# Doubling the thickness of a cutting edge ...anyone try this...



## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I always feel like I am throwing away 1/3 of my cutting edge so I welded old cutting edge to back of new cutting edge.....cut old edge in 12" pieces and welded edges and welded the bolt holes to new cutting edge....Time will tell....

Any else ever try it?.....


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Uh, silly question. What happens when the front edge wears down and reaches those back pieces that are about as straight as a country road?


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## TJS (Oct 22, 2003)

Why not just build up on the original one with hardfacing. I did this to take the smile out of my edge.


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

cwren2472 said:


> Uh, silly question. What happens when the front edge wears down and reaches those back pieces that are about as straight as a country road?


Maybe it's my eyes, but if you look at the bolts, they appear to be the same distance off if his scraps, thereby making his blade frown shaped.

Or So it appears.

I was under the impression you weren't supposed to weld on plow edges, as you're tempering the metal, weakening its ability to resist wear. This is why curb guards are bolted on.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Dogplow Dodge said:


> Maybe it's my eyes, but if you look at the bolts, they appear to be the same distance off if his scraps, thereby making his blade frown shaped.
> 
> Or So it appears.
> 
> I was under the impression you weren't supposed to weld on plow edges, as you're tempering the metal, weakening its ability to resist wear. This is why curb guards are bolted on.


I highlighted in yellow what I assume are the pieces of scrap that he welded on. The original blade, in black, is on the bottom (away from the photo)


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

I know I’ll be the one to hit a hunk a metal in the road behind you.
It may have been more cost effective and a better fit if you went to your local metal supply and bought the right width without the curved ends. Drilled them and used longer bolts. 
Not sure I’m sold that thicker will wear slower. I plow quite a bit and get 2 seasons out of my boss oem edges.
JMO


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I know but hardened steel is only getting my a year of plowing....the weld areas loose hardening who cares.....I will see if it works......They weld D9 and bulldozer blades all the time do they loose hardening...I don't really care....I just wanted it thicker.....they will wear down and be straight..


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I plow a lot and one season is not working for me.....If i'm wrong i am out $500 if I am right I saved $500 plus....figured I would gamble this year...


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## FredG (Oct 15, 2012)

I don't think that is a great Idea. I have welded scraps on pusher shoe and I won't do that again. There just wear items it is what it is.


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## FredG (Oct 15, 2012)

PaTeeny said:


> I plow a lot and one season is not working for me.....If i'm wrong i am out $500 if I am right I saved $500 plus....figured I would gamble this year...


 Sure okay whatever. Good Luck.


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

D9 blades won't be tr


FredG said:


> I don't think that is a great Idea. I have welded scraps on pusher shoe and I won't do that again. There just wear items it is what it is.


Did uour D9 dozer welded blade fall off at 40mph and get kicked up into a windshield of the caterpillar behind you, on US80 ?

You and your crazy dozer chases on highway stories always had me chuckling


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

yea it broke off just driving down the road.........had to out run the cops with the D9...I need new cleats on it as feels like I am on a mule bouncing....I was worried that the bouncing would make a blade pieces just drop off.....Putting a new can muffler on the Dozer to go faster.......


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

yes cwren....those are the scrape pieces.....the center wears faster than the outside edges of my V plow...so I put thicker pieces- wider pieces near center of V....I placed the pieces as tight to the upper plow support as the shock from dropping plow would transfer to plow frame instead of welds....that is why it looks skewed....


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

Issues I see here are:

1. Thicker blade means less ground pressure since weight of plow is spread over a larger area, usually means it won't scrape as well. 

2. Uneven mounting of the pieces is going to cause very odd wear of the edge. Areas that have the pieces welded lower are going wear much slower than where they are higher up. 

3. Really should have some plug welds. With them on the back you will be literally trying to pull them off while plowing. 

4. All that extra weight making the pump work harder and hanging off the front of your truck. Be just that much less snow your plow will be able to stack. 

