# Look at what Mass DOT bought this year. WOW



## meathead1134 (Nov 12, 2004)

WOW is all I have to say
http://www.boston.com/Boston/metrod...3kO3gjWKJ591yI8GUbO/index.html?p1=Local_Links


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## Tubby's Snow Plowing (Dec 13, 2009)

Holy crap that's a good sized blade! Twenty-tive feet? Nice.


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## M & MD Lawn (Aug 29, 2010)

WOW is right I would love to see that thing in action, seems awkward to drive/tow but I would love to see it


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## grandview (Oct 9, 2005)

M & MD Lawn;1343874 said:


> WOW is right I would love to see that thing in action, seems awkward to drive/tow but I would love to see it


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

Is it weird you only gain one extra lane of cleaning for the 25 feet. The plow on the truck is what 11-12 feet? seems like you could have a nice truck for year round use for $100,000.00 and maybe include a workers salary


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## theplowmeister (Nov 14, 2006)

That tow blade is not verry high. Id think by the time all (25 feet + 10 foot from the truck plow) the snow got to the end of the blade it would just go over the top of the blade.


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## lawn king (Nov 21, 2004)

That thing will be sitting in a yard after some knucklehead destroys it on a guardrail!


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## RLM (Jan 12, 2006)

I still haven't figured what the DOT obsecession is with the "tow plows", in NY some of the DOT trucks have dual wings, one on each side, to me that seems like a better idea, they ma have "tow plows, I just haven't seen one. I cant imagine trying to plow, control a salter, then tow a trailer, with a complete additional set of controls, seems like an accident waiting to happen. So while it may save them money short money in fuel/labor, @ 100K a piece, then taking into the fact I think they are going to kill someone with one. Personally in the long run I think it will end up costing these states more money.


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## 32vld (Feb 4, 2011)

RLM;1343977 said:


> I still haven't figured what the DOT obsecession is with the "tow plows", in NY some of the DOT trucks have dual wings, one on each side, to me that seems like a better idea, they ma have "tow plows, I just haven't seen one. I cant imagine trying to plow, control a salter, then tow a trailer, with a complete additional set of controls, seems like an accident waiting to happen. So while it may save them money short money in fuel/labor, @ 100K a piece, then taking into the fact I think they are going to kill someone with one. Personally in the long run I think it will end up costing these states more money.


I agree the state trucks with a huge wing on each side will clear just as wide.


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## wizardsr (Aug 8, 2006)

The tow plows are cool until you get stuck behind one on the interstate... :realmad:


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## JaimeG (Jan 25, 2009)

In the video, only about 5ft are touching the road, not very effective is it? Or can you angle it somehow?


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## PlowThisSnow (Oct 6, 2011)

lawn king;1343962 said:


> That thing will be sitting in a yard after some knucklehead destroys it on a guardrail!


Im sure we'll all see it on the news hahaaa.


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## G.Landscape (Oct 20, 2011)

RLM;1343977 said:


> I still haven't figured what the DOT obsecession is with the "tow plows", in NY some of the DOT trucks have dual wings, one on each side, to me that seems like a better idea, they ma have "tow plows, I just haven't seen one. I cant imagine trying to plow, control a salter, then tow a trailer, with a complete additional set of controls, seems like an accident waiting to happen. So while it may save them money short money in fuel/labor, @ 100K a piece, then taking into the fact I think they are going to kill someone with one. Personally in the long run I think it will end up costing these states more money.


There is no more work involved then there was before... they just swapped having to control a wing for towing the trailer.


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## coyote (Jan 6, 2011)

It looks like a wreck and lawsuit ready to happen.


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## RLM (Jan 12, 2006)

G landscape,
I haven't looked at one in person but there is a second spreader, then you have to swing the wing out, lower, & some how watch it to the complete rear of truck. I have to assume it also has some trailer properties as well, so turning radius, etc are going to be affected, just seems like a lot more going on and it's to the rear of the truck. I'm sure there are blind spots all over on those trucks to start with the couple stupid drivers & snow just seems like a disaster waiting to happen. But again that's just my thoughts. I tend to have alot of the newer technologies ( all v plows, sectional plow, Inverted blower, started liquid calcium) but I do believe somtimes in the KISS methodology, is best this is one of those instances. I do hope I'm wrong, time will tell.


