# 2wd Backhoe help



## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Plain and simple, does anyone use a 2wd backhoe with a pusher on it? Work well, would it work well? Not huge runs, all pretty flat.


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## procut1 (Jan 21, 2004)

Its going to depend on your surface.

Flat ground is a plus
Short runs is a plus.

The main thing you want to do if youre using a machine is pretreat. Large tire machines are great pushing but become useless on ice or really slippery snow.

As long as the tires have something to grip. It will do fine. Not as good as a 4x4 but far from useless.


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## bterry (Oct 30, 2003)

Good question - good answer. Please keep the discussion going as I'm thinking about the same thing.


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

The lot(s) we would use a machine like this on are newer lots, pretty flat, some slight slopes but nothing huge and we keep on the storms pretty well so it wouldnt build up too much. Lookin for a machine with good tires and some decent weight to it, keeping the hoe on the back, thinking the weight would obviously help. Found a couple decent 4x2 backhoes for around 8-10k, hard to beat that.


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## procut1 (Jan 21, 2004)

Ive run pretty much every machine on wheels doing snow from lawn tractors to 5 yard loaders.

Its all going to come down to traction. You wouldnt believe how a 5 yard JD744 with tires the size of your truck will become useless on a slick surface. Those tires are like sleds. They are meant for mud, to sink and dig in. 

Youre going to want to keep up on the salting. 
Presalt
Do a light salting after each time pushing off if its a big storm.

Just enough to keep it from packing and so that the pusher does a pretty clean scrape.

Pushers dont "dig in" like plows do and they like to ride up on anything packed or sticky. 

A little salt to break the bond will make a pusher work like magic. Pushers are designed to be PUSHED. 

Sounds simple but almost everyone I see uses a pusher like a plow. There should be no down pressure, the box should be flat on the skids, and the machine literally just pushes it. If you have your rubber edge adjusted, and your surface has traction.....The 2wd will push like a champ


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Very good info thank you.


My belief/understanding is that the rear wheels (especially on a 2wd of course) on a machine with a pusher like this are the ones doing the most work so a 2wd machine should in theory do just fine. 

Next question- what size pusher. And yes, usually rubber edges.


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## procut1 (Jan 21, 2004)

With a 2wd I would say a 12' would be the most ideal.
You could probably get away with a 14' 

Youre going to want a smaller pusher on a 2wd not so much for the pushing capability but for the steering ability.

The front wheel drive doesnt do much to assist the pushing, it mainly assists the steering.
Youre going to have reduced steering with a 2wd machine. Even though you will be doing straight runs, you will notice a difference.

The reason for the smaller pusher is if you get heavier snow that you cant make a "full bite" you will have to take smaller bites with the pusher. Thats going to want to pull the machine sideways as just one side of the box fills up.

With a 4wd machine or a loader, you can compensate for that side pull and keep your push straight with your steering. A 2wd is going to want to drift right into the snow.

The smaller the box the less of a side pull you will have. 

You can run 16ft pushers on backhoes. 

If I were running a 2wd I would want a 12' on it


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Thanks for the help!, trying to figure out what machine to purchase. Need something that will handle a 12ft pusher, but we do landscape work all other seasons of the year so something like a tractor/loader, skidsteer, or wheel loader would be awesome. Backhoe would become a yard machine in the warmer seasons as we dont really need anything that large in the warmer months. Sooo my other question would be, knowing that we need a 12' pusher, what type/size/model machine would work-skidsteer? tractor with a cab?


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## bterry (Oct 30, 2003)

From the research I've done (no experience).... I don't think a skid will push a 12 footer very well. Boils down to physics, you need weight.


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## procut1 (Jan 21, 2004)

Skidsteers are great in the snow. A big skidsteer will handle a 12 ft box.

Personally I dont like operating skidsteers in anything other than snow. 
I have both a tractor and a skidsteer and unless its snowing I wont touch the skid. Ill always use the tractor. But thats just personal preference. All my guys prefer the skid over the tractor for everything.

A good sized tractor with a cab would work too.

As far as model numbers. That Im not too sure on. 

Ive run JD 260 and the equivalent size volvos and new hollands. Ive never run larger than a 10 ft pusher on those and that was about all they could handle. If you want to go 12 ft then you definitely want a bigger machine than those. Even the 10ft was big on those.

Ive run a JD 4700 4wd tractor with a 10ft. That was a struggle traction wise. The tractor would push the weight no problem, but the tractor itself wasnt heavy enough. I think if I weighted the tractor better it would have worked. So same thing. For a 12ft pusher go bigger than the JD 4700 or equivalent.

