# Bobcat S300 Single Speed for 1 km (0.6 mi) steep driveway?



## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

We have a 1 km (0.6 mi) driveway with over 250' of rise in probably 1/4-1/3 of the length. A typical snowfall is 4-6", but I've seen 2' overnight twice (in one week). Back then all I had was a snow shovel! Wait for grader...

Snow season is pretty well beginning of November to early April, though most snow falls in the first half of that window most years. Typical snowpack seems to be around 2' (seems to just settle down more with each layer added, can walk on top it by end of year). One year we had 4' we could walk on top of.

Driveway surface is rough dirt and rocks--nothing smooth about it, though I hope to make some summer use of the S300 to begin changing that.

Currently driveway is cleared with Polaris Big Boss 6x6 with plow and a large walk-behind snowblower (use plow till banks are too high, then plow to center and blow it out). Needless to say, this takes too long.

The S300 has high flow and I think I'll eventually want a blower. But the part of the driveway with all the rise is cut into the side of a bluff and lots of rocks drop onto it (I've changed way too many shear pins). I'm thinking even with a big skid steer snowblower, I may want to plow this section at least most of the time to avoid blowing rocks. For that matter, I understand that as long as the plow will work, it ought to be faster than blowing the snow.

Is the lack of high speed range on an S300 (means max speed 6 mph at wide open throttle) a no go for plowing? What would you recommend in the way of attachments for the S300 for snow removal on this driveway?

I also plan to use the machine for brush hogging, likely chipping a lot of limbs (pine, along with willow, trembling aspen and occasional other stuff), unloading/loading/moving heavy stuff, clearing out ditches, improving driveway, digging holes, pulling fence posts, moving brush piles, and anything else it may prove useful for on 20 acres of partially tamed wilderness. Is the S300 a good choice? Or would you recommend I rethink this? I considered a T300 for added stability and flotation, but am not sure I can justify the extra cost when I can afford to be choosy about when to do the work (when it's dry) as it's just for work around my own place.

All suggestions/questions/feedback welcome. Shoot!


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

S300 is gold package with heat & a/c (though there is a good crack between closed door seal and frame on latch side). It's ~4500 hrs and quite clean. Apparently it spent most of its life working in a warehouse. Problems I've noted are suspension seat has no suspension (flopped down flat, broken), roof has some surface rust on top (rest of machine has very little rust--a touch on a scratch here and there), and one tire slowly goes flat (apparently over 2-3 months). Tires are probably 60% tread.

I will definitely need to do something about the seat--back bugged me after a few minutes bouncing in there. I'm not sure if these are a fix or replace item.

It has three couplers for hydraulics and a high-flow button. Present owner has never used auxiliary hydraulics, and neither of us have any hydraulic attachments presently. Is there any way to confirm they are in working order without an attachment (attachment rentals are 10 hr one-way drive away)?


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Oh, and kind of hard to tell when it is freezing outside, but it doesn't seem as if the A/C is working on the S300. Present owner used it only for snow removal at their place and never used A/C. I won't either in winter, but do plan to use the machine plenty for summer projects as well.

I'm curious what you figure a clean gold package single speed S300 from '06 with ~4500 hrs would be worth in Canada.


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## TKLAWN (Jan 20, 2008)

Personally I'd consider a smaller size bobcat maybe a s185/205 that has lower hours. The 300 just has too many hours for me.

A blower seems most logical to me, maybe consider a v plow too.


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## 90plow (Dec 22, 2001)

4500 hours is a lot for a skid steer. I would look at a smaller machine or even look at a tractor. The problem with skid steers is the way you run them wide open throttle most of the time which would wear out any engine let alone one that's jammed in a small compartment with high heat all the time. I own an 05 s300 with roughly 2600 hours and the hours are really starting to show. Why not get a nice Kubota tractor with 45 horse power or so. The nice thing with a tractor is you can leave the bucket in place and use your blower off the rear pto. Also the attachments are much cheaper for a three point pto setup over a hydraulic skid steer attachment.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks guys. S300 does start real well with little smoke at 0 degrees C without being plugged in and has a smoother idle than my '02 7.3L (which is overall in very good condition--I like to maintain stuff well). I get the impression the S300 wasn't run WOT that much, but am hesitating over the hours anyway. By appearance, I would've guessed lower hours. It's nearby while anything else will be 10 hr + drive away, so if this happened to be the right machine it would be convenient.

