# Cvs - crazy!!!



## snowbrothers101 (Jul 27, 2009)

Did you hear that CVS is requiring every local vendor to carry a smart phone and check in via an app on the phone? Failure to do so means no payment. No exceptions. It uses a geo locator so they can pull your coordinates. Serious Big Brother s%%$! They are getting rid of the hard copy work orders. I only have 3 sites but my guys carry blackberries and they say you need an apple or android phone only.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

Outside the fact its CVS or any other company. 

Its hard for them to say you did not plow or salted. Its prove you provide service add such and such time. It also could to used in court when someone slips and falls and blames you. 

My point is, as many negative things their are, their are some positive ones to.

I love my BB, I'll never give it up. I also carry a driod.


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## Banksy (Aug 31, 2005)

I can easily see both sides of the coin. It could end up helping you someday.


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## hatefulmechanic (Dec 27, 2012)

I use Mpengo Snow for all my drivers, it sends an email to the client when they are on site. Logs LOTS of information.

Personally, I use it for covering my ass more than anything. Works great.

Look at it from the company side, it is eliminating the cost of dozens of workers handling that paperwork and puts it all in a computer, making it easy to track.


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## hoskm01 (Oct 17, 2008)

It's about time someone got it together on an app. Now if you just had to use that and not send in an invoice, it would be a slick setup (maybe it is that way.)


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## MatthewG (Jun 16, 2009)

hatefulmechanic;1648753 said:


> I use Mpengo Snow for all my drivers, it sends an email to the client when they are on site. Logs LOTS of information.
> 
> Personally, I use it for covering my ass more than anything. Works great.
> 
> Look at it from the company side, it is eliminating the cost of dozens of workers handling that paperwork and puts it all in a computer, making it easy to track.


Interesting app, simple to use or not??? Not bad for $10.


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## Brad3403 (Sep 8, 2008)

hatefulmechanic;1648753 said:


> I use Mpengo Snow for all my drivers, it sends an email to the client when they are on site. Logs LOTS of information.
> 
> Personally, I use it for covering my ass more than anything. Works great.
> 
> Look at it from the company side, it is eliminating the cost of dozens of workers handling that paperwork and puts it all in a computer, making it easy to track.


Is that APP worthwhile???


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## got-h2o (Sep 26, 2008)

Interesting^^^^^ I too am curious


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## Pool&Plow (Sep 17, 2013)

I just checked it out myself, looks pretty cool!


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

snowbrothers101;1648726 said:


> Did you hear that CVS is requiring every local vendor to carry a smart phone and check in via an app on the phone? Failure to do so means no payment. No exceptions. It uses a geo locator so they can pull your coordinates. Serious Big Brother s%%$! They are getting rid of the hard copy work orders. I only have 3 sites but my guys carry blackberries and they say you need an apple or android phone only.


I saw it too... is it an app then? I can only imagine the logistical nightmares in billing/invoicing and office work in the end of the season :/

We have blackberries too, not only that, but even a gps report for the trucks won't suffice... We just had NexTraq install ones on all of our trucks and some of the equipment that is left on site. Mainly due to billing issues and disputes, now that will be nipped in the bud quickly.

Last year, we had Walgreens and Public Storages through SMS Assist... a bunch of them. With multiple trucks and drivers out there, the only real manageable way to keep track of all services without pointing the finger to every employee for "forgetting" or who knows what when it comes down to the end of the season, was to have all drivers text in the store number and time completed, when they're done. One person would then call them all in. In any more major storm, 4-6" max last year, with many trucks out, it was a full time job just to call these in on the fly and manage the spredsheet and quickbooks for accounting. By the time we got to the end of the season, they claimed they paid 100%, and we were 25% off what we billed versus what they paid still.

We had almost 800 services we then later had to go over, THREE times, multiple methods, line item by line item cross referencing checks they paid.

End of season they told us we had 80~ services needing manually signed work orders, we got about ~50 signed of the 80, and then we're still unpaid for 120+ services. Others we had manual signoffs for, they said we never logged into their system... well duh, we have the manual signoff which overrides everything!

