# How Much to Pay A Sub



## xc23 (Jan 29, 2007)

I Am hiring a sub for the first time , and wondering how much to offer him. He is new to plowing so I am giving him my residential drives only . He has a 2004 Chevy 1/2 ext cab with a 71/2 fisher mm2. I am in the central new York area. I am thinking of paying him per hour 2 1/2- 3 hr per event ,I plowed the route last year so I can estimate the time. I am figuring on 22-25 events for the season. Any info would be greatly appriciated.


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## THEGOLDPRO (Jun 18, 2006)

50 bucks an hour?


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

He should pay the teacher for his schooling


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## RBRONKEMA GHTFD (Dec 17, 2006)

So i take it he is brandy new to snow plowing??? If so start him off at 30 a hour. Make sure he is insured too. You don't want to be paying for a garage door and maybe some damage to some cars inside the garage too just in case something should happen.


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

RBRONKEMA GHTFD;431396 said:


> So i take it he is brandy new to snow plowing??? If so start him off at 30 a hour. Make sure he is insured too. You don't want to be paying for a garage door and maybe some damage to some cars inside the garage too just in case something should happen.


$30 an hour ... that stinks. $50 for a first timer if they seem responsible/


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## xc23 (Jan 29, 2007)

Thanks I think I will go in the middle at 35-40 and see how he works out. Much appreciated


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

Sounds like he is an Employee.

Be careful come tax time. 
Yours and His....


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## StratfordPusher (Dec 20, 2006)

*What about his fuel*



xc23;433742 said:


> Thanks I think I will go in the middle at 35-40 and see how he works out. Much appreciated


Hey, you gotta face it, a sub gotta make money or he's not worth having... if he has good equipment and knows what he is doing he will make you good money.... with fuel prices as they are 50.00 an hour is still cheap

I pay my subs 50.00 per hour plus fuel... they look after me real good...
and I don't have to worry or check on them....it's worth the extra...

My 2 cents...

Al


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## THEGOLDPRO (Jun 18, 2006)

i'd tell you to pack sand for 35-40 bucks an hour......


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

StratfordPusher;434073 said:


> Hey, you gotta face it, a sub gotta make money or he's not worth having... if he has good equipment and knows what he is doing he will make you good money.... with fuel prices as they are 50.00 an hour is still cheap
> 
> I pay my subs 50.00 per hour plus fuel... they look after me real good...
> and I don't have to worry or check on them....it's worth the extra...
> ...


I'm surprised you can find guys for $50, I've been to Straford before and it's a nice real nice town. Price depends on area and what I would do is sit down with the guy and ask him what he expects to make. It doesn't take long for a good operator to catch on. If the guy can't plow by the third storm, find someone else because he's never going to be any good.


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## StratfordPusher (Dec 20, 2006)

*Stratford is Cheap for subs*



JD Dave;434118 said:


> I'm surprised you can find guys for $50, I've been to Straford before and it's a nice real nice town. Price depends on area and what I would do is sit down with the guy and ask him what he expects to make. It doesn't take long for a good operator to catch on. If the guy can't plow by the third storm, find someone else because he's never going to be any good.


Hi JD, it is a nice city thanks.... with all the plant closings and layoffs in the area it seems like there is a bunch of new grass and snow removal companies popping up every time a plant shuts.... fools, they must think there is money in this... lol

I have seen written quotes for late model trucks, plows with driver going at 28.00 per hour, single driveways for 15.00 per.... it really makes it hard to charge what the jobs are worth when your dealing with a bunch of newbies and lowballers....

I can still get good quality subs and equipment for 50.00 per hour..... but believe their true value should be around 65-75 depending on the equipment and the driver...

I agree, if by the third time out he is not making you happy, drop him and move on....

Al


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## iakentdoz (Dec 20, 2005)

I'm getting 55 per hour and this is my first year as a sub. I was hopping for 65-75 but I know I'll get more next year.


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## bribrius (May 5, 2007)

xc23;431297 said:


> I Am hiring a sub for the first time , and wondering how much to offer him. He is new to plowing so I am giving him my residential drives only . He has a 2004 Chevy 1/2 ext cab with a 71/2 fisher mm2. I am in the central new York area. I am thinking of paying him per hour 2 1/2- 3 hr per event ,I plowed the route last year so I can estimate the time. I am figuring on 22-25 events for the season. Any info would be greatly appriciated.


2.5 hours per event. he might get maybe 15 events if hes lucky? (guessing. figure residential isnt zero tolerance)so that is 37.5 total hours? at sixty a hour thats only 2250.00

your basically covering his insurance and maybe some of his gas. if thats right do him a favor and tell him you wont hire him because your accounts may not even support you paying the sixty a hour and any breakdowns on his truck could eat that up easy. i know i wouldnt sub for that and i have no idea how many plowable storms you guys get or what his insurance rates are, but thats me.


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## CHCSnowman (Nov 11, 2006)

I get $65 per hour plus time bonus, usually around $75-80 an hour, per truck and operator payup


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## QuadPlower (Jan 4, 2007)

bribrius, Read the first post again. They get 22 -25 pushes per season. That makes it 3 hrs x 25 pushes x $40 hour = $3000 or at $60/hr = $4,500

Figure out how many drives per hour he can do (you did last year) 
Figure out how much you make (profit if you were to do it yourself) on those same drives.

