# What do I need to keep my 2.5 mile gravel road clear?



## Jedon

I live off grid in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada's in northern California. 
It is 2.5 miles up a winding gravel road to pavement where they plow. 
A few times a winter we get a really heavy snow storm that dumps 3-5 feet in a few days, 2 inches an hour isn't uncommon. 
I have a tracked Recreatives Max II 6x6 with tracks and a v-plow, it has kind of worked the last 2 years but pushing it has taken its toll and it has broken down many times this year, broken chains, snapped axle, melted drive belts etc. 
I also have a 70HP Massey Ferguson MF50E 2WD tractor with a 4/1 bucket but it doesn't like slopes and doesn't have much traction even though I have chains on it. 
I would like something that is useful year round for all the kind of things you would want to do on 100 acres in the woods so a SnoCat doesn't fit the bill. 
I thought perhaps something like a track hoe with a snowblower like a JD 450B but they are so large I'd have a hard time manueving around the house just like I do with the tractor ( has a gannon box hanging off the back ).
A 4x4 tractor might work but my neighbor got his 110HP 4x4 chained up loader stuck in my driveway and had to have a Cat D4H pull him out. 
Perhaps an ASV MTL with a blower and plow and those new extreme terrain tracks?
Cheaper the better of course. 
Please help, wife has had it up to here and beyond! This is now our 12th day of being snowed in, in November it was 15 days. 
Thanks!!


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## grandview

Move away for the winter? Sounds like you need one of those loaders with the snow blower on it!


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## pmorrissette

something like this would probably work:


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## pmorrissette

or build a garage where the driveway meets the asphalt, then buy a SkiDoo.


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## festerw

One of these would probably work lol

http://www.truckntrailer.com/trucks...8764/325/1982-oshkosh-w_700_15r-for-sale.html


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## 32vld

Even though it's only 2wd do you use tractor weights to get better traction?

Do you plow with the storm?

Why wait till the snow piles up more then your equipment can handle?

Plowing every two or four inches is better then waiting for the storm to stop. Better to plow every hour then snowed in for fifteen days.


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## Jedon

> Move away for the winter?


Not an option.



> build a garage where the driveway meets the asphalt, then buy a SkiDoo.


We don't own the land there, it's a state park. I borrowed a ski-doo, it kept getting stuck in all the powder.



> something like this would probably work:


Yep, but it costs what, $60-70K? Also my back does not appreciate going backwards much.



> One of these would probably work lol


Probably but $48K and single purpose :-(



> Even though it's only 2wd do you use tractor weights to get better traction?


The wheels are filled with water, the problem is that the front wheels get stuck since they aren't drive wheels. I also lose the ability to steer when pushing.



> Do you plow with the storm?


With the 6x6, yes I did, that's the only way it could handle it but even that was too much for it over time.



> Why wait till the snow piles up more then your equipment can handle?


This is of course a good idea and I do it when possible. This last storm dumped 3ft in 24 hours!



> Plowing every two or four inches is better then waiting for the storm to stop. Better to plow every hour then snowed in for fifteen days.


Yes I agree, still need something that can do that though, if it's a plow like I have on the 6x6 the snow piles up on the sides and then there is no place to put the new snow. That's why I was thinking a blower would be good.

I had thought a MTL with a smaller blower and a plow could get it done, I would keep up on it and do a foot at a time.

With a loader or tractor it's tricky sometimes because the sides of the road can be soft and very steep so rolling off is a danger.


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## GL&M

If you can't make any of the options work it sounds like you're screwed.


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## Chris112lee

Sounds like you need a snowblower with that amount of snow


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## Chiputz

What about something like this?


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## Dakota Dave

I would hang a snowblower on the 3pt of the tractor you allready have. The weight on the back would do wonders for your traction. Keep the chains , the front loader should give you plenty of wieght for steering. Prefrably a pull type blower you can drive through an amazing amount of snow and blow it out into the woods. Blowing the snow out will keep the road edge from building up and causing worse drifting on the next snow. I need to blow mine out after 24" or I can't drive through. then I need to use the back up blower and back out the drive its a lot slower and I would not want to back 2 1/2 miles unless I really had to.