Its terrible, although i 100% agree that this day and age, contractors have to be accountable for their crews and trucks for services, its nothing more than extra avenues to allow the mangement companies to not pay, AFTER all the work is completed.

We had one walgreens in WEstampton, NJ, suddenly refuse to email sign off on 15 services end of season. No one at SMS really cared, we spent hours on end proving times of service for the Walgreens to check their video camera footage. Eventually the manager did find our truck on all times stated, and signed off, but then was transfered to another store, and the main manager "released" or fired. We were left with nothing, almost $3k in services performed in Feb/March 2013 that were never paid for one store alone.

Here it is from one vendor.

CVS- As we had communicated earlier, CVS corporate is planning on implementing a GPS based service verification system to report completed snow services. This system will require the driver to be on site with either an iPhone or Android phone to verify the service completion.
Unfortunately, we do not have any additional detailed information at this time. We will be providing you with any updates on this new process as we get the information from CVS.

BTW, we bid a CVS distribution plant last summer, facility on both sides of the street is over 800k sq ft. In the end, they gave it to the ONE bidder lower than us, a local company that has ONE pickup truck and one personal pickup truck like a 2005 F250 Ford. Even the office said we're next on the list to call if anything happens and they can't handle the area. There was a run 1300ft long behind where the trucks park that you'd flat out need a 15 ton Front end loader and a 14-16' box for in any major storm. This year, they renewed contract with the same guy, so they don't really care about who they hire or how the work is, as long as someones insurance covers their lot when its winter time !


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## SnoDaddy (Dec 17, 2012)

anyone know who has the CVS stores in Ohio they always look horrendous in my neck of the woods...gotta be USM or a cheapie Nat'l


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

SnoDaddy;1695909 said:


> anyone know who has the CVS stores in Ohio they always look horrendous in my neck of the woods...gotta be USM or a cheapie Nat'l


The ones here locally look like Hell too!


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

Pool&Plow;1649116 said:


> I just checked it out myself, looks pretty cool!


I couldn't find it in the Google play store..


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

SnowGuy73;1695990 said:


> I couldn't find it in the Google play store..


Nevermind, apple only I guess.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

Ramairfreak98ss;1649252 said:


> I saw it too... is it an app then? I can only imagine the logistical nightmares in billing/invoicing and office work in the end of the season :/
> 
> We have blackberries too, not only that, but even a gps report for the trucks won't suffice... We just had NexTraq install ones on all of our trucks and some of the equipment that is left on site. Mainly due to billing issues and disputes, now that will be nipped in the bud quickly.
> 
> ...


your last sentence probably sums up every national's business plan and the demise of quality work and fair pay


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## Glenn Lawn Care (Sep 28, 2009)

The Walgreen here require that as well but you have to call in and listen to a machine recorded person and say what service you did via keypad.


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## lilweeds (Aug 3, 2007)

The CVS app is actually pretty nice. The reason they look like crap is they won't let us out before 2" and only one salting per storm. We are getting some more leeway with the app, but it's hard to get them to give us much!


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## Drakeslayer (Feb 11, 2011)

Who really cares about cvs anyway. Plenty of small local business' that pay way more.


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## ServiceOnSite (Nov 23, 2006)

SMS assist does the same crap every year. They send you an email and you have to go and prove you did the service and if you cant your out the money. Should go right to Walgreens and ask if they paid out for those services and show them that your not paid and how can they bill out for them. God i hate these companies.


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## lilweeds (Aug 3, 2007)

Drake, CVS is not a bad paying account at all. One of them that I have is nearly $700 a push. Not bad.


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## Bossman 92 (Sep 27, 2006)

lilweeds;1701102 said:


> Drake, CVS is not a bad paying account at all. One of them that I have is nearly $700 a push. Not bad.


$700 a push?


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## Drakeslayer (Feb 11, 2011)

lilweeds;1701102 said:


> Drake, CVS is not a bad paying account at all. One of them that I have is nearly $700 a push. Not bad.


Must be their headquarters!


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## OC&D (Dec 2, 2009)

I find a lot of this really sad. What has happened in our society where no one can be trusted anymore?