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## ameyerman (Dec 15, 2005)

MoDOT has 3 of them. Very cool to see them running down the highway. They have been runing them around here for about 2 years now.


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## fireside (Mar 1, 2008)

Ct dot Tested one last year on the route 8 torrington run. It was cool watching it go down the road. I saw no real need for it. It can'nt be used in traffic or any single lane state roads. They have had better luck with there new tri axles with double wings.


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## NFDDJS (Sep 22, 2009)

xtreem3d;1343920 said:


> Is it weird you only gain one extra lane of cleaning for the 25 feet. The plow on the truck is what 11-12 feet? seems you could have a nice truck for year round use for $100,000.00 and maybe include a workers salary


I want to know where you are getting your workers!? ONE full time person that makes $38000 a year with all the cost like workers comp, insurance, and a 401K cost just over $60,000 a year. Then you can add over time, and if they work over time workers comp goes up because workers come is all set at 40 hours a week and if they work more then at when you renew your workers comp they will charge more for those hours. It is VERY easy to have a full time person cost you $80,000 or more.

The state of NH just got one of these also, they did a cost study on these and they had to add $10,000 to the cost of the truck or trucks they got to pull this because off the added HP they need to pull these. After all the added cost they said one truck with plow, wing and spreader with one of the 25 plows can clean 3 lines and only made they truck they tested it with burn 23% more fuel. That is a BIG saving!!! That saves them the cost of one driver and one truck that is big!!! They seems to work great if you have some one that knows what they are doing behind the wheel...


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## wizardsr (Aug 8, 2006)

NFDDJS;1345867 said:


> I want to know where you are getting your workers!? ONE full time person that makes $38000 a year with all the cost like workers comp, insurance, and a 401K cost just over $60,000 a year. Then you can add over time, and if they work over time workers comp goes up because workers come is all set at 40 hours a week and if they work more then at when you renew your workers comp they will charge more for those hours. It is VERY easy to have a full time person cost you $80,000 or more.
> 
> The state of NH just got one of these also, they did a cost study on these and they had to add $10,000 to the cost of the truck or trucks they got to pull this because off the added HP they need to pull these. After all the added cost they said one truck with plow, wing and spreader with one of the 25 plows can clean 3 lines and only made they truck they tested it with burn 23% more fuel. That is a BIG saving!!! That saves them the cost of one driver and one truck that is big!!! They seems to work great if you have some one that knows what they are doing behind the wheel...


Some good points. MNDOT has been using these for several years. They don't use them in the metro, but in out-state areas, where they have long stretches of rural 4-lane highways, they seem to work quite well.


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## sectlandscaping (Sep 7, 2009)

It seems like its not scraping the road. Not sure if its just the above video. I would think if it wasnt angled so much it would be more effective. Something like a 18ft rear plow or wings would do better but wouldnt salt.


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## DaveCN5 (Oct 19, 2011)

This is a better video of it's clearing capacity: 




Another thing to think about is if you have long runs that you usually run 2 trucks on, you can run 1 pull plow and send the other truck off somewhere else, meaning you can get highways cleared faster. It's just an efficiency tool. It will have certain applications where it will be very useful and others where it won't. It's just a matter of knowing when to use it and having a skilled operator to run it.


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## dfd9 (Aug 18, 2010)

xtreem3d;1343920 said:


> Is it weird you only gain one extra lane of cleaning for the 25 feet. The plow on the truck is what 11-12 feet? seems like you could have a nice truck for year round use for $100,000.00 and maybe include a workers salary


I see someone explained it later, but you're not very good at math are you?

