# Magic Salt Good or bad



## onemancrew (Feb 28, 2007)

ussmileyflag I live in northwest Iowa and thinking about becoming a dealer. How many of you guys use it and does it work like it says it does.


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## tuney443 (Jun 25, 2006)

I use it when it's real cold out,melts the ice much quicker than regular straight salt or my 60-40 salted sand.I would use it all the time but my clients would complain about the higher cost.I know all about using app. half the amount of Magic versus straight salt or salted sand,but it's hard for me to do this.I'm a more is better type of guy.Overall though,I think it's the cat's ass.I also love the smell.


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

The stuff works well, the price point is usually the problem. Most contractors wont pay the price for the product. If you have guys spreading sand in your area they sure as hell wont pay you what ya need for stock pile treatment. 
Its a tuff sell for sure, especially when ya got beat juice kicking the crap out of your prices
From what I have seen usually the dealers of this product are the biggest user's as well. 
I would not plan on recovering your investment quickly.


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## Mick (May 19, 2001)

T-MAN;666228 said:


> I would not plan on recovering your investment quickly.


Second that... Do your homework before jumping.


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## SpeedyGreenInc (Jul 17, 2008)

I think you would make 75% of your money selling the bagged salt anyways not the liquid. Pretty much everyone buys bagged salt and it shouldnt be hard to sway them towards magic.


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## onemancrew (Feb 28, 2007)

I looked and the only dealer is about 200 miles from me. The price is a little high. That is why I thought I would ask about it. Thanks Guys.


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

SpeedyGreenInc;666489 said:


> I think you would make 75% of your money selling the bagged salt anyways not the liquid. Pretty much everyone buys bagged salt and it shouldnt be hard to sway them towards magic.


Baged Magic around here is 3.5 -4+ times more then baged rock salt. If you use half as much (which I never seem to be able to do) your still paying way to much to see a decent profit. Most customers could care less what ya use, it is to the contractors advantage to use it in there arsenal.. Cold temps it does great, wet heavy concrete snow it has no benefit, all the mag dilutes right out. We get way to much wet heavy stuff to use it exclusively.
Like I said it works well, but for the price not to many guys willing to throw down $500 a skid when you can get 2.5 skids of rock salt.


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## EFR Landscaping (Oct 7, 2007)

I would use it all the time where I am its over $100 a ton in bulk and now salt is up to $90 now too.As for the product it works well, I always Defanitly get it if the temp . is gonna be below 18 degrees or expecting alot of ice. So basicly I use straight salt unless I feel I may need magic. I am noticing alot of guys here are using it and only it though. Sand and salt is becoming a thing of the past in my opinion. I would take the chance and sell it its the new thing... Good luck


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

EFR Landscaping;667333 said:


> I would use it all the time where I am its over $100 a ton in bulk and now salt is up to $90 now too.As for the product it works well, I always Defanitly get it if the temp . is gonna be below 18 degrees or expecting alot of ice. So basicly I use straight salt unless I feel I may need magic. I am noticing alot of guys here are using it and only it though. Sand and salt is becoming a thing of the past in my opinion. I would take the chance and sell it its the new thing... Good luck


If the price difference was only $10 dollars a ton you could sell the hell out of it. The problem is you still have the base price of a ton of salt no matter what it costs. So your always going to see $35+ more for a ton of magic. 
Your looking at close to $1000 more for each semi load.

EFR Do you know what a franchise cost's for Magic ? Its not cheap, and you really dont get alot of product to start off with. You would be lucky to recover a tenth of your investment if you only sell that amount of product the first season. The other problem is trucking to Iowa cost a couple bucks more then CT to. I have no clue what Magic is this season, last season I paid $3.75 a gallon. Im sure it went up.

If I lived in Iowa and had that kind of money to burn I would be looking at Geo Melt. Great product as well, most of the Muni's here are using it, and it is made in your backyard. No trucking from Up state New York to get it here.