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## klaus

I'm in a similar situation with about 1 mile of road to my house and I get about 500 inches a year in snowfall. (we're already at 559" for this year. (http://www.skisolitude.com/mountain/mountain_report.php) So it's a significant job, and I have other maintenance that needs to be done in the summer. After quite a bit of research, I settled on a Bobcat with a blower (Erskine 73" )and I am very happy with the results. The Bobcat clears snow well with an out and back, and I can use it in the off season to do other tasks like grading, moving rocks, etc. I have an S185, turbo, high flow (which you'll need if you are blowing snow). Be prepared to do some simple maintenance on your machine and you are good to go. Here's a few videos of me blowing my driveway:











Kinda gives you an idea of the amount of snow I get to deal with. But it's actually kinda fun.


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## justme-

FWIW if the snowmobile you borrowed got stuck in powder there are 2 solutions- 1st is get some practice riding in powder- most sleds will handle powder with an experienced rider, 2nd get a mountain sled which are designed and outfitted specifically for riding in powder and fresh accumulation.
Park or not, you might be able to make arrangements with the park to still have a garage or shed to park in and sled between them- it's done alot.

I agree a blower is the best bet- I can see how 2inches per hour would get ahead of you even if you started with 2 inches down. If a 3pt blower bothers you driving backwards, get a loader mounted blower and put more weight on the 3 point - make sure you have good snow capable tires, not general traction tires or turf tires and purpose ice/snow chains. (http://www.babactirechains.com/babac_stud_models.html).
Tires should be calcium (chloride I think) filled, not water - calcium won't freeze.
The other option is a small dozer. 
Good family friend up in Maine in the mountains used to sled out the 10 miles like everyone else up there until he came across a good deal on a trail groomer- at which time he started grooming the snowmobile trail in the area and all the way up the property - then a sled worked fine no powder issues on groomed trail. After a few years he bought a small dozer- JD450 and started plowing the road all the way out - lots of work but doable. Mind you this is mountain area and logging roads. I would recommend modifying the track grousers to prevent side sliding on ice (they tend to act like ice skates sideways).


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## Jedon

Dakota Dave, Unfortunately my tractor is an industrial model and doesn't have a PTO so that's not an option. I could get a bobcat type hydraulic blower and mount it somehow I suppose.

Chiputz, Not a bad idea! Funny the guy who plowed our road yesterday with a Cat D4H suggested that as well.

Klaus, wow!! That looks like a sweet setup and if it works for you it should work for me, thank you!

Justme, yes I am a n00b on a snowmobile and wouldn't have as many problems if I was a better rider. My tracked 6x6 would get me around just fine if I stopped plowing with it though and as a bonus the wife would actually drive it, unlike a snowmobile. I think some kind of blower is in our future for sure.

This looks handy: http://goldcountry.craigslist.org/grd/2280711010.html

Could Go Big or Go Home: http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/grd/2293417460.html but it would probably tear up the road and washboard it.

Maybe something like this http://reno.craigslist.org/grd/2278497932.html ( maybe a larger one would be better )
with this http://reno.craigslist.org/tls/2284735968.html


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## jb1390

Couldn't do it with a truck and a v plow with chains on 4 wheels?


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## Jedon

> Couldn't do it with a truck and a v plow with chains on 4 wheels?


Maybe could, the issue is that it's a gravel road that tilts this way and that way etc so would need 6 way movement probably and a setup like that approaches a piece of equipment that could do more than one thing.

We do have a 1995 Pathfinder that could probably do the trick, maybe that with a cheaper used plow could be part of the equation.


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## jb1390

A pickup truck would have lots of uses during all seasons-and you could get one for a lot less money than heavy equipment. A v plow with full movement will only run you around 5 grand new-less if you can find one used. Check out some of Alaska Boss's threads to see what he does with his boss v-plow to give you an idea of what it is capable of. Without seeing pictures of your driveway, it's tough to determine exactly what you'd need. His threads have a lot of info and pictures though, that could help you make a decision.

Here is one:
http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=89122


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## Jedon

I watched a video of an RC-30 with one of those cool v-plows on it, looked great! The snow here gets so heavy ( Sierra Cement ) 
Some pictures might help!


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## Jedon




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## Chiputz

> Chiputz, Not a bad idea! Funny the guy who plowed our road yesterday with a Cat D4H suggested that as well


 My Buddy has a Hanson Snow Pump on his truck. We get on average 325 inches if snowfall per year with some storms dumping upwards of 2 feet at a time with severe drifting. He just puts the truck in low range in low gear and idles around blowing everything. I believe Hanson went under but there are others making them. If I had a chance, my plow would be a lawn ornament and I'd have a blower on my truck.

Are you sure you don't live in Upper Michigan? You pics look real familiar. lol


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## justme-

Don't take offense to the snowmobile comment - I have a little seat time in powder on one, my BIL does not and until I cut him a few paths this season in the yard (and got stuck a few times) he was hopelessly stuck in the powder.

