# ND Blizzard



## 4x4Farmer

Well were in a blizzard warning. 10-14 inches there saying by tommrow morning. I'll belive it when I see it, but it is storming out pretty good right now. Interstate is closed through the whole state. Was out for a bit this morning but it was worthless, just kept blowing in. Never thought Id go from combineing corn to plowing snow in a matter of hours! lol, There will be video to come after tonight and tommrow! Heres a pic I just snapped out the basement window.


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## Elwer Lawn Care

WOW! I see a good chunk of money there. The blowing snow would just be the bad part of the whole thing. Be carefull out there and have fun.


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## Grass Master

4x4Farmer;675861 said:


> Well were in a blizzard warning. 10-14 inches there saying by tommrow morning. I'll belive it when I see it, but it is storming out pretty good right now. Interstate is closed through the whole state. Was out for a bit this morning but it was worthless, just kept blowing in. Never thought Id go from combineing corn to plowing snow in a matter of hours! lol, There will be video to come after tonight and tommrow! Heres a pic I just snapped out the basement window.


Can't wait to get at it........ once the wind dies down. We really haven't had a blizzard in quite a few years, we've gotten heavy spring snows, but not a blizzard. I wonder how much equipment will break down for us?


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## Green Grass

we are just hoping that it will hit down here?


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## jhakarter

Ya this is the real deal guys thats for sure. I went out for a few today too but it was absolutly worthless. Be safe out there guys that wind is nasty. 
Josh


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## tls22

Nice man, say hello to the weather channel for me they are in fargo! Have fun and stay warm!


Cant wait for the vid!:waving:


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## fireball

North Fargo checking in, stoke the fire and fill the coffee mug. Not much for depth but some interesting drifts already. Window wells are filling up with snow on the south side.


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## Supper Grassy

I will be waiting for videos


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## 01CTD2500

We arent gettin much of anything up in Grand Forks... MAYBE an inch or two of snow so far with a ton of wind.. not worth trying to push anything untill the wind dies down a lot but there are bound to be some rock hard drifts after all this.. yuck..

EDIT: Figures, soon as I post this I go look out the window and can't hardly see across the street haha


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## Grass Master

Pic doesn't show much, but it's a view from my door. Snowing steady lots of wind.


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## Grass Master

Yup, still snowing!


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## cretebaby

Your still combining corn?


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## 04superduty

the news said it was suppose to be like -10 there in fargo, with the wind chill bringing it down to -30 to -50 below. wow thats cold, stay warm and take lots of pics.


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## JD Dave

cretebaby;676356 said:


> Your still combining corn?


They had extremely wet weather, they couldn't even drive in the feild. Alot of guys still have corn left around here also.


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## Mark13

cretebaby;676356 said:


> Your still combining corn?


The farm my friend works on has something around 90 acres left. And they arn't the only ones who arn't done. Northern, IL had some wet weather that kept most guys from starting on time.


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## wannabeplowing

Just heard from my boss and we are heading out at midnight, should be a very interesting night with all of this wind!! I think this is the first blizzard I've been a part of in my short life and I have to admit it, I'm lovin every minute of it!! I tried to run to walmart about two hours ago and had to turn back I couldn't see ten yards in front of my truck, everyone in fargo BE CAREFUL when your out, roads suck and it's goin to be cold!!


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## Grass Master

cretebaby;676356 said:


> Your still combining corn?


 Yes area farmers are still getting corn off, although they are nearing the end of what can be harvested. We had a very wet November and fields could not be harvisted untill the ground froze. I spoke with a producer 3 days ago who claimed he had 30% moisture yet. The dryers are getting a workout.


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## 04superduty

cretebaby;676356 said:


> Your still combining corn?


same here, the farmers were unable to get all the corn picked before the weather closed in. sure is funny seeing a combine out in the snow pickin corn.


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## Grass Master

wannabeplowing;676372 said:


> Just heard from my boss and we are heading out at midnight, should be a very interesting night with all of this wind!! I think this is the first blizzard I've been a part of in my short life and I have to admit it, I'm lovin every minute of it!! I tried to run to walmart about two hours ago and had to turn back I couldn't see ten yards in front of my truck, everyone in fargo BE CAREFUL when your out, roads suck and it's goin to be cold!!


Ya, it's gonna be fun. I looked at the hourly and they are forecasting 27mph winds straight out of the north all through tomorrow with continuing snow. FINALLY a decent snow fall.


