# Loader Per Hr. Price



## Bporter

I'm bidding a job that requires a loader to be on site at all times anyone give me an idea on a per hr. Price for a loader with a pusher thanks
Brian Porter


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## cretebaby

what size loader

what size pusher


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## elite1msmith

1 million dollars, and 10 hours min charge plus 200 per hour operator cost, and fuel is not included, also customer to pay for all wear and tear on plow, to incude cutting edges, and oil changes on the machine


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## cretebaby

elite1msmith;589907 said:


> 1 million dollars, and 10 hours min charge plus 200 per hour operator cost, and fuel is not included, also customer to pay for all wear and tear on plow, to incude cutting edges, and oil changes on the machine


smart ass LOL


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## Ramairfreak98ss

Bporter;589862 said:


> I'm bidding a job that requires a loader to be on site at all times anyone give me an idea on a per hr. Price for a loader with a pusher thanks
> Brian Porter


Well your asking for two prices. First, if they REQUIRE it to sit there all winter, what does said machine cost to rent? We have never HAD to leave a machine anywhere, and since if we had such a job, i would just bring the loader over a day prior on the trailer, unless your talking big massive ones in which arnt used for much else in our line of work...

Machine that sits there, i would bill per month, used or not, 1hr or 100, if its gonna cost you 3-6k for the machine rental, plus tax, transportation there etc. Id take your cost and add at least 25% monthly to that, before ANY snow removal costs.

Then per hour really is just fuel and operator...

I would guestimate, 10gph maximum x $5gal/max =$50 hr, if your operator is paid $15-20 per hour, charge them $50/hr so $100hrly plus their monthly figure for snow stacking/pushing

Of course, those who do this day in and day out could probalby enlighten you on the fine details, i think thats a start.

We supply loader rates if need be, say if there is a requirement where we "cant" push the snow with the trucks or it needs to be stacked $235 hr , 2hr minimum.

And no i would never leave it there for any amount short of something insane like, my monthly payments are 1k or less and theyre spotting me 5k a month, ill leave it sit for a while and go over every week to drive it around for 10 minutes 

Up in chicago area, wouldnt you need a spot to plug it in for the block heater too?


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## Bporter

I'll Leave the loader on site, and that is good for me since i really don't have anywhere to put it. Um welll it will be somthing simular to a cat 906 a 2yd bucket possible 3yd and a 12foot pusher


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## elite1msmith

cretebaby;589910 said:


> smart ass LOL


well i figure just sell one account and be done with it , for 10 years


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## cretebaby

seriously now, do you own a loader are you renting a loader are you renting buy the month by the hour

you cant price the loader by the hour if you rent it by the month

and why does it need to be onsite you cant use it anywhere else


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## Bporter

It looks like i will be renting it by the hr. I'll will be getting a couple of bids in on the loader by tommrow so i'll have a better Idea


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## elite1msmith

i have had pletty of bid specs, say at least 1 loader/skid , on site at all times (not that would stop me from puilling it to other locations for small jobs after) - on site, is what it said in the specs

i refuse to give out a per push , or and hourly price if i have to leave the machine on site, or if it is a site that "requires " the use of one inorder to do the job.... in other words, if isnt a good equiptment choice, for a site, then they ge a seasonal rate, or a retainer rate


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## Bporter

ok Change of plans it's going to cost me 3000 a month and the company wants an hourly rate on top of that they are a no tollerence company last year and the year before i was the sub for someone eslse at this place with two pick-ups and they supplied the loader this year that company i was a sub for was gone and now the company seeked me out to be there contractor very confusing situation. But anyways I go out when the snow starts falling and don't leave till the snow stops and its all 100% cleaned up I put in over 150 hr. last year and 142 the year before i figured I would price it out at 235per hr for the loader and 125 per hour for each pick-up with 8' blade does that sound right let me know thanks.
Brian Porter


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## JohnnyRoyale

Just be certain the loader rental is going to cost you only $3000/mth. How about insurance, and your time to sit around? How about if your get zero snow? I'd try to get 100 hours guaranteed, if their paying you hourly. At those rates, on top of a loader rental rate your golden, but you probably wont get it. JMO.


