# Westen Wideout or Fisher XLS



## six in a row

I am new to the forum here and had a question for all you seasoned guys. I am looking to get a plow for my 08 dodge 5500 for next season. not looking to get into an argument over who's better western or fisher but I am torn between a western wideout and a fisher XLS. I herd some of the horror stories about the wideout when they first came out but haven't heard anything recently. i am leaning more towards the western just for the ease of mounting and also the added ground clearance in the off season. the support for both western and fisher are pretty much the same around here so that is pretty much a wash. thanks in advance for the advice.


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## kimber750

You are pretty much down to which you like better, yellow or red. Remember both plows are made by the same people and a lot of the parts are interchangeable.


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## six in a row

yeah i understand that douglas dynamics makes both western and fisher. i was leaning towards western. i like red better. haha


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## snowish10

Depends, hopefuly olddog will comment on the wideout, But depends what you like better full plow trip for the western or cutting edge trip for the fisher.


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## White Gardens

Has nothing to do with color.

What it comes down to is if you want a trip edge or full trip.

Personally, I love a trip edge, especially the heavier plows. It will break up hard pack way better while you'll be fighting a full trip plow.



........


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## six in a row

I was thinking the western full trip would be better in this situation because if the wing hits something on the fisher nothing is there to trip from what i understand.


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## 2006Sierra1500

Poly edges, its not an issue. Fisher mounts vs Western and ground clearance...if your low enough to hit the mounts chances are your gonna be bottomed out somewhere else on the truck too.


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## White Gardens

six in a row;1788099 said:


> I was thinking the western full trip would be better in this situation because if the wing hits something on the fisher nothing is there to trip from what i understand.


That makes no sense. A trip edge won't drop very far, a full trip slams forward and if there is any obstacles around the wings, they're done for.

......


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## six in a row

yes I can see your point white gardens. guess I'm just not too familiar with the trip edge and not too trusting. please forgive my lack of knowledge.


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## 2006Sierra1500

Also...as we've seen from Pat's wonderful writeup...if you treat your equipment like he does(which honestly isn't well) a Wideout WILL break.


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## six in a row

not saying I am the greatest in the world but I think my equipment gets treated pretty good. but I think if anything is abused eventually you will find the breaking point no matter how good it is.


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## Antlerart06

Fisher XLS if I buy one I run western My V plow is trip edge and I not going buy another full trip plow
I just wish western would offer wideout in trip edge Like the truck side hook ups


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## six in a row

Decisions decisions. Sounds like this will be alittle bit tougher than I thought. I do love the western mount as well. Can anyone with a trip edge plow tell me what they like/dislike about it compared to a full trip?


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## Antlerart06

six in a row;1788710 said:


> Decisions decisions. Sounds like this will be alittle bit tougher than I thought. I do love the western mount as well. Can anyone with a trip edge plow tell me what they like/dislike about it compared to a full trip?


Full trip when it trips you will lose speed and something traction and you know when it trips

Trip edge it trips so fast you will never notice it
its noisy when it trips 
Trip edge plow will be heavier then a full trip plow

I think a trip edge scrapes better then a full trip plow
I notice this between my BossV and my MVP
and Notice it with my skid and its trip edge vs western 8.6 pro + plow
So I think Fisher XLS will scrape better then the wideout but I don't own neither one to know for sure


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## Flawless440

Go V plow.... It can do more than a wideout plow... Also there has been issues with those plows...I'm buying a trip edge Boss DXT next season to mount on a GMC Denali 1 ton


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## kimber750

Antlerart06;1788793 said:


> Full trip when it trips you will lose speed and something traction and you know when it trips
> 
> Trip edge it trips so fast you will never notice it
> its noisy when it trips
> Trip edge plow will be heavier then a full trip plow
> 
> I think a trip edge scrapes better then a full trip plow
> I notice this between my BossV and my MVP
> and Notice it with my skid and its trip edge vs western 8.6 pro + plow
> So I think Fisher XLS will scrape better then the wideout but I don't own neither one to know for sure


I know it when my trip edge trips, every dam time. Hard to miss a 900lb plow jumping a foot in the air. Even going slow you can tell when it trips. Now my trip edge plow doesn't seem to rattle the truck as much as my old full trip plow would when being tripped. But a trip edge can definitely give a more spectacular show when it trips.


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## 1olddogtwo

2006Sierra1500;1788133 said:


> Also...as we've seen from Pat's wonderful writeup...if you treat your equipment like he does(which honestly isn't well) a Wideout WILL break.


This true. I demand maximum and then some out of my équipement. I will give my $0.02 later when I have time.


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## Flawless440

Wish you could demo plows like other equipment..


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## six in a row

I agree on the demo. Wish I could try them both put. I can see why a trip edge would be better than full trip but I am still leaning towards western just for the mount and the added ground clearance in the summer. Don't really want to go v plow just because I have some commercial and residential accounts and I would still have a nice small 8 foot to get in some tight spots.


