# Contractor settles over Snowvember price gouging



## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Need to be careful on those driveway accounts,

http://www.wkbw.com/news/state-news/contractor-settles-over-snowvember-price-gouging


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

They should have used Plowz. :laughing:


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

If you don't like the price don't hire the contractor. Shovel your own roof/driveway


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

Longae29;1983120 said:


> If you don't like the price don't hire the contractor. Shovel your own roof/driveway


Indeed..... That guy sure knows how to make a good profit


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

I dunno GV, you posted a driveway you did for $150, I would've charged $50 for. You should give them $100 back and send me $25. I never understand some judgements but then I'm a low baller honest guy.


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

If I charge $130/hr and my competition charges $65/hr am I also gouging?


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

According to the judgement you are...was my point.


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## Camden (Mar 10, 2007)

Longae29;1983120 said:


> If you don't like the price don't hire the contractor. Shovel your own roof/driveway


I can't believe this isn't the mindset. Didn't these people willingly agree to the price?


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## 90plow (Dec 22, 2001)

We were charging $75 an hour per man to shovel roofs last year. People new the rate going in and were home when we came and when we left. It was a 4 man crew and a typical house we shoveled problem areas cleaned gutters of ice etc. I don't think I would have done well in that judgement as most houses were charged around 1,200 and the whole roof was not cleared....


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

Camden;1983148 said:


> I can't believe this isn't the mindset. Didn't these people willingly agree to the price?


The price was agreed on I dont see an issue... its the homeowners fault for agreeing with the price...


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## bluejlandscaper (Mar 2, 2008)

Why should the NYS attorney general say that these contractors gouged those home owners that probably agreed on the price. I know of several people that paid at least $500 to have their drives plowed, when their own contractor could not perform the work with 5-7' of snow. I did not work in that area, but I know of one contractor from central NY, that came in with a skid steer with a high flow snow blower that charged home owners an average of $500. He boasted that he made over $25G for a couple of days work.
When a contractor has invested a lot of money in equipment, why should NY State tell him what he can charge. This is still a free country and price gouging to one is not the same to others.
As far as the contractors clearing roofs, that Collingwood Co. was right in saying that most of those low ballers were not legitimate contractors. They took the cash and ran. No insurance, no workers comp and no employees on the books.
Back in 2000, when our area got hit with 7' of snow between Christmas and New Years, I know of an individual that paid a contractor, several thousand dollars to clear the roof of his 3,500 sq/ft home. He was happy just to get his roof cleared at the time.


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## UltraLwn&Lndscp (Oct 20, 2013)

Damn, I got hosed. I went into Lancaster/Depew to plow my buddy, his in-laws and brother in-law. We also shoveled the roofs and all I got was a $100 gas card, bottle of Glenlivet and a case of beer. Damn it. :hide:


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## Triple L (Nov 1, 2005)

So everyone has the exact same size driveway and roof huh? The people with the huge driveway only pay $300 just like the single car driveway? Seems as though that hasn't been thought about


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

I guess I fail to see where 350-500 for a driveway with 7 FEET of snow is that unreasonable. 

GV, what's your average snowfall per season and what do you charge for an average driveway per season? Quick Google search shows around 70 inches per season. Say your average drive for the season you're charging 400 bucks. So in 1 storm you've got 1.2 feet ABOVE your average to clear at once. 

Seems to me that your seasonal price should apply to one time customers, considering you're plowing more at once than you do all season on average.


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## Buswell Forest (Jan 11, 2013)

I would fight it tooth and nail. If I had a written contract. This sets precedent. Not cool.


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## FordFisherman (Dec 5, 2007)

Think we need to have the Judge ride along the next time we plow a huge dump of snow. Bet he changes his tune.
Last time I checked upstate New York was still a free market economy,no?
Those guys are only guilty of hiring shi##y lawyers.


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## procut (Dec 1, 2004)

What a joke. If you don't like the price keep shopping.


