# Who Adds a "service fee" to stake out driveways?



## EGLC

I've been charging $5.00 this year but will probably up it to $10.00 next year to mark out my customers driveways.....who here does the same??


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## Luther

Not here. Staking is always included.


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## F-SERIES BEAST

I don't on my own return accounts. I do some high end drives, i think of it as insurance on the drives till i push it once or twice, then it's out lined for me...i don't feel i should kick that onto the customer and i don't like to do repairs in the spring. So i mark for free and grab my flags back at the end of the season, being all my accounts are within a 8 mile radius.


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## WIPensFan

I don't charge.


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## Grn Mtn

EGLC;903843 said:


> I've been charging $5.00 this year but will probably up it to $10.00 next year to mark out my customers driveways.....who here does the same??


maybe jersey is different, but people are tired of getting nickled and dimed, just raise your rates $2 and offer staking as a free service. on big commercial jobs you'll have to charge more of course.


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## JD Dave

I think charging for staking or taking them out is a BS charge and I will never do that. Staking is for your benefit not to do property damage. JMO


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## EGLC

so far I've had no complaints.....I dont see why its BS when the stakes are almost $2.00ea and I'm spending my time and fuel driving around to put them out. Most driveway here I use 8-12 stakes......

I have a clause in my service agreement that if customer opts for us not to stake I am no longer held responsible for turf repair in spring......like I said I have now over 20 customers which isnt a whole lot, but it is my first year and no issues


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## grandview

What are stakes?


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## exmark1

We don't charge anything! Like it's been said that is for YOUR benefit not the customers, therefore you should do it for them. Or let them do it themselves, we do charge for missing stakes in the spring however since they do cost money.


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## EGLC

grandview;904122 said:


> What are stakes?


http://discountsnowstakes.com/index.php?p=home



exmark1;904157 said:


> We don't charge anything! Like it's been said that is for YOUR benefit not the customers, therefore you should do it for them. Or let them do it themselves, we do charge for missing stakes in the spring however since they do cost money.


I dont understand your arguement....I have a landscape business, so lets say theres an over grown apple tree on the property and while mowing you constantly get whacked in the head by some low branches. So by your statement I should trim the tree for no charge?

I mean I've spent close to $400 just on stakes alone and I bet by next year I get back less then 2/3 from customers, now including hours I've spent marking out drives and fuel driving around I'd like to try and recoup SOME of that. Hell customers cant even stake out their own driveway for anywhere near $5.00........


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## Grassman09

grandview;904122 said:


> What are stakes?


Ummm Stake.. 









Here is a whole one. A small one.


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## LoneCowboy

JD Dave;903986 said:


> I think charging for staking or taking them out is a BS charge and I will never do that. Staking is for your benefit not to do property damage. JMO


exactly
well said

If I was a customer and you buried some "staking" charge in your bill, I'd drop you.

I don't see the problem.
I use the cheap ones from angelo's (50c each), I lose almost all of them each year (I don't do landscaping, and our last snows come late March, by which time grass is already growing typically and the landscapers have removed them) and it's just a cost of doing business.

I've only ever seen one other lot staked out here (some other company).

It's a LOT cheaper than fixing curbs, turf, etc

It's a BS charge, price your work correctly.


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## WIPensFan

exmark1;904157 said:


> We don't charge anything! Like it's been said that is for YOUR benefit not the customers, therefore you should do it for them. Or let them do it themselves, we do charge for missing stakes in the spring however since they do cost money.


You charge the customer for missing stakes? How do you know it's their fault there missing?


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## EGLC

LoneCowboy;904177 said:


> If I was a customer and you buried some "staking" charge in your bill, I'd drop you.


Theres not "buried" staking charge, its IN the seaonal contract and shows up on the first invoice.



LoneCowboy;904177 said:


> It's a BS charge, price your work correctly.


So are you saying I should figure this into my "per push" pricing? Wouldnt that be more of a "buried" charge then just telling people openly WHY they're getting charged $5.00???

And seriously guys, calm down. There's no need to jump on me, I'm not stealing busines, hell from the way you guys are talking it seems like I'd be loosing business which would be a positive for other local plowers!


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## JD Dave

EGLC;904054 said:


> so far I've had no complaints.....I dont see why its BS when the stakes are almost $2.00ea and I'm spending my time and fuel driving around to put them out. Most driveway here I use 8-12 stakes......
> 
> I have a clause in my service agreement that if customer opts for us not to stake I am no longer held responsible for turf repair in spring......like I said I have now over 20 customers which isnt a whole lot, but it is my first year and no issues


Being a professional plower it is your job not to do property damage, so IMO it's your discretion if you need stakes or not. Some of our sites we use them others we don't, it all depends. We are responsible for any damage caused plowing. If you can get paid for staking and no one complains then the more power to you. I would assume doing driveways stakes would also asisst you in finding your driveways and also you could you the road stakes for advertising hence why you shouldn't charge for them. This is all JMO.