$XX.xx per drive * # of drives per hour - paying sub $XX.xx per hour - your expenses = profit

When you get a profit you can live with you have the sub hourly rate.

Then sit down with him and ask him what he expects to get paid. Make it clear to him that he is responsable for the work, insurance, gas, repairs, etc.


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

bribrius;436434 said:


> your basically covering his insurance and maybe some of his gas. if thats right do him a favor and tell him you wont hire him because your accounts may not even support you paying the sixty a hour and any breakdowns on his truck could eat that up easy. i know i wouldnt sub for that and i have no idea how many plowable storms you guys get or what his insurance rates are, but thats me.


He is a sub"contractor"
Why do you care about his profit margin?

Do you think that is all he can do?
He is a contractor TOO.
He (the sub"contractor") could have many more accounts you know nothing about.

He is a sub-"contractor" not an employee...... or is he?

I think this is one of the biggest misconceptions on this board.
Allot of members think they are hiring a sub when they are hiring an employee.
A sub Is an independent contractor that works for the general contractor.. 
He has his own business
..........period..............

not a employee


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## HBLandscaping (Feb 13, 2007)

Up until 2 yrs ago I work as a sub for a couple different companies and I was paid $75 & $80 per hour plus one of the companies would give me $50 for gas to fill -up before the storm. My time started from the time the boss called and said to head out until the time I pulled back into my driveway, Also all on road time (Travel Time) between sites was included. The last company I worked for also gave each worker an additional $15 per every 8 hours worked for Food/Drinks.


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## tls22 (Sep 30, 2007)

I get $90/hr the clock starts running when i leave my driveway, until i pull into my driveway again at the end of the storm. I get a good amount of hours per storm, plus some times the boss is lazy and i go salt for him in one of his trucks. I get 50 hr for that, plus its a tailgate spreader so it take time to fill it up. I def found a home for snowplowing for the forcibly future.


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## Gicon (Oct 1, 2005)

xc23;431297 said:


> He is new to plowing so I am giving him my residential drives only . He has a 2004 Chevy 1/2 ext cab with a 71/2 fisher mm2. I.


I hope you are joking.......a beginner on Residential Driveways?????? They belong in parking lots where no damage can be done.....not in between houses, garages, parked cars, and retaining walls.


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## fordzilla1155 (Jan 10, 2004)

Ask him what he wants to plow each drive. That way everyone is happy...


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## AbsoluteH&L (Jan 5, 2006)

A buddy of mine did sub work a few years back and got $50. They also only hire if you have a 8 foot plow and they highly recommend wings. All for there better profit.


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## Chris-R (Jul 9, 2005)

To get the going rate in your area, just call your local public works department and ask what they pay for a sub. That will give you an idea of what rates are in your area.


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## RacerBren (Nov 6, 2005)

We have a 2000 f250 v-10 available for sub work this winter. My employee has enough experience and with the truck I was thinking about 60-75 per hours for sub work..Other wise the truck sits..Its got to worth it. Gas, liability and such..I just like selling Magic.


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## Injunfarian (Oct 17, 2009)

Any input from London, ON?

I am just trying to guage the rate in my city on how much to expect as a sub, it seems that my expectations are too high or I have just been lowballed a couple of times. 

My Experience is really 0 as a plower but my equipment includes 2004 Dodge 2500 with Cummins
and a Boss 8'2" Poly V

So far I have been offered $40 an hour and $45 an hour.


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## buckwheat_la (Oct 11, 2009)

just a suggestion here boys, but why not offer him $40/hour, with the incentive that if you get no complaints, and he does a good job, there is a bonus at the end of the month, that way he well try his best, learn fast, and do good work. i always start employees a little lower when i first hire them, and after the first month if they have worked out well i give them a raise to regular wage and i back pay them for the previous month, for the regular amount. it has worked well for me and i don't see why you couldn't apply it to subs to.


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

SUB!!! Tell him to pay YOU.

Laborers and drivers in your vehicle and subs who use your anything of yours is considered in the US a taxable IRS certified employee. I don't agree given the random nature of winter, hours and work.

However, when you consider how much to pay also add; Workmens comp, State/Fed, SS and medicare along with payroll services and filings to the fully loaded cost. Now your $10-$15 hour employee is much much higher.


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## buckwheat_la (Oct 11, 2009)

scottL, my friend you need to read through the posts before you reply, the SUB is provinding his own vehicle, insurance, etc. Also, i don't know what it is like in the USA, but in Canada, a sub can lease your equipment from you and then use it, lots of paperwork, (invocing back and forth) but then he can still work as a subcontractor, no different then if he leased from a car dealership


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## scottL (Dec 7, 2002)

buckwheat_la;843144 said:


> scottL, my friend you need to read through the posts before you reply, the SUB is provinding his own vehicle, insurance, etc. Also, i don't know what it is like in the USA, but in Canada, a sub can lease your equipment from you and then use it, lots of paperwork, (invocing back and forth) but then he can still work as a subcontractor, no different then if he leased from a car dealership


Yup ... I shot the email early .... As for leasing in the US ... Good luck with that game. The IRS will nail you and then if there is an accident workmans comp, disability, auto insurance and fines. This trick has been done before.


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## buckwheat_la (Oct 11, 2009)

thank goodness i am in Canadatymusic
that really sucks though, governments are always trying to give the little guy the shaft


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