A dozer would be a good tool to recut/grade the road level (side to side), then resurface it (to avoid the mud). That would make it easier on anything that was used to plow. With banks like those I'm not convinced anything shy of a blower or a dozer would work long, especially without the capability to shelf the banks or the space to push them back into. A vblade on a dozer maybe...

Also, if your tractor has hydraulic outs, and enough flow a PTO is unnecessary- blowers are also made with hydraulic motors. Some have pony motors (I think Hanson was a self contained pony motor for trucks).
All in all, talking to the park service about parking out there and using the 6wheel to get to the car would be the cheapest in the long run.


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## Jedon

Oh no offense taken! I know I'm somewhere below a rank amateur on one  Just kind of hard to bring back 20g of diesel and groceries on a snowmobile. The 6x6 could do it though and has, I just call a friend and have them pick me up at the top. 
This year was very unusual in the amount of snow so it's not always this bad but prepare for the worst right?
I could fab a skidsteer style mount on the tractor to run a hydraulic snowblower but I don't trust that it wouldn't get stuck. 
I'm going to keep my eye out for a cheap skidsteer and snowblower, that combined with a track hoe/dozer would get a lot of jobs done!


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## leon

*cascade concrete et. al.*



Jedon;1272925 said:


> I live off grid in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada's in northern California.
> It is 2.5 miles up a winding gravel road to pavement where they plow.
> A few times a winter we get a really heavy snow storm that dumps 3-5 feet in a few days, 2 inches an hour isn't uncommon.
> I have a tracked Recreatives Max II 6x6 with tracks and a v-plow, it has kind of worked the last 2 years but pushing it has taken its toll and it has broken down many times this year, broken chains, snapped axle, melted drive belts etc.
> I also have a 70HP Massey Ferguson MF50E 2WD tractor with a 4/1 bucket but it doesn't like slopes and doesn't have much traction even though I have chains on it.
> I would like something that is useful year round for all the kind of things you would want to do on 100 acres in the woods so a SnoCat doesn't fit the bill.
> I thought perhaps something like a track hoe with a snowblower like a JD 450B but they are so large I'd have a hard time manueving around the house just like I do with the tractor ( has a gannon box hanging off the back ).
> A 4x4 tractor might work but my neighbor got his 110HP 4x4 chained up loader stuck in my driveway and had to have a Cat D4H pull him out.
> Perhaps an ASV MTL with a blower and plow and those new extreme terrain tracks?
> Cheaper the better of course.
> Please help, wife has had it up to here and beyond! This is now our 12th day of being snowed in, in November it was 15 days.
> Thanks!!


Good afternoon Jedon,

I have read your posting and the responses with great interest on my part with regard to your brand of "Cascade Concrete".

Your situation is not unique with regard to the snow types and and snow pack melt during the sunlight hours.

The terrain holds both cold and warmth and this makes snow removal daunting to say the least.

The gravel access road to your home and its route also adds to the algebra problem and its end solution.

The fact that Hanson Snow blowers is no longer in business and larger municipal snow blowers are impractical for your use is also an issue.

I would like ot suggest the followng scenario as moving for you is not an option apparently.

IF it were "Me" in your Sorels/Wellys etc.,

The current tractor should be traded in for the following unit;

A Kubota 8540 Narrow tracked low profile utility tractor with rubber tracks. it can be purchased with 4 wheels but in your situation purchasing tires would be a mistake as you need cleated rubber tracks which the M8540N has

The 8540 has 4 wheel drive -two rubber drive tires up front and the rear tracks of course

It has a an all season cabin, very low ground pressure, high tractive effort, excellent visibility and work lightling.

You would be able to install a wide 2 stage snow blower of your choosing on the rear of the machine and a front end loader as well.

About snow blowers you have to keep in mind you are dealing with cascade concrete and itis very dense at over 21 one pounds per cubic foot (before pack melt-which makes it even heavier of course).

I have posted extensive numbers here on the plowsite forum about a typical snow blowers efficiency as well as www.tractorbynet.com describing the tonnages moved by a typical single or two stage snow blower.

Snow blowers 101:

My personal choice would be a pronovost group one or tow snow blow blower with the rotating drum to bypass the chute and spout(very handy with wet snow pack believe me)

The P-720 or P-800 72 or 80 inch units would be well up to the task that you have as a single stage propeller or drum snow blower for this mount would be much much more costly 
to purchase.