All that said I have welded pieces of old cutting edge to a new cutting edge before. Just on the ends to help slow the uneven wear caused when windrowing. Didn't see a noticeable improvement in edge life. I also put them on the front of the edge.


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

PaTeeny said:


> yes cwren....those are the scrape pieces.....the center wears faster than the outside edges of my V plow...so I put thicker pieces- wider pieces near center of V....I placed the pieces as tight to the upper plow support as the shock from dropping plow would transfer to plow frame instead of welds....that is why it looks skewed....


This is normally caused by the plow being out of adjustment.


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## Hydromaster (Jun 11, 2018)

I don’t think adding the weight is a nonissue for your boss plow as a set of wings Would also add weight. Boss uses the same pump in all of their plows and they vary in weight and if you put wings on a 9 foot plow???

The weight does add ground pressure .
I just think you’re added edge needs to be straight /even with the new edge you have.

Keep the backyard engineering ideas comming


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

Hydromaster said:


> I don't think adding the weight is a nonissue for your boss plow as a set of wings Would also add weight. Boss uses the same pump in all of their plows and they vary in weight and if you put wings on a 9 foot plow???
> 
> The weight does add ground pressure .
> I just think you're added edge needs to be straight /even with the new edge you have.
> ...


To figure out how ground pressure is effected would require math, I will leave that for markO, he likes math. Just pointing out that it could effect ground pressure.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

Kimber....It will wear smooth....not worried about weight....the adjustment is the plow has 15 years of service and will sell it and buy a new one soon...or keep as back up...not sure..

The cutting into ice and getting under will be better as more weight as an edge is an edge....my thoughts....


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

So no one has ever done this? I thought someone would have tried it

....I have been debating this in my head for a few...and I ask every welder in my home town....as we have a lot.....everybody welds here... Fabrication of truck beds, tanks, and more truck beds.....and water tankers....

The one welder said about welding bulldozer blades...its hardened steel and pushing ton boulders..

and One welder said just to stop being a "Farmer" and pay the money and forget about it...he is a millionaire...

also we turned the temperature up on the welder to get deep weld an that is what might weaken the steel......


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

PaTeeny said:


> Kimber....It will wear smooth....not worried about weight....the adjustment is the plow has 15 years of service and will sell it and buy a new one soon...or keep as back up...not sure..
> 
> The cutting into ice and getting under will be better as more weight as an edge is an edge....my thoughts....


I doubt it will wear even since the edge is different thickness at different heights on the edge. Don't understand what you are saying about plow adjustment. Yes you may have added more weight but you also added more surface area to spread that weight across. So PSI could have gone down or up. Noticed you left out responding to the part about welding. Two little edge welds holding on a 20+ pound hunk of steel to the back of edge could end badly.

This is what we tried. Like I said no noticeable improvement in edge life. 
This is on a 9.5' Fisher. 1/2" thick welded to outer edges.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I see..but my main wear area is in the V....the down pressure seem to be greater there or the way i plowed angled wears the center more...I like too hear what your saying...I was going to weld to the front....but thought the better support was to rest the steel slab against the plow frame....on the back side and any sudden impact would be taken by the newer cutting edge.....so that is why I did the back side...also wanted to keep it looking clean...I guess.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

Also we used a plasma cutter to cut old cutting edge...Those things are amazing.....not a torch.
Thanks


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

Overall weight is marginally more, but psi is different. When I added Meyer wings to my 8.5, it did not make it scrape better, just wider, even though combined, the wings are over 100 lbs

Think dually truck, vs SRW. That's how I look at it, the dually spreads the weight over a greater surface

To me, the thinner blade would scrape better, otherwise plow designers would offer super thick edges as an option. Not sure if anyone does.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

yes but snow plow designers want to sell more cutting edges.more $$....

And I think the weight of the snow and angle of cutting blade pushes the cutting edge down and helps to wear faster.....and clean up lots...That is why Boss plow needs the Hook up pins at 8' 1/2" height or whatever it is....that creates an angle for cutting.....


