# Dodge vs. Chevy



## CrewCut

I hear rumors on how much better a chevy 3/4 h-d is so much better than dodge 3/4. I have a brand new 2001 2500 ram and I beg to differ, I don't see anything the chevy can do that the dodge can't. Whats your opinion?


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## thelawnguy

"I hear rumors ..."

Thats about it. Your Dodge has higer front axle rating, more ground clearance, roomier cab, proven track record, solid front axle vs. VW Jetta-style front end in the GM, you get the picture.

Anybody can read the fancy rhetoric from a glossy ad folder, but put em to the test and the real winner will stand tall.


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## John DiMartino

Gm's usually offer better ride quality and overall reliabilty,up til now they have never been able to match Dodge or Ford for capabilitys(towing,hauling,plowing).The better ride thing is gone,the HD's ride as firm as Ford and Dodge now,but the on-road feel and tracking of the IFS is superior to the solid axle,but thses are trucks,and id rather have the beefy Dana 60 in mine,it handles great for me.Reliabiltiy of GM's has been slipping,especially with the 99 and newer models,and Dodge's are now a lot better than they were in 99.Either truck will do what i need,but the Dodge will do the work end better and the GM would be my choice if i wanted a compromise between work/play.Im toosing both these trucks back and forth,ill end up buying one of them,Im not sure which one yet myself.Leaning more towards the dodge i think,now,especially after seeeing a new HD excab with an 8 ft western-front end is almost dragging on the ground,about 4" of clearance between road and plow frame.This one was a 6.0 auto with plow prep,short bed.My 89 LD 2500 sags less than the new HD,and ive never touched the torsion bars or anything in the front end.


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## PMU

All trucks are a compromise, and each has its streangths
that make it biased toward a certain use. The Dodge has
unsurpassed heavy towing economy with the I6 diesel and is
available with an iron cased 6-speed which is very robust.
Ford has a good all-around product, and their diesel will
appeal to those desiring acceleration near equal to a gas
engine (unloaded). Ford has a little better record with
their auto tranny behind the diesel than Dodge. Chevy has
a history of undersizing the cooling system, and even
programed the 6.2-6.5 to reduce power when the cooling
system couldnt keep up. There are a lot of problems with
the 6.2-6.5 Chevy compaired to Dodge/Ford, but they steer
and ride well. Chevy has done better with gas engines.
I'm still waiting to see if Chevy has done an in-depth
quality job on the duramax, or if they once again cut
corners on streangth,durability, and ultimate capacity.
Long winded, but if I could have the Allison in my Dodge
with brakes like the F450 then I wouldnt even consider the
others!


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## plowking35

I will qualify this post by first stating that I am a GM man. That being said I will go over the + for the GM product, you apparently know what you like about the Dodge.
I have driven all three brands, diesel and gas, and will say that next to the GM I would get a dodge.
The 2001 GM trucks have the best ride and interior of The big 3. Exterior looks are subjective so I wont go there.
The GM will do at least one thing the dodge or ford cant, and that is tow a gcwr of 22000 lbs. The ford and dodge are rated at 20000 lbs for 3/4 and 1 ton trucks.The limited slip differential is also better in the GM.
With the auto you get a far better tranny, and a grade braking feature as well that will stop the truck payload and trailer on its own, with no brakes. The duramax is alot quieter than a cummins, which translates to a an overall better driving experience. So at the driveup youi can order with out yelling. With the auto you also get alot more torque and hp thana dodge, with the 6 sp, you still get more hp and torque, but the HO cummins is better, but still not up the d max power levels. The dmax also has a very flat torque curve, so engine power is steady across the plain, instead of peaking and dropping off like the cummins.
Also you have the ability to purchase a crew cab with 6 and 8' beds, something dodge hasnt been able to offer in the 94+ models.
And for as many issues people have with the 6.2/6.5 mine has been more than able to perform for my needs, and I personally know of several dodge owners with a mutiltude of tranny, front end, and injector pump troubles. And unlike GM,dodge wont foot the bill past 100K or 5 yrs.
One has to drive the new d max to fully understand the level that Gm has raised the bar to, but time will tell as to whether or not it is as reliable as it needs to be.
I am not trying to start a flame war here, I have tried to keep it middle of the road, please dont start a brand war from this.
Dino


