# How much salt do you guys like to mix with your sand? What size sand?



## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

I have found a sand for $7/ton with a $75 delivery charge. Any suggestions on the size of the granules? You don't want it too fine right? 

How many parts sand should I mix with the salt? For example how many lbs salt per ton of sand? 

Thanks guys, I am new so bear with me.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

kruser6;792263 said:


> I have found a sand for $7/ton with a $75 delivery charge. Any suggestions on the size of the granules? You don't want it too fine right?
> 
> How many parts sand should I mix with the salt? For example how many lbs salt per ton of sand?
> 
> Thanks guys, I am new so bear with me.


Don't waste your time with sand.


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## leon (Nov 18, 2008)

*salting sand etc.*



kruser6;792263 said:


> I have found a sand for $7/ton with a $75 delivery charge. Any suggestions on the size of the granules? You don't want it too fine right?
> 
> How many parts sand should I mix with the salt? For example how many lbs salt per ton of sand?
> 
> Thanks guys, I am new so bear with me.


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As general rule mason sand is used, usually 80% sand 20% salt, even less with calcium
thats what works in the east anyway.:waving:


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## mvhauler (Jan 26, 2009)

A lot of folks don't use/like sand as it leaves a mess. Most use straight salt. I use sand where I'm at. We have steep hills. If I were to use straight salt I would have no customers because of the cost. I used to mix 35% salt 65% sand,but right now I'm mixing calcium chloride liquid in with the sand. I am thinking of going with about 20% salt in addition to the chloride to have better melting power. I have one customer that wants no salt at all. You'll need to put something in the sand to keep it from freezing. The street dept. where I work only uses about 10-15% salt and the pile sits outside. The guy is cheap. The pile partially froze last winter, what fun that was. My product sits in a covered bin to protect it from the elements and dilution. As for size, I use sand with up to pea gravel size.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

How much are you really saving them by using sand?


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## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

cretebaby;792456 said:


> How much are you really saving them by using sand?


I don't know!

I thought this site would be great for information, but honestly I have gotten nothing but this - 

I have yet to get a straight answer from anyone. I don't know these answers which is why I am asking.

I know how to get customers, run a business, and plow snow. I have a sub for hauling, and I have 8 subs plowing for me. The last thing I really need is answers on the salting part and I can't get a straight answer ANYWHERE.

Is there anyone out there that doesn't work in central IA that would be willing to call me and talk me through the salting aspect? Please. 515-681-5082


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

I will try to help.
The Town here uses a 10% mix. I find that too hard to spread.
My contract calls for a 20% mix. I buy what we call Sharp sand, it is very coarse sand. Do not use fine sand, like brick sand.
I mix my own sand/salt mix. I put 1 large bucket of sand down, then 1 medium bucket of salt on top and then 1 large bucket of sand on top of that and then flip it/mix it with the skid steer. My concentration is around 30%. If I had my way they would get pure salt but this is what they want and I make a little bit more money but not much.


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## deicepro (Mar 24, 2009)

cretebaby;792268 said:


> Don't waste your time with sand.


I agree with cretebaby. I try to use straight salt unless someone has to have salt sand, if i have to spread salt sand i fill my spreader half full of salt, then i go to the concrete plant and back under the chute to get dry unfrozen "washed" sand for a 50/50 mix and it works great. Hope that helps.


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## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

Thanks, I have been trying to find salt for a week now. Any idea good places to look for bulk salt? 

Also, 50# bags?


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

Can't help with the salt, I'm in Canada. The main suppliers won't sell to you but find a local Co. Maybe a landscape supply place.


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

kruser6;792463 said:


> I don't know!
> 
> I thought this site would be great for information, but honestly I have gotten nothing but this -
> 
> ...


Sorry that question was aimed toward mvhauler, not you,

We can chat a little when you get your PM privileges in a couple of days.


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## mullis56 (Jul 12, 2005)

0%, unless you have contracts in Indy and then do 80% so you can get fired that day we will take you over. Couldn't image that being used here....never will happen!


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

I also use "sharp" sand, sometimes called septic sand. No pebbles, not even as big as a BB. It is the best in my experience. My sand is so clean that it won't clump in your hand if it's dry, and when you open your hand, it is almost perfectly clean. Very little fines. I like a mix of about 6 or 8 to one. I have gone as light as 10 to one. My buddy likes it hot, he goes two or three to one. All his accounts are hot top. The colder mix keeps the cost way down, and if it's dry when you start and you keep it covered you shouldn't have any trouble with freezing. That sand price sounds low, make sure it's suitable for spreading. If it's dead sand, you will be in big trouble.

