truck is rated to tow. He's too dense, and he's sucking others in. A sad state of affairs indeed...


----------



## JDiepstra

WIPensFan;1068775 said:


> Is JDiepstra saying if you put a plow on a 3/4 ton pickup, you're over 10,000# and need the numbers? If he is I think he's wrong. Wizardsr is right. Only if the OP is towing.


No that is not what I am saying.


----------



## JDiepstra

snocrete;1068776 said:


> Is that why you been here so much lately? ...hugs and kisses


Right back at you.......


----------



## JDiepstra

wizardsr;1068785 said:


> As Crete stated above, and exactly what I was saying when I poked this fool waaaaaay back on page 2. GCWR is truck and trailer ratings COMBINED, and has nothing to do with what the truck is rated to tow. He's too dense, and he's sucking others in. A sad state of affairs indeed...


You are incorrect about what I am saying. You're trying to tell me that a vehicles GCWR would change every time you switch trailers? :laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## ajslands

So should I get a direct lift or a chain lift plow?


----------



## WIPensFan

JDiepstra;1068783 said:


> We are not talking overweight or license requirements. We are talking DOT numbers.


He doesn't need the DOT #'s until he hooks up a trailer to his truck. GCWR doesn't come into play until you hook something up to tow it!


----------



## JDiepstra

Again guys, check the link. The GCWR of a 2500 Dodge is 20,000 lbs. It's not rocket science. http://dodgeram.info/2004/load-tow/2500.html

Also, you can see that adding the CURB WEIGHT to the MAX TOW CAPACITY does not equal GCWR so I don't know why some of you think I am trying to say that....


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068790 said:


> You are incorrect about what I am saying. You're trying to tell me that a vehicles GCWR would change every time you switch trailers? :laughing::laughing::laughing:


IF the GVWr of the trailer is different it would.


----------



## wizardsr

MileHigh;1068784 said:


> no...he saying that the gcwr on a 3/4 ton is higher than 10k...hence putting it in the category of needing dot numbers.


Which is wrong. Read and understand what's been posted for yourself. Use your brain, quit getting sucked in to his trap.

In Dip's mind, GCWR = Tow Rating.
In DOT's regs, GCWR = Gross COMBINATION Weight Rating

It's really that simple, believe it or not...


----------



## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068794 said:


> Again guys, check the link. The GCWR of a 2500 Dodge is 20,000 lbs. It's not rocket science. http://dodgeram.info/2004/load-tow/2500.html


Did you miss the part where they said they don't care what Dodge or Ford say?


----------



## Mackman

ajslands;1068791 said:


> So should I get a direct lift or a chain lift plow?


I was thinking of mounting a big broom to the front of my truck. Since it spins like a rotor on a helicopter do i need my pilots licence??


----------



## WIPensFan

I can't handle this anymore.


----------



## JDiepstra

WIPensFan;1068792 said:


> He doesn't need the DOT #'s until he hooks up a trailer to his truck. GCWR doesn't come into play until you hook something up to tow it!


Wrong. A rating is a rating. If you are rated to tow at that weight, you need the numbers. Look at is this way, if your trucks GVWR is 15,000 lbs you would need the numbers. What some of you guys are saying is the equivalent of saying yeah but if your truck only weighs 9,999 lbs even though the GVWR is 15,000, you don't need the numbers. You're just not right.


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068783 said:


> We are not talking overweight or license requirements. We are talking DOT numbers.


The definition of GCWR is the same for both.


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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068797 said:


> Did you miss the part where they said they don't care what Dodge or Ford say?


Again, that letter was about licensing. Not DOT numbers.


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068802 said:


> What some of you guys are saying is the equivalent of saying yeah but if your truck only weighs 9,999 lbs even though the GVWR is 15,000, you don't need the numbers. You're just not right.


Nobody is saying that.


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## ajslands

Mackman;1068799 said:


> I was thinking of mounting a big broom to the front of my truck. Since it spins like a rotor on a helicopter do i need my pilots licence??


:laughing: :laughing:


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## cretebaby

Bang head on wall.

'Nite fellas.


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## JDiepstra

wizardsr;1068796 said:


> Which is wrong. Read and understand what's been posted for yourself. Use your brain, quit getting sucked in to his trap.
> 
> In Dip's mind, GCWR = Tow Rating.
> In DOT's regs, GCWR = Gross COMBINATION Weight Rating
> 
> It's really that simple, believe it or not...