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## 1olddogtwo

that's a funny statement in the grand scheme of things.


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## six in a row

Guess I should have worded that alittle better


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## 1olddogtwo

Just trying to picture a 5500 doing residentials and being concern with tight areas for the plow


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## snowish10

1olddogtwo;1788935 said:


> Just trying to picture a 5500 doing residentials and being concern with tight areas for the plow


Sh*t its a pain in the ass with my 350. 5500 would suck.


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## six in a row

It's going to be mostly commercial lots but I just wanted to know the smaller plow is there when I need it. Plus transporting an 8 footer is a lot nicer than a 10. Really wish I could put the fisher mold board/plow in the western head gear. Think that would be the best.


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## snowish10

six in a row;1788950 said:


> It's going to be mostly commercial lots but I just wanted to know the smaller plow is there when I need it. Plus transporting an 8 footer is a lot nicer than a 10. Really wish I could put the fisher mold board/plow in the western head gear. Think that would be the best.


Im pretty sure you could, if i remember correct olddog looked into it or someone did. wasnt worth the cost. But thats a really good idea if you got the money.


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## six in a row

after doing some more research I am still leaning towards western. pretty much just for the mount and off season ground clearance. but still hung up on witch one would be the most durable of the two. I guess that should have been my question up front


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## SnowGuy73

Wideout....


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## snowish10

six in a row;1788985 said:


> after doing some more research I am still leaning towards western. pretty much just for the mount and off season ground clearance. but still hung up on witch one would be the most durable of the two. I guess that should have been my question up front


Depends from some of my research due to i never used either, if your use your plow to its fullest ability the fisher might be better since the trip edge, but I say if your not using the plow to its fullest go western. But I say western either way.:salute:


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## Defcon 5

snowish10;1788997 said:


> Depends from some of my research due to i never used either, if your use your plow to its fullest ability the fisher might be better since the trip edge, but I say if your not using the plow to its fullest go western. But I say western either way.:salute:


Cant go wrong with eather one.......I own an XLS and have run Wideouts...Very Productive Plow......Good Luck with your purchase and you wont be sorry....:salute:


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## snowish10

Defcon 5;1789471 said:


> Cant go wrong with eather one.......I own an XLS and have run Wideouts...Very Productive Plow......Good Luck with your purchase and you wont be sorry....:salute:


Very true! Next truck I get ill be getting some sort of expandable wing plow.


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## 2006Sierra1500

snowish10;1788954 said:


> Im pretty sure you could, if i remember correct olddog looked into it or someone did. wasnt worth the cost. But thats a really good idea if you got the money.


I think he asked Western to make it for him but it wasn't crash tested and something else they told him then gave him a stainless MVP+. Wideout/XLS Moldboards look like it could be done with minimal fab, Fisher on Western A-Frame.


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## Mark Oomkes

1olddogtwo;1788935 said:


> Just trying to picture a 5500 doing residentials and being concern with tight areas for the plow


Ruh roh, a 5500 doing residentials was my undoing a few years back. Resulted in a lengthy vacay.

I'll shut up now. About that at least. :laughing:

If I had to make the choice betwixt the 2, I would go XLS and never look back.


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## Mark Oomkes

Flawless440;1788810 said:


> Go V plow.... It can do more than a wideout plow... Also there has been issues with those plows...I'm buying a trip edge Boss DXT next season to mount on a GMC Denali 1 ton


BS and BS.

Other than drifting drives--long drives--I can and will outplow a V any and every day. I will leave a cleaner lot that requires less salt as well as plow it faster.

Not to mention, there have been problems with every single plow manufactured. Maybe you could expound on the problems you've had with either a Wideout of XLS that you have run? Or any expanding plow for that matter.

I started with a V plow in 1990. From a straight blade. It was awesome, other than broken hinges and crappy scraping. Switched to all V blades until I bought my first Blizzard in '05. Within 3 years, all my V's were gone and all trucks were running Blizzards. I currently have 1 straight blade on my L8000. Oops, 2, one on my RTV for walks as well. Everything else is an expanding plow. From my Toolcat up to my JD 5101e. Or push boxes.

So while I may not have experience with the Wideout of XLS, I do with their predecessor, and will tell you that an expanding plow is far better, productive, etc than a V plow in 90% of applications. In all those years of running V's , I can count on 1 hand how many times I actually had to use the plow in a V position to break through drifts.