Have you not noticed that just about every single gov't entity in this country is running a deficit or close to it? Tax revenue is down, costs are up and you don't want them to work more efficiently?



theplowmeister;1343955 said:


> That tow blade is not verry high. Id think by the time all (25 feet + 10 foot from the truck plow) the snow got to the end of the blade it would just go over the top of the blade.


These things aren't exactly new, they've been around for several years. The private companies up in Canada are using them, so that ought to tell you naysayers something.



NFDDJS;1345867 said:


> I want to know where you are getting your workers!? ONE full time person that makes $38000 a year with all the cost like workers comp, insurance, and a 401K cost just over $60,000 a year. Then you can add over time, and if they work over time workers comp goes up because workers come is all set at 40 hours a week and if they work more then at when you renew your workers comp they will charge more for those hours. It is VERY easy to have a full time person cost you $80,000 or more.
> 
> The state of NH just got one of these also, they did a cost study on these and they had to add $10,000 to the cost of the truck or trucks they got to pull this because off the added HP they need to pull these. After all the added cost they said one truck with plow, wing and spreader with one of the 25 plows can clean 3 lines and only made they truck they tested it with burn 23% more fuel. That is a BIG saving!!! That saves them the cost of one driver and one truck that is big!!! They seems to work great if you have some one that knows what they are doing behind the wheel...


Thank you for being a voice of reason.



DaveCN5;1346301 said:


> This is a better video of it's clearing capacity:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


And another voice of reason.

Mike, do you use a pusher and loader on every single job you do? Do you use a quad on a 5 acre parking lot? Do you have a guy that runs a stick plow jump in a loader and start plowing?

I'd be jumping for joy if my state or county bought one of these things to increase efficiency and save me, the taxpayer, money.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

Just out of curiosity...what do 5 $100,00.00 tow behind plows do after winter ? so that's an additional 50,000 in upgrades to trucks plus 23% more fuel per 5 trucks. And won't those trucks use more fuel the other 8 months out of the year because they had to be upgraded?


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

NFDDJS;1345867 said:


> I want to know where you are getting your workers!? ONE full time person that makes $38000 a year with all the cost like workers comp, insurance, and a 401K cost just over $60,000 a year. Then you can add over time, and if they work over time workers comp goes up because workers come is all set at 40 hours a week and if they work more then at when you renew your workers comp they will charge more for those hours. It is VERY easy to have a full time person cost you $80,000 or more.
> 
> The state of NH just got one of these also, they did a cost study on these and they had to add $10,000 to the cost of the truck or trucks they got to pull this because off the added HP they need to pull these. After all the added cost they said one truck with plow, wing and spreader with one of the 25 plows can clean 3 lines and only made they truck they tested it with burn 23% more fuel. That is a BIG saving!!! That saves them the cost of one driver and one truck that is big!!! They seems to work great if you have some one that knows what they are doing behind the wheel...


I can tell you my $38,000.00 employee is nowhere near $ 80,000.00 Get real !!! you may need to shop insurance and such


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## dfd9 (Aug 18, 2010)

xtreem3d;1346576 said:


> Just out of curiosity...what do 5 $100,00.00 tow behind plows do after winter ? so that's an additional 50,000 in upgrades to trucks plus 23% more fuel per 5 trucks. And won't those trucks use more fuel the other 8 months out of the year because they had to be upgraded?


Same thing that 5 unnecessary trucks, plows and spreaders do.

Although, there will be 5 less employees that need to be paid throughout those 8 months off.

Do you play the lottery?


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## dfd9 (Aug 18, 2010)

xtreem3d;1346577 said:


> I can tell you my $38,000.00 employee is nowhere near $ 80,000.00 Get real !!! you may need to shop insurance and such


Let's put it this way, maybe you'll grasp this.

You can buy a plow or mower than will increase your productivity 100% with half the additional cost of another piece of equipment and one less operator. (just for grins and giggles, let's assume the truck required to tow these costs $100K)

That would mean you could double your income with half the investment and no increased labor costs. That's the first year.

Does that make any sense at all?