You are wrong about what I am saying. Honestly I don't even know how you came up with that. You obviously haven't read my posts. I have even posted exactly the opposite of what you are saying. You're not a smart person...........


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## jomama45

JDiepstra;1068761 said:


> Perhaps your medication is what you really need.......


The only thing I need when reading your posts is aspirin.................

JDip, the burden of proof lies on you to decipher the lawful meaning of GCWR by the DOT. So far, IMO, you haven't done so, just bickered the same minute points. You should probably call MDOT tommorrow, as maybe you'll trust some degenerate paid off of your taxroll to explain to you the same thing everyone here is.

As for your plow, I have to ask, how do you carry it on the truck, as in: what position? I'm fully aware that your V-plow is a V-plow, not that hard to understand.


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## ajslands

Is usm a good company to work for?


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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068805 said:


> The definition of GCWR is the same for both.


You believe what some idiot who works for the government told you? You could talk to 10 people and get different answers. Get a clue man. I know who you voted for! If you even bothered..........


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## Mackman

ajslands;1068813 said:


> Is usm a good company to work for?


Very good company. Thats where me and my broom mounted truck are going to work.


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## ajslands

Mackman;1068816 said:


> Very good company. Thats where me and my broom mounted truck are going to work.


Don't you need a pilot licence?


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## wizardsr

ajslands;1068817 said:


> Don't you need a pilot licence?


Nope, but he might need DOT numbers, depends on what Ford thinks it can tow... xysport


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## JDiepstra

jomama45;1068811 said:


> The only thing I need when reading your posts is aspirin.................
> 
> JDip, the burden of proof lies on you to decipher the lawful meaning of GCWR by the DOT. So far, IMO, you haven't done so, just bickered the same minute points. You should probably call MDOT tommorrow, as maybe you'll trust some degenerate paid off of your taxroll to explain to you the same thing everyone here is.
> 
> As for your plow, I have to ask, how do you carry it on the truck, as in: what position? I'm fully aware that your V-plow is a V-plow, not that hard to understand.


No it's not. It's common sense. Check the link I gave you. GCWR on a 3/4 ton truck is going to be around 20,000 lbs no matter how you look at it. It will always be over 10,000. I'm not sure why you would bother arguing this..........


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## ajslands

Family guy is on


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## JDiepstra

ajslands;1068822 said:


> Family guy is on


How old are you? Do you giggle each time you post?


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## jomama45

JDiepstra;1068821 said:


> No it's not. It's common sense.
> 
> Yeah, "common sense", administered by you............
> Check the link I gave you.
> 
> That link means diddly0squat, take it to court with you as your defense, I'm sure you'll get far...............
> GCWR on a 3/4 ton truck is going to be around 20,000 lbs no matter how you look at it.
> 
> Considering you're the only one who's going to use this in your defense, that number is once again useless..............
> It will always be over 10,000. I'm not sure why you would bother arguing this..........


Why argue this? Merely with intentionst to avert someone from stumbling across your bad judgement & information & take your poor information for fact.

BTW, nice way to skate away from the rest of my post.............


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## JDiepstra

jomama45;1068832 said:


> Why argue this? Merely with intentionst to avert someone from stumbling across your bad judgement & information & take your poor information for fact.
> 
> BTW, nice way to skate away from the rest of my post.............


My info is good. I don't know why you insist on being wrong. But it's fine with me.

Your other question was off topic.


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## ajslands

JDiepstra;1068829 said:


> How old are you? Do you giggle each time you post?


18 how about yourself? (6)
:laughing:
jk

oh and to your other question, this thread at least the last 4 pages have been very comical.

Why do you ask?


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## JDiepstra

haha............


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## tuney443

JDiepstra;1068764 said:


> That makes no sense.... ID of what? For what purpose? It's all about the money. If you believe otherwise, you've been drinking too much koolaid!


You really should get a grip and think before you writeith!!! A DOT # is for identification purposes so that a DOT officer can track your trucking history.From what I'm reading here [and I'm stopping now because this thread is way over the top now],you might be drinking something a little more potent than Koolaid.


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## ajslands

tuney443;1068843 said:


> You really should get a grip and think before you writeith!!! A DOT # is for identification purposes so that a DOT officer can track your trucking history.From what I'm reading here [and I'm stopping now because this thread is way over the top now],you might be drinking something a little more potent than Koolaid.


Pink lemonade


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## jomama45

JDiepstra;1068835 said:


> Your other question was off topic.


And the answer would prove your ignorance to MI law, as well the hypocracy that you're guilty of.

