# after plowing cooldown



## cward05 (Aug 16, 2004)

hi everyone, just a quick question...i've heard that you're supposed to leave your truck on for up to 20 min! after plowing (just let it idle) to help cool down the engine...is this true for all trucks? i have an 83 chevy k10 1/2 ton w/manual transmission. should i do this? or just turn if off? thanks


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## PremierLand (Jun 11, 2004)

I dont. Basically, I let it run like 2 or 3min before I go out plowing, I work it hard for 10-15hours, then come home shut it right off and go to sleeppp....

Only thing I could say letting it idle and cool down, is MAYBE with a diesel. But IDK


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## RamesesSnow23 (Jan 4, 2004)

cward05 said:


> hi everyone, just a quick question...i've heard that you're supposed to leave your truck on for up to 20 min! after plowing (just let it idle) to help cool down the engine...is this true for all trucks? i have an 83 chevy k10 1/2 ton w/manual transmission. should i do this? or just turn if off? thanks


This would not be to let the engine cool down necessarily, it would be to cool the transmission down by letting the fluid circulate for a while while your not plowing and changing geers constantly. Its good to have a tranny temp gauge if you plow, that way there you know if its too warm. If you idle for a while tranny temp will go down. Id say do it only if your gauge indicates that the tranny is too hot after plowing. If you have an aux cooler like most trucks then your all set.


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## dirt digger (Feb 27, 2005)

i'm not sure about gas engines but you should let a diesel cool down. The turbo is spinning at several thousand RPM and when you cut the engine off the oil pump stops and no oil gets to the turbo. By letting a diesel idle down it gives the turbo time to slow down when oil is still flowing to it. 20 minutes may be a little extreme, we usually run our diesels for 5-8 minutes after a hard days work.


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## justme- (Dec 28, 2004)

Dirt digger is correct- diesel only needs a cool down- auto tranny might not be a bad idea, but no need on a manual at all.
Keep in mind 90% of late model autos do not circulate fluid in Park- the pump is only ingaged in Neutral


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## smokin_stroker (Dec 13, 2005)

It would hurt any truck to run a little afterward if nothing else to help charge the battery


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## CrazyCooter (Jan 29, 2005)

smokin_stroker said:


> It would hurt any truck to run a little afterward if nothing else to help charge the battery


It takes 5 minutes of running the truck to make up for just starting it. Running it for a few minutes doesn't help much, other than the gas station's pocketbook. IF you're concerned about draining the battery, get a 2nd, or use a maintainer.


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## justme- (Dec 28, 2004)

depends on the truck- mind you a diesel has heaters (grid or glow plugs) which take alot more juics from the battery on start- more like 20 min idle time- which is also very bad for a diesel incidentally.

If you're plowing the battery is likely charged back up unless you just plowed your own drive then parked it immediatly after. I really wouldn't sweat it for a cool down unless your a diesel and/or a turbo.


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## smokin_stroker (Dec 13, 2005)

Well my old plow truck with the heater on and the lights it show really low on the amp guage then start running the plow alot in little drives it really drops. There is not much driving invovled so I let it run to charge I need all the juice I can get to start in the morning when it is cold.


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## CrazyCooter (Jan 29, 2005)

smokin_stroker said:


> Well my old plow truck with the heater on and the lights it show really low on the amp guage then start running the plow alot in little drives it really drops. There is not much driving invovled so I let it run to charge I need all the juice I can get to start in the morning when it is cold.


So,
Invest in a block heater, or a trickle charger. Much cheaper and less wear on the vehicle in the long run.
Trickle chargers sell for $19.99. That aint too much to ask to charge your battery back up overnight, methinks, rather than spending gas / engine life of your truck to do the same.


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## smokin_stroker (Dec 13, 2005)

Why don't you do what you want and I will do what I want. 

The truck only uses .42 gallons an hour at an idle so it is not going to break me up. If it breaks you up maybe you should get out of this line of work.In 24 days I will use 1 gallon of fuel idling for 5 minutes out the end of each day and that is only if you plow everyday hardly seems like it is worth it to piss around with a trickle charger.

On a side note do you shut your truck off at stoplights as well just look atr the fuel and wear and tear you will save


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## justme- (Dec 28, 2004)

Smokin- are you sure you have an ammeter? If so it's not telling you anything about the state of your battery. add a voltmeter.