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## sectlandscaping (Sep 7, 2009)

dfd9;1346580 said:


> Same thing that 5 unnecessary trucks, plows and spreaders do.
> 
> Although, there will be 5 less employees that need to be paid throughout those 8 months off.
> 
> Do you play the lottery?


I dont see it. Every video I seen had 3-4 trucks tailing it. Like I said if the angle was better it would clear more but its angles so only 14 ft is being used. I watched a video with a plow and wings and it looked to be clearing more.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

sectlandscaping;1346589 said:


> I dont see it. Every video I seen had 3-4 trucks tailing it. Like I said if the angle was better it would clear more but its angles so only 14 ft is being used. I watched a video with a plow and wings and it looked to be clearing more.


Thank You !!!!!!!!!


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

dfd9;1346580 said:


> Same thing that 5 unnecessary trucks, plows and spreaders do.
> 
> Although, there will be 5 less employees that need to be paid throughout those 8 months off.
> 
> Do you play the lottery?


5 trucks can remain working ...5 employees can be productive year round 5 tow behinds can't


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

dfd9;1346586 said:


> Let's put it this way, maybe you'll grasp this.
> 
> You can buy a plow or mower than will increase your productivity 100% with half the additional cost of another piece of equipment and one less operator. (just for grins and giggles, let's assume the truck required to tow these costs $100K)
> 
> ...


That's for 4 months not 12. BTW the tow behind isn't even double the productivity of a plow truck . That was whole point of my intial post


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

i finally watched the vid as i only read the article about the plow..that thing isn't even plowing a lane and a half. and like the other poster said ..it's not scraping at all.
Steve


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## dfd9 (Aug 18, 2010)

xtreem3d;1346643 said:


> That's for 4 months not 12. BTW the tow behind isn't even double the productivity of a plow truck . That was whole point of my intial post


Uh, yes it is. 1 truck does 1 lane. Maybe another half if it has a wing, but then it's not just a truck, it too, has upgrades. If you do some investigating, the only way they are clearing 1 entire lane with 1 truck is if they are running 14' plows. That is what MoDOT did when they moved to TowPlows.

Add the tow plow and it does 2-2 /2 lanes. You just doubled productivity, which in most people's math is an increase of 100%.

So you do play the lottery. You know what another term for the lottery is? It's a tax on people who are bad at math.

As for the 5 additional trucks\employees, what if there isn't work for them? And you really think a union operator in Mass is costing the state less than $80K a year?

Not to mention, why is it you guys are against productivity and efficiency of gov't employees? Hello, we already have too many gov't employees and too high of deficits. Do you guys pay attention at all to the state of our government?


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## WilliamOak (Feb 11, 2008)

Work smarter not harder is ever prevalent here and never fails. One less operator is needed b/c one truck is now doing 2 lanes instead of 1. The tow plow itself saves the state damn near $80k a year in one union members salary nearly paying for itself just in the man power it replaces let alone the truck it either replaces or allows it to be re-routed to clear snow accumulation quicker and more efficiently.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

dfd9;1346653 said:


> Uh, yes it is. 1 truck does 1 lane. Maybe another half if it has a wing, but then it's not just a truck, it too, has upgrades. If you do some investigating, the only way they are clearing 1 entire lane with 1 truck is if they are running 14' plows. That is what MoDOT did when they moved to TowPlows.
> 
> Add the tow plow and it does 2-2 /2 lanes. You just doubled productivity, which in most people's math is an increase of 100%.
> 
> ...


Are we watching the same video ??? watch the vid and at 27 second you can see the width of the plow swaths. If there's not enough work for additional employees then i understand. I don't know what a worker in Mass costs but your telling us that a salary of $38,000.00 actaully includes extras totalling $42,000.00 to equal 80,000.00 ? so the extras are more than the salary?