I looked seriously at Kubota tractor options in spring. I really don't want to blow snow backing up on a driveway this long (whiplash injury years ago, neck just doesn't like doing that). I also like the idea of hydraulic pressure relief instead of shear pins. A front hydraulic blower is possible on tractors, but costs as much as a skid-steer blower. And to get any lift capacity on the loader (for other jobs), the tractor needs to be fairly large. All that said, I think I'll end up with a tractor as well in the future, but I'm doubtful it's what I want for the driveway and heavy lifting jobs.

If I do end up with a skid steer, how much is speed going to matter with a V-plow for this driveway? I'm thinking the S300 should have the weight to push the widest V-plow Bobcat sells (and perhaps there are better options). Is the lack of 2-speed a problem?


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## abbe (Sep 8, 2009)

I have nothing to add except holy hell 10hr drive one way. God bless you


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

Normally a two speed is preferred for plowing lots, for a drive, and what year describing, its perfect.

What is ur location?


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

1olddogtwo;2054988 said:


> Normally a two speed is preferred for plowing lots, for a drive, and what year describing, its perfect.
> 
> What is ur location?


Thanks! We're close to the Yukon, and not far from Alaskan panhandle. Am I understanding that 2 speed is best for lots, but not so much for a driveway like I'm describing?

What would you recommend attachment-wise for moving the snow? I'm thinking blower and maybe a v-plow (as TKLAWN mentioned)--or straight plow with a move-able wings to keep snow from tumbling off the wrong edge (not sure if I know what I'm talking about here--have seen something like wings where one on leading edge of plow is sticking out ahead). I've also wondered about the pushers and huge snow buckets, but am thinking one version or another of a plow seems like it would be most productive when conditions don't warrant the blower. Blower purchase will probably wait a winter or two while other priorities are higher.

Some years snow blowing wouldn't be necessary (had one winter recently where I always had room to put it with the ATV). I have no experience moving snow with anything motorized other than the ATV plow and walk-behind blower, so I don't have a feel for which of the skid-steer snow moving options would be best suited outside of the blower.


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## allagashpm (Sep 29, 2012)

What is your budget like? Have you considered a plow for your truck instead?


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Plow for the truck was my first thought, but then everyone up here told me not to beat up my truck. It is the family vehicle, primarily used for 24 hr one-way drives to civilization and back, usually hauling/towing something back.

The other problem is sometimes I come home from one of those trips to a driveway with 2' or so of settled in snow. I could leave the plow at the bottom, but doubt plowing uphill would work so well. I could get a dedicated plow truck to drive down from the top, but really want the utility of a skid steer for other uses.

Budget is ~$21k Canadian. If I want to spend much more than that, I'll need to wait for next winter.


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

I would get a snow bucket first - then a V plow if you think the bucket is to slow. Put chains on two tires, 10 foot bucket and on small snows just use it like a plow. With 2 feet you may need to dig your way out. 
I would not buy a skidloader with 4500 hours unless it was real cheap and I had lot of time to fix it. Lots of parts to break.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks maxwellp. I was wondering about the 10 foot bucket; like you say, for small snows it wouldn't need to be emptied often if at all.

Skid comes with 4 chains (though only has back installed and I understand they don't like to stay on front tires too well during skid-steering), HLA SB78BO500 bucket, forks that still have most of their paint on, and a spare glass door.

Thanks for all the input; really appreciate it. I ran a Bobcat 763 and then Case 85XT for a few hundred hours years ago, but this is my first time looking at buying a piece of heavy equipment.

The hours do concern me some. Apparently it spent most of it's life idling between unloading bales of hay from trucks onto a conveyor inside a feedlot warehouse. It looks good, idles smooth, lift/tilt work smooth, and overall it seems to be in fairly good shape. No leaks I could find. I'm not sure how much this balances out the high hours. Asking price is $25k Canadian.

Only things I noticed that bugged me outside of those noted in previous posts are:

1 - Somewhere between 1800 and 2300 RPM it hits a resonant frequency in something in the control sticks--quite the racket if you're not holding onto them. Is this normal?

