# What to use to prevent ice?



## AO8 (Nov 17, 2009)

I use salt but customers complain after the snow and ice dry up that they have salt stains on their concrete, does this hurt the concrete? or should i use something else that wont hurt the pavement if the salt does? thanks in advance


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## Advantage (Nov 7, 2007)

They are complaining about "salt stains"? Tell them its just residue and that it is proof that you are doing a good job. The salt vs concrete debate has been beaten to death if you'd like to search it on here.


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## AO8 (Nov 17, 2009)

Advantage;1104031 said:


> They are complaining about "salt stains"? Tell them its just residue and that it is proof that you are doing a good job. The salt vs concrete debate has been beaten to death if you'd like to search it on here.


Yeah I've noticed all the posts lol, they don't really give a clear winner tho, I guess I'm just wondering if the salt hurts the concrete or not, like will it make it erode or crack easier, customers ask me that ALL the time


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## Rc2505 (Feb 5, 2007)

Just switch to a calcium mix for concrete surfaces. There are many available, but you have to pay for it. So in turn if your customer is asking for you to change, then I would safely assume that same customer isn't going to mind the extra charges to do what they want. It all just means extra dollars in your pocket. I don't get what the problem is.


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## AO8 (Nov 17, 2009)

Theres not really a problem, im just wondering if salt will hurt the concrete over time, like corode it. if it does then i would go to a calcium but if it doesnt then ill just tell the customers that it wont hurt anything. I just dont want to lie to them and say salt wont hurt the concrete if it actually will


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## PTSolutions (Dec 8, 2007)

the salt doesnt corrode the concrete. rock salt lowers freezing point of water, so the ice turns to water and then gets absorbed into tiny cracks of the concrete. it then freezes and expands which cracks the concrete. so its the natural freeze thaw cycle accelerated by rock salt that damages concrete.

calcium chloride reacts with the ice to create heat, melting the ice and helping it to evaporate therefore leaving less water to get into the concrete to re-freeze.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

AO8;1104270 said:


> Theres not really a problem, im just *wondering if salt will hurt the concrete over time, *like corode it. if it does then i would go to a calcium but if it doesnt then ill just tell the customers that it wont hurt anything. I just dont want to lie to them and say salt wont hurt the concrete if it actually will


No. Salt is no worse or better than calcium if used properly.


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## AO8 (Nov 17, 2009)

Ok Thanks alot for the replies!


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

cretebaby;1106473 said:


> No. Salt is no worse or better than calcium if used properly.


Wait a Minute....I thought salt Ate Concrete...


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

Matson Snow;1107015 said:


> Wait a Minute....I thought salt Ate Concrete...


Only if it is hungry. :waving:


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

salt is bad for new concrete and stamped acid stained concrete. I dont know from experience but this is what I've heard.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107185 said:


> salt is bad for new concrete and stamped acid stained concrete. I dont know from experience but this is what I've heard.


Well that is a big help.


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

BOSS TOY;1107185 said:


> salt is bad for new concrete and stamped acid stained concrete. I dont know from experience but this is what I've heard.


............Nevermind......Im too tired..


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107234 said:


> Well that is a big help.


yeah and your a big help too


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107234 said:


> Well that is a big help.


So mr helpful are you saying you would go and salt someones new stamped acid stained concrete that cost them $ 75,000, when there are other products available, without giving it a second thought? I have heard the chemical used to allow the acid to absorbe will do the exact same with salt It will absorb it. Obviousely you are trying to make yourself look smarter by making me look dumber, Good luck to you.:realmad:


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107185 said:


> dont know from experience but this is what I've heard.


Since you don't have any first hand experience what have you heard that would work good instead?:laughing:


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## creativedesigns (Sep 24, 2007)

BOSS TOY;1107307 said:


> So mr helpful.... Obviousely you are trying to make yourself look smarter by making me look dumber, Good luck to you.:realmad:


HaHAHAHA, I think Cretebaby needs the best of luck! :laughing:


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107548 said:


> Since you don't have any first hand experience what have you heard that would work good instead?:laughing:


I'm not sure, I have left it to the homeowner to supply me with ice melter. I assume it will be some sort of fertilizer based product. If I have to I will talk to the people who installed the driveway to see what they recomend. I dont want to use salt if I dont have to, at least if the homeowner supplies it I'm off the hook.tymusic


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

creativedesigns;1107563 said:


> HaHAHAHA, I think Cretebaby needs the best of luck! :laughing:


Maybe we could use some HulkSalt on it. :waving:


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107608 said:


> I'm not sure, I have left it to the homeowner to supply me with ice melter. I assume it will be some sort of fertilizer based product. If I have to I will talk to the people who installed the driveway to see what they recomend. I dont want to use salt if I dont have to, at least if the homeowner supplies it I'm off the hook.tymusic


Like Potash?


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

cretebaby;1107611 said:


> Like Potash?


Add some Urea and you are gonna have a nice Green Patio.......:waving:


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107611 said:


> Like Potash?