Honestly, it doesn't matter to me. I remember telling you last year that you could expose your ignorance far more easily than I could, so I'd let you have at it. Carry on, your doing a superb job again......... :waving:


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## JDiepstra

jomama45;1068845 said:


> And the answer would prove your ignorance to MI law, as well the hypocracy that you're guilty of.
> 
> Honestly, it doesn't matter to me. I remember telling you last year that you could expose your ignorance far more easily than I could, so I'd let you have at it. Carry on, your doing a superb job again......... :waving:


The fact is, when it comes to the topic of this thread, I am right. I don't see how me being right leads to my ignorance. Yours becomes crystal clear when u begin to try to go off topic to get around me being right. Carry on, your doing a super job.....being wrong.


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## JDiepstra

tuney443;1068843 said:


> You really should get a grip and think before you writeith!!! A DOT # is for identification purposes so that a DOT officer can track your trucking history.From what I'm reading here [and I'm stopping now because this thread is way over the top now],you might be drinking something a little more potent than Koolaid.


Track my trucking history? Lmao! I have a pickup truck..... tell me, what is a CDL for? Is it not good enough to track my trucking history????


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## cretebaby

JDiepstra;1068874 said:


> Track my trucking history? Lmao! I have a pickup truck..... tell me, *what is a CDL for*? Is it not good enough to track my trucking history????


It licenses a driver.

DOT number is for the entire company.

What is with all the insults and name calling? How old are you?

Like I said in my original post you have no idea what you are talking about and continue to prove it with every post.


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## ajslands

What is curb weight?


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## JDiepstra

Sorry crete but he did not say it tracks a companies trucking history, he said "your". A cdl is a better way to track an individual persons driving history etc.


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## cretebaby

ajslands;1068877 said:


> What is curb weight?


Empty weight



JDiepstra;1068878 said:


> Sorry crete but he did not say it tracks a companies trucking history, he said "your". A cdl is a better way to track an individual persons driving history etc.


Your company.


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## JDiepstra

cretebaby;1068879 said:


> Empty weight
> 
> Your company.


I'm aware of that  have a nice day fellas.


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## Kavu

What's the down side to getting DOT numbers?


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## Mick

:laughing: 

I leave for a few hours and there's four more pages.

Note to self: Change trailer registration to Commercial. Get DOT #'s and hook up trailer before plowing snow. If questioned or told I can not do that, I will refer MDOT to JDiepstra as the MDOT officials clearly do not know how to read the regulations that they wrote.


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## ajslands

So if you get the #, do you need an inspection sticker?


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## Mick

Has anyone thought to look at Michigan DOT? I found a FAQ site. Pay attn to #11. No trailer - no numbers.

http://mnla.org/documents/USDOT_FAQs.pdf


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## cretebaby

Mick;1069050 said:


> Has anyone thought to look at Michigan DOT? I found a FAQ site. Pay attn to #11. No trailer - no numbers.
> 
> http://mnla.org/documents/USDOT_FAQs.pdf


That is just more dumbness Mick. :laughing:


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## Mick

cretebaby;1069051 said:


> That is just more dumbness Mick. :laughing:


Sorry, you'd think I'd know better.


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## ajslands

Why is it always Michigan people bring up? Why not floridia or Canada?


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## cretebaby

Hmmm.... JDiepstra is sure quiet tonight.


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## jomama45

cretebaby;1069283 said:


> Hmmm.... JDiepstra is sure quiet tonight.


Nothing but the sound of crickets in here tonight.................................


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## Mackman

So if i do get a DOT number. Should i put it on the moldboard of the plow. Real big so the cops can see it?? Cuz the plow puts me over my GVWR, CGVWR, GVWASDR, and my GVTREW. 

Bet you all don't know what they stand for?


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## MileHigh

Mackman;1069295 said:


> So if i do get a DOT number. Should i put it on the moldboard of the plow. Real big so the cops can see it?? Cuz the plow puts me over my GVWR, CGVWR, GVWASDR, and my GVTREW.
> 
> Bet you all don't know what they stand for?


GVWASDR 
generic vicodin was always served during resting.


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## ajslands

Mackman;1069295 said:


> So if i do get a DOT number. Should i put it on the moldboard of the plow. Real big so the cops can see it?? Cuz the plow puts me over my GVWR, CGVWR, GVWASDR, and my GVTREW.
> 
> Bet you all don't know what they stand for?


GVTREW
good vehicles tow right every winter

GVWR
Grandview Wants Rabies

jk  grandview saved me 50$


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