# Towing w/ F250 or F350- CDL Required?



## ARP (Feb 27, 2005)

I was to purchase a used F250 or F350 diesel and tow with it either a drop deck equipment trailer or a dump trailer rated at 14- 16,000 lbs. (GCVWR at approx. 20- 24,000 lbs) for a skidsteer business- would I need a CDL to operate this rig?


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## plowed (Nov 30, 2001)

Yes, to pull any trailer with a GVW above 10k lbs, even with a 250/350, you will need a Class A CDL.


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## ARP (Feb 27, 2005)

thanks plowed


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

no,as long as you are not grossing over 26001 lbs.


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## GSE (Dec 17, 2004)

bsnead said:


> no,as long as you are not grossing over 26001 lbs.


Actually, you can drive anything under 26K with a standard MV operators license. Anything over 12K you need a medical card, renewed bi-annually. To tow anything over 10K, regardless of the combined weight, you need a CDL-A.


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

not to get in a pissing contest,but i would suggest you re-read the regs,especially the part where it says any combination of vehicles with a gross weight rating of 26001 or more provided the trailer being towed is rated over 10,001.This means you can pull a trailer rated to 20000 with a Yugo as long as you are not grossing over 26001.


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## 04superduty (Jan 9, 2004)

go to your local DMV, secretary of state or what ever they call it and ask them. here im MI you need a shoufers(sp) license to tow anything over 10,000 lbs, but still under the 26,000 lb GCWR.


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

I think some confuse a class A license with a class A cdl.For example,the state of NC has both.You need a class A license to pull a trailer over 10001 lbs. regardless of gross rating provided you are exempt from other CDL requirements,however,you are required to have a CDL only if the vehicle being towed has a rating of 10001 or more AND the combination is rated over 26001.http://www.ncdot.org/dmv/driver_services/drivershandbook/chapter1/typesLicenses.html


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## GSE (Dec 17, 2004)

Like anything else, these things vary state to state. I know in NH you need a CDL-A to pull a trailer greater than 10K, regardless of the towing vehicle....


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## SnoForce (Feb 8, 2004)

By the way this is not the full Class A license (tractor trailer) you need a restricted Class A ( trailers over 10,000 lbs.)


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

not according to this.......http://www.cdl-course.com/faq-nh.html


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

show me where you came up with restricted class A,and what are the requirements


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## SnoForce (Feb 8, 2004)

http://www.marylandmva.com/DriverServ/Apply/licenseclass.htm

If you look at the class codes (A, B, C ) only Class A can pull trailers over 10,001 lbs. Now if you go down the page to the restriction codes you will see the code "O" which means you are restricted from driving tractor trailer. Hence the restricted Class A. And yes CDL licensing is the same state to state in the USA. John


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

You are correct about the O restriction,but only as it relates to class A CDL requirements.ARP does not meet the basic requirements for needing a CDL because of the 26001 gvwr.The O restriction would apply to someone that is already required to have a class A CDL,such as a dump truck operator pulling a dozer on a tilt top trailer.
The 26001 gvwr and the 10001 trailer weights are not either or,they are both requirements for needing a class A CDL.You are also correct that CDL requirements are uniform from state to state.Thats why I don't understand the confusion.This subject pops up here and on other sites about every week.Here is a link to the DOT site that will explain everything.....http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/safetyprogs/cdl.htm


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## echovalley (Dec 5, 2004)

What it comes down to is check with the DMV in your own state.Your single wheel 250 is not going to last very long pulling that kind of weight.In CT u MUST have a CDL A to pull a trailer over 10001[even if some of u guys want to try and use your garden tractor].I think this site is really turning into a site more for homeowners,and ham n eggers.


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

Echovalley,no you don't,check this site from CT.....link http://www.ct.gov/dmv/lib/dmv/20/29/ctdriver.pdf
page 17 has the pertinent info
Requirements are the same for every other state too.


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## echovalley (Dec 5, 2004)

Hey do u even have a CDL?


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

I have held a Class A CDL for over 14 years.I have logged over 1 million miles as an OTR truck driver the first 12 years of that period.The last 2 yrs. i have scaled back my driving to concentrate on my own business.I have driven for SWIFT Trans.,FWC trucking,Dan-Valley foods and Overnite Trans.I have been to every state in North America except for WA,OR,MT,and ID,have crossed scales in every one of them and been inspected at one time or another in most.


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## echovalley (Dec 5, 2004)

Well only a million miles in 12 years, maybe it was more local work,but anyway.No one ever worked for me,or moved any of my machines or drove any of my CDL trucks without a class A or B.