Amps is the current- all it tells you is the direction of current (charging or discharging) and the amount of flow (high current or low current in the given direction) It tells you nothing about the battery's charge level. 
You know how it's affecting the current flow, but not the charge state of the battery. Voltage tells you that. For all you really know with only an ammeter you could be needlessly idling the truck to add a charge it doesn't need.

A trickle charger is a bad answer too- most take too long to adequately charge a big battery. a float charger is useless completely for charging- it only maintains a charge.

If you want to idle it good for you. As long as it's a gasser you're not likely to see the effects too soon. You WILL however clog your cat- idle does not produce exhaust temps high enough for the cat to properly vaporize the soot which clogs it. VERY prevalent on diesel's, not as much on gassers because there's less soot, but it does happen and it's expensive to replace a cat.


Shut off the truck at stop lights: not yet, but you all will be in the future whether you know it or not. Most of the hybrid vehicles on the road today already do this and the GMC/Dodge truck hybrid joint project for the 07 market (possibly the 06 market) will do it too. It can increase MPG by a significant amount and therefore reduces emissions a significant amount too.


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## frostservices (Nov 19, 2005)

I would shut it off and be done with it unless you were just pushing really hard and really long within 5 min of getting home. The only other thing is if your temp is raising from driving down the road with the plow up might be a good idea to let it idle a couple min.
Seth


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## murphyslaw (Oct 2, 2005)

I consider the 12 minute drive from my last account to the shop cool down enough.


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## johntwist (Feb 10, 2004)

I agree with most of what's already been said; a gas engine can pretty much be shut off right away and a diesel should be given a few minutes to idle down. I've owned both.

The important thing though is that the tranny is what really needs to cool down, not just at the end of a plowing run, but during it too. My truck has an aux. tranny cooler so I don't really have problems running hot. Even with that when you're really working the truck hard and doing some heavy pushing, taking a few minutes to let the tranny fluid cool is a good idea. It also gives you time to pour some coffee, eat something, jump out and stretch, make or take a few phone calls or whatever.

With my Dodge, the tranny fluid only circulates through the cooler when in gear, not while in park. This is stated in the owner's manual. I usually just drop the blade and put her in neutral and sit for 5 minutes and that does the trick. I may do it once an hour pushing heavy wet snow, maybe once in 2 or 3 hours or not at all pushing fluff.

This is something I think more of us are not aware of than they'd want to admit. When I read it in the manual, I didn't want to believe it either. So if you're idling in park, in a Dodge anyway, your tranny's just cooking. Something to think about. And if you don't have a tranny cooler and warning light, you should absolutely get a tranny fluid temp gauge.


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## daninline (Nov 1, 2004)

I installed a remote starter on my diesel that has a cool off timer so I just hit a button and it runs for 5 mins to cool down the turbo.

Driving home from the last plow is more then needed to cool down the trans.
Just do what you want a cool down it cheaper then replacing parts.

I think a warm-up is needed more on cold mornings.


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## streetsurfin' (Jan 22, 2004)

dirt digger said:


> i'm not sure about gas engines but you should let a diesel cool down. The turbo is spinning at several thousand RPM and when you cut the engine off the oil pump stops and no oil gets to the turbo. By letting a diesel idle down it gives the turbo time to slow down when oil is still flowing to it. 20 minutes may be a little extreme, we usually run our diesels for 5-8 minutes after a hard days work.


You are on the right track here digger. It actually has more to do with the turbo being very hot after working under a load, that you need to idle down. Heat soak can burn off oil in the turbo bearings and oil supply passages and leave behind hardened residue which can eventually block passages and hinder heat transfer between surfaces. Not so much about slowing the turbo down before the oil supply is cut off, but cooling it down so there is not a big heat soak which cooks the oil.

I usually shut off all accessories and fast idle for a minute or to add a littlle extra recharge to the batteries before parking.


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## frostservices (Nov 19, 2005)

Well if what is said about the transmission pump is correct maybe on warm ups you should be taking your auto out of park to. just a thought.
Seth


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## murphyslaw (Oct 2, 2005)

you are right about the dodge tranny thing. My employees and I always start the rig put it in net. and let it warm up. we also chock the tires to prevent accidents.


