# I will let you know what happens....



## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

... expecting heavy snow fall in the Baltimore, MD area. I invoice after each snow plow. It's been over 2 weeks and I have some unpaid invoices. I do not plan to show up and plow for those that owe me. If they call and offer to pay in full when I arrive, I'll take the money and plow. One person told me that she lost my 1st invoice. Okay, I can believe that. She called to have her driveway plowed again. I am thinking >>> If you lost my invoice, you could have called for a duplicate. >>> No, you just call when you want your driveway plowed. Not this time!!!!


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

All I can say is seasonal contracts


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## nepatsfan (Sep 16, 2004)

lettuce know! 2 weeks and you're shutting them off?! I don't think I'd have customers


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## JohnDeere2320 (Dec 12, 2009)

I invoice at the end of each month, and have 30 day payment terms. Which means if we plow on the first of the month, we could go 60 days before getting paid for it. You may be a little optimistic expecting to get paid by 2 weeks after a service. I know it can take a lot of funds to bankroll a snow removal operation especially in a winter like this one. It may be a little inconvenient for your customers to have to write, say, 6 checks a month as well if you invoice after each storm. I think people like to anticipate when their bills are due. They know when their electricity, water, gas, ect bills are sent each month and know when they are due so they can plan when to send payments out. Getting a number of invoices per month from one company can lead to a lot of paperwork and lost bills.

I really am not trying to pick on you, but maybe you could save yourself and your customers some headaches if you were to invoice on a more set schedule.


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

Grandview: This is where you and I disagree. There are certainly advantages to both. I prefer my method.
Nepatsfan & John Deere: You both make valid points ... stay tuned .....


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

By the way,2 weeks is nothing.I'm surprised if I get something back so soon.


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## Snow tracker (Jan 31, 2014)

Soooo.. Are you changing your billing now? At the end of the snow season? Do your customer know what is expected of them? I have some customers that use a service to pay bills and it only happens once a month. I know I would hate to write that many checks a month. It sure would help cash flow to be paid often though. Keep us posted on how it works out for you. We all may learn something new. Good luck


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## scott3430 (Dec 28, 2010)

To each his own Lettuce. If I have a big snow month I can bill a few commercial customers 2/ a month. But I think all my other customers like the stability of a set snow bill getting to them around the first of each month.


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## allagashpm (Sep 29, 2012)

That's crazy lol..did you send any follow up inquiries? You will probably lose those customers and will probably not recieve what is owed


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## Bossman 92 (Sep 27, 2006)

2 weeks and you are cutting them off???? LOL Are you serious?


I assume you dont dabble much in the commercial side of this business. I have customers that are current on their bill and they still owe their December bill... thats 11 weeks behind.

If I had 2 week pay terms I would have only a couple customers......If I was lucky.


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## UltraLwn&Lndscp (Oct 20, 2013)

all I can say is wow. Per storm invoicing is something I can't fathom. You must have 6 customers. Stamps are pushing $.50


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## M & MD Lawn (Aug 29, 2010)

On small per push accounts I bill per storm, now larger businesses I agree with a set billing cycle which for me would be monthly.


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## Triton2286 (Dec 29, 2011)

UltraLwn&Lndscp;1776642 said:


> all I can say is wow. Per storm invoicing is something I can't fathom. You must have 6 customers. Stamps are pushing $.50


People still send invoices through the mail?


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## nepatsfan (Sep 16, 2004)

Triton2286;1776694 said:


> People still send invoices through the mail?


Thumbs Up:whistling:

I didn't realize it was that absurd but I suppose in this day and age, if it isn't, it's probably getting there.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

My customers would fire me if I invoiced per storm. 

And I can't even imagine how I would have been able to send that many out. Dec-January I would have been invoicing just about every day. Pretty sure no one wants 50+ invoices, 4 was just fine with them.


