# It's Official, The Powerstroke is Dead!



## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

Just got done shooting the breeze with my diesel tech and he told me that 2010 is going to be the year the powerstroke dies with Ford and the "Scorpion" is born into the Super Duty mainstream.
Why can't they just let the damn consumer choose what the hell kind of diesel they want to use? 
Navistar, Cummins, Detroit. I'm an American damnit and I want choice!ussmileyflag


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## blowerman (Dec 24, 2007)

Why can't they just let the damn consumer choose what the hell kind of diesel they want to use? 
Navistar, Cummins, Detroit. I'm an American damnit and I want choice!ussmileyflag[/QUOTE]

Why can't we just put the best items from each into one great truck?
Cummins diesel, GMC's ride, suspension of the Ford, handling of a BMW, long term reliability of a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry? Oh ya, and manuverablility like a Bobcat, strong as the Volvo loaders, and disposable like a plastic shovel?


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

blowerman;696622 said:


> Why can't they just let the damn consumer choose what the hell kind of diesel they want to use?
> Navistar, Cummins, Detroit. I'm an American damnit and I want choice!ussmileyflag


Why can't we just put the best items from each into one great truck?
Cummins diesel, GMC's ride, suspension of the Ford, handling of a BMW, long term reliability of a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry? Oh ya, and manuverablility like a Bobcat, strong as the Volvo loaders, and disposable like a plastic shovel?[/QUOTE]

because id rather have the nice stiff ride of my ford suspension and be able to hang a plow off it without timbrens. this is old news they called this out a while ago. also coming out with a 6 speed auto similar to allison. there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons. the scorpion is said to make 390 hp and 720 ft. lbs. torque stock 

heres an article on the 6.7 for the super duty's http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/news/ford/scorpion/ford-scorpion-diesel-said-to-have-big-sting.html

articlle on 4.4l v-8
http://www.dieselforecast.com/ArticleDetails.php?articleID=208

go on http://www.ford-trucks.com theres forums on all these motors and such already.


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## Spitz (Feb 28, 2008)

LawnProLandscapes;696644 said:


> Why can't we just put the best items from each into one great truck?
> Cummins diesel, GMC's ride, suspension of the Ford, handling of a BMW, long term reliability of a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry? Oh ya, and manuverablility like a Bobcat, strong as the Volvo loaders, and disposable like a plastic shovel?


because id rather have the nice stiff ride of my ford suspension and be able to hang a plow off it without timbrens. this is old news they called this out a while ago. also coming out with a 6 speed auto similar to allison. there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons. the scorpion is said to make 390 hp and 720 ft. lbs. torque stock 

heres an article on the 6.7 for the super duty's http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/news/ford/scorpion/ford-scorpion-diesel-said-to-have-big-sting.html

articlle on 4.4l v-8
http://www.dieselforecast.com/ArticleDetails.php?articleID=208

go on http://www.ford-trucks.com theres forums on all these motors and such already.[/QUOTE]

Yea, thats what he said, read it closely.


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## cocco78 (Dec 12, 2003)

The powerstroke died when they stopped making the 7.3L, old news!


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

Spitz;696731 said:


> because id rather have the nice stiff ride of my ford suspension and be able to hang a plow off it without timbrens. this is old news they called this out a while ago. also coming out with a 6 speed auto similar to allison. there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons. the scorpion is said to make 390 hp and 720 ft. lbs. torque stock
> 
> heres an article on the 6.7 for the super duty's http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/news/ford/scorpion/ford-scorpion-diesel-said-to-have-big-sting.html
> 
> ...


Do you really think Ford will debut its heavy duty similair to the Allison transmission in an f150? I doubt it.

Ford hasn't been able to do squat with it's last two engines. I doubt this one will be any better, especially since it can't master the emissions equipment either.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

JDiepstra;696743 said:


> Do you really think Ford will debut its heavy duty similair to the Allison transmission in an f150? I doubt it.
> 
> Ford hasn't been able to do squat with it's last two engines. I doubt this one will be any better, especially since it can't master the emissions equipment either.