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## cretebaby

I didnt realize it stayed that wet

I remember seeing the pix of the ruts in the beans feild

Our ground rolls enough that it doesnt get that bad we typically runthe day after it rains here


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## Grass Master

Well, It's official this is a doosy. I just got a call no school in the largest city in the state, which is Fargo by the way.


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## Mysticlandscape

I hate you all.


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## Sydenstricker Landscaping

Mysticlandscape;676456 said:


> I hate you all.


agreed x2 You guys do be careful and take some good pics!!!!!!!! I know how you are feeling, we had one heck of a storm back in march that dropped anywhere from 24-36" and had 30-35mph wind gusts with very, very cold temps. That was a long a$$ 4 days


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## JD Dave

Why can't I get a blizzard.:crying:


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## fireball

actually think the wind has picked up a lot since the sun went down. All the vent pipes on the roof are blowing different tunes. Noticed that the yellow and house finchs at the feeders had snow on them. Radar seems to have the storm centered here in Fargo. Just have to sit tight until this wind slows down.


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## lawncare18

JD Dave;676366 said:


> They had extremely wet weather, they couldn't even drive in the feild. Alot of guys still have corn left around here also.


Still a lot of corn left around my area to. What do the farmers do who have not goten it in yet.??? I gota asume runing those dryers is big big money???


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## JD Dave

lawncare18;676485 said:


> Still a lot of corn left around my area to. What do the farmers do who have not goten it in yet.??? I gota asume runing those dryers is big big money???


We never get dry corn like most of the US corn belt, so once it 30% moisture or dryer we combine and dry it, it's not cheap but we have no other choice. It's better combining on frozen ground then playing in the mud but once the becomes deep you can't get all the corn ears so you have to wait for a melt and freeze again and pray that the corn does not decide to lay down.


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## lawncare18

What happends if it lays down?? I have a feeling farmers are gona have that problem around me since we have had a bit of snow. Ive actuly saw one farmer with tracks on his machine instead of tires. You got any farm pics of your operation jd dave???


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## JD Dave

lawncare18;676499 said:


> What happends if it lays down?? I have a feeling farmers are gona have that problem around me since we have had a bit of snow. Ive actuly saw one farmer with tracks on his machine instead of tires. You got any farm pics of your operation jd dave???


http://www.plowsite.com/showthread.php?t=66033&highlight=Harvest+vid Here's a small vid, I need to take more pics, I'm getting better though. If the corn lays down the yeild loss is tremendous, the only good place for corn now is in the bin, that's what my dad always said.


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## lawncare18

farming is got to be a rewarding life but tough tough long days from what I can see from the big dairy farmer near me .. hes always doing something in the field or hauling beding sand for his livestock.


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## wannabeplowing

Well I just took a little drive around fargo, needed to get to walmart to get warmer gloves for tonight and man it's rough out there!! I saw a bunch of cars stuck in drifts alon the side of main roads, the only other people that were out there with me were people driving 4X4's. I'm surprised we are still goin out at midnight with the wind this bad, I'm pretty sure we are goin to be fighting a losing battle against this wind. And to top it all off it's finals week this week, might be a LONG couple of days!!


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## FordFisherman

Good luck and be safe out there. BTW, that guy with the snowblower is a diehard, huh?


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## ABES

well have fun guys. Here in the twin cities all we had was a lot of ice but they are still saying 1-2" of snow. Its going to be fun plowing snow ontop of all this ice


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## iceyman

JD Dave;676479 said:


> Why can't I get a blizzard.:crying:


i dont even wanna hear your *****in


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## veggin psd

ABES;676561 said:


> well have fun guys. Here in the twin cities all we had was a lot of ice but they are still saying 1-2" of snow. Its going to be fun plowing snow ontop of all this ice


I layed some salt down pretty heavy before the snow resumed at dusk. I sure hope that it helps later tonight cause I feel you pain with the ice.

I would take the snow over ice any day.