2 - There's a bit of a jerk when engaging push button float. Is that normal, or should it be engaging smoothly? Other than that, it seems to work well as long as you curl the bucket out at the end of the float. If you just go to lift the arm while floating before getting arm to bottom of stroke by curling out bucket, it gives the arm a bit of a jerky push down and then up (control direction is up the whole time, and it doesn't matter how gently I move towards up on the sticks). I still feel a bit of a jerk exiting float when arm is already at bottom, but much less pronounced. I'm not sure if this is all normal or not. During typical back drag floating, it's doesn't seem bad as curling out the bucket before lifting results in relatively smooth disengagement of float. It's been too long since I've driven another machine to compare. Does this sound normal, or like something is wrong?

3 - after parking brake is engaged and disengaged, it seems you need to back up slightly before going forwards to get brake to disengage. Would this be normal/easy fix/bigger problem?

4 - right side window latch mechanism is detaching from window (seems glued on), so it doesn't stay latched well, interior light probably needs a new bulb, and one of the back lights is missing a small piece of the lens.


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

3, yea that common.

Do you have other use for the machine?


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

What Year? That's $18,766.51 US 
What Engine?


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Likely uses on 21 acre wilderness property, not necessarily in order:
1 Clear driveway of snow
2 Maintain/improve badly neglected dirt/rock driveway and ditches, including taking sand/gravel from pit along driveway and spreading on driveway, hauling away stumps from removed trees we'll undercut in the process.
3 Unload and place pallets of stuff brought home
4 Move heavy stuff
5 Move dirt. Have some lower spots to fill in, some ground that we'd like to reshape, etc
6 Brush hog along driveway and ~10 acres of fields
7 Possibly run hydraulic feed chipper to chip a lot of pine branches, poplars, willow, etc, clearing out and thinning forest
8 Won't be surprised if it ends up taking part in one form or another in yearly harvest of 4-5 cords firewood
9 Pull old fence posts
10 Bury old rotting wood under rows in garden
11 Dig holes for adding fruit trees to garden
12 Assist in excavations/backfill for building barn, shop, and hopefully new house over next decade or so

If I had to wild-guess, I'll probably put 100-200 hours on it at most per year.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

2006 S300 T3 81 HP. It's also nearby, while anything else will be 10+ hr one-way drive away. I do have the truck and trailer to haul one in, but that costs a bit even doing it myself and it would be convenient if the one nearby is suitable.


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## allagashpm (Sep 29, 2012)

I really would consider a tractor personally if you don't want a plow for your truck. 
Sounds better suited to your needs but that's just my opinion.
Or widen your search. Just because it's the only one for sale in your area doesn't mean that's the one you should get.


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

Too Much / High hours
Here is one in Canada - 
http://www.machinerytrader.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=10970159
1654 Hours
$23750 CAD

Now that said In a fast check I found many with over 6000 hours.


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## jomama45 (Dec 25, 2008)

NorthernWild;2055663 said:


> Thanks maxwellp. I was wondering about the 10 foot bucket; like you say, for small snows it wouldn't need to be emptied often if at all.
> 
> Skid comes with 4 chains (though only has back installed and I understand they don't like to stay on front tires too well during skid-steering), HLA SB78BO500 bucket, forks that still have most of their paint on, and a spare glass door.
> 
> ...


1 - I have no idea, perhaps the handles need drive levers need to be adjusted.

2 - Yes, they're stiff on purpose, there's a detent built into them, and hardly anybody uses them.

3 - Is the e-brake a toggle switch above the front door? If so, I've never had one stick like that. The old mechanical foot pedal always sticks though, but I don't think Bobcat put those in this series, at least not as new as 2006.

4 - Easy fix, re glue the glass to the channel. The window units actually come out pretty easy.

I won't comment on price, as it may be hgh for the hours here, but your cost of living is ALOT higher than that here in the Midwest.

As for the hours, my first 2002 s250 was a farm unit that had 4000 hours on it when I bought it, and it was only a few years old. If it didn't have a Duetz, I might still own it.

I replaced it with a new one in 2007 and I think the only major things I've had to do was have the seals in one tilt cylinder replaced and I replaced one set of tires. I should have the injectors looked at soon, as it's startign to smoke a little. Not too bad for 2500 hours IMO. These machines were built to run a long time with llight use and decent maintanence...........


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Yes, I'm thinking I will want a tractor (better suited for some things), but I haven't been excited about tractor options for snow removal. Backing up to snow blow is not an option. Front mount is possible, but gets more complicated. And if you want to eliminate shear pins--and I do (lots of rocks)--, it gets even more complicated and no less expensive than a skid-steer snow blower. Heated cab is a must for snow removal, but not for anything else I plan to do. I've pretty well decided we're going to want two machines--and maybe three if we add a mini-excavator to the mix.