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## Antlerart06

Mark Oomkes;1789739 said:


> BS and BS.
> 
> Other than drifting drives--long drives--I can and will outplow a V any and every day. I will leave a cleaner lot that requires less salt as well as plow it faster.
> 
> Not to mention, there have been problems with every single plow manufactured. Maybe you could expound on the problems you've had with either a Wideout of XLS that you have run? Or any expanding plow for that matter.
> 
> I started with a V plow in 1990. From a straight blade. It was awesome, other than broken hinges and crappy scraping. Switched to all V blades until I bought my first Blizzard in '05. Within 3 years, all my V's were gone and all trucks were running Blizzards. I currently have 1 straight blade on my L8000. Oops, 2, one on my RTV for walks as well. Everything else is an expanding plow. From my Toolcat up to my JD 5101e. Or push boxes.
> 
> So while I may not have experience with the Wideout of XLS, I do with their predecessor, and will tell you that an expanding plow is far better, productive, etc than a V plow in 90% of applications. In all those years of running V's , I can count on 1 hand how many times I actually had to use the plow in a V position to break through drifts.


1990 V plow vs a MVP+ or MVP 3 with wings on a 9.6 isn't the same


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## 1olddogtwo

Mark Oomkes;1789739 said:


> BS and BS.
> 
> Other than drifting drives--long drives--I can and will outplow a V any and every day. I will leave a cleaner lot that requires less salt as well as plow it faster.
> 
> Not to mention, there have been problems with every single plow manufactured. Maybe you could expound on the problems you've had with either a Wideout of XLS that you have run? Or any expanding plow for that matter.
> 
> I started with a V plow in 1990. From a straight blade. It was awesome, other than broken hinges and crappy scraping. Switched to all V blades until I bought my first Blizzard in '05. Within 3 years, all my V's were gone and all trucks were running Blizzards. I currently have 1 straight blade on my L8000. Oops, 2, one on my RTV for walks as well. Everything else is an expanding plow. From my Toolcat up to my JD 5101e. Or push boxes.
> 
> So while I may not have experience with the Wideout of XLS, I do with their predecessor, and will tell you that an expanding plow is far better, productive, etc than a V plow in 90% of applications. In all those years of running V's , I can count on 1 hand how many times I actually had to use the plow in a V position to break through drifts.


I never use as /\…






WO/Xls and forth have a place, but I'll never own one again. Own two WO's in four years and they a Vee will move more snow faster and quicker plus stack higher. The MVP3 will do the same as the plus and throw snow back on the roof if you want…


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## Mark Oomkes

Antlerart06;1789837 said:


> 1990 V plow vs a MVP+ or MVP 3 with wings on a 9.6 isn't the same


No wings, only stock plows.

Actually, the first gen Boss plows were awesome. Chain lift and very seldom broke.

The last Boss V I had was the not-so-RapidTach 2.

The last Fisher V I had was a 9'6".

As for wings, in my area we are allowed 8'6", with Blizzards I never have to get out to remove my wings to be legal.

Besides, the straight blades always have and will scrape and windrow better than a V because the hinge disrupts the flow.



1olddogtwo;1789887 said:


> I never use as /\…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WO/Xls and forth have a place, but I'll never own one again. Own two WO's in four years and they a Vee will move more snow faster and quicker plus stack higher. The MVP3 will do the same as the plus and throw snow back on the roof if you want…


You are basing this on using 1 of the 3 from DD.

Also, your WO has the same mount\lift system as an MVP, so the stacking should be the exact same.

I've had at least 6 V's. I own 10 or so Blizzards. First time plowing a church lot with a Blizzard, we cut 40% off our time compared to a 9'6" V.

I will challenge anyone to what plow moves more snow faster. There is no way a stock V--NO WINGS--compares to a stock expanding plow.


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## Antlerart06

Mark Oomkes;1789900 said:


> No wings, only stock plows.
> 
> Actually, the first gen Boss plows were awesome. Chain lift and very seldom broke.
> 
> The last Boss V I had was the not-so-RapidTach 2.
> 
> The last Fisher V I had was a 9'6".
> 
> As for wings, in my area we are allowed 8'6", with Blizzards I never have to get out to remove my wings to be legal.
> 
> Besides, the straight blades always have and will scrape and windrow better than a V because the hinge disrupts the flow.
> 
> .


O I see your point I have a RT2 Boss V and I will agree with you it doent scrape very well 
Legal width I'm legal I had to buy a permit cuz even a 9.6 w/out wings its wider then 8.6 
Not often I run my in V mode but its nice when I need to bust a drift 
I run mine semi Scoop with wings on and you put a tape on it be 10'
In my town there are 2 wideouts and 1 blizzard now for V plows with wings I know one company running 18 V plows with wings 
Then I have 1 thinking there is 2 others running wings

If they are more productive then a V then I know that one company would be running them They plow some big lots 10 acres size

I think between the 2 The V w/wings will hold more snow then a Wideout


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## kimber750

In a parking lot a expandable plow will out perform a v plow any day of the week. Now I agree that v plow will stack better since when in scoop the wings will reach higher and further than an expandable can. 

Maybe your friend with 18 v plows is not willing to upgrade yet?


I have a 8.5 XV and have plowed with an xls. The xls is much much more productive.