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## sluggermn

I went to the walmart in moorhead about 2 or 3 pm and it was scarey!! 
there were 4 cars stuck in drifts and a huge loader backed right out into the road in front of me I had to swerve to miss him (YIKES) and the visibility was ZERO. 
I drove past one of my accounts on the way to walmart and there was a 8 foot tall drift the entire length of the building! holy crap is that going to be fun to attack if I get my plow working tonight! 
I went out about 15 min ago and did my sidewalks with the snow blower and I was fighting 3 and 4 foot drifts. it is going to be an interesting day. 

slugger


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## dfdsuperduty

good luck and be careful tonight... they are calling for one thenth of an inch of freezing rain and ice tonight looks like it could be fun I am planing on going out at midnight doing a pre salt and then checking again at 5am hopefully payuppayup out of this one


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## Supper Grassy

Sounds like you guys are facing scary conditions. be sure to get pictures of the snow


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## lawnproslawncar

you guys can have the blizzard. a few inches of snow to take the snowmobile out on is good enough for me. I'm in off season lol


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## Grass Master

FordFisherman;676528 said:


> Good luck and be safe out there. BTW, that guy with the snowblower is a diehard, huh?


LOL, that would be my father. He was getting tired of sitting around.


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## Wiseguyinc

I would rather just keep getting the light fluffy 2 inch drops. This blowing snow is getting on my nerves. I want to go do my accounts but it's pointless with 40 mph wind gusts.
Everything closed early today.I blew a fuse and had to look for 30 min to find an open gas station! They closed 15 min. after I left.
Oh well these storms make me glad I charge by the hour.Just hard on equipment.


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## 01CTD2500

yeah its pretty worthless trying to move anything.. was out most of the day checking things out and takin care of the big drifts just to try keep them from getting any bigger.. there are some roads in town with 4-5 ft drifts over both lanes.. did a lot more pulling/digging people out then plowing.. really really wish my lights had come in by now though as visibility is very bad. Helped a few city rigs that were escourting firetrucks and etc on the smaller roads that the big trucks couldnt get down.. just a big big mess, and by the sounds of it you guys in fargo have it a lot worse as we only got maybe 4 inches out of this storm and i have heard reports of 10-12 down there??

Corn harvest is/was in full swing up here also. We have just about 3k acres left.. bad news haha.. and with the cold nothing has been working right and lots of break downs so even with 4 combines its not going to fast. Well better try get a few hours sleep and see if the wind has died down in the AM to get out and actually clean some stuff for good. oh and BE SAFE OUT THERE GUYS!


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## fireball

10 inches here at airport, think that tomorrow will be a carhart day


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## LawnProLandscapes

any pics yet, i love drifts with my v plow


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## 4x4Farmer

Holy, you guys went at it sence i started this thread!! I had to go start plowing about 30 min after I posted it and have been plowing ever sence with a few naps here and there. It was a good storm! Plenty of snow and plenty of snow to be hauled yet. I did get some pictures and a couple of short videos which i will post some time today. I still have a skid on a trailer that I have to unload then a little nap then maybe I'll get them posted.


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## sno commander

glad to hear you guys got some snow. can't wait for the vid


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## wannabeplowing

Well it was absolutely crazy last night, we worked 16 1/2 hours straight and that wasn't even doing everything at the accounts. Had finals so couldn't work this morning but they went out at 2:00 this morning to finish everything up. Hardly had time to go to the bathroom let alone take pics so none of those from me but I wish I could have, we had some ridiculous drifts at some accounts, probably 6-7 foot drifts. All in all ended up being a hellacious storm but hey that just means payup!! 4X4 looking forward to your pics and videos, sure was a good time huh!!


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## Humvee27

It was wet around this area too....I know my cousin still has 50 acres left but he's now waiting, or was, until he could get into the fields without too much trouble...


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## Grass Master

Well Monday was a 20hr day, there was so much snow to move I forgot to get pics of the sites before we started:crying:, but here are a few I did get. With all the drifting going was slow until the loaders got the bulk of it off.


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## Grass Master

Here are a couple of the 7040 opening sidewalks, and two of the city's heavy hitters. The old FWD was throwing snow 70 yards or so.


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## plowindiesel

looks like you guys got to have some fun...keep the pics coming


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## Grass Master

Damage assessment, Two transmissions,shredded one tire, one broken axle (picture), lost power to auxiliary controls on bobcat, oh and the turbo on the A-66 blew(picture). 

Spendy storm.


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## Grass Master

Here's some of our lots.


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## fireball

Forum said that this was the worst since 96-97 but still didn't make the top 10 worst storms. Saw the city's newest Oskosh blower limping home on 7th Ave draging a driveline underneath it, no pictures though


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## Supper Grassy

Wow looks like alot of snow.