On edit I'm not excited at all, Im just expressing my views.


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## show-n-go

Grassman09;904168 said:


> Ummm Stake..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here is a whole one. A small one.


Those are steaks.


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## EGLC

JD Dave;904272 said:


> Being a professional plower it is your job not to do property damage, so IMO it's your discretion if you need stakes or not. Some of our sites we use them others we don't, it all depends. We are responsible for any damage caused plowing. If you can get paid for staking and no one complains then the more power to you. I would assume doing driveways stakes would also asisst you in finding your driveways and also you could you the road stakes for advertising hence why you shouldn't charge for them. This is all JMO.


I see your point....for now I'll keep the charge, if/when as I grow and accumulate more accounts people complain then I will remove it. Like I said over 20 very good accounts and not a single complaint....now again this is my first year plowing.



JD Dave;904272 said:


> We are responsible for any damage caused plowing.


I have one customer who refuses to allow me or her husband to stake out the driveway. She says they look "ugly" and can not stand looking at them. I told her we will not be responsible for any turf damage. The driveway is 2 cars wide and about 3 deep, pretty square. However I would've felt MUCH better just putting down 6-8 stakes just to make sure I dont get near the lawn.

She was totally OK with signing a disclaimer just to not have to see the stakes....I personally think she's CRAZY but oh well.


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## EGLC

show-n-go;904287 said:


> Those are steaks.


AHAHAHAHA :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## deicepro

Why not use "irrigation" flags. $2.50 for 100. Cheap and who cares if they get lost.


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## Mackman

I dont think the charge is BS. Sounds like a good idea to me.


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## blowerman

I don't think you'd get too many people around here paying to have you stake their place. You might be able to bury the charge in the first billing, but don't be suprised if a few resi's drop you. (whoever is charging for stakes)


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## exmark1

WIPensFan;904242 said:


> You charge the customer for missing stakes? How do you know it's their fault there missing?


It's in the agreement they sign, however in the 5 years since we started doing that we have only lost 2 stakes! And the customer had no problem paying for them since they removed them and admitted that they threw them away thinking they were junk.

So yes we would charge if the stakes got lost or removed...


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## Mackman

If they are willing to drop you for a 5.00 one time charge. Then i would be more then happy to show them the door.


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## WIPensFan

deicepro;904308 said:


> Why not use "irrigation" flags. $2.50 for 100. Cheap and who cares if they get lost.


They will be lost by mid season if you get any kind of descent snowfall. Or the first snow of the year in my case - 17"


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## EGLC

WIPensFan;904405 said:


> They will be lost by mid season if you get any kind of descent snowfall. Or the first snow of the year in my case - 17"


Yep, they'd be probably burried here. Plus they're short, the entire purpose of stakes are for you to EASILY see the outline of the driveway hahaaa


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## Grassman09

show-n-go;904287 said:


> Those are steaks.


Its different here in Canada.. You know like Tonight Tonite Colour Color type deal.  tymusic


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## mullis56

I think it is a BS CHARGE and you will lose business over this IMO! Like hiring a tree trimmer and him charging you for gas for his saws, like hiring a landscaper and him charging you for line on on the weed eater, like paying for pizza delivery and his head light goes out and him billing you for the light because it went out going to your house! Just my opinion!


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## ABsnow

I explain to my customers that they are not necessary but will help in avoiding damage to their property. My contract states that they are responsible for marking their property boundaries. So either they buy stakes and do it themselves, I buy and install then charge them, or no stakes at all. If they want them and will pay for them and I can make a few pennies then why not? However I do not "hide" any charge, if they don't want them then I just have to be more careful. Grass seed is cheap.


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## EGLC

mullis56;904867 said:


> I think it is a BS CHARGE and you will lose business over this IMO! Like hiring a tree trimmer and him charging you for gas for his saws, like hiring a landscaper and him charging you for line on on the weed eater, like paying for pizza delivery and his head light goes out and him billing you for the light because it went out going to your house! Just my opinion!


like stated several times before no lost business so far and EVERYONE has paid with not a single complaint.

I doubt I have enough problems in the future for me to drop the charge....he people who complain about $5.00 will probably be the ones calling every hour to see where you are, want to know the exact time you leave their property and their bills are late....frankly I'll pass on those customers, you can take 'em tho hahaha :salute:


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## ScnicExcellence

steaking is for your benefit only not theirs. if you don't put markers on the driveway and tear up a $1 worth of sod big deal. it would be cheaper for you to replace the sod. 