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## salopez

if the machine is going to cost you 3k a month, i would charge them 1k a month to have it there plus the 235 an hour you listed.

This is because if it was your machine you would have it elseware making money when its not snowing. If they want it there they need to pay for that service.

just make sure you have enough snow in general that you will cover that 3k a month.


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## Bporter

Thanks for all the resposes to my question but the 235.00 and hr. Sound right or to low


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## T-MAN

Bporter;590694 said:


> I put in over 150 hr. last year and 142 the year before i figured I would price it out at 235per hr for the loader and 125 per hour for each pick-up with 8' blade does that sound right let me know thanks.
> Brian Porter


Wow how did you pull off 150 last year and 142 the year before ? We had double the snow last year compared to 06-07.

For a 12' pusher you seem a bit high IMO at 235.00 per hour. 
But what do I know pumpkin:


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## elite1msmith

3000 per month to rent a loader? how big , what kind? seems high to me - is that your cost, or what your charging them ?


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## JD Dave

elite1msmith;590859 said:


> 3000 per month to rent a loader? how big , what kind? seems high to me - is that your cost, or what your charging them ?


When we talk loaders, we don't mean skids, were talking 544's, L70's and bigger. 15k for the season is cheap IMO.


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## elite1msmith

well i figured it was a true loader - but why only a 12 foot pusher ? seems kinda small for such a high rental cost - 

i could get 2 skids almost 3 rented with 8 foot each , total of 16/24 feet - if its a zero tollerance account , the snow should never pile up ,

im sorry im not filmilar with the "CAT" equiptment all that much, - i have run a few peaces , but he said something like a 2 yard bucket? i could put that on a skid as well for snow -


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## T-MAN

elite1msmith;590925 said:


> well i figured it was a true loader - but why only a 12 foot pusher ? seems kinda small for such a high rental cost -
> 
> i could get 2 skids almost 3 rented with 8 foot each , total of 16/24 feet - if its a zero tollerance account , the snow should never pile up ,


Skids have a time and place, but 3 skids wont replace JD 644 with a 16' pusher for moving big snow long distance. A 2 speed skid is 1400 a month here. For Stacking skids suck, loading trucks takes alot of time as well.
Big sites need big equipment IMO pumpkin:


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## JD Dave

T-MAN;590929 said:


> Skids have a time and place, but 3 skids wont replace JD 644 with a 16' pusher for moving big snow long distance. A 2 speed skid is 1400 a month here. For Stacking skids suck, loading trucks takes alot of time as well.
> Big sites need big equipment IMO pumpkin:


I agree. You also have to pay three drivers. Also Elite 1 12 ft pusher will do alot more then 2 skids with 8 ft pushers.


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## elite1msmith

JD Dave;590934 said:


> I agree. You also have to pay three drivers. Also Elite 1 12 ft pusher will do alot more then 2 skids with 8 ft pushers.


well you learn somthing new every day


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## storm king

We have a good size strip mall and are on a hourly rate for the john deere 544 ( $135.00 ) per hour and ( $100.00 ) for the cat backhoe plus ( $75.00 ) for the F-350.

I own them all and the way I figure it $235.00 per hour if it snows is better than letting the iron rust in my yard all winter and it is not hard hours on the machines either.

If you are not renting and they want an hourly rate stay reasonable $$$$$........ chances are after they hear quotes like some posted above it's money in the bank ...

Good luck on the hourly . 
Storm King


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## big pusher

storm king;590948 said:


> We have a good size strip mall and are on a hourly rate for the john deere 544 ( $135.00 ) per hour and ( $100.00 ) for the cat backhoe plus ( $75.00 ) for the F-350.
> 
> I own them all and the way I figure it $235.00 per hour if it snows is better than letting the iron rust in my yard all winter and it is not hard hours on the machines either.
> 
> If you are not renting and they want an hourly rate stay reasonable $$$$$........ chances are after they hear quotes like some posted above it's money in the bank ...
> 
> Good luck on the hourly .
> Storm King


Trust me snow and especially salt are extremely hard on equipment


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## JohnnyRoyale

Your not going to get anything done with a 16ft pusher in a lot when its full of cars-just turning down laneways is a PITA and is an accident waiting to happen. On big empty lots (at night), no problem. A 12 Footer would suit the job better IMO.


