# New Fisher MM2 plow motor SPARKS



## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

The usual story, my plow stopped working. I took the cover off the motor and when the joy stick was employed the motor smoked. I took it off and it was seized. I ordered a new motor and installed it today. Had a lot of hope when I employed the joy stick but the solenoid started smoking and the wires got hot even though it did click. I was afraid it burnt out the new motor but when I took the cover off it looked ok and I could turn it. But I had to start somewhere so I disconnected the positive from the motor and left the negative on. I then took a wire connected to the fuse box and quickly touched the positive post on the motor. I expected it to spin, but it sparked instead. Obviously I didn't connect it. ANY ideas would be appreciated. Thank you.


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

First. That little "wire" you used is junk, you cant expect 100+ Amps to flow through a small wire?

Ck your grounds first, ck the big 2 pin plow plug. After that I would use jumper cables to try and get the plow to move... stand clear it might jerk in the wrong direction 
If the plow wont move with cables, your new motor is junk


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> The usual story, my plow stopped working. I took the cover off the motor and when the joy stick was employed the motor smoked. I took it off and it was seized. I ordered a new motor and installed it today. Had a lot of hope when I employed the joy stick but the solenoid started smoking and the wires got hot even though it did click. I was afraid it burnt out the new motor but when I took the cover off it looked ok and I could turn it. But I had to start somewhere so I disconnected the positive from the motor and left the negative on. I then took a wire connected to the fuse box and quickly touched the positive post on the motor. I expected it to spin, but it sparked instead. Obviously I didn't connect it. ANY ideas would be appreciated. Thank you.


First, where did you get the replacement motor? OEM or AM?

Second, if I am reading that correctly, you tried to jump the motor from the fuse box? Or did you mean to say that you tried to jump it from the battery? 'cuz, as @dieselss pointed out, you couldn't possibly have thought that touching a wire from the fuse box was going to spin the motor. As he said above, jumping from cables or a jump pack will tell you if the motor is still good.

The solenoid started smoking as soon as you pushed the joystick? Have you ruled out that the solenoid is bad? 'Cuz the solenoid shouldn't overheat that quickly even if the motor was junk. The fact that it "clicked" doesn't really tell you anything at all.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

As dieselss said, run jumper cables from the battery directly to the motor. And if the relay was smoking, replace it with the correct part. To many guys last year using the wrong parts chasing their tail for days.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Randall Ave said:


> As dieselss said, run jumper cables from the battery directly to the motor. And if the relay was smoking, replace it with the correct part. To many guys last year using the wrong parts chasing their tail for days.


But my buddy told me it's much better to just pick up a solenoid at NAPA. Those plow dealers are always trying to gouge you. Greedy bastards.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thank you all, and yes I'm afraid I did think a wire from the fuse box would turn the motor, sorry. Anyway, the motor for who asked was from The RopShop at theropshop.com. Yes the motor sounded like it was running with the jumper from the battery. The plow didn't move but it is on the ground. I will pick up a new solenoid tomorrow so to be continued.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> Thank you all, and yes I'm afraid I did think a wire from the fuse box would turn the motor, sorry. Anyway, the motor for who asked was from The RopShop at theropshop.com. Yes the motor sounded like it was running with the jumper from the battery. The plow didn't move but it is on the ground. I will pick up a new solenoid tomorrow so to be continued.


The plow would not NORMALLY move when jumped unless someone was also operating the controller to trigger the valves. But dieselss warned you because if a valve was stuck, the plow could unexpectedly move in any direction

Also, I swear I am not saying this to be snarky, but if you expected the plow to run with a tiny wire from the fuse box, you should consider just taking it to a professional for repair


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

If I could afford it I would have sent it out for service a long time ago. I assume the purpose of this site is to help people that might be proficient in other things but not necessarily snow plows. But I didn't take it as snarky. There's another issue that is irrelevant but I need to get the truck inspected to drive it anywhere anyway, and cannot be inspected with the plow on. And I don't want to take the plow off until it's working. And it won't go up!

