# Chains, Tensioner's and Studded tires?



## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

Hi,

I'm still pretty new to plowing, this is only my second winter. Last winter, mid-season I ditched the old plow truck I bought from the previous homeowner as it was becoming a money pit.

Now I'm plowing with my 2013 Chevy Silverado 2500 HD, with a Fisher V-Plow. 

Combined I have about 3/4 of a mile of driveway and Class 6 town dirt road to keep clear. (In NH a "Class 6" road is owned by a town, but not maintained). My challenge is the top 500 feet of my driveway are paved asphalt, and VERY steep. Last winter only the top parking apron & about 100' of driveway were paved, and the rest of the hill was dirt. We paved another 400' or so late this past summer. Reasons being that, a) torrential rains in the spring and summer washed nearly all of the top layer of the driveway off, and b) the hill faces southwest, and the old parts of the paved driveway always melted nicely in the sun, even in sub freezing temps, so we figured the pavement would help keep the driveway ice free.

I have 2 sets of V-Bar chains that I used last year. On the dirt hill, it was a monster. This season I've have to plow twice, and I've had traction issues. The first time, I tried to plow without chains at all, as I was afraid the V-Bar chains would tear up the new asphalt. The guy from the company who paved the new section claimed he never uses chains to plow, even on driveways as steep or steeper than mine. I should NOT have listened to him, as that was scary. I should point out I don't have snow tires, as I figured last year with the chains they would be moot. The second snowfall this season, I used some ladder chains I had bought as back ups. They turned out to be inferior and the truck threw them on the first pass down the hill, I had them as tight as I could, but they didn't really fit that well. So I went to the V-Bar's, rear only. 

Side note, the V-Bar's tore up the back of my wheel wells. I had them as tight I as could make them (I thought), but once the truck got rumbling UP this hill to get back on top, all hell would bread loose... 

I still had moments where I totally broke traction & that is scary on my hill.

So, there's my long background story.

What I'm interested in hearing from you all is

1 - What can I do to get better traction?

2 - Should I use the chains of the front as well? (I have another set of V-Bars I used on the front last year on the dirt hill)

3 - Should I consider studded snow tires instead?

4 - What are the best chain tensioners to use? The chains have 3 cams on them & I use the rubber type 5 arm tensioners. Would the spring type work better?

5 - On the inside the tire link-up, should I just put the hook on the last link on the other side of the chain, or is it appropriate to "choke it up" a bit for better tension on the outer side? I guess I'd have to wire up the loose links or cut them off...

Lot's of questions, I know, but I'd like to stop tobogganing down my driveway with a plow. Bad things happen.

Thanks!

Marleywood


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## seville009 (Sep 9, 2002)

As a start, I’d definitely get winter tires and also stud them. I use studded Duratracs; work great on icey pavement. 

Also need weight in your truck. I carry about 1,000 lb in my 2006 F350 CC.


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## seville009 (Sep 9, 2002)

Also try these diamond shape chains, just becsuse you would always have the chains in contact with the road. I don't know how durable they are though.

https://www.etrailer.com/Tire-Chain...er+Duty/2006/TC2533.html?vehicleid=2006205720


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Also need weight in your truck. I carry about 1,000 lb in my 2006 F350 CC


I carry 500lbs, which is a bit over what Fisher recommends for my truck with the S.S. V-Plow.


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Also try these diamond shape chains, just becsuse you would always have the chains in contact with the road. I don't know how durable they are though.


I've got some big $ invested in these Peewag V-Bar chains already, I'm hoping not to have to buy another set(s).


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## scottr (Oct 10, 2013)

OP. You have many issues to cover. Like the other post says. Counterweight is a major factor. Get 900-1200 lbs over the rear wheels. Go find a trucker who uses chains all the rims. Ask him to teach you about chains. You are doing many things wrong if their falling off and hitting your fenders. Last option. Get a dozer and fix your approach


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Also try these diamond shape chains, just becsuse you would always have the chains in contact with the road. I don't know how durable they are though.


I've got some big $ invested in these Peewag V-Bar chains already, I'm hoping not to have to buy another set(s).


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Also need weight in your truck. I carry about 1,000 lb in my 2006 F350 CC.