The larger the impeller the greater the tonnage of snow casting per minute or hour at the rated speed of 540 rpm.

using the two examples I cited previously.

The P720 2 stage caster

The impeller drum has a 10.5 inch depth and a 24 inch diameter

3.14 times the radius squared times the height gives us

3.14 times 12 times 12 times 24 equals 6,28 cubic feet times 21 pounds equals 131.88 pounds per revolution times 540 revolutions per minute gives us 35.6 tons per minute of snow casting ability per pass.
5 miles of snow casting at 2 miles per hour(176 feet per minute) at 35.6 tons per minute will:

1. require one hour of snow casting in two passes

2. will dispose of 1,068 tons of snow per pass at a minimum
2,136 tons in 2 passes

The P800 2 stage snow caster

The impeller drum has a 12 inch depth and 26 inch diameter

3.14 times 13 times13 times 12 = 3.69 cubic feet rounded times 21 times 540 equals 21 tons per minute 1,260 tons per hour rounded,

This snow caster will remove 2,520 tons of snow at a minimum over 5 miles at 2 miles per hour using the M8540Narrow tracked unit.


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## leon

*Sierra/Cascade concrete*

Fixing my grammar and punctuation whoopsies



leon;1275921 said:


> Good afternoon Jedon,
> 
> I have read your posting and the responses with
> great interest on my part with regard to your brand
> of "Cascade Concrete".
> 
> Your situation is not unique with regard to the snow types
> and and snow pack melt during the sunlight hours.
> 
> The terrain holds both cold and warmth with ease and this
> makes snow removal daunting to say the least.
> 
> The gravel access road to your home and its route also adds
> to the algebra problem and its end solution.
> 
> The fact that Hanson Snow blowers is no longer in business
> and larger municipal snow blowers are impractical for your
> use is also an issue.
> 
> I would like to suggest the followng scenario as moving for you
> is not an option apparently.
> 
> IF it were "Me" in your Sorels/Wellingtons etc.,
> 
> The current tractor should be traded in for the following unit;
> 
> A Kubota 8540 Narrow tracked low profile utility tractor with
> rubber tracks.
> 
> It can be purchased with 4 wheels but in your specific situation
> purchasing tires would be a mistake as you need cleated
> rubber tracks which the M8540 Utility Narrow has.
> 
> You could easily install Bridgestone Polar Treads in this case.
> 
> The 8540 has conventional 4 wheel drive offered as onr of the
> standard equipment options- with R1 tires Agricultural use
> 
> The M8540 Narrow has an all season cabin and is equiped with
> an automatic transmission.
> 
> The tracked option very low ground pressure,
> very high tractive effort, excellent visibility and work lightling.
> 
> The steel tracked units have finish dozer treads and have low tractive effort.
> 
> You would be able to install a wide 2 stage snow blower of your
> choosing on the rear of the machine and a front end loader as well.
> 
> About snow blowers you have to keep in mind you are dealing with
> "Cascade Concrete" and it is very dense at over 21 one pounds per
> cubic foot (before pack melt-which makes it even heavier of course).
> 
> I have posted extensive numbers here on the plowsite forum about
> a typical snow blowers efficiency as well as www.tractorbynet.com
> describing the tonnages moved by a typical single or two stage snow blower.
> 
> Snow blowers 101:
> 
> My personal choice would be a pronovost group one or two
> snow blow blower with the bi-directional rotating impeller drum
> to bypass the chute and spout(very handy with wet dense
> snow pack believe me)
> 
> The P-720 or P-800 72 or 80 inch units would be well up to the
> task that you have. A single stage propeller or drum snow blower
> for this mount would be much much more costly to purchase.
> 
> The larger the impeller the greater the tonnage of snow casting per
> minute or hour at the rated P.T.O., speed of 540 R.P.M.
> 
> Using the two examples I cited previously.
> 
> The P720 2-stage snow caster:
> 
> The impeller drum has a 10.5 inch depth and a 24 inch diameter.
> 
> 3.14 times the radius squared times the height gives us
> 
> 3.14 times 12 times 12 times 24 equals 6,28 cubic feet times 21 pounds equals 131.88 pounds per revolution times 540 revolutions per minute gives us 35.6 tons per minute of snow casting ability per pass.
> 
> 5 miles of snow casting at 2 miles per hour(176 feet per minute) at 35.6 tons per minute will:
> 
> 1. require five hours of snow casting in two passes and will dispose of 10,680 tons of snow per 2 lane passed at a minimum.
> 
> The P800 2 stage snow caster:
> 
> The impeller drum has a 12 inch depth and 26 inch diameter.
> 
> 3.14* 169*12=6367.92 cubic inches divided by 1,728 Cubic Inches (one cubic foot)
> equals 3.685 cubic feet per revolution times 21 pounds per cubic foot(77.385 pounds)
> times 540 equals 41,789 pounds per minute times 60 minutes equals 2,507,274 pounds
> (1253.637 tons) per hour 21 tons per minute rounded times sixty minutes equals 1,260 tons per hour at 1 mile per hour (rounded higher).
> 
> This snow caster will remove 5,620 tons of snow at a minimum over 5 lane miles at 1 miles per hour using the M8540 Narrow tracked unit.