Btw what I have done so far is wash and clean all the pins in the connections. Found that the power wire to the joystick controller was dead and replaced that. Found a blown inline fuse by the power module. And changed the oil and cleaned the screens while I had it apart.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> If I could afford it I would have sent it out for service a long time ago. I assume the purpose of this site is to help people that might be proficient in other things but not necessarily snow plows. But I didn't take it as snarky. There's another issue that is irrelevant but I need to get the truck inspected to drive it anywhere anyway, and cannot be inspected with the plow on. And I don't want to take the plow off until it's working. And it won't go up!
> 
> Btw what I have done so far is wash and clean all the pins in the connections. Found that the power wire to the joystick controller was dead and replaced that. Found a blown inline fuse by the power module. And changed the oil and cleaned the screens while I had it apart.


Ok then, replace the relay, or solenoid, with the correct part. Clean all the battery connections. Don't assume they are clean. The plow battery cable, clean them with electrical cleaner, then spread the pins with a small screwdriver. The multiple pin connector, clean with electrical cleaner. Then blow dry with compressed air.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Randall Ave said:


> Ok then, replace the relay, or solenoid, with the correct part. Clean all the battery connections. Don't assume they are clean. The plow battery cable, clean them with electrical cleaner, then spread the pins with a small screwdriver. The multiple pin connector, clean with electrical cleaner. Then blow dry with compressed air.


Thank you Randall, I had already spread the pins and did use electrical cleaner after soaking the connections in Dawn to clean off the grease. I'll be getting the solenoid this morning and let you know!


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Good morning,
I wish I had good news. When I employ the joy stick in any direction the plow doesn't move. However the motor runs and jerks indicating it is spinning. I'm assuming now both the motor and solenoid are good as are the truck-side electronics?


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

Now it's time to test light the coils while operating the controller. Remove the output pos wire at the solenoid, and rubber band the clicker u, l and r and see if the test light lights at the coils.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thanks Dieselss. By the OUTPUT POSITIVE wire at the solenoid I'm assuming you mean one of the small terminals? I just tested them and with the ignition on shouldn't one small terminal register hot?
Also I'm wondering if you can tell me if the relief valves should be screwed in as tight as they'll go?
thanks again,
mike


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> Thanks Dieselss. By the OUTPUT POSITIVE wire at the solenoid I'm assuming you mean one of the small terminals?


No, he means the big red wire going to the grill plug. That way the motor doesn't stay running while you are trying to test it.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> just tested them and with the ignition on shouldn't one small terminal register hot?


No.



Mikerugg said:


> Also I'm wondering if you can tell me if the relief valves should be screwed in as tight as they'll go?


No.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Update: I hung a nail on a string from the frame hanging down in front of the coils. When employing the controls, facing the truck the coil on the left (blue wire) and the middle coil (green wire) had magnetism but the right coil (white) did not. Would that actually be the problem because the plow doesn't move up or angle?

Thanks for the answer on the relief valves, I remember now they have to be backed off x amount of turns.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

The white wire is the lower valve. It would only be magnetized if it was in float.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Gads you guys know a lot. Anyway I tried the magnetism test on the white wire coil while pulling the stick down to float and nothing.
So back to the original test as Dieselss suggested. Disconnected the solenoid wire feeding the 2 plug connector to the motor. Pinned the control lever in the left, right, and up position while inserting the tester prong into each of the 3 coil wires. Nothing registered on the tester.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

Stupid question, you do have it full of fluid? When the motor runs, does it sound like it is free wheeling, or struggling?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> Gads you guys know a lot. Anyway I tried the magnetism test on the white wire coil while pulling the stick down to float and nothing.
> So back to the original test as Dieselss suggested. Disconnected the solenoid wire feeding the 2 plug connector to the motor. Pinned the control lever in the left, right, and up position while inserting the tester prong into each of the 3 coil wires. Nothing registered on the tester.


I think the two wire battery cable needs to be connected, as the big ground cable completes the ground circuit for the valves also, but I could be wrong.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Not stupid to me. But yes I drained the fluid and refilled with new Fisher fluid until it flowed out of the fill hole. I know sometimes the system needs to bleed but since the plow hasn't moved all the hoses must till be full.
The motor is new and all I know is it sounds like it's running and shakes while getting power.
I don't know why it seems there's no power to the coil wires since power does get to the motor.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Ok, 2 new tests and I won't pretend to know what it means.
1. Re-connected the solenoid wire going to the motor. Then put the tester prong into each coil wire and operated the stick. the motor ran but nothing registered on the meter. Not to forget 2 out of 3 had magnetism. 
2. Put the tester prong onto each of the 2 small solenoid terminals and operated the stick. the brown/red wired terminal had power, the black/orange wired terminal had nothing. Again I don't know what any of this means.