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## PMU

No brand war here, and I hope the d-max chevy is everything
GM claims, as we will all benefit from the competition. I
better not tell my Dodge that it can't tow 26000 GCVW, as
so far it has done so 400 miles each way while returning
11 [email protected] mph for the last 4 years and 35000 miles. I can
also drive 65mph with my 9' plow on front without the
cooling system giving me any trouble, and my 88 chevy sure
couldn't do the same! That said, my 96 3500 GM was a better
truck than the 88 chevy, and had the best steering of any
truck I've ever driven as well as a smooth quiet ride. No
doubt, the Cummins is biased toward hard industrial use and
mine is turned off at the drive thru window! If that d-max
lives up to the hype then some day I'll buy one! Hope GM
(& Dodge) puts out a 4x4 to compete with the F450, and that
they ride as smoothly and quietly as my 96 chevy 3500. Now
THAT would be quite the truck: tow the loader, plow snow,
AND navigate that drive thru window!


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## plowking35

I have no doubt that the truck can tow it, its just exceeds the limits that Dodge has put on the truck. I dont think its the engine that isnt up to the challenge, its the rest of the drivetrain that may be suspect.
I see many hotshots towing goosnecks with 3-4 cars on them, how they can be legal, I dont know. But they do it all the time, and 75% of them drive dodges.
I see now that both ford and gm are designing class 5 trucks to be used just for that segment of the market.
Chevy is releasing a new line of medium duty trucks this year, and 4 wd will be an option late in the year. 
Dino


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## PMU

Dino, do you know if the GM class 4 or 5 4x4 trucks will
have independant front suspension? If so, this sounds like
a very nice developement in the marketplace. I have owned
all the brands, and buy whichever comes closest to providing
a solution to my needs. I had been looking at another truck
and wanted to test the chevy 3500 chassis-cab, but none were
to be found near me. I looked at the F450, but it rode very
harshly and I didnt care for the interior. I am interested
to learn more about the class 4 Chevy 4x4. FWIW I'm not
brand loyal to Dodge, just satisfied that the truck does a
wide range of jobs without complaint.


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## plowking35

http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/autoshows/sema2000/chevrolet/bruin.html
That is the show truck, but should look close to the finished model.I personally like the ford super cruizer better, looks wise. But the work type truck may look better.
Dino


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## John DiMartino

Dino,the 6 speed dodges have a 21,500GCWR,the auto s have a max of 19K with a 4.1o axle.The GM's are sweet trucks,but the Dodge's just handle the blade so much better I my opinion.As far as GCWR,it is for warranty only,i have a friend with a 1999 Dodge 3500 and its an auto,he is tagged for 38K lbs,legally,truck has 278K on it,still original tranny,engine's just broken in.LOL.


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## wyldman

I have test driven a new GM HD,and they are a really nice truck.One concern though,they are REALLY slow in reverse,and the trans seems to shift to much (concerned about longetivity).Not too good if your lots require a lot of backing up.

I sure wish our dodge's tracked as well,as the GM's.That's my only complaint with the dodge's we have.We just bought another 2001-2500 Quadcab diesel,and was hoping to see an improvement.Nada,zip,my 97 Ram steers just as well,if not better.


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## DaveO

*Ram Steering*

wyldman,

The newer Rams definitely have a steering issue. I drove several before buying my '01 2500, and they all wandered somewhat in a straight line. Many people have brought them in for new steering boxes. Dodge has released a new box (Delphi) to be installed if warranted.

That said, perform the bearing preload adjustment, then the OTC(over center adjustment), on the box. These corrected mine to driving like it should. The TSB's are on "Fritz's" web page. Takes all of 1 hour, and steers excellent. Normally the dlr won't perform these, they just swap out the box.

Dino,

You don't think the torque curve is flat for a Cummins? From 1700-2700 it's a straight line....LOL

Dave


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## thelawnguy

The 2001 has completely different brake system and steering components-knuckles, rotors, linkage, even wheels are not interchangeable with 94-00 models.

Could be 00 was the change but since it was only in production 3 mo its hard to say without research.