-The contractor can't trust the customer to pay unless they go through ridiculous means to prove they did the work.
-The customer can't trust the contractor to actually do the work, to the extent that they actually _create their own flipping mobile app_ to satisfy their paranoia.
-Neither the contractor nor the customer can trust the general public to actually take responsibility for themselves and their own actions. Everyone feels like this is something that must be done to CYA in court when someone falls and breaks a bone walking in to get their $10 triple mocha espresso cappuccino with a cherry on top in the middle of a blizzard.

Have we really degraded this far? Apparently we have, and it makes me a little sick to my stomach.

A buddy of mine does foreclosures for Safeguard. For each place he does, he takes an average of _15 pictures_ to show the work was done. Really?!?! A mere 10 places would yield 150 pictures! He spends more time taking pictures, uploading them, and invoicing than he does actually doing the work. Anyone see anything wrong here?


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

Glenn Lawn Care;1697683 said:


> The Walgreen here require that as well but you have to call in and listen to a machine recorded person and say what service you did via keypad.


Haha, now that would suck!


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

OC&D;1701711 said:


> I find a lot of this really sad. What has happened in our society where no one can be trusted anymore?
> 
> -The contractor can't trust the customer to pay unless they go through ridiculous means to prove they did the work.
> -The customer can't trust the contractor to actually do the work, to the extent that they actually _create their own flipping mobile app_ to satisfy their paranoia.
> ...


Its the world we live in now. Everyone is looking to save a buck/ make a buck..

In some cases to do that its easiest to screw someone over, I see it everyday!


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## OC&D (Dec 2, 2009)

SnowGuy73;1701799 said:


> Its the world we live in now. Everyone is looking to save a buck/ make a buck..
> 
> In some cases to do that its easiest to screw someone over, I see it everyday!


What does it say about us that we all just accept it with such complacency?

People suck.


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

OC&D;1701827 said:


> What does it say about us that we all just accept it with such complacency?
> 
> People suck.


Well if you'd see the guys that plow the walgreens next to two of my properties you'd understand. Two sepporate walgreens in two different cities, and two different contractors that I wouldn't trust to take out my trash!

I base this off of their vehicles, type of work preformed, and the language that they openly use while shoveling walks in front of customers.... That is this season so far anyhow.


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## OC&D (Dec 2, 2009)

SnowGuy73;1701886 said:


> Well if you'd see the guys that plow the walgreens next to two of my properties you'd understand. Two sepporate walgreens in two different cities, and two different contractors that I wouldn't trust to take out my trash!
> 
> I base this off of their vehicles, type of work preformed, and the language that they openly use while shoveling walks in front of customers.... That is this season so far anyhow.


That's the problem, everyone's standards have dropped so low that no one can trust anyone anymore. That's pathetic.


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

OC&D;1701895 said:


> That's the problem, everyone's standards have dropped so low that no one can trust anyone anymore. That's pathetic.


Very true.

Unfortunately its in every business and every industry too.

The same reason know one can agree on things with just a handshake anymore.


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## 90plow (Dec 22, 2001)

Well everyone is becoming used to this nanny state we have been living in. When you see state trucks dumping salt during a storm then come the plow trucks 30 minutes later plowing it all up and this being seen as acceptable so mrs jones can go to her yoga class at 9 at night. People have just lost the notion to just stay home when the weather is so bad. The cvs around here is done for about $150 a push and $80 for salt. Prices are so low.


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

snowbrothers101;1648726 said:


> Did you hear that CVS is requiring every local vendor to carry a smart phone and check in via an app on the phone? Failure to do so means no payment. No exceptions. It uses a geo locator so they can pull your coordinates. Serious Big Brother s%%$! They are getting rid of the hard copy work orders. I only have 3 sites but my guys carry blackberries and they say you need an apple or android phone only.


i saw that too, it was funny. We NEVER let the employees handle the logistics of billing, and by them doing all that work such as checking into the corporate system, bypassing our office will never fly. Problems 90-120 days down the road and all blame would be left on each individual employee, not our office.


