# Insurance Nightmare!!!!!!!!!



## bigjeeping

I have called nearly every company in town looking for liability insurance for my lawncare and snowplowing... well none of them will insure you if you're snowplowing income is more than 10% of your lawncare/snowplowing income.

*DOES ANYONE KNOW OF A COMPANY WHICH WILL INSURE ME?*


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## Grn Mtn

*the insurance break-down*

I am in the process right now of getting quotes for my landscape/plow business. What I am finding out is that you can get landscape General Liability with a snow plow rider as long as you do NO commercial and like you said its only 10% of your net income. But, if you do any commercial, or the percentage is more like 50%, than it will be a separate policy ranging from $3,000 to over $10,000. The more commercial the higher it is. They got us by the balls boys, and this is why the lowballers can be so low, because they don't have insurance. Period.


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## flykelley

bigjeeping said:


> I have called nearly every company in town looking for liability insurance for my lawncare and snowplowing... well none of them will insure you if you're snowplowing income is more than 10% of your lawncare/snowplowing income.
> 
> *DOES ANYONE KNOW OF A COMPANY WHICH WILL INSURE ME?*


Bigjeep call my agent he is in Clarkston MI. 248 625 0410 I do not do any lawns, and I pay about $800.00 a year for G/L ins. Ask for Bill Smith or Sharon.

Good Luck Mike


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## Mick

Try Mutual Assurance Insurance. That's who I'm with and don't have to show percentage of income. I'm not really pushing any company, just offering it as an alternative. Insurance is very changeable from State to State and personal circumstances, but it looks like this is offered in both Michigan and NY.

http://www.middlesex-mutual.com/


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## Eyesell

All I do is call my insurance company that insure's my truck and cars and get the G/L insurance added in October, it cost me at $ 350.00 of which I make payments on, I once stretched it ( payments ) out over the end of the snow season and canceled it before it was paid in full


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## Mick

Eyesell said:


> All I do is call my insurance company that insure's my truck and cars and get the G/L insurance added in October, it cost me at $ 350.00 of which I make payments on, I once stretched it ( payments ) out over the end of the snow season and canceled it before it was paid in full


Just a caution on this tactic. I know with my insurance, cancelling or letting it lapse is not an option. Once cancelled, I have been informed they will not rewrite it. Once a policy is lapsed with any company, the likelihood of any other company writing a policy is nil.


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## bigjeeping

Thanks for all the replies so far!

I just called bill smith and that company from Mick... waiting for responses from both of them


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## bingermann

*Insurance*

I know that insurance can vary state to state, and by personal circumstances, but I use Country Insurance for my lawn & snow removal business. They insured me with a $1,000,000.00 liability policy that covers slip and fall and it only cost me $399.00 annually. Any insurance company trying to hit you with premiums in the 1000's are wholesaling your policy from another provider on the "Excesses" market. Many big companies do this as they have lost so much money from snow removal. Country put no limits on residential or commercial or total percentage of overall income. As an extra layer of security I made my business an S-corp, which limits personal liability and protects my personal assets. It is a more solid way to protect yourself rather than using LLC's. If you are a sole proprietor and uninsured your eventually gonna lose it all! Just my two cents.


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## Eyesell

Mick said:


> Just a caution on this tactic. I know with my insurance, canceling or letting it lapse is not an option. Once canceled, I have been informed they will not rewrite it. Once a policy is lapsed with any company, the likelihood of any other company writing a policy is nil.


Thanks Mick, your right, it's not something you ever want to take for granite, it will bite you in the a** as soon as you start pulling stupid stuff.


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## Makndust

Try State Farm, they have been the cheapest for us in rural Montana


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## bigjeeping

Just got a quote from Bill for: 

$500,000 coverage landscaping & snowplowing
885/year

workers comp 
750/year

Is this a good rate? Anyone getting better? I know that the workers comp rate is the minimum.