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

Let's start here.
Blk/org is ground for the whole system.
So If you clamp the test lead on batt positive and touch the probe to the blk/org wires the test light should light.
So start there, at the plow motor there should be a small wire that goes to the coils, test them and see if you have ground


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thanks Dieselss. 
"clamp the test lead on batt positive and touch the probe to the blk/org wires the test light should light" YES
Then there is a small blk/org wire going from the coil with the blue wire to the middle coil. Both ends light the meter
Then there is a blk/org wire going from the motor ground, which lights the meter, and goes into the harness.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

So it appears all grounds are ok from the above tests. I don't want to hurt anything so I'm wondering what would happen or if there would be anything to gain from putting a jumper cable from the battery and touching each coil wire?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

Go to the Radio Shack, or hardware store and get a few sets of alligator clip leads. Handy to have. Run power to the up valve. Then energize the solenoid, stay clear of the plow.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Randall Ave said:


> Go to the Radio Shack


Should he stop by the time machine store first?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

cwren2472 said:


> Should he stop by the time machine store first?


I think there's still one around here.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

I don't recall if I already posted this here or another thread


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thank you everyone, going to get alligator clips! 
(I think what's bothering me is power to the motor operating the joy stick, but I couldn't get any voltage to register at the coils, and the grounds tested good)


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

You can try home deeps, don't do snap on, close to 60.00 for a set. But they are nice.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Randall Ave said:


> You can try home deeps, don't do snap on, close to 60.00 for a set. But they are nice.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thanks Randall, are you talking about a new set of 3 coils?


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

No, the test leads


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

I really apologize but will this be different than clipping one end of a jumper cable to a coil with the wire removed and touching the battery with the other end?


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mikerugg said:


> I really apologize but will this be different than clipping one end of a jumper cable to a coil with the wire removed and touching the battery with the other end?


it does the same thing, but if you are trying to use jumper cables on the tiny little spade connectors, you are just as likely to accidentally contact both posts, not make a good connection on one post, or slip off entirely as you are to actually test it correctly so it's better to use the right tools rather than test it and not know if you did it right


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Thanks now I understand. I'll be trying that this morning.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

These plows are more complicated than building a house.
Anyway, when the battery is connected directly to each coil, each one clicks and is magnetized. However the plow does not budge. I don't know what's left to try!


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

So you ran s power and ground jumper lead to each coil, one at a time. Then ran the motor, still nothing. Is the motor straining or freewheeling? You sure the filter didn't fall off the pump, she's sucking air.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

I ran power to each coil one at a time and got the click, do you mean I was then suppose to use the joy stick to power the motor? I didn't do that.
When I run the motor it sounds just like it would if the plow were moving. 
I was thinking about the pump as another option, but I had the canister off when I cleaned the screen and it seemed well inserted when I put the canister back on.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

I need to get on my laptop, not the phone.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

OK, here's the best way for me to splain it to you. The other guys are better at this. You did get a set of alligator leads? At the magnets, there are two terminals. Remove all the hot leads from the magnets. Run a ground wire to the ground terminal at the magnet, to a known good ground source on the truck, preffrebly the batter Neg. terminal. Now run a positive lead from the battery to say the lift valve, see the diagram listed before. You should hear a click sound. Go in the truck. Key on, the controller lights up. Hit the raise function. All you are doing at this point there is running the Hyd. motor. The plow should raise. If I am wrong, Crewn or Dieselss will chime in, been a long couple days here.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

It went up! (actually it went up whether I put the stick up, left or right). Seems like progress?
I know all of you are taking a good deal of time for this and I greatly appreciate it.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

It will only go up because if you followed those instructions then you disconnected the control from the valves. Add another jumper lead to the valve on the right (without removing the one going to the middle) and it should angle left. If so, that means your valves are working and you have a problem in the control harnesses


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

By chance do you know how to use an OHM meter. Most of the time the problem is in, or by the multi pin connector, how many plugs again?


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

dieselss said:


> Now it's time to test light the coils while operating the controller. Remove the output pos wire at the solenoid, and rubber band the clicker u, l and r and see if the test light lights at the coils.