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## John DiMartino

Bill the 2000's have the new front end with the 5200 lb rating.and the 2001.5's got the rear disc brakes on top of that.The Gm steering box they come with is usually out of adjustment from the factory,proper adjustment takes out all the wander and play,but they will never track quite as good as IFS,but an IFS will never hold up to plowing and not sag out like the Dana 60.


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## plowking35

I dont know John about the plowing wear John. 
Case study
1997 W-300 cab and chassis
1998 k-3500 cab and chassis
Both trucks have similar bodies on rear, and have plowed the same amount of time. My truck did need replace the pit man arm and one idle arm at 30K.
The dodge has had every component in the front suspension replaced, all bushings and springs.
The axel is stronger yes, but the springs,control arm bushings, and items related to them are not as strong.
As far as torque curves go, the d max is above 500 ft lbs from 850 rpm through 3100 rpm. That is as flat as it comes.
Dino


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## DaveO

> _Originally posted by plowking35 _
> *As far as torque curves go, the d max is above 500 ft lbs from 850 rpm through 3100 rpm. That is as flat as it comes.
> Dino *


GM's site dyno chart show's 500+ft/lbs from 1500 to 3100rpms.

http://gmc.com/sierra/heavyduty/flashed/frameset.html

Still IMPRESSIVE!

Dave

[Edited by DaveO on 01-26-2001 at 03:17 PM]


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## thelawnguy

"The dodge has had every component in the front suspension replaced, all bushings and springs."

Dodge cab and chassis are not available (well, at least in 97 werent) with snow plow prep package. The steering components of a plow prep truck are stouter than those from a standard package truck. 

Dodge dropped the "W" nomenclature in 93. 94-up are known as "BR".


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## plowking35

Dave is right, the d max torque curve starts at 1000 rpm at about 320 ft lbs and reaches 500 ft lbs at 1500 rpm, and stay above 500 ft lbs till 3100 when it begins to drop off.
In 97 we were told that the plow was acceptable for that truck. I was looking at a 98 dodge c&c and was told that the plow was not available for that model year.
The only ? I then have is, if the truck can take the abuse and weight so well, why no plow prep option?
Dino


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## PMU

UH-OH, starting to sound like a brand war...

Just speaking from experience, my 97 Dodge chassis cab has
held up well and I've only had to replace the track bar on
the front end. Is it a perfect truck? NO, there is no such
animal! I did own a 88 chevy that overheated, needed ball-
joints at 13000 miles, blew the guv-lock posi into small
expensive bits, and chevy was in denial until the arbitrator
told GM they would have to buy the truck back. Truth is
that ALL the brands could do better, and the customer is
always the field test engineer for a new design. If you
find a dealer that is a cut above the competition, then
that may surpass all the brand considerations. I've heard
the 98 story concerning lack of plow package, and I'm
not discounting it...sounds like another case of the mfgr
not knowing their customers needs. Note that the marketplace
soon straightens those nitwits out! ALL the brands have
problems, and half of a satisfactory ownership experience is
if the dealer steps up when the owner has a problem. BUT I
still say if you tow over 5 tons then the dodge-cummins will
be the fuel economy leader:>)


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## pottstim

Plowking wrote:

"The axel is stronger yes, but the springs,control arm bushings, and items related to them are not as strong." 

In referring to the current generation Dodge trucks, I agree with Plowking wholeheartedly on this. Yes, the axles on a dodge 4X4 pickup are strong and relaible units. Is the hardware which holds the front axle on strong enough for this truck? My answer is NO. You've got a big, heavy, and tall truck here..and the front axle is held on by 4 small link arms. Common sense tell you that after some time and some miles are racked up on the truck, a lot of play is gonna develop in this front end. There are 2 guys in my town that i know of that have had these problems. My mechanic, which has his own garage, told me about these 2 guy's experiences. One had a 95 2500 4X4 with the cummins..the other is a prominent farmer here in town and he has a 96 or 97 3500 diesel dually. The guy with the 2500 had his truck at the local dodge dealer for several service visits. My mechanic told me that he said the truck was shaking bad while you were going down the road, and it was especially bad when you hit a bump in the road. As it turned out, the dodge dealer knew it was a problem in the front end..but didn't quite know how to fix it. He said, "Well i know how to fix that..i'm going down the the Ford dealer now and get rid of it." He did just that and ended up with a 97 PSD crew cab. His dodge was 2yrs old and had just over 30,000 miles on it. 
One day my mechanic ran into the farmer at the local auto parts store. He asked him if he had any problems with his dually shaking in the front end..then he told him about the other guys experiences. He told him that yes he was having the same problems and had been down the the same dodge dealer and discussed the problem with the owner of the dealership. I don't know what ended up happening with his situation, because my mechanic hadn't seen him since then. In the trucks defense, the farmer did say that nothing pulled like the cummins did. 
I'm a Chevy man all the way, and i don't mean this to come across like i'm knocking dodge pickups. I'll admit that i wish the new Chevy HD's had a solid axle with leaf springs, that's the route that Dodge should follow also. IMO..nothing beats this setup for heavy duty work