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## Mike_C (Feb 9, 2014)

Two weeks and you're cutting them off? Wow, hope you're ready to lose those customers. If I cut people off after two weeks my trucks would all be sitting at my yard with nothing to do whenever it snowed. I don't know who would be more pissed at me if I invoiced per storm, my customers for hitting them with 20 something separate bills or my secretary for having to send them out


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Question for you lettuce, what does your contract state? 

I assume (lol) you have this all spelled out.


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## Omega (Dec 22, 2013)

*know the feeling*

In this area a typical winter is 4-5 events of 2-3" and that has been true for the last couple years. We handle both commercial and residential, my commercial are net 30 and my residential are either on the spot or at the end of the season(maybe $200) so I can see how it might be overwhelming this year. I suspended service to Royal Farms(gas/quick stop) since they started randomly shorting my invoices( over $8k):realmad: and stretching out the payment time(60+) The strange thing is they have yet to explain or respond to my emails or calls.....I have a feeling they might come around with todays snowpayuppayup


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## Wilnip (Oct 4, 2011)

Wonder how you would feel if your water company sent a bill after every shower? Or you got a heating bill after the furnace turned on? If you are running a business, treat it like a business.


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## Flawless440 (Dec 6, 2010)

We invoice every few events, large storms try to do every event..

We do it to keep $$$ rolling in.. Some properties rack up a 5k invoice in a event, i couldn't see letting that build up and send them a invoice for 50k..

My big contracts are 45 day pay, still have two huge ones i haven't seen any $$ all season.


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## UltraLwn&Lndscp (Oct 20, 2013)

Triton2286;1776694 said:


> People still send invoices through the mail?


Yes some people do. My residential clients get them. My checks come in through the mail. Its a bit more personal than sending through technology. Would you like the United States Post Office to disappear? If not buy stamps and send mail. I dislike text messages too most of the time. I feel they are impersonal. I am 30 years old.


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## ByDesign (Sep 2, 2011)

I was like you when I started, I had 15 day payment terms or late fees got charged. I didn't that for 1/2 a season...too much of a pin in the ass. 
I still invoice after every storm, but that's more so I don't loose track of the snow amounts. Now I have relaxed and my resi accounts usually pay in about 1-2 weeks and the commercial is about 30-45 days. You get used to it, plan for the middle of your months to be little income.

If you are going to continue to provide service the way you do, at least provide the names if your accounts and help fellow members to know where to bid when they ditch you!


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## GMC Driver (Sep 9, 2005)

No different here - even the e-mailed ones get a paper copy.

Glad to hear we`re not the only ones waiting. Got a few that are over 60. What hurts is the Jan 1 invoices are for work done in Dec - so we`ve already carried the month for them.

Phone calls are critical - they may offer alot of excuses, but in the end they owe it. Usually the ones that wait are just holding out until you call, and I`m not sure they budgeted for a winter like this. The last few years they got off easy.

As much as contracts are worrisome this year - they are necessary for the cash flow.


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## ByDesign (Sep 2, 2011)

UltraLwn&Lndscp;1776919 said:


> Yes some people do. My residential clients get them. My checks come in through the mail. Its a bit more personal than sending through technology. Would you like the United States Post Office to disappear? If not buy stamps and send mail. I dislike text messages too most of the time. I feel they are impersonal. I am 30 years old.


I agree, however with the unreliable of the postal service in my area, email works best. I always make sure add a paragraph or so of witty banter to establish a good relationship. As long as you are following your contract and taking care of the client, payment has never been an issue. I also meet with every client at the beginning in and end of the season. I ask what we could have done better or what they were not happy about. It shows clients you really care.


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## jrs.landscaping (Nov 18, 2012)

We have one contract that is invoiced every week,

A) because they are 45 day net

B) anything over x amount needs to be verified and then re verified by the corporate office.

I used to have a few residentials who paid after every event, their idea not mine.