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## Hydromaster (Jun 11, 2018)

kimber750 said:


> To figure out how ground pressure is effected would require math, I will leave that for markO, he likes math. Just pointing out that it could effect ground pressure.


Lol

I would agree if he welded on the edge on like you adding to the corner, it would increase the thickness of the cutting edge and the added weight would be displaced along the thicker edge it would be a minimal increase in actual ground pressure.

But it looks like he added his above the existing cutting edge. His edge is still at the oem thickness.

Soooooo, without getting the slide-rule out I'll go out on a limb and make the prediction that it increased ground pressure.

Butttt
I Would've added it to the front like you did also


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I could have tripled it an beefed up the front too...next years project...sorry 2 years from now ....I will triple it up...


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

They'll pop off way before then...impact, flex, moisture, freeze thaw between the metal surfaces. They have a lot working against them the way you installed them. Im not knocking having a double thick edge, I just think there is an easier way to do it where it will stand the rigors of plowing.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

Mr.Markus said:


> They'll pop off way before then...impact, flex, moisture, freeze thaw between the metal surfaces. They have a lot working against them the way you installed them. Im not knocking having a double thick edge, I just think there is an easier way to do it where it will stand the rigors of plowing.


Someone should devise a way to attach a cutting edge to a plow without welding...


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I agree but wanted to try and see as I'm from Missouri.....




"The Show Me State"


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

PaTeeny said:


> I agree but wanted to try and see as I'm from Missouri.....
> 
> "The Show Me State"


I thought it was spelled "Misery"...


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

Hydromaster said:


> Lol
> 
> I would agree if he welded on the edge on like you adding to the corner, it would increase the thickness of the cutting edge and the added weight would be displaced along the thicker edge it would be a minimal increase in actual ground pressure.
> 
> ...


Was kinda my point about wear. All the pieces are at different heights, so some parts will double thickness while others are single thickness until he gets enough wear to get to all the pieces he welded on. But who knows until someone shows up here with some math no one will be able to understand.


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## Mudly (Feb 6, 2019)

500 bucks? You should of bought a muni edge for that price.


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## TJS (Oct 22, 2003)

Dogplow Dodge said:


> Maybe it's my eyes, but if you look at the bolts, they appear to be the same distance off if his scraps, thereby making his blade frown shaped.
> 
> Or So it appears.
> 
> I was under the impression you weren't supposed to weld on plow edges, as you're tempering the metal, weakening its ability to resist wear. This is why curb guards are bolted on.


 Never had a problem with what you say so called tempering when hardfacing edges. People also say you cannot weld on frames of vehicles. I never had a problem and my old man (82) was doing this way back in the day and never had a problem. All in prep and process. Somewhere there is a 85 Chev pickup where the frame broke in half on both sides of the horns in he front. I fixed this many years ago. I think this truck is still on the road today.


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

TJS said:


> Never had a problem with what you say so called tempering when hardfacing edges. People also say you cannot weld on frames of vehicles. I never had a problem and my old man (82) was doing this way back in the day and never had a problem. All in prep and process. Somewhere there is a 85 Chev pickup where the frame broke in half on both sides of the horns in he front. I fixed this many years ago. I think this truck is still on the road today.


It would be nice if you didn't misrepresent my point.

Please re-read my post. I said "I was under the impression". I didn't say you"cannot" weld. You're changing what I said, and the meaning behind it, for whatever so called reason

There are talented, professional welders out there, and I do not claim to be one, that have skills beyond my wildest dreams of ever achieving. I'm in awe of their abilities, and will never hold myself equal to their skills.

I'm a firm believer that almost anything can be achieved, under the right circumstances, and in the hands of the right person.


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## TJS (Oct 22, 2003)

Dogplow Dodge said:


> It would be nice if you didn't misrepresent my point.
> 
> Please re-read my post. I said "I was under the impression". I didn't say you"cannot" weld. You're changing what I said, and the meaning behind it, for whatever so called reason
> 
> ...