3 times a charm


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## JDiepstra (Sep 15, 2008)

cretebaby;696744 said:


> 3 times a charm


Could be but I will be the first to tell the guy who posts up on here that his new 6.7 Ford is in the shop and its his only truck and now he is in deep doo doo and he has no idea how he will get his accounts done and he is worried he will lose them all and not be able to make his truck payment that he is  for jumping right on that one! Guess it will be a couple years, but I'll be ready to flame! LOL


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

JDiepstra;696743 said:


> Do you really think Ford will debut its heavy duty similair to the Allison transmission in an f150? I doubt it.
> 
> Ford hasn't been able to do squat with it's last two engines. I doubt this one will be any better, especially since it can't master the emissions equipment either.


quote from article "Scorpion fuel economy is expected to improve by 3 mpg or more compared to the current Power Stroke. Helping the Scorpion's mileage will be a new six-speed automatic transmission, like the 2009 Ford F-150 will have. " yea they had problems with 6.0's but theres also 6.0's that are running great, and the 6.4 hasnt been too bad besides poor fuel economy. Navistar hasnt gotten it together since the 7.3 so im hoping ford did some research and a hell of a lot of testing on this new motor which sounds like they have



JDiepstra;696753 said:


> Could be but I will be the first to tell the guy who posts up on here that his new 6.7 Ford is in the shop and its his only truck and now he is in deep doo doo and he has no idea how he will get his accounts done and he is worried he will lose them all and not be able to make his truck payment that he is  for jumping right on that one! Guess it will be a couple years, but I'll be ready to flame! LOL


your right cummins makes a great motor, too bad dodge cant build a truck to put it in.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

LawnProLandscapes;696766 said:


> quote from article "Scorpion fuel economy is expected to improve by 3 mpg or more compared to the current Power Stroke. Helping the Scorpion's mileage will be a new six-speed automatic transmission, like the 2009 Ford F-150 will have. " yea they had problems with 6.0's but theres also 6.0's that are running great, and the 6.4 hasnt been too bad besides poor fuel economy. Navistar hasnt gotten it together since the 7.3 so im hoping ford did some research and a hell of a lot of testing on this new motor which sounds like they have
> 
> your right cummins makes a great motor, too bad dodge cant build a truck to put it in.


Yeah and Fords the best truck made because you don't need Timbrens.


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## Ford445 (May 26, 2006)

Well...Im curious to say the least.


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## Doakster (Aug 15, 2008)

The development of the 4.4 diesel in the F-150 has been postponed and they won't be developing it until further notice.


And it would be my guess that the name Powerstroke won't be dead, Scorpion is a name that Ford has used in the past for developmental engines. I believe Powerstroke is copyrighted to Ford not international, they have nothing to do with the name, they just build the engines.


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

JD Dave;696771 said:


> Yeah and Fords the best truck made because you don't need Timbrens.


never said it was the best just stated i dont want a suspension out of a gmc/chevy, for what i do id rather have the ford suspension and have it ride like a lumber wagon. ford has its flaws just like every other truck, and plow and so on. dont get me wrong there are features of those trucks i would like with mine, but overall i buy Ford's because overall i like them better.


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

I guess I'm out of the loop when it comes to cutting edge Ford news I didn't realize it was old news.


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## Milwaukee (Dec 28, 2007)

JD Dave;696771 said:


> Yeah and Fords the best truck made because you don't need Timbrens.


You are still observe about F250 you used to have back in 88 Maybe you should think about GM 6.2L you used to have. There are no good truck or best engine.

Now they are different no more TTB front axle on superduty. They have solid axle.

I don't feel comfy use chevy because frame problem like this. http://www.plowsite.com/showpost.php?p=413342&postcount=7

For me I would buy Ford, chevy, and Dodge with solid axle instead IFS.