Right now I have 500lbs (behind the rear axel), which is slightly more that Fisher recommends for their V-Plow & my truck....


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

scottr said:


> You are doing many things wrong if their falling off and hitting your fenders.


The cheap ones are the ones that fell off, and that's because they were wimpy little things that were not up for the job. The V-Bars have always been tightened up with the 3 cams and rubber tensioner. They are as tight as I can get them, but I have to go up the hill pretty fast to make it, and they still hit. I was told when I bought them that they would be a pretty tight fit, but the concern had been more about the front chains & turning.



scottr said:


> Last option. Get a dozer and fix your approach


If only. The terrain makes that impossible, unless I built a switch back (probably need two to do it correctly, LOL.


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## scottr (Oct 10, 2013)

Well your PeeWag's should do the trick, they are very good chains. Couple things you might consider, toss on a set of air bags in the rear and raise the back up just enough to allow the chains to clear, also trimming the inner fender well a bit can help. The asphalts not helping your winter time dilemma. I still say a dozer, fix it right, it will be safer for your family and friends.


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

scottr said:


> The asphalts not helping your winter time dilemma. I still say a dozer, fix it right, it will be safer for your family and friends.


So, are you saying I would have been better off not paving it?

And, I'm not kidding, a dozer isn't going solve my problem, I have to live with it the way it is.


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## scottr (Oct 10, 2013)

Copy that on the dozer work, My opinion is that gravel would give better traction with chains on over asphalt. I understand why you needed to pave however. Get more weight in there, toss out what the manufacturers chart shows, you have a particular situation that calls for extremes. Get a 1000 lbs or more, chain it up on all 4, use low range and back up the hill.


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## BUFF (Dec 24, 2009)

I'd park my stuff at the bottom of the hill and uses a Snocat or sleds to get to the house or sell the place.
Steep and pavement don't work, I would have left the drive / road dirt and deal with the summer maintenance. There's several options to get a good hard pack on dirt that resist erosion, some are even eco friendly too.


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## seville009 (Sep 9, 2002)

Don’t know how they work in real life, but there’s something called a tire sock, which is a textile “thing” that goes over your tires in lieu of chains for snow and ice. Just another option....,


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Don't know how they work in real life, but there's something called a tire sock, which is a textile "thing" that goes over your tires in lieu of chains for snow and ice. Just another option....,


We used tire socks on the steer tires on the fire engines. They work good for steering traction. I dont think they would work well on drive tires.


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## seville009 (Sep 9, 2002)

ktfbgb said:


> We used tire socks on the steer tires on the fire engines. They work good for steering traction. I dont think they would work well on drive tires.


Was watching the show "Highway Thru H!ll" on the Weather Channel last night and one semi was using them on his drive wheels.


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## ktfbgb (Jan 31, 2016)

seville009 said:


> Was watching the show "Highway Thru H!ll" on the Weather Channel last night and one semi was using them on his drive wheels.


On flat or semi flat ground where you are maintaining momentum I'm thinking they should be fine. I was just thinking about the OP talking about starting and stopping and then giving it everything it had to crest the hill that had me picturing them tearing or rolling up or something weird under high torque situation like he was describing.


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## seville009 (Sep 9, 2002)

ktfbgb said:


> On flat or semi flat ground where you are maintaining momentum I'm thinking they should be fine. I was just thinking about the OP talking about starting and stopping and then giving it everything it had to crest the hill that had me picturing them tearing or rolling up or something weird under high torque situation like he was describing.


I think you are correct. When they showed it on the show, he was being pulled up the hill by a tow truck.....


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## Brettny (Jul 12, 2017)

If your just going to keep useing what you have and dosnt work then why ask the questions? Many people alreaty said snow tires and more weight. That fixes 90* of traction problems.

Your V plow weight is about 900lbs. You will need that much behind the rear wheels just to counteract the weight of the plow sticking out 4-5ft from your front bumper.
Chains will help but mark up your new driveway. Its s part of plowing with chains so unless you want to buy a new driveway i suggest studded snow tires. They will save you money in the end.
I know alot of new trucks only come with highway/"all season" tires. There no good for snow, rain, mud or plowing.


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

Brettny said:


> If your just going to keep useing what you have and dosnt work then why ask the questions? Many people alreaty said snow tires and more weight. That fixes 90* of traction problems.