Tim


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## thelawnguy

"The only ? I then have is, if the truck can take the abuse and weight so well, why no plow prep option? "

Part of the reason is that some equipment required for plow prep is not available on c&c, rear bumper for one.

Does seem kinda lame to not have plow prep for a truck that will obviously be a good candidate for a plow.

"and the front axle is held on by 4 small link arms."

LOL, spoken by one who evidently has not looked at these "4 small link arms" up close. They are as stout as the frame rails on the truck. They keep the axle square to the truck. There is a massive track bar to control lateral movement. The only problem I could see is if the bushings wore, not uncommon on any bushing, I had Ford LTDs which always needed bushings on the upper a-arms.

My Dodge routinely carries 1000 lbs of Fisher plow all winter and will weigh in close to 2000 lbs over gvw during storms and these so-called "problems" apparently spoken from hearsay and obviously not from personal experience have not shown up on my truck.

I have never heard a Dodge dealer recommend Timbrens to to carry a plow, unlike the GMC dealer did re: 2001 HD.


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## wyldman

Just a note on dodge front ends.We have several,the oldest a 97,with 175,000 KM,33X12.50 BFG MT's,an 11Ft modified western (very heavy !),and tons of extra front end weight (ie:2 tractor batteries,lights,etc).It has had only one front end part replaced,and that was the track bar,at 80,000,never even had an alignment.I am just starting to get a tiny amount of play in one upper ball joint.Everything else is rock solid,considering the abuse it takes.Only thing we do is make sure it gets greased after every plow,to get all the water out,and add a set of Timbren springs.I know the Timbren's aren't really neccesary,but we have had such good luck with them,i had to put them on,maybe thats why.Even has the original trans (knock on wood).Not to put down any other trucks,because we have had good luck with them too,just hate to see the dodge getting bashed.I guess it depends on how it's taken care of.


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## pottstim

the lawnguy wrote:

"LOL, spoken by one who evidently has not looked at these "4 small link arms" up close"

I've looked at these link arms enough times to develop my own opinion of them. So please don't make it sound like i don't know what i'm talking about here..or making something up. You don't know me personally. I was just sharing my opinion and a couple of accounts from owners of these trucks. You've got your opinions..i've got mine.

Tim


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## John DiMartino

My Dodge had 67K on it when i sold it,I plowedcommercially with it for 3 years,and the only thing that went wrong with the front end when i had it was the track bar,and it was replaced under warranty.It didnt have a plow prep pgk,but did have the temp light for the tranny,it never came on once,w I wasnt supposed plow with it,since it was an excab diesel.I had to order push plates for a reg cab truck,since they wouldnt sell me the plates for an excab diesel.Personally the Dodge's turning radius and ground clearance make it a much better plow truck,the Dana 60 is the icing on the cake.I had that Dodge and my GMC,at the same time,my Uncle has 96 chevy 2500 diesel exacb,the exact chevy version of my Dodge,and that truck couldnt compete with the big Dodge,I could literally turn circles inside it,although ouir wheelbases are within 2" of each other,and the Dodge went into gear so much quicker than the GM tranny,i was backing while he was waiting for reverse to engage.I love both trucks,but plowing-dodge all the way,for on highway feel and smoothness Chevy wins hands down.


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## DaveO

I have driven both the Chev 2500 6.5 xcab, and my Ram 2500 xcab diesel, back to back. Towing the SAME trailer on the same roads. Haven't plowed with both yet.