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

Mid-Ohio Scaper;697357 said:


> I guess I'm out of the loop when it comes to cutting edge Ford news I didn't realize it was old news.


check out that ford trucks forum i posted. alot of good info. on there on all the of the ford trcuks engines and different trucks. you can also look up your trucks recalls and TSB's on there. i still cant wait to see these motors come out, it will be nice to see an inhouse diesel and hopefully it does good.


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

LawnProLandscapes;697396 said:


> check out that ford trucks forum i posted. alot of good info. on there on all the of the ford trcuks engines and different trucks. you can also look up your trucks recalls and TSB's on there. i still cant wait to see these motors come out, it will be nice to see an inhouse diesel and hopefully it does good.


I REALLY hope it does good also!!!!!! I fear that if it were to fail along with the 6.0 black eye it will scare Ford beyond repair. And that my friends would crush me! NO JOKE! I could never buy a Chevy or a Dodge and feel as good about it as I do my Ford truck.

Also do you have a link to your forum?


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## festerw (Sep 25, 2003)

LawnProLandscapes;696766 said:


> Navistar hasnt gotten it together since the 7.3 so im hoping ford did some research and a hell of a lot of testing on this new motor which sounds like they have.


Don't blame International, blame Ford's crappy programming. From what I understand the 6.0 is working fine in the International trucks.


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

Mid-Ohio Scaper;697415 said:


> I REALLY hope it does good also!!!!!! I fear that if it were to fail along with the 6.0 black eye it will scare Ford beyond repair. And that my friends would crush me! NO JOKE! I could never buy a Chevy or a Dodge and feel as good about it as I do my Ford truck.
> 
> Also do you have a link to your forum?


its www.ford-trucks.com theres also a dealer on there you can order factory parts from and get a discount, even with shipping from him i saved about 20 bucks on a part my local dealer wanted over 60 bucks for.

i dont think it will be that bad, ford will be in charge of there own product and i think even they know its time to show up. im sure they could of found another good diesel company to make there diesels but they are taking it on there own... idk everyone has there opinion but ive still got faith in ford and am not too worried.. if worse comes to worse there gasser motors arent all that bad


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## OhioPlower (Jan 13, 2004)

Thats too bad its made in mexico


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

we have a ford Diesel in an f800 and i think it's a damm good motor...assuming that Ford made that motor, too bad they cant make something on that I6 platform and just scale it down to fit into a pickup....


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## Bigfoot Brent (Mar 19, 2008)

festerw;697529 said:


> Don't blame International, blame Ford's crappy programming. From what I understand the 6.0 is working fine in the International trucks.


Guess again, I have had turbos carbon up, headgaskets blow out, injectors self destruct, IDM's fry, oil coolers plug (coolant side), EGR systems leak and various other problems on the 6.0 (VT365 in International trucks) all before 30,000 miles. Sometimes all of the above problems on the same engine even with all of Internationals recalls and updates.

The VT365/6.0 Powerstroke was Internationals first bad engine that I had seen, and I have worked on quite a few models.


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## Bigfoot Brent (Mar 19, 2008)

LawnProLandscapes;696644 said:


> Why can't we just put the best items from each into one great truck?
> Cummins diesel, GMC's ride, suspension of the Ford, handling of a BMW, long term reliability of a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry? Oh ya, and manuverablility like a Bobcat, strong as the Volvo loaders, and disposable like a plastic shovel?


because id rather have the nice stiff ride of my ford suspension and be able to hang a plow off it without timbrens. this is old news they called this out a while ago. also coming out with a 6 speed auto similar to allison. there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons. the scorpion is said to make 390 hp and 720 ft. lbs. torque stock 

heres an article on the 6.7 for the super duty's http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/news/ford/scorpion/ford-scorpion-diesel-said-to-have-big-sting.html

articlle on 4.4l v-8
http://www.dieselforecast.com/ArticleDetails.php?articleID=208

go on http://www.ford-trucks.com theres forums on all these motors and such already.[/QUOTE]

Did anybody else notice in the picture of the white crew cab dually the black masking around the fuel door area on the box? I bet it is hiding a really big or second fuel door to fill the Urea tank... meaning the new Scorpion engine will use SCR (urea injection) to meet the strict 2010 Diesel emissions standards.