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## CityGuy (Dec 19, 2008)

Longae29;1983120 said:


> If you don't like the price don't hire the contractor. Shovel your own roof/driveway


That's what I was thinking. If they want prompt service from a contractor that does not normally service them then you pay for it.

Don't like the price get someone else. Don't pay then *****.


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## CityGuy (Dec 19, 2008)

xgiovannix12;1983179 said:


> The price was agreed on I dont see an issue... its the homeowners fault for agreeing with the price...


Agreed.....


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

John_DeereGreen;1983359 said:


> I guess I fail to see where 350-500 for a driveway with 7 FEET of snow is that unreasonable.
> 
> GV, what's your average snowfall per season and what do you charge for an average driveway per season? Quick Google search shows around 70 inches per season. Say your average drive for the season you're charging 400 bucks. So in 1 storm you've got 1.2 feet ABOVE your average to clear at once.
> 
> Seems to me that your seasonal price should apply to one time customers, considering you're plowing more at once than you do all season on average.


we ended up with around 200 inches of snow. If you take out that November snow,I was on track for a normal season for plowing.


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## jhenderson9196 (Nov 14, 2010)

Every time I think I've had enough of RI, I hear something else about NY and I thank my lucky stars I dont 
Live there.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

2 hundred..... U gots pics?


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## Bossman 92 (Sep 27, 2006)

John_DeereGreen;1983359 said:


> I guess I fail to see where 350-500 for a driveway with 7 FEET of snow is that unreasonable.
> 
> GV, what's your average snowfall per season and what do you charge for an average driveway per season? Quick Google search shows around 70 inches per season. Say your average drive for the season you're charging 400 bucks. So in 1 storm you've got 1.2 feet ABOVE your average to clear at once.
> 
> Seems to me that your seasonal price should apply to one time customers, considering you're plowing more at once than you do all season on average.


I have to agree!! If we were forecasted to to receive 7' of snow in a week here I would be on the first plane out of here!!! All kidding aside $500 seems like a heck of a deal to me.

I hate these kinds of stories. What ever happened to being accountable for your actions??? I am sure these contractors gave a price to clear the snow and these homeowners paid what they were quoted....and we're happy to be able to leave their home. Now big brother steps in and says no you charged them too much??? WTF???

What if I call a roofer and get a quote to replace my roof because it's leaking...we agree on a price and he replaces my roof. Is the government going to jump in several months down the road and say he charged you too much??

It sure seemed like the private contractors handled that super storm better than the government did. Just my .02


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

1olddogtwo;1983612 said:


> 2 hundred..... U gots pics?


Not like it all fell in one day, all winter

They could of backdragged it if they had a Boss v plow.

.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

That's the dumbest thing I've read in quite a while. If they were quoted a price ahead of time and agreed on it, that should be what they pay. As others have said, if you don't like my quote, do it yourself or keep shopping. I can have you out of your house in an hour, or you can wait another couple days until someone else who is cheaper shows up. What ever happened to supply and DEMAND? Contractors can't be everywhere at once, those who get serviced sooner pay more. EASY CONCEPT. That's what happens when you let idiot Democraps run your state. Isn't this the same city that tells you how big a soda you can buy? What a croc.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Few years ago NY when after gas stations who jacked up the price of gas. Also stores that jacked up prices on portable generators.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

OK, we all know lake effect isn't really snow, therefore you can't jack up prices


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

1olddogtwo;1983676 said:


> OK, we all know lake effect isn't really snow, therefore you can't jack up prices


Buried under that 71/2 feet of snow were Bilandic's hopes of keeping his job. On Feb. 28, the Tribune reported on another flurry:

"An avalanche of snow protest votes carried Jane Byrne to the most stunning political upset in Chicago history late Tuesday as the second biggest primary election turnout in 40 years crushed the legendary Democratic political machine and ended Michael Bilandic's two-year reign in City Hall."