Grass masters do you have enough trucks that the probelms did not stop you?


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## nms0219

expensive damage list


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## Grass Master

Supper Grassy;679441 said:


> Wow looks like alot of snow.
> 
> Grass masters do you have enough trucks that the probelms did not stop you?


 Here is a link to our equipment. It slowed us down but we got our buildings open.

http://www.plowsite.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=45020&stc=1&d=1226786999


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## 4x4Farmer

computers a piece of crap! Heres the only picture i have so far, and the videos are impossable to upload right now. Ok, got a start for ya. I'll work on more videos later. Have to get back to hauling snow!

a drive through








One of the doors at the school I had to dig out.








Short Video of us finishing up at a school. 
http://i29.photobucket.com/player.swf?file=http://vid29.photobucket.com/albums/c284/xc500rule/MOV02382.flv


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## Supper Grassy

thats alot of snow!!!! what was the final total

4x4 if you can get thevideos to your pc bt cant upload to here i can help you


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## 4x4Farmer

Supper Grassy;680416 said:


> thats alot of snow!!!! what was the final total
> 
> 4x4 if you can get thevideos to your pc bt cant upload to here i can help you


Total snow fall they say was about 10 something, It was hard to tell with all that wind though, it could have been 12 for all we know! I have the videos on the PC but its my internet connection right now thats giving me the problem. I'll get it when that starts working better.


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## 4x4Farmer

Grass Master;679263 said:


> Damage assessment, Two transmissions,shredded one tire, one broken axle (picture), lost power to auxiliary controls on bobcat, oh and the turbo on the A-66 blew(picture).
> 
> Spendy storm.


haha, I know! We dident break anything to spendy, but we have a bunch of dumbarses running two of the pickups this year so that was enough stress though the storm. oh ya and I also had to push one of your broncos into the shop at south with my loader casue the hubs where froze up on it or something. lol. Good Times!


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## Supper Grassy

is that inches or feet


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## Grass Master

4x4Farmer;680431 said:


> haha, I know! We dident break anything to spendy, but we have a bunch of dumbarses running two of the pickups this year so that was enough stress though the storm. oh ya and I also had to push one of your broncos into the shop at south with my loader casue the hubs where froze up on it or something. lol. Good Times!


Ya, I got a phone call from those guys saying,"the bronco has a noise when you turn the wheels, it might have something to do with the four wheel drive."

The pic on the previous post is what I found when I got there, a WAY broken front knuckle. Like you said dumbarses.

I like the vid I wish our people would buy a pusher, thats why we took out two trannys we push every lot with pickups, and we have some big lots. Did someone call you back to clear out that door in the pic?


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## Grass Master

Just a couple more from today, still digging out. Still having fun.


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## Supper Grassy

Grass Master great pics!!!!
do you run your own opperation or do you work for somone?


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## 4x4Farmer

Grass Master;680530 said:


> Ya, I got a phone call from those guys saying,"the bronco has a noise when you turn the wheels, it might have something to do with the four wheel drive."
> 
> The pic on the previous post is what I found when I got there, a WAY broken front knuckle. Like you said dumbarses.
> 
> I like the vid I wish our people would buy a pusher, thats why we took out two trannys we push every lot with pickups, and we have some big lots. Did someone call you back to clear out that door in the pic?


oh yeah, she had some issues from the looks of it I guess. I guess they had broke the snowblower at south so they had me dig out a couple of doors. That one would have been a little deep for the deere anyways I think.lol Yeah we like the pushers for big lots! Trying to get the boss to buy another one.


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## lawnproslawncar

geesh! You guys can have them drifts. I'll take the money though


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## Grass Master

Supper Grassy;680576 said:


> Grass Master great pics!!!!
> do you run your own opperation or do you work for somone?


I am a grounds keeper for the school district in Fargo.


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## Supper Grassy

Grass Master;680613 said:


> I am a grounds keeper for the school district in Fargo.


Very Cool!

Some questions if you dont minf answering them
what is your average storm time wise? 
Do you run smaller things than SS to remove snow from sidewalks?
i think that is for now

do either of you have an IM account?


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## MileHigh

That's what you call a storm...

In those last two vids...Is that noise your truck losing traction?...sounds like tires spinning.