Not sure where I misrepresented you. I quoted you. Your impression is wrong and I am telling you this though real world experience and not internet hersay. I am stating from my experience of many years of welding and fabricating and I am not an English writing major.


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

TJS said:


> Not sure where I misrepresented you. I quoted you. Your impression is wrong and I am telling you this though real world experience and not internet hersay. I am stating from my experience of many years of welding and fabricating and I am not an English writing major.


Cool..

Thanks for clarifying.

Maybe you can help or instruct the OP the proper technique for attaching the cobbled hunks on his plow blade, as to not wind up as road debris


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

LOL I dont think DogPlow.D needs to worry unless you come skiing at Hidden Valley or Seven Springs about chunks...lol


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## Dogplow Dodge (Jan 23, 2012)

PaTeeny said:


> LOL I dont think DogPlow.D needs to worry unless you come skiing at Hidden Valley or Seven Springs about chunks...lol


Here's the chunks that worry me the most!

Addictive chunks


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

PaTeeny said:


> I always feel like I am throwing away 1/3 of my cutting edge so I welded old cutting edge to back of new cutting edge.....cut old edge in 12" pieces and welded edges and welded the bolt holes to new cutting edge....Time will tell....
> 
> Any else ever try it?.....
> 
> ...


I can see that you are missing the center pin through the


PaTeeny said:


> I always feel like I am throwing away 1/3 of my cutting edge so I welded old cutting edge to back of new cutting edge.....cut old edge in 12" pieces and welded edges and welded the bolt holes to new cutting edge....Time will tell....
> 
> Any else ever try it?.....
> 
> ...





PaTeeny said:


> I always feel like I am throwing away 1/3 of my cutting edge so I welded old cutting edge to back of new cutting edge.....cut old edge in 12" pieces and welded edges and welded the bolt holes to new cutting edge....Time will tell....
> 
> Any else ever try it?.....
> 
> ...


Where is your center pin. I'm asking because why would you pull it out half way and flip the plow. Unless it broke off.


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## cjames808 (Dec 18, 2015)

I run a double stacked edge on Westerm heavy weight 10'.

I guess it's actually 6 cutting edges. MORE POWER.

Came like that. Was that or a single edge with orange carbide curb corners. DOPE.

Breaks right through and scrapes to the bone.


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## johnhenry1933 (Feb 11, 2013)

cjames808 said:


> View attachment 189925
> I run a double stacked edge on Westerm heavy weight 10'.
> 
> I guess it's actually 6 cutting edges. MORE POWER.
> ...


Yeah I was just running a 9' heavy (w/ wings that I removed) that has a 3/8"+ edge on 1/2 an acre of 1/2" of solid ice. Broke it up like a slushee. I love my Westerns.


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## kimber750 (Sep 19, 2011)

boutch said:


> I can see that you are missing the center pin through the
> 
> Where is your center pin. I'm asking because why would you pull it out half way and flip the plow. Unless it broke off.


Good eye, very easily could cause his uneven edge wear.


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## NYH1 (Jan 10, 2009)

PaTeeny said:


> yea it broke off just driving down the road.........had to out run the cops with the D9...I need new cleats on it as feels like I am on a mule bouncing....I was worried that the bouncing would make a blade pieces just drop off.....Putting a new can muffler on the Dozer to go faster.......


If I was on a D9, I'd just back over the cops. Out running them is a felony in most states nowadays....you don't want to get jammed up! 

NYH1.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I just like the speed of a D9...and the power...funner to out run them and see them try to stop me....

I flipped to get better access to bots and yes center pin has worked out some ...so hammered it back down ...welded a small holder and said Lets Roll...
Gentleman...the Plow is 15 years old.....I plow a bunch ....I have been plowing for 29 years....


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

Hey after 2 plowable snows all steel plates are on and holding up...plow still has not worn down to perfection but happy with results....the black paint came off at the welded are....