5 times 5,280 =26,400 feet

26,400 feet divided by 88 feet per minute (1 MPH) is 300 minutes
26,400 feet divided by 176 feet per minute (2 MPH) is 150 minutes
26,400 feet divided by 264 feet per minute (3 MPH) is 100 minutes

With regard to other snow removal equipment and basing it solely on its intended main use with regard to the limited terrain and the topography of the terrain involved:

The native gravel road base is detrimental with regard to traction and ground temperature issues.

The annual snow loading, tree lines and Chinook winds will limit your snow disposal to daylight hours.

The tree lines will limit the ability to push snow and dispose of it the first time 
eliminating a used road grader for the purpose entirely as a possible avenue, where a snow blower mounted on a tractor will not have these issues at any time.

A plow on truck will only be as effective as the traction and dead weight it can carry and if the snow is dense and packed it will be no match for the snowfall.

A skid steer loader and hydraulic drive snow blower with or without tracks will be compromised by the low ground clearance and possible traction loss and low available power for the snow blower with regard to deep snows.

The use of an ASV will require the largest model with the largest snow blower available at a much larger cost.

A four wheel drive backhoe and a mounted motorised snow blower will cost 6-8 times the purchase price of a new M8540N tracked unit and a P.T.O., operated snow blower.

A standard dozer of any size with cleated track will have the problem of pushing the snow pack and limited avenues of snow disposal when working as it must always push snow forward.

The added benefit of a Kubota M8540 Narrow tracked tractor will be that you can remove and install the front end loader whenever you wish so road clearance issues will not be an issue.

IN addition you will also have the ability to purchase the widest 2 stage snow blower and simply drive at a slower ground speed with no losses with regard to efficiency and have the added ability to operate at faster groundspeeds when cutting back snow banks when required or obviously desired in your case.


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## leon

*Cascade concrete/Sierra cement*

Adding to my previous comments and 
again apologising for the typo's I found
a second time-

I failed to add the following to my previous
posting-

Adding "Pneumatic Caster Wheels" to the
body of the snow blower will aid in turning
while casting snow and avoid digging in 
the road base at all times.

Excellent heavy payload dual caster sets
can be obtained from
Mcmaster Carr Supply from thier
regional warehouses.

Perhaps as an aid in reducing the problem
of annual mud and ruts you should ask 
someone about renting a small vibrating 
asphault paving roller of the ride on 
variety when the weather is dry and 
managable to tighten the road base.

Ir would take a day or two to completely 
tamp and roll the road to maintain a tight surface;
in any case.

If there is no poor or ditch drainage the whole
exercise may be a waste of time.


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## Jedon

Leon thank you so much!
Perhaps there is an intermediate non-optimal thing I can get in time for next winter with limited funds and save up for the M8540. 
I agree that right now drainage is a huge issue, first thing is to fix that before next winter. Now that the road is plowed the mud is a larger issue, most of our driveway is compacted DG but one section was fill below that and washed out and is now a huge mud pit which is worse than the snow!


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## leon

*Cascade Concrete*



Jedon;1276202 said:


> Leon thank you so much!
> Perhaps there is an intermediate non-optimal thing I can get in time for next winter with limited funds and save up for the M8540.
> I agree that right now drainage is a huge issue, first thing is to fix that before next winter. Now that the road is plowed the mud is a larger issue, most of our driveway is compacted DG but one section was fill below that and washed out and is now a huge mud pit which is worse than the snow!


Hello Jedon,

I am glad I could offer some form of assistance in this forum.

Ideally for you the current mule must be traded for your purpose

and to purposefully defray the purchase cost of the M8540 Narrow

tracked utility tractor for your mutual use as your spouse/signifigant

other will not want to get out of the cab after she drives the new mule.

