# 2000 Spaces?



## Duramax66 (Aug 24, 2008)

I have a shopping center that is asking me to place a bid. I haven't had a chance to measure it but they said that it is 2000 parking spaces in the lots plus some drives and loading docks. Is there a way to estimate acre's from spaces?


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## Chrisxl64 (Dec 10, 2008)

measure one space,,,and multiply


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## bigmudder77 (Dec 5, 2007)

Chrisxl64;785559 said:


> measure one space,,,and multiply


bingo

im guessing one spot will be close to 7ft-8ft wide by 16ft long

thats just a guess though


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

Find JD Dave on here he can help you out. If you can get a few hundred per space you should make out. Salting is extra right?


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## RLM (Jan 12, 2006)

You really need to measure the lot & see the layout. I went to school for civil engineering part of a class was on that (parking lot layout), the spaces per sq ft can vary greatly. Then add in roadways. 
They may know the sq ft of the lot if you ask. I did one bid last season, they knew exactly as it had just been sealcoated & measured by 3 sealcoat co's, I went & looked, closed enough (the numbers seemed about right to work with).


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## dirtmandan2 (Nov 2, 2007)

why not go there and measure it???


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## JohnnyRoyale (Jun 18, 2006)

You can measure on Google Earth without having to go there.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

JohnnyRoyale;786310 said:


> You can measure on Google Earth without having to go there.


That would be your best bet but if I had to guess 2000 spots will be really close to 20 acres.


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## TPC Services (Dec 15, 2005)

JD Dave is my hero!!! One of these days I will be as good as him, just like rain man he is , ask him a ? and he'll spit the correct answer out just like a friggin computer!! why do we did one we got JD Dave (LOL)


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

littleo92;786377 said:


> why do we did one we got JD Dave (LOL)


 I find it very difficult to understand a lot of your posts........

I agree google earth is a very nice tool to have in your estimating arsenal, but you definitely need to take the time and go out to the site to make sure you know what the condition of the lot is, what the curbs look like, whether there are now pallets or building expansion that now takes up 1/2 the parking lot and to make sure the property in general is the same as what it was when the image of the property was taken.


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## JohnnyRoyale (Jun 18, 2006)

Your absolutely right...and i wouldnt price a property without seeing it-and wouldnt recommend that practice to anyone. But when it comes to measuring, I'd rather do it online, cuz my measuring tape is only 16 ft long and i'm not that good at math. 

Plus, It also allows me to see what it is I'm going out to price, and if its even worth pursuing.


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## Brant'sLawnCare (Jun 29, 2007)

Longae29;786450 said:


> I find it very difficult to understand a lot of your posts........
> 
> I agree google earth is a very nice tool to have in your estimating arsenal, but you definitely need to take the time and go out to the site to make sure you know what the condition of the lot is, what the curbs look like, whether there are now pallets or building expansion that now takes up 1/2 the parking lot and to make sure the property in general is the same as what it was when the image of the property was taken.


I agree. I go to the jobsite and look at it then go and measure it out on G-earth to make sure my estimates are correct. But just going to Google Earth is not so good, because it's hard to estimate time without actually seeing it.


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

So glad everyone bills out hourly for nice size jobs down here.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BladeScape;788587 said:


> So glad everyone bills out hourly down here.


Really, why is that.


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

cretebaby;788589 said:


> Really, why is that.


Well it's easier to just give your hourly price on equipment, than to figure out a per push price in my eyes.


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## JD Dave (Mar 20, 2007)

BladeScape;788590 said:


> Well it's easier to just give your hourly price on equipment, than to figure out a per push price in my eyes.


If I had to plow hourly I'd quit. My whole goal in life is to find the most efficient ways to do jobs and working by the hour takes that incentive away. JMO


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

JD Dave;788597 said:


> If I had to plow hourly I'd quit. My whole goal in life is to find the most efficient ways to do jobs and working by the hour takes that incentive away. JMO


I'm like that with lawn and landscaping.

But what happens when a storm kicks your arse? and you can't finish your contracted "per push" requirements? Do you just eat the losses?


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BladeScape;788607 said:


> But what happens when a storm kicks your arse? and you can't finish your contracted "per push" requirements? Do you just eat the losses?


What do you mean?


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## Longae29 (Feb 15, 2008)

JD Dave;788597 said:


> If I had to plow hourly I'd quit. My whole goal in life is to find the most efficient ways to do jobs and working by the hour takes that incentive away. JMO


I couldn't agree with you more.



