# New Diesel



## psdiesel24 (Nov 25, 2003)

I got my offroad magazine today and they have a big article saying that ford and internation are not meeting ends that ford wants a 6 cylinder to put in the 150 and that international won't do anything and that ford is looking at other diesel manufactors to replace international. A couple of them were detroit, john deere, cat, and cummins. I personally would like to see a cat engine in in a f350 that would be sweet but who knows just wondering if anyone else has heard anything like this.


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## The Boss (Oct 22, 2003)

I haven't heard anything yet but I would LOVE to have a Detroit or Cat rumblin under my hood. :yow!:


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## psdiesel24 (Nov 25, 2003)

ya that would be pretty sweet


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## 04superduty (Jan 9, 2004)

i think ford and international had a rough time after all of the problems with the new 6.0 PSD. I heard the new engine international was working on wasnt going to meet emissions standards set for a few years from now. So basically the engine would have a limited lifespan without spending more $$. Heard international spent like 145 million developing the new engine, then ford cancelled the contract, but did pay some money to cover the costs.  i believe ford is part owner of cummins, so possible that might be an option, even though dodge uses cummins, and has since i believe 89.


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## 85F150 (Mar 13, 2003)

they have been havin probs...International already developed a 6 cyl for and f150 and explorer base. They got everything the way ford wanted it and was an awesome motor but ford keeps pushing the date back and was looking at another manufacture/proprietery (sp)....this was all happening earlier last year....International was sueing (sp) ford over this don't remem how it was resolved....


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## Heron Cove PM (Aug 4, 2003)

Wouldn't mine seeing the Cummins, but a Cat...


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## crashz (Jan 12, 2004)

A diesel F150 would be perfect! I heard rumors before the 2004 launch that Ford was looking into a miniture Powerstroke for the 150, but got axed. 

Aaaaw to have the rumble of a Cat inline 6 under the hood of my F150!


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## WOODY367 (Dec 19, 2002)

psdiesel24 what offroad mag was that in?


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## QMVA (Oct 9, 2003)

Cummings are to shaky the one i rode in felt like the truck was going to fall apart. International makes a great engine. At work the delivery truck is an international with international engine and Allison transmission. Replaced the Allison about a year ago but no problems with the engine.


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## psdiesel24 (Nov 25, 2003)

woody it was in the january issue of off road mag.


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## harley hauler (Nov 20, 2003)

FYI My dad works for CAT you can special order a diesel for a pick up cost some dough a couple of his customer's have them both in fords.


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## danzig (Dec 12, 2003)

My prediction is that ford will be using cummins engines in their trucks around 2007 or 2008. Dodge will be powered by a top of the line mercedes diesel. Look around at chrysler they replaced their full size van with a mercedes van powered by a 5 cyl turbo'd mercedes diesel. The jeep liberty will have a mercedes diesel option soon. Ford does not own any of cummins and hasnt for the last 5 years but the cummins contract with dodge is up in 2007 and it will be more cost effective for dodge to use a benz engine. You watch ford will jump to get the cummins for their light duty trucks. You can get a cummins in a medium or heavy duty ford now as well as a cat.


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## tuna (Nov 2, 2002)

Believe it or not at one time you could get a GM engine in a Ford Medium Duty.My buddy has a 1980 F800 with a 8.2 Detriot.


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## QMVA (Oct 9, 2003)

I hope your wrong danzig. Cummins


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## Ggg6 (Oct 14, 2003)

So the magazine that has Ford as a major advertiser says that IH who does not advertise in that magazine will not make a 6cyl diesel for the F-150 project. Take what you read in magazines with a water softener block of salt. They are in the business of selling issues, and to do that they need money, to get money they need advertisers. So if they took IH's side of this story they would be biting the hand that feeds them.


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## psdiesel24 (Nov 25, 2003)

This is very true but still really bugs the hell out of me.