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## downtoearthnh (Jan 16, 2009)

The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


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## Wilnip (Oct 4, 2011)

downtoearthnh;1777238 said:


> The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


What a dlck


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## Buswell Forest (Jan 11, 2013)

The biggest issues with billing every event, for those of us who plow 20+ events as a start, is the paperwork is bottomless...and getting the money in small doses leads to pissing it away..
A monthly billing leads to windfall amounts, amounts big enough to pay off large debts, or buy equipment. 
I use a 13x8 generic 3 copy contractor's invoice that I buy @ Staples. It has room enough for the whole month and then some. Each event, I list the amount, time I was there, and fee. Then at the end of the month, add it up and mail it out. 

YES, I said mail it out. I also had staples make me up several hundred stickers with my name and addy.
I buy the peel off self adhesive envelopes while I am there too...small and large sizes.
I write out each customer's addy on the large envelope, attach my return addy sticker and a stamp, and enclose a small self addressed and stamped envelope with the invoice.
Yes, I spend $20 on postage once a month. It's tax deductible. You might be surprised at how much faster your money arrives when you give them a pre stamped and addressed envelope. People notice little things like that.


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## ALC-GregH (Nov 26, 2008)

Wilnip;1777241 said:


> What a dlck


you got that right.....:angry:


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## Triton2286 (Dec 29, 2011)

downtoearthnh;1777238 said:


> The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


What the hell was the point of this post?


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## JohnDeere2320 (Dec 12, 2009)

> The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


Lol the Christian in me tells me that its wrong, especially if she was a sweet little old lady that loved to see you show up and complimented your work and always wanted to hear about what's going on in your life. Now if she was crotchety, nit picked every little thing, and called every 10 minutes once the snow stopped to wonder where you are then I can't say I wouldn't be glad not to have to work for her anymore.

I'm sure we've all been in positions like that before and I have found out how to handle it. If she is the crotchety type, I will politely decline to work for her the next season. If she is the sweet understanding type I will put her at the end of the route (which is only about 6 hours after the end of the storm, and she's likely not leaving anyway if the roads are bad) and be happy to take the extra time to clear her drive and talk to her for a few minutes. Sometimes the only interaction these old folks get is at the doctors office or when someone comes over to perform services around the house.


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

Got more grief here than I expected but I am glad that I started this topic. I most likely will change my billing procedures next season. Seems that my customers are no different than most of yours. I was out for 12 hours today and I did collect some back money. 

I do have 1 contract and everybody else is not by contract. The 1 that is by contract is the 1 that owes the most. The payment terms are clearly spelled out. The customer is late on payment. Go figure!


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Here you go Lettuce. We all took care of you!


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

Lmao !!!!!!!!!


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## Flawless440 (Dec 6, 2010)

downtoearthnh;1777238 said:


> The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


Way to much work for $20.....


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## 94gt331 (Oct 21, 2011)

downtoearthnh;1777238 said:


> The only client I have had in my history of plowing who paid per event was a 90 year old, who still drove. Her car was parked outside, and she would wait for me, open her inside door and wait for me to shovel my way to her door, all the time waving the crisp $20 that she was so proud to give me. She would then bring out her broom, I would walk her out so she could brush off her car, move it out of the way so I could do a good job, and then walk her back in. OMG I am sorry , but did not regret her passing. Is that so wrong?


I hope you were joking and not being serious here. Anyway I have a couple old timers like that, they are a very honest hard working breed that really cares about you, it's kind of nice that they are thinking about paying you before you are even done. It is tough sometimes when your real busy and don't really have time to talk but if you can put them off to alittle lator in your route maybe you can slow down alittle and put a smile on there face.


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## downtoearthnh (Jan 16, 2009)

Long winter, thought the post would bring a little comic relief, and yes, this sort of customer reminds all of us that at some point in our lives, we too, will be dependant on others for what we once took for granted. Sorry to all of you who took it literally!


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## nepatsfan (Sep 16, 2004)

downtoearthnh;1777625 said:


> Long winter, thought the post would bring a little comic relief, and yes, this sort of customer reminds all of us that at some point in our lives, we too, will be dependant on others for what we once took for granted. Sorry to all of you who took it literally!