Buffalo still has its mayor.:laughing:


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

That was really snow that hit Chicago.... It was called a Blizzard


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

grandview;1983677 said:


> Buried under that 71/2 feet of snow were Bilandic's hopes of keeping his job. On Feb. 28, the Tribune reported on another flurry:
> 
> "An avalanche of snow protest votes carried Jane Byrne to the most stunning political upset in Chicago history late Tuesday as the second biggest primary election turnout in 40 years crushed the legendary Democratic political machine and ended Michael Bilandic's two-year reign in City Hall."
> 
> Buffalo still has its mayor.:laughing:


your boss v plow cant stack all that snow tho :laughing: Just pushing ya buttons GV

Silly direct lift plows leave the stacking for chain lift plows


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

xgiovannix12;1983680 said:


> your boss v plow cant stack all that snow tho :laughing: Just pushing ya buttons GV
> 
> Silly direct lift plows leave the stacking for chain lift plows


Two points award here


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

xgiovannix12;1983680 said:


> your boss v plow cant stack all that snow tho :laughing: Just pushing ya buttons GV
> 
> Silly direct lift plows leave the stacking for chain lift plows


Atty general,didn't knock on my door looking for money


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)




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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

grandview;1983687 said:


>


haha I Like that GV


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)




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## iceyman (Mar 1, 2007)

grandview;1983671 said:


> Few years ago NY when after gas stations who jacked up the price of gas. Also stores that jacked up prices on portable generators.


Goods can only be upcharged so much during a natural disaster such as the lake effect and sandy. But who thw hell is to say how much you can charge for services done. Thats borderline insane for any court to say how much someone should charge for its services. Gv go smack these people into shape.


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## PTSolutions (Dec 8, 2007)

NY has been on a steady downward spiral. You can all thank bloomturd and cuomo (my witty word for cuomo would have been censored...)


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## flyguyirvin65 (Feb 18, 2015)

At $45 a push with a 5 inch trigger, 84 inches = $765. $500 is a bargain why cant NY state see that one?


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## cowbay (Dec 7, 2009)

What a fluster f***. As stated by others if you don't like the price get somebody else to do the job. One more case why NYS is dying a slow death on a vine


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)




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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

1olddogtwo;1984828 said:


>


oh not this guy again.... LOl


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Holy crap, $6500.00 for a plow rig? I didn't realize it was sooooooo expensive LOL. Gee, sure wish I only had that guys overhead.


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

derekslawncare;1984838 said:


> Holy crap, $6500.00 for a plow rig? I didn't realize it was sooooooo expensive LOL. Gee, sure wish I only had that guys overhead.


20 dollar driveways ??? when he opened that book I saw a 7 dollar driveway


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Example of a guy who should not be in the business.


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

Dude make some good points on that video. He is on his way to low ball Grandview's customers. $100.00 seasonal price. One size fits all


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## xgiovannix12 (Dec 8, 2012)

thelettuceman;1984857 said:


> Dude make some good points on that video. He is on his way to low ball Grandview's customers. $100.00 seasonal price. One size fits all


hes got the idea but his prices are ridiculous


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Maybe he's in a time warp. He's quoting prices/cost from the 80's? Did anyone see a DeLorean in the background? HaHa


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## PLandscaping (Dec 20, 2013)

I snowblow a few accounts during the off season from mowing. Each one of them would have been 250-500, one over a grand for this big a storm. 

Mind you, most of them are two cars wide one car long.

The prices these guys charged are far from unreasonable, I'm glad I don't live in this sh!t hole state anymore.


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## 32vld (Feb 4, 2011)

thelettuceman;1984857 said:


> Dude make some good points on that video. He is on his way to low ball Grandview's customers. $100.00 seasonal price. One size fits all


The only good point is that you don't charge $20 when other people are charging $40.

Yet he has not made the connection as to why he will be lucky to break even this year as he said in that video.

Oh, and the only way to lowball Grandview is for the plow man to pay the customer for the privilege plow their drive way.


