# this lot



## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

how long would this lot take with a pickup or a back hoe w 12' blade? any idea what one would charge a person to do this


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## Burkartsplow (Nov 1, 2007)

measure it out and see how many acres it is then multiply it by the how much you charge per acre and there is your price. Simple. Plus you have no picture.


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

What do most charge per acre on mostly flat clear surfaces? its around 5-5.6 acres if i did it right lol. kinda new to google earth. I just dont have much experience figureing these kind of lots. thanks guys


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## LoneCowboy (Jan 2, 2007)

there's no way the parking lot is 5 to 6 acres. The whole property might be, but not just the lot.

About 3 hours with a pickup, 2-6" of snow


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

LoneCowboy;1067356 said:


> there's no way the parking lot is 5 to 6 acres. The whole property might be, but not just the lot.
> 
> About 3 hours with a pickup, 2-6" of snow


LOL like i said i most likely screwed up somewhere. so ok then how would ya come up w a per acre dollar amount? I been lookin into this for awhile but have stayed with the smaller 15-30 minute lots lol. a few ppl have asked me to give them a number so i decided to use that pic for a reference. pms r welcome lol


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

*lot size is...*

This lot with driving lanes around the perimeter and back loading lanes is about 380,000 ft, or about 8.5 acres.


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

thanks weeded!

So def gonna need a backhoe w/pushblade huh. lol


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## Chrisxl64 (Dec 10, 2008)

Figure your costs, into what you'll need to make an hour, find how many acres you can do per hour, and there you have it.


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## Mick76 (Aug 2, 2009)

Chrisxl64;1067565 said:


> Figure your costs, into what you'll need to make an hour, find how many acres you can do per hour, and there you have it.


I agree... but also check for the bid specs...chances are a National has this and can email them too you....can it be done with a pu?...sure... but what do the bid specs state have to be done and in what time frame?...... chances are your going to need a loader with push box of some sort for that place..... please tell me you have a v box spreader and not a tail gate? For the $ they pay you will loss money if your using bagged product.....

And on a side note, no ones going to tell you what to charge .....

Do a search and you'll find some usefull info about pricing Lowes.....

Good Luck!


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

common kramer your no rookie to the site, you know those with the experience are not going to give it up... 

looking at google map may help you but if your really going to bid, go there and scout. do they have specific places the snow has to go? if that is lowes don't you have to submit a bid to a national account management firm.

we use backhoes with 14' scoops on our medium size properties, then you clean up with the truck you drove to the site with.

when I was just starting out into commercial something that would help me was I would picture a lot that I did, with an average known time to plow, then I would figure how many of that known lot would fit inside the big lot you are bidding. if your lots take 30 minutes, and 5 of them fit inside your big lot then you can expect it to take about 2 1/2 hours to complete, less if its open, more if it has lots of islands or few places to put snow.


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## cmo18 (Mar 10, 2008)

thats a big lot, hope you have more than just a pickup


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

With a fleet of 28" snow blowers....20hrs with a full sized p/u....way too long and with a loader with a 45ft push box.....20 minutes.


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## hoskm01 (Oct 17, 2008)

$17 per square foot.


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Wow everyone on this site had become less and less helpful each year........ bummer.

You guys all b**** about people lowballing but then when someone comes on and asks for help you won't offer any. I imagine most of the time this leads to someone putting in a low ball bid (probably unintentionally) and then you all just b**** more.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

Is a backhoe with a 14 foot blade faster at clearing snow than a strong skid steer with a 10 foot box? Seems the maneuverability (and safety) of the skid can get more done. I have run backhoes (without push box) pushing snow, and they seem snow and clunky.


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## buckwheat_la (Oct 11, 2009)

JDiepstra;1067672 said:


> Wow everyone on this site had become less and less helpful each year........ bummer.
> 
> You guys all b**** about people lowballing but then when someone comes on and asks for help you won't offer any. I imagine most of the time this leads to someone putting in a low ball bid (probably unintentionally) and then you all just b**** more.


Agreed, however, all the info is already here to figure this stuff out. I well even say that at one point I did a extensive post on figuring out your rates, and expected performance on equipment. I would feel more for the original poster if he had presented his thoughts and estimations first, then we can help him fine tune his own plans for this lot.