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## 1olddogtwo

kimber750;1789955 said:


> In a parking lot a expandable plow will out perform a v plow any day of the week. Now I agree that v plow will stack better since when in scoop the wings will reach higher and further than an expandable can.
> 
> Maybe your friend with 18 v plows is not willing to upgrade yet?
> 
> I have a 8.5 XV and have plowed with an xls. The xls is much much more productive.


agreed on large parking lots without wings. My MVP3 is 11-6.

Until they improve the base angle support and moldboard cracking, I'll stay with the V plow. I would pick the XLS over the WO for the trip


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## Mark Oomkes

1olddogtwo;1789965 said:


> agreed on large parking lots without wings. My MVP3 is 11-6.
> 
> Until they improve the base angle support and moldboard cracking, I'll stay with the V plow. I would pick the XLS over the WO for the trip


That was your problem, buying a DD version. :laughing:

My pre-DD's have held up just fine.

Well, actually I have one that has a cracked moldboard, but it was #3 off the line in the LP models, so it kinda makes sense. It rusted through. 

This is also the reason I will not buy anything but an 8611 new. I will piecemeal my old ones back together as long as I can. Because Niemalas didn't care about "more platforms", they actually cared about building a product that would stand up to being used hard.

And, since we have double the average of snow Chicago does and mine have been in service longer than yours, Pat, pretty sure we are not comparing apples to apples.


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## 1olddogtwo

Mark Oomkes;1789967 said:


> That was your problem, buying a DD version. :laughing:
> 
> My pre-DD's have held up just fine.
> 
> Well, actually I have one that has a cracked moldboard, but it was #3 off the line in the LP models, so it kinda makes sense. It rusted through.
> 
> This is also the reason I will not buy anything but an 8611 new. I will piecemeal my old ones back together as long as I can. Because Niemalas didn't care about "more platforms", they actually cared about building a product that would stand up to being used hard.
> 
> And, since we have double the average of snow Chicago does and mine have been in service longer than yours, Pat, pretty sure we are not comparing apples to apples.


I agree on the snowfall and that's the sad part. Three of those years when I had them, we got 60 in's. One of those we seen a salt shortage too Our avg is 38. On the beginning of 2nd season Arctic rebuilt the base angle cause all 6 gussets bent and the edge rolled back. During the same season, the face cracked all four corners of the slide boxs. Year 3, the cutting edge bolt holes start pulling/egging out so the edge still roll back. At beginning of season 2, my dealer (CPW) told me Western would not cover it. Sold it to SullivanSeptic season 3. by this time it was bulletproof after Arctic rebuilt again. I bought another one thinking what are the changes of it happening again.

Season 4. 20 hrs later, crack face and cutting edge rolling back. Western told me to continue the season and they made me the SS Vee to replace the 2nd WO.. That one is now two seasons old and sold off to sully again. Well in a week.


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## Antlerart06

kimber750;1789955 said:


> In a parking lot a expandable plow will out perform a v plow any day of the week. Now I agree that v plow will stack better since when in scoop the wings will reach higher and further than an expandable can.
> 
> Maybe your friend with 18 v plows is not willing to upgrade yet?
> 
> I have a 8.5 XV and have plowed with an xls. The xls is much much more productive.


O no when the wideout came out they bought 4 or 5 of them after the first winter they sold them went back to V plow with wings

And they are not my friends


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## Defcon 5

I find it funny that guys will fight to the death that there plow is better....My "V" plow will stack as high as a 3 story building or My Wideout will plow 6 acres in 13 minutes.....The fact is an expandable wing plow will out perform, production wise a "V" in most Commercial plowing situations...When you have a business owner(MarkO) with the vast knowledge and years in the business telling you this....You can take it to the bank.....:salute:


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## 1olddogtwo

Defcon 5;1790230 said:


> I find it funny that guys will fight to the death that there plow is better....My "V" plow will stack as high as a 3 story building or My Wideout will plow 6 acres in 13 minutes.....The fact is an expandable wing plow will out perform, production wise a "V" in most Commercial plowing situations...When you have a business owner(MarkO) with the vast knowledge and years in the business telling you this....You can take it to the bank.....:salute:


Been snow businesses myself almost 30. Plowed with every type of plow ever made. I've tested stuff before its evened hit the open market. I base my comments off experience, 1st hand.

Taking nothing away from Mark or any others, we all have our opinions.

Back to the question on hand......XLS


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## Antlerart06

1olddogtwo;1790275 said:


> Been snow businesses myself almost 30. Plowed with every type of plow ever made. I've tested stuff before its evened hit the open market. I base my comments off experience, 1st hand.
> 
> Taking nothing away from Mark or any others, we all have our opinions.
> 
> Back to the question on hand......XLS


Dang your old like me
I know back in the 80s/90s I ran 8'-9' box pushers on trucks
I sure love my V now
I had a chance to buy a 2 yr old used XLS Truck hookup for 3k but I was going mount it on a skid. The guy sold it as I got to his place piss me off. He was 3hrs from me .Told him I wanted it and was leaving town and told him when I was going get there.