Thumbs Up

sometimes sarcasm or joking around gets misinterpreted on the computer. It happens to me all the time!


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## Wilnip (Oct 4, 2011)

I knew you were joking, as was my response.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

If it had been a real post,she would of offered him some cookies with that double sawbuck.


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## SnowGuy73 (Apr 7, 2003)

Triton2286;1777293 said:


> What the hell was the point of this post?


I was wondering the same......


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## snocrete (Feb 28, 2009)

Triton2286;1776694 said:


> People still send invoices through the mail?


lol, I still have 7 accounts that prefer this...but obviously most want email.



Mark Oomkes;1776851 said:


> My customers would fire me if I invoiced per storm. *If I was in a higher snow area, I could see this being more common...but it honestly is the opposite for me, here, with most of my customers. Just like pricing, I would say that its relative to your area.*
> 
> And I can't even imagine how I would have been able to send that many out. Dec-January I would have been invoicing just about every day. Pretty sure no one wants 50+ invoices, 4 was just fine with them.


Invoicing after each event, in theory, will boost cash flow...granted you have fast paying customers lol. The other + to this, is if something is in question, its still fresh in everyones mind(I just went through this with a customer on the storm before last, they had a question about the bill, and everything was resolved quickly & easily). No 1 right way to invoice, what works for some, dosent for others. BTW, I lump multi day storms into 1 bill(on the rare occasion that happens here). With us having a record winter in my area, It has really made me see more clearly why higher snow areas (customers & contractors) do things somewhat differently. But I will continue to bill out after each event because that's what my customers expect...and for me, it does boost cash flow.

Like some others said, if I required 2 week payouts, I wouldn't have many of my customers. Typically its 30days for us. I do have some that consistently take 45-60 days, but I knew that when going into it, so its fine...but I do have some customers that will consistently pay within 1 week after billed, and I don't mind it.


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Still send out invoices though the mail,I like it that way. And also still use payment books when i get a loan from my bank,the good olde days!


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## Omega (Dec 22, 2013)

Wilnip;1776906 said:


> Wonder how you would feel if your water company sent a bill after every shower? Or you got a heating bill after the furnace turned on? If you are running a business, treat it like a business.


Water company??? whats that....i figure 30 days is more than enough time, hell they expect me to pay for all the fuel I put in the tankThumbs Up


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## 94gt331 (Oct 21, 2011)

downtoearthnh;1777625 said:


> Long winter, thought the post would bring a little comic relief, and yes, this sort of customer reminds all of us that at some point in our lives, we too, will be dependant on others for what we once took for granted. Sorry to all of you who took it literally!


Cheers!Thumbs Up


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## NickSnow&Mow (Jul 12, 2014)

Flawless440;1777507 said:


> Way to much work for $20.....


I used to charge 20$ per push for a 4 car drive shoveling included. What would you charge?


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## thelettuceman (Nov 23, 2010)

I have $85.00 still owed to me from this past season. Best $85.00 I never got because I don't want the account anymore even if the customer did pay the $85.00


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## Defcon 5 (Mar 20, 2014)

NickSnow&Mow;1816733 said:


> I used to charge 20$ per push for a 4 car drive shoveling included. What would you charge?


$19.98...........ussmileyflag.......That's American Dollars....Not that Looney and Tooney stuff.....payup


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## NickSnow&Mow (Jul 12, 2014)

Defcon 5;1816857 said:


> $19.98...........ussmileyflag.......That's American Dollars....Not that Looney and Tooney stuff.....payup


why so low?


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## gc3 (Dec 6, 2007)

Somebody has to


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## Chineau (Aug 24, 2010)

Somebody has to be the wal-mart.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

Defcon 5;1816857 said:


> $19.98...........ussmileyflag.......That's American Dollars....Not that Looney and Tooney stuff.....payup


$19.95, and I'll be happy to take Looney's and Tooney's.


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