The local pit sells some crushed stuff, screened down to 3/8 or 1/2. Premixed with salt. They never give a straight answer how much salt is in it. "yeah, that's a pretty hot batch". I hate it. It's always damp, leaves a terrible mess on hot top, and doesn't spread worth a damn. You can put more color down with less product if it's straight sand. Some of my clients are happier with color than melting.........

As for straight salt, I do use it, mostly as presalting.


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## cet (Oct 2, 2004)

Never heard the terms "hot' and "cold" when referring to salt content. Learn something new every day.


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

cet;792510 said:


> Never heard the terms "hot' and "cold" when referring to salt content. Learn something new every day.


Glad I could help. Getting close to bed time, too!


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## capital (Sep 26, 2000)

Kruser6,

I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize the most important rule.

What is it your wanting to do? Do you want to plow ? Run a snow removal Company ? Because if this is what your attempting to do-you will loose money. All the questions your asking cannot be answered by other operators-you need to figure out your cost-the amount it takes you to operate and then figure out what you want for your return on investments. The prices you are quoting are on the very low end in Central Iowa-yes you can get the work but will find at the end of the winter you have very little to show for your time and your return on investments. I wish you luck and hope you realize you need to sit down and figure out what you want to make-not what others make in central iowa.-Because many of the prices your talking about will not show you a return on investments.


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## leon (Nov 18, 2008)

*salt and sand etc.*



capital;792515 said:


> Kruser6,
> 
> I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize the most important rule.
> 
> What is it your wanting to do? Do you want to plow ? Run a snow removal Company ? Because if this is what your attempting to do-you will loose money. All the questions your asking cannot be answered by other operators-you need to figure out your cost-the amount it takes you to operate and then figure out what you want for your return on investments. The prices you are quoting are on the very low end in Central Iowa-yes you can get the work but will find at the end of the winter you have very little to show for your time and your return on investments. I wish you luck and hope you realize you need to sit down and figure out what you want to make-not what others make in central iowa.-Because many of the prices your talking about will not show you a return on investments.


=================================================================
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Perhaps he should look at the state of Iowa DOT web site to see what thier salt and sand mixing rates are to get an idea or look at the salt institute and its guidelines etc.

Highway departments mix salt and salt and either cover it or leave it exposed as in prior years it was a last resort item of use due to the sand and its clean up costs for storm drains.

The overuse of salt has increased its popularity along with state and federal mandates for bare roads in all conditions and as a result the roads and brdges are damaged and man made salt shortages create problems.


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## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

capital;792515 said:


> Kruser6,
> 
> I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize the most important rule.
> 
> What is it your wanting to do? Do you want to plow ? Run a snow removal Company ? Because if this is what your attempting to do-you will loose money. All the questions your asking cannot be answered by other operators-you need to figure out your cost-the amount it takes you to operate and then figure out what you want for your return on investments. The prices you are quoting are on the very low end in Central Iowa-yes you can get the work but will find at the end of the winter you have very little to show for your time and your return on investments. I wish you luck and hope you realize you need to sit down and figure out what you want to make-not what others make in central iowa.-Because many of the prices your talking about will not show you a return on investments.


Thanks for the info, but that is kind of what I am trying to do. I am asking how much sand do you mix if any at all so I can do some math and figure out how much the salt/sand will cost per ton. The numbers I have used are off of other bids that have been given to me by my clients that they have received in the past. I have made quite a bit of money making $55 an hour for the past 6 years, so by doing it this way I have increased an extra $25 an hour so I can't see how I wouldn't get an ROI at $80?

All in all it's very hard to find specific information. I am trying to get as much information as I can. Problem is that everyone does something different! 100% salt, 80% salt, liquid, sometimes a mix, sometimes not, it gets very confusing. Not to mention I can't find anywhere I can buy salt in IA and trust me I have spent HOURS online trying to find out.


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## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

capital;792515 said:


> Kruser6,
> 
> I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize the most important rule.
> 
> What is it your wanting to do? Do you want to plow ? Run a snow removal Company ? Because if this is what your attempting to do-you will loose money. All the questions your asking cannot be answered by other operators-you need to figure out your cost-the amount it takes you to operate and then figure out what you want for your return on investments. The prices you are quoting are on the very low end in Central Iowa-yes you can get the work but will find at the end of the winter you have very little to show for your time and your return on investments. I wish you luck and hope you realize you need to sit down and figure out what you want to make-not what others make in central iowa.-Because many of the prices your talking about will not show you a return on investments.