Did you ever do this yet?


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Hi Randall,
The connection I made was to the lift valve on the right according to the chart, the blue wire, with the middle and left valve disconnected as you said.
Yes I use an ohm meter frequently for wiring problems on my boat. By multi-pin connector do you mean the 2 pin harness, the 9 pin, etc. Or the 6 pin toggle controller connector?


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Hi Dieselss, yes we tried that. I inserted the positive meter lead to each coil connector (and the negative grounded of course) and operated the controller. I didn't get any reading on any of the coils, but did get magnetism for whatever that's worth. And the test for good grounds you had me do were ok.
I have to be honest, just getting the blade to raise after all this time was like a miracle!


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

OK let me try to explain what I just tried even tho I can't say yet that I understand it.
1. disconnected all 3 coil wires.
2. Connected a ground from the battery to the ground on the right coil (the blue wire coil)
3. connected power from the battery to the right coil (blue wire coil). Operated the controller and plow went up in all three positions, up-left-right.
4. with ground jumper still attached and all coil wires still disconnected, I connected a jumper from the battery to the middle coil. it clicked, but operating the controller, the motor ran but no blade movement.
5. Under the same conditions, I then touched the power lead from the battery to the left coil (white wire coil) and the blade went down without operating the controller.
Are we frustrated yet?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

First, go on the manufacturer site, get the repair manuel. Read it, it will give you some understanding on what is happening during each commanded function. The plow dropped cause it is a gravity down design. The motor don't run on the down function. The multi pin is the 9 pin at the grill, that's where they mostly fail. You can get repair ends for those.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

At least my post count is going up.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Glad to help!
Anyway, I know the motor doesn't activate for the down function. I was only explaining what happened when I energized the left white wire coil. Those are the tests you suggested.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Curious why you have an insta-act pump with a 9 pin plug


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

Don't really understand that. Bought the truck 3 years ago and that's what it had. To be honest I've plowed for over 40 years, most of the time for myself or small residential routes and friends. Never had a plow problem. But this is my first minute-mount, all my other plows were the conventional ones with the pump under the hood. Never had a problem.


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

cwren2472 said:


> Curious why you have an insta-act pump with a 9 pin plug


Without seeing it, there could be a tech term for it, MUTT. Not busting the OP, but without much more info, well, ya no. Unhook the controller 6 pin, ohm out the harness at the pump at the three magnets with the wires off. If ya got nothing, go to the truck side of the 9 pin. Ohm out that. And what I do sometimes, I will use a headlamp for a test lamp so I am using more amperage draw.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

So I've ordered a new plow side and truck side 9-pin harness, not very expensive. By the process of elimination that seems like the next logical step because:
1. coils respond to direct current without wires connected.
2. when i insert the voltmeter prong into any of the coil connectors and operate the toggle there is no reading.
3. motor is new and runs so power through the 2-prong connector is ok, as is the solenoid. 
4. all grounds tested were ok.
5. fluid canister and screen were cleaned and new fluid and pickup properly inserted. I believe that activating the coil causing the plow to lift shows hydraulics are not the problem.
6. dead power wire to controller replaced and all fuses checked. One blown inline fuse replaced.
7. not ruling out the controller being faulty.
new harness coming Wednesday. Stay tuned.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

I made a big mistake. My harness is 11 pin, not 9. Much more expensive for both ends.


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## Mikerugg (Sep 5, 2018)

I found a break in the 3-pin harness. Repaired it and the plow functions fine. Something so simple and I probably never needed a new motor!
Anyway I learnt quite a bit about the way a plow functions and the hydraulics and electrical components. I want to thank all of you that were nice enough to take the time and do your best to help, and I'm sure working with a novice can be demanding. This is a great site. Have a safe and prosperous winter all.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Glad to hear you got it working!


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

cwren2472 said:


> Glad to hear you got it working!


Should we send him a bill?


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Randall Ave said:


> Should we send him a bill?


Do we charge by the hour or by the post?


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## dieselss (Jan 3, 2008)

cwren2472 said:


> Do we charge by the hour or by the post?


Just like a lawyer, by the thought?


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## Randall Ave (Oct 29, 2014)

dieselss said:


> Just like a lawyer, by the thought?


There ya go.


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