Plow truck is an option, but not on the main truck (won't help when I come home to bottom of driveway with 2' of settled snow). But a dedicated plow truck won't be useful for anything else I can think of.

I keep coming back to the skid-steer for the various attachments it can run and high lifting capacity. Tractor can do some of the same things with more economical attachments, but skid-steer is better for some (like blowing snow). Tractor can't lift the heavy stuff unless it's a big one that costs as much/more than a skid-steer. At least that's what I've gathered so far.

All that said, this may not be the right skid-steer for us. I just don't think a plow truck or tractor is really what we want either. I do appreciate all the input; good food for thought.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks maxwellp, my feeling was it's a bit high for the hours too. They may accept less. I did look around on machinerytrader and other sites and noted a lot of S300s are in the higher hour ranges. The one you linked is much lower on hours with a few less options. Depending on how it has been treated, it might be a good one.

I'm not sure how much lighter use compensates for higher hours, but am guessing some machines at 4000 hrs may be in better shape than others at 1500. Open to input on this.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks jomama45. Yes, e-brake is a toggle above the door. Now that you mention it, I think I do remember the same kind of behavior (half to back up a bit after releasing brake) on the old 763 I spent a fair bit of time in over a decade ago. I'm guessing this means something in the e-brake system could use some adjustment/lube, or something, but I'm not familiar with the system so that's just a guess.

On the float, just to make sure we're talking about the same thing, I'm talking about a jerk in the lift arms themselves (not ACS control sticks) on engagement, and the sudden down/up jerk on disengagement when not fully lowered is also in the lift arms. The one on disengagement is really obvious and quite surprising (it pushes the arms down a good bit in that split second), but becomes minor if arms are already all the way down as is usual if bucket is curled up at end of float like a guy typically would. I'm guessing this may be normal, as float seems to work fine, but thought I'd check.

Price does seem to vary a fair bit by location. Seems east coast of USA has the best pricing, but that's an awfully long ways away and our low dollar doesn't make buying in the US as attractive as it was a few years ago when I picked up the truck in Arizona for less than 2/3 of the best deals available in Canada for equivalent. BC, AB, and Yukon are all not that far away (well, within about 24 hrs drive one-way), and there's only so many machines advertised. I have wondered about an A300. Not familiar with them, or if the all wheel steer results in significantly increased operating costs.

Glad to hear your 4000 hr farm machine worked out well. Maybe this one would too. One thing I'm checking on now is one dealer told me presence of high flow switch meant it had high flow. I now understand that is not the necessarily so and will need to look into this a bit further. I think I'm going to want high flow for blower, and possibly brush hog (again, think I'd rather not be backing up while doing this). High flow for chipper too, except chipper is one attachment I think likely makes more sense on a tractor (back mounting is fine, and half the price for a higher capacity chipper with hydraulic feed).


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## jomama45 (Dec 25, 2008)

1- I think the e-brake is simply electric over hydraulic, not sure where there's any room for play in it.

2 - I wouldn't be too hung up on the float issue, as it's unlikely you'll ever use it. You won't be using it for plowing, even though it seems like you would. Trust me.

3 - All is can say is you've got slim pickings where you live, and it's less than an ideal time of year to be looking for a piece of equipment for snow removal. If you were to pay $1,2,3K more than buying something 24 hours away, you may still be ahead.

4 - They all have the 5 button set on the upper left hand control panel, lights - self-leveling - hi-flow - variable/max flow - aux. pressure dump. They also all have a thumb switch on the right drive lever for low & high speed. These switches ARE NOT indicators of the actual options. The quickest way to tell is the lettering on the side of the machines in back.

If you feel you have time to look for a machine, I'd personally try to find something with 2-3K hours, and a 2 speed, with cab & heat obviously, if you're willing to travel farther for it. Also, I wouldn't get too hung up on the blower, it might not work worth a darn if the driveway is as rough as you say. You can easily push the banks back with a bucket when it gets cramped, even if they've been piled all winter.....


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## 1olddogtwo (Aug 6, 2007)

jomama45;2056510 said:


> 1- I think the e-brake is simply electric over hydraulic, not sure where there's any room for play in it.
> 
> 2 - I wouldn't be too hung up on the float issue, as it's unlikely you'll ever use it. You won't be using it for plowing, even though it seems like you would. Trust me.
> 
> ...