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## sectlandscaping (Sep 7, 2009)

I'm all for efficiency that's why I think the blade needs to be straighter. At best its a 45 degree angle. I'm not arguing the cost at all. Just the fact that only a little more then half the blade is being used.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

xtreem3d;1343920 said:


> Is it weird you only gain one extra lane of cleaning for the 25 feet. The plow on the truck is what 11-12 feet? seems like you could have a nice truck for year round use for $100,000.00 and maybe include a workers salary


That was my point in my initial post. I think it is weird that you only gain a little over a lane for the 25 feet of width
Steve


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## DaveCN5 (Oct 19, 2011)

xtreem3d;1346813 said:


> That was my point in my initial post. I think it is weird that you only gain a little over a lane for the 25 feet of width
> Steve


Oh come on, that's easy and simple math. Standard highway lane is 12' wide. Even if a 25' blade is at a 45 degree angle, it means it can only clear about 20' at a time, which is about a lane and a half.


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## NFDDJS (Sep 22, 2009)

asdasefWEV


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## NFDDJS (Sep 22, 2009)

xtreem3d;1346577 said:


> I can tell you my $38,000.00 employee is nowhere near $ 80,000.00 Get real !!! you may need to shop insurance and such


I am sorry I didn't and try not to spell out everything for people that cant stop and think on there own. First off if you take care of the people that work for you then yes $80,000 with over time include is a very easy number to hit. I threw the number $80,0000 with out pulling up actual numbers but if you want actual numbers I will do those for you.

40 hours a week at 52 weeks is 2080 hours
Then you start they guy out at 18.50 an hour with a CDL and that is low mass starts CDL-B DOT drivers out at just over 20.00

So we are at $38480.00
Now you take into account they they have paid holidays and start out with 3 weeks of vacation on most state jobs but that doesn't matter because I did 40 hours a week for all 52 weeks right? Wrong... How many holidays, nights and weekend do you plow? So lets remember while we are doing these numbers that all those nights, weekend, and holidays are getting paid at the OT rate ($27.75) and if it is during the day during a paid holiday new he is making double and a half time ($46.25).
In the state of NH the average DOT worker that plows worked 381 hours of over time a year.

So we were at $38480.00
Over time now is $10572.75
total $49052.75

So lets get into health care. Say the person has a family ( more common then not) a family plain cost the state $23,890.81 with that person paying 10%

So we were at 49052.75
Insurance is $23,890.81 and then the employee picks up the other %10
Total $72,943.56

So now we also have to talk about workers comp, and I have already stated what the state says that cost them for each employee and also most states pay 100% for both dental and disability insurance.

So I guess I was wrong. $80,000 is less then what one full time state first year employee cost us. I am also just thinking that MOST of the guys we see out plowing are NOT first year on the job people that they have worked a couple of years so they are making more money, and more vacation...

Next it brings me to how much these trucks cost, state bid 10 wheel dump with one 12ft angle plow, 12ft wing, and sander with warning lights $148,389.91 and that is from the state of NH if you add a left wing your talking another $13,000 ish. The wing I got for my truck last year cost me $15,590.00 and then I had to pay 12% FET tax on that but the state doesn't have to pay that. So yeah if you do the math over the 8-10 years the state keeps these trucks with a $100,000 plow behind it. They SAVE A **** LOAD!!!!

Also mos of the trucks in Mass, all of them in Maine, and the new set up in NH also put wings on the trucks so they can cover 1 1/2 lanes with the truck and 1 1/2 with the tow plow. They could plow more with the tow plow but because they have put some thought into it they don't. If you read about these at all you will see the primary use is
multi-lane, high speed echelon plowing. So if you put it at more of an angle they you are going to have a big mess with you go over a bridge expansion joint, ect.

If you would like to see more about these this is the unit the state of NH just got.

http://www.vikingcives.com/pdf/VCL/Tow Plow.pdf

If you would like I can go on about how much they would save by not having one more truck to insure, put fuel in, tires on, and O yeah these things break down... I know I just put $5600 into my dump.

So you told me to "get real" 
So I will get real... The reason things are so messed up are because people like you don't read into things and do things how they have always been done because why? Because that is how they have always been done... It is things like this that is going to save this state money that we all need to save. Now we can save money by not having a guy on the pay roll or put him on another crew that needs the help or open a new job at another spot in the state DOT or other place.