I sincerely submitted the idea of the M8540 narrow tracked tractor

because it will be a forever purchase that will retain its value for you and

being a utility tractor will always be there for you as it is much less

complicated than dealing with a large truck that will lose value and

traction with your snow conditions of which I am very familiar with regard

to the Wellington and Rodgers passes disaster(s) and the consequences.

I also wish to re-iterate that you must NOT consider the Mattracks system for a

4 wheel drive vehicle for the following reasons:

1.they will sink like a stone in powder because they are not large enough in

cross sectional area to overcome the weight of the internal combustion

engine in the transport vehicle and that is an automatic deal breaker.

2. The 4 Mattracks alone would almost pay for a base model 8540 with tracks.

Plase inderstand that with your snow totals and ground conditions you only

realistically have one other viable option and it is establishing a tow line to

follow the path from your domicile to the asphault.

I am unsure if it is with the realm of possibility for you but that is the only viable

reliable method of egress and entry that can be powered by a generator mounted

on a trolley basket to power thre traction motor that you would ride on a suspended

wire rope trolley line.

Many people have trolley baskets for access and eggress to cottages on

steep lake shores and it can be done successfully and has been done.

Its implementation would be quick and simple following the road route but

the problem of obtaining permisssion to install a single line trolley may be

the issue for you but it is something that will bear serious scrutiny for your

domicile location and the snow pack.

To paraphrase Dr. Einstein:

Just remember that you have attempted many times to come to a

successfull conclusion and you have not failed in any attempt.

Your Hyposthesis is transit to and from your remote domicile being 2.5 miles distant one way and 5 miles round trip.

Your experiment is the determination the most effective and cost effective method of transit 
from A your home to B your end location being the tarmac and from B the tarmac to A your home.

The conclusion is the most effective method of reliable transit with or without a road opening 
during snow season.

As long as the funicular trolley is properly sized to carry personnel and supplies and the generator and drive motor and the wire rope is maintained by oiling to prevent corrosion and the wire rope is properly supported at intervals to avoid sagging and dragging on snow pack it is something to consider even with the 11000 foot (cable length only)distance.

It may be much less in cost initially than an M8540 narrow tracked utility tractor and a Pronovost P-800 TRC snow blower and as a result it will allow you to reserve your funds for the purchase of the M8540 narrrow tracked utility tractor and wide snow blower at a faster rate of savings as well.

The added factor of safety with regard to the suspended wire rope funicular trolley in the case of a medical emergency is also justified position whe discussing this with one of the manufacturers of these units for the 11,000 foot distance as well.
Wire rope becomes much less expensive per foot in large single spool quantities and single strand carrier and suspension system will last for 50 or more years with the limited use it will recieve. The added benefit is simply one of availability with regard to snow pack depth as well as it(the snow pack) will become the "Null Set" issue.

I want you to succeed and not fail that is much more important.


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## Jedon

I had looked at and dismissed Mattracks as being both not good enough for the task as well as way too expensive. 
If I stop using my tracked 6x6 for plowing then it won't break and I could use it in emergencies to get up the road.
Speaking of wires, we are below 300ft cliffs and know the people above us, I thought a zipline would be awesome! Quite a bit of engineering involved with that though.


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## leon

*Cascade/Sierra concrete*



Jedon;1276238 said:


> I had looked at and dismissed Mattracks as being both
> not good enough for the task as well as way too expensive.
> 
> If I stop using my tracked 6x6 for plowing then it won't break
> and I could use it in emergencies to get up the road.
> 
> Speaking of wires, we are below 300ft cliffs and know the people
> above us, I thought a zipline would be awesome!
> 
> Quite a bit of engineering involved with that though.


Hello Jedon.

The engineering is not a problem
the routing is the issue as many tons
can be transported with a tugger hoist
with a counter weight with ease.

I am glad you read my update regarding your situation.

The cable would not be actual zip line system; but it is
a funicular with a trolley riding on a stationary carrier cable 
will tug in both directions for you..

I will post a picture of a personal system for you in a few minutes.


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## leon

*Cascade/Sierra concrete*

Hello Jedon

Here is one manufacturer

www.americantram.com

Picture 4 is not there because I miscounted, Whoopsie!!


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## Jedon

That looks fun! Even better, this: http://www.the-ashpit.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=47


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## mchur01

How about this?


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## Jedon

I like it! Now to find one in this country... That one doesn't even have 4WD.


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## leon

*Cascade concrete/ Sierra cement*

Hello Jedon,

If you want to know more about these types of propeller 
snow casters and prices please send me a PM with your e-mail
as the type of snow caster you see is no longer available with
hydraulic drive.