I mean if you can get the $5 sure but it would be better for you to just look at the property before the season and remember what you need so you can avoid damage.

I don't mark my driveways and if i will in the future it will only be because of having people working for me and they need them there to see the edges. I will not charge for this service because it is only going to save me headaches with having people working for me.


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## Grassman09

ScnicExcellence;905197 said:


> steaking is for your benefit only not theirs. if you don't put markers on the driveway and tear up a $1 worth of sod big deal. it would be cheaper for you to replace the sod. .


Sod might be a $1 but your time fuel and all that is worth allot more. So the markers are cheaper in the long run and you look more professional.


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## Luther

ECLC....Just curious. What would you charge to stake a subdivision with 440 homes? Several miles of roads with not one being straight. No mail boxes in front of homes either....pockets of mailbox clusters.


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## Deco

i collect the "vote for..." signs after a november election . chop the metal up into stakes and tie ribbon on them . really simple and cheap .


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## Deco

heres a sample


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## EcoGreen Serv

grandview;904122 said:


> What are stakes?


Yummy on the BBQ !



Grassman09;905425 said:


> Sod might be a $1 but your time fuel and all that is worth allot more. So the markers are cheaper in the long run and you look more professional.


I would never consider charging. For me there are several benefits.

The marker at the foot of the driveway has my company name on it and had led to new business. They're one of the few types of signs the bylaw guys will leave alone.

In my contract I repair any turf damage.. I don't just toss down some cheap seed. I put down fertilizer and compost pellets, then use a premium blend seeded with a slit seeder.

90% of the time the repaired area looks much better than the rest of the lawn.

Last year alone homeowners seeing how good the "Repaired" Area looked has led calls from customers asking what I did to make the grass look so good. This has led to numerous compost and fertilizer applications and to 6 complete lawn overseeding restorations at $500 to over $1000.. more than they paid for the prior seasons plowing 

The Repair only costs me a few bucks to do properly, but has led to a lot of additional business. Quality work gets noticed and leads to free word of mouth advertising. All part of the bigger picture.

Just my 2 cents


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## clark lawn

theonly time i charge is for lost stakes. have it in the agreement only had to do it one time a condo development i do was having something and one of the people took them all out and through them out because she didnt like the way they looked was about 50-60 stakes gone. i have that any that are removed by customer and not returned to me will be billed at $3 a piece,the board was a little p.oed at her.


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## augerandblade

Benefits are both ways, so I dont charge, this is the first year I had people at a Seniors residence relocating my stakes, We will see if the insanity continues. Stakes are mostly for my benefit. 
My crew knows where the driveways are, even if I dont know the address cuz my are the only 4 to 5 footers in town and taped both sides red. Heavy snows require big stakes when the visibility is poor. However in the past some of my drivers became brain dead after a long shift and have busted 3 point hitches on tractors and bent snowblowers. DUH.


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## JDiepstra

I don't charge this fee but I don't fault you for doing it either.


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## snowplowchick

I think charging for setting up stakes so that the contractor can perform the job he/she is being paid to do is a cash grab. I wouldn't want anyone in our equipment so inexperienced that they needed stakes to tell where to plow.


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## Luther

snowplowchick;906117 said:


> I wouldn't want anyone in our equipment so inexperienced that they needed stakes to tell where to plow.


That doesn't matter....the most experienced guy/gal will have difficulty seeing the edge of pavement on tight curves, drifted areas and other difficult scenario's ~ especially during the first push.

Unless of course you don't get a lot of snow and the sites are simple and basic.


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## mnglocker

deicepro;904308 said:


> Why not use "irrigation" flags. $2.50 for 100. Cheap and who cares if they get lost.


Ditto, it's what I do.



WIPensFan;904405 said:


> They will be lost by mid season if you get any kind of descent snowfall. Or the first snow of the year in my case - 17"


All I need is to see the edges the first time. After that there is a nice border of snow to use as a driveway guide. I usually wait till the snow stops, otherwise I will go every 4" if it doesn't stop, so I'm not woried about the flags being buried.


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## EGLC

TCLA;905491 said:


> ECLC....Just curious. What would you charge to stake a subdivision with 440 homes? Several miles of roads with not one being straight. No mail boxes in front of homes either....pockets of mailbox clusters.


Well we're talking about residential in this thread, NOT large HOA's. Now if a HOA contacted me I would probably NOT charge because all they care about is PRICE.

But residential here could careless about the $5.00 fee.....now if you tried to even charge $2 per house on that HOA they'd have a sh1t fit.

you have to know your limits


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## Division

I do not charge for stakes.....