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## lilweeds (Aug 3, 2007)

I loved it. Worked great and Merit paid in 30-45 days, which was the best ever. Hope it goes this well next year.


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## Broncslefty7 (Jul 14, 2014)

Brickman is requiring it also. Check in/out. you can either call in, or use the GPS app. it records time, and they pay you based off of how much time you spent and how much time you should have spent. we backed out of our accounts with them this year. they pay very slow, and dispute payments at the end of the year. With this new system i cant immagine whats going to happen this year.


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## Broncslefty7 (Jul 14, 2014)

a large problem for the plow industry are the damn landscrapers, that have 1 pick up and go around bidding lots at like 50 bucks a push. they figure if they can get 5 or 6 lots its good money for a nights work. little do they know how much money they are actually leaving on the table. the idea of making more money because you are a professional and having some type of integrity in the work you do is gone. its a major problem where i am. i lost 4 accounts last year that i was getting 225 on a 2" trigger to some landscrapers (the kind that only mow lawns). when i asked to see the bid they where anywhere from 50-75 dollars on a 2" push. makes the pros who know how to make money look like gougers, and lowers the industries consumers ideal of what it actually costs to do something.


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

Broncslefty7;1816607 said:


> Brickman is requiring it also. Check in/out. you can either call in, or use the GPS app. it records time, and they pay you based off of how much time you spent and how much time you should have spent. we backed out of our accounts with them this year. they pay very slow, and dispute payments at the end of the year. With this new system i cant immagine whats going to happen this year.


Are you on per push with Brickman? We don't have that issue on seasonal. Just clock in and out.

Even on landscaping. We have a 5 minute stop and it's always same price


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## Broncslefty7 (Jul 14, 2014)

yeah, we where on push with brickman last year. i dont know why its just how it was bid. we had 12 day cares that we did.


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

Yeah on heavy per push years some are a pain in the ass. They tried to get me to take over a home depot mid season but I wouldn't do it unless they honored full contract price. 

They found someone else lol


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## NickSnow&Mow (Jul 12, 2014)

thats bs they're trying to ruin our Canadian pride!!!


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## NickSnow&Mow (Jul 12, 2014)

snowbrothers101;1648726 said:


> Did you hear that CVS is requiring every local vendor to carry a smart phone and check in via an app on the phone? Failure to do so means no payment. No exceptions. It uses a geo locator so they can pull your coordinates. Serious Big Brother s%%$! They are getting rid of the hard copy work orders. I only have 3 sites but my guys carry blackberries and they say you need an apple or android phone only.


thats bs they are trying to ruin or Canadian pride!!tymusictymusictymusictymusic


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## Broncslefty7 (Jul 14, 2014)

yeah last year we had to take them to court over 40 grand. they where disputing 2 or 3 10"+ events. they wanted pictures of a tape measure in the snow at each lot. it was annoying.


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

That's standard practice. All of them do that. 

It's a good way to cover your ass because slot of weather stations do not report accurate totals for a specific area


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## Broncslefty7 (Jul 14, 2014)

yeah we always do it. we have about 60 driveways that we snow blow and we do it on every one, the picture gets emailed to customer straight from the truck. that way theres no disputes.


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## Upallnite (Nov 22, 2009)

Does anyone know who has the contract for CVS this season or how the smart phone app worked out last year? Did people get paid quicker or did it hold things up?


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## framer1901 (Dec 18, 2005)

Don't know if they have it but we just received a request to bid CVS for AGMG.

Anyone that allows another party to be in control of if and when you get paid deserves the shafting you'll eventually get. The paid when paid clause locks you down to hoping the middle man is doing everything right on their end - cause when they don't, you don't get paid.

Find your own work, you'll be more profitable and happier.


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## Bossman 92 (Sep 27, 2006)

framer1901;1819983 said:


> Don't know if they have it but we just received a request to bid CVS for AGMG.
> 
> Anyone that allows another party to be in control of if and when you get paid deserves the shafting you'll eventually get. The paid when paid clause locks you down to hoping the middle man is doing everything right on their end - cause when they don't, you don't get paid.
> 
> Find your own work, you'll be more profitable and happier.