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## QuadPlower

If they require it to be there, then they need to pay for it to be there no matter how much it snows. You need to charge Cost of loader & operator X your % mark up each and every month. Then you need to give a per push price on top of that.

I don't have any, but every job around here that requires a loader on site is Seasonal paid out monthly. Money in pocket to pay for your lease/rental costs. I priced a 544 for a job & they wanted $4,350 a month. That was with 100 hours and me running it.


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## Ramairfreak98ss

big pusher;590990 said:


> Trust me snow and especially salt are extremely hard on equipment


sure is.

You guys only charge $100hr for a backhoe and $200ish for a 544j? WTF? in jersey we can get $120 an hour for my little ass machine and $225-250hr for a sub compact tractor with a 73-84" bucket for loading to maybe the smallest Deere 244J.. A 544j would be well over $400/hr if not being paid a contract price to rent it monthly to begin with. $100 an hour for a backhoe, i charge $200 as a minimum to bring it to a site, and take it back and use it for one hour for the first hour alone. $100, F that, the snow could pile up 10' tall for that price.


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## JD Dave

big pusher;590990 said:


> Trust me snow and especially salt are extremely hard on equipment


Snow isn't hard on industrial equipment, maybe salt is but if you park your machines onsite and they don't go down the road during storms, salt isn't an issue. JMO


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## Superior L & L

Ramairfreak98ss;591723 said:


> sure is.
> 
> You guys only charge $100hr for a backhoe and $200ish for a 544j? WTF? in jersey we can get $120 an hour for my little ass machine and $225-250hr for a sub compact tractor with a 73-84" bucket for loading to maybe the smallest Deere 244J.. A 544j would be well over $400/hr if not being paid a contract price to rent it monthly to begin with. $100 an hour for a backhoe, i charge $200 as a minimum to bring it to a site, and take it back and use it for one hour for the first hour alone. $100, F that, the snow could pile up 10' tall for that price.


$400 for a 544j come on. The idea behind a loader is to do bigger areas cheaper than trucks. If you can use a 20' box on it you could average 4 acres per hour, it would take you 4 trucks to cover the same area. So if you charge $80 per truck thats $320. So its more money for the loader if you are at $400.00 At that price you have no competative advantage to using a loader. Any joe shmow can find four pick ups.

I would think Low two hundreds per hour would work real well. You would be lower priced than most plow guys but still make some good money. Most excavators around me will charge $120-150 per hour for a decent sized wheel loader (case 721). Then you make $100 per hour for supplying the box

Sorry for the rambling!


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## Ramairfreak98ss

superior, all that you say may be 100% true.

In your case, Michigan, always is guaranteed to get more snow and more occurances than say NJ does. So you will surely "profit" from say charging $200 an hour for a loader that costs $5k monthly to rent. In NJ, we'd have to make that amount back "fast" during snow, we would NEVER make 25 billable hours on a big machine for ONE Month and every month throughout the winter, any company here would surely loose money JUST on machine rental, then you have labor per hour to run it, delivery/pickup state sales tax, etc... Its VERY expensive here to sit a huge loader like that on site, your accounts would be huge to even consider this.

And with your range in the $80/hr range for a truck, are we talking 1/2 ton F150s with a 7'6" straight plow or 1 ton-F550s with 8-10ft plows? Either way, being the business owner and handling snow removal in NJ, we can get a bare minimum of $100/hr with a half ton easy. 

I have accounts that paid well over that if you want to break it down per hour that i could do MORE quickly with a half ton pickup than my F350, just was too big for tight areas.

We can get between $140-$200/hr , again, if you averaged out how long you log you enter a site until you leave, that time period would equal those pay ranges. In this industry there is preperation, salt storage, driving time etc as you all know, but when you guys plow accounts that are hourly, do you bill from the time you arrive on site until you leave or you bill when it starts to snow, drive time to the site, time plowing/salting etc. and leaving?