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## 6feetdeep (Sep 8, 2006)

I've started using it this year, and so far see zero advantage over straight salt. I'm not sure if I got a 'bad batch' of it, or what, but for the last two seasons I used bagged rock salt exclusively. I got my hands on bulk 'magic' salt for less than what I could buy bags of straight rock salt for, and got myself set up to handle bulk (store it inside, use it through a tailgate spreader w/ vibrator) and it seems to spread pretty nice. But, I have seen zero advantage to it over the salt I used to spread. I've used it anywhere from pre-treating before a freezing rain, 1 inch of fluff, packed down wet heavy snow in 30+ degrees, and this am on 1-2 inches of dry snow in 5-15 degree weather. 
I have actually seen more negatives than positives: Ships wetter, therefore you get less material in a ton (water weight), is gummy and I had to purchase a $300 vibrator to make the stuff go through my spreader, and I've had complaints about foot traffic tracking the stuff into buildings and 'muddying' up the floors. Though I like the smell of it, I dont like the smell of the inside of my truck right now, from it tracking in on my boots.
I am trying to be very open-minded about this stuff, I've heard nothing but good from some very respected people in this business, and nothing but bad from some state DOT guys that have had bad luck with it for the very same reasons I have stated. The DOT has been using the same, or a very similar product for about 10 yrs. on limited applications.
I am hoping that I just got a 'bad batch' of the stuff??? Any insight or suggestions are certainly welcome.


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

6feetdeep;667411 said:


> I've started using it this year, and so far see zero advantage over straight salt. I'm not sure if I got a 'bad batch' of it, or what, but for the last two seasons I used bagged rock salt exclusively. I got my hands on bulk 'magic' salt for less than what I could buy bags of straight rock salt for, and got myself set up to handle bulk (store it inside, use it through a tailgate spreader w/ vibrator) and it seems to spread pretty nice. But, I have seen zero advantage to it over the salt I used to spread. I've used it anywhere from pre-treating before a freezing rain, 1 inch of fluff, packed down wet heavy snow in 30+ degrees, and this am on 1-2 inches of dry snow in 5-15 degree weather.
> I have actually seen more negatives than positives: Ships wetter, therefore you get less material in a ton (water weight), is gummy and I had to purchase a $300 vibrator to make the stuff go through my spreader, and I've had complaints about foot traffic tracking the stuff into buildings and 'muddying' up the floors. Though I like the smell of it, I dont like the smell of the inside of my truck right now, from it tracking in on my boots.
> I am trying to be very open-minded about this stuff, I've heard nothing but good from some very respected people in this business, and nothing but bad from some state DOT guys that have had bad luck with it for the very same reasons I have stated. The DOT has been using the same, or a very similar product for about 10 yrs. on limited applications.
> I am hoping that I just got a 'bad batch' of the stuff??? Any insight or suggestions are certainly welcome.


You should have seen results in the 5-15 degree weather. Magic should start working right away. Were salt "will just lay there" for some time before starting.
You should also have better residual as well. If the storm is wet snow or sleet it is no better then straight rock salt as high water content will rinse the mag down the drain.
Was the product treated then delivered ?


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## EFR Landscaping (Oct 7, 2007)

When I buy it its straight salt treated already with the liquid . I dont know anything about the price of it in a liquid form or even how much you would need in liquid . But Like I said I only get it if the temperature is goning to be less than 18 Degrees other than that I too do not see much diffrence between Straight salt.


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## onemancrew (Feb 28, 2007)

It sounds like it is good. I checked on the trucking to get it to me and the trucking is VERY BAD as in HIGH payup payup. I also looked at some companies that do salt and there is no one in 25 miles that salts. So I called them and the company said that there is some compnies that are intested in it but they are 50-250 miles from me and they would like for me to deliver it at no extra charge. I 'm not stupid I'm not going to drive say 150 miles and not get paid for my gas and time thats bad business don't you think I might be wrong. Thanks for the input.