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## 32vld (Feb 4, 2011)

PLandscaping;1984904 said:


> I snowblow a few accounts during the off season from mowing. Each one of them would have been 250-500, one over a grand for this big a storm.
> 
> Mind you, most of them are two cars wide one car long.
> 
> The prices these guys charged are far from unreasonable, I'm glad I don't live in this sh!t hole state anymore.


Problem is lack of documentation. Contractor has to have a pricing system in place and history proving that it has been used to have a chance to not be found guilty of price gouging.

There has to be a pricing structure that for every inch of snow the price goes up X dollars.

Say a drive way has a base price at a trigger 2" for $50, then $5 each additional inch. So a 7' snow storm: 7 x 12 = 84 - 2 = 82 x 5 = $410 + $50 base price = $460.

Then no need to have a blizzard clause in the contract.


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## PLandscaping (Dec 20, 2013)

32vld;1984965 said:


> Problem is lack of documentation. Contractor has to have a pricing system in place and history proving that it has been used to have a chance to not be found guilty of price gouging.
> 
> There has to be a pricing structure that for every inch of snow the price goes up X dollars.
> 
> ...


You're right. My customers know already, I made it abundantly clear from day one, and sent them all emails. I gave up on the inch structure. Mine just do it multiple times for bigger storms, basically snowblowing at a per push rate.


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

Longae29;1983120 said:


> If you don't like the price don't hire the contractor. Shovel your own roof/driveway


yep, not price gouging, thats like saying our commercial prices of $200/hr is price gouging because some joe blow will plow for $50/hr plus donuts :yow!:


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## Diesel Dan (Sep 8, 2012)

derekslawncare;1983670 said:


> That's the dumbest thing I've read in quite a while. If they were quoted a price ahead of time and agreed on it, that should be what they pay. As others have said, if you don't like my quote, do it yourself or keep shopping. I can have you out of your house in an hour, or you can wait another couple days until someone else who is cheaper shows up. What ever happened to supply and DEMAND? Contractors can't be everywhere at once, those who get serviced sooner pay more. EASY CONCEPT. That's what happens when you let idiot Democraps run your state. Isn't this the same city that tells you how big a soda you can buy? What a croc.


Welcome the the United Socialist States of America.


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## sven1277 (Jan 15, 2008)

So I may be in the population minority being a social liberal but stuff like this is ridiculous (also limiting cup sizes). I understand not letting gas stations price gouge during a natural disaster because there really isn't any added cost to be able to get fuel to the stations. This is completely different because the amount of labor it takes to move 7' of snow. We have had a couple blizzards in the last few years. When we were hit with 40" of snow, I charged residential customers 4x their normal price to clear driveways. Drives that would normally take 5-10 min during a normal snowfall were taking two guys an hour using track drive snowblowers. Guys that normally work around 6-8 hours on a normal storm pulled in 50-60 hours on the two big ones. Its hard on us and our equipment and we should be fairly compensated for it and not worried about being sued. I wouldn't classify this as gouging at all. I did a lot of roof clearing jobs this past winter and I based every estimate on $200/hr. I worked my rear off to make those rates. But those jobs were priced by the job to the customer, not at an hourly rate. And if consumers are going to be able to sue after they obviously agreed to a price, then I want the ability to sue a customer if I under charge on a job. Ugh, let the free market do its job.


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## shooterm (Feb 23, 2010)

A good example is I used a avalanche type roof rake to take care of a two story tri-plex. I spent a hour tops getting the snow off the roof and blowing it off the walks. A roofer with four drunks I personally knew was a on a roof scoop shoveling the roof off. I Knew they'd been there for two hours before and when I left looked half done on a dinky house. They found widowed grams to take advantage off. Time and material is a good way screw people when the time is ripe.


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## JimMarshall (Jan 25, 2013)

derekslawncare;1984838 said:


> Holy crap, $6500.00 for a plow rig? I didn't realize it was sooooooo expensive LOL. Gee, sure wish I only had that guys overhead.