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## mike psd

excellent videos farmer like always


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## IDOCTORTREES

wow great storm.sorry your equipment broke in a crazy way it makes me feel good to know its not just my equipment


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## ford550

I think you need bigger equipment wesport


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## Dan85

Crazy pictures guys! That snow is just nuts! Best of luck with the plowing!

Good videos too Farmer - I approve of the sound track! 

Grass Masters - That injury list made me die a little inside, especially the picture with the turbo, sorry to hear about that!

- Dan


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## deere615

Awesome pics and videos you guys got dumped with snow!


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## farmerkev

You guys took all the snow from us guys a little south of ya. We got about 5" where i am according to the hood of my truck. Looks like Sat/Sun could be another good chance for us.


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## NorthDakota

some shots i took this week


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## lawnproslawncar

Look at those piles in the background! holy moley!!!! Money Money!


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## 4x4Farmer

Great Pictures North Dakota. I have to try to get some better ones this next go around. Still have some video to try to upload, but its not the best footage.


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## 4x4Farmer

Here we go agian boys!!!! Get your equipment ready!!!!! winter storm watch in effect.




Winter Storm Watch
URGENT - WINTER WEATHER MESSAGE
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE GRAND FORKS ND
401 AM CST FRI DEC 19 2008

...ANOTHER WINTER STORM EXPECTED THIS WEEKEND...

.SIGNIFICANT SNOW ACCUMULATIONS...FOLLOWED BY STRONG WINDS AND
DANGEROUS WIND CHILLS WILL AFFECT THE NORTHERN PLAINS THIS
WEEKEND. SNOW IS EXPECTED TO MOVE INTO THE DEVILS LAKE BASIN
THIS EVENING...THEN INTO THE REST OF WESTERN MINNESOTA BY SATURDAY
MORNING. THIS STORM HAS THE POTENTIAL TO PRODUCE 6 OR MORE INCHES
OF SNOW...IN ADDITION TO STRONG WINDS AND DANGEROUS WIND CHILLS BY
SATURDAY NIGHT.

LOW PRESSURE WILL MOVE ACROSS THE DAKOTAS FRIDAY NIGHT AND MINNESOTA
SATURDAY...THEN MOVE SOUTH OF THE AREA BY SUNDAY. STAY TUNED TO
LATER STATEMENTS ON THIS WINTER STORM.

MNZ001>004-007-029-NDZ008-016-027-029-030-039-049-052-053-211200-
/O.CON.KFGF.WS.A.0010.081220T0600Z-081221T1200Z/
WEST POLK-NORMAN-CLAY-KITTSON-WEST MARSHALL-WILKIN-PEMBINA-
EASTERN WALSH COUNTY-GRAND FORKS-STEELE-TRAILL-CASS-RANSOM-
SARGENT-RICHLAND-
INCLUDING THE CITIES OF...CROOKSTON...EAST GRAND FORKS...
HALSTAD...MOORHEAD...HALLOCK...WARREN...BRECKENRIDGE...CAVALIER...
GRAFTON...GRAND FORKS...FINLEY...MAYVILLE...FARGO...LISBON...
GWINNER...WAHPETON
401 AM CST FRI DEC 19 2008

...WINTER STORM WATCH REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM LATE TONIGHT THROUGH
LATE SATURDAY NIGHT...

A WINTER STORM WATCH REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM LATE TONIGHT THROUGH
LATE SATURDAY NIGHT.

SNOW WILL MOVE INTO THE RED RIVER VALLEY REGION OF EASTERN NORTH
DAKOTA...AND WESTERN MINNESOTA TONIGHT...AND BECOME HEAVY ON
SATURDAY. TOTAL STORM ACCUMULATIONS OF 6 INCHES OR MORE ARE
POSSIBLE THROUGH SATURDAY NIGHT. IN ADDITION...STRONG NORTHERLY
WINDS WILL GUST OVER 30 MPH SATURDAY NIGHT...AND PRODUCE NEAR
BLIZZARD CONDITIONS IN OPEN COUNTRY. TRAVEL WILL LIKELY BECOME
DIFFICULT ON SATURDAY...WITH REDUCED VISIBILITIES FROM FALLING AND
BLOWING SNOW. DANGEROUS WIND CHILLS TO 40 BELOW ZERO ARE ALSO
EXPECTED TO DEVELOP BY SATURDAY NIGHT.