I was told by AGMG a few years back that when they ask us to bid properties most of the times they don't have the contract for that property, they only have an "ok" to turn a bid in. Then we do the leg work...they mark it up...and turn in a price.

Got the same request here on Monday evening and they wanted it back by Wednesday. Called them Thursday ( was out of town when it came thru ) and they were very rude on the phone when I asked if we could turn them in a day late. We get a lot of requests from them with very little work to show for our efforts.


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## racer47 (Feb 24, 2011)

ussmileyflag got it today ,don't think I want it .I think I will talk to manager first .its close to me, but I seen to many different people over the last few years doing it . might not be getting paid .


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

I'm confused. I'm new to the site, but have been plowing for 8 years now, so not new to snow removal. I am a one man, one truck operation with 10 commercial accounts. Half are small businesses, with lots roughly the size of a McDonald's, the others consist of a big warehouse in an industrial park, a small strip mall and two churches. These accounts keep me more than busy as I do all the work myself, (plowing, sidewalks and salting). I have seen many postings on here about the national management companies screwing guys over as well as I have heard from other local contractors that I talk to about the same kind of treatment during the mowing season.

I guess my questions are this: Why do you guys continue to work for these jackasses that don't pay or make the paperwork to get paid a full time job in itself? Why do you work for ANYONE that makes you sign THEIR contract and abide by their rules? Why would you EVER agree to waiting even 1 day past net 30 terms to be paid? It's all completely absurd to me. Why don't we ALL give these idiots a dose of reality and quit jumping through THEIR hoops?

Make your own contracts with your own payment terms. Tell the customer in writing what you are providing as a service for them and what you expect as payment in return. I would venture a guess and say that all these big companies that are hiring out for maintenance through these national providers would quit using them when all there properties start yielding "nastygrams" from the city for weed violations because they aren't mowed and when all there lots are buried under a foot of snow in the winter because they aren't getting plowed. 

And for those of you who are saying that I don't service any real accounts, and don't know the real world, keep in mind that the snow removal client I referenced above as being a warehouse in an industrial park is Sanyo Energy, Inc. (now Panasonic) and they requested "net 30" terms. All my other accounts are "net 15" terms and I get paid on time by all about 95% of the time. The ones who are late are quickly handled with a polite phone call or personal stop if I'm in the area.

SO TELL THOSE BIG CONGLOMERATES TO KISS YOUR A$$


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

Not all companies are the same 

And the fact of the matter is most national chains or large accounts are going to be controlled by a "national" company. Gone are the days of walking inside and submitting a bid. 

Sure you can do that for local businesses, but there aren't enough of them


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

I don't know about you, but I would consider Sanyo Energy (a global company) to be a pretty big company. I was actually contacted by the manager at that site to provide him with a bid about 6-7 years ago, and have been doing them ever since. The reason I had to go with net 30 terms for them was because the invoice has to go to the manager at my site that I deal with for his approval before he then sends it to corporate in CA. to have the check cut, signed and sent to me. I realize there isn't enough "mom & pop" type businesses to keep all you bigger guys busy, but like I said, if we all got together and refused to work for the national chains, the companies would have no choice but to find the contractors themselves. At that point, you are then dealing directly with the company you are doing the work for, you could establish a personal relationship with them, and if they were happy with your work, I would think they would want to keep you happy by keeping you paid properly and it would work for everyone.

I just think that it is ludicrous for you to go into a business relationship with a company in California or Arizona or wherever the national is located that is going to try and sit there and armchair quarterback you during a storm when they have no clue what the weather actually is at your location, then purposely try to screw you out of the pay you rightfully deserve for doing the work.


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

It'll never happen. Nationals are here to stay wether you or anyone else likes it. We work for a handful of them. One of our LOCAL places pays 90 days out. We get a check cut every month for nationals on seasonal. Per push/hour takes 15-45 days depending on who and how much


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

There's just no way I would (or could) wait 90 days to get paid for work. I hate waiting the 30 on the one account, but I do because I know its gonna be a big check when I get it and I have the cash flow from the others to work off of. My hats off to you guys who can, I just don't believe you should have to and if NOBODY was willing to play by their jacked up rules, they would have to make the change.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

My main work, 120 or longer is the norm to get paid. AR is north of 7 mil at any given time. If you have deep enough pockets, 90 isn't bad.