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## Frozen001

Anybody got a good company for NY... I keep getting astronomical rates....


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## gene gls

Frozen001 said:


> Anybody got a good company for NY... I keep getting astronomical rates....


I use Farm Family Ins....They are in New York...

Gene


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## hickslawns

I use Motorists Mutual. They have been good for me for our rental properties, home insurance, auto policy, and general liabilities. The only other insurance company I use is for our health insurance, and disability ins. We also use progressive, but that is for personal toys like motorcycles, and jet skis. Motorists has been good for all auto/bus insurance. Workers' comp will vary per state depending on employees and payroll if I am correct. Thru Motorists I do meet with my insurance guy once or twice per year to make sure we have correct payroll amounts per category (lawn/landscaping, street sweeping which also is the category our snow plowing and parking lot sweeping fall into). Good luck.


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## T-MAN

bigjeeping said:


> Just got a quote from Bill for:
> 
> $500,000 coverage landscaping & snowplowing
> 885/year
> 
> workers comp
> 750/year
> 
> Is this a good rate? Anyone getting better? I know that the workers comp rate is the minimum.


Couple things here you may want to look at.
Workers comp is based on a percentage of your annual payroll.So to quote 750 seems odd I guess and way to low. ( I pay 2000 a month for 2 trim carpenters) You will be audited yearly to see what you still owe. It takes time so you get spanked for being new, once you get your own rating it should drop if you have no major claims.

500,000 is low so look at a million it usually is only a few bucks more. 
Oh and try Auto Owners Insurance, its strictly commercial insurance.
Todd


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## JPLTrucking

Anyone from Massachusetts in here? I just got quoted $8000 yr. for my 78 F700 for plowing w/1 mil liability. This seems really high. Can anyone shed some light on this????


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## Killswitch

900 sounds great for lawn and snow Jeep. 

State Farm told me they dont insure landscapers in Michigan period.


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## bigjeeping

Killswitch said:


> 900 sounds great for lawn and snow Jeep.
> 
> State Farm told me they dont insure landscapers in Michigan period.


A place called Total Insurance Services in Clarkston MI
(248) 625-0410 Bill Smith
I think the carrier is Zurich

How can I add someone to my LLC company? Basically, now that it's formed how can it be turned into a partnership?? anybody


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## JPLTrucking

I've been reading up on forming a LLC or a LLP recently. I believe you just have to file a modification to your original Certificate of Organization stating the changes.


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## PremierLand

Killswitch said:


> 900 sounds great for lawn and snow Jeep.
> 
> State Farm told me they dont insure landscapers in Michigan period.


Ya I called state farm a few weeks ago, they said they dont insure landscapers either, so that sucks.

Im calling bill tommorrow


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## TRUE TURF LAWN

i have state fame thats the only company that i could find.


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## Grn Mtn

*great insurance experience, finally*



Frozen001 said:


> Anybody got a good company for NY... I keep getting astronomical rates....


Okay so after 6 weeks of internet surcharges, yellow page listings, Sams Club for business, and eighteen billion phones calls back and forth I am finally hooked up. Victor Montaglione @ MGM associates set me up: 2 million GL, Rental and Equipment coverage, Comm. Auto (so I can letter my truck now) for just over $3000 annual. :bluebounc The snowplowing was covered under the streetsweeping category also, thought that was funny someone else mentioned that.

Frozen, if you haven't yet, pm me and I'll give you his phone #.


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## Killswitch

I got a price from Bill Smith today for 1300 a year for a million General Liability for Lawn and Snow removal, and insurance on about 11,000 in gear.

Plus they want 100 dollars for each person I subcontract for which is only one and they want proof of insurance for them too.

Anyone else ever heard of a fee because you sub?


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## flykelley

Killswitch said:


> I got a price from Bill Smith today for 1300 a year for a million General Liability for Lawn and Snow removal, and insurance on about 11,000 in gear.
> 
> Plus they want 100 dollars for each person I subcontract for which is only one and they want proof of insurance for them too.
> 
> Anyone else ever heard of a fee because you sub?