ALSO I am 100% sure you don't have one employee other then yourself ( I hope you cost your company more then $80,000.00 a year) but if you take care of your people it is very easy to get over $80.000 a year for a full time person...


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## Banksy (Aug 31, 2005)

It doesn't do anything for me. Does 5 less drivers mean 5 less employees as a whole?


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

NFDDJS;1346975 said:


> I am sorry I didn't and try not to spell out everything for people that cant stop and think on there own. First off if you take care of the people that work for you then yes $80,000 with over time include is a very easy number to hit. I threw the number $80,0000 with out pulling up actual numbers but if you want actual numbers I will do those for you.
> 
> 40 hours a week at 52 weeks is 2080 hours
> Then you start they guy out at 18.50 an hour with a CDL and that is low mass starts CDL-B DOT drivers out at just over 20.00
> ...


since your from NH i assume you know what your talking about but it looks like drivers would make 23,000 to 29,000 per year. On my books an employees "salary" is the end of the year total but your adding overtime and bumping up the number. I can only find that vacation is 3 weeks after about 9 years. I'm still looking up the insurance but your showing that insurance is about 63% of the actual income. Just show me a vid where this is plowing 1.5 lanes of snow and i'm a believer


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

another poster was all worked up about Gov deficits and being more efficient...if NH or Mass. is spending 63% of an employees income on health care...that's the real waste IMO.
Does anyone reading this thread spend that much on health care for employees? or if you have heatlh care does it equate to 63% of your income?
24000 / 38000 = 63.1%


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## wizardsr (Aug 8, 2006)

xtreem3d;1347315 said:


> another poster was all worked up about Gov deficits and being more efficient...if NH or Mass. is spending 63% of an employees income on health care...that's the real waste IMO.
> Does anyone reading this thread spend that much on health care for employees? or if you have heatlh care does it equate to 63% of your income?
> 24000 / 38000 = 63.1%


I'm not going to question the amount, as I don't know the facts, but government workers have the best possible health insurance plans, no deductibles, no co-pays, highest negotiated payouts from the carrier to the provider, etc. Commonly referred to as "Cadillac plans", they're insanely expensive, and of course not available to us "common folk".


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

I believe they may but i would think the states can negotiate a good price. I have seen bid sheets for states snow equip and the prices are very good...at least the ones i have seen so that makes me think they can get good values on other "items"


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## theholycow (Nov 29, 2002)

NFDDJS;1346955 said:


> asdasefWEV


Yes, my thoughts exactly.



NFDDJS;1346975 said:


> Also mos of the trucks in Mass, all of them in Maine, and the new set up in NH also put wings on the trucks so they can cover 1 1/2 lanes with the truck and 1 1/2 with the tow plow.


In this thread, it's seemed like everyone is talking about a non-winged truck towing the trailer. I suspect that a dual-wing truck would cover the same width in a more sane and practical way.

When you start talking about a wing AND the trailer together, now that's a little more coverage. I didn't see that configuration in the Missouri video. Is that practical? Can one truck get enough traction and have enough power to do that job? Can one driver *safely* handle all of that? That's a lot of width to watch, a lot of equipment to control, a bit more complex than dual wings with a bit less visibility.

Those are my thoughts on the concept; now here's the big question: Does *Massachusetts* have enough use to buy this stuff? It's not like you'll find stretches of hundreds of miles of abandoned 4-lane-each-way freeway. Everything is congested and full of drivers except the western half of the state. Sure, Route 90 west of Worcester could probably use it for 80-90 miles. Maybe Route 91, which is about 50 miles long. There _might_ be 50 miles worth of 495 where it could be used. How much do you need to be able to use this thing for it to be worthwhile?