If all the big conctactors held back, the small guys try and step up and grab the national thinking they've made the big time.......way to may little guys looking to make the big time. 

Most who do snow is to keep their guys busy just to retain them for the non-winter work. That's where the profit is them.


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## Derek'sDumpstersInc (Jul 13, 2014)

WOW! Ok, forget being in the same game, we aren't even playing in the same hemisphere.  I think the only time I will see $7,000,000.00 is just now when I typed it on the screen. I guess if you have that type of cashflow, you can operate like that. Like I said, my hats off to you who can, I just wouldn't.

By the way, I was happy last year when my gross figures almost broke 100k, they will this year, and I find that to be a milestone for me. I do get contacted once or twice a year by the national man. companies wanting me to submit a bid, but I always refuse. When they ask why, I always tell them that I have heard from too many of my friends that they don't pay their bills. So, I am one small fry you don't have to worry about trying for the big time, I'm happy where I'm at.


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## Whiffyspark (Dec 23, 2009)

derekslawncare;1820103 said:


> WOW! Ok, forget being in the same game, we aren't even playing in the same hemisphere.  I think the only time I will see $7,000,000.00 is just now when I typed it on the screen. I guess if you have that type of cashflow, you can operate like that. Like I said, my hats off to you who can, I just wouldn't.


He's not talking about snow lol

But yeah you need to have reserves no matter what you're in


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

derekslawncare;1820103 said:


> WOW! Ok, forget being in the same game, we aren't even playing in the same hemisphere.  I think the only time I will see $7,000,000.00 is just now when I typed it on the screen. I guess if you have that type of cashflow, you can operate like that. Like I said, my hats off to you who can, I just wouldn't.
> 
> By the way, I was happy last year when my gross figures almost broke 100k, they will this year, and I find that to be a milestone for me. I do get contacted once or twice a year by the national man. companies wanting me to submit a bid, but I always refuse. When they ask why, I always tell them that I have heard from too many of my friends that they don't pay their bills. So, I am one small fry you don't have to worry about trying for the big time, I'm happy where I'm at.


Main job isn't snow. its restoration work. My main job is spending money on projects. All my long term vendors know its going to be 90 before we pay. Now my trucking brokers, I try and get them paid within 30, they need gas money.

I agree with what you are saying, it won't ever happen cause the next guy will roll the dice and hope to get paid.


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## lilweeds (Aug 3, 2007)

Upallnite;1819905 said:


> Does anyone know who has the contract for CVS this season or how the smart phone app worked out last year? Did people get paid quicker or did it hold things up?


TO answer your question, yes it worked great. NO paperwork and I got checks in 30 days or less. The first one was small and strange, but it came in 20 days. Some invoices went close 45 in the first check, but was paid in 15 on others so it all worked out. Loved the app, got paid quick, the only hard part was getting my guy to document the work on the time sheet, so keeping track of the invoices was difficult at times.


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## Upallnite (Nov 22, 2009)

Anyone have suggestions on how to get in on the CVS or Walgreens Plowing or what they might pay? Are they seasonal or per push? Thanks


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

framer1901;1819983 said:


> Don't know if they have it but we just received a request to bid CVS for AGMG.
> 
> Anyone that allows another party to be in control of if and when you get paid deserves the shafting you'll eventually get. The paid when paid clause locks you down to hoping the middle man is doing everything right on their end - cause when they don't, you don't get paid.
> 
> Find your own work, you'll be more profitable and happier.


Very true, never sign any contract like that. If they can't get paid for a service you performed, tough. They still need to pay you for the service you PERFORMED.

When you sign those contracts, and then go to collect via lawyer or in court or arbitration, they'll throw that in your face, fudge their numbers and show none of those services were paid somehow and you're left with nothing.

You did all the work, completed all their BS insane paperwork, and they're not paid for any reason, you lose out all of your time and money spent on salt, labor, insurance, supplies and repairs.


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