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## dcf (Dec 19, 2005)

I've used it for four years with great success. If you have clumping usually that means the salt was wet when it was treated. I have run in to a few suppliers that claim they are selling Magic and it turned out they really were selling salt only treated with mag and that didn't work at all like the Magic did. The real deal is the real deal!


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## 6feetdeep (Sep 8, 2006)

Thats what worries me, the treated salt seems to be really wet. I've honestly noticed zero difference between the treated and regular. This morning I used it in 5-15 degree weather, after plowing off 2-3 inches of fluff that had been driven over in a few lots. The lots next to mine are treated w/ regular salt, and at about 10am, temp up to mid 20's all lots looked the same. Mine definately didn't melt off quicker.
Another apt. lot that was salted early this am, when checking it tonight is frozen right back over (temp tonight is 15-20. Zero residual. 
I am thinking bad treating or something. I'm banging my head.


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## dcf (Dec 19, 2005)

Definitely a problem with the material. You should definitely not have a refreezing problem. That for me has been one of the best benefits. I wonder if it was real Magic. Did you notice any brown runoff on the treated salt(bad) or a strong molasses odor(good)?


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## 6feetdeep (Sep 8, 2006)

Definately brown runoff, but it definately smells like molasses, too. Funny, I store it at my in-laws barn, neighbor was checking it out and smelled it, didn't know it was salt thought it was cow feed. 
I know I was told it would 'bleed' if it got wet, I usually try to scoop up from the bottom to get the most of the treatment w/ the salt. Still banging my head.


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## EFR Landscaping (Oct 7, 2007)

where Iget mine its staright salt that they treat, Isnt that what it is supposed to be? If I leave some in my sander it drips out my chute and seems to freeze up lik eif it is wet. It does smell like like molasses though..


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## plownoob (Aug 14, 2008)

maybe theyre watering it down with something to increase profits?


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## dcf (Dec 19, 2005)

The liquid wont freeze at any temperature that we will experience. We store it in tanks and have sprayed our own salt pile at 0 degrees. There wasn't any noticeable difference with spraying the liquid at that temperature other than I was miserable. If you had it freeze it must be tremendously diluted or not Magic. I use it a self storage facility and I know I use a lot less treated salt than I did sand salt and seldom have any refreeze. I'm not sure if I put down a little too much but I don't care if I don't get called back!


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

dcf;668087 said:


> The liquid wont freeze at any temperature that we will experience. We store it in tanks and have sprayed our own salt pile at 0 degrees. There wasn't any noticeable difference with spraying the liquid at that temperature other than I was miserable. If you had it freeze it must be tremendously diluted or not Magic. I use it a self storage facility and I know I use a lot less treated salt than I did sand salt and seldom have any refreeze. I'm not sure if I put down a little too much but I don't care if I don't get called back!


Your comparing treated salt to sand, what's the point of that?


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

If the salt was wet when it was treated you will have problems. Rock salt absorbs nothing, so you can only coat it so much. If the salt is already wet, then the magic will not cling like it should. I had a refreeze problem with the product as well. Extreme temps, If I recall it was down around 5 degree's. I did achieve a quicker burn off, then it refroze that night. Ended up droping a couple ton of straight wet white salt in there to mop up the mess.


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## kimber (Oct 27, 2008)

T-MAN;667401 said:


> If the price difference was only $10 dollars a ton you could sell the hell out of it. The problem is you still have the base price of a ton of salt no matter what it costs. So your always going to see $35+ more for a ton of magic.
> Your looking at close to $1000 more for each semi load.
> 
> EFR Do you know what a franchise cost's for Magic ? Its not cheap, and you really dont get alot of product to start off with. You would be lucky to recover a tenth of your investment if you only sell that amount of product the first season. The other problem is trucking to Iowa cost a couple bucks more then CT to. I have no clue what Magic is this season, last season I paid $3.75 a gallon. Im sure it went up.
> ...