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## OhioPlower (Jan 13, 2004)

Did anybody else notice in the picture of the white crew cab dually the black masking around the fuel door area on the box? I bet it is hiding a really big or second fuel door to fill the Urea tank... meaning the new Scorpion engine will use SCR (urea injection) to meet the strict 2010 Diesel emissions standards.[/QUOTE]

Whats SCR (urea injection) ?? It doesnt sound good if you ask me.


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## Bigfoot Brent (Mar 19, 2008)

*SCR explained*

To meet 2010 emissions standards for on road Diesel engines manufacturers basically have two choices EGR or SCR.
I am a Heavy Truck Mechanic and this is what I have learned so far about the 2010 emissions. Anybody, feel free to correct or add to my info! North American Diesel trucks built on Jan. 1, 2004 and after use EGR technology, with the exception of Cat. Cat uses ACERT.(Advanced Combustion Emission Reduction Technology). SCR has not come to North America in Heavy Trucks-YET. It is being used by all European truck manufactures with the excecption of Germany's MAN. Cummins will be using it here next year. Daimler's version of SCR is called Bluetec, I think. (Think Ram pickup and Jeep Grand Cherokee Diesel).

EGR= Exhaust Gas Recirculation- some exhaust gas is taken, cooled and sometimes filtered and then mixed with intake air as it goes back into the engine. 
SCR=Selective Catalytic Reduction- liquid urea (basically pig urine suspended in water as some engineers have described it) is pumped from a storage tank on the truck to the engine where it is injected to reduce nox emissions.

EGR seems to be a cheaper and easier solution to get the lower emissions, but it cuts into fuel economy. Think of a 6.0 Powerstroke(all have EGR) fuel economy compared to a 7.3 Powerstroke(none w/EGR).

SCR keeps fuel economy the same or improves it up to 5%. BUT it means you have to have a tank filled with liquid urea on your truck that can freeze and cuts into payload and frame space. Urea usage is about 2-5% of Diesel fuel burned. If you run out of urea while driving the engine will derate(loose power) and or shut down after a certain time. There is also no infastructure in North America yet to support the use of urea. Have you seen a separate urea pump beside the Diesel one at a truckstop?. I haven't. In Austrailia it seems you have to buy it in 15 litre boxes, like cheap wine. This must be REAL convienent at a truckstop when your Kenworth road train needs 350 gallons of diesel fuel and 2-5% of that in urea.

In short I didn't like EGR when it came out in 2004 due to the higher cost, complexity and fuel usage. So, I'm pretty worried about what will come of SCR in 2010. In the meantime I hope I can keep my 7.3 Powerstroke with no emissions crap running forever.


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## Doakster (Aug 15, 2008)

SCR technology has been around for some time now, not just in automobiles but it has become the standard in power generation facilities mainly coal plants. We're talking about an SCR system that is the size of a 10 story building. In my previous life I worked in power plants worldwide installing damper systems that would direct flue gas into the SCRs or bypass it during certain time periods. Right now power plants are required to met certain emissions as some point, I can't remember the year and SCR and FGD (Flue Gas Desulferication) are the two systems that do it efficiently. 

I'll throw this out there, does burning more fuel in a DPF really help reduce carbon emissions in a diesel, probably not once you look into how much pollution is really takes to burn that extra gallon of diesel to light a DPF, but if you're burning urea problem solved. 

Urea injection will come some day and become the standard in the states, that's my prediction.

Also as you are probably aware EGR systems have been used in gas motors for decades, but yes in 2003 is when it showed up in the 6.0. 
EGR systems in diesels are basically taking the simple fact that diesels work efficiently with high combustion/cylinder temps and working against it by ammiting colder exhaust in to the engine. Gas engines by design are not as effected by this for obvious reasons.


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## Bigfoot Brent (Mar 19, 2008)

Wow, everything that I have read about SCR only ever mentions it in automotive applications. So thanks for the lesson!