The GMC has a more precise road feel, IMO. Not that my Ram is lacking this, but you can tell the IFS on the chevy. They both are VERY smooth on the highway. The Chevy needed to be shifted out of OD to climb hills that the Ram pulled in OD no prob(towing 6K). 

Also @ 85mph the Ram is "glass" smooth, almost scary for a 7K lbs vehicle, while tachin 2200rpms. The Chevy will cruise well at that speed also, but seems like it is working harder to do so(maybe diff ratios).


Pottstim,

Everybody has their opinion. I myself am tired of hearing people "bashin" a product on HERESAY. In fact at one point in time, I decided NOT to buy a RAM because of all this HERESAY about them...tranny's etc. After finally realizing that most of the people condeming them had NEVER owned one, I only listened to owners. Yes there was some owners unhappy with their Rams, BUT a much higher percentage of these owners were VERY happy with the truck. Especially those who educated themselves about the Rams weaknesses, and took the precautions for these. Lawnguy and John Dimartino are 2 of a few guys who helped me realize this.
And if you are so smart mechanical wise? Why do you need a mechanic? 

So go drive/buy one before you bash it....


Dave


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## pottstim

Dave:

"Pottstim, 

Everybody has their opinion. I myself am tired of hearing people "bashin" a product on HERESAY. In fact at one point in time, I decided NOT to buy a RAM because of all this HERESAY about them...tranny's etc. After finally realizing that most of the people condeming them had NEVER owned one, I only listened to owners. Yes there was some owners unhappy with their Rams, BUT a much higher percentage of these owners were VERY happy with the truck. Especially those who educated themselves about the Rams weaknesses, and took the precautions for these. Lawnguy and John Dimartino are 2 of a few guys who helped me realize this. 
And if you are so smart mechanical wise? Why do you need a mechanic? 

So go drive/buy one before you bash it...."

Dave,
Like i had said before..i didn't want my posts to come across like I was bashing the truck. I was simply giving my opinion just like you are. I did not use adjectives like "junk" or "hey don't buy one of these." You seem to like your truck and that's cool. I like my 2000 Silverado also..it does a fine job with no problems so far. As far as my comments being heresay..those were facts that i heard..no one made them up. These guys are well respected people in the town i live in. They had problems with their trucks..that's the bottom line. No certain brand of car or truck is problem free..i realize that.
I didn't insist that i was a genious technical wise. I know a good deal about cars. Things that i know how to do..i do them. Things that i know i'm not skilled enough to do..i let the mechanic do. This mechanic i know works on our company trucks at work..that's how i got to know him. I used to have an old 83 S-10 and he fixed some cooling system leaks for me. Since i have a new truck now..it doesn't require things like that..just normal maintenance that i can take care of. If a warranty problem comes up, i'll let the chevy dealer take care of it. Sorry that you seemed to take offense to what i had to say. I do feel, however, that your statement about my possibly not being too smart technical-wise was kind of abrasive. You don't know me personally..and i don't know you. I don't come in here or anywhere else and make comments like that to other people. Sorry if this bothers you..but that's the way i feel.

Tim


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## DaveO

*Heresay*

Tim,

"As far as my comments being heresay..those were facts that i heard..no one made them up."

That is heresay in my book.

Don't take offense by my comment, was just throwin it back at ya. Don't believe everthing you hear...no matter what the source.

Glad you like your GMC. Couple of my bud's have them. They are great trucks, nobody makes a bad truck nowadays. They all have their pros/cons.

Rememeber, your in a Dodge forum, what did you expect? LOL

Dave

[Edited by DaveO on 01-30-2001 at 09:58 AM]


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## thelawnguy

hear·say [hr sày ] noun 
second-hand information: information that is heard from other people

adjective 
heard second-hand: being or containing information heard from other people

(From Encarta Reference Dictionary)