Some good info right there.

Bobcat has always been my favorite skid, why aren't you looking at other manufacturers?


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks guys. Yeah, I'm starting to think if getting a skid-steer I really would like joystick or pilot controls to eliminate the long forward/reverse throw with the Bobcat ACS controls. I'm over 6' tall, but found I had to lean forwards to throw the levers all the way forwards. Even sitting at a desk working at a computer (day job), my back is happier leaning back in a chair, not leaning forwards. So, between the lack of joystick control, no 2-speed, no high flow, and higher hours, I think I'll pass on this one despite it being nearby.

I've spent a lot of time reading various other threads on this forum trying to wrap my mind around pros and cons of various options. I've gathered that while the big blowers--skid and PTO--will likely handle rocks better than my walk-behind, they still don't like them and occasionally they can do significant damage (saw a picture of a cracked skid-steer blower housing). I'm thinking maybe I don't need a blower. Watching videos of guys with snow scoops on skid-steers, I don't think I'll be real thrilled with that (due to spillage off sides) on the 1 km run down/up the driveway. This leaves plowing. Seems for plowing with skid-steer or tractor a Metal-Pless or other hydraulic wing plow might be ideal for both the long runs on the driveway and clearing the parking area up by the house.

I'm getting the impression that tractors are lower maintenance/operating cost as well as less depreciation than skid-steers.

Would I be crazy or regaining sanity to consider buying an L6060HSTCC and a Metal-Pless or similar hydraulic wing plow mounted on loader arms for the snow clearing, brush hogging fields (can go forward over stuff that's not too big, so backing for the job will be only first time on stuff that hasn't been cleared recently), etc? If I really want to add a blower, the inverse Normand option sounds like it works really well for driveways (read the whole switching to blowing thread). If I'm coming home to deeper settled snow, I may not be able to drive over the snow first with a 60 HP tractor like the L6060, but I'm thinking with plow on the front I could peel the top bit off with the plow and blow the rest. Am I missing something or on the right track?

The reason for L6060HSTCC is heated cab, 50+ PTO HP (for possible blower, wood-chipping, etc) and hydro-static drive (making it easy to operate for me, possibly my lovely wife, and definitely kids as they grow a bit--delegation is a good thing . JD 4066R also meets these specs, and base price in Canada looks lower right now, but I'm wondering if I'll want the mid-PTO option on the L6060... Is it good for anything besides mowing and front PTO blower? Does a mid-mount blower and bagger (to collect mulch) on L6060 make any sense for around 10 acres of gently sloping fields? Or should I forget the mid-PTO and consider Deere?

Thanks again for sharing your knowledge. I expect to be working in Calgary for a week shortly and am thinking I'll try to get in a Kubota and possibly Deere test-drive. I've never driven a tractor besides and ancient/rough TLB years ago which I think may have biased me too much against tractors (I found it a real chore to operate compared to skid-steer). I get the impression a modern HST tractor is an entirely different experience.

On the skid-steer front, I mainly was looking at Bobcat due to the one available locally and dealer 10 hrs away (no dealers closer) seems good (just based on talking with sales and a mechanic on the phone). After reading a lot more on here, if a skid-steer is the way to go, I think I'd lean towards CAT or Bobcat. JCB unit looks like a great idea, but I think I've only run into one guy using them in his fleet who likes them. With dealer support so far away, I'd want to be sure they've worked out the bugs before buying one of those.

Whatever I buy will likely stick around for a decade or more, so waiting a few months/year to get the right machine probably makes the most sense. L6060HSTCC, 4066R with cab, or?

Sorry for the long post... got lots of stuff rolling around the mind.


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## Rick547 (Oct 9, 2009)

Check this guy out. He has a similar machine and use to do commercial snow plowing. Plenty of videos on his site using it.


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## NorthernWild (Nov 15, 2015)

Thanks Rick. I'll check out Paul Short's videos.


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## maxwellp (Feb 16, 2013)

I would get a tractor first. I had a CASE tractor for years, then sold it and got a CASE 1840 and a L3710. But if I was going to have one or just start with one it would be a tractor.


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## BlackIrish (Dec 22, 2007)

This what you need for the long driveway.


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## SnoFarmer (Oct 15, 2004)

And a Boston terrier...


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## BlackIrish (Dec 22, 2007)

The Shepherd in the 3rd pic is the snow dog.
Little guy gets lost in soft snow & gets chilly lol


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