I also question the sense of burning more fuel to clean the DPF to get less particulate emissions. 

Only the EPA could think of burning more fuel to get less pollution


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

well ive learned my one thing for the day, time to go back to sleep  i had no clue about the scr , that does sound like it could be pretty inconvienent .. thanks for the info guys.


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## OhioPlower (Jan 13, 2004)

Thanks for the info. Ive been wondering what the hell that was for a couple months. It doesnt sound good. Looks like my next truck will be a early 07 Non- DPF truck and run it til it falls apart


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## Ramairfreak98ss (Aug 17, 2005)

JD Dave;696771 said:


> Yeah and Fords the best truck made because you don't need Timbrens.


 Yeah, we should all buy GMC/chevys for plowing with their 4800lb front axles haha !

no seriously, i like both, just for my business id slightly prefer the ford stuff over the gm... never would think about dodge stuff other than its looks.

next powerstroke/scorpion=built in mexico=i wont be buying one. I know we cant buy everything domestic, but if im dumping out 50k on a "american built ford tough truck" goddam most of it, especially the diesel engine better goddam be american and domestic product! why are deere, cummins, international, detroit diesel, cat all domestic but Fords new engine has to be foreign? fawk that


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## Doakster (Aug 15, 2008)

Ramairfreak98ss;702344 said:


> Yeah, we should all buy GMC/chevys for plowing with their 4800lb front axles haha !
> 
> no seriously, i like both, just for my business id slightly prefer the ford stuff over the gm... never would think about dodge stuff other than its looks.
> 
> next powerstroke/scorpion=built in mexico=i wont be buying one. I know we cant buy everything domestic, but if im dumping out 50k on a "american built ford tough truck" goddam most of it, especially the diesel engine better goddam be american and domestic product! why are deere, cummins, international, detroit diesel, cat all domestic but Fords new engine has to be foreign? fawk that


Do you own a harley? Ever wonder how many parts are not made in the states? ALOT!
(I can here everyone gasping now)

Their is no such thing as any a 100% American made product any more that's just the reality of it. And all the above that you listed are not all domestic products and have manufacturing facilities in foreign countries. ALOT of John Deere tractors are now made in India and shipped to the states.


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## bossplowguy (Jan 6, 2008)

Jay brown;699274 said:


> we have a ford Diesel in an f800 and i think it's a damm good motor...assuming that Ford made that motor, too bad they cant make something on that I6 platform and just scale it down to fit into a pickup....


Thats because your motor is a cummins. Ford branded it as a ford diesel but they were a Brazilian made cummins.


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

I also heard that Cat is dropping their over the road diesel engines and just sticking with heavy equipment and generators. 
Anyone else hear this?
Not that I would mind, I had an 04 F650 with a Cat under the hood and it sucked! That thing had NO POWER! Got rid of that piece for an 06 F650 with a Cummins under the hood, WOW night and day difference!


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## Bigfoot Brent (Mar 19, 2008)

Mid-Ohio Scaper;702594 said:


> I also heard that Cat is dropping their over the road diesel engines and just sticking with heavy equipment and generators.
> Anyone else hear this?
> Not that I would mind, I had an 04 F650 with a Cat under the hood and it sucked! That thing had NO POWER! Got rid of that piece for an 06 F650 with a Cummins under the hood, WOW night and day difference!


You heard right, Cat will stop making engines for on highway trucks in North America at the end of this year due to tougher emission laws. 2013 in Austrailia apparently. BUT, you will be able to buy a CAT made truck with an International Maxxforce engine from International and maybe Cat dealers in 2010. Cat has also said they will continue to support all Cat powererd trucks and buses for many years to come.

What was the HP rating for the Cat in your F650? C7's were rated from 190HP up to about 300HP if I remember correctly. Some of the Allison automatics behind those Cat's seemed to have the wrong torque convertors and shift points though.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

Bigfoot Brent;702605 said:


> Cat will stop making engines for on highway trucks in North America at the end of this year due to tougher emission laws. .