BladeScape;788607 said:


> I'm like that with lawn and landscaping.
> 
> But what happens when a storm kicks your arse? and you can't finish your contracted "per push" requirements? Do you just eat the losses?


Thats why you price it on a graduated scale for parking lots that are going to take longer to do when there is more snow. 1-4'', 4-8''. 8''+ then there is no arse kicking payup


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

cretebaby;788620 said:


> What do you mean?





Longae29;788709 said:


> Thats why you price it on a graduated scale for parking lots that are going to take longer to do when there is more snow. 1-4'', 4-8''. 8''+ then there is no arse kicking payup


I have a per-push lot that I sub out with that same scale...

Problem is that when a 12 inch storm comes in, and the actual weather measurements are at 7 inches, and you bill out for two separate pushes at 6 inches each, clients ask questions I can't answer....After a while the whole : "that's what we measured on site" won't work.

There are some lots where an entire area never sees the sun the entire year, and other areas get pounded with the sun. The parts with no sun ever can have 3 or 4 times the amount of accumulation than other parts of the lot. Is that a 2 inch push or a 6 incher?

I know you guys are obviously going to bill out in your favor...but do you ever get pissed off clients?

Also what happens when you start pushing a lot immediately at the 1 or 2 inch trigger...and by the time you get 3/4 done...there is 6 inches on the lot? Is that a 3.5 inch push or something?


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BladeScape;788730 said:


> I have a per-push lot that I sub out with that same scale...
> 
> Problem is that when a 12 inch storm comes in, and the actual weather measurements are at 7 inches, and you bill out for two separate pushes at 6 inches each, clients ask questions I can't answer....After a while the whole : "that's what we measured on site" won't work.
> 
> ...


I look at things a little different than Longae.

I like the KSSS plan

One push is one push no matter how much snow, you got to remember that it all averages out. The 12'' storm sucks but the 1'' are gravy.

Thats why I like seasonals better and better all the time.

Just like you stated hourly is easy to bid, but that allows every Thomas, Richard and Harold to bid on it also. Bidding per push and seasonal weeds out some of the crap and keeps it honest IMO.


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

cretebaby;788734 said:


> I look at things a little different than Longae.
> 
> I like the KSSS plan
> 
> ...


I can't see how billing a 12" storm the same as a 1" storm weeds out the crap and keeps it honest. And I would dread a big storm coming in...as opposed to enjoying it.

With hourly...All your bases are covered.

I'm not against per-push, or even seasonal.

It's just that it's all hourly down here. I can't change that.

And just because it's hourly...doesn't mean you plow slow. By no means would I be working for who I do If I wasn't an efficient plower...hours are easy to get as long as there is snow. Crappy subs are how the snow contractors lose sites.


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## MileHigh (Nov 6, 2007)

It's all about service in my eyes.

With hourly...during a day-time storm for example. I can come into a lot, push the entries and exits, and drives, have my sidewalk crew handle what needs to be done, drop some melt on the walks...take a measly 45 min, bill out for 1hr and a half + ice melt...the place looks great and is safe.

I go to the next site and start all over again all day long untll the cars are gone...billing out multiple sites at the same time while only being at one, and just waiting for cars to leave so we can clear the whole lot.

I'm not stuck at one site trying to "fufill my contractual agreements" so I can feel comfortable billing out for an entire push at who knows what inch accumulation.

A whole day and night of per-push lots would be scetch in my eyes.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

BladeScape;788737 said:


> I can't see how billing a 12" storm the same as a 1" storm weeds out the crap and keeps it honest. And I would dread a big storm coming in...as opposed to enjoying it..


That's not really what I said.

Bidding per push keeps it honest because the owner can't be over charged.

Hourly guys can bid a low hourly rate and then jack up the hours to make up the difference.



BladeScape;788737 said:


> It's just that it's all hourly down here. I can't change that.


I used to think the same thing.

Offer the client a push price or seasonal beside your traditional hourly rate. You might be surprised how much interest you have in doing it in a way other than hourly.

Beside a 12'' storm will almost never be billed only as one push. You set up parameters to work in before the season and charge accordingly. For example a office building that opens at 7 am would be plowed by 6:30 and it takes a 1/2 hour to plow it. So you start plowing between 5:30 and 6:00 whether it is done snowing or not and come back and do it again when it is done snowing and charge them for 2 pushes no matter how much or how little you got.


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