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## Defcon 5

1olddogtwo;1790275 said:


> Been snow businesses myself almost 30. Plowed with every type of plow ever made. I've tested stuff before its evened hit the open market. I base my comments off experience, 1st hand.
> 
> Taking nothing away from Mark or any others, we all have our opinions.
> 
> Back to the question on hand......XLS


You are right everyone has opinions........

As for the XLS.....Great Plow(My Opinion)......Oldest one i have is 6 Years old....Very Good condition......I guess it's all how you treat the Equipment...


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## SnoFarmer

An old man pissing match,
I started in the snow business back in 1980...
That and $2 will get you some coffee at starbucks...

A boss V with wings is more reliable that a expandable plow.

Fewer moving parts to go bad....


Then some say the str8 plow cleans up better. and it may, but then they just salt the lot anyway so what did it matter?

A veee leaves so little behind, it's only the anal retentive who mention it. :waving:

jmhao

my 8.2 with wings comes to 10' 1" and some change.
for $ you can get a permit, but most don't. 
I never have, the money saved will more than pay the fine...
Name me one plower who hasn't skirted a law or 2 and I'll show you someone who doesn't plow snow for a living.


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## six in a row

well I'm still on the fence. haha. does anyone have pictures of what the fisher minute mount looks like on the truck side with no plow. dont want it to be too low as i know you can un pin the western horns.


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## Defcon 5

six in a row;1791461 said:


> well I'm still on the fence. haha. does anyone have pictures of what the fisher minute mount looks like on the truck side with no plow. dont want it to be too low as i know you can un pin the western horns.


You live in PA im sure there is a truck around you can look at....Fisher mount sits as high or even a little higher than the western mount....


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## Antlerart06

Defcon 5;1791501 said:


> You live in PA im sure there is a truck around you can look at....Fisher mount sits as high or even a little higher than the western mount....


Don't think so 
Western receivers will remove in summer time and cant even see the truck brackets 
Fisher receivers wont remove They don't set flush with the bumper like my Western brackets do with the receiver horns off

I wish DD would make the Ultra mount a standard feature for all 3 plow brands they make


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## potskie

You guys need to stop comparing the WO and XLS to Vs like they are one in the same. Go compare the two and you'll see why. The XLS is a heavier built plow. (not necessarily better but certain aspects are heavier and stronger) 

For what it's worth I ran Vs, WO's and XLS's as an employee for various companies for many hrs/seasons. When I finally bought my own, XLS all the way. Way more productive than stock XVs and MVPs. It's also legal to go down the road..... A good chunk of the Vs with wings around here are not legal which in my opinion is a big consideration aswell.


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## Mark Oomkes

Antlerart06;1790193 said:


> O no when the wideout came out they bought 4 or 5 of them after the first winter they sold them went back to V plow with wings
> 
> And they are not my friends


So what exactly were the reasons for going back to V's?

Also, Missouri is a big state. Kind of. Not really known as being in the snow belt, maybe you could give us a little more detail of type, frequency, seasonal averages of snow you plow.



Defcon 5;1790230 said:


> I find it funny that guys will fight to the death that there plow is better....My "V" plow will stack as high as a 3 story building or My Wideout will plow 6 acres in 13 minutes.....The fact is an expandable wing plow will out perform, production wise a "V" in most Commercial plowing situations...When you have a business owner(MarkO) with the vast knowledge and years in the business telling you this....You can take it to the bank.....:salute:


Better than a catfight over lipstick.



potskie;1791875 said:


> You guys need to stop comparing the WO and XLS to Vs like they are one in the same. Go compare the two and you'll see why. The XLS is a heavier built plow. (not necessarily better but certain aspects are heavier and stronger)
> 
> For what it's worth I ran Vs, WO's and XLS's as an employee for various companies for many hrs/seasons. When I finally bought my own, XLS all the way. Way more productive than stock XVs and MVPs. It's also legal to go down the road..... A good chunk of the Vs with wings around here are not legal which in my opinion is a big consideration aswell.


Pffft, why are you talking of these fact things?

I agree, I can run my Blizzards down the road 100% legal without any permits. If I could get one. I can pull a wing in to get through a narrow area or go around a light pole, I can extend the wing, I can have an 11' straight blade or just about any variation therein. The only thing a V has over an expanding plow is the ability to break through drifts. Which, as I mentioned, I could count the number of times that was needed over the course of 15 or so years, on 1 hand. That included our heaviest snowfall that I ever plowed, 22" with strong winds for a 48 hour period.