They had already quit in early 08


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

that's crazy about cat quiting on making motors for highway applocations...why did they develop ACERT then?


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

Bigfoot Brent;702605 said:


> What was the HP rating for the Cat in your F650? C7's were rated from 190HP up to about 300HP if I remember correctly. Some of the Allison automatics behind those Cat's seemed to have the wrong torque convertors and shift points though.


Can't remember, all I know is after using that Cat in the F650 and talking with some of the diesel techs over at Ohio Cat, this sounds like a really smart move by Cat. They need to stick to what they do better than anyone else, HEAVY EARTH MOVING EQUIPMENT!


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## abagoz (Jan 6, 2009)

*6.7L PWR Stroke*

News Flash some of the best quality Ford has is coming out of Mexico..


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## ZamboniHDB (May 8, 2004)

Go NAFTA....Long live Clinton!


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

ZamboniHDB;704437 said:


> Go NAFTA....Long live Clinton!


Is this a joke?


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

LawnProLandscapes;696644 said:


> there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons.


FWIW, an F150 IS a half ton. 



LawnProLandscapes;696766 said:


> Navistar hasnt gotten it together since the 7.3 so im hoping ford did some research and a hell of a lot of testing on this new motor which sounds like they have


Navistar built the 6.0, and it has been relatively flawless compared to the 6.0 in the Fords. Ford screwed it up when they insisted on playing the HP wars. The stock 6.0 from Navistar has 190 HP and something like 125 ft\lbs more torque than from Ford. Well, since I'm trying to buy a WORK truck, I could care less about HP, I want torque to move snow, heavy loads and trailers.

The majority of the problems rest on Ford's shoulders, not Navistar.



festerw;697529 said:


> Don't blame International, blame Ford's crappy programming. From what I understand the 6.0 is working fine in the International trucks.


Exactly.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Jay brown;699274 said:


> we have a ford Diesel in an f800 and i think it's a damm good motor...assuming that Ford made that motor, too bad they cant make something on that I6 platform and just scale it down to fit into a pickup....


It is a I6 Cummins. B-Series just like in the Dodges.

I have one also, never heard that it was built in Brazil, didn't know Cummins had a plant in Brazil and not sure why they would build them there, when it's the same engine as the Dodge.



Bigfoot Brent;699314 said:


> because id rather have the nice stiff ride of my ford suspension and be able to hang a plow off it without timbrens. this is old news they called this out a while ago. also coming out with a 6 speed auto similar to allison. there going to debut that in 09 f-150's and theres a smaller diesel in the works for the 1/2 tons. the scorpion is said to make 390 hp and 720 ft. lbs. torque stock
> 
> heres an article on the 6.7 for the super duty's http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/news/ford/scorpion/ford-scorpion-diesel-said-to-have-big-sting.html
> 
> ...


Did anybody else notice in the picture of the white crew cab dually the black masking around the fuel door area on the box? I bet it is hiding a really big or second fuel door to fill the Urea tank... meaning the new Scorpion engine will use SCR (urea injection) to meet the strict 2010 Diesel emissions standards.[/QUOTE]

Interesting, never heard of these many issues before.


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

Mark Oomkes;704454 said:


> It is a I6 Cummins. B-Series just like in the Dodges.
> 
> I have one also, never heard that it was built in Brazil, didn't know Cummins had a plant in Brazil and not sure why they would build them there, when it's the same engine as the Dodge.
> 
> Did anybody else notice in the picture of the white crew cab dually the black masking around the fuel door area on the box? I bet it is hiding a really big or second fuel door to fill the Urea tank... meaning the new Scorpion engine will use SCR (urea injection) to meet the strict 2010 Diesel emissions standards.