I don't know why you got that impression, I'm very interested in what all you folks have to say.



Brettny said:


> Your V plow weight is about 900lbs. You will need that much behind the rear wheels just to counteract the weight of the plow sticking out 4-5ft from your front bumper.


I'm planning on adding weight, thanks!



Brettny said:


> Chains will help but mark up your new driveway. Its s part of plowing with chains so unless you want to buy a new driveway i suggest studded snow tires. They will save you money in the end. know alot of new trucks only come with highway/"all season" tires. There no good for snow, rain, mud or plowing.


If it's just "marking up" the driveway, that's not the end of the world, the aesthetics don't bother me, we're pretty rural out here. Damage is what concerns me.

One other concern I have is whether my PeeWag chains will fit on the snow tires?

I should also mention that the "snow showers" we had forcasted for yesterday turned out to be about 3"-4", so I had to plow. I decided to chain her up all four, and that worked like a charm, no skidding whatsoever, and it was a pretty slick snow, earlier in the afternoon we could not get my Wife's Chevy Traverse up the unplowed drive, and that car is usually solid in snow.


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## Brettny (Jul 12, 2017)

As long as your not spinning the tires with the chains on your just going to get some light scratching.

After a 2ft storm last season i had to put the v bar chains on. Not one of my accounts said anything. I also did about 125mi that storm and didnt have to readjust the chains more than once. Black bonge cords across the wheel can help keep things tight.


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## Marleywood (Nov 19, 2016)

Brettny said:


> As long as your not spinning the tires with the chains on your just going to get some light scratching.
> 
> After a 2ft storm last season i had to put the v bar chains on. Not one of my accounts said anything. I also did about 125mi that storm and didnt have to readjust the chains more than once. Black bonge cords across the wheel can help keep things tight.


I've got the rubber 6 leg tighteners. For some reason, when I chained up again yesterday, I was able to get the chains MUCH tighter than I ever had before. In the past, the 3 cams on the chains closed right up easily (and not tight enough), so I had to really wail on the rubber tighteners. This time I had to use the cam tool! SO much better. I guess I'm learning, LOL.


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## BUFF (Dec 24, 2009)

I use to have a truck I kept chains on all winter. I’d let the air oot of the tires, put the chains which were cam locks I n as tight as I could get them and than inflate the tires. I’d also tensioners not that I needed.


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## ConnorExum (Jan 5, 2010)

I live for tire chains...

Okay, you want make sure you get a properly sized pair of chains... ladder with V-bars are what I consider minimum requirements. I am investing a type of chain they call Profilgreifsteg by RUD. It is a diamond pattern with special profile type links that dig in nicely... maybe too nicely on pavement. But a diamond pattern chain ride smoother , have more chain contact area thus more traction, secondly the have a built in tensioning chain that you use to tension it. So, they are easier to store fewer parts but more weight...

Your Peewags will work with studs and snow tires. Plus studs wear out faster than tire chains and they aren't as effective as chains are in deep snow. Studs work well on ice and hard packed snow-but, so will v-bars. In fact v-bars will give you many more points of contact that dig into the ice than most studded tires do. Obviously, the greater number of ladders in your V-bar chain the more points of contact you have with the surface.

Your Peewag chains are nice... when you install them you should make sure both sides of the chain are as tight as possible to the tire. So, yes make sure the link on the inside of the tire wheel well is tight as possible and not just on the last link. You will also want drive it about 100 or 200 feet and retighten them before you start plowing. I use chains on all three of my axles because all three have power. Myself, I like having chains on all axles. Especially, if you have load up front that will cause a shift in dynamic weight distribution of the vehicle. If everything is chained up then you can be sure that your truck will have the best possible traction all the time no matter which side of the truck has the most load.

Other options to consider:

Rear axle driver controlled locking differential I like air the best but the do make electrically actuated units too. This will ensure the axle is providing power equally to each tire. I would do the front axle myself as well. But you don't have to. The only down side is an increase in turning radius while locked. But since it is a driver controlled model you can turn it on only when needed.

Bigger truck... yeah, I said it. Get a big old truck like a Walter Snow Fighter that I own...











As for tensioner I like the spring mounted ones best. They seem to work well unless I get into deep mud then the break off or break.


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