What do clients say when you have 4 trucks at an account, 3 finish, one is still going and 3 guys are waiting to leave or your talking, fixing equipment, loading salt etc? I sure hope for the low rate of $80/hr your getting paid straight through for ALL Of your time dealing with these accounts, not just on site from time you show up to the time you leave?

Accounts that i have would be 2hrs or less, 1hr 45min and i would still bill 2hrs at $80 hr gets me only $160 plus tax? This same account we get well over $400 for with two guys and one truck and snow thrower.

I know NJ and areas like this are higher for pay rates for this industry, but how can so many other areas, guys talking about these $60-$90hr ranges just blows my mind. Our insurance in NJ costs enough that at that rate we couldn't cover diesel fuel, tolls for bridges, tires, wear and tear, insurance for the truck itself before we make profit. Again, if i KNEW we would get 90" of snow this year and every year after and i would be busy every other day at the very least, sure ill work for $50 an hour then, because

$50hr x 400hrs per season 

is still more than 

$175hr x 100hrs per season


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## Superior L & L

Ramairfreak98ss;592152 said:


> What do clients say when you have 4 trucks at an account, 3 finish, one is still going and 3 guys are waiting to leave or your talking, fixing equipment, loading salt etc? I sure hope for the low rate of $80/hr your getting paid straight through for ALL Of your time dealing with these accounts, not just on site from time you show up to the time you leave?


I dont believe anyone would ever do what your saying here. The three trucks would leave when there done and go home or go to the next site. IF i had four trucks on one site it would be a BIG site. I prefer to have no more than two trucks on any site that way we can service many people at the same time(one company truck one sub). If i had a site that warranted four trucks then i would just put a loader on it instead and then we are back to our earlier discussion

It seems like you know what your talking about so im not going to "chant" back on all your comments. Every market is different and you try and get the best dollar you can based on what your market will bear.
But Michigan only get 40" of snow usually.

I would NEVER give a per hour price on a loader if I had a monthly rental on it. Maybe $250 per hour with a 25 hour min per month could work. But i would probably use a out of work excavator and pay him only by the hour. Most excavators have there equipment sitting all winter so it might as well be sitting on my site with the opportunity to get some hours on it for the owner.

Regarding the truck /hours deal I would never charge by the hour anyways I was just supporting my ideas.


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## storm king

The per hour quote I gave here is cheap I know, but but my landscape bis is very small and excavating is my bread and butter.... so anything is better than nothing this year for me.
Don't think I have to post how crappy the housing market has been or how slow it is these days for most small business.

The friends we have in the landscaping business are all saying the same thing this year very slow , just the basic min. maintence lately hardly any extras this year for em.

We used to do alot of small diggs for landscapers in our area paver walls, shallow ponds ,havling and removing fill ...ect. ect. type stuff in between jobs when it has been slow. But never saw it this bad in over 20years in the excavating business.


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## JD Dave

storm king;592493 said:


> The per hour quote I gave here is cheap I know, but but my landscape bis is very small and excavating is my bread and butter.... so anything is better than nothing this year for me.
> Don't think I have to post how crappy the housing market has been or how slow it is these days for most small business.
> 
> The friends we have in the landscaping business are all saying the same thing this year very slow , just the basic min. maintence lately hardly any extras this year for em.
> 
> We used to do alot of small diggs for landscapers in our area paver walls, shallow ponds ,havling and removing fill ...ect. ect. type stuff in between jobs when it has been slow. But never saw it this bad in over 20years in the excavating business.


I agree it's better to have some money comiing in then none at all. Farmers get bad names, like excavators because alot go in cheap because they think their summers pay for their machinery so why not make something in the winter instead of the equipment sitting. Well when times are bad everyone decides to get back into snow and make some extra money and the guys that make most of their income off snow get screwed. Don't sell yourself short try to make the most money you can, that way we can all stay profitable. JMO


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## storm king

I hear ya , most of the stuff we do for landscapers is real cheap and is usually a one hand washes the other type of thing , and you are right price gouging hurts us all. 