CONDITIONS WILL SLOWLY IMPROVE SUNDAY MORNING...ALTHOUGH
DANGEROUS WIND CHILLS WILL PERSIST INTO SUNDAY.

A WINTER STORM WATCH MEANS THERE IS A POTENTIAL FOR SIGNIFICANT
SNOW...SLEET...OR ICE ACCUMULATIONS THAT MAY IMPACT TRAVEL.
CONTINUE TO MONITOR THE LATEST FORECASTS.


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## fireball

snow shovel is ready. Should be interesting what the city will do with some of these intersections that they haven't pushed back yet. I was suprised that they still hadn't widened 38th St at the mall when you come off 29 at 13th as of last night. Mayor is beating himself a lot over that accident on University, the video interview was sad to watch.


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## 4x4Farmer

fireball;682822 said:


> snow shovel is ready. Should be interesting what the city will do with some of these intersections that they haven't pushed back yet. I was suprised that they still hadn't widened 38th St at the mall when you come off 29 at 13th as of last night. Mayor is beating himself a lot over that accident on University, the video interview was sad to watch.


I know, i was there last night also, and there was no right turn lane onto 13th ave yet. They have alot of places that havent been pushed back or blown away yet. It should be interesting. I hear ya on that accident. It was a bad deal and I know a few city workers and have talked to them about it. Theres more to it then the news said aparentley. It is good that the city is taking full responsabilty for it though. Sad deal.


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## Grass Master

Supper Grassy;680635 said:


> Very Cool!
> 
> Some questions if you dont minf answering them
> what is your average storm time wise?
> Do you run smaller things than SS to remove snow from sidewalks?
> i think that is for now
> 
> do either of you have an IM account?


1-Unless I'm mistaken this is the largest storm we've had since the winter of '96/'97

2-We clear all our sidewalks with trucks

3-I do not have an IM

I hope this answers your questions.


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## Grass Master

IDOCTORTREES;680712 said:


> wow great storm.sorry your equipment broke in a crazy way it makes me feel good to know its not just my equipment


 Yeh, it was a good storm, did I forget to mention the John Deere in the picture had the windshield shashed out just befor we used it? ha ha ha I'll post a pic you can see the snow building up by his feet.



ford550;680779 said:


> I think you need bigger equipment wesport


Yes, bigger and newer our loaders were made before I was born !

Grass Masters - That injury list made me die a little inside, especially the picture with the turbo, sorry to hear about that!

- Dan[/QUOTE]

Thanks I is not my idea to keep all the old equipment around hopefully it will wake up some of the decition makers.


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## NorthDakota

lawnproslawncar;682337 said:


> Look at those piles in the background! holy moley!!!! Money Money!


I believe you are talking about the picture with the two loaders going down the road? On the left the pile is our snow dump.....So it is stacked high there.


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## deere615

4x4Farmer;683225 said:


> I know, i was there last night also, and there was no right turn lane onto 13th ave yet. They have alot of places that havent been pushed back or blown away yet. It should be interesting. I hear ya on that accident. It was a bad deal and I know a few city workers and have talked to them about it. Theres more to it then the news said aparentley. It is good that the city is taking full responsabilty for it though. Sad deal.


What was this accident? I guessing there was a death/s


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## fireball

eight year old died being driven by her fifteen old sister. There was supposdley a rut along side of road that caused accident. There were a few accidents prior to this one and numerous people called to notify the city about hazard. The city had no material to fill the rut in since all their material was frozen. Plenty of blame to go around and it doesn't change a thing. Just a real sad situation for all parties involved. Mayor is taking responsibility but you can truly see how sorry he is about it even when he had no control over the situation personally. Fargo and it's workers truly work hard and do a great job in everything.


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## deere615

fireball;684066 said:


> eight year old died being driven by her fifteen old sister. There was supposdley a rut along side of road that caused accident. There were a few accidents prior to this one and numerous people called to notify the city about hazard. The city had no material to fill the rut in since all their material was frozen. Plenty of blame to go around and it doesn't change a thing. Just a real sad situation for all parties involved. Mayor is taking responsibility but you can truly see how sorry he is about it even when he had no control over the situation personally. Fargo and it's workers truly work hard and do a great job in everything.


I see, that is sad. Was the 15 yar old a legal driver? 16 is the age one starts around here


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## jhakarter

ND you can get your lisence at age 15, i think permit at 14? MN however you get permit at 15 and lisence at 16.


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