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## bsnead (Dec 3, 2004)

Why would they?You state that they are CDL required trucks so then they would require CDL Qualified drivers.I don't understand your statement.If the vehicle does not fall under cdl requirements,then neither does the driver.

What kinds of trucks and trailers do you operate?


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## GSE (Dec 17, 2004)

bsnead said:


> not according to this.......http://www.cdl-course.com/faq-nh.html


I'll have to follow up with the DOT again on this matter. The Highway Enforcement Officer I spoke with was pretty adamant about needing a CDL-A to tow more than 10K.

If this web site it correct, this will alleviate a lot of hassle!


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## SnoForce (Feb 8, 2004)

I am sorry if I steered anyone wrong on this answer but this is what I know from reading the DOT laws and been told from several DOT officers. I do have a Class A and do drive everyday. I think it also would be best to check with your local state police (DOT division) or better yet your motor vehicle licensing dept. That really is a awful lot of weight for even a F-350 to be pulling around. John


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## Oshkosh (Sep 11, 2005)

*Yes you need a class A for anything in tow over 10,000lbs*



SnoForce said:


> I am sorry if I steered anyone wrong on this answer but this is what I know from reading the DOT laws and been told from several DOT officers. I do have a Class A and do drive everyday. I think it also would be best to check with your local state police (DOT division) or better yet your motor vehicle licensing dept. That really is a awful lot of weight for even a F-350 to be pulling around. John


 Having been impounded and fined for being over the 10,001 lb trailer weight with my Class B. I am here to say "Federal"CDL license are FEDERAL now. Not state by state that is in the past, trailer in tow weighing over 10,001lbs combined weight needs a cdl class A.That doesnt matter if you are driving a Ford F450 or A Triaxle dumptruck.
Hope this helps.


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

If your Sec'y of State\licensing bureau is anything like MI's, they won't be able to answer your question. All they do is administer the test.

My understanding from the book and the guy who tested me is that any trailer over 10,001 requires a Class A.


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## Oshkosh (Sep 11, 2005)

*Youve got that right*



Mark Oomkes said:


> If your Sec'y of State\licensing bureau is anything like MI's, they won't be able to answer your question. All they do is administer the test.
> 
> My understanding from the book and the guy who tested me is that any trailer over 10,001 requires a Class A.


 Mark, you have that right.You can ask three different people who should know and get three different answers.lol Government at its best.
I dont know if you've tried but try to find out what permits you need to cross into the next state, talk about a run around.......


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## Mark Oomkes (Dec 10, 2000)

No thanks, I have enough headaches already.   

It's even difficult to get the same answer from the Motor Carrier guys, they usually have different interpretations as well.


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## powerjoke (Nov 13, 2004)

damn boys dont sound like anyone knows i aing going to B.S. yolu and say i talked to 25hiwaypatrol oficers and 5 D.O.T. oficers blah blah, but in MO i do know that you can tow a d-10 dozer with a suburban but not a lawn mower with a f-450 if you have 6k lb plates, you can have 26k lb plates and under with a class F but for anything 32k lb an over you need a class e unless it has a 12k lb frt axle then u ned a class a and if it has airbrakes you then ned a air brake endorsment, but there is a R.V. loop hole even with air brakes you don't need class A only a air brake waiver and veicle to be marked FOR R.V. USE ONLY. but i dont think any body or anything that you print off of this site will hold up in a court of litigation

CHECK WITH YOUR DOT


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## Detroitdan (Aug 15, 2005)

*O restriction*

I have a NH class A CDL with an "O" restriction. This is because I took the class A test with a dump truck towing a deckover trailer, this means I can't legally drive a TT with a 5th wheel hitch. However in Mass and Maine (I'm told) they don't use this restriction, I know several people who took the test with a pintle hitch and didnt get an "O" restriction like I did. Oh well, I really don't want to drive TT anyway. As far as I know, you can tow a trailer over 10k without a CDL, unless the tow vehicle exceeds 16001. One of our drivers just got stopped for this last week. C4500 with juice brakes towing a 10k GVW trailer. Both were empty, but the truck is registered for 17,700 and the trailer is registered for 10,000, so it put him over gcvwr. But, I am reasonably certain he can drive this combination with a class B, doent have to have a class A. I'll have to check my book on that one.
Anybody who wants to tow more than about 12k with juice brakes is an idiot anyway. I can't believe how many morons confuse their Superduties with real work trucks and tow 15-20k down the road. Check your GVWRs, an F250 or 350 is NOT supposed to be doing that! I know everybody out there thats doing it thinks it is okay because they have gotten away with it, but just because you can move a trailer doesnt make it safe. They have wheels, they will roll no matter what you pull it with, but that doesnt make it safe.
Sorry for the rant, but this is one of my pet peeves.


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