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## C&J Snow Plowin (Dec 10, 2004)

*Cool Down*



cward05 said:


> hi everyone, just a quick question...i've heard that you're supposed to leave your truck on for up to 20 min! after plowing (just let it idle) to help cool down the engine...is this true for all trucks? i have an 83 chevy k10 1/2 ton w/manual transmission. should i do this? or just turn if off? thanks


 This would be the first I heard of it. If you have a Turbo Diesel the recemend you give the turbo a few minute cool down but not 20 minutes. as far as a gas motor goes no.


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## Detroitdan (Aug 15, 2005)

johntwist said:


> I agree with most of what's already been said; a gas engine can pretty much be shut off right away and a diesel should be given a few minutes to idle down. I've owned both.
> 
> The important thing though is that the tranny is what really needs to cool down, not just at the end of a plowing run, but during it too. My truck has an aux. tranny cooler so I don't really have problems running hot. Even with that when you're really working the truck hard and doing some heavy pushing, taking a few minutes to let the tranny fluid cool is a good idea. It also gives you time to pour some coffee, eat something, jump out and stretch, make or take a few phone calls or whatever.
> 
> ...


Very interesting, does anybody know if this is true with GMs? I've never heard of it, but come to think of it I know Allisons in truck applications dont even pump fluid if it's not in gear, so I bet the pickups are the same. That's why you can't tow a truck with an Allison, even if it's running in neutral, you have to pull the driveshaft or an axleshaft first. Tranny will smoke in about fifty yards. So my next question is, you said the Dodge doesn't circulate to the cooler unless it's in gear: I didn't think neutral was a gear.


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## johntwist (Feb 10, 2004)

Detroitdan said:


> So my next question is, you said the Dodge doesn't circulate to the cooler unless it's in gear: I didn't think neutral was a gear.


Well you're right, it's not a gear. What it is, according to Dodge, is the only place the tranny fluid will circulate when the truck is not operating in R, D, 2, or 1. Now, I don't know about you, but if I can't get circulation in park then I figure I have 2 choices. I can do what I said I do, which is drop the blade and sit in neutral for a few. I make sure I'm on level ground and that lets me sit without moving; the emergency brake is something I stay away from in freezing weather...if it freezes in the "on" position... . The other choice is to sit there in gear with my foot on the brake, which I don't want to do since as I said, while the truck's on break, so is the driver.


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## greenscapes inc (Oct 28, 2005)

justme- said:


> Smokin- are you sure you have an ammeter? If so it's not telling you anything about the state of your battery. add a voltmeter.
> 
> Amps is the current- all it tells you is the direction of current (charging or discharging) and the amount of flow (high current or low current in the given direction) It tells you nothing about the battery's charge level.
> You know how it's affecting the current flow, but not the charge state of the battery. Voltage tells you that. For all you really know with only an ammeter you could be needlessly idling the truck to add a charge it doesn't need.
> ...


I let my diesel warm up for 5-10 min in the morning when it is cold. How can letting a diesel idle hurt the engine?? The 18 wheelers out there sometimes let there truck idle all night long. So your telling me they are damaging there engines? 
My opinion is do whatever works for you, letting your engine idle isnt going to hurt anything


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## justme- (Dec 28, 2004)

greenscapes said:


> I let my diesel warm up for 5-10 min in the morning when it is cold. How can letting a diesel idle hurt the engine?? The 18 wheelers out there sometimes let there truck idle all night long. So your telling me they are damaging there engines?
> My opinion is do whatever works for you, letting your engine idle isnt going to hurt anything


Yup.
Idleing a small/medium duty like apickup is a little different than a semi, but not much. Semi's do not have Cathlytic converters which require exhaust temps to be at certain levels to properly vaporise the contaminants, at idle they don't reach said temps and cannot vaporise everything- most common repair on a medium duty pickup with diesel is plugged cat.

Also, idle reduces CHT which can contribute to incopmplete combustion- contaminating the oil in the cyl and wearing the rings. Cooler Cylinder Head Temp's also allow carbon to form in the combustion chamber that should not be there.