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

PaTeeny said:


> Hey after 2 plowable snows all steel plates are on and holding up...plow still has not worn down to perfection but happy with results....the black paint came off at the welded are....


Spend the money on carbide edges. Long run it'll pay off. Like these.


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## Mr.Markus (Jan 7, 2010)

John_DeereGreen said:


> Spend the money on carbide edges. Long run it'll pay off. Like these.
> View attachment 190348


He doesn't want to spend the money on regular edges...lol.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Mr.Markus said:


> He doesn't want to spend the money on regular edges...lol.


Short term pain, long term gain.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

I might but I just wanted to see if doubling works and it has...Will not be wasting steel but gaining time.....will see if it gets me 2 years or 3 years.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

Hey John Deere How much was the cutting edge?
Who did you buy it from...


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## tpendagast (Oct 27, 2012)

If one were to plow so much that the cutting edge wears down in a single season, you’d think replacing wear parts would be the least of ones problens due to the fat wallet from all that work. 
Most plowing companies have their issues in lean times with no snow fall.
Even if you have monthlies, mire snow is better because your contract plate shouldn’t be overloaded with monthlies.
The proper balance gives you more money with more snow but enough to get by without snow.

Tires are wear items.
Can you double up on them?
Maybe if I change all my trucks to duallies I’ll buy less rear tires?
That hasn’t worked for me yet.... 

Those things are just part of the numbers you figured in to get your price in the first place... 
McDonald’s doesn’t freak out and say “omg stop using straws!! We got to slow this straw using thing down!”
If they’re going through straws it means their sales are good and they can afford to buy more. 

When we have to bring our spreaders into the shop to replace fins on the spinners I smile, because it reminds me of what I already know : we do a lot of sanding and sanding is a high net service for us. 

If you’re spending time in your shop trying to save scrap metal.... because “you’re plowing so much” , in my opinion, that means something else is wrong... 
if the numbers were working for you, you wouldn’t be concerned about going through cutting edges.


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## johnhenry1933 (Feb 11, 2013)

tpendagast said:


> If one were to plow so much that the cutting edge wears down in a single season, you'd think replacing wear parts would be the least of ones problens due to the fat wallet from all that work.


That's it in a nutshell: if you are wearing your edge out quickly, you must be making good money...or not charging enough (if you feel the need to comment on it).


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

Just don't like to waste good American Steel.....and yes money is good but want more in my pocket for IE. toys...snowmobile, 4 wheeler and fishing trips. If you want to waste some just send it my way...
Needless to say the time wasted changing blades....I am telling you a good plasma cutter and welder can save you time......

It was a thought that I would try it and see....and seem to be working....


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## tpendagast (Oct 27, 2012)

PaTeeny said:


> Just don't like to waste good American Steel.....and yes money is good but want more in my pocket for IE. toys...snowmobile, 4 wheeler and fishing trips. If you want to waste some just send it my way...
> Needless to say the time wasted changing blades....I am telling you a good plasma cutter and welder can save you time......
> 
> It was a thought that I would try it and see....and seem to be working....


I don't want to be an ass dude: but there are bolts on the cutting edge which make for a pretty speedy swap out of the cutting edge.
I don't see how a plasma cutter and welder are going to help... unless the edge has been on so long you can break the nuts to get off the edge... but in your case at once a year that's unlikely.


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

No problem...cutting the old cutting edging smooth to weld to the back of the new cutting edge......I am not offend as simple question....look at the photo as I just made sure the old piece was firmly against the top support of the plow....and welded the sides to new cutting edge...


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## tpendagast (Oct 27, 2012)

PaTeeny said:


> No problem...cutting the old cutting edging smooth to weld to the back of the new cutting edge......I am not offend as simple question....look at the photo as I just made sure the old piece was firmly against the top support of the plow....and welded the sides to new cutting edge...
> 
> View attachment 190390
> 
> ...