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## Mark Oomkes

SnoFarmer;1790335 said:


> An old man pissing match,
> I started in the snow business back in 1980...
> That and $2 will get you some coffee at starbucks...
> 
> A boss V with wings is more reliable that a expandable plow.
> 
> Fewer moving parts to go bad....
> 
> Then some say the str8 plow cleans up better. and it may, but then they just salt the lot anyway so what did it matter?
> 
> A veee leaves so little behind, it's only the anal retentive who mention it.
> 
> jmhao
> 
> my 8.2 with wings comes to 10' 1" and some change.
> for $ you can get a permit, but most don't.
> I never have, the money saved will more than pay the fine...
> Name me one plower who hasn't skirted a law or 2 and I'll show you someone who doesn't plow snow for a living.


Not as old as you, you old duffer.

Besides, there must be frozen dog crap that is showing up you need to scoop.

If you want to call it anal retentive, just fine. But when more snow is left behind and I have to salt it, it costs me more in materials. Every little bit adds up over 70+ inches a year.

Fewer moving parts, horse hockey. Same bovine excrement that was used when Boss V's came out in the late 80's and everybody was affeared of them because they were too complicated. Besides, this coming from the guy who wants a 12 way blade for a truck. :laughing:

Troll, you need some lessons from bri. What a miserable attempt. :laughing::laughing:

PS Pretty sure water at Starbucks costs more than $2, probably tastes as bad as their coffee too.


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## SnoFarmer

It snowed, crap disappears or melts in...

I've been using the snow blower to sent it out of the runs, man that s hit can fly.....



Mark Oomkes;1791911 said:


> Not as old as you, you old duffer.
> Besides, there must be frozen dog crap that is showing up you need to scoop.


? you don't make money from salting?
Why sure you do.


Mark Oomkes;1791911 said:


> If you want to call it anal retentive, just fine. But when more snow is left behind and I have to salt it, it costs me more in materials. Every little bit adds up over 70+ inches a year.


A 12 way would be the cats meow...
no springs, no one way rams.
Total control over the blade and wings
heaven....


Mark Oomkes;1791911 said:


> Fewer moving parts, horse hockey. Same bovine excrement that was used when Boss V's came out in the late 80's and everybody was affeared of them because they were too complicated. Besides, this coming from the guy who wants a 12 way blade for a truck.


xysport


Mark Oomkes;1791911 said:


> Troll, you need some lessons from bri. What a miserable attempt.
> 
> PS Pretty sure water at Starbucks costs more than $2, probably tastes as bad as their coffee too.


fewer moving parts,,, that actually work reliability even if you do hit a curb or hop it

Yea,not sure about the $2, that was a troll, as I've never been in a Starbucks.


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## Mark Oomkes

I've been in a Starbucks once. Overpriced crap is what they sell. 

Yes, I make money from salting, but all my accounts are per app not per ton. The less I spread, the better.


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## 1olddogtwo

Oh so we moved on to salting now.....LOL

To each their own I guess....

I wonder why everyone (almost) wants a V with expanding wings on them? Silly people.


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## 1olddogtwo

potskie;1791875 said:


> You guys need to stop comparing the WO and XLS to Vs like they are one in the same. Go compare the two and you'll see why. The XLS is a heavier built plow. (not necessarily better but certain aspects are heavier and stronger)
> 
> For what it's worth I ran Vs, WO's and XLS's as an employee for various companies for many hrs/seasons. When I finally bought my own, XLS all the way. Way more productive than stock XVs and MVPs. It's also legal to go down the road..... A good chunk of the Vs with wings around here are not legal which in my opinion is a big consideration aswell.


I'm sorry, did u say stop comparing then compare them?

We understand we will defend what we own, some to the bitter end. I've had Vee, then WO, back to Vee. My angle is the WO needs improving and if he wants the western mount, go VEE.


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## potskie

1olddogtwo;1791960 said:


> I'm sorry, did u say stop comparing then compare them?
> 
> We understand we will defend what we own, some to the bitter end. I've had Vee, then WO, back to Vee. My angle is the WO needs improving and if he wants the western mount, go VEE.


No I'm saying stop using WO and XLS interchangeably. Built different, XLS has more beef because of the trip edge.


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## Mark Oomkes

1olddogtwo;1791960 said:


> I'm sorry, did u say stop comparing then compare them?
> 
> We understand we will defend what we own, some to the bitter end. I've had Vee, then WO, back to Vee. My angle is the WO needs improving and if he wants the western mount, go VEE.


But what you are ignoring--and giving bad advice--is that there are 2 other viable options. You had problems with the WO because they are crap. The XLS does not have those problems, they have very few problems if any.

Other than antler, everyone else realizes that expandable plows are more efficient as well as scrape cleaner than Vs, but one happens to be crap. I won't comment on the DD Blizzard, although they are not nearly as reliable as pre-DD Blizzards (thank goodness they lightened them up so the masses could purchase them and in the mean time turn them into crap). So, out of the 3 right now in an 8'-10' model, the XLS is the hands down winner.

But, because you had a bad experience with the WO you are categorically telling him to go with a V because you think they are all junk.