I'm told in our area, a dealership is $50K. What were some of you others quoted. That price is for the purchase of a combination of bagged salt and straight liquid. The product seems good on paper, and from what i've read on here it does work as well as they state it will, but I'm still not sure. I'm actually going to meet with a local distributor within the next week. Any thoughts. Thanks


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## kimber (Oct 27, 2008)

I'm hearing comments mostly about the treated salt. Is there, or has there been much demand for the application of straight magic -0 liquid? What price ranges are you hearing for this product? thanks.


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## Stud Bro (Oct 24, 2007)

this is my first year using magic salt i treated it my self and did some side by side tests and the results were very surprising.

1. Plain salt melted the 1inch of snow and a thin layer of ice faster than magic salt allot faster. how ever over night the magic side caught up and with the taper that was on the slab the magic salt test area grew larger than the actual area in witch it was spread.

2. Magic salt dose track tire pick it up and spread it for you. I have not received any complains yet about it being tracked in to stores but i have only spread it a half of a dozen times.

3. If we plow and then spread magic salt if we get a 1 inch snow storm the next day magic dose a very good job of melting it with no need to plow.

4 As far as using 50% less i think 50%is a stretch more like 35% but u do use less the salt doesn't freeze up in the spreader we fill our trucks the day before the storm throw a tarp over and haven't had a single freeze up as long as the salt doesn't get wet.

5 as long as salt is over $100.00 per ton i will continue to use it because it is saving me money (all my salt contracts are flat rate)


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## kimber (Oct 27, 2008)

Stud Bro;672368 said:


> this is my first year using magic salt i treated it my self and did some side by side tests and the results were very surprising.
> 
> 1. Plain salt melted the 1inch of snow and a thin layer of ice faster than magic salt allot faster. how ever over night the magic side caught up and with the taper that was on the slab the magic salt test area grew larger than the actual area in witch it was spread.
> 
> ...


Wow, now that was some good information. Thanks for taking the time to go into all that detail. Continued Success to you.


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## kimber (Oct 27, 2008)

Stud Bro;672368 said:


> this is my first year using magic salt i treated it my self and did some side by side tests and the results were very surprising.
> 
> 1. Plain salt melted the 1inch of snow and a thin layer of ice faster than magic salt allot faster. how ever over night the magic side caught up and with the taper that was on the slab the magic salt test area grew larger than the actual area in witch it was spread.
> 
> ...


Oops...couple of questions.

Please re explain what you mean in your first point. Since you treat your own salt, what did the liquid cost you per gallon if you don't mind sharing. thanks again.


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## tuney443 (Jun 25, 2006)

When I use Magic on my commercial lots,say at 7AM,by noon that lot will not only be melted,it will be dry.It is very good stuff when mixed with salt correctly.It sounds like something else in some of these posts.


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## farmboy52787 (Mar 22, 2007)

Stud Bro;672368 said:


> this is my first year using magic salt i treated it my self and did some side by side tests and the results were very surprising.
> 
> 1. Plain salt melted the 1inch of snow and a thin layer of ice faster than magic salt allot faster. how ever over night the magic side caught up and with the taper that was on the slab the magic salt test area grew larger than the actual area in witch it was spread.
> 
> ...