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

buckwheat_la;1067678 said:


> Agreed, however, all the info is already here to figure this stuff out. I well even say that at one point I did a extensive post on figuring out your rates, and expected performance on equipment. I would feel more for the original poster if he had presented his thoughts and estimations first, then we can help him fine tune his own plans for this lot.


Good points. Fair enough!


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

Weeded!;1067673 said:


> Is a backhoe with a 14 foot blade faster at clearing snow than a strong skid steer with a 10 foot box? Seems the maneuverability (and safety) of the skid can get more done. I have run backhoes (without push box) pushing snow, and they seem snow and clunky.


A 4wd backhoe will make the skid look silly in big lots as most times big lots have designated areas for snow and you can't plow both ways.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

LoneCowboy;1067356 said:


> there's no way the parking lot is 5 to 6 acres. The whole property might be, but not just the lot.
> 
> About 3 hours with a pickup, 2-6" of snow


There's parking for over 700 cars. I think you better take a better look at the pic. I would guess 3 hours on anything under 4" with a 12 ft pusher pushing the snow to the far end.


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## Weeded! (Nov 13, 2009)

JD Dave;1067691 said:


> A 4wd backhoe will make the skid look silly in big lots as most times big lots have designated areas for snow and you can't plow both ways.


Would you mind elaborating on the backhoe vs skid for me?

Here's my impression:
Backhoe: Pushing power but poor maneuverability and dangerous arm hanging in back.
Skid steer: Less pushing power but great maneuverability and quickness.

I have to make this decision this year on some lots.
Thanks.


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## LoneCowboy (Jan 2, 2007)

JD Dave;1067692 said:


> There's parking for over 700 cars. I think you better take a better look at the pic. I would guess 3 hours on anything under 4" with a 12 ft pusher pushing the snow to the far end.


Look, I'm not doing measuring here (because the OP didn't)
But i'm not that far off on size.
700 car spots
700 * 10' wide * 15' long = 105,000 square feet
doubled (lanes, islands, turn lanes, etc, just a SWAG) is 210,000 square feet which is 4.7 acres (ok, I'm off some), but that's still 3 to 4 hours of work)

and yes, if the OP wants real info, they need to do research first.


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## Brant'sLawnCare (Jun 29, 2007)

I usually try and get around $100 per acre. Maybe a little less if it's open like that. But that seems to be a good rate. Sometimes that doesn't happen in my area though. I bid on bigger jobs like that, and I am usually high on salting or something.


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

Sorry didnt mean to start an arguement. Yes a national has it. And I know that pickups wont do it alone. I just never come close to bidding on a site that big and have beeen asked to so well here I am.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

LoneCowboy;1067356 said:


> there's no way the parking lot is 5 to 6 acres. The whole property might be, but not just the lot.
> 
> About 3 hours with a pickup, 2-6" of snow





LoneCowboy;1067732 said:


> Look, I'm not doing measuring here (because the OP didn't)
> But i'm not that far off on size.
> 700 car spots
> 700 * 10' wide * 15' long = 105,000 square feet
> ...


Your first post said the whole property might be 5-6 acre. That's what I was commenting on and you seem to agree with me now.

To Weeded the skids are great in small lots but when all the snow has to go to one end the skid looses it's edge. The backhoe will shine in big heavy storms on long pushes. If all you have is short pushes where you can plow both ways the skid will work better.


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

Weeded!;1067673 said:


> Is a backhoe with a 14 foot blade faster at clearing snow than a strong skid steer with a 10 foot box? Seems the maneuverability (and safety) of the skid can get more done. I have run backhoes (without push box) pushing snow, and they seem snow and clunky.


in a busy retail lot operate visibility is key to safety. skids have terrible blind spots, in the backhoe I can see every idiot. the backhoe can stack higher and farther onto the lawn. the 14' box holds way more snow and on long open runs that is key.

our smaller commercial lots we just use the f550's with v's, and leave the backhoes on site.


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

forgot to mention one last advantage, last winter in a particularly icy storm one of the opperators got stuck and with all of us busy he very carefully used the bucket arm to pull himself out of the loading dock he slid down in.