Personally, for me, production is my first consideration. Reliability is second. Mount style and price or warranty don't even factor in my buying decisions.


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## Defcon 5

Mark Oomkes;1791984 said:


> But what you are ignoring--and giving bad advice--is that there are 2 other viable options. You had problems with the WO because they are crap. The XLS does not have those problems, they have very few problems if any.
> 
> Other than antler, everyone else realizes that expandable plows are more efficient as well as scrape cleaner than Vs, but one happens to be crap. I won't comment on the DD Blizzard, although they are not nearly as reliable as pre-DD Blizzards (thank goodness they lightened them up so the masses could purchase them and in the mean time turn them into crap). So, out of the 3 right now in an 8'-10' model, the XLS is the hands down winner.
> 
> But, because you had a bad experience with the WO you are categorically telling him to go with a V because you think they are all junk.
> 
> Personally, for me, production is my first consideration. Reliability is second. Mount style and price or warranty don't even factor in my buying decisions.


Where doe's the "Cool" Factor fit in....I painted My XLS silver and Pretended that it was stainless...I thought I was pretty cool.....:salute:


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## 1olddogtwo

1olddogtwo;1790275 said:


> Been snow businesses myself almost 30. Plowed with every type of plow ever made. I've tested stuff before its evened hit the open market. I base my comments off experience, 1st hand.
> 
> Taking nothing away from Mark or any others, we all have our opinions.
> 
> Back to the question on hand......XLS


Mark ^^^^^^ I'm with you on the current 3 models......so we both giving bad info? There are a few others like Mr.Elite and KJ Creamer to name a few having the same issues I had.

Once again, western mount, Vee over WO based on personal experience. I will also at I'm very rough on my eqm.


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## 1olddogtwo

potskie;1791980 said:


> No I'm saying stop using WO and XLS interchangeably. Built different, XLS has more beef because of the trip edge.


Please read the thread on what you are writing about. The boards are interchangeable for the record.

I agree the XLS is a better plow with some of the same defects.

We snow guys are so damn protective our stuff, is it like this on lawnsite?


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## snocrete

Defcon 5;1791986 said:


> Where doe's the "Cool" Factor fit in....I painted My XLS silver and Pretended that it was stainless...I thought I was pretty cool.....:salute:


cant you get banned for PUI?

PUI = posting under the influence


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## peteo1

I can't believe you pulled out "affeared" Lol! 

I'll vote for the XLS only cuz I'm a Fisher guy. I don't like western products even though they're supposedly the same. Personally I've never spent much time with an expandable and for what i do a Vee works better. We usually see 100" or better and it seems my accounts get a lot of drifting so this year I'll be buying a Vee.


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## potskie

1olddogtwo;1792009 said:


> We snow guys are so damn protective our stuff, is it like this on lawnsite?


Pretty much and for good reason. I mean our equipment is the basis of our businesses. If we didn't take pride in ownership and said no no buy that other manufacturer or style. Wouldn't we be implying that we ourselves failed at managing, running and purchasing for our businesses? For us small and even medium sized guys with only a few pieces of equipment and a stubborn/hard nosed attitude this is just an unacceptable and impossible thing to say, to a fault even.

But you are right the Western mount is better, but the XLS is hands down a better plow. My previous point was simply that the wing plows were being put down as a whole because of a couple bad experiences with a specific brand and it's not really fair. They aren't Asian drivers...... Should I write off wing plows as a whole because of my buddies 29R that we now lovingly call the gillette plow?


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## Mark Oomkes

1olddogtwo;1792001 said:


> Mark ^^^^^^ I'm with you on the current 3 models......so we both giving bad info? There are a few others like Mr.Elite and KJ Creamer to name a few having the same issues I had.
> 
> Once again, western mount, Vee over WO based on personal experience. I will also at I'm very rough on my eqm.


Pretty sure some of these folks here would poo their panties if they saw how I plow. I push things to the edge, and then past to see what they will do, but am still running an '05 8611 LP on my personal truck. It works just fine. Sure, it's been repaired and some parts replaced, but it has 9 1/2 seasons, with several of those being over 100". And I am not close to ready to replacing it. I won't, because if I bought a DD 86110 LP whatever it's called now, I would have been through several now.



1olddogtwo;1792009 said:


> Please read the thread on what you are writing about. The boards are interchangeable for the record.
> 
> I agree the XLS is a better plow with some of the same defects.
> 
> We snow guys are so damn protective our stuff, is it like this on lawnsite?


Where are the folks with XLS complaining about all the same issues with XLS? I haven't read near the complaints about the XLS vs WO. I attribute that to having a trip edge, which is much easier on the plow and truck.



snocrete;1792041 said:


> cant you get banned for PUI?
> 
> PUI = posting under the influence


That's PWI (Posting while Intoxicated)

PS Funny thing is, I don't own any of the 3 expandable plows and only 1 Boss V plow, which is a UTV version.