This is my first year using it and the trick that i was told use as little as possible and its worked great for me. It provides some traction because the liquid is rough. This morning it was sleeting/freezing rain and I salted 10 parking lots and 2 condos and I used about 1.3 yards. I have my fisher sander barely open and full throttle and i drive around about 10mph and it does a great job. I even checked parking lots 8 hours later and no ice had built up at all. Now that its freezing up again tonight I'll have to do em all tomorrow again but they're sayin were gonna get quite a lot of ice. Last Tuesday I was checking one of the banks i take care of and the lot was all glazed over with ice, really slippery, went around everywhere applying magic salt and it instantly started working and no more ice. The dealer i talked to showed me everything about Magic Salt and explained everything. Its so much better because come time for Spring Cleanup, I'll charge the same price, but there wont be any sand to clean up, lucky me. Also when you look at it for cost I bought 20 tons of it for $2350 delivered, then another $650 to have it treated. Ok so thats $3000 bucks, and about 17 yards of salt. I'd say this year i have used 2.5 yards and already made atleast $700 salting for black ice and this mornings mess. So you do the math it easily pays for itself, just use as little as possible and it works. I could even save more money by getting a tank and pump and buying the magic -0 liquid and treating my own pile but that will probably be next year. Another good thing about it is that you can store it in a storage container and it will not rust it out. Ive rented a 20' for $75 a month and the salt is easily paying for that too. Also I left some in my sander when it was 12 degrees out and it didnt freeze up at all, I wont ever have to worry about putting my sander inside to keep warm. I could never imagine using salt sand again, i would have had to come back to my shop to fill up the sander again because you have to put so much done to get it to work. Another thing too I didnt go up on my prices for salting either, i just planned on using half as much as salt sand. One last thing since bulk piles are treated 8 gallons per ton you dont want to use it for sidewalks or entrances to buildings because it tracks the liquid in and makes a mess so instead buy the bags of Magic Salt which are treated 4 gallons per ton and that way it wont track into buildings. For my condos and parking lots I bought a pallet of bagged Magic Salt and put that in barrels with scoops so whoever or myself can spread some out. I've typed enough.


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

My expierience with Magic is that it extends the useful temperature range of salt, if used as a treatment Magic 0 which by the way can be purchased in almost exactly the same chemical composition for much less money is a great pre-treatment, it really does help prevent the bond between the ice/snow and pavement, thereby giving you a much cleaner surface after a plowing pass. It will not take the place of salt completely. Also traffic really helps in a lot. Like many others have said, it's just another tool, if somebody comes up with something thats cost effective, not any more labor intensive than whats availible now, and works regardless of temp/traffic that company will do extremely well, unitl then we do as we can.........


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## T-MAN (Jan 9, 2001)

When Magic Dilutes out it becomes a greasy, slippery mess. I mix my own bulk batchs, so I always get some liquid driping out of the v-box. On my drive last week were the truck was parked there was a slick spot, When the rain mixed with the liquid, and temps droped. The "spot" were the liquid leaked out was far more dangerous then the untreated drive.
I am no chemist, but my guess is the Mag Chloride in the Magic re-acted with the moisture, and caused this. I can not imagine spraying a lot with Magic -0 and getting rain, freezing rain then temps droping. Talk about a nightmare. 

Magic has its place, but when temps are high, or the water content in the snow is high, it is no better then straight rock salt. ANY MOISTURE will rinse the Magic right off the rock salt, dilute then go down the drain. Also just like rock salt, any residual will not hang around if you get any rain or high water content snow. When water runs out of the piles yer pushing save your money.

Forest Fire Guy are you refering to Ice Ban for the cheaper product, with similar results ?


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## forestfireguy (Oct 7, 2006)

I was referring to straight mag chloride, a company out of NY that we got some potassium acetate from for a environmentally sensitive location reccomended it and as cheap as it was we tried it, similar results....not the same, defintiely increase in effectivemess over staright salt, and used alone performed as well if nopt better that Pot acetate.


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## Stud Bro (Oct 24, 2007)

kimber;672455 said:


> Oops...couple of questions.
> 
> Please re explain what you mean in your first point. Since you treat your own salt, what did the liquid cost you per gallon if you don't mind sharing. thanks again.


$ 4.00 per gallon your suposed to use 8 gal a ton i only used 4 (i think my salt was a little to wet befor started treated it) I cant wait till next year if i get some dryer salt and can use the entire 8 gal a ton


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