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## danzig (Dec 12, 2003)

Emissions might be the reason you wont see a diesel in a half ton ford or expedition. A diesel in a 1/2 ton is redundant and will probably be a liability for ford and navistar. Most trucks sold are 1/2 ton. The average 1/2 ton truck buyer doesnt want a diesel for various reasons. Sure a 1/2 ton diesel will be more of a niche market especially for diesel heads. Chevy offered a diesel in their halves up to 97 i believe, but they just did not sell. A lot of ford guys seem to poo poo on the cummins engine. Because it is in the dodge they seem to think the ps is better. Well if you ever see the crank and bearings of the 2 engines side by side this will change your mind. The components of the ps look like a gas engine when compared to the cummins. A ps is a light duty engine where as the cummins is a medium duty engine. 30% fewer moving parts and a much longer lifespan. A ps has better acceleration and power but not by very much. The cummins now is available with 325 hp and 600 ft pounds of torque. Its still the same engine you will find in much heavier trucks. Somebody is going to want the cummins contract when daimler/chrysler does go to a mercedes benz diesel.


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## juggernaut (Jan 14, 2004)

Danzig is that Glen Danzig the singer you refer to? He's awesome but anyways your right the cummins b series compared to the international T444E (7.3) has much beefier internals but does the B series have forged pistons and piston cooling jets along with a forged crank? (I'm not sure) That was the 7.3 though. I really can't compare the vt365 to the 5.9 havn't seen the internals of the vt365. Now the Cummins in a Ford would be so damn popular, "I cant tell you how many people I have heard say if only they offered the Cummins in a Ford." Ford couldn't make enough j/k. Cats are "fine" engines but I agree with you HeronCove, the size they would use in pickups would be small and their smaller engines tend to eat themselves if the power is turned up. I think the ideal engine would be to put a DT or HT wet sleeve series in-line six in the Ford, like a 466 or 570 that would be sweet!!! 400,000 mi overhaul intervals!!! Thats one HELL of an engine but it will never happen. Now the VT 365 will meet newer emissions for medium duty trucks but not for pickups which is why it will most likely be dropped eventually. As for the myth about Ford owning part of Cummins, Ford in past years had a 10% share in the company, but they have long since given that up. Part of the reason Ford has been having trouble with the new 6.0 powerstroke engine is Ford clearly rushed its debut, while it may have had a few glitches in vt365 trim it did not have nearly as many problems as the powerstroke. But hey the Torqshift is doing damn well 1 for 2 isn't too bad hahaha.


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## danzig (Dec 12, 2003)

I do believe all the cummins components are forged as well as the navistar. Not aware of piston cooling jets on the b series 5.9 cummins. The cummins engine has been documented to run 1 million miles, the average overhaul spec is now 350,000 miles. I have an international 4900 with a dt466 and a 5 speed tranny. 300,000 miles on it. The 466 does not have the power a t444e does. My 466 does not have the pep of a cummins or a powerstroke. I think im gonna put a chip in it.


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## juggernaut (Jan 14, 2004)

Sure they have been documented to run 1,000,000 miles. At TheDieselStop.com there is a thread about a guy in a boating magazine that had 1,000,000 mi on his PSD too I think it was a 95/96 something like that, so it can be done. I'll try to find the thread. I will also say that its much easier to do that with the Cummins though. The Cummins is a great engine they really have that B series dialed in, tough as nails for a pickup. But lets not forget to compare overall vehicle quality. I am surprised T444E feels quicker are they both in med duties (I assume yes)? Also I would tend to say the 466 handles lugging much better than the 444. Any way I am getting off topic here sorry.


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## doh (Sep 23, 2003)

I have heard from a number of places about a 6 cyl diesel for the new F150, and I have seen a belt routing guide on a new truck stating a 4.0L engine ? and lets face it with an optional 8200lb GVWR there is plenty of payload left for the extra wieght.

Thats is what happened to GM's diesel 1/2 ton. After you loaded all the goodies on it and a driver all you had left was 500 lbs of payload left.

Actually GM enginers refuused to build 2 fleet ext cabs 4x4's that I had sold in 1997 because they were over weight at the factory.

This combination makes sense and I hope they can work it out with navistar or someone.


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