To be honest with you all the private driveways we plow are on the backside of a very steep mountain and All the accounts we have there we given to me by other landscapers who do not have the equiptment to handle thier customers up there in the snow and ice. I am talking really steep stuff and not much room to put snow. ( THAT MOUNTAIN CAN DO A NUMBER ON A TRUCK , )

In turn we do alot of favors for them like getting rid of extra fill and material including leaves for them guys. Usually it's just for a reference to thier customers if they need a dig sometime.

We are close to NYC in the suburbs and most landscapers pay a premium for yard rental and space is tight around here not like in the country where you can just dump fill over a bank somewhere or get rid of matieral easy , believe me I know where you are comming from, and we PLAY NICE WITH OTHERS ,but things are getting tuff this year and we all have to do what we have to do sometimes ,ya know how that goes.
Best whishes ,Storm King


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## JD Dave

storm king;592518 said:


> I hear ya , most of the stuff we do for landscapers is real cheap and is usually a one hand washes the other type of thing , and you are right price gouging hurts us all.
> 
> To be honest with you all the private driveways we plow are on the backside of a very steep mountain and All the accounts we have there we given to me by other landscapers who do not have the equiptment to handle thier customers up there in the snow and ice. I am talking really steep stuff and not much room to put snow. ( THAT MOUNTAIN CAN DO A NUMBER ON A TRUCK , )
> 
> In turn we do alot of favors for them like getting rid of extra fill and material including leaves for them guys. Usually it's just for a reference to thier customers if they need a dig sometime.
> 
> We are close to NYC in the suburbs and most landscapers pay a premium for yard rental and space is tight around here not like in the country where you can just dump fill over a bank somewhere or get rid of matieral easy , believe me I know where you are comming from, and we PLAY NICE WITH OTHERS ,but things are getting tuff this year and we all have to do what we have to do sometimes ,ya know how that goes.
> Best whishes ,Storm King


Good response.


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## Ramairfreak98ss

Superior L & L;592468 said:


> Regarding the truck /hours deal I would never charge by the hour anyways I was just supporting my ideas.


I gotcha L&L, im not trying to really tell anyone they should charge double or $200-300hr, i know all market go for different rates, just seems when your having a machine going that sells for $140k, for whatever model and you charge only $125hr in bumblebee, west VA but can charge $350 an hour in NJ, i mean one is either charging too much or the other isn't making good profit.

If you can profit well enough at 60$ hr for whatever said machine, thats fine. We surely could probably profit charging $125/hr for a machine in NJ, but i dont want to make the bare minimum, i need money to pay for either rental cost, monthly payments, down payments etc.

Granted if said machine lasts 5000hrs before a toast engine, major failures to frame etc that it is 100% junk, you paid 50k for a machine and without fuel/upkeep its only costing you $10/hr to use for its purchase price, sure $30/hr can probably make money.

I understand why guys have the purpose of a loader, to cut down on vehicles, truck time and employees on one site. In NJ areas at least, we use the machine to get things done faster and thats it, not because its cheaper.

If we had 10 trucks that can plow 5 acres an hour each thats 50 acres an hour total, figuratively.

If we only have a total of 12hrs to plow snow, and can now add a loader on a big site or a small portable/trailer able one to take between sites and use ONE loader for 12hrs too, we could possibly "double" our output of moving snow... If i wasnt offered "more" money for a contract to use a loader, it would never be there, unless like you said, the site was so large, like a huge NJ mall lot, that id literally have to use 20 trucks instead of 5 and a big loader, thats the only reason i'd consider it. In NJ at least, our rental rates are expensive for these machines, 4-8K+ a month, if it doesn't snow, id better have ALL of those funds paid on contract each month if it doesn't snow an inch ALL winter or else i'd never consider it. I think a lot of guys on here, simply, weather renting or owning, dont know what their labor/loader is truely worth per hour, some that charge $100/hr may get $150 if they bid it at that.


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## Bturman

*Dave said
When we talk loaders, we don't mean skids, were talking 544's, L70's and bigger. 15k for the season is cheap IMO.*

he stated earlier a Cat 906, that is not a large loader. I would think $3000 a month is a little high. That machine goes for about $1800 around here.

As to the pricing question I would charge the client a flat rate to have machine on site for winter maybe 15% over rental and then bill out your hours.

If you just bill $235/ hr and it doesn't snow your screwed.

BT


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