Putting 8 stakes on a 2 car by 3 car driveway seems excessive..... dont you think you could get away with maybe 2 or 3?


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## EGLC

Division;906722 said:


> I do not charge for stakes.....
> 
> Putting 8 stakes on a 2 car by 3 car driveway seems excessive..... dont you think you could get away with maybe 2 or 3?


i could get away with 6...but thats just a rough idea and im talking about drives that 2 stakes curve....

even if i used just 2 stakes id still be charging


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## dforbes

no one may be complaining now but If you go from 5 dollars this year to 10 dollars next year that may change. 100 percent increase in a year, I would be looking for someone else. If you can get paid, more power to you, but I would think real hard about that much of a raise in price.


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## EGLC

yah after reading the replies here i think i'll just keep it at $5.00....maybe up it a dollar or two at MOST.


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## redman6565

EGLC;903843 said:


> I've been charging $5.00 this year but will probably up it to $10.00 next year to mark out my customers driveways.....who here does the same??


staking is always for my benefit not my customers, but thats also cause i offer free lawn damage repair


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## blknight06

I rent my stakes to my customers it is for my benefit that they are there but it is also to my customers benefit that I don't do damage to their property. So if any are missing from theft they get charged also they get charged to have them put in but not to remove. Snow is an extreme situation weather or not you want to admit it. It is best compared to well drilling and if anybody had a well drilled and they broke the bit you are going to be billed for the bit.


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## lawnkale

EGLC;904054 said:


> so far I've had no complaints.....I dont see why its BS when the stakes are almost $2.00ea and I'm spending my time and fuel driving around to put them out. Most driveway here I use 8-12 stakes......
> 
> I have a clause in my service agreement that if customer opts for us not to stake I am no longer held responsible for turf repair in spring......like I said I have now over 20 customers which isnt a whole lot, but it is my first year and no issues


$2.00/ stake ur getting robbed. You can buy professional orange fiberglass stakes for .60 a piece


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## Ozone

EGLC - 

Your initial post makes me realize that you UNDERSTAND the economics of business.


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## StormRanger

I stake the driveways for my own good, less property damage I have to go fix in the spring.
I couldnt imagine charging my customers for that.


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## Neige

You asked who charged for stakes, as you can see very few of us. More power to you if you can. Our company spends hundreds of man hours every year to stake the drives. I will lose a couple of hundred to theft, and my drivers will destroy a few hundred more. Its the cost of doing business for us, the benifits are completely ours. #1 drivers can find the clients quickly, with 150 each thats very important. If the driver breaks down or is sick, someone else can do his route and find the clients. #2 We are responsible for all the damage, the stakes have cut down turf, curb, and wall repairs. (that in itself has offset the cost of the stakes.) Years ago we started advertizing on our stakes, this generated new clients so well, it is our best form of advertizing. So now our stakes come out of our advertizing budget. You mention you have 20 clients, will be interesting in the future when you have 200, or 2000 if you are still charging for staking the drives.


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## bighornjd

I don't disagree with charging for stakes necessarily however I think that it is simply part of your expense for providing the service and should be built into the price you quote, not an additional charge. I have considered stakes in the past however I am familiar enough with most of my accounts that I don't generally have any problems. I have found that having to go back in the spring on an occasional repair or even taking the time to get out of the truck and walk around the site real quick to find your boundaries before pushing if you are unsure takes less work. The time spent, fuel used, and cost of stakes, most of which will be damaged or missing by the end of the season, if not before, would be far more than what I have ever spent repairing damage. A friend of mine gave up on stakes after finding many of them had been removed or damaged/ran over between the time he put them out and the first snow. He said he had to go around and check or replace them before every storm and quickly realized it wasn't worth it. To each his own I suppose.


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## mike custom

its not BS to charge, you run a business. I dont stake the 65 residential clients I have, but I would charge a one-time fee of whatever you charge to plow. as long as you have them as a customer, they dont have to ever pay it again, and you get your stakes back at the end of the year. if you lose or break some, you're covered. I think thats fair, and I dont think my customers would be pissed about it. But then again...my customers are mostly execs with million dollar homes


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## Ozone

I agree 100% with the notion "to each his own".


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## TNT Lawn Mainte

not here, I prefer to take 15-30 mins per property to save myself the time and money of fixing landscaping or grass in the spring.


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## firemt036

no charge here but at the end of the season i ask that that they dont remove them or i will incur a $5 charge i come around on april 1st to get them damage control is the key and if your real good get the commercial like lowes and hd to fork them over from the store switch from 1" oak to 1.5"x1/2" grading stakes from lowes cut my cost by 75%


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