Interesting, never heard of these many issues before.[/QUOTE]

i'm not sure on the series probably a C, but i know it's not the same motor as in a light duty Dodge..i'll have to look but it's a 7 or 8L in size...smaller than a L10 but bigger than a pickup motor..it's around a 200hp


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## LawnProLandscapes (Nov 15, 2007)

Mark Oomkes;704453 said:


> FWIW, an F150 IS a half ton.
> 
> exactly if you actually read the whole sentence the first part of your quote was referring to the 6 speed auot there going to debut in the f-150 and there also working on a smaller diesel for the 1/2 tons (f-150)


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## ZamboniHDB (May 8, 2004)

Mid-Ohio Scaper;704442 said:


> Is this a joke?


Which part don't you like???


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

ZamboniHDB;705070 said:


> Which part don't you like???


Both parts


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## ZamboniHDB (May 8, 2004)

GOP here.

IT'S A JOKE!


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## Mid-Ohio Scaper (Aug 17, 2008)

ZamboniHDB;705209 said:


> GOP here.
> 
> IT'S A JOKE!


God love ya!:salute:


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

LawnProLandscapes;705066 said:


> Mark Oomkes;704453 said:
> 
> 
> > FWIW, an F150 IS a half ton.
> ...


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## abagoz (Jan 6, 2009)

Ford Fusion and Merc Milan are built in Mexico and have outstanding quality.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Jay brown;705016 said:


> i'm not sure on the series probably a C, but i know it's not the same motor as in a light duty Dodge..i'll have to look but it's a 7 or 8L in size...smaller than a L10 but bigger than a pickup motor..it's around a 200hp


What year is it Jay?

Mine's a '98, and it's a B-Series 5.9. Called a "Ford Diesel" when I ordered it. But my Cummins dealer has warranted a bunch of stuff on it.


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

Mark Oomkes;705604 said:


> What year is it Jay?
> 
> Mine's a '98, and it's a B-Series 5.9. Called a "Ford Diesel" when I ordered it. But my Cummins dealer has warranted a bunch of stuff on it.


sorry mark i forgot to mention it's an old gal, it's a '90....does this still make it a Cummins?


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## abagoz (Jan 6, 2009)

Mark Oomkes;704454 said:


> It is a I6 Cummins. B-Series just like in the Dodges.
> 
> I have one also, never heard that it was built in Brazil, didn't know Cummins had a plant in Brazil and not sure why they would build them there, when it's the same engine as the Dodge.
> 
> Did anybody else notice in the picture of the white crew cab dually the black masking around the fuel door area on the box? I bet it is hiding a really big or second fuel door to fill the Urea tank... meaning the new Scorpion engine will use SCR (urea injection) to meet the strict 2010 Diesel emissions standards.


Interesting, never heard of these many issues before.[/QUOTE]

Urea will be coming!!!!!


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## DIESEL PLOWER (Jan 21, 2009)

Acert was made for the emmisons and it was ust a big joke for them and they new it. Cat on road motors are only 10% if cat sales so its not a big hit to them and before emmisons Cat made a better motor then cummins ever thought of making seem to turn hands now. Lets not forget now that cummins has made the first 2010EPA happy motor the 6.7cummins with no Urea. Im a diesel fan,but if they do go to this urea injection I dont think i would buy one. IF they do use Urea they better get it at the pumps or it wont look good for the new motors and how much will it cost??? Diesel is $2.45 a gallon and just what yea want to put another 30gallons of urea on board. I think I will just buy the V10 that ford offers or a 6.0liter from chevy you can buy alot of gas with the $6,000 you save for getting the gasser compared to the diesel.


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## BigDave12768 (Nov 17, 2006)

2010 the Dodge 1500's get a 5.0 CUMMINS!!!!!

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/09/11/dodge-to-use-5-0l-diesel-v8-from-cummins/


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## BigDave12768 (Nov 17, 2006)

DIESEL PLOWER;734293 said:


> Acert was made for the emmisons and it was ust a big joke for them and they new it. Cat on road motors are only 10% if cat sales so its not a big hit to them and before emmisons Cat made a better motor then cummins ever thought of making seem to turn hands now. Lets not forget now that cummins has made the first 2010EPA happy motor the 6.7cummins with no Urea. Im a diesel fan,but if they do go to this urea injection I dont think i would buy one. IF they do use Urea they better get it at the pumps or it wont look good for the new motors and how much will it cost??? Diesel is $2.45 a gallon and just what yea want to put another 30gallons of urea on board. I think I will just buy the V10 that ford offers or a 6.0liter from chevy you can buy alot of gas with the $6,000 you save for getting the gasser compared to the diesel.