Most of us are just putting on another cutting edge with bolts and moving on. 
We have ours made as a local steel fab place makes them cheaper than you can get from the dealer.
I had to make the original CAD template for them to cut the bolt holes and length and width to. But that was done years ago and now you just order another one, they're about half price done that way.

Seriuosly you're over thinking this 
If you're a welder/fabricator then thinking about how to make money doing that.
If your a plow company think about ways to make money doing that, not ways to save money welding... 
you'll make more money with your chosen profession with your time than you will with your same time spent on a hobby.
Which ever one you are better at, that should be your profession.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

PaTeeny said:


> Hey John Deere How much was the cutting edge?
> Who did you buy it from...


MHL Systems.


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## boutch (Aug 3, 2015)

John_DeereGreen said:


> MHL Systems.
> View attachment 190396


Wow those are not cheap. What the life expectancy of that compared to a regular hedge.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

boutch said:


> Wow those are not cheap. What the life expectancy of that compared to a regular hedge.


Chip says 10x OEM and while I think that may be a bit over optimistic, I've seen what the carbide edges are doing on other plows compared to OEM. I'm fairly confident it'll outlast 5 OEM edges without much difficulty. Break even for me is 2.1x OEM. So basically if it lasts twice as long it's the same final cost. Any longer and it's just free life on it.

Edit, our trucks mainly plow access roadways and around buildings etc. so the plows don't get a lot of hours, but the plowing they do is more similar to roadways than parking lots, and it's all on pavement that gets frequent salting so lots of wear on the edge.


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## cwren2472 (Aug 15, 2014)

John_DeereGreen said:


> Chip says 10x OEM and while I think that may be a bit over optimistic, I've seen what the carbide edges are doing on other plows compared to OEM. I'm fairly confident it'll outlast 5 OEM edges without much difficulty. Break even for me is 2.1x OEM. So basically if it lasts twice as long it's the same final cost. Any longer and it's just free life on it.


You were paying $600 for an OEM edge?


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

cwren2472 said:


> You were paying $600 for an OEM edge?


No. My break even is calculated with the main formed edges, wing edges, new hardware for the main plow edges, and an hour of in house labor to change it all each time.


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## tpendagast (Oct 27, 2012)

John_DeereGreen said:


> ....but the plowing they do is more similar to roadways than parking lots, and it's all on pavement that gets frequent salting so lots of wear on the edge.


That's a good point
I didn't think about that 
More than half our properties don't get salting

Now that that's getting more common here... plow edges will be replaced more often..

Good call on that


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## leigh (Jan 2, 2009)

This was a successful project, used a worn cutting edge and sander shaft to reuse these pricey blizzard wings .But a full cutting edge? Don't think so. If your worried about wasting it, put it in the steel pile, maybe use later. I guess getting some welding practice is one positive!


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

OMG $1,300.00 that is steep...I'D hope to get 4-5 times as much wear...if your getting 10x would be awesome.....


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Who cares how much it costs if it cuts your cost per hour in half....or more...

We’ve got 60+ hours on some of our carbide edges on Arctic Sectionals and the bottoms aren’t even worn level yet. 60 hours on OEM edges and you’d be preparing to change them out.


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## Mudly (Feb 6, 2019)

John_DeereGreen said:


> Who cares how much it costs if it cuts your cost per hour in half....or more...
> 
> We've got 60+ hours on some of our carbide edges on Arctic Sectionals and the bottoms aren't even worn level yet. 60 hours on OEM edges and you'd be preparing to change them out.


You sir, are a gem.


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## John_DeereGreen (Jan 2, 2011)

Mudly said:


> You sir, are a gem.


Well...that's a first


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## pipelayer (Oct 6, 2013)

@John_DeereGreen genalco wants 4-500 for 5/8 edges on my xv2. should kick the crap out of the standard 3/8 edges, those carbide edges seem like they'll blow any competitor out of the water. may have to give them a call Thumbs Up


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## PaTeeny (Dec 10, 2018)

will keep you posted...Hope and Pray for snow...


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