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## NFDDJS (Sep 22, 2009)

xtreem3d;1347309 said:


> since your from NH i assume you know what your talking about but it looks like drivers would make 23,000 to 29,000 per year. On my books an employees "salary" is the end of the year total but your adding overtime and bumping up the number. I can only find that vacation is 3 weeks after about 9 years. I'm still looking up the insurance but your showing that insurance is about 63% of the actual income. Just show me a vid where this is plowing 1.5 lanes of snow and i'm a believer


You are 100% right and I should have said this from the get go. I can only speak for the state of NH but I they have different classes of worker. HM1 worker (no CDL) they start at I think $24000 now and top out around $30,000 then you have HM2 these are guys that have a CDL or HM1 people that have got a CDL they move up to HM2 pay and spots the next pay period after they get there CDL. Then you have HM3 guys, they are the equipment operators and 10 wheelers drivers. These guys start around $36000 and top out around $45000 after 10 years. So yes not every state DOT guy makes $38k or more but if they are in a 10 wheeler and lets keep in mind if they have a tow plow behind the truck they have a CDL-A so they are making a small amount more because they have a CDL-A.... Last I knew it was $0.50 an hour. ALSO to stop this convo before it starts yes they are state employee but they DO need a CDL-A to drive a truck of that size with a trailer. They are NOT exempt because the needing a CDL-A is a federal law not a state law. Federal law supper seeds state laws that is why we all need medical cards if we are driving a CDL truck even thought the state of NH doesn't require medical cards.


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

Somewhere i thought it said the drivers of the tow plows need a "special" license? (maybe because the rear wheels steer/move?


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## xtreem3d (Nov 26, 2005)

Disregard previous post... they just need special training on the tow plow,
Steve


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## NFDDJS (Sep 22, 2009)

xtreem3d;1347719 said:


> Disregard previous post... they just need special training on the tow plow,
> Steve


The CDL-A with air bakes will cover what they need from a legal stand point. One other thing they will need is if they put a tank on the back for "liquid salt" or what ever you want to call it, if it is 500 gallons or more they will need a tank endorsement.


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## SnowPro93 (Oct 25, 2006)

I know the guys from mass will back me on this. It any of you have driven down the many highways in Massachusetts a ton of them are awful....Massachusetts infrastructure is pretty sub par...I have a feeling someone is going to destroy this investment...nevermind everyone that still doesn't know how to drive in the snow...


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## dfd9 (Aug 18, 2010)

xtreem3d;1347315 said:


> another poster was all worked up about Gov deficits and being more efficient...if NH or Mass. is spending 63% of an employees income on health care...that's the real waste IMO.
> Does anyone reading this thread spend that much on health care for employees? or if you have heatlh care does it equate to 63% of your income?
> 24000 / 38000 = 63.1%


OK, I wasn't going to comment anymore, but here I am. :crying:

Just think, if you could replace an employee with a tow plow, you could save the 63% AND the 37% of the rest of his\her salary. Thumbs Up



theholycow;1347544 said:


> In this thread, it's seemed like everyone is talking about a non-winged truck towing the trailer. I suspect that a dual-wing truck would cover the same width in a more sane and practical way.


So, what happens when the median has a barrier that cannot handle the snow and all snow must be plowed to the right?

Or, those 4 lane country roads that a driver's side wing can't be used on?

And maybe you could show us a picture of a truck with wing that can plow 2 entire lanes?

Can a dual winged truck even cover 2-2 1/2 lanes?


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## DuraBird02 (Oct 26, 2011)

theholycow;1347544 said:


> Yes, my thoughts exactly.
> 
> Those are my thoughts on the concept; now here's the big question: *Does Massachusetts have enough use to buy this stuff? It's not like you'll find stretches of hundreds of miles of abandoned 4-lane-each-way freeway.* Everything is congested and full of drivers except the western half of the state. Sure, Route 90 west of Worcester could probably use it for 80-90 miles. Maybe Route 91, which is about 50 miles long. There _might_ be 50 miles worth of 495 where it could be used. How much do you need to be able to use this thing for it to be worthwhile?


It can be used on 2 lane highways, right?


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