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## 1olddogtwo

I was referring to slide boxes, the inside corners of the slide boxes. They start cracking on the 90's, the cracks form and flare out at a 45. This is caused when the wings are fully extended. The inner part of the side is forced forward and pushes/cracks the moldboard.

My fear was always tearing up a wing while plowing, never had a issue besides the cracking of the face ,which is probably more cosmedical then mechanical.


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## Antlerart06

1olddogtwo;1792228 said:


> I was referring to slide boxes, the inside corners of the slide boxes. They start cracking on the 90's, the cracks form and flare out at a 45. This is caused when the wings are fully extended. The inner part of the side is forced forward and pushes/cracks the moldboard.
> 
> My fear was always tearing up a wing while plowing, never had a issue besides the cracking of the face ,which is probably more cosmedical then mechanical.


I wonder if on a WO if there more pressure on the wings in scoop mode during the time when the plow is tripping VS XLS tripe edge there no pressure on its wing when it trips

Might be reason you don't hear much about cracking on the XLS


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## 1olddogtwo

Antlerart06;1792239 said:


> I wonder if on a WO if there more pressure on the wings in scoop mode during the time when the plow is tripping VS XLS tripe edge there no pressure on its wing when it trips
> 
> Might be reason you don't hear much about cracking on the XLS


Could be, never thought of that.

By the way, I'm workings in Moberly,Mo anywhere near you?


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## Antlerart06

1olddogtwo;1792249 said:


> Could be, never thought of that.
> 
> By the way, I'm workings in Moberly,Mo anywhere near you?


Im on hwy 63 north about 60 miles give or take

What are you doing down there


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## 1olddogtwo

Antlerart06;1792740 said:


> Im on hwy 63 north about 60 miles give or take
> 
> What are you doing down there


Came 63 here.....

Working at a distribution warehouse.


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## Antlerart06

1olddogtwo;1792743 said:


> Came 63 here.....
> 
> Working at a distribution warehouse.


Im at Kirksville


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## 90plow

"I attribute that to having a trip edge, which is much easier on the plow and truck." This is a fact?? I can see how trip edge would be easier especially in the wideout version. If a western wing hits something the plow should trip if the fisher wing hits something there's no trip that's a fact. I don't see how much different they could be just might have more members with wideouts on this site or in general therefore a larger representation of failures. They are both from the same company so insure they use the same engineers. I would choose a wideout over an xls just for the trip factor.


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## 1olddogtwo

Trip edges saves transmissions......must be true seen it on plowsite


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## Defcon 5

1olddogtwo;1793951 said:


> Trip edges saves transmissions......must be true seen it on plowsite


Trip Edge and Chain Lift save Transmissions..........:laughing:


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## Antlerart06

90plow;1793946 said:


> "I attribute that to having a trip edge, which is much easier on the plow and truck." This is a fact?? I can see how trip edge would be easier especially in the wideout version. If a western wing hits something the plow should trip if the fisher wing hits something there's no trip that's a fact. I don't see how much different they could be just might have more members with wideouts on this site or in general therefore a larger representation of failures. They are both from the same company so insure they use the same engineers. I would choose a wideout over an xls just for the trip factor.


But WO in scoop and it trips there more pressure on the wings when it fully trips over
XLS when it trips no pressure on the wings

I don't think if the wing catches something since it has no steel edge The wing its self wont make the plow trip But who knows


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## potskie

Antlerart06;1793984 said:


> But WO in scoop and it trips there more pressure on the winTubegs when it fully trips over
> XLS when it trips no pressure on the wings
> 
> I don't think if the wing catches something since it has no steel edge The wing its self wont make the plow trip But who knows


I've hooked a few curbstones plowing along them with my XLS. Wing goes straight from scoop then the poly edge acts like a trip edge. Doesnt trip the main edge tho. I did tear a poly edge this year but it was worn to less than 1/4 thickness from running curbs. It's still on the plow actually.

Rib spacing is different on them and it uses thicker wall square tubing for cross bracing rather than the thinner round on a WO. Combined with the trip edge is most likely why cracking unheard of with them IMO.


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## Antlerart06

potskie;1794007 said:


> I've hooked a few curbstones plowing along them with my XLS. Wing goes straight from scoop then the poly edge acts like a trip edge. Doesnt trip the main edge tho. I did tear a poly edge this year but it was worn to less than 1/4 thickness from running curbs. It's still on the plow actually.
> 
> Rib spacing is different on them and it uses thicker wall square tubing for cross bracing rather than the thinner round on a WO. Combined with the trip edge is most likely why cracking unheard of with them IMO.


Good to know Im a western fan but The XLS looks like its made better 
I know it has to made better and stronger to handle the trip edge

I have to spend some money and thinking a new dually wont be new Been looking for 99-02 models They are getting hard to find 
The XLS is on my mind or another MVP


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## Mark Oomkes

Oh boy, here we go again.


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