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## Michael F

Dave O, your probably right about the different ratio's, and that makes a huge difference. I have driven all brands, ford chevy & dodge. I prefer Chevy, but with any truck that is being worked it's who sets the truck up. I have a 99 chevy K3500 pickup, 454 AT & 4:10. I set it up, looked till I found exact truck I wanted. 
We were just looking at a 2000 Chevy K2500 Silverado, 6000 engine, AT, & 3:73. The salesman said it was rated to tow 8800 lbs. My landscape traier(20' Enclosed) weighs in the neighborhood of 6000-7000 every day(depending on jobs that day), I tried to explain to salesman that the rated towing capacity was not adaqute, I felt truck would be working to hard, as it pretty much lives with a trailer on it from mid April-December. I felt this would cause the truck to wear prematurely. My feeling is that the rated towing is fine if your towing the boat to the lake on the weekend, periodt towing, Ect.
My point is unless the salesman understands what the truck is doing and understands trucks, and how to equip them. Part of this is the purchasers responsibility, when Chevy came out with the Allisons, I thought I really wanted one, after reading about them(slow in reverse, to much shifting) & seeing the addition $ 1000 price tag I'm rethinking that. The 6000 has more HP than my 454, and just a little less torque. I will probably buy one with the 4:10's.
The purchaser will not be happy, unless they get lucky. No matter what brand.


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## DaveO

Michael,

You are on the $$ about setup being important. I test drove several trucks before purchasing my '01 Ram. This included GMC' and SD's. I tow highway mostly, and NOT at 55mph. The 1st Ram I drove had 4.10's and tached too much on the highway. Another Ram(the one I bought), had 3.55's and was turning [email protected], with no strain. With the Cummins engine, 3.55's are quite sufficient unless towing over 10K continuously, and return great mileage. I tow 5-6K lbs, barely use 1/2 throttle, and get [email protected] Tough to beat. 

The powerstroke'd SD was my only other choice, and it was a close call. The big Ford/Chev/Dodge gas motor's were an option, but their mileage was a concern. I have towed with BB chevy's before.

Most saleperson's don't know trucks. The one I dealt with was the "truck" expert, and he was knowledgeable. However I still knew more about the truck/options than he did. This is a result of doing my homework on the vehicle, to the N'th degree. When I spend over $30K on a vehicle, I make sure it's what I want. 

One good feature about buying the diesel, you get almost ALL the HD upgrades included. No wonder it's a $4K option. $$$ well spent IMO. Figured out I have saved over $1500 in fuel in less than one year so far.

Dave


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## pottstim

Hey Dave,
No offense taken here..it's all good. I understand your point when you talk about heresay. Yes, i did hear this info second hand from the mechanic. However, he should know the situation because he did look at the truck for this man, when the dealer couldn't figure out what the problem was. So i believe what Tom told me was the truth..he looked at the truck and drove it. I don't expect anyone here to believe what i've said..i'm an unidentified source so to speak..just like anyone else in here. About this being a Dodge forum, you are right. I should have taken that into consideration a little more. :O)

Take care,

Tim


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## pottstim

Bill,

"adjective 
heard second-hand: being or containing information heard from other people "


Back when i was in English class in middle and high school, i can remember our teacher giving us the definition of the word adjective. Adjective: a word used to describe a noun.

example: cool truck! truck is the noun..cool is the adjective used to describe the truck.


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## slplow

With all the problems i had with my 97 gmc 4/4 1ton dump, I would never buy another gm truck. My new 2001 dodge dump with the 360 gas holds the weight of the plow and the sander full far much better than the gmc.Plows way better than the gmc and plowing for 11hrs you don't get stiff from sitting in it.One bad note it is harder on gas than my vortac 5.7 was


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## 66Construction

I've driven all three brands. I destroyed a ford but that was my fault. The only conclusion I came to is I'm not buying a new truck. With the new silverado I cant help but remember the 88 3/4 ton my friend owned, he went through three transmisions and cracked the block before 60,000 miles. Part of it could have been his fault but enough of it was GM's fault. I own a 90 GMC 3/4 ton. I plow with it in the winter (the plow is on from mid November untill april) and day after day it carries more then the gvw in the summer. Everything has held up great so far except the front end. It's been totaly replaced. I just looked at a 2001 dodge cab and chasis and would have bought it except it didnt have the payload I was looking for. It seemed like a good truck I may still buy it. For now the next time my front end goes on my GMC I plan to swap that garbage IFS out for a Dana 60. The aftermarket kit is about a 1000$ plus the axel will be about the $2500 I have into the front end now. I just see it cheaper to run an older chevy. A universal 350 is real cheap and a rebuilt turbo 350 only goes for 600.00 from summit. They make good beaters. However I still have my eye on a dodge 3500 with a cummins.