Idling is bad for any engine- oil pumps wear out faster at idle too.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

justme- said:


> Yup.
> Idleing a small/medium duty like apickup is a little different than a semi, but not much. Semi's do not have Cathlytic converters which require exhaust temps to be at certain levels to properly vaporise the contaminants, at idle they don't reach said temps and cannot vaporise everything- most common repair on a medium duty pickup with diesel is plugged cat.
> 
> Also, idle reduces CHT which can contribute to incopmplete combustion- contaminating the oil in the cyl and wearing the rings. Cooler Cylinder Head Temp's also allow carbon to form in the combustion chamber that should not be there.
> ...


Interesting comments. From all the reading I've done on FTE and TDS, the problem with idling at low RPM's is wet stacking, not burning off contaminants and plugging the cat. According to them, add the AIC or high idle mod and you shouldn't have any of these problems.

Now with the Ford's EGR, this may start causing problems with the contaminants, but still the bigger concern is wet stacking.

Just out of curiosity, why does an oil pump wear out quicker at idle?

I have heard and been told by our tranny rebuilder the same thing with the Dodges.


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## Willy-D8 (Feb 21, 2004)

justme- said:


> Yup.
> Idling a small/medium duty like apickup is a little different than a semi, but not much. Semi's do not have Cathlytic converters which require exhaust temps to be at certain levels to properly vaporise the contaminants, at idle they don't reach said temps and cannot vaporise everything- most common repair on a medium duty pickup with diesel is plugged cat.
> 
> Also, idle reduces CHT which can contribute to incopmplete combustion- contaminating the oil in the cyl and wearing the rings. Cooler Cylinder Head Temp's also allow carbon to form in the combustion chamber that should not be there.
> ...


What do you consider excessive idling? Over night is kind of extreme but I don't think 30 mins would hurt?
How many late model diesel are equipped with Cats? I thought the majority were Cat-less?


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## mr.plow 2 (Oct 20, 2005)

all of you dodge guys out there they make a kit that you put on so you dont have to have it in gear to cool trans down i can take some pic of the one i got on mine and post them if you want the kit is a bout 300.00 bucks but it is better then 2000.00 for new trans trust me i know :realmad:


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## C&J Snow Plowin (Dec 10, 2004)

*Idleing*



greenscapes said:


> I let my diesel warm up for 5-10 min in the morning when it is cold. How can letting a diesel idle hurt the engine?? The 18 wheelers out there sometimes let there truck idle all night long. So your telling me they are damaging there engines?
> My opinion is do whatever works for you, letting your engine idle isnt going to hurt anything


 I have drove Over the road for 16 years and yes it does hurt the big trucks components to idle every day. This is why they are trying gen pacs to provide heat and ac without running the motors. It is best to idle (Big Trucks ) at 900 to 1000 RPM's because this allows the fluids to circulate properly etc. and it also keeps the turbo from " Slobbering " Leaking oil do to damage to turbo from idling the Big trucks. I hope this helps. Maybe the small diesle is set up the same as the Big Trucks with a cruise control idle rev up. This means that when parked you would set the cruise, then hit accele to raise the idle RPM check with a dealer or give my tips a try to idle your truck and keep fuids moving. Good Luck


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## justme- (Dec 28, 2004)

Willy-D8 said:


> What do you consider excessive idling? Over night is kind of extreme but I don't think 30 mins would hurt?
> How many late model diesel are equipped with Cats? I thought the majority were Cat-less?


Acording to Cummins and Dodge more than 10 minutes is excessive. All Cummins diesels therefore Dodge are CAT for the Emissions states (CA, MA, NY) from 1994 through 19981/2 until the ISB for particulate emissions- the ISB reduced the emissions enough. Many Dodges were built with cats- some were built with resonators that look like cats. Many owners don;t know if they have a cat since they think it's a resonator.

Unless the engine is computer controlled in an emission state it has a cat- Ford, GM, whatever (for up to 1 ton trucks) The current gen of Fords has a cat in MA (boss's van has one) and the current Dodges might. the HO diesel is not available due to emissions in Emissions states.

Once your CHT drops to normal you shouldn't idle it. Do you have a pyro? you should if you don't- and a boost gage. They are the only 2 gages that will really tell you what's going on in the engine.

Most of the newer trucks have idel boosters for idle- (boss's Ford again). My 96 used to have a traditional high idle when cold, but it hasn;t functioned for a few years- not sure why.

MR plow2 post the info- I'm curious. I think a compatant tranny shop could modify the tranny to pump in park but that will tend to wear the pump out faster.


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