Why are you saying I will lose money? From the 11 posts I have made you are telling me I will lose money? Why?


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

capital;792515 said:


> Kruser6,
> 
> I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize the most important rule.
> 
> What is it your wanting to do? Do you want to plow ? Run a snow removal Company ? Because if this is what your attempting to do-you will loose money. All the questions your asking cannot be answered by other operators-you need to figure out your cost-the amount it takes you to operate and then figure out what you want for your return on investments. The prices you are quoting are on the very low end in Central Iowa-yes you can get the work but will find at the end of the winter you have very little to show for your time and your return on investments. I wish you luck and hope you realize you need to sit down and figure out what you want to make-not what others make in central iowa.-Because many of the prices your talking about will not show you a return on investments.


What on earth are you talking about? He asked two specific questions. What kind of sand to use, and how much salt to mix in. He's new to the site, and the sanding business. Most of us are trying to help him. You are located about as close as anyone, and could give him pricing help that would pertain to his area, but you seem to be more interested in further confusing him.

The only price he gave was what he might be paying for sand to be delivered to his home/business/yard.



capital;792515 said:


> Kruser6,
> 
> I happened to glance through your post and have noticed you ask everyone questions but seem to fail to realize* the most important rule.*


Please enlighten us, what is the most important rule, oh great one?

Most of us plow snow, offer snow removal, and sand/salt. All without great confusion, problems, tremendous financial losses, etc.


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## kruser6 (Jul 31, 2009)

2COR517;792539 said:


> What on earth are you talking about? He asked two specific questions. What kind of sand to use, and how much salt to mix in. He's new to the site, and the sanding business. Most of us are trying to help him. You are located about as close as anyone, and could give him pricing help that would pertain to his area, but you seem to be more interested in further confusing him.
> 
> The only price he gave was what he might be paying for sand to be delivered to his home/business/yard.
> 
> ...


Thanks, I was kind of feeling the same way. Unfortunately it seems that most are scared to post actual prices on here. I understand this, but can SOMEONE, anyone who doesn't plow in Central Iowa help a fellow plow guy out? My e-mail is [email protected].


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## deicepro (Mar 24, 2009)

Last year I picked up a new lot that required a 30%salt/70%sand mix. I was lucky enough to find a guy that owns a gravel pit and he blends 100 thousand ton a year. I payed him $35 per ton for the salt/sand mix, however I still charged $70 per ton for the salt sand and then added my labor and profit. Also understand my contract states that the parking lot must be swept in the spring and if I don't sweep it they will withhold 10% of my last invoice. So the extra $35 per ton that I charge goes to pay for the sweeping. Hope that make sense.


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## mvhauler (Jan 26, 2009)

cretebaby;792456 said:


> How much are you really saving them by using sand?


Boy, take a day off from the computer and see what happens. I knew I'd start something with that post! Cretebaby, I understand the merits of straight salt, The DOT uses it in this area unless they run short, then it's 50/50. Most all of my customers want traction, subdivisions with winding steep roads of rock and one with concrete. Most of them are will call, and of course, don't call until the snow is packed and no one can get up. The hospital, nursing home, and fast food joints are among regulars. They almost all are looking at price, plus the traction factor. To be honest, I've never looked at providing straight salt until I joined this site and looked at what others did. I guess what I'm doing has worked for me for a number of years. I must also state that I'm the only one in this county that provides commercial sand/salt services. Compared to what I've seen on this site, I guess that I'm is some kind of quirky area. Not trying to start a riot here, but I do enjoy some spirited conversation.


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

Sand vs. Salt

Salt runs me about 115/ton.

Sand is about 15/ton.

Mix it 8 to 1 ~30/ton.

So straight salt costs me about 4 times as much to fill the hopper. Even though I need more sand, it's still cheaper. In my area, there is no expectation for straight salt, but I do use it for my premo customer. And I do some presalting at the schools, but they only expect sand. I can put down $30 bucks worth of sand between three schools. If I know the sun is coming and most of it will melt, I am clear by the end of the day, for much less money. And they are just as happy. Of course, they are the type of client that I can drive through with the lights flashing and they are happy............


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## cretebaby (Aug 23, 2008)

2COR517;792768 said:


> Even though I need more sand,


Are you putting more on weight wise or volume wise?


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## 2COR517 (Oct 23, 2008)

cretebaby;792770 said:


> Are you putting more on weight wise or volume wise?


Both? I don't really pay that close attention. My experience with the salt we get is that it is almost as heavy as the sand. Sanding/salting is almost a sideline around here. Need the sander to get the commercial stuff, but nobody goes crazy with ice management.


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