All of the propeller snow casters are mechanical drive.

There is a Schmidt / Beilhack dealer in Canada in Britsh Columbia.

the large snow casters require hundreds of USEABLE horse power in OPERATION.


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## BlueWing

I don't care now much you spend you can NOT push that much snow a winter without making a really big mess and a TON of work.
The ONLY way is to use a really large snow blower. That way you can blow the snow way back off the road and away from your driveway. What you need is a 75 to 125 HP 4-wheel drive tractor with a cab and a 72" or larger two stage blower that runs off your rear PTO. Then you also need to make sure you have a good front end loader on the tractor. It can do amazing things to get you unstuck. Either pull you forward or push you backwards.
If you buy less then 75 HP you will be slow going when blowing. You will want to run your tractor at least 10 mph when blowing.


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## Jedon

Thanks BlueWing, I did figure whatever I get should be, like you say, 75+ HP with a snowblower. 
When I used the 6x6 it would take me 40 minutes to an hour to go up the 2.5 miles and back again which was fine, even if it takes longer with a blower that's okay.


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## leon

*Cascade concrete/ Sierra cement*

Hello Jedon,

Here are pair of pictures with Schmidt single stage propeller 
snow blowers that can be mounted on larger tractors
like the M8540 Narrow Tracked Utility Tractor.

They are very well suited for heavy Cascade Concrete
type snows as well as powder.

These Schmidt single stage propeller type snow casters
routinely remove heavy dense snow pack and ice and
also removes packed snow banks.


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## leon

*snow etc.*

Another option is a large tracked walk behind 
self propelled snow blower which has diesel power and 
are made by Fujii and Zaugg.

If you look for my posts you will see larger pictures of them.
The remove deep snows with little effort and good speeds.

Collectively they are the size of a small1973 Volkswagon 
wagon.:waving:


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## leon

*snow removal*

Hello Jerod,

With regard to your snow removal issues you honestly seem 
to need a machine quckly for immediate results and heavy wet 
snow conditions.

The issues you have are:

time- you have plenty of time apparently for snow removal work and a
smaller machine less than 100 horse power with 4 wheel drive will work for you

close by dealer location for repairs and maintenance
aquisition cost
snow loading 
5 miles total distance required for the actual purpose of snow removal in 2 directions.

As you have 5 lane miles of mountain road distance and limited immediate funding:

You have a few useable options

Kubota like many others have a zero percent interest option for new machinery 
(saying that- the zero percent issue is simply a sales tactic.

Even the smallest four wheel drive sub compact weather cab tractor will be a haven for you in relation to snow removal.
for the followin reasons.

You can install very wide snow caster on the rear of the tractor using caster wheels to aid in turning and to avoid gouging.

The rear tires will be loaded and you will be able to use V chains for traction on the front tires as well 
You can install duals on the front and rear ( the information for this is located on the tractorbynet forum in the Kubota section

The BX2660 with an all weather Curtis cab and a front end loader will be easy to use and maintain.

A BX2660 with an all weather Curtis cab, work lights, front end loader, and a Pronovost snow blower will be a about $300 a month
it is lighter in weight and smaller in size

The BX2660 like the M8540 Narrow has a platform operating station as it is a hydrostatic drive unit allowing much comfort while operating 
the tractor


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## leon

*Cascade concrete/ Sierra cement*



leon;1277814 said:


> Hello Jerod,
> 
> With regard to your snow removal issues you honestly seem
> to need a machine quckly for immediate results and heavy wet
> snow conditions.
> 
> The issues you have are:
> 
> time- you have plenty of time apparently for snow removal work and a
> smaller machine less than 100 horse power with 4 wheel drive will work for you
> 
> A tractor radio reduces the tedium considerably and the need for coffee in the cab is a given as well as a CB radio or cell phone and cans of fuel in a ballast box or a box welded on the snow blower frame to hold fuel and oil.
> 
> (you may consume a lot of fuel one way removing snow on the way down jeopardising the return trip second pass).
> 
> The heated cab will let you work in a shirt and or vest in comfort
> 
> close by dealer location for repairs and maintenance
> aquisition cost
> snow loading
> 5 miles total distance required for the actual purpose of snow removal in 2 directions.
> 
> As you have 5 lane miles of mountain road distance and limited immediate funding:
> 
> You have a few useable options
> 
> Kubota like many others have a zero percent interest option for new machinery
> (saying that- the zero percent issue is simply a sales tactic.
> 
> Even the smallest four wheel drive sub compact weather cab tractor will be a haven for you in relation to snow removal.
> for the followin reasons.
> 
> You can install very wide snow caster on the rear of the tractor using caster wheels to aid in turning and to avoid gouging.
> 
> The rear tires will be loaded and you will be able to use V chains for traction on the front tires as well.
> You can install duals on the front and rear ( the information for this is located on the tractorbynet forum in the Kubota section.
> 
> The BX2660 with an all weather Curtis cab and a front end loader will be easy to use and maintain.
> 
> A Kubota BX2660 with an all weather Curtis cab, work lights, front end loader, and a Pronovost snow blower will be about $300 a month, it is lighter in weight and smaller in size
> and many units are in service in snow.
> 
> The Kubota branded snow blowers will remove much less snow than the comparable Pronovost or Allied snow caster.
> 
> The BX2660 like the M8540 Narrow has a platform operating station as it is a hydrostatic drive unit allowing much comfort while operating the tractor in reverse by simply turning slightly in the seat; you shoud invest in the delluxe seat for the tractor as you will be spending a lot of time in it ( the deluxe seat is standard in the M8540 Narrow Tracked Utility tractor)


As you have heavy wet snow I would strongly suggest that you spend the 30 bucks on one of Clarences impeller kits to improve the efficiency of the snow blower as it cast the snow further and higher than the original equipment impeller alone and it will blast the snow over the banks
of snow pack.


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## BWSwede

Jedon,

You certainly have a tough nut to crack. Have you considered using a Unimog with a snowblower on front. I have similar snow conditions as you and have found the Unimog/snowblower an excellent combination. The truck has a little less than 100 hp (of course less than that at the PTO) and runs an 84" two stage blower without any problems at all.

As far as costs go a good 20 speed truck can be purchased for between 10 and 20k, I paid $2,500 for the blower, and about $500 to convert the blower to front mount, plus my time. Since the truck is street legal, in the off season it can be driven to town with no problem. With the 3 point hitch on the back you could also attach ground engaged equipment such as a box blade to maintain your road during the non-snow months.

BWSwede


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## Jedon

I did indeed think of a Unimog, actually it was the first thing I thought of! My neighbor had two of them and said to steer clear due to maintenance issues although I'm not sure that his suggestion of a 35 year old wheel loader would have less maintenance. I haven't been able to find a decent sized 4x4 tractor for a reasonable price so far. I've looked into a 100HP articulated wheel loader that comes with a plow, or a large wheeled bobcat with grouser tracks and a snowblower.


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## BWSwede

Jedon,

I'll start off by saying that Unimogs are not for everyone. Some people have a lot of maintenance issues (usually deferred from the previous owner) and some people don't have that much. Part of it depends on the truck you buy, meaning how was it used and and well was it taken care of prior to your purchase. When you have components and systems such as 2 circuits of hydraulics off the main pump, another high volume circuit off the lower pto pump, cam driven compressed air system, a 540/1000 live pto to the front and rear, hydraulic connections to the front and to the rear, a two stage clutch (like a tractor), multiple stacked gearboxes, portal gears at the end of each axle, locking differentials, you are going to have to take some time to check fluid levels and keep things greased. My one ton pickup doesn't require 1/4 the maintenance this truck does, but it also doesn't do 1/10 of what this truck will do.

One of the best things you can do for a Unimog is to work it hard every week. Doing that will ensure the truck will last a long time.

Maybe a wheel loader is best for you, but then again you can't drive the wheel loader to town or put a 3 point hitch on it. The red device on the rear hitch is a Farmi logging winch. In the summer it is used for selective logging/firewood gathering and it the winter it is used for additional weight over the rear axle as well as winching objects like stuck vehicles. The winch pull is 11,000 pounds at 2.1 to 4.6 feet per second. If 11,000 pounds is not enough for you put a block on it and pull 22,000 pounds at 1 to 2.3 feet per second. Since the harder the winch pulls the deeper the blade sinks into the ground, there is no pulling the truck backwards. It is quite a site to see this thing yank a Suburban out of a snow covered ditch.

Good luck and I hope this helps you in your decision.

BWSwede


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## PrimoSR

Kind of off topic but how long have you lived up there? I am super intrigued by the amount of snow that falls in that region and how people deal with it.


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## Mabepossibly

Id visit a local equipment rental company and check on rates for rental of a skid stear over the winter. Many ofthese places have excess equipment thru the winter when the building season ends.


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