Too say Cat maybe on the road motors better than Cummins has to one of the most the most foolish statements on this board. Yes Cat made some great motors but at what price. The leak everywhere, They are real rough to start if anywhere near freezing.But they made huge HP and tourqe. But not all that fuel efficant. Also to buy one of those great 550hp cat motors you had to pay a 10k emmsions surcharge. Not saying Cat motor were not great. But they were huge offenders to the EPA


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

BigDave12768;734421 said:


> Too say Cat maybe on the road motors better than Cummins has to one of the most the most foolish statements on this board. Yes Cat made some great motors but at what price. The leak everywhere, They are real rough to start if anywhere near freezing.But they made huge HP and tourqe. But not all that fuel efficant. Also to buy one of those great 550hp cat motors you had to pay a 10k emmsions surcharge. Not saying Cat motor were not great. But they were huge offenders to the EPA


Come on, this is getting to be a Ford is better than Chevy is better than Dodge.

Cat and Cummins are both great engines.

People say the 3126B that I have in my 750 is a junk engine, but I have spent far, far, far less money on repairing that than my 5.9 Cummins in my F800. It has no leaks and it will outstart the Cummins everyday of the week. And it has less torque than the Cummins. Smoother and quieter, but if I was ordering another one, it would be Cummins.


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## BigDave12768 (Nov 17, 2006)

We have a Cat 350hp in our Bus and its the worst. Its leaks antifeeze everywhere. PIA to start when its cold. Powerful as all hell. And keeps going just has issues. We also have a 5.9 Cummins in the F650. Also starts like crap when its cold. I guess its all matters what its in and how much yo ru them, I have driven a 600Hp cat in 10 car carrier. I was impress with its power. I was doing 80mph before I knew it and the damm thing wanted to keep going. flew up a hill like I had no cars loaded. Cats are great and I know the big cummins cant hang with them.

Our 650









Now this has real HP and pulling power


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## beaver2 (Aug 16, 2004)

Bump and a litle off topic, but this needs clarified:

The brazilian engine you guys are refering to is an engine built by ford's agricultural division in Brazil. They are either 6.6 liter or 7.8 liter with a variety of HP ratings. The cummins 5.9 replaced the 6.6 due to emissions, and the 8.3 cummins IIRC replaced the 7.8.

They were used in the late eighties through early 90's in ford medium duty trucks.

They ARE NOT built by cummins, although they share a bosch p pump and are inline 6. The turbos are on the drivers side as well. (cummins 5.9 has them on passenger side)

The 6.6 and 7.8 are good engines, maybe a little low on power and hard to get parts for.

Just type in "Ford/ New Holland 6.6 diesel engine" in a search engine to find rebuilt ones.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

beaver2;744016 said:


> Bump and a litle off topic, but this needs clarified:
> 
> The brazilian engine you guys are refering to is an engine built by ford's agricultural division in Brazil. They are either 6.6 liter or 7.8 liter with a variety of HP ratings. The cummins 5.9 replaced the 6.6 due to emissions, and the 8.3 cummins IIRC replaced the 7.8.
> 
> ...


Sweet, I can go home now, just learned my one thing for the day.


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## Jay brown (Dec 26, 2005)

beaver2;744016 said:


> Bump and a litle off topic, but this needs clarified:
> 
> The brazilian engine you guys are refering to is an engine built by ford's agricultural division in Brazil. They are either 6.6 liter or 7.8 liter with a variety of HP ratings. The cummins 5.9 replaced the 6.6 due to emissions, and the 8.3 cummins IIRC replaced the 7.8.
> 
> ...


thanks beaver, ours is a 7.8l and for a salt it has plenty of HP to tote around 5 ton of materials.


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