Hi Killswitch
I have not heard of this before but Bill is my ins guy and he is a straight shooter. I like the fact that if I have a question I can call and talk to him, not somebody across the country that doesn't have a clue what Im talking about. Been with Bill for about 4 years now and am very happy.

Regards Mike


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## Killswitch

Yeah him and Sharon both seem ok. I dont think 1300 is a terrible price. Id like to do a few hundred cheaper.

To cut costs a but I think Im gonna have him run it through at 500K and see what the price difference is. 

I have a few more calls to make.

Bums me out they want it in a couple installments instead of a monthly electronic withdrawl. Thanks to the guys that get it for a month to get a cert then cancel no doubt.


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## Mick

$1300 for $500,000 and $100 for each sub? I'd keep looking, too. Mine is $780 for a million.

Don't know what you'll find, but the difference between $300,000 and $1,000,000 was around $60/yr for me.


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## digit

I was going to bid some bank parking lots but they want 3 million liability insurance. I got a quote for 2million umbrella $2200. and 3 million umbrella $3300. So either I have to bid high or skip them.


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## Killswitch

No that price is for 1 million and equipment insurance as well.

When you guys are tossing out prices....does that include any equipment insurance?


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## Mick

Killswitch said:


> When you guys are tossing out prices....does that include any equipment insurance?


Usually not. Usually you'll see prices for General Liability insurance. Equipment, such as trucks and any attached equipment (plow), will be on a Commercial Vehicle insurance policy. Other equipment, such as snowblowers, generally are not insured but could be. Larger items, such as loaders and tractors etc would require a special rider on your Commercial Vehicle policy. What most people don't think about is - while something like a snowblower is insured on your house policy, when you use it in a commercial venture (snowblowing for pay) it no longer is considered a personal use item and loses coverage under the homeowner policy.


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## sgodiv

*Better Price*



mpdcameron said:


> Anyone from Massachusetts in here? I just got quoted $8000 yr. for my 78 F700 for plowing w/1 mil liability. This seems really high. Can anyone shed some light on this????


I pay $1200/yr for my 1976 F600 dumper. Progressive Commercial Service


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## flykelley

Killswitch said:


> Yeah him and Sharon both seem ok. I dont think 1300 is a terrible price. Id like to do a few hundred cheaper.
> 
> To cut costs a but I think Im gonna have him run it through at 500K and see what the price difference is.
> 
> I have a few more calls to make.
> 
> Bums me out they want it in a couple installments instead of a monthly electronic withdrawl. Thanks to the guys that get it for a month to get a cert then cancel no doubt.


Killswitch I have always paid for my Liabilty Ins for the whole year in one shot. But Commercial truck ins is monthly.

Regards Mike


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## firstclasslawn

*Insureance*

I am in Grand Rapids, MI......I am 19 and i pay $1200 for a gl with 500 dedcutable for hitting garage doors...etc......i got it through a local agent, but i am actually insured my haistings mutual, so check them!
- jon


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## grandview

*insurance*

Just jumping in missed yesterday still cutting.
I have Ohio casualty group.
500,000/1,000,000
But i bumped my deductible uppto 1,000.00 and that helped.
Mines about 870.00 for the year.


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## Killswitch

Mick.....I figured vehicle insurance wasnt included, and I didnt clarify but I was refering to lawn equipment, like an 8000 dollar rider and such.


Fly.....I'll be making a bi annual payment. 

Yeah the deal Im going with is through Hastings too. I was with them back in the nineties. 


One thing about Hastings though. My agent told me that if you plow a strip mall or any restuarants they will not cover you.


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## firstclasslawn

*Kinda*

My hastings guy told me kinda the same thing. he said "dont plow any really high traffic/ high risk areas such as fast food or malls because your insureance will go up too much to be worth it"


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