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## Grn Mtn (Sep 21, 2004)

oh and faster travel speed to other lots nearbypayup


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## grf_1000 (Sep 14, 2009)

i do the local lowes store here. they are all close to the same size, yes they do vary in size some. with 4" of normal snow( not the real wet stuff) i can clear the whole lot in an hour using 3 8'2" boss v's. front lot is all pushed to 1 side and the rear is pushed both ways. every other push i stack with the loader. 
its a seasonal contract and not done by the push.


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

I knew its a seasonal contract. thanks.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

I know this thread is about a week old but how did we go from his price question to backhoe vs. skid? To clear it up I can/have operated both and they both have their uses. If you have a backhoe use it. If you have a big skid use it. If not get a large tractor with a 12'-14' pusher and use that. Give me your picture labeled with the approx. dimensions and list the number of obstructions (poles, islands/medians/curbs, walls ect). Tell me if they want it done day or night or as needed. Label or tell me if they require you to put snow in a spot. I'll tell you about WHAT I WOULD CHARGE...now that means my overhead and region could be different but I'll tell you how to get to your numbers. I'm willing to help you even if your competition because I'm a better salesman...(its all in confidence baby!) (jk about better salesman but I offer a good service and I sell it) I have sat down with the owners of my biggest competition and shared exact numbers....it doesn't scare me so ask if you have a question!


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## kramer56 (Oct 13, 2006)

DaytonBioLawns;1073254 said:


> I know this thread is about a week old but how did we go from his price question to backhoe vs. skid? To clear it up I can/have operated both and they both have their uses. If you have a backhoe use it. If you have a big skid use it. If not get a large tractor with a 12'-14' pusher and use that. Give me your picture labeled with the approx. dimensions and list the number of obstructions (poles, islands/medians/curbs, walls ect). Tell me if they want it done day or night or as needed. Label or tell me if they require you to put snow in a spot. I'll tell you about WHAT I WOULD CHARGE...now that means my overhead and region could be different but I'll tell you how to get to your numbers. I'm willing to help you even if your competition because I'm a better salesman...(its all in confidence baby!) (jk about better salesman but I offer a good service and I sell it) I have sat down with the owners of my biggest competition and shared exact numbers....it doesn't scare me so ask if you have a question!


Wow thank you.


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## PerfiCut Inc. (Jan 31, 2008)

First of all, like any job, yuu should know what your production rates are. (What can you do in a given amount of time). How much does that cost, and what profit margin do you need to be at in order to make money. Once you know that, then you can estimate most jobs, (or atleast get you started)

An 8' blade with wings can on a pickup can clear an acre in just under an hour for a 2-3" snowfall. Of course, when you start getting into large acreage you start talking about accumulation. 2-3"s of snow ads up fast and therefore slows production down. 

Break large lots into small manageable sizes. A 5 acre lot, with 5 trucks should take an hour. Give or take depending on experience, obsticles, type of snow. But roughly. The rest is math.

The idea is know what equipment you have, know their production rates, and then determine which type of equipment will best be suited for the site.

Good luck with it.

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PS: We charge about 100-135 per hour per truck on the average. I also allow for some extra time in there, because things always tend to take longer.

I dont know why people so afraid of letting other know what they charge for things. I've never had a sales rep at a store tell me (take a guess) and how much it costs.

Sounds like little man syndrome. People here are afraid to give out there costs because they think someone in their neighborhood is watching and is going to under bid them on projects or steel their customers with lower rates. Inferiority complexes i suppose.


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## DaytonBioLawns (May 20, 2010)

PerfiCut Inc.;1073569 said:


> First of all, like any job, yuu should know what your production rates are. (What can you do in a given amount of time). How much does that cost, and what profit margin do you need to be at in order to make money. Once you know that, then you can estimate most jobs, (or atleast get you started)
> 
> An 8' blade with wings can on a pickup can clear an acre in just under an hour for a 2-3" snowfall. Of course, when you start getting into large acreage you start talking about accumulation. 2-3"s of snow ads up fast and therefore slows production down.
> 
> ...


You nailed it right on the head!


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