A backhoe. Theyre roughly standard size over the last few years. The main differences will be in options and engines. I think pretty much any relatively modern backhoe Case 580 size or so will push the 12'

So a lot of combination will work. Just figure out what will be most versatile to your business year round.

If it was snow only. I would say scrap the backhoe idea and go for a loader. You can find decent.....Not great, not new, but decent snow loaders for 10-15 k

But for year round....sometimes getting something thats "good for a lot of things" is better than a machine thats "great at one thing"


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

I knew that, not sure why I put it in my last post lol. Havin a hard time findin some decently priced machinery ie. small backhoes and wheel loaders.


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## procut1 (Jan 21, 2004)

PS 

When I said BIG skidsteer. I mean a BIG skidsteer. And weighted down very good


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

If I'm going BIG skidsteer Id rather find a decent backhoe or wheel loader, really would prefer the wheel loader but been havin a hard time findin anything worth a darn.


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## windrowsnow (Aug 31, 2008)

a guy here uses an old 2wd ford back hoe with a box on it, he does amenards with no issues


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## bterry (Oct 30, 2003)

procut1;1066368 said:


> ...A backhoe. Theyre roughly standard size over the last few years. The main differences will be in options and engines. I think pretty much any relatively modern backhoe Case 580 size or so will push the 12'


Are you talking 2 or 4 wheel drive?


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## samjr (Mar 18, 2008)

*No brakes*

If u move it from site to site on the roads remember u only got back brakes with 4x4 u got all 4 to lock up . With pusher on all the weight is up front


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## Dave N (Aug 26, 2010)

as it was already said, you'd have trouble steering with only a 2 wheel drive machine

to compensate for this, you should also look for a machine with 'split' brakes, or two separate brake pedals


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Wont be roading the machine. Split brakes, good idea then I guess. Not sure what machine to be looking for really, see a lot of Ford 555


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

So this may hekp my decision---


Found a 1989 JCB 408 with a little under 3k hours. All enclosed, articulated, good tires, looks to be in pretty good condition, comes with pallet forks, 4-in-1 bucket and a 12' pusher and the guys is asking $15k for it. Not sure with the age but otherwise it sounds alright and very versatile for us (ie. year round use)


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

Let me know where it if you don't buy it!! We need a second loader.


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

OK, need to bring back an old thread for some help

Thinking of givin up on the 2wd backhoe.

Goin along the lines of a large skidsteer (more versatile for us as a landscape company) or a "compact" wheel loader.

Found this machine, test drove it and love it, 4 wheel steer it turns on a dime, great cab, very clean, good price. But my question now is this, what size pusher would work on this and what size skidsteer is comparable to a machine like this. I'm thinkin a s250 or300 but I'm not sure.


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## Mike S (Feb 11, 2007)

How much does that wiegh? I know a few people around where I live run Deere 244 loaders and put 10 and 12 foot pusher on them and they work good but work better with the 10. I have a sub that has a 
2wd Case 580 that plows for me and it works good but for a year around machine its not that great. I like the loader in the pic, very cool!


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Its a little over 10,000 pounds, and thats probably without the 4 in 1 bucket.


Also found an Earthforce (Now bobcat) TLB, 4 wheel drive and 4 wheel steer. I'll try and post a picture. Not sure what size box it would push but....


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Heres the backhoe I found for sale. Wondering what this would push. Would be a good fit for us for year round work and its currently priced at 7k lower than that wheel loader I posted the pic of. 10,000lbs and a 46hp Kubota diesel.


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## spaceman12321 (Dec 3, 2007)

Something to consider is ground speed. When you have more speed, your momentum will carry you better (at least in a straight line). An articulating loader will turn a pusher better but when you max out the size of the pusher any machine will have a hard time turning with a full load.


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## Mike S (Feb 11, 2007)

I wouldnt not rule out the little backhoe! It might be the prefect machine for your company all year! They are a little on the slow side but still not bad having the hoe and skid steer quick attach all in one. It might not be the perfect snow machine but you know it will work. The all wheel steer will work better then a smaller skid steer.


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## srl28 (Jan 2, 2006)

Thats what I'm thinking, at least we ll use it. What size pusher though? 10 too big?


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## Mike S (Feb 11, 2007)

A compact 10 foot would be perfect! Snow dogg makes one with quick attach on it for about $2000. Pro tech makes one also with bucket mount deal that chains on like a big one for $2000 also. I have one or two of each that we have used on all sorts of machines. I would not go any bigger in size then the compact 10 foot models for that machine.


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