# Ins cost..!!



## Snow Jaw (Aug 17, 2003)

I had been checking around for plow ins. up to 1,000,000
was told it cost 1 year for 2,000...

where other ins can I check that be less that than?
it's really snowing here..!!!

I was told that my truck ins can cover?!?!? other ins said that but my ins said no. feels like I am in a ball game.... 

any of you guys have ins just for one plow truck. that all I got.
too short to buy other truck... that what I want to do later.


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## CPSS (Mar 15, 2002)

General liability policy is what you want. Your regular truck policy will most likely cover you if you do some damage while plowing. The real problem is when someone sues you after you have completed the plowing, thus the term " completed operations" General Liability insurance comes into play. There are people out there that are looking for a slip and fall accident so that they may sue someone.


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## 440trk (Nov 27, 2003)

I just went through this here in Pennsylvania. My advice (which was also the advise of several here who helped me) is to call a couple of your local Erie Insurance agents. I too was being quoted in excess of $2100/yr for just a single operator (me) and a single plow truck. I spoke with several insurance agents/agencys and as soon as "Snow Plowing" was mentioned....they didn't wanna talk anymore. First Erie guy I spoke with wan't able to help me out. The SECOND Erie guy I called, got me hooked up with 500,000 GL and Commercial Auto for under $800/year. 
There ARE good agents out there who know how to get you proper coverage for reasonable amounts.

Considering the Harrisburg Area of Pa. only averages around 33" of snow a year....that $2100 price tag was NOT a cost effective option. 

Good Luck!


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## FSUPERDUTY (Jan 1, 2003)

The way my agent put it,is if you are plowing your neighbors drive way for FREE your regular insurance will cover it! if you are out making money you need some kind of contractors policy.My insurance doubled this year from $250.00 to $500.00 for 1.5million in liability coverage.also said that they won't write a policy like mine any more so if i cancell i am screwed.If you are a buisness owner like a lanscaper for example they will add a plow policy to your buisness no problem.But it sounds like the guy who wants to make a little extra money in the winter is going to have a hard time!If they raise me up to $1000.00 or more i will probably quit plowing and sell my plow!!


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## NYRookie (Mar 22, 2003)

I too would recomend Erie Ins. I have them for a commercial policy on my 2002 GMC and $1,000,000 liability policy for landscaping and snowplowing. My truck is only $1100 and my liability is $1300. It was the best I could find. I just hit my first vehicle yesterday, I will let you now how they treat me after a claim.


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## Grshppr (Dec 2, 2002)

This is a little off topic, but a lot of people I have met haven't done this: 

Make sure your truck has the proper insurance on it. Not pleasure, but business insurance. If you have pleasure driving insurance on it and are snowplowing and hit something, you are not covered.


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## FSUPERDUTY (Jan 1, 2003)

Thats basically what i said grasshopper you just said it better!


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## ClintSinger (Dec 9, 2003)

Here in Nova Scotia,Canada when I purchased my truck for my property maintenance business, my insurance company that we have been with for years insured it with no problem however as soon as I installed the plow the ball game changed.I had to contact a different broker and start shopping around, that was last may, we finally received our insurance today for snowplowing and it cost us $1600 for the truck to be insured commercially and a further $1500 for commercial general liability.


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## easthavenplower (Aug 21, 2003)

you can try north american underwriters they were 700 for the snow season 4 months


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## CPSS (Mar 15, 2002)

> _Originally posted by FSUPERDUTY _
> *The way my agent put it,is if you are plowing your neighbors drive way for FREE your regular insurance will cover it! *


 Well sort of. You need commercial vehicle insurance is you are engaged in a business using your vehicle, IE: plowing. Even if you have regular personal auto insurance you will probable be covered if you do some damage with your vehicle such as hitting a parked car, or a garage door. The real problem is the General Liability after you leave the driveway. If grandma slips and falls and breaks her hip she can sue you for not doing a proper job plowing. Now I know there is always a little snow and ice left over after we plow. Almost any lawyer would take the case for free hoping to get some settlement from you or your insurance company. Theres the problem. If you don't have the "completed operations" General Liability insurance in addition to your personal auto, or commercial auto policy, you are on your own to defend yourself in court. Sure you will probably win if you made a "reasonable and prudent" effort to plow, and performed to the standards of the industry, but who's going to pay for your lawyer? You will be paying him because he won't take your case on a contingency basis as grandma's lawyer will. She has nothing to lose by bringing suit. If she looses, her lawyer doesn't get paid. If she wins, she gets some money, her lawyer gets 30% of it and they are both happy.


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## DuallyVette (Dec 10, 2003)

I don't understand what kind of a case someone could make for falling after a "negligent plow job". Here in NC our snow doesn't usually last very long. The problem is the ice. If you don't plow the snow, the tracks left by cars and footprints do offer some traction over a slick sheet of ice left after plowing. By plowing, the pavement will be clear and dry a couple of days earlier than non plowed pavement. I don't see how an "act of nature" could hold someone responsible for the negligence of the falling person. Walking on ice was a judgment call. Are they qualified to carry out this outing. I think they they assumed the liability for their actions when they left the house knowing that snow and ice are slippery.
Has anyone on this site been sued and lost ?


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## PLOWMAN45 (Jul 2, 2003)

Im LLC i wont pay 2k year for special insurance


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## Plow Meister (Oct 16, 2001)

> _Originally posted by DuallyVette _
> *I don't understand what kind of a case someone could make for falling after a "negligent plow job". Here in NC our snow doesn't usually last very long. The problem is the ice. If you don't plow the snow, the tracks left by cars and footprints do offer some traction over a slick sheet of ice left after plowing. By plowing, the pavement will be clear and dry a couple of days earlier than non plowed pavement. I don't see how an "act of nature" could hold someone responsible for the negligence of the falling person. Walking on ice was a judgment call. Are they qualified to carry out this outing. I think they they assumed the liability for their actions when they left the house knowing that snow and ice are slippery.
> Has anyone on this site been sued and lost ? *


DuallyVette,

Welcome to the 21st century where there is no such thing as a "Frivolous lawsuit". Thank God I haven't been sued yet or even had a claim against. But many members here have dealt with being sued or have had an insurance claim against them. If I were to slip and fall on a freshly plowed lot I would not sue. I would chalk it up to "Well, I should have watched my step a bit better." Not everyone has this general sense of self-stupidity.


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## DuallyVette (Dec 10, 2003)

I'd like a response from someone who HAD been sued by a person that fell. The person filing the suit would have to prove that I had done something to cause the fall. They would have to prove that I was negligent. example: I poured 500 gallons of water on a bridge on a dry COLD night.
I've heard this example on this forum, I'd like to hear how this could play out.


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## Matthew Bowman (Sep 21, 2002)

DuallyVette - I have a claim against me. A 400lb (no joking)
women wearing slippers fell when her husband was helping her in the car. I keep very detailed records for these occasions and when interviewed by my insurance company they were shocked by how prepared I was, and how much written info I had on the date & property in question. I later received a copy of the letter sent to the nice lady's attorney from my ins. company basically saying that they were nuts thinking that I was liable. Last paragraph of the letter offered her thousands of $ to go away. I then received a letter of non-renewal from my ins. company because of my claims. This is my second year with my own accounts and insurance is my biggest challenge. Before being on my own I subbed for a big company and they are always defending slip and falls. If you plow large commercial accounts it happens way too often. Insurance is a must.


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## DuallyVette (Dec 10, 2003)

Matthew Bowman;
What kind of records do you keep. It seems that facts are irrelevant.
So, insurance companies and attorneys are screwing up this society. Ins. co's NEED to pay some claims so they can justify their existence and get premium increases. Attorneys wouldn't'want to do a discourtesy to another attorney by not letting him make at least a few hundred dollars for coming up with a client. A private investigator friend of mine explained this to me years ago. They would rather pay a mooch than do some research and and discredit the mooch.


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## Crumm (Nov 5, 2003)

I am not plowing for hire but many neighbors and friends want me to plow there little driveways. I have did a few but my old 390 burns alot of gas doing it. If I plow for in exchange for gas money would it throw me into the commercial bracket and void my insurance? I have a hard time saying no to the little old lady next door that is trying to survive on social security but some of my friends at work live several miles away. We have only had a few snow storms so far this winter but being a nice guy is getting expensive.


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## Matthew Bowman (Sep 21, 2002)

What kind of records do I keep? You name it, I document it. Any winter weather event - or non - event. Date, time, weather conditions, property condition, temp, what was done, how much deicer was applied, when the lot was black and wet, any complaints, requests, comments by property managers, supervisers etc.. I even have documented site and weather conditions when nothing (weather wise) is going on. If you don't have these records and something from last year comes up, how will you make your case?


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## CPSS (Mar 15, 2002)

> _Originally posted by PLOWMAN45 _
> *Im LLC i wont pay 2k year for special insurance *


Chris, does the LLC own the equipment? Does it have any assets? A successfull lawsuit would take these. If the LLC doesn't own the equipment, how do you cover the use of non owned equipment? Lease?

Just because your are an LLC, don't think you have nothing to worry about. How do you defend a suite? Who pays the LLC lawyer to defend you? If the LLC is not properly set up, and if the use of non owned equipment is not properly set up, the "corporate viel" can easly be pierced. It's done every day by personal injury attorneys looking for assests. One firm I know of even has 2 paralegals on staff who's sole jobs are "asset identification", looking for the "deep pockets" as they say in the tort world.


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