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## landscaper3

My question is why does GMC trucks now have a H/D version are the others light duty? MMMMMMMMMMMMM!


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## plowking35

Same reason that ford has has a f-150 and a SD line up. The same reason that Dodge will be splitting their line up in 2002/2003. Its all for marketing.
Dino


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## RTallday

PLOWKING35, Awsome quote. The best that i have ever read. I am a GM man, and thats what i stick behind. GM RULES!! Although, as far as the new trucks go, i would have to choose between a dodge or a chevy. The only thing is the $$$. I can get a used dodge cheaper than a used chevy. Besides, i would only take a REALLY new Chevy. Like brand new. Dodge, ill take a few years old. I dont really tow a lot of stuff, but when i do pull, I pull a landscape trailer and in the bed i move people around. (tools, etc) and my chevy 350 holds up just as well as a new one, if not better. Its a 79, and it does NOT sag. Even with 1000 pounds in it. It easily holds that. Ive seen a new ford that cant take anything in the bed without sagging. Thats all for now. 

-Rich


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## TRACY

*DODGE -VS- CHEVY*

I HAVE BOTH A 1999 RAM SPORT 2500 & JUST PURCHASED A CHEVY 3500, WITH A 6.5 TURBO DIESEL, 4X4. REASON: MY RAM HAS A 360 MAGNUM AND WHEN I HOOK UP MY TRAILER W/LAWN EQUIPT. ETC.. THE RAM FEELS LIKE IT'S STRUGGLING . WITH THE CHEVY 3500 , I HAVE TO LOOK TO SEE IF MY TRAILER IS STILL ATTACHED. BIG DIFFERENCE. GO TURBO DIESEL TRACY


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## DaveO

Tracy,

Should have bought the Cummins. You can't compare a gas motor to a turbo diesel. 

Dave


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## slplow

You can say that again Dave.


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## nsmilligan

I have both a Dodge 2500 V10, and a 98 GMC 454 and no you don't need a diesel to push or pull, the big blocks are every bit as good. Only you pay for gas over the long haul instead of up front with extra cost of the diesel, so it all works out to how many miles and how long you keep a truck.
The GM rides and handles better. that's why Dodge will have a IFS torsion bar setup in 2002. The GM has a MUCH better trany it doesn't heat up like the Dodge when working (plowing), and the GM will whip the Dodge from 30 to 80.
Also the GM is about 20% better on fuel. Each truck has it's own personality, the V10 is the smoothest truck I've ever driven, but it has had some front end work(track bar, simmy shock, steering box seal) vs none with the GM. All my other GM's 90 & 94 ate idler arms and U joints, but th 98 has been trouble free. I think the Dodge wins hands down for styling, cab comfort and room ( both are regular cabs). The GM for power train and handling, now if I could just get the V10 mated to a GM tranny in a Ram with torsion bar IFS, I'd have a near perfect truck!


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## cowboy

*my experience*

I have owned an older dodge and older Chevy and have driven newer ones for work etc.

on the older side, the Dodge didn't hold up as well, was noiser, harder to find parts for, had the worst interior ever designed. Had good drivetrain, engine was fairly good.
1974 Dodge W200 4x4 3/4ton
1981 Chevy 1/2ton 2wd

My Chevy I actually want to drive, I enjoye driving it every day, it runs perfect, has a very nice and well laid out interior, almost no rust, awesome engine and drivetrain, original Th350 tranny went 330,000 miles!!!

I like the dodge but I'm a Chevy guy and would take a Chevy anyday, but the dodge runs good has good snow country drivtrain like 4speed with granny low (I forgot which tranny it is), Np205 transfer case, Dana 60 full floating rear, dana 44 front, warn hubs, so I keep it because it has let me down (well away from home <g>).

On the newer ones, in my experience the Chevy is a lot more comfortable, I don't like the seating position of the dodge. The design is pretty good but my personal prefernce is the 3/4ton and 1ton chevys with the fender flares, they look awesome. They have really good engines, both of them, GM auto trannies are much better, thats why rolls royce uses them. IFS/Solid axle I don't really care either way.


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