Sounds expensive. I have some organic ice melter which is safe for plants so it cant be salt. Not sure what ti is. I suppose if I had to choos between salt and any old fertilizer I have kicking around I would try the old fertilizer first. Evergro Canada sells icemelter I havent bought any but it is not salt, I think it is fertilizer. I relly dont know though. I'm just trying to be part of the conversation, learn something, and work toward becomeing a senior memberwesport


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

Matson Snow;1107615 said:


> Add some Urea and you are gonna have a nice Green Patio.......:waving:


Add some diesel and you could just blow it off.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107620 said:


> Sounds expensive. I have some organic ice melter which is safe for plants so it cant be salt. Not sure what ti is. I suppose if I had to choos between salt and any old fertilizer I have kicking around I would try the old fertilizer first. Evergro Canada sells icemelter I havent bought any but it is not salt, I think it is fertilizer. I relly dont know though. I'm just trying to be part of the conversation, learn something, and work toward becomeing a senior memberwesport


So you scold me for using salt but would use "any old fertilizer I have kicking around " without even really knowing what it is?


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107626 said:


> So you scold me for using salt but would use "any old fertilizer I have kicking around "?


Did I scold you? I didn't know you were Canadian at the time. I would be hesitant to use salt in this case but I would also be asking someone like yourself what my other options are. I have never used fertilizer but if it works what is the harm in using it in moderation.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107637 said:


> Did I scold you? I didn't know you were Canadian at the time. I would be hesitant to use salt in this case but I would also be asking someone like yourself what my other options are. I have never used fertilizer but if it works what is the harm in using it in moderation.


Could you say the same about salt?


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

cretebaby;1107709 said:


> Could you say the same about salt?


I say Yes...But..If you use to Mulch Salt it will eat the concrete...I also hear some brands of salt are Mulch more hungry than others....This is what i hear...:waving:


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

Matson Snow;1107721 said:


> I say Yes...But..If you use to Mulch Salt it will eat the concrete...I also hear some brands of salt are Mulch more hungry than others....This is what i hear...:waving:


How about fertilizer, does it eat mulch?pumpkin:


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107709 said:


> Could you say the same about salt?


How do you know how much salt to use?


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107726 said:


> How do you know how much salt to use?


220, 221 what ever it takes. :laughing:


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## Matson Snow (Oct 3, 2009)

cretebaby;1107728 said:


> 220, 221 what ever it takes. :laughing:


:laughing::laughing:



cretebaby;1107725 said:


> How about fertilizer, does it eat mulch?pumpkin:


No..Fertilizer does not eat Mulch at all...Its a lite eater...


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

cretebaby;1107728 said:


> 220, 221 what ever it takes. :laughing:


what is 220 ,221


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

This is why I like liquid, you can dump 1,000 gallons in a 5ft area and no stains. As far as stains go.....they are usually caused by too much salt. Use less salt. You aren't the mad salter are you?, using a 50lb bag for a 10 foot sidewalk? Unless you are and do the previous statement I would let it go and tell them it is what it is, I mean come on a few little white stains.


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

cretebaby;1107728 said:


> 220, 221 what ever it takes. :laughing:


Good one! :laughing:


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## creativedesigns (Sep 24, 2007)

BOSS TOY;1107745 said:


> what is 220 ,221


....222 granules of treated rock salt to be exact!


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

Brian Young;1107761 said:


> This is why I like liquid, you can dump 1,000 gallons in a 5ft area and no stains. As far as stains go.....they are usually caused by too much salt. Use less salt. You aren't the mad salter are you?, using a 50lb bag for a 10 foot sidewalk? Unless you are and do the previous statement I would let it go and tell them it is what it is, I mean come on a few little white stains.


Can I make my own liquid easily?


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

Are all the threads this vague and hard to follow?::salute:


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BOSS TOY;1107745 said:


> what is 220 ,221


 It's from a movie probably made before you where born. Google Mr Mom.



BOSS TOY;1107825 said:


> Are all the threads this vague and hard to follow?::salute:


Hang around a while you will get up to speed.


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## BOSS TOY (Oct 31, 2010)

Mr Mom rings a bell. Thanks.


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## Kubota 8540 (Sep 25, 2009)

BOSS TOY;1107825 said:


> Are all the threads this vague and hard to follow?::salute:


Absolutely not, some are even more vague and totally useless in following. :laughing:

I do like the adding diesel fuel idea though.

In the last 2 years I have been using a lot more liquid, saving some big bucks in doing so, and no leftover stains.


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## Brian Young (Aug 13, 2005)

BOSS TOY;1107819 said:


> Can I make my own liquid easily?


You can make it but not "easily". Just use less salt. I dont know if I would use liquid on sidewalks only because the rock salt gives you traction until the ice melts off, but thats just me.


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## REAPER (Nov 23, 2004)

AO8;1104027 said:


> I use salt but customers complain after the snow and ice dry up that they have salt stains on their concrete, does this hurt the concrete? or should i use something else that wont hurt the pavement if the salt does? thanks in advance


Have you ever seen how much salt they pour on the roads and highways around here?

As long as the surface is sealed good and no cracks you should be good.


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## monson770 (Dec 18, 2010)

i use rock salt every year, concrete seems to handle it fine, it's alsphalt you want to worry about IMO, i see my driveway wash away a lil every year it seems like...

as far as the stains are concerned, use less salt. it is hard to know how much to use when snow is still coming down, but after a while of trial and error you should get a feel for how much to put down.. maybe using a good walk behind spreader will help you be more consistant? 

i switch between the spreader and using a 5 gallon bucket with a big scooper and spreading by hand, it's nice when you have stairs, but time consuming if you have a long run of sidewalk (spreading by hand that is)...

i may be the mad salter, but i have never had anyone fall. and the old ladys that visit the coffee shop i do say i have the cleanest sidewalks in town.. and you know how the old ladys talk amoungst eachother...payup


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