Guy would **** his pants if he knew. I have nearly $80k into my rig. "That kind of equipment takes years and years to pay for" no, not if your pricing is where it should be and you aren't a pathological low baller


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

JimMarshall;2041310 said:


> Guy would **** his pants if he knew. I have nearly $80k into my rig. "That kind of equipment takes years and years to pay for" no, not if your pricing is where it should be and you aren't a pathological low baller


Tell me about it. I've got close to 100k in mine, but it IS all paid for. payuppayup


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## JimMarshall (Jan 25, 2013)

derekslawncare;2041697 said:


> Tell me about it. I've got close to 100k in mine, but it IS all paid for. payuppayup


I've got loans on a couple of my trucks, namely my Ram and the new 1 ton Chevy. They could be bought snd paid for but the interest rates are low enough that doesn't make sense.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

JimMarshall;2041735 said:


> I've got loans on a couple of my trucks, namely my Ram and the new 1 ton Chevy. They could be bought snd paid for but the interest rates are low enough that doesn't make sense.


Yeah, financed mine through my bank because that was the only way I could register it through my Corp and not have my name on it, so interest rate was 4.5% financed over 80 months. Paid it off 25 months early. I HATE owing money, so it felt great to write that 15k check and be done with it. Now the ONLY thing I owe on is my skidsteer.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

derekslawncare;2041697 said:


> Tell me about it. I've got close to 100k in mine, but it IS all paid for. payuppayup


So what makes a pickup truck worth a $100k?


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

Mark Oomkes;2041754 said:


> So what makes a pickup truck worth a $100k?


Didn't know he had a pickup, learn something new every day on PS.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

Mark Oomkes;2041754 said:


> So what makes a pickup truck worth a $100k?


Nothing. Thankfully, I don't own a pickup. My truck is a F-550 Chassis cab (54k) with a Swaploader hooklift (18k) and then the toolboxes, custom aluminum diamond plate headache rack, central hydraulics. Then you add the 10.5' V-plow (9k), hyd. auger stainless spreader (10k), spray rig, hose reel for liquids and all mounted on a hooklift flatbed and it adds up fast. However, with the way they keep jacking up the prices on new trucks, it won't be too many more years, and we will be paying that for a pickup. LOL


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

Mark Oomkes;2041754 said:


> So what makes a pickup truck worth a $100k?


The Cdn dollar...


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## JimMarshall (Jan 25, 2013)

Mark Oomkes;2041754 said:


> So what makes a pickup truck worth a $100k?


A good operator


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

JimMarshall;2041794 said:


> A good operator


Ah, then my pickemup must be worth a million. Since King Einstein is behind the wheel.


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## JimMarshall (Jan 25, 2013)

Mark Oomkes;2041797 said:


> Ah, then my pickemup must be worth a million. Since King Einstein is behind the wheel.


More like bout tree fiddy


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## jhall22guitar (Dec 11, 2011)

90plow;1983153 said:


> We were charging $75 an hour per man to shovel roofs last year. People new the rate going in and were home when we came and when we left. It was a 4 man crew and a typical house we shoveled problem areas cleaned gutters of ice etc. I don't think I would have done well in that judgement as most houses were charged around 1,200 and the whole roof was not cleared....


My father and I charged $250 per hour to clear ice dams last year payup 
not one person complained and everyone paid. Our average was $1000 per house, and took 4 hours. (if it took a little longer we just kept the price at $1000 to keep them happy. One guy called twice!


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

The problem is. there is no baseline pricing. If this was going on every year and the price was consistent every year, then they would notice there was no rampant price gouging going on.


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## jhall22guitar (Dec 11, 2011)

grandview;2042054 said:


> The problem is. there is no baseline pricing. If this was going on every year and the price was consistent every year, then they would notice there was no rampant price gouging going on.


I wonder how deep the snow was when the plow guy charged that much. I am going to assume it was DEEP and it was someone flagging him down. Person deserved to pay that much, and agreed too it. It was probably the guys